IN-GAME FEEDBACK - Some comments

[A]

There is no place in the forums for In-Game Feedback, especially non-class related. I do want to take this opportunity to comment on the "state of the game" from my (and others) perspective.Does anyone else think something is very very wrong with EQ2? There are some great features to EQ2, there's no question of that...but I do honestly feel like I'm playing a beta or even an alpha (if there is such a thing).I only want to give one example:3 months ago I created my character and entered the Isle of Refuge. As with everyone else, my first task was to kill a few goblins.3 months later, 44 levels and...entering Lavastorm for the first time....what do i see? the same goblin in the same loincloth! But he's now level 48!! OMG!oh, and his cousins in Antonica, Thundering Steppes, EL, etc. This is not acceptable.If people will flame me, that's fine. People will tell me to go play WoW...apparently Blizzard is doing something right (1.25 million subscribers compared to 350 000 for EQ2 - Beta Testing in China 100 000 in one hour). Compared with dead newbie zones for EQ2 and free trial offers from SOE. Ummmm....I still feel EQ2 has great potential. But, after 3 months of playing and seeing the cookie-cutter level 50's in their rubicite armor or purple mage robes .... just the same as with level 22-25 and the AQ armor.... It's blatantly obvious that this MMOrpg is lacking.I am not renewing my subscription, obviously. Though I may come back in 6 months or a year if things were to change. Oh, and i certainly realize that my one little meager subscription doesn't signify anything, but the one million non-subscribers certainly do.I don't want to start a comparison with WoW because we already know the winner. I simply would like to people to post their comments on points that they feel should be removed, improved or changed for the developers to read and think on.Happy Trails <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[mai]

I TOTALLY agree with you, Aia. Thank you from bringing this up. The devs need to read this thread in a bad way before they find themselves sending their resumes over to Blizzard. Two of my friends are switching to WoW and if things don't change, I will, too. The cookie cutter quality and downright silliness of everything level after level is horrible. These things are not even grey area issues that people dispute. They're black & white INEXCUSABLE. - Mobs: I'm all excited to get to antonica and what do I see? The same mobs I saw in the newbie zones. Ok, then I'm all excited to get to Thundering Steppes. What do I see? The same mobs. Now I'm in EL. The same old skeletons, zombies, badgers, deer, fairies, ad nauseum. And the level of mobs is just silly. In TS there are epic looking giants who go down like paper, then I get to EL and there's some double arrow red badger that looks like a cute stuffed animal, the same exact badger I first saw in the newbie zones. C'mon, guys, please! How am I supposed to feel like a mighty warrior killing the same 'ol badgers and crabs level after level?- Armor: How tiresome is it seeing the whole population running around in the same exact armor like the AQ gear? I'll trust Aia that it's still the same boring pattern in the highest tier.- Quests: Most of the quest storylines must've been written by grade schoolers. Level after level it's the same ridiculousness. Take the AQs, one of the most involved, multi-level quests in the game. It's length and span are of epic proportions. But what's the storyline behind it? Some fool needs you to find poker chips, arrows, etc. that his family lost!!! I'm supposed to feel heroic getting lost poker chips??? "C'mon, Undead Cavalier! I know you're gambling with stolen poker chips. Give 'em up!" I should feel immersed in the fiction when I'm fighting to get back journal pages that BEARS steal? - Items: Tons of items in the game are totally screwed almost half a year into the game. Furniture can't be used functionally (like to sit on). Potions are nearly useless. The EQ franchise is fast losing it's status as the MMORPG king. There's VERY little new blood coming in. The newbie zones are empty. People have moved to WoW in droves. Gee, I wonder why? What's not to love about hitting tier 4 to battle the same badger I saw in tier 1? What good is tweaking tradeskills or solo XP if the foundation reeks of tedium? It's not too late to turn it all around, but it will be soon.<p>Message Edited by maiki on <span class=date_text>03-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:46 PM</span>

[Car]

