Kiting

[asdfaseerd]

<DIV>Sure its cheesy...but how do you propose they "fix" it as i read through articles about assassin's ability to solo? other than mob ability to summon...on select mobs like in EQ1..which would be acceptable - especially if it stops after /yell</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>but is it really something to "fix" ? be able to kill any mob that doesnt cast...at the cost of time and arrows(iron hunting arrows are still not grey at 48..probably 50 too, for 6c -- granted the more expensive ones do more damage...but not that much more). </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>otherwise we cant solo for chit <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> unless you count solo mobs...which are worthless at 40+ *cough*anylevel*cough*. unless you are twinked out of course</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Graton]

how would they "fix" it? 1. lower combat speed and raise average mob speed so you couldn't stay away from them 2. make it so you couldn't cast  combat spells while moving 3. put in a new damage mitigation factor that only applies when a mob is hit while moving lots of ways most of which will probably end up affecting lots of things outside of kiting so here's hoping they don't "fix" it. <div></div>

[fcw04]

<DIV><img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[InuyMa]

I'm kind of leaning towards mob speed going up once they are engaged, not enough that they can catch you while sprinting, but enough that you can't move around and damage them forever. <div></div>

[Lo]

Ha ... If they fix that i suppose they're going to fix the fighters ability to solo nameds ++  blue mobs without even running ? <div></div>

[Unfeter]

<P>I soloed Chomper last night who to my surprise was till green to me.  My horse a bunch of arrows and 5 poisons applied and 5 minutes later.. Chomper was dead and had dropped me a master chest.</P> <P>Please never change kiting.</P>

[Lo]

Lucky you, i had 2 master chests in 150 + named mobs kills ... or maybe unlucky me ... <div></div>

[Tazzrin]

<DIV>huhu</DIV>

[Bjerde]

Assassins have to be one of the worst classes to solo....which sucks cause I like to solo sometimes. I just got access to the new solo instanced area in Nek (Necromancers somethin..) I went in there and there are all solo mobs, but I can't get very far in there. I have good equip and lots of Adepts too. I have to use Assassin's Blade to start out an even con mob, or I won't make it thru the fight....we all know that it has a long recast timer. So, I resorted to trying to kite mobs down halls to get some good damage in before doing my pathetic front facing attacks. It was quite funny actually as I am not used to playing like this, but it is the only way to kill mobs. I had to zone trying this tactic with a single ^ yellow mob. He was too tuff for me. In short, I guess we are not a solo class, I think we do good damage in groups....although I am only level 27 and we shall see how that scales. Assassin is a really cool class, I love playing it....I hope they make the class a desirable one. I guess my point to all this, if they take away kiting...we wont be able to solo anything but single blues.....and you will be in the orange or red when you are done : ) Fun stuff. <div></div>

[Lo]

Did i mention that Sks and prolly other fighters can solo Iceberg ? So the problem isn't maybe only in the scout archetype ... <div></div>

[Kokus]

<DIV>The scout archtype is broken. That's all there is to it. There is almost no reason whatsoever currently to play a scout. Let's look at the advantage a fighter has over a scout:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>More Base Damage</DIV> <DIV>More Hit Points</DIV> <DIV>More Mitigation</DIV> <DIV>More Avoidance (yes even if you have over 100 more agility than a equally equipped fighter, they have more avoidance)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So they deal more base damage, can take more hits, get hit for less, and get hit less often. Why are we playing a scout?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I first started playing scouts could at least avoid more than a fighter. That was our only thing we had over them. Now we don't even have that since the agility nerf. I go back to it so often, but it's the biggest hit the scouts have taken to an already broken archtype. The new combat changes on test don't seem to favor scouts either. Plus with the improved mitigation on light armor, it's just stupid. Light armor drops all the time for us on our raids. More mitigation, and better stats compared to medium. Fighters are just spoiled rotten, and are getting looked at and tweaked out more and more all the time, while the scouts catch random nerfs ("fixes") putting us farther down in the hierachy of usefulness.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But we are talking about kiting.. and you know what? Fighters can do it too. We just don't have to spend as long doing it, but they run less risk of suddenly getting stunned and dropped by an even con named mob.</DIV>

