Sony, Fix before you break...

[Brigog]

Well I must say there is some things in this patch that were very nice but for the most part ALOT of the big changes compleatly sux. First off lets look at the manditory attune items... In EQ1 you didnt need to attune things and the economy was great, people bought at sold like no tomorrow. With this new system your making it so basicly its a crafters dream and people who get a drop in a dung that may wanna use an item for 3-4 level then gets shafted when they wanna sell it in order to make profit to buy new gear. As is mobs dont drop gold so its not like just killing mobs we make easy cash and I know many dont wanna craft such as myself.Second you guys are changeing and adding things to some classes while you leave others broken to all hell. Zerkers /Guardians /Warlocks /Wizards are gettign alot of attention while other classes are compleatly broken. Necros for instance, we are a DPS class that does JACK for damage. I mean phasing the damage I see rogues doing 3-6 times my damage in groups... come on. Im nukeing for about 100 damage a hit at lvl 30 with an adept 1 spell and my pet that you guys claim is good gets resisted NON stop in groups making him compleatly useless. Our DOTS which should make a necro also are HORID they do about 20-40 damage a tick and last only 10 seconds...what is that bs. You guys also state that we can solo well our pets get beat up on a even con with no arrows up and our pet heal does a heal over time that does 60 a tick...mobs are hittign my pet for 600+ whats a 60 damage heal every few seconds gonna do? Also we have spells that atm do NOTHING, I got an ability at lvl 20 or so (something aura) that was suposed to be an adept 1 version of sheild of magi but it does LESS then sheild of magi and when u put it on it increases NOTHING except 1 less buff slot...nice one there sony. I could prob go on alot more cuse I am really upset but the last thing I gotta say is why did you mess up the conn system??? IT was perfect the way it was and now its silly... Its hard as hell to see whats 1 up 2 up 3 up etc and your discription of the changes didnt help at all really. Why do you try to fix something that isnt broken... SPEND THE TIME FIXING WHAT IS BROKEN ALREADY!<p>Message Edited by Brigog on <span class=date_text>02-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:29 PM</span>

[Thesp]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P> <HR> </P> <P>Brigog wrote:<BR>Well I must say there is some things in this patch that were very nice but for the most part ALOT of the big changes compleatly sux. First off lets look at the manditory attune items... In EQ1 you didnt need to attune things and the economy was great, people bought at sold like no tomorrow. <HR> </P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>The eqlive economy was completely mudflated and flooded with items with little value. I can't believe there are people that actually think it worked. Maybe it did when the game was still new, but take a look now, its completely worthless. This change will be a huge boost to the longevity of the economy system for years to come. Hey, if you find something that you know will only last you a couple levels, then maybe you should consider selling it immediately rather than holding on to it. I see no problem with this.</FONT></P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR></P> <P> <HR> </P> <P>Second you guys are changeing and adding things to some classes while you leave others broken to all hell. Zerkers /Guardians /Warlocks /Wizards are gettign alot of attention while other classes are compleatly broken. Necros for instance, we are a DPS class that does JACK for damage. </P> <P> <HR> </P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>Its better to take things one at a time. Focus on one class(es) issues and then move on to the next. Be patient, Rome wasn't built in a day.</FONT></P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P> <HR> </P> <P>I could prob go on alot more cuse I am really upset but the last thing I gotta say is why did you mess up the conn system??? IT was perfect the way it was and now its silly... Its hard as hell to see whats 1 up 2 up 3 up etc and your discription of the changes didnt help at all really. <HR> </P></BLOCKQUOTE><FONT color=#ffff00>Did you read the patch notes where it tells you how to switch back to the old version? Basically you have a choice of one or the other, how do you have a problem with that?<BR></FONT>

[LingusKh]

Give SOE a much larger base of developers a much larger amount of time and I imagine they could do what you ask. Patience my son. They can only concentrate on so much. Next patch I imagine they will offer some fury/necro love. I am happy to sit back, wait and see. While I wait, I am happy playing my fury and my ranger with what I have.