A couple of friends of mine were having a discussion about WoW the other day. There are enough problems with EQ2 to make me think of at least trying WoW.A lot of people say they don't want PvP and so they won't play WoW. I played SWG which had PvP and sure there were immature people but some of the most fun I had was on a raids of rebel bases. As long as it's consenting PvP I don't see the problem. After all you do have the /ignore command for the kiddies.I'm going to preface this list with the note 'I enjoy EQ2 a lot but these are some of the flaws as I see them.'1. This was noted above but lack of variety of mobs. You can pick a mob..beetles, deer, skeletons that are the same mobs as seen in previous levels except with a higher level number next to their name. Last time I checked deer were deer and beetles were beetles.2. Lack of variety in appearance. Woohoo! I can make jewelry. Oh wait. No one can actually see it while wearing it. Oh I finished AQ's! Oh wait there are 5 other people in the bank that look just like me. Oh I just looted 'Helm of major brains' and it looks like a tier 1 skullcap.3. Major inconsistancy in the graphics engine. I mean I have a top of the line system x800xt 1gb ram athlon 64 3500 and I have to adjust the settings everytime I get in a group of 3 or more. Something is wrong there....4. Too many instanced zones. I have to go to a zone to craft? or a new zone going from NQ to SQ? I can see maybe Antonica to TS or something...And I'll reiiterate I'm not saying EQ2 is a bad game but just the flaws make me want to check out WoW

[Andari]

<DIV>Ich denke die Werbung die SOE gemacht hat, war einfach zu viel versprechend.</DIV> <DIV>Dieses Monster Project konnte ja niemals so auf die beine gebracht werden, wie sie es umliebkost haben.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ich denke einfach die Beta phase war zu kurz.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Das beste was dem spiel jetzt passieren kann, ist jedem mann und jeder frau 3 monate gratis EQ2 spendieren, und einen volkommenen Restart machen, additional wenn Mentoring in game ist.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------</DIV> <DIV> <DIV>I think the advertisement the SOE made, was promising simply too much. This monster Project could be never brought in such a way on the legs, as they discribt  it. I think simply the beta phase was too short. Best which can now happen to the play, is each man and each woman 3 months give free of charge EQ2, and a totaly restart to make, additional if Mentoring is into game.</DIV> <DIV>translatet by babelfish</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Greetz Andi</DIV></DIV>