[Putka]

<DIV>Eek I didn't expect such a rant from you <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Calm down it'll be ok hehe <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Don't judge the test changes too early please, you know well that the VAST majority ofthem are still coming, sweeping changes with all 24 classes, heck, they're even revamping the entire spell system. CAs won't even improve with levels anymore, there will be new ones etc. And it was already stated that once all is said and done, scouts WILL outdamage fighters.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And they're changing items too, so things like the RGF that make fighters so powerful, probably wont be as good anymore <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, how can you say there's no reason to play a scout? What exactly should the reason be? I always thought you were supposed to choose a class whos play style you like best, who you enjoy playing.. So now that some fighter occasionaly outdamages you, you're suddenly not having fun anymore? That doesn't really make sense. Maybe you're a person who likes to play the currently most powerful FOTM classes then? MMOs change so often that you could have a new "highest DPS" class out there every other month.. you'd be very busy rerolling <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Putka]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kokusho wrote:<BR> <DIV>There is almost no reason whatsoever currently to play a scout. Let's look at the advantage a fighter has over a scout:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>More Base Damage</DIV> <DIV>More Hit Points</DIV> <DIV>More Mitigation</DIV> <DIV>More Avoidance (yes even if you have over 100 more agility than a equally equipped fighter, they have more avoidance)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So they deal more base damage, can take more hits, get hit for less, and get hit less often. Why are we playing a scout?</DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Let's take a look at what makes scouts fun for <STRONG>me:</STRONG></P> <P><STRONG>Safe Fall</STRONG> - I love this, silly tin can tanks going splat down the mining shaft in Vallon Foundry, while I just hop down in 3 jumps :smileyvery-happy: I love jumping off Permafrost, the big spire thingy in Zek, cliffs.. great fun <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P><STRONG>Speed - </STRONG>Yeah well it's just 16% from pathfinding (if you're not a bard) but let me assure you, you'll miss these 16% once you crawl around with your fat plated [Removed for Content].</P> <P><STRONG>Big Hits - </STRONG>Having fun debuffing mobs as much as I can and then going "Yay new high hit with CB!" :smileyvery-happy: I just love unloading all those massive hits <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P><STRONG>Sneaking & Evac - </STRONG>I don't know what I'd do without these. I love snooping around unfamiliar locations and picking up quests, sneaking down deep inside dungeons to join groups.. and if anything goes wrong I can just easily Escape. I'm not afraid to go anywhere, there is no risk.</P> <P>And about tanks mitigating more than us.. lol yeah well, we're a DPS class, I'm not bothered by our mitigation. I always laugh out loud when a warlock pulls aggro and gets 1-shotted from just about anything.. Want to see what happens once they lose Parry as well? Poor [Removed for Content] <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> They sacrifice so much for so little DPS over us. I don't remember the last time I died because I got aggro though.. /shrug</P> <P>There's just so many of these little "unimportant" things that you take for granted every day that make the class so much fun.. so what if all this stuff is pointless on raids? All you do is raid all day every day, you've forgotten what this game and your class is all about, you're not having fun anymore.. sad :smileysad: Maybe you will find enjoyment again in the expansion, when you'll be using all these abilities again while grinding to 60 and doing new heritages etc.</P> <P>You're clouded by the emotions about your class I'm afraid <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> You only see the worst things about it, and only the best things about every other class. I have a lv50 wizard friend, who just unguilded and rejoined with her (now lv43) assassin. She is so disgusted by her wizzy that she gets upset just by talking to me about it. Another friend has a 50 warlock that he never logs in anymore, and is now playing a ranger. He always brags about how he's nuking mobs with his bow, and how great his damage is. This is coming from a 50 warlock.. Also I should mention they were both active raiders on their mains.</P> <P>So far every single assassin I talked about was having great fun with the class, except the forum assassins. I dunno, maybe the class does have all the problems you complain about, but then, maybe youre just one of those unlucky people that made the wrong class choice. If this is the case, I would suggest you reroll now. You are rich and skilled enough to easily grind it out to 50 weeks before the Desert of Flames is out. You have friends who will help you as well.. just stop torturing yourself. Pick the right class.</P><p>Message Edited by Putka on <span class=date_text>05-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:53 AM</span>

