Why be a ranger when you can be an assassin?

[chrno01]

<font color="FF6600"><b>Really, from what ive seen all there CA are better, faster, don't have to worry about position to use their CA. Their CA seem like they have more utilities attached to them as well. So what incentive do I really have for being a ranger any more when theres the assassin. What is sony giving us to be rangers? I mean....the dark side even LOOKS cooler. That, and I don't have to worry about buying so many arrows to actually be able to use my CA. Only reason really I havn't betrayed is im on pvp server and I don't want to work 100k faction just to buy the special gear on the other side. Also could a ranger post the T7 attacks for me. Preferably all adept 3 or higher quality. </b></font><div></div>

[Jayad]

There's no reason.  Well, you get an attack bird#!#@!

[wvorster]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Xney wrote:<div></div>There's no reason.  Well, you get an attack bird#!#@!<hr></blockquote><font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> </font><font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> he has a point ...</font><font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> </font> <font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> </font> <font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> </font><font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> That bird kicks [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] vs classes like brigands / assasins in pvp ... keeps dropping them out of stealth so they can't get any of their stealthed attacks off <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></font><font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="3"> </font> <b><i><font color="#ccff00" face="Verdana" size="4">Andariel 70th Ranger - Darathar</font></i></b> <div></div><p>Message Edited by wvorster on <span class=date_text>07-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:25 AM</span>

[Merkad]

I don't play evil classes. And while I would rather not be an Archer, I do tend to play Rangers/Druids (except when the Druid is a healer class). Even though I personally don't feel I help my guild enough to justify my presence, they don't mind and like me, so I can live with how things are. Though I certainly have less love for the raid parser <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Merkades, 70th Ranger.Siege, Najena.

[Teksun]

I still think it would be funny if we got every Ranger on the forums to betray to assassin... Keep your ranger stuff in bank, we'll be back, just on strike, LOL<div></div>

[Gareorn]

<DIV>Rangers definately take a back seat to assassins as far as DPS goes.  But, Rangers are without a doubt an excellent class to play.  99% of the guilds in this game are not going to care about the little bit of difference between the two classes DPS.  I recommend playing the class that suits your play style to maximize your enjoyment.  Besides, the only thing consistant in this game is change.  You can count on change.  Who's on top today, will not be on top tomorrow.</DIV>

[BooDon]

<P>We were taking down labs last night and our raid assasin got owned by those firedrakes 4 times.  Guess who didn't die?  Yep the arrow slinger in the back.</P> <P>I can occasionally beat assasins in parses on trash (I go balls out and win on named fights) but sometimes playing a ranger makes you feel like a chain wearing wizard.  Rangers, being the "broken/inferior class" that we are, still do some dmg.  I don't think our raid sucess depends on the fact that the assasin is doing 150 more dps than me.  They do more dmg but I don't need to be healed as much or deaggro as much.  Against mobs like Corsolander and Talendor I get to sit back and dps like crazy while the poor assasin has to joust so he doesn't spawn adds or get hit by a dmg shield.  Also more assasins = less rangers which means I have to compete with less, sometimes no one on fabled bow drops.</P> <P>Don't worry boys and girls, it will cycle around again where we will be top dog like in t6 days, heck maybe even a group buff.  But thats just wishful thinking.</P>

[Sirlutt]

<div><blockquote><hr>Gareorn wrote:<div></div> <div>Rangers definately take a back seat to assassins as far as DPS goes.  But, Rangers are without a doubt an excellent class to play.  99% of the guilds in this game are not going to care about the little bit of difference between the two classes DPS.  I recommend playing the class that suits your play style to maximize your enjoyment.  Besides, the only thing consistant in this game is change.  You can count on change.  Who's on top today, will not be on top tomorrow.</div><hr></blockquote>I wouldnt say definately.. but its far easier to extract the DPS from an assassin than Ranger .. i get beaten regularly by the rangers in our guild on raids.they are fully fabled, lvl 70 with almost all their masters .. and i am a mixture of treasured, legendary, and a couple of fabled armor with a few masters the rest adpet 1.. and only lvl 69.. but they do beat me about 50-70% of the time.When i have the same gear?.. i think we will be pretty even.One thing i miss from being a ranger is you dont have to contantly readjust your position.. stuff is always in range pretty much .. as an assassin i have to reposition almost every mob.. especially if i want to get my back attacks off.</div>

[Tseri]

<DIV>Been raiding a little over a month now.  I started off with zero fabled and a mix of Legendary/mastercrafter/treasured, zero masters a few adept 3's then rest ad1 with amazing shot and surveillance still at app4.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Our assassins kicked my hiney in parses.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm now sitting at 4 fabled, the rest legendary/mastercrafted/treasured, 4 masters(inc selection M2), a couple more adept3's and I respec'd my agi/int AA's to agi/str with both poise and selection.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>On our last Labs run My damage was -noticibly- higher and much closer to being on par with the assassin who has mostly fabled and too [Removed for Content] many masters to keep track of.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It's still frustrating as hell when he outdamages me, but I have faith that the situation will be rectified once our gear and CA's are comparable.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, why be an assassin when you can be a Ranger? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[SnakeMalo]

Thats like asking why eat a beautiful perfect chocolate cake when you can eat feces infested maggot bread....Being a ranger is playstyle we have learnt to love, even though we have suffered some changes we are still here to stay. I have out parsed rangers even at my level and with no fabled or legendary. We are sought after in groups cause there is not alot of us around, and we do alot of dps without needing to be healed every few seconds. We dont need to be babysat and can fend for ourself in any situation.We may have to pay for arrows, but you pay for it in repairs. We may have to stand back, but your the first one to get eaten. Rangers may have to be behind the target, but assassins are still ugly.That is all.<p>Message Edited by SnakeMalone on <span class=date_text>07-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:28 PM</span>

[Teksun]

<div><blockquote><hr>SnakeMalone wrote:Thats like asking why eat a beautiful perfect chocolate cake when you can eat feces infested maggot bread....<hr></blockquote>/[Removed for Content]that's funny right there</div>

[Shoenasty]

LOL.  Snake,  that was funny.

