Solo adventuring - much more work to do

[Toroll]

<DIV>I'm a back-and-forth player between EQ2 and WoW.  Sometimes I wish a third game would come out that just had the best characteristics of both since most people agree on the pros and cons of each one. But anyway, to the problem at hand.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm a 42 assassin and was solo hunting in Zek near the bridge to the citadel this morning because the last patch added more solo's in the area.  I say I killed about 25-30 guardians/lumberjacks around lev 39.  What I noticed on just about every kill:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- lose about 20-40% of health on each kill </DIV> <DIV>- .2 or .3% of experience on each kill (WITH vitality on)</DIV> <DIV>- No loot (except for few orc meats)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is absolutely unacceptable and no fun at all.  After an hour of hunting and massive HP loss, I expect um..a "little" something in return?  No coin, no chests, no equipment drops, nothing. This is an area where WoW blows EQ out of the water since every drop in wow you get something, and many times FOUR to SIX items: money, herbs, tradeskill components, food, rares, equipment. Plus I get a solid 1% experience on each kill.  THAT's reward.   If EQ can enhance huge gameplay elements like soloing to make it more competitive to WoW, it can really gain an advantage.  I was a longtime EQ1 player and really want to see this game work, but the high end soloing and loot is so BAD in this game, its making people to quit and I don't want to be the next one in line. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Toro</DIV>

[LadyEternity]

<DIV>I think SOE is on the right track to making the game fun and enjoyable to play for groupers and soloists..and even small groupers alike. They still have a long way to go, but I really do have faith that they will achieve a better game overall then WoW could ever be. They just need to remove the pointless tedium, insert more 'fun' and drive away most of the bugs...in otherwords, they need to balance solo vs group vs raid vs small group...so everyone has a goodtime. Reworking of some of the tradeskills is also on the list of things that need to be fixed tedium wise..and definately for insertion of more fun... Heh.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now as for your post about the loot. I think some mobs were 'skipped' over unintentionally during the itemization of solo mobs. I have found some here and there that didn't really drop anything. It's real hard to tell if you are having a bad streak, or they really don't drop any treasure.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What I personally would like to see is a random treasure generation system put into place. I'd like to see items drop that were completely unique. This gives the feeling of "difference" from one character to the next. Sure have 'static' item drops, but put those randomly generated ones in also...and mix up those graphics some. I would love to see players looking different. I enjoyed the mix and match WoW, AC, UO, DAoC(SI and beyond) had. It was just a good time all around. I would also like to see colors added onto items according to how it was generated. (Stat wise). I'd like to see items that give to certain damage types...such as poison, or disease...or melee...or bare fisted...and so on. I'd like to see items that cast light..of varying colors around your character. There really are tons of items that could be put in to spice up the loot tables. How about placeable objects...like skeletal parts (placeable in houses), or box's and crates. How about bags and packs? Foodstuffs, Drinks, Dyes, Clothing, Bandages (Heh ofcourse you'd have to impliment a bandage skill ;P) Hey I have an idear....how about make torches burn out after awhile...and allow players to make their own via spider silk and "sticks" that could be gotten off of harvest wood nodes and in loot tables. Really honestly...there is so much one could do to spice up the loot. I suggest..if the Devs want good idea's...go play AC, UO and Ultima 7, and the Underworld series. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> There's all the idea's you could ever want.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Blacksabath (Necromancer) - Test</DIV>

[Kwoung]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Torollin wrote:<BR> <DIV>This is an area where WoW blows EQ out of the water since every drop in wow you get something, and many times FOUR to SIX items: money, herbs, tradeskill components, food, rares, equipment. Plus I get a solid 1% experience on each kill.  THAT's reward.  <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>No, thats being spoon fed. I am not saying that there are not encounters that need fixed, but folks like me like to feel that when we get something, it is a bonus, not something that is expected from every mob. Nothing makes a game more boring than to be spoon fed everything you need and to have very little to anticipate or look forward to.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I hope you bugged the mobs you mentioned though, because my wife and I were hunting solo spiders in EL and got way more loot than expected this weekend... including close to a full set of armour (numerous duplicate pieces), weapons, numerous adepts, quests out the wazzu and tons of sellables in the form of no-stat armour and mob body parts... all in the course of making a single level. Personally, I think the loot tables need looked at in both directions, as other similar level mobs in the area rarely (if ever) drop loot while the spiders overloaded us with it.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Kwoung on <span class=date_text>03-13-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:51 AM</span>

