current mob cons needs changing

[Bearboo]

<DIV>The newest patch is 'grouped mobs do more melee dmg'</DIV> <DIV>As we all know, any lvl 20+ solo mob that for example cons white is considered 'even fight' any blue con='easy fight' but as we know, this isnt the case.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Since the new patch, a group of say 2 blue con mobs are considerably harder to kill............so should Sony change there con to reflect this?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why are Sony making the game more difficult for solo players? do they not know ppl will quit and pay $15 else where?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>already 6 of my friends have quit due to xp debt, mob difficulty NOT reflected by their con, no solo game play</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Shazzbott_Feldercarb]

<blockquote><hr>Bearbooth wrote:<DIV>The newest patch is 'grouped mobs do more melee dmg'</DIV><DIV>As we all know, any lvl 20+ solo mob that for example cons white is considered 'even fight' any blue con='easy fight' but as we know, this isnt the case.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Since the new patch, a group of say 2 blue con mobs are considerably harder to kill............so should Sony change there con to reflect this?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Why are Sony making the game more difficult for solo players? do they not know ppl will quit and pay $15 else where?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>already 6 of my friends have quit due to xp debt, mob difficulty NOT reflected by their con, no solo game play</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><hr></blockquote>The 'con' system at best is only going to give you an indication of the mobs level relative to your own. It can't take into account, gear, buffs, loaded spells, and tactics. What might be hard for a warrior, might be a cakewalk for a mage. There are just too many variables to consider. As to the group mob change. If in your example, you as a solo player, was fighting a "group" of 2 blue mobs. Why do you feel they should be an 'easy fight'. It would be an easy fight for a group of players. That is why they are "group" mobs.Shazz

[denverguy81]

<DIV>Then perhaps there ought to be more solo mobs then there are now.  It just seems to me that there are more group mobs than solo ones...  and it's especially discouraging, for the solo player, when there's nothing s/he can fight.</DIV>

[Shazzbott_Feldercarb]

<blockquote><hr>denverguy81 wrote:<DIV>Then perhaps there ought to be more solo mobs then there are now. It just seems to me that there are more group mobs than solo ones... and it's especially discouraging, for the solo player, when there's nothing s/he can fight.</DIV><hr></blockquote>Adding more 'solo' mobs isn't going to change much. One of the reason you have a hard time finding solo mobs, is because groups hunt them too. Add more, and you will still be competeing with the groups for them.Shazz

[Bearboo]

<DIV>what I am saying is.......if it was a solo blue con mob.......and it can take your health down to say 70%, why should 2 blue con mobs be able to kill u outright?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, I am sure you know, most of the higher lvl mobs are all grouped......most of the solo ones have 1 or 2 arrows, with Sony's previous patch......even a green con 2 arrow solo mob hits like a yellow con +</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>so before they came out with this unfriendly solo player patch, should they not have put in more solo mobs? or is it Sony's intention to make this game group based, no casual weekend players welcome?</DIV>

[Bearboo]

<DIV>not quite true Shazz. If you were grouped with 5 others....why would u want to hunt a solo blue con mob for 4hrs when u can be doing and gaining significantly more xp hunting group based yellow con + mobs?</DIV>

[Shazzbott_Feldercarb]

<blockquote><hr>Bearbooth wrote:<DIV>what I am saying is.......if it was a solo blue con mob.......and it can take your health down to say 70%, why should 2 blue con mobs be able to kill u outright?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Also, I am sure you know, most of the higher lvl mobs are all grouped......most of the solo ones have 1 or 2 arrows, with Sony's previous patch......even a green con 2 arrow solo mob hits like a yellow con +</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>so before they came out with this unfriendly solo player patch, should they not have put in more solo mobs? or is it Sony's intention to make this game group based, no casual weekend players welcome?</DIV><hr></blockquote>On Test, where Solo is a why of life. I'm never at a loss for creatures to fight. There are almost no groups, except for specific quests. I'm able to do quite a bit solo.As for why, if I can take one and only be down 30%, can 2 beat me like a government mule. Ask any football player who has been doubleteamed, they can tell you why.Shazz