[Amwix]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Sirlutt wrote:<div>they are fully fabled, lvl 70 with almost all their masters .. and i am a mixture of treasured, legendary, and a couple of fabled armor with a few masters the rest adpet 1.. and only lvl 69.. but they do beat me about 50-70% of the time.When i have the same gear?.. i think we will be pretty even.</div><hr></blockquote>This comment shows the issue.  Your not lvl 70 you dont have fable kit and you dont have AD3+ spells but you still beat a lvl 70 fable kitted master useing ranger...  Do you see the problem now?When raiding im ALWAYS out dps by assasins.  im mix of master craft and Fables (couple of relic's, bows, other random stuff, 95% of my CA's are Ad3+)  i parse 600 - 800dps (some times highter / lower).Assasins built the same gear wise are with CA's @ AD3+ are they parse 1.1k+.  There are the fights that stop them from meleeing.. Tala or the DS guy in lab.Sorry to break anyones idea's about how close we are but its just not going to happen.. Dont get me wrong Ranger is good fun but we are no T1 DPS.Note: One thing to note with parsers.. some of them work out the dmg differently so its in no way the be all and end all.  but it helps work out where you stand in the grand scheme of things.</div><p>Message Edited by Amwix on <span class=date_text>07-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:15 PM</span>

[BSbon]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Chrystolred wrote:<BR><FONT color=#ff6600><B> don't have to worry about position to use their CA. </B></FONT> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>do you have an assassin?

[chrno01]

<blockquote><hr>bongotez wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Chrystolred wrote:<font color="#ff6600"><b> don't have to worry about position to use their CA. </b></font> <div></div> <hr> </blockquote>do you have an assassin?<hr></blockquote><font color="FF6600"><b>I meant distance when I said position. Sure you have the back but they don't have to be a certain distance to use half there attacks. Some times its hard to be far enough way in close quarters or to avoid agroing something. Ever since I played a ranger all ive seen is that we've been screwed over basically every patch. The only thing we have been given is a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ty 4 second root. Now they took away our utility poisons before T7, no more stun or stifle poison now. I want to know when we actually get something to be proud of, something that makes us actually worth something in the game.</b></font><div></div>

[Recca[BK]]

oh assassins have a range it right next to the mob and in AE range. yeah rangers were screwed with the proc day of lu13, grnted you got nerfed a bit too hard. im still pullin for a new boost to the rangers. when did they take away stun poions? i sold some tonight.

[Sirlutt]

<div><blockquote><hr>Amwix wrote:<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Sirlutt wrote:<div>they are fully fabled, lvl 70 with almost all their masters .. and i am a mixture of treasured, legendary, and a couple of fabled armor with a few masters the rest adpet 1.. and only lvl 69.. but they do beat me about 50-70% of the time.When i have the same gear?.. i think we will be pretty even.</div><hr></blockquote>This comment shows the issue.  Your not lvl 70 you dont have fable kit and you dont have AD3+ spells but you still beat a lvl 70 fable kitted master useing ranger...  Do you see the problem now?When raiding im ALWAYS out dps by assasins.  im mix of master craft and Fables (couple of relic's, bows, other random stuff, 95% of my CA's are Ad3+)  i parse 600 - 800dps (some times highter / lower).Assasins built the same gear wise are with CA's @ AD3+ are they parse 1.1k+.  There are the fights that stop them from meleeing.. Tala or the DS guy in lab.Sorry to break anyones idea's about how close we are but its just not going to happen.. Dont get me wrong Ranger is good fun but we are no T1 DPS.Note: One thing to note with parsers.. some of them work out the dmg differently so its in no way the be all and end all.  but it helps work out where you stand in the grand scheme of things.</div><p>Message Edited by Amwix on <span class="date_text">07-17-2006</span> <span class="time_text">07:15 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>its not as clear cut as that..its very situational .. and i have to work hard for my DPS .. ALOT of moving around.. when the MA changes targets, its generally always in bow range, its usually not in my melee range and I have to move.  Also fights with multiple mobs they always beat me on, I really only out parse them on large single fights.. and then its hit and miss..it depends who's big CA's are up.. and who puts in the most effort.. i have to try my [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] off to beat them..I will say that all 3 of our rangers know their class inside out and one in particular is amazing.. i count myself very lucky if i beat her or am within 100DPS.</div>

[Amwix]