[observer]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Aia wrote:<BR><FONT color=#ffff00>I don't want to start a comparison with WoW because we already know the winner.</FONT> I simply would like to people to post their comments on points that they feel should be removed, improved or changed for the developers to read and think on.<BR><BR>Happy Trails <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Ok, i will compare then.  Keep in mind i've been playing WoW for about a couple weeks so i don't know too much about it.  I got a lvl 17 tauren hunter already though.</P> <P><STRONG>User Interface: </STRONG></P> <UL> <LI>EQ2- Hotbars, Quest Journal, Map, Compass,  XP bar, etc. can all be resized and/or moved around.</LI> <LI>WoW- has a UI scaler that resizes all of the UI, but you can't resize or move certain stuff individually.  In WoW, you can either download some 3rd party program (cosmos) or create one yourself to customize your UI.  If there is a way to move stuff or resize without a 3rd party program, i haven't figured it out yet.</LI></UL> <P><STRONG>Quest Journal: </STRONG></P> <UL> <LI>EQ2- quest journal is about the same as WoW's, except EQ2 has a completed tab that i can go back to and see if i already completed it.  It also has the quest helper in the upper right hand corner you can use instead of opening your journal all the time.</LI> <LI>WoW- you can share quests in the same group but i'm not sure how this works yet.  WoW has no quest helper and no completed tab, you can only have 20 quests at a time.</LI> <LI>Both use color conned difficulties for quests.</LI></UL> <P><STRONG>Questing:</STRONG> </P> <UL> <LI>EQ2- you don't know who gives out quests unless you talk to the NPC.  You can skip the through the dialouge, and there is onscreen dialouge in chat bubbles too.  In EQ2, you don't have to have quest items in your inventory or bags.</LI> <LI>WoW- any NPC with a exclamation mark in yellow above their head gives quests. After completing the quest in WoW, the same NPC will now have a yellow question mark above their head that lets you know it's finished.  In WoW, you can't skip the dialogue, it's very short dialouge though that appears inside the quest journal.  You have to have the items physically in your bags and inventory which takes up space.</LI> <LI>Questing in both of these are the same thing really.</LI> <LI>NPC says go kill X number of mobs or talk to NPC in location Y. </LI></UL> <P><STRONG>Looting: </STRONG> </P> <UL> <LI>EQ2- gives <EM>gear/<STRONG>quest</STRONG> <STRONG>starters</STRONG>/etc. </EM>thr<EM>o</EM>ugh chest drops.  Animals dropping chests is unrealistic.</LI> <LI>WoW- gives <EM>coin/gear/<STRONG>quest</STRONG> <STRONG>items and starters</STRONG>/etc.</EM> by looting the actual corpse (haven't seen chests drop yet).  Animals dropping coin and gear is unrealistic.</LI></UL> <P><STRONG>Maps:</STRONG></P> <UL> <LI>EQ2- has a map on screen and can be moved around.  No mini-map though. It also has tabbed windows on it.</LI> <LI>WoW- has a map that takes up the whole screen and cant be moved or resized.  Has a mini-map though even though i never use it because you can't zoom out all the way which makes it useless to me.  I just use the map that takes up the whole screen.</LI></UL> <P><STRONG>Hotbars:</STRONG></P> <UL> <LI>EQ2- you can have multiple hotbars on screen at once.</LI> <LI>WoW- only 1 hotbar at a time.  You have to hold shift + mouse scroll to go through them or customize the controls for hotkeys.</LI></UL> <P><STRONG>Closing thoughts:</STRONG></P> <P>This was a very short review of both games and i didnt cover all the areas of the games like configuration controls, beastiary, graphics, sound quality, story and lore, guilds, etc.  </P> <P>I could spend days writing up differences and similarities, but i won't.  Both these games are good and both have bugs, flaws, balance issues, etc.  I will say that EQ2 is my first MMO game and i'm liking it.  I'm also trying WoW and having fun with it too.  </P> <P>There's one thing EQ2 has that is superior over WoW and that's server stability and no waiting in lines to play because of over populated servers.  I've never had to wait in line while playing EQ2 and there's only been 1 downtime that i can remember.  WoW continues to have server instability, downtime, and queued lines (waiting in line to play), although those are usually on the busiest servers.  I personally have not had these problems since i started on a new server that went up, so i guess i'm lucky for now.</P> <P>I have to be honest here though, i'm liking EQ2 better because the world feels more realistic like the character models and creatures, and the graphics are just awesome.  WoW's approach is more fantasy based and looks more cartoonish and it's graphics aren't all that great.  Everyone has different opinions on this though, but these are mine.</P> <P>If anyone wants to pick apart my short review that lacks in a lot of details and different areas of each games, feel free to do so.</P> <P align=right><EM>Can't forget the one star bandits, click below to give it <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></EM></P>

[A]

thank you for your comparison, Observer! Very objective and thoughtful!I'm certainly NOT saying that WoW is a better game. Over 1 million people around the world are playing it and not EQ2. And, yes, there are flaws, bugs and problems in every game, especially MMOrpg's!The very nature of a MMOrpg is change. SOE is changing a lot of things in the game world now. They have seen the numbers. Their jobs are on the line. EQ2 must change! Let's just hope it arrives while there is still a player-base worth talking about. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><p>Message Edited by Aia on <span class=date_text>03-06-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:27 AM</span>

[Telad]

<DIV>For those of you that want pvp there may be a way to have it. Guild wars will be out soon which is heavy on the pvp with n o monthly fee <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> i plan on playing it myself to get my pvp fix that EQ2 cant give and also when i just need a break from EQ2</DIV>

[Nim]

what about LFg in WoW? Eq2 has a great way of finding and asking players for groups but not seen one in WoW? Maybe i'm issing something.. only played a bit Tauren lvl 7 hunter..

[yes4]

<DIV>Both games are below expectation, but that the only choices we currently have</DIV> <DIV><A href="http://www.mmorpgdot.com/index.php?hsaction=10053&ID=1091" target=_blank>http://www.mmorpgdot.com/index.php?hsaction=10053&ID=1091</A></DIV>

[Qandor]