[Kokus]

<DIV>Putka said: <HR> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <DIV>Also, how can you say there's no reason to play a scout? What exactly should the reason be? I always thought you were supposed to choose a class whos play style you like best, who you enjoy playing.. So now that some fighter occasionaly outdamages you, you're suddenly not having fun anymore? That doesn't really make sense. Maybe you're a person who likes to play the currently most powerful FOTM classes then? MMOs change so often that you could have a new "highest DPS" class out there every other month.. you'd be very busy rerolling</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <P>You are absolutely right. I still play my assassin because it is fun, regardless of being outclassed in practically every situation and people should keep playing their assassins as long as they are having fun.</P>

[Brianf]

<P>2 points since this thread seems to have split in two.</P> <P> </P> <P>1. Kiting - I occasionally use this but more often I include it into a fight as I start to run on the close ones. Slow em, stun em, run backward and fire off a couple heavy hitters as you go and you cna sometimes drop them. As for pulling somethign and running around in circles to kill it? I did that once or twice on the beach in Nek with the ^^Spiders back when they were green to me but in most areas running backwards did not work too well for me.</P> <P> </P> <P>2. Assassins and are they fun? - Mine is, I know I'll hear form the 50's crowd saying it won't be some day. I have to disagree because thanks to all of you there are things getting fixed every month. i won't hit 50 probably until the expansion comes out to go to 60 so I still won't be at an end game. I like that. I want to pace myself so that this game is never some oft-repeated raid or event every week in hopes that this time I get the UBER CHEST OF GREATNESS. That is not why I joined the game and while I would love to find that chest I am just as happy running through different Heritage and other quests and delving deep into the dungeons with my companions by my side wondering what we will find around that next bend.</P> <P> </P> <P>But I do want to thank all of you 50's out there for testing the ground ahead and warning of pitfalls and traps that need to be fixed before I come plodding along with that silly "I'm having fun" grin plastered on my face <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P>

[ERROR]

<div></div><font face="Arial"><strong>Safe Fall</strong> - Monks get this skill aswell I believe. Maybe some other classes too? Not sure.<strong>Speed - </strong>Priests SOW is faster then our PF<strong>Big Hits - </strong>Big Melee hits are nice, you're right, but when you're in a group, people don't care if the hits are Magic or Melee.<strong>Sneaking & Evac - </strong>Too many classes get group sneak at high levels, and a few mage classes get evac. Please understand, I'm not trashing Assassins. I love playing my Assassin and I would never reroll my main as another class. To tell you the truth, I'm not really sure what exactly I like about the class in general, but I do enjoy playing him. I commented on those abilitys because I don't agree that they are things that us Assassins have "over" other classes. <strong>Kiting: </strong>Love it... seriously, to death. If they took away kiting I have absolutly no idea what I would do with my time while I was trying to get into a group. I'd still be like, level 25 or something. <a href="../view_profile?user.id=4259" target="top"><span></span></a><span></span></font><div></div>