<div><blockquote><hr>Sirlutt wrote:<div><blockquote><hr></blockquote>its not as clear cut as that..its very situational .. and i have to work hard for my DPS .. ALOT of moving around.. when the MA changes targets, its generally always in bow range, its usually not in my melee range and I have to move.  Also fights with multiple mobs they always beat me on, I really only out parse them on large single fights.. and then its hit and miss..it depends who's big CA's are up.. and who puts in the most effort.. i have to try my [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] off to beat them..I will say that all 3 of our rangers know their class inside out and one in particular is amazing.. i count myself very lucky if i beat her or am within 100DPS.</div><hr></blockquote>Im not sure i put my point correctly becouse you seem to have missed what i was saying.  I understand you work hard and there are times when you wont beat them but the point is that you do beat them.  your NOT 70, your NOT in the same lvl of gear and your NOT using the same level of spells.When you hit the mob becouse your lvl is lower you suffer a pen check on that roll.  that pen check is based on mit, resistances, attack power, and level.  the fact that you can beat them is where the problem sits for me.  Not raggin on you personally you have to understand its just the whole mess up why it works.  Hell you may be an unreal player and your rangers may suck <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> but you have said this isnt the case.in this case we are compairing a standard equiped Assasin with rangers that have worked hard as hell to get Fable/master kits.  they shouldnt even have to worry about being out done in what they are ment to be doing.. and lets face it rangers and assasins only bring DPS to the table.  its what we are ment to do.Over a whole nights fighting (even tho this sample set is to small its all i have on me) assasins beat me 80% of the time (wont even bother with what nec/conj do lol).I dont feel we should beat you guys all the time what im asking for and what i really want is to be compairable.  It should be some where about 50/50.   Some times you win sometimes we win..</div>

[LoreLady]

If you want to feel a use on raids, as well as dps go assassin.. If you want the long road of waiting stick with ranger. Either way its a rocky road.

[Jayad]

This is anecdotal, but my brother who is equally skilled to me now has his assassin outparsing my better-equipped/mastered ranger.   By the time he gets to the same gear level and masters, I suspect he'll be right around +20% to what I can do, if not more.  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I wonder if SOE will wake up and smell the un-nerf coffee?

[LoreLady]

<div><blockquote><hr>Xney wrote:<div></div>This is anecdotal, but my brother who is equally skilled to me now has his assassin outparsing my better-equipped/mastered ranger.   By the time he gets to the same gear level and masters, I suspect he'll be right around +20% to what I can do, if not more.  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I wonder if SOE will wake up and smell the un-nerf coffee?<hr></blockquote>Bet ya 50 plat its right before the expansion when all this crap becomes game breaking due to changes.</div>

[Amwix]

<div><blockquote><hr>LoreLady wrote:<div><blockquote><hr><div></div></blockquote>Bet ya 50 plat its right before the expansion when all this crap becomes game breaking due to changes.</div><hr></blockquote>Ill take that bet!! <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> 50 says its about 2 - 4 weeks after expantion.. when they go over logs of high lvl guilds to make sure DPS / encounters they designed are where they want them to be.  and the workout there are no rangers <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  they will change something and mess it all up again.. I beleave its more reactionary then anything.Im sure they design the game in a vacum and then load it on to the test server where well there are only a hand full of ppl.  once it goes live that is the real testings.  thats why we have so many patchs/outages after an expantion/patch.</div>

[Sirlutt]

all you guys and gals who are rangers shoudl stay Rangers.. being an assassin sucks compared to being a ranger.. you shudl definately not betray..ever... at all.. not for anything.. ok?<div></div>

[Mabes]

<P>I find it funny that there's constant talk about betraying to assassins on our board, but basically no talk at all about betraying to ranger on the assassins board.</P> <P>But, I personally won't betray because I feel they will eventually screw up the assassins somehow.</P>

[Teksun]

<div><blockquote><hr>Sirlutt wrote:all you guys and gals who are rangers shoudl stay Rangers.. being an assassin sucks compared to being a ranger.. you shudl definately not betray..ever... at all.. not for anything.. ok?<div></div><hr></blockquote>I wouldn't DREAM of it.It's kind of funny though: Go to any class board and you'll see a "Should I be this class or another" thread. Half the people in it push them away from their class. No one wants the competition.</div>

[BSbon]

assassin vs ranger all comes down to what you want to get from the game. if you want the most DPS it appears you need to go with assassin. if you want to play for fun then you need to decide what class will give you the most fun when you play. and if DPS = fun then it appears you need to be an assassin. good luck with whatever choice you guys make.

[Mirdo]

<P>All that tight leather Assassins wear would make me sweat too much and constrict those places that should never be constricted. I pity them <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Mirdo.</P>

[LoreLady]

Im a leathered up ranger! <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Dura]