<DIV>I have a number of gripes but what bothers me the most is that everything is so [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] structured with this tier system both adventure wise and tradeskill wise. Everything is tier this and tier that. If they had modeled bodily functions into the game I'm sure we would have tiered toilet paper as well. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Then on top of this higly regimented system which is as big an immersion breaker as you can get, very often there aren't even graphical differences in armor looks by tier which we could at least expect I would think. My tier 2 sorcerer is wearing a crafted canvas blouse while my son is wearing the Tier 4 RARE crafted blouse and it is the exact same graphic. How nuts is that?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Everyday it becomes more and more apparent that this game was far from ready for primetime. Couple a whored out (money schemes and giveaways) short beta with a very premature release and this is what you get. You get to fight deer, badgers and crabs everywhere and forever. You get the most unimaginative gear both graphically and statwise that you can imagine. Tough choice, do I want this ring with +5agility and +4 strength or would I prefer this one with +4 agility and +5 strength? Of course, I could wait for the next TIER (sigh) and have the +6 agility and +5 strength ring. Really gives me something to strive for.</DIV>

[Azaik]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Aia wrote:<BR>There is no place in the forums for In-Game Feedback, especially non-class related. <BR><BR> I simply would like to people to post their comments on points that they feel should be removed, improved or changed for the developers to read and think on.<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Odd... from where I'm sitting, I can see at least 11 forums dedicated to gameplay topics that aren't class related. Most seem to be under the heading 'Gameplay,' and contain posts on things could be removed, improved or changed.</DIV>

[A]

<blockquote><hr>Azaik wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Aia wrote:<BR>There is no place in the forums for In-Game Feedback, especially non-class related. <BR><BR> I simply would like to people to post their comments on points that they feel should be removed, improved or changed for the developers to read and think on.<BR><BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV>Odd... from where I'm sitting, I can see at least 11 forums dedicated to gameplay topics that aren't class related. Most seem to be under the heading 'Gameplay,' and contain posts on things could be removed, improved or changed.</DIV><hr></blockquote>oops <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I'll move ... or at least repost it there.Thank you Azaik

[Proudfoot]

<blockquote><hr>maiki wrote:I TOTALLY agree with you, Aia. Thank you from bringing this up. The devs need to read this thread in a bad way before they find themselves sending their resumes over to Blizzard. Two of my friends are switching to WoW and if things don't change, I will, too. The cookie cutter quality and downright silliness of everything level after level is horrible. These things are not even grey area issues that people dispute. They're black & white INEXCUSABLE. - Mobs: I'm all excited to get to antonica and what do I see? The same mobs I saw in the newbie zones. Ok, then I'm all excited to get to Thundering Steppes. What do I see? The same mobs. Now I'm in EL. The same old skeletons, zombies, badgers, deer, fairies, ad nauseum. And the level of mobs is just silly. In TS there are epic looking giants who go down like paper, then I get to EL and there's some double arrow red badger that looks like a cute stuffed animal, the same exact badger I first saw in the newbie zones. C'mon, guys, please! How am I supposed to feel like a mighty warrior killing the same 'ol badgers and crabs level after level?- Armor: How tiresome is it seeing the whole population running around in the same exact armor like the AQ gear? I'll trust Aia that it's still the same boring pattern in the highest tier.- Quests: Most of the quest storylines must've been written by grade schoolers. Level after level it's the same ridiculousness. Take the AQs, one of the most involved, multi-level quests in the game. It's length and span are of epic proportions. But what's the storyline behind it? Some fool needs you to find poker chips, arrows, etc. that his family lost!!! I'm supposed to feel heroic getting lost poker chips??? "C'mon, Undead Cavalier! I know you're gambling with stolen poker chips. Give 'em up!" I should feel immersed in the fiction when I'm fighting to get back journal pages that BEARS steal? - Items: Tons of items in the game are totally screwed almost half a year into the game. Furniture can't be used functionally (like to sit on). Potions are nearly useless. The EQ franchise is fast losing it's status as the MMORPG king. There's VERY little new blood coming in. The newbie zones are empty. People have moved to WoW in droves. Gee, I wonder why? What's not to love about hitting tier 4 to battle the same badger I saw in tier 1? What good is tweaking tradeskills or solo XP if the foundation reeks of tedium? It's not too late to turn it all around, but it will be soon.<p>Message Edited by maiki on <span class=date_text>03-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:46 PM</span><hr></blockquote>Proudfoot: Level 57 Warrior in WoW.For some reason people seem to think that WoW's high-end game is different. Its actually less. The comment about fighting the same mobs also applies to WoW. There are only a handful of mobs that don't have a low level counterpart/model. WoW isn't any better, its just a horse of a different color.WoW actually ends around level 50-52 because 55-60 just isn't finished. As a casual player it only took me 3 months to hit 57. Others, EQ players, will hit the cap much sooner.The only draw WoW really has to people who haven't played it is they think it looks "fun". Well, it is fun but the fun factor is not long-lasting. The quests you do at level 2 are the same quests at level 55, just in a different zone. Even the dungeons are the SAME. (copy/paste routine).WoW also fails in the solo department just like EQ2. How so? You can't see 90% of the game content post 45 without a group. Their dungeons have mobs called "Elite", which are basically 2 arrow up mobs like in EQ2. Bonus... Greys attack! You can't just skirt by them.The drop-rate of items outside of a dungeon, post level 40, is 0.05%. Ask a dev. Makes finding items extremely hard. There are no armor quests for high-end either. Two, maybe three pieces can be quested for post 55 in the level 60 Instances that require 2 groups to clear.<b>The grass is not greener.</b> Please stop saying it is.