[Amise]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Torollin wrote:<BR> <DIV>I'm a back-and-forth player between EQ2 and WoW.  Sometimes I wish a third game would come out that just had the best characteristics of both since most people agree on the pros and cons of each one. But anyway, to the problem at hand.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm a 42 assassin and was solo hunting in Zek near the bridge to the citadel this morning because the last patch added more solo's in the area.  I say I killed about 25-30 guardians/lumberjacks around lev 39.  What I noticed on just about every kill:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- lose about 20-40% of health on each kill </DIV> <DIV>- .2 or .3% of experience on each kill (WITH vitality on)</DIV> <DIV>- No loot (except for few orc meats)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is absolutely unacceptable and no fun at all.  After an hour of hunting and massive HP loss, I expect um..a "little" something in return?  No coin, no chests, no equipment drops, nothing. This is an area where WoW blows EQ out of the water since every drop in wow you get something, and many times FOUR to SIX items: money, herbs, tradeskill components, food, rares, equipment. Plus I get a solid 1% experience on each kill.  THAT's reward.   If EQ can enhance huge gameplay elements like soloing to make it more competitive to WoW, it can really gain an advantage.  I was a longtime EQ1 player and really want to see this game work, but the high end soloing and loot is so BAD in this game, its making people to quit and I don't want to be the next one in line. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Toro</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>Wow.  My experience (43 Assassin)  has been completely different from yours.  Since that patch I've soloed in Everfrost, Lavastorm, Enchanted Lands, and Feerrott.  While I agree that the rate of XP gain is still slow I think it's about acceptable for solo play.  The loot is great.   Have had several pieces of new armor, weapons, adepts, tradeskill books, haven't really counted up the rate of drops but it's been good and after every solo session I've come away feeling like I accomplished something.  Before the patch I avoided soloing for XP like the plague because I found it very frustrating.</P> <P>My advice to you would be to sample a few more solo areas before you say there's something wrong.  As someone else said, it's looking like mobs in some locations haven't been itemized with the new drops yet.  The places I mentioned above most definitely have, I would suggest you try one of those before you start with the "it's broken it's broken I'm going to WoW".</P>

[Cecil_Stri]

<DIV>Loot is great for solo play... exp still needs to be increased by a small amount</DIV>

[Fle]

<DIV> <DIV>Loot is great for solo play... exp still needs to be increased by a small amount.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-----------</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Well this is just a matter of opinion yet again and i don't think it needs ajusting any more.</DIV></DIV>

[Cecil_Stri]

<DIV>Well you still get less exp solo then you would in a group... you have much much longer down time.. and you kill slower.  Plus you don't get that great bonus for completing an encounter... Solo exp is still much much slower then grouping... Not even compareable still</DIV>

[Fle]

<DIV>Yes it's not supposed to be as good as grouping.</DIV>

[Jeridor]

I think the solo -> group exp gap could be improved some. It's still pretty wide. As for loot, it totally depends where and what you hunt. For example, if you hunt beetles and stuff like that in enchanted lands you will get complete crap if anything. Lots of quest starters and little of anything else. Yet if you fight the new evil fairies out there, you'll get various new armor drops which are reasonably ok loot I guess. I think they do need to fix both issues, make the gap smaller and adjust the loot on many of the older creatures to actually drop loot of value.

[Spaceweed]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Torollin wrote:<BR> <DIV>I'm a back-and-forth player between EQ2 and WoW.  Sometimes I wish a third game would come out that just had the best characteristics of both since most people agree on the pros and cons of each one. But anyway, to the problem at hand.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm a 42 assassin and was solo hunting in Zek near the bridge to the citadel this morning because the last patch added more solo's in the area.  I say I killed about 25-30 guardians/lumberjacks around lev 39.  What I noticed on just about every kill:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- lose about 20-40% of health on each kill </DIV> <DIV>- .2 or .3% of experience on each kill (WITH vitality on)</DIV> <DIV>- No loot (except for few orc meats)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is absolutely unacceptable and no fun at all.  After an hour of hunting and massive HP loss, I expect um..a "little" something in return?  No coin, no chests, no equipment drops, nothing. This is an area where WoW blows EQ out of the water since every drop in wow you get something, and many times FOUR to SIX items: money, herbs, tradeskill components, food, rares, equipment. Plus I get a solid 1% experience on each kill.  THAT's reward.   If EQ can enhance huge gameplay elements like soloing to make it more competitive to WoW, it can really gain an advantage.  I was a longtime EQ1 player and really want to see this game work, but the high end soloing and loot is so BAD in this game, its making people to quit and I don't want to be the next one in line. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Toro</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>So 'after an hour of hunting', you expect say...</P> <P>A full suit of pristine Ebon platemail armour, 5 or 6 rare harvestables, a nice orange con wep with proc, 2 levels, a cuddly toy and a partridge in a pear tree - that better?</P> <P>Stop being so ridiculous.  This game has some 'challenge' involved - don't tell me, you have levelled up 9 chars in WoW to max, and have 'uberlootz' for all of them?</P> <P>Sounds like Wow is the game for you - enjoy :smileywink:</P>