<P>Just came back to the game a month ago, leveled up to 70 and joined a good guild.  Getting back into the raiding mode, and seeing top 8ish dpsers cut and pasted from the parser to the raid chat after nearly every fight.  Our folks are mostly a combo of relic/and almost relic gear, most with Masters and A3s.</P> <P>Two Rangers in the guild, me being one.   In our guild our Assassins, Necros, Wizards, Conjs. and a Monks rule the dps.  We are noticeably behind, but then in our own niche above and beyond the Singers, Swashys and Offenesive Tanks.  It also makes a big difference who is in your group.  My dps jumps 200ish with the right class(s) buffs.  However, those classes are usually put into the main tank and t1 dps groups for the same reason, causing an even greater disparity in our dps.</P> <P>Also the t1 classes I mentioned above have raid utility that we seem to lack at this point.  Some encounters/pulls/ etc. during a raid can really be made or not bye having an Assassin's pulling skill.  I have yet to see a spot where a Ranger's unique utility is needed.  Mages and Monks have even greater abilities in this department, but that was not the point of this thread, so let me stay on point.</P> <P>Last night I said to our group in the raid (which was odd in that they actually let me have an sk and necro who enhance our dps) <EM>"heh can't you guys do something to up my dps even more?"</EM>.  Our guild leader, a Swashy, who was also in the group said <EM>"Yeah betray to Assassin."</EM>  I believe the guild would like me to do that at this time for raiding purposes.  I won't and that is no big deal to them, but it is sad that our class has this break atm. :smileysad:</P> <P>Dps wise/Raid wise, there is no reason to be a Ranger over an Assassin at this point imho.   It is not even close.  Raid perfection would not include a Ranger at this stage in the end game.  Fortuneately guilds and raids are about supply and demand, personal skill, relationships and other factors.</P> <P>I like soloing with my Ranger though, flexible, diverse approaches and can do alot of things uniquely that many other classes can not.  Not having any trouble getting groups either, as the disparity for groups is not a big deal vs Assassin.  Also, we have options in combat be it soloing, grouping or in raids that keep the game fresh for me personally.  I am not sure if Assassins have that same creative option in fighting.  I am not a fan of click and forget game play.</P> <P>I am hoping that the disparity in high end raid dps/utility compared to  Assassins will get us some fixes from Sony, and I actually am an optimist in that I think they will.  We are kinda broken in that phase of the game, and I do not think that was Sony's intent for any class.</P> <P> </P> <P>Message Edited by Duran7 on <SPAN class=date_text>07-24-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>08:45 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Duran7 on <span class=date_text>07-24-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:46 AM</span>

[Pinfall1]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Mirdo wrote:<BR> <P>All that tight leather Assassins wear would make me sweat too much and constrict those places that should never be constricted. I pity them <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Mirdo.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Eeer.... Assassins can wear chain...:smileywink:

[TaleraRis]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SnakeMalone wrote:<BR>Rangers may have to be behind the target, but assassins are still ugly.<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>LOL<BR>

[ary]

<DIV>I recently took a breather from my Ranger and have been playing a fury and defiler. I enjoy how I get invites even when I am not looking. I think maybe my love affair with rangers have ended. I am not enjoying soloing so much at 55 and I want groups but no one seems to want me. I decided to play the healer full time.I liked the ranger but if we do not get utility there is no point in taking us anymore. I thought I would still enjoy it even without groups but it is getting lonely and you cannot blame me for giving up and going with a class people want. I want to be wanted.</DIV>

[LoreLady]

<div><blockquote><hr>aryel wrote:<div>I recently took a breather from my Ranger and have been playing a fury and defiler. I enjoy how I get invites even when I am not looking. I think maybe my love affair with rangers have ended. I am not enjoying soloing so much at 55 and I want groups but no one seems to want me. I decided to play the healer full time.I liked the ranger but if we do not get utility there is no point in taking us anymore. I thought I would still enjoy it even without groups but it is getting lonely and you cannot blame me for giving up and going with a class people want. I want to be wanted.</div><hr></blockquote>You mean dps <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> - diffrent form of utility! <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Rinio]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sirlutt wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Amwix wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sirlutt wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR>they are fully fabled, lvl 70 with almost all their masters .. and i am a mixture of treasured, legendary, and a couple of fabled armor with a few masters the rest adpet 1.. and only lvl 69.. but they do beat me about 50-70% of the time.<BR><BR>When i have the same gear?.. i think we will be pretty even.<BR></DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>This comment shows the issue.  Your not lvl 70 you dont have fable kit and you dont have AD3+ spells but you still beat a lvl 70 fable kitted master useing ranger...  Do you see the problem now?<BR><BR>When raiding im ALWAYS out dps by assasins.  im mix of master craft and Fables (couple of relic's, bows, other random stuff, 95% of my CA's are Ad3+)  i parse 600 - 800dps (some times highter / lower).<BR>Assasins built the same gear wise are with CA's @ AD3+ are they parse 1.1k+.  There are the fights that stop them from meleeing.. Tala or the DS guy in lab.<BR><BR>Sorry to break anyones idea's about how close we are but its just not going to happen.. Dont get me wrong Ranger is good fun but we are no T1 DPS.<BR><BR>Note: One thing to note with parsers.. some of them work out the dmg differently so its in no way the be all and end all.  but it helps work out where you stand in the grand scheme of things.<BR><BR></DIV> <P>Message Edited by Amwix on <SPAN class=date_text>07-17-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>07:15 PM</SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>its not as clear cut as that..its very situational .. and i have to work hard for my DPS .. ALOT of moving around.. when the MA changes targets, its generally always in bow range, its usually not in my melee range and I have to move.  Also fights with multiple mobs they always beat me on, I really only out parse them on large single fights.. and then its hit and miss..it depends who's big CA's are up.. and who puts in the most effort.. i have to try my [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] off to beat them..<BR><BR>I will say that all 3 of our rangers know their class inside out and one in particular is amazing.. i count myself very lucky if i beat her or am within 100DPS.<BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Thats the problem Sirlutt its all situational.  Yes on a AE fight we can own an assassin, but how many raid targets are AE fights? Thats what most people look at., the actual bosses. </P> <P>As for the ranger that you have to work to keep up with, what kind of bow does she have? </P> <P>Thats the main factor, look at how many dual weild fabled there are and look at there damage ratings compared to the very limited selection of bows. Yes our CAs are more balanced then people would like us to think, BUT we have a very limited arsenal of weapons.</P> <P> </P> <P>btw anyone have a sarnak warbow? what kind of parses do you get with it?</P> <P>interested in parses from bazkul to, or a combination of both sarnak + ichor/baz arrows</P><p>Message Edited by RinionX on <span class=date_text>07-25-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:33 AM</span>