[Putka]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> ERROR wrote:<BR> <P><FONT face=Arial><STRONG>Safe Fall</STRONG> - Monks get this skill aswell I believe. Maybe some other classes too? Not sure. <FONT color=#6699ff>Well good for them, they enjoy it as well, I guess <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT><STRONG><BR>Speed - </STRONG>Priests SOW is faster then our PF. <FONT color=#6699ff>Your point..? Why would I care if some druid and shaman have a faster speed buff? /boggle</FONT><STRONG><BR>Big Hits - </STRONG>Big Melee hits are nice, you're right, but when you're in a group, people don't care if the hits are Magic or Melee. <FONT color=#6699ff>I don't care if they're melee or magic either. I just said I like doing these massive hits, looking at big numbers, and checking out the highest hit rankings.</FONT><STRONG><BR>Sneaking & Evac - </STRONG>Too many classes get group sneak at high levels, and a few mage classes get evac. <FONT color=#6699ff>Too many? 4.. both rogues, fury and illusionist. 1 mage has evac- wizard. Once again, I do not care if they have these things, I said sneaking and evac are what I enjoy about my class. I like having them.</FONT><BR><BR>I commented on those abilitys because I don't agree that they are things that us Assassins have "over" other classes. <FONT color=#6699ff>And where have I stated that I have these things over other classes? If you reread my post, I think it says something like "these are the things that make my class fun for me"</FONT></FONT><FONT face=Arial><BR><BR><STRONG>Kiting: </STRONG>Love it... seriously, to death. If they took away kiting I have absolutly no idea what I would do with my time while I was trying to get into a group. I'd still be like, level 25 or something. <FONT color=#6699ff>Well that sucks.. I never had group issues as an assassin. My defiler on the other hand had to beg for groups :smileyvery-happy:</FONT></FONT></P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/view_profile?user.id=4259" target=top><SPAN></SPAN></A><SPAN></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR></DIV>

[ERROR]

Okay, we have different oppinions and we're both intitled to them. I wasn't attacking you. Before this thread goes to crap, lets move on. Kiting: <div></div>

[Kokus]

Kiting lets me kill Iceberg and the Overfiend =)

[ERROR]

I can't kite named mobs anymore... they run faster then me. Anyone else? <div></div>

[Brianf]

They nerfed it the other day...

[Amise]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><span>Not exactly, they just made ^^^ mobs immune to runspeed changes.  Over the last few days I've done the broodmother, bloodthirsty leopard, tundra jack + iceberg,  chieftain iceburn, manticore terror lord, devout thule sattar, hukulan the despoiler.   None of them have changed in difficulty since that patch. However I am totally expecting some kind of nerf when combat changes go live.  I won't mind as long as our ability to solo is on a par with everyone else's.  I am fairly well equipped, several raid drops and prismatic and stuff.    But I did a kill 10 sheep quest in EF last week and I had to kite some of those grey sheep because they came close to killing me.  So given that I don't feel at all bad that not everyone can kite. </span><div></div><p>Message Edited by Amise on <span class=date_text>05-20-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:11 AM</span>

[jpace1976]

I'm a casual player and my assassin is my main. I've had him since release and I'm lvl 20...that's how casual a player I am, but anyway...I would like it if we could solo a little better. I don't uaually have time for groups to form when I log on. The thing that bothers me about our class is that we're supposed to be Assassins...by defination we should work alone. I'm not asking to be able to solo groups of mobs by myself, but I think we should be a little more efficient in 1 on 1 combat. If not, just rename our class to thief or something. Just a thought. <div></div>

[Brianf]

<P>We are good at one on one killing (at least up to 36 so far). The key to this is good equipment adn a good strategy and understanding your strengths and weaknesses. In a straight up brawl fight with no spells coming at me I can take something up to 5 levels higher than me (Nightbloods currently). But if you add in spells it becomes dicey with yellow cons unless I get off a flurry of damage before the get a chance to do anything. All my equipment is and has been orange con or heritage or D'Morte/Ravenring (adds to Str and Dex). That is the key to our success. Solo'd I have a 165 Dex and a 100 Str. I am thinking of switching over to rare leather to add in more Str bonus but want to think about it more first. Grouping I often hit 230-250 Dex and 140 Str. </P> <P>Speaking of grouping, you may not liek it but that really is where we shine. Put me behind a big mean ??? and a big meaty tank in front and big mean ??'s start dropping like flies. We are made as a DPS machine and with practice and the right equipment we can be for quite soem time. Granted I am getting out DPS'd some times by others but that is usually becuase they are higher level than me. at 36 I can still out DPS most of the time in battles that last longer than 5 seconds.</P> <P> </P>