[Shazzbott_Feldercarb]

<blockquote><hr>Bearbooth wrote:<DIV>not quite true Shazz. If you were grouped with 5 others....why would u want to hunt a solo blue con mob for 4hrs when u can be doing and gaining significantly more xp hunting group based yellow con + mobs?</DIV><hr></blockquote>I'm 20 hunting a solo blue con, a group of 5 16s come alone and kill the solo yellow/orange mob.Its all relative. What is blue for you is yellow/orange to someone lower. Shazz

[Grimina]

<DIV>The reason 1 blue mob only takes you down 30%, and 2 will kill you (or at least come close) makes sense when you think about it mathematically.  We'll assume your hps at 1000 for ease, each mob having the ability to knock out 30% of your life before you kill it.  Fight starts, both mobs are hitting you...you are hitting one.  They take you down to 400 life.  You kill Mob1.  Mob2 (still full life mind you) then takes you down another 300 before it too dies.  Now if you have no misses/resists...and neither mob does a super special jujitsu move, you just lived through that fight with 100 life left.  Now we know things don't work like that all the time.  So on average, those mobs will wipe the floor with you.  The same would happen if you had two solo mobs on you.  It isn't the group tag that makes that happen...it's the fact that you have two mobs hitting you.  This is only referring to normal, no arrow, mobs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The single mobs that are one or two arrow...though they may be "solo" in the normal sense of that word...are NOT solo content.  They aren't meant to be soloed.  Think of them like lieutenants compared to privates.  They are stronger and more cunning.  The fact that they could be soloed easily is why these changes were made.  Yes, people can still kill them solo (my husband, a monk, is killing some right now) but it's a lot tougher now.  As it should be.  They are marked "group" for a reason.  Not because there is a group of mobs, but because it should take a group of players to kill them.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The real thing to complain about would be groups killing the solo mobs.  I really dunno why they'd do it (outside of needing them for a quest) but they do kill them.  If they'd stop that, there'd be plenty of solo mobs to be...soloed. Really there isn't THAT big a lack as far as I've experienced (up until 27, couldn't say after that) they are just a little more difficult to get to.</DIV>

[PhourZwanZig]

<DIV>K.. They are talkin about GROUP mobs.. not grouped SOLO mobs...  My guess is this is to make the fight a lil trickier for the group encounters.. Think you get more XP from GROUP mobs.. so if they are just to SOLO mobs w/ the GROUP thrown on it why the EXTRA bonusXP.. Only makes sence..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and BTW, if no1 above mentiond it, that update is on the live servers..  This is for stuff in testing.. PLZ refrain from using this section of the board for other than Test server updates.. Thanks.. It will make us testers so much happier :smileytongue:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>edit..  I just wanted to again try and make this clear.. Just cuz 2 mobs are 2gether dont make it a GROUP mob..  it needs to say GROUP.. a SOLO mob can be more than one mob, just has a SOLO tag on it instead of GROUP..  This is just the encounter type.. What it seems your getting confuzed is that GROUP/SOLO thing..  Again when we talk about SOLO and GROUP we are not just talking about the MOB being groupd or not.. We are talking encounter type.. SOLO- Designed for Solo'ers and GROUP- Designed for Groups to kill.. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Things to Remember:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1. SOLO doesnt mean alone or 1..</DIV> <DIV>2. GROUP doesnt mean more than 1..</DIV> <DIV>3. SOLO and GROUP encounters are just either designed for SOLOers or GROUPers..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Remember those 3 things and maybe itll make a lil better sense..</DIV><p>Message Edited by PhourZwanZig on <span class=date_text>01-04-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:38 PM</span>

[Morl]

<EM>Adding more 'solo' mobs isn't going to change much. One of the reason you have a hard time finding solo mobs, is because groups hunt them too. Add more, and you will still be competeing with the groups for them.</EM> <DIV><BR>A-ha!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If the intent is to make it so that solo players cannot attack group mobs without serious risk of dying to a blue con mob, then how would you propose to balance that for groups attacking solo mobs?  Why not just make it so groups cannot get any xp or loot from solo mobs?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[aeio]