[Bledso]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Chrystolred wrote:<BR><FONT color=#ff6600><B>Really, from what ive seen all there CA are better, faster, don't have to worry about position to use their CA. Their CA seem like they have more utilities attached to them as well. So what incentive do I really have for being a ranger any more when theres the assassin. What is sony giving us to be rangers? I mean....the dark side even LOOKS cooler. That, and I don't have to worry about buying so many arrows to actually be able to use my CA.<BR><BR>Only reason really I havn't betrayed is im on pvp server and I don't want to work 100k faction just to buy the special gear on the other side.<BR><BR>Also could a ranger post the T7 attacks for me. Preferably all adept 3 or higher quality.<BR></B></FONT> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Because there is more to the game then who outdamages who.</P> <P>I choose Ranger because that is the class I liked and wanted to be.    I could care less about parsing and DPS stats.    I solo just fine and I can't stand freeport and all the evil sides of things.</P>

[Rinio]

<DIV>I respect all of you that stayed rangers.. but come on, Half elves own! go Re-Roll and become Half Elf rangers instead. jeez</DIV>

[Sirlutt]

<div><blockquote><hr>RinionX wrote:<div></div> <div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Sirlutt wrote: <div> <blockquote> <hr> Amwix wrote: <div></div> <div> <blockquote> <hr> Sirlutt wrote: <div>they are fully fabled, lvl 70 with almost all their masters .. and i am a mixture of treasured, legendary, and a couple of fabled armor with a few masters the rest adpet 1.. and only lvl 69.. but they do beat me about 50-70% of the time.When i have the same gear?.. i think we will be pretty even.</div> <hr> </blockquote>This comment shows the issue.  Your not lvl 70 you dont have fable kit and you dont have AD3+ spells but you still beat a lvl 70 fable kitted master useing ranger...  Do you see the problem now?When raiding im ALWAYS out dps by assasins.  im mix of master craft and Fables (couple of relic's, bows, other random stuff, 95% of my CA's are Ad3+)  i parse 600 - 800dps (some times highter / lower).Assasins built the same gear wise are with CA's @ AD3+ are they parse 1.1k+.  There are the fights that stop them from meleeing.. Tala or the DS guy in lab.Sorry to break anyones idea's about how close we are but its just not going to happen.. Dont get me wrong Ranger is good fun but we are no T1 DPS.Note: One thing to note with parsers.. some of them work out the dmg differently so its in no way the be all and end all.  but it helps work out where you stand in the grand scheme of things.</div> <p>Message Edited by Amwix on <span class="date_text">07-17-2006</span> <span class="time_text">07:15 PM</span></p> <hr> </blockquote>its not as clear cut as that..its very situational .. and i have to work hard for my DPS .. ALOT of moving around.. when the MA changes targets, its generally always in bow range, its usually not in my melee range and I have to move.  Also fights with multiple mobs they always beat me on, I really only out parse them on large single fights.. and then its hit and miss..it depends who's big CA's are up.. and who puts in the most effort.. i have to try my [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] off to beat them..I will say that all 3 of our rangers know their class inside out and one in particular is amazing.. i count myself very lucky if i beat her or am within 100DPS.</div> <hr> </blockquote> <p>Thats the problem Sirlutt its all situational.  Yes on a AE fight we can own an assassin, but how many raid targets are AE fights? Thats what most people look at., the actual bosses. </p> <p>As for the ranger that you have to work to keep up with, what kind of bow does she have? </p> <p>Thats the main factor, look at how many dual weild fabled there are and look at there damage ratings compared to the very limited selection of bows. Yes our CAs are more balanced then people would like us to think, BUT we have a very limited arsenal of weapons.</p> <p>btw anyone have a sarnak warbow? what kind of parses do you get with it?</p> <p>interested in parses from bazkul to, or a combination of both sarnak + ichor/baz arrows</p><p>Message Edited by RinionX on <span class="date_text">07-25-2006</span> <span class="time_text">09:33 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>she has a legendary bow.. flapping wing ?.. she's just really good.  She has 2 nice fabled DW weapons though .. mine are legendar.y</div>

[Tseri]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Bledso wrote:<BR> <P>Because there is more to the game then who outdamages who.</P> <P>I choose Ranger because that is the class I liked and wanted to be.    I could care less about parsing and DPS stats.    I solo just fine and I can't stand freeport and all the evil sides of things.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Ok, please don't take this as an attack cause it's not.  Just want to get that out of the way since text sucks at conveying tone.</P> <P> </P> <P>If this is how you feel about playing your ranger then that's wonderful.  I'm glad you like it and are happy with your play style and what it gives to you.</P> <P>I, however, -am- concerned with parsing and DPS.  It's my job on a raid to do a lot of damage and parse high and when I can't accomplish that because of a variety of factors ranging to things that are occasionally my fault to things beyond my control it gets frustrating.  Especially when I know I'm working my hiney off, I have good group setup with the buffs I need, and the assassin is -still- outparsing me by a very wide margin.</P> <P> </P> <P>It makes me feel pointless, like I'm taking up a slot in a raid that could better be filled by someone with utility or even another assassin.</P> <P> </P> <P>Don't get me wrong.  I love my Ranger and I'm not going to be quitting.  I have too many masters and adept3's to consider betraying so I'll just have to voice my opinion and hope that someone at SOE cares enough to listen to me and the rest of the people that have voiced their opinions too.</P> <P> </P>