[Brigog]

<blockquote><hr>Thespar wrote:The eqlive economy was completely mudflated and flooded with items with little value. I can't believe there are people that actually think it worked. Maybe it did when the game was still new, but take a look now, its completely worthless. This change will be a huge boost to the longevity of the economy system for years to come. Hey, if you find something that you know will only last you a couple levels, then maybe you should consider selling it immediately rather than holding on to it. I see no problem with this.</FONT><hr></blockquote>Excuse me, first off apprently you havent looks at things like spells for one...we have adept 1's selling for 5gold COME ON most people level 10-30 have but a few gold and they arnt about to spend it all on one spells. As for armor lower prices are good, common items should be cheap and rares should be more expencive.<blockquote><hr>Thespar wrote:Its better to take things one at a time. Focus on one class(es) issues and then move on to the next. Be patient, Rome wasn't built in a day.</FONT><hr></blockquote>Some of us dont have all the time in the world due to things we must do, School/Jobs etc so during the time we do have we would like to play a fun game and not have to worry about how things are screwed up or how things arnt being fixed before others are broken. Also rome wasnt built in a day may be true but they arnt around anymore are they, we dont have all the time in the world and with they money sony makes off this game they can EASILY aford a crew to balance things out quickly. If it was a game like WC3 where u didnt pay per month I could understand limited resources and slower updates but not when u pay and not when its sony.<blockquote><hr>Thespar wrote:Did you read the patch notes where it tells you how to switch back to the old version? Basically you have a choice of one or the other, how do you have a problem with that?</FONT><hr></blockquote>I apoligize, I didnt see that but it was still a waste of time to add somthing that wasnt needed, the old system was perfect imo.BTW What lvl crafter are ya...50? GG<p>Message Edited by Brigog on <span class=date_text>02-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:50 PM</span>

[Thesp]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Brigog wrote:<BR><BR>Excuse me, first off apprently you havent looks at things like spells for one...we have adept 1's selling for 5gold COME ON most people level 10-30 have but a few gold and they arnt about to spend it all on one spells. As for armor lower prices are good, common items should be cheap and rares should be more expencive. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>If they're actually selling for 5g then obviously someone has the money to spend, or are you just seeing prices on the broker? I've noticed some select people have no clue what to price spells at, they see adept I and think they can charge anything they like. If the price is too high, no one buys, simple as that, he either drops his price or sits around with a spell he can't use. I've seen many times someone prices a spell at a rediculous price and a week later he's still got the same spell at the same price, apparently they don't learn. Its a free market economy system, prices are dictated by supply and demand, in the eqlive/mudflation model, supply constantly rises while demand is proportional to the amount of players still interested in that content, you're eventually left with lots of items of no value. In the new, EQ2/attuneable model, supply is proportional to the number of people hunting in the zones that drop the items and the number of artisans making said item, while demand remains proportional as it does in the previous model.</P> <P>It will be much better, trust me. Items will retain their value, this is good for everyone involved.</P>

[Tinn]

<DIV>You forgot to say you were a 50 crafter =</DIV>

[gpochr]

<DIV>I was in a group a while back, and the Necro's pet was out-damaging the group by itself. You shouldn't be doing dps equal to a wizzie or warlock, if you wanted to you should have chosen one of them. Your pet is a safety valve for you, and as such, you accept that benefit for the disadvantage of doing high amounts of damage.</DIV>

[Svan]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P> <HR> Thespar wrote:</P> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>Did you read the patch notes where it tells you how to switch back to the old version? Basically you have a choice of one or the other, how do you have a problem with that?</FONT><BR> <HR> </P></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>they changed the old one slightly too. the box that surrounded the names of the mob/encounter that you have targeted is no longer there, making it harder to see what you have targeted. which sucks.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>imo, if they just added the lvl of the mob next to the name above the mob, it woulda been a lot better.</DIV>