<blockquote><hr>Bearbooth wrote:<DIV>The newest patch is 'grouped mobs do more melee dmg'</DIV><DIV>As we all know, any lvl 20+ solo mob that for example cons white is considered 'even fight' any blue con='easy fight' but as we know, this isnt the case.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Since the new patch, a group of say 2 blue con mobs are considerably harder to kill............so should Sony change there con to reflect this?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Why are Sony making the game more difficult for solo players? do they not know ppl will quit and pay $15 else where?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>already 6 of my friends have quit due to xp debt, mob difficulty NOT reflected by their con, no solo game play</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><hr></blockquote>You ever consider that the mobs were not as powerful as their con message before so the change just corrected that fact?

[Magic]

<DIV>Amen to that, Morlar!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'd like to see SOE make mobs tagged as SOLO that are impossible for groups to kill.  Making them invulnerable to any damage from groups.  Solo players and groups could work together in the same area to kill everything that spawns.  Hmm, what a concept.  Everybody working together in harmony.  You know, it just might work!  :smileyhappy:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV>The idea for this invulnerability first hit me when I was trying to kill a carrion hound that was in the banded armadillo area not far from the thresh bats.  No matter how many arrows I fired into it and hit, it would fully heal instantly and a message would pop up after each hit telling me that the encounter had been broken.  I later realized that this mob was far from home and that this was normal behavior.  I don't think that the encounter should break in the case of a group trying to attack a SOLO mob.  The mob should continue to attack after any group member enters its aggro range.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>If SOE were to make this change, they would need to put correct loot for the SOLO mob's level.  If you kill a white con mob solo, you should get loot that is appropriate to your level.  GROUP mobs get lower level loot because a large number of lower level players can defeat them.  Also, have them put recipe books and what not into SOLO mobs.  I don't want to be forced to group in order to get some of my needed items.  Raids and instanced group zones are exceptions.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So let's hope that they make this change and load it into the Test server!</DIV>

[Lancealittle]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Bearbooth wrote:<BR> <DIV>The newest patch is 'grouped mobs do more melee dmg'</DIV> <DIV>As we all know, any lvl 20+ solo mob that for example cons white is considered 'even fight' any blue con='easy fight' but as we know, this isnt the case.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Since the new patch, a group of say 2 blue con mobs are considerably harder to kill............so should Sony change there con to reflect this?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why are Sony making the game more difficult for solo players? do they not know ppl will quit and pay $15 else where?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>already 6 of my friends have quit due to xp debt, mob difficulty NOT reflected by their con, no solo game play</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You've missed the point entirely. They made 'group' mobs hit harder. How is that affecting your solo play?</P> <P>The blue group mobs are still conned correctly for a group, so no need to change anything.</P> <P>You can use the existing con to determine how difficult something will be to solo. If it says 'group' then it may be too hard to solo. Problem solved.</P>

[CerraWhisperwind]

<blockquote><hr>Bearbooth wrote:<DIV>The newest patch is 'grouped mobs do more melee dmg'</div>On test or on live? This forum is for feedback on TEST patches. Once the patch is on live its a little late for the testing feedback.

[Thyri]

