Stalk vs. Surveil

[Cariana]

<DIV>I have a question that I hope you all could help me with.  We were on a raid the other night and there was an assassin in our group who was telling another assassin to pull with Stalk instead of Surveil.  As a matter of fact he insisted on it, as he was told by someone ages ago to always make sure he uses Stalk instead of its upgrades.  Supposedly he says there is less chance of social aggro.  Now, seeing as I am not an assassin, and have no experience with the spells, I was wondering if anyone could verify this information for me.  Thanks so much for the help!</DIV>

[whytakemine]

I've never had anything social when using any of the stalk/surveil line spells.  I've never used stalk though, since I didn't catch on to the surveil pulling until my 30's (great fun to pull nameds in RE without clearing to them).I did have a ranger friend who is not quite 70 tell me that he tried using improved surveil to pull a named in one of the new instance zones and it aggro'd the werewolves around the named too.  I haven't had that problem with surveillance.  The only thing I can think of is he had some gear on that proc's on spell use, and surveil is considered a spell?<div></div>

[Jvaloth]

<DIV>Hmmm, </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Are you sure surveil doesnt prox pull social agro now??</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I surveiled a few times, got adds and have never done it since.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[jacobag]

<P>I regularly use improved surveil to pull names and any other mobs that we want to single pull without social agro. The only time that I get socials is if they are linked, and you can forsee this by using your tab key to target.  The only thought that I have on your getting socials is that you were not at max range (35 meters) and you accidentally body pulled. I hope that my experience with this spell has be helpful.</P> <P>Zeeman 70 assassin Permafrost</P>

[Computer MAn]

I regulary pull mobs with Surveilance and it works fine. Anything from pulling heroics in Kaladim to pulling x2's in CMM the only times I have ever had problems is when I am grouped with a troubador and forget about their spell procs.<div></div>

[Sirlutt]

Surveil = social agroSurveilance = no social agro.<div></div>

[Graton]

he probably got adds because he fired off a proc but he didn't realize this and blamed surveil. i use surveillance to pull but i would imagine the line is the same across the board.  if you are surveillance pulling you need to make very sure that take off any spell procs you have or you risk getting everything within social range.the other possibility i had not considered is that the lower spell is resisted ( not sure surveil can be resisted , i've never seen it ) and that means it's treated just like an attack. i seriously suspect though that the time he got adds was a proc. that's burned me more than once. when i duo with my troub friend though he knows enough not to put procs on me.<div></div>

[Jayad]

The line is not the same across the board.  Surveillance is the only no-aggro one.

[Mystiq]

<div><blockquote><hr>Xney wrote:<div></div>The line is not the same across the board.  Surveillance is the only no-aggro one.<hr></blockquote>In my experience on my Assassin and of our other guild's Assassin, this has proven to be the case.</div>

[Jayad]

<DIV>I should clarify - the Surveil line all can pull without social *sometimes*, but Surveillance is the only one that does it *every time*.  The other ones are not safe.</DIV>

[Jvaloth]

<DIV>Ah there we go, </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I was using  Improved Surveil back in the day.  Since it always pulled social,  I never even tried with Surveillance.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Very cool, good to know.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Nice to see Assassin have something cool to add to a group besides straight DPS.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[whytakemine]

<div><blockquote><hr>Xney wrote:<div></div> <div>I should clarify - the Surveil line all can pull without social *sometimes*, but Surveillance is the only one that does it *every time*.  The other ones are not safe.</div><hr></blockquote>Was this a semi-recent change?  I haven't used anything but surveilance since I hit 70, but I've used the surveil line for ages and never had anything social.  Since the group I usually leveled with had no pet classes (and before the range was nerfed on surveil), I used it quite a bit to long range non-aggro pull.  I'm sure I used it every time I went to RE, and every time we ran Cazel's, not to mention all the one-off situations it cropped up.  I find it hard to believe that in all those pulls I was just lucky...</div>

[Arda]

<div></div>Until some days ago I never used Surveillance for pulling as well, since I experienced social aggro once in a while with the lower spells in the line before. But then I gave it another go and it works absolutely fine. I always look into my buff bar exspecially if there is a wizard or a bard in my group because of their dmg-procs. Then I just switch them off and pulling works with no problems at all.Someone told me that the A3 version would make social aggro, but the master one doesn't. Since I've got the m1 version, I can't test it. Can anyone have a look at this?<div></div><p>Nachricht bearbeitet von Ardain3 am <span class=date_text>12-13-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:40 AM</span>

[Cariana]

Thanks so much for the input.  Now all I have to do is see if he'll read this forum and give it a try!  Hehe.  Thank you all!

[Jayad]

The adept1, adept3, and master 1 versions all work the same.  Although i'm not sure what happens if it's resisted - that might be a reason the m1 is better for pulling purposes.