[Aegori]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Brigog wrote:<BR>In EQ1 you didnt need to attune things and the economy was great, people bought at sold like no tomorrow. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>This is wholly untrue in the fact that only rare items held any value. Everything else got watered down to hardly any value in that "economy" due to the endless supply. Even rare items from certain eras of the game lost value over time because they never left the economy (thus becoming common). Common drops had no chance at all to retain value... they dropped faster than... i dunno... something that drops really fast. This is what EQ2 is attempting to avoid and making the game viable for both crafters and adventures. This is a good change.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Aegorian on <span class=date_text>02-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:37 PM</span>

[Brigog]

<blockquote><hr>Aegorian wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Brigog wrote:<BR>In EQ1 you didnt need to attune things and the economy was great, people bought at sold like no tomorrow. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE><DIV>This is wholly untrue in the fact that only rare items held any value. Everything else got watered down to hardly any value in that "economy" due to the endless supply. Even rare items from certain eras of the game lost value over time because they never left the economy (thus becoming common). Common drops had no chance at all to retain value... they dropped faster than... i dunno... something that drops really fast. This is what EQ2 is attempting to avoid and making the game viable for both crafters and adventures. This is a good change.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Aegorian on <span class=date_text>02-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:37 PM</span><hr></blockquote>Umm okie things that are rare at first SHOULD become common as more people find it...Thats why sony makes new items and new expansions...eventualy everyone will have the best items if they dont.

[Aegori]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Brigog wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Aegorian wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Brigog wrote:<BR>In EQ1 you didnt need to attune things and the economy was great, people bought at sold like no tomorrow. <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>This is wholly untrue in the fact that only rare items held any value. Everything else got watered down to hardly any value in that "economy" due to the endless supply. Even rare items from certain eras of the game lost value over time because they never left the economy (thus becoming common). Common drops had no chance at all to retain value... they dropped faster than... i dunno... something that drops really fast. This is what EQ2 is attempting to avoid and making the game viable for both crafters and adventures. This is a good change.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by Aegorian on <SPAN class=date_text>02-17-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>04:37 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Umm okie things that are rare at first SHOULD become common as more people find it...Thats why sony makes new items and new expansions...eventualy everyone will have the best items if they dont.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>True... and they still will, just not as quickly now. Right now, an item will lose value proportionally with the number of people that hit the lvl ranges the items fall in. It's simple: as more players get to 30, lvl 30 item X becomes common, while lvl 30 rare item X retains its rarity. Now, it will at least take 2-3 generations of lvl 30 players to make an item common place in the market since the inital find wont make it into the market. I dont necessarily camp one spot over and over, so i may not be as subject to it, but i rarely find myself selling the same items over and over again. This is good in the fact that it supports my theory, but i guess others do have different play styles than me, so it may not totally hold true. It will, however, slow item commonality down, if not just a little bit. Just a flashback to the EQ forums, one of the things people disliked was the short sitedness in items and the fact they outgrew content too easily with expansions... this may ease at least the item end of that arguement.</P> <P>-Aeg</P><p>Message Edited by Aegorian on <span class=date_text>02-17-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:55 PM</span>

[Svan]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Brigog wrote:<BR><BR>Umm okie things that are rare at first SHOULD become common as more people find it...Thats why sony makes new items and new expansions...eventualy everyone will have the best items if they dont.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>actually, they really shouldnt, not at the lvl that eq1 took it to at least. new expansions usually put in new items for mid to higher lvl characters, leaving low lvl ones with the same stuff. so the items at that lvl have to retain their value over time, or else everyone is gonna be hella poor, unless they're a twink. also, old mid to high lvl items need to retain some of their value too, and not become totally common like you think they should. not everyone has the expansions and has access to these new and great items...</DIV>

[Ash]

<blockquote><hr>Brigog wrote:In EQ1 you didnt need to attune things and the economy was great</span><hr></blockquote>I'm sorry I kinda stopped reading here. Hard to see through the tears of laughter.

[Thesp]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Tinnan wrote:<BR> <DIV>You forgot to say you were a 50 crafter =</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> Actually, I'm only a lvl 22 crafter. Its not the lvl 50s that this helps, they already make the uber-leet-shiz. This helps the up-and-comers, those who get into crafting 2, 6, 12 months from now don't have to come into a market that is already completely saturated.