[KudLenka]

<DIV>the new mobs in TS are really fine, good drops, nice xp (0,9 % for blue con mob with vitality) but starting a new character in commonlands the drops are poor. like the existing mobs were left without changes to loot tables. LIke 40 wisps killed (two arrow heroic encounters) and did not get single drop from them - soloing them with cleric when they are green to me (great exp on the other side, and challenge too)</DIV>

[Ethelwo]

<DIV>IMO. I believe the experience gain soloing far outways the loot drops. I'm not unhappy with the rate nice loot drops, I am very unhappy with the rate of vender loot drops. I can understand the need to control the rate that nice items enter the game. I just can't understand why in Gods name SOE controls the rate of vender trash loot in the exact same way. If it wasn't for no loot, I wouldn't get any loot at all. I find myself leveling and not being able to buy the things I need to stay competitive in the game. This is disheartning and because of it, I am constantly going to the web sites of other in development MMORPGs in hopes of finding something better. When that better MMORPG gets released it will be so long SOE and EQ forever.</DIV>

[DreadRanger]

Tied hand in hand with better loot drops is a better way to sell what you find. I'm not looking to get rich, but I find good usable items and scrolls that I wind up selling to my wholesaler because I'm simply not going to park my character in my apartment and go AFK. Honestly, when was the last time you bought something from another player and found a real person actually "there"? I can safely answer "never". I have however been in a lot of apartments with AFK sellers and filled with every overpriced pet and indulgence. Somebody's making money, but it's not the people who are truly playing the game.I think a decent way to sell is a bigger priority than fixing the loot drops. I'm finding decent drops, but just have no way to get it into the hands of other players who can use it.

[Flab]

<DIV>Have had same experience in Zek myself, 30+ white and yellow solo mobs, one lousy drop and a bad one at that..</DIV> <DIV>Found drops in EL to be both better and more frequent, try soloing there instead.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>On the overall, the rate of drops in the game IMO is way too low and infrequent. As I see it for example, when I kill a powerfull orc warrior, I would expect him to have at least something in the way of a weapon or some armor that could be peddled for a few silvers..the way loot works now reminds me of an arcade game with "powerups" -drops.  In my experiece, with numerous rpg's and MMO's tested..the loot system here is the least enjoyable..IMO.</DIV> <DIV>Not saying I will quit, hey, I can get immersed in the game anyway and the community is great on my server, but there have been many times when I have found myself asking "is that it ?".. </DIV> <DIV>Anihilating a platoon of orcs and only having a crappy helmet for loot..is baaad...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hope this,along with other issues like having to be logged on to sell on broker, will be fixed and ballanced in time however...as I am sure SOE is not stupid, and indeed want people to enjoy this game. They could just add loads of more drops, but keep the average quality of the drops under the average level of adventureres in the zone, to make people earn stuff that they can sell to Npc's at least. Or...even better, add coin drops..</DIV> <DIV>Still remember the days of Diablo, which was a drop-happy game <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  (yes I know the economy in an MMO requires some ballancing measures etc...but FUN is the only true scale of measure)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also I miss the "skinning" skill from Wow....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kassander of Neriak</DIV>

[SanJ]

<DIV>An EQ2 buddy just called my office and reported that at level 27 last night in TS, he killed a green con solo gnoll and it dropped a master's chest!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>"Favor of the Untamed (Master I)" </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is a 29 Warden group power pool buff.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I had no idea that a solo mob green con (no up arrows--non heroic) carried such worthy loot.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Personally, I go through periods in EL where every other mob drops a chest or I get literally 3 in a row.  Then I'll stick on the same mobs and fight for an hour with no chest drops.  It's seems very inconsistent, but I am pleased to see at least some loot with nice stats that you can sell to lower level players.  At level 38 most of the loot I'm finding in EL is good gear or starter good gear for upper 20's.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I get very little XP for killing solo mobs in the orange and even red range .05 to .2.  However, duoing green ^^ nets as much as 2.2 percent XP per kill in EL.  Obviously, I'm trying to dou with friends and guildies as much as possible when not group hunting.  If I can't find a duo buddy, I just harvest for rares with my LFG tag up <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now to find the right green solo mob that drops Master Chests ... haha <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks,</DIV> <DIV>Kalen</DIV>