<blockquote><hr>Shazzbott_Feldercarb wrote:<blockquote><hr>Bearbooth wrote:<DIV>The newest patch is 'grouped mobs do more melee dmg'</DIV><DIV>As we all know, any lvl 20+ solo mob that for example cons white is considered 'even fight' any blue con='easy fight' but as we know, this isnt the case.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Since the new patch, a group of say 2 blue con mobs are considerably harder to kill............so should Sony change there con to reflect this?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Why are Sony making the game more difficult for solo players? do they not know ppl will quit and pay $15 else where?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>already 6 of my friends have quit due to xp debt, mob difficulty NOT reflected by their con, no solo game play</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><hr></blockquote>The 'con' system at best is only going to give you an indication of the mobs level relative to your own. It can't take into account, gear, buffs, loaded spells, and tactics. What might be hard for a warrior, might be a cakewalk for a mage. There are just too many variables to consider. As to the group mob change. If in your example, you as a solo player, was fighting a "group" of 2 blue mobs. Why do you feel they should be an 'easy fight'. It would be an easy fight for a group of players. That is why they are "group" mobs.Shazz<hr></blockquote>Exactly, also there are many other things reflecting what mob is "easy" for a group and what mob isnt it. For example, if u have caster hybrid mob (healing and doing magical damage), the mob will be easy with some mages in your group stifling and stunning the mob, without them and a tank that has eqipment 5lvls under him it could get a though fight even if the mob is blue conned. Also dont forget, that a mob "blue++" is coned as blue, but the "++" says, its like 2 lvls higher, which would be like yellow conned if your under lvl25. Also a blue con says, that this single mob will be easy. If your attacking a group of 8 blue con mobs, for sure it wont get easy. The only thing i would generaly say, is that caster mobs in the very lower levels are too low conned. At 25+ they are not more problem then any other mob at all (take a little more mana but no real problem), but at lvl15 or lower if you engage a caster mob its a wipe in most cases due to missing resistances on gear.

[Dyeana]

<DIV>I think there is a point.  With a change earlier, mobs were changed to present a greater risk to a group based on level and gear.  Take Anguis, the drake in Anatonica, a 2 group triple arrow up level 20 mob.  Could kill this mob with less than 2 full groups with the highest person in the groups a level 20, the tank.  Now the group levels up, and we are 25 to 27 and the mob cons green to us, every time we attack it, guess what ... We die.  It now has a 853 dd Area effect and hits between 350 and 450.  This is definately not right and should be corrected to be more in line to present a challange, not present a continual wipe.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Another place where the con is definately out of wack is in Crypt of Betrayal or Ruins of Varsoon.  You can't even solo a greyed out mob there till you are much higher than the mob, on the order of 8 to 10 levels higher if you are very lucky.  All the mobs are double up arrows.  When the grey mobs hit for 150 to 450 and can wipe out any player in range of it's melee, you don't survive too long trying to solo it.  Isn't it enough that you don't get exp from the mob.  Why do these mobs hit way out of proportion to other zones.  Sure it is a tier 3, but does it have to hit like a tier 5 or 6?  Why are these so far out from say even Stormhold, which is very hard for even soloing a green or grey with 1 or 2 person groups? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Princess / Linsha of Test Server</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Miral]

<DIV>I think all casting mobs should have their con upped, at least reward-wise... those things are quite a bit harder than a melee of the same level...</DIV>

[Thyri]

<blockquote><hr>Miral wrote:<DIV>I think all casting mobs should have their con upped, at least reward-wise... those things are quite a bit harder than a melee of the same level...</DIV><hr></blockquote> thats only in the first 25 levels that way, latest at lvl30 even tanks found out that RK isnt all and they should get some good resist rings and such. With good Equipment that has good resistances they are like they are conned. changing that would be like having a lvl20 melee mob being whit against a tank and orange against a caster

[Miral]

<DIV>But PC casters dont have the same hp and defense as a PC melee, while for NPCs that seems to be the case <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Bruge]

<DIV>Maybe the con should take into account your gear, stats, resists, spell/skill levels, past skill performance, internet connection, race and hair style.... calculate all that up vs mob.... then have only 2 con colors, Green = you can kill this, Red = you cant kill this.....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Con "Color" is nothing more than the mobs lvl against your lvl.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think they should just make every mob in the game show as a plain white name. You have no idea what level it is, how many arrows up or down. Make it more realisitic instead of some magically ability where you can tell what the mobs sisters name is and what color its favorite flowers are.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Things are already over simplified as is. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Ethi]

<DIV>FYI a group of players would general not bother with solo mobs unless they are around group mobs and will agro, or they are needed for a quest.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Solo mobs give a group virtually no xp.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you look around there are numberous places where there are solo mobs and not a soul in sight.  If you need help finding solo mobs to fight at a certain level range just post your level and I'm sure someone can help you out.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>