[CherobylJ]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Brigog wrote:<BR> Zerkers /Guardians /Warlocks /Wizards are gettign alot of attention while other classes are compleatly broken. <P>Message Edited by Brigog on <SPAN class=date_text>02-17-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>12:29 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>No changes for Guards (other than Str nerf).  4 major nerfs to Berserkers since launch and a list of 10+ spells that are still broken outlined in this thread: <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=4&message.id=6172" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=4&message.id=6172</A>  Not really sure what this "attention" you refer to is?  Cant comment on Warlocks/Wizards as havent played those or read their boards with any regularity (or is that Locks and Izards? :smileyhappy<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[aeio]

"compleatly sux."!!

[skr]

<DIV>My only question about the Attune bs is this:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>      Crafters, what will happen, when the cash that the Adventurers have saved up, runs out, and they have no way to sell back items to make a decent amount of that cash back? You guys are gonna get the shaft, is exactly what is going to happen... There will be no more players, or very few, that will have the cash to purchase your items, that you have spent your hard earned cash, and time on, therefore, the economy will die.</DIV>

[BlackHa]

<DIV>The NPC's bought a lot of gear....that went away forever.  Forcing us to sell to other players is what keeps items around. Hence, the whole attune thing. The fanbois bought all of thiese changes...... hook, line, and sinker. </DIV>

[Aegori]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> skrik wrote:<BR> <DIV>My only question about the Attune bs is this:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>      Crafters, what will happen, when the cash that the Adventurers have saved up, runs out, and they have no way to sell back items to make a decent amount of that cash back? You guys are gonna get the shaft, is exactly what is going to happen... There will be no more players, or very few, that will have the cash to purchase your items, that you have spent your hard earned cash, and time on, therefore, the economy will die.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>First off, i'd like to know what lvl you are. I can make a few gp in a matter of minutes of fodder loot at lvl 40. I've always been impressed with the fact that the money you earn scales very well with the money an adventurer needs at any given level. Not to mention the quests. Not sure if you've run into any yet, but i've run into quite a few in the upper 30s that give a few gp as reward. I can only imagine it scales up from there. Also, the money supply will be cyclical in the fact that many adventurers supply the crafters with their ingredients. This isn't always true, but in many cases it is. Not to say your idea doesn't warrant thought, but i would say the scenario you present is an extreme.</P> <P>-Aeg</P><p>Message Edited by Aegorian on <span class=date_text>02-18-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:45 AM</span>

[DjLowball]

<DIV>People who do not see the long term benefit of the short term inconvienience are probobly better off playing WoW.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Really... that game is nice and simple... and you will be happier being led around and attuning items there.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Personally I love seeing the posts of people "I am cancelling all 3 or 4 or 5  of my accounts", all that means to the rest of us is that there will be one less idiot on the server taking up space. And people who quit for the reason of one patch really arent the type of people I want to play with.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you arent happy, quit, thats how you protest. Dont come on forums giving your grand goodbye post, we dont care. Do not make a huge flashy exit spamming how much you hate this game and preaching the glory of WoW. We dont care. Alot of people are in game enjoying the changes and adapting. We will play and be happy, you will not and be happy.... it works</DIV>

[Brigog]

<blockquote><hr>DjLowballer wrote:<DIV>People who do not see the long term benefit of the short term inconvienience are probobly better off playing WoW.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Really... that game is nice and simple... and you will be happier being led around and attuning items there.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Personally I love seeing the posts of people "I am cancelling all 3 or 4 or 5 of my accounts", all that means to the rest of us is that there will be one less idiot on the server taking up space. And people who quit for the reason of one patch really arent the type of people I want to play with.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>If you arent happy, quit, thats how you protest. Dont come on forums giving your grand goodbye post, we dont care. Do not make a huge flashy exit spamming how much you hate this game and preaching the glory of WoW. We dont care. Alot of people are in game enjoying the changes and adapting. We will play and be happy, you will not and be happy.... it works</DIV><hr></blockquote>[FAAR-NERFED!] your dumb...this is the feedback area, I was giving my option on how I think they made alot of bad changes etc, I didnt mention anything about WoW. As for your remark about people with multi accounts and telling them to just quit. It may not seem like much to you but to sony who is in this for the profit it is a big deal plus just beasuse some people have more then one accounts u dont like them...wow how old are you 10? 11?.