[mai]

Thank you for informing us of WoW's deficiences, Proudfoot. Those of us who are dissatisfied with EQ2, like Aia and myself, have obviously not yet played WoW. So it's always good to hear evaluations of it. What we are saying is not that the grass is greener on the other side, although WoW has higher subscription rates and consistently gets better reviews online. Obviously we couldn't say the grass is greener on the other side without ever having played the other side. We are simply saying that if things don't improve, we would try the other side. I, for one, went with EQ2 instead of WoW because of EQ's reputation. This being my first MMO, I wanted to go with the king. And don't get me wrong, I"ve had tons of fun in the game. There's a lot they have done right.

[GoNom]

<DIV>NM</DIV><p>Message Edited by GoNomar on <span class=date_text>03-06-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:44 PM</span>

[GoNom]

<DIV>Grrrrrrr even the boards are bugged today........double post so i'll say it again NM</DIV><p>Message Edited by GoNomar on <span class=date_text>03-06-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:45 PM</span>

[Jeridor]

Let me preface what I'm about to say by stating that I enjoy EQII quite a bit, and I have not played WoW. I think the points made above are very valid. I agree that the "EverQuest Dynasty" is at risk. EQ1 came out of nowhere and took the gaming world by storm. But, EQ1 of course has faded as natural, and now it's up to its successor to bear that crown. I think EQII has a lot to offer, and I think it has a lot of potential. However, I also think that it's open to being hammered by competitors.However, the sands of time in the gaming community fall slowly and nothing happens at the pace any gamer would like it to happen in. Whatever is to come of EQII will not be realized for some time to come. It might falter and be swept to the side to become the next Asheron's Call, or it might become something beyond what EQ1 accomplished. I will say, however, that the fact SOE is putting a lot of manpower into EQII gives it a lot of potential and promise. If they use that manpower well, it would be very hard for a competitor save WoW to cause them great grief.All the features observer pointed out were worthy, valuable features that set EQII in a place that WoW isn't. However, I believe UI features save stability of the client itself are easily addressed and things like journal and map improvements are trivial compared to adding real, unique content. Also, improving server stability and ridding WoW of those wait times may be trivial by comparison, but that's something none of us could really know. It's worth pointing out that WoW's greatly larger community is probably a significant cause for those network problems. One could surmise that EQII would have the same problem (again, in theory) if they had such a sized community. EQII might have a leg up on WoW on the client stability issue if not for the fact that many people have problems with EQII's client as well.Bottom line? EQII is an awesome game and it offers a lot that no other game does, but SOE needs to be quite concerned and quite steadfast in the months ahead in order to protect and grow the world they have created.P.S. One of my own personal gripes about "redundant content" would be dungeons, esp. the ones with undead. The new condemned catacombs they released a bit ago were very disappointing in terms of originality. Skeletons and goblin as always, the same walls and other textures used in places like the down below / vermin snye / crypt of betrayal (can we say copy and paste mentality?) and even the music was the same dreadful tune from those places. Surely someone at SOE has to realize that after people have spent nearly their entire time playing EQII thus far fighting in catacombs against undead, listening to the same old music, seeing the same old wall textures, that they'd not want an exciting new dungeon with... the same.P.P.S. Maiki, I got a good laugh from some of the examples you gave for quests.<p>Message Edited by Jeridor on <span class=date_text>03-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:34 AM</span>