[LoreLady]

<div><blockquote><div><blockquote><p>essage Edited by RinionX on <span class="date_text">07-25-2006</span> <span class="time_text">09:33 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>she has a legendary bow.. flapping wing ?.. she's just really good.  She has 2 nice fabled DW weapons though .. mine are legendar.y</div><hr></blockquote>You said earlier that she has all masters and you have app 4's, and your in legendary gear and shes in  fabled gear..OFCORSE this ranger is going to do more damage than you, hell I have picked up assassins and done tripple there damage. But this doesnt mean much in the overal picture.. Just because those assassins suck.Out of a typical ranger NOT doing the rangers dance, you can expect 700-1100 dps. A ranger doin gthe rangers dance, 900-1600 (assuming thats the top end ranger)..Typical assassin does 1.3-2k No assassins out there do the rangers dance, but I bet ya you will see there dmg go from 1.5k-2.5kish. Stop in the world assassin channel and ask how assassins think rangers are doing.</div>

[Baelor_xev]

<P>I would betray today if I weren't so sure that the devs are eventually going to either mess with assassins or give us a boost.  All of this stuff happens in cycles and rangers just happen to be in the crap position right now.</P> <P>-bae</P>

[snowfleck]

Well, this is certainly a depressing thread. I have just betrayed to Qeynos and am panicking a bit as I discover I don't know how the hell to play a 53 ranger. Reading these forums tonight -- after disparaging attempts today to learn how to use ranged while soloing and what on earth to do with the funny trap thing -- is making me feel like I've made a terrible mistake. I could betray back, of course, but those instances weren't soloable for a not-brilliantly equiped assassin, so they won't be for a ranger either.The thing is, last month or so when I last really read the assassin forum, it was full of posts about how crap assassins are compared to rangers, and how rangers always beat assassins in raid parsers. Now I see it's more like this one, and assassins>rangers is the current consensus. It took me a long time to bother to complete betrayal as I was so unhappy with the character (so I levelled a fury up to 40 instead) and now I find I'm even more useless as a ranger?Most of this perceived crapness seems to concern raiding DPS. As I rarely raid, can I ask how rangers fare solo (surely can't be worse than an assassin... can it? I'll happily admit I was pretty hopeless earlier, but it's hard to suddenly have an almost-all-new set of skills to learn), duoing and in small groups?Give me some hope?<div></div>

[LoreLady]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>snowfleck wrote:Well, this is certainly a depressing thread. I have just betrayed to Qeynos and am panicking a bit as I discover I don't know how the hell to play a 53 ranger. Reading these forums tonight -- after disparaging attempts today to learn how to use ranged while soloing and what on earth to do with the funny trap thing -- is making me feel like I've made a terrible mistake. I could betray back, of course, but those instances weren't soloable for a not-brilliantly equiped assassin, so they won't be for a ranger either.The thing is, last month or so when I last really read the assassin forum, it was full of posts about how crap assassins are compared to rangers, and how rangers always beat assassins in raid parsers. Now I see it's more like this one, and assassins>rangers is the current consensus. It took me a long time to bother to complete betrayal as I was so unhappy with the character (so I levelled a fury up to 40 instead) and now I find I'm even more useless as a ranger?Most of this perceived crapness seems to concern raiding DPS. As I rarely raid, can I ask how rangers fare solo (surely can't be worse than an assassin... can it? I'll happily admit I was pretty hopeless earlier, but it's hard to suddenly have an almost-all-new set of skills to learn), duoing and in small groups?Give me some hope?<div></div><hr></blockquote>Your best bet is dont listen to me, dont listen to what people say.. Have fun with what youve got.. Theres alot people dont understand and theres alot that people are overstating.. What applys to a level 70 ranger top end doesnt nessasarly apply to 53..Have fun with your character..Heres an example, when we were doing nest - this is a pretty basic zone.. We had a shadowknight, a pally, myself (ranger), and a wizard.. We had the shadowknight tank while the paly healed.. It was a blast we were pulling entire rooms, the SK was holding a good amount of agro, and the paly was having a fun time healing.. While the wizy and I were having a fun time taking everything else down in less than a min.. This shadowknight just joined our guild, and we wanted to give him a true guild experiance <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Another example, is few nights ago a guildie bezerker (our mt) wanted an update in hof for his claymore. He was boxing his wifes fury (for those of you who dont know its [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] hard to heal as a druid in that zone), and we ended up pulling 1/2 the room in several cases on purpose, and living by the skin of our teeth.. And killing franky while I was at 5% life, with himself and the fury dead.. We got through that zone in an hour and a half - 3 people..Its all in what makes it fun for you.Somewhat edited for writing this at one in the morning.</div><p>Message Edited by LoreLady on <span class=date_text>07-27-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:25 AM</span>

[firewolf]

Recently I started a ranger to try out the class. Pretty fun so far soloing. Surprisingly fast too. This is the combo I used for soloing. Not sure if it works at higher end. Will change and adept once I get there. 1. arrow combat art 2. Melee 3. HO 4. HO starter 5. Stun 6. Back/flank combat art with invis 7. Back/Flank combat art 8. HO finisher 9. debuff 10. root combat art 11. arrow combat art Most non yellow con pretty much dead before I get to 8. I would say, just have fun with the class. <div></div>

[Sirlutt]

<div><blockquote><hr>LoreLady wrote:<div><blockquote><div><blockquote><p>essage Edited by RinionX on <span class="date_text">07-25-2006</span> <span class="time_text">09:33 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>she has a legendary bow.. flapping wing ?.. she's just really good.  She has 2 nice fabled DW weapons though .. mine are legendar.y</div><hr></blockquote>You said earlier that she has all masters and you have app 4's, and your in legendary gear and shes in  fabled gear..OFCORSE this ranger is going to do more damage than you, hell I have picked up assassins and done tripple there damage. But this doesnt mean much in the overal picture.. Just because those assassins suck.Out of a typical ranger NOT doing the rangers dance, you can expect 700-1100 dps. A ranger doin gthe rangers dance, 900-1600 (assuming thats the top end ranger)..Typical assassin does 1.3-2k No assassins out there do the rangers dance, but I bet ya you will see there dmg go from 1.5k-2.5kish. Stop in the world assassin channel and ask how assassins think rangers are doing.</div><hr></blockquote>my gear changes daily .. but as it stood back when i first commented, I had 2 adept III's, 5 masters and the rest adept I .. i've never had app IV and it just highlights your total lack of grasp on reality..she has almost all masters, i think 3 are not, those are adept III.  She has Wurmslayer and Oblivions edge, amongst others and nice armor.  And the flapping wing bow.. .. my weapoins are DR 52/53 Legendary, so not total junk.as it stands right now I've adept III'd 3 more spells, and gotten 2 more fabled armor drops .. i have done nicely with armor.The gap between the DPS is narrowing, but more times than not unless its a single target and all my timers are up she is about 100-300 DPS ahead.  Typically I parse over 1000 ever fight.. she is usually higher unless all my timers are up and its single target.. then i am up around 1200-1500.Oh she does have 50 aa's aswell. i have 26.I am in the global assassin channel and i see a few rangers in there.. poor guys get made fun of alot.</div>

[Sirlutt]

<div><blockquote><hr>snowfleck wrote:Well, this is certainly a depressing thread. I have just betrayed to Qeynos and am panicking a bit as I discover I don't know how the hell to play a 53 ranger. Reading these forums tonight -- after disparaging attempts today to learn how to use ranged while soloing and what on earth to do with the funny trap thing -- is making me feel like I've made a terrible mistake. I could betray back, of course, but those instances weren't soloable for a not-brilliantly equiped assassin, so they won't be for a ranger either.The thing is, last month or so when I last really read the assassin forum, it was full of posts about how crap assassins are compared to rangers, and how rangers always beat assassins in raid parsers. Now I see it's more like this one, and assassins>rangers is the current consensus. It took me a long time to bother to complete betrayal as I was so unhappy with the character (so I levelled a fury up to 40 instead) and now I find I'm even more useless as a ranger?Most of this perceived crapness seems to concern raiding DPS. As I rarely raid, can I ask how rangers fare solo (surely can't be worse than an assassin... can it? I'll happily admit I was pretty hopeless earlier, but it's hard to suddenly have an almost-all-new set of skills to learn), duoing and in small groups?Give me some hope?<div></div><hr></blockquote>if you are just soloing, and grouping you will be fine.  Both classes are gear dependant so after you upgrade your gear a bit, especially your spells you will find you'll be fine in both those situations.The current thinking is yes, in many situations assassins do more damage, but unless you raid alot that wont matter.  Ignore the parsers and enjoy the character.</div>

[LoreLady]

"I am in the global assassin channel and i see a few rangers in there.. poor guys get made fun of alot."Yea, went through that in eq1.. Going through that in eq2 <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.. Id like a game where im not the butt of every joke <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />And 24 aa's, afew masters, some new weapons.. You will outdps her everytime. Even if she is the best ranger out there and your the worst assassin out there (And im not actually saying that you arent any good as a player, just class comparison).. But afterall we are talking raids here.

[Isaelee]

I have fun as Ranger. I understand there is always better this, better that, yadda yadda. In some of the groups I've been in, my skills have come in handy. My play style is usually with groups who work together, so if I don't do more damage than others, it's usually ok. If I can't solo something in particular, I will come back when I can. I am enjoying the ability to play the game casually and gaining new friends. It's all good.

[TaleraRis]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> snowfleck wrote:<BR><BR>As I rarely raid, can I ask how rangers fare solo (surely can't be worse than an assassin... can it? I'll happily admit I was pretty hopeless earlier, but it's hard to suddenly have an almost-all-new set of skills to learn), duoing and in small groups?<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I can help you there <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I'm a predominantly soloing ranger, very rarely grouping because I hate grinding, and a questoholic/explorer to boot.</P> <P>I've soloed Gwyn her 54 levels almost exclusively solo. I can count on one hand the number of times I've actually grouped. I do just fine with her soloing. I'm having difficulties recently in certain places with social aggro, and adjusting ways to try to pull safely, but I think this is part of a bigger issue with social aggro and not with the ranger class itself. Perma-stun and perma-root mobs are also giving me trouble, but I'm looking into ways to up my resists to see if that helps. </P> <P>Rangers do nicely solo. I'm not a raider, never will be. I rely on the items I can gain through questing, crafting (I have one of everything, although the armorer is only 24) and the random drops I might get in different zones. I don't take on heroics, but then I don't try. With good tactics, I can take no arrow yellows, and even VERY rarely no arrow oranges. ^ mobs still tend to give me some problems, but I can usually handle them if they're green and sometimes even when they're blue if I have room to move around. </P> <P>In duos we do great. I mentor down a lot to play with my boyfriend and his zerker and we make quite a killing team. When I duo with his mystic, I can take on green heroics in Stormhold tanking, sometimes blue if we have another groupmate or two. I do fine in groups, when I do group, but there's not a lot of effort involved in grouping. Just have to watch your aggro and maintain your DPS. </P> <P>All in all, I think we do fine soloing, so long as we don't expect to go out and solo heroic triple arrow up mobs.<BR></P>

[LoreLady]

<div><blockquote><hr>TaleraRis wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> snowfleck wrote:As I rarely raid, can I ask how rangers fare solo (surely can't be worse than an assassin... can it? I'll happily admit I was pretty hopeless earlier, but it's hard to suddenly have an almost-all-new set of skills to learn), duoing and in small groups?</blockquote>/cut<p><b>All in all, I think we do fine soloing, so long as we don't expect to go out and solo heroic triple arrow up mobs.</b></p><hr></blockquote>Untill you hit 70 with a good deal of masters.. then you can go and kite ^^^'s with ease. Takes a long time to get there though <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Ethelwo]

If you max out the strength and agility AA lines and reduce your casting time and spell reuse times, then you will make the parse with ease on raids. My daughters dps has gone way up on raids. You wont beat everyone on the parse, but you'll be on it much more often then not.

[LoreLady]

<div><blockquote><hr>Ethelwolf wrote:<div></div>If you max out the strength and agility AA lines and reduce your casting time and spell reuse times, then you will make the parse with ease on raids. My daughters dps has gone way up on raids. You wont beat everyone on the parse, but you'll be on it much more often then not.<hr></blockquote>Im max aa'd str is near cap unbuffed.. I do 1100-1400 average.. But its depressing when your wizards are doing 2k with ease.. For those of you who want to see what I mean, go on the wizard fourms and track the posts by illusivethoughts.. He has been doing a great job helping people do 2k dps. There are also plenty of parsings on there that include ranger.. I dont like to post parsings on here myself.... turns.. bad.</div>

[Sirlutt]

i hear you talk about 2K DPS, but 2K DPS against what? over how long ?.You cant just throw out a magical number without quantifying it.. DPS is situational, if your going to quote the DPS, caveat it with the situation description.I have a parse of HOF with a warlock doing an AVERAGE over the entire time we were in there of 9000 DPS.  OMG nerfs them !without describing the situation it looks like the class is way over powered and anyone not doing 9000 DPS as a warlock doesnt know their class.  It was brought about by 49,000 DPS on the groups of small drakes and when applied over the course of the 1hr 25 minutes we were in there it brought his average up to 9000.  Do warlocks do 9000 DPS ?.. hell no .. and i dont believe Wizards do 2000 DPS all the time.  It needs to be a range and needs to be caveated.. what kind of mob, what kind of battle.. what kind of gear were they wearing?  what AA's were they using ?Parses are a nice tool for comparing DPS, but only when you keep as many of the constants the same as you can.  IE the same group of people in the same zone, then you can compare it and say, wow last time we did 6000 DPS on average as a group and tonight we are doing 6500, yes that master i bought and the new weapons Timmy got are working.its the same as using Dyno's in the car tuning industry.. they are a tuning tool.  Comparing Mustang A that makes 350 HP at the rear wheels with Mustang B that makes 360 is pretty useless.  Alot of factors can account for that difference.  Some dyno's read high, some low, temp makes a diff, engine oil, tires etc etc..its the same with parses.. saying class A does 2000 DPs means absoloutly zero .. class A does not do 2000 DPS.  Someone playing class A in a paarticular time and place with certain gear doing something did 2000 DPS, but That class as a whole does not.You can however say things like.  On average, on encounter X, a decent Wizard with legendary type gear does 900-1400 DPS.  on the same encounter a legendary equiped decent Ranger does 600-1200 DPS .. or something like that... but comparing parsers is prett useless, they are great for seeing whats happning on this raid right here right now and comparing the players doing things in that raid but totally useless to take outside that context.<div></div>

[EomerFarst]

<div><blockquote><hr>Chrystolred wrote:<font color="#ff6600"><b>Really, from what ive seen all there CA are better, faster, don't have to worry about position to use their CA. Their CA seem like they have more utilities attached to them as well. So what incentive do I really have for being a ranger any more when theres the assassin. What is sony giving us to be rangers? I mean....the dark side even LOOKS cooler. That, and I don't have to worry about buying so many arrows to actually be able to use my CA. Only reason really I havn't betrayed is im on pvp server and I don't want to work 100k faction just to buy the special gear on the other side. Also could a ranger post the T7 attacks for me. Preferably all adept 3 or higher quality. </b></font><div></div><hr>Each time I read these posts it make me wonder if the OP players for fun or to some uber pwnzor PvP/PvE death machine.I play rangers because I find is the only unique profession in the game and it is fun to play. I don't play EQ2 to be able solo instances etc.I guess if you want to be a bit l337 then betary and go Assassin. But I will contine to