[warchild]

<DIV><FONT color=#999999>I'm a back-and-forth player between EQ2 and WoW.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#999999></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#999999> </FONT><FONT color=#ffffff>The solo game is fine the problem is your compareing EQ2 to WoW. </FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> its simple if you want a ton of  loot for free play wow. If you want to work for your</DIV> <DIV> loot play EQ2. eq2 and wow are 2 diff games. if eq2 soloing is absolutely unacceptable to you</DIV> <DIV> then you should go for the free loot in WoW, because in eq2 we like working for our loot.</DIV>

[KudLenka]

<DIV>as much as i dont think getting a master form green con solo mob is ok (it is not by any means) there is one interesting quote popular no the boards</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2><EM>Many people out there (quite a few of the dev team included) just don't have the large blocks of uninterrupted time that we used to. We still want to be able to come online, have fun, be challenged, and be rewarded for our efforts. Soloists and those who prefer small groups should never have to feel like they're the ones getting the proverbial table scraps, as it were." - Scott Hartsman, Senior Producer, Everquest II</EM></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV>so back to your words on WoW and EQ2 - work hard for loot? Thats somewhat invalid point of view, EQ2 is a game after all, not second job. The increased drop rate is awesome, adventuring feels simply more rewarding even when the drops in chests are vendor trash (but well paid for). Not sere if you ever played game called Horizons: Empire of Istaria - the game killed itself witht wo things, lack of usable loot and nerfs. Loot as reward is needed and occassional clump of maggots simply wont do the job, there are already too many on the boards anyway <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think SOE did good job on keeping people interested with the lot changes, they only need to take it little further and update the loot tables across the board not only for the new creatures</DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV>

[GraymaneGravitic]

<DIV>"So 'after an hour of hunting', you expect say... <P>A full suit of pristine Ebon platemail armour, 5 or 6 rare harvestables, a nice orange con wep with proc, 2 levels, a cuddly toy and a partridge in a pear tree - that better?</P> <P>Stop being so ridiculous.  This game has some 'challenge' involved - don't tell me, you have levelled up 9 chars in WoW to max, and have 'uberlootz' for all of them?</P> <P>Sounds like Wow is the game for you - enjoy <IMG height=16 src="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif" width=16 border=0>"</P> <P> </P> <P>NO, after an hour of hunting he expects more than a rotten piece of meat thats worth 24c!</P> <P> </P> <P>Stop being so ridiculous yourself! No one is asking for an extreme. </P> <P>By jumping to the conclusion that anyone who criticizes what was most certainly a pitiful excuse for a reward prior to the tweaking must certainly be asking for everything on a silver platter only makes you look like a fool.</P> <P>There needs to be a micddle ground between handouts and barely enough reward to cover the costs of adventuring. </P> <P>Stop reacting like a petulant child when some one levels a valid criticism!</P> <P> </P> <P>Sounds like kindergarten is the place for you! Enjoy!</P> <P> </P></DIV>

[Wu]

<DIV>Well I think compared to the start of EQ2 the solo drops are now ok, xp is also ok, making 5% in lvl 46 in 1 hour is acceptable for me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What is not ok is group loot. Example given: 4-5 hours soloing in Everfrost gains you ~ 50 gold from various adept drops or armor/critterdrops now and even more because you can harvest a bit and maybe get lucky to find a rare. Now 4-5 hours grouping in Permafrost gains your group 6 fulginate weapons, 3-5 adepts and 2-4 linnen shawls, maybe if you get extra lucky some named drops some items - which are 80% vendor trash everyone has already or wouldnt use. So out of this each player gets 2-6 gold. I think now group loot needs a big revamp, getting 10 different items and 10 different adepts over and over again out of one dungeon is not very entertaining. </DIV> <DIV>I do not ask for 1000+ Items like in another game per dungeon but 100 items or so should fit and entertain the players <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[StGabri]

I've been consistently earning more cash and xps solo/duo than in larger groups after all the recent changes. On both of my characters.*shrug*StGabe.