[Jade7073]

<DIV>Brig I totally agree... If you factor into the situation where I have little to no money and I do try and craft hmmm how expensive is this to try and craft and play and purchase needed upgrades. Then you factor nice people I was given 2 Forged Cresant Axes and I charish them as they are the best I have ot use... I was given 6 gold by a guildie and 2 more by a kind person and it is slowly deminishing due ot crafting processes.... I have to say the attuneable idea SUX MAJOR S... you finish that if you choose. I mean I can't pass down my dang Axe's to say my other char(s)? How about makeing more items Lore or introduce a new catagory of item that allows 2 of said item on a character... or maybe a flag that shows you have defeated and looted a certain item from a mob and you can never do it again with said character? This is smarter idea to keep down dropped items being camped and flooded into the market and ooutrageous prices, and then steadily dropping to nada. How about the fix the box around the original con system to tell what mobs are part of the encounter for those that wish to use the old system? How about trying to put sujested retail value on item descriptions lol for morons that do not know what a items value should be lol.. yeah I know and who is going to determine price lol but hey it is a idea for those idiots that value a Steal Rapier at 2 gold lol... This is just my RANT lol... I can't stand the attunable and hate that the pally horse got so NERFED I understand checking into major speed buffs that are just ridicules but the pally got smacked hard lol... Good thing I had not gotten my pally horse as of yet or I would be more [Removed for Content] to see my speed go wham lol... <<< happy to have a horse eventually but glad did not have b4 this patch. </DIV>

[Landiin]

<P>Aegorian you are being misleading by saying you make a couple of gold in a matter of min., Yes you may get lucky enuff to wind a fodder drop within the 1st 1 or 2 min of grouping but its no where consistant. They even go so far as to nerf the sell back of thulzite from CT witch was nice for every one in the group to get to make that buggy zone worth going to. I exp in T5 zones and normaly come out with 6 gold tops. After replacing food/drink that leaves me with 3 gold tops and if it was a bad nite that 3 gold will be spent at the mender. </P> <P>With the new attune system, it makes it even harder to do DBG groups because every on needs the drop now to make coin to buy food/dring, repairs and upgrades.</FONT><BR></P>

[warchild]

<BR> <DIV>I keep seeing over and over...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> I can make 4 to 6 gold in a matter of mins.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>                         or</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> the aveage player can make 360g a week</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> would someone like to let the other 70% of us in on how you guys make</DIV> <DIV>this kind of cash?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> for the real aveage player 3 to 4 gold a week is more like it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Aegori]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Landiin wrote:<BR> <P>Aegorian you are being misleading by saying you make a couple of gold in a matter of min., Yes you may get lucky enuff to wind a fodder drop within the 1st 1 or 2 min of grouping but its no where consistant. They even go so far as to nerf the sell back of thulzite from CT witch was nice for every one in the group to get to make that buggy zone worth going to. I exp in T5 zones and normaly come out with 6 gold tops. After replacing food/drink that leaves me with 3 gold tops and if it was a bad nite that 3 gold will be spent at the mender. </P> <P>With the new attune system, it makes it even harder to do DBG groups because every on needs the drop now to make coin to buy food/dring, repairs and upgrades.</FONT><BR></P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P>i guess our concept of a couple of minutes is a bit skewed. As a guardian, i can kill 3-4 mobs every 5 minutes... by a couple i mean 10-15 minutes... usually i can get at least one smal chest drop and 3-4 fodder drops. I wont say it's consistent, but i've come away from nights lately easily with 20+gp in my pocket. Regardless... this may please the masses a bit:</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=general_tradeskill&message.id=46671#M46671" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=general_tradeskill&message.id=46671#M46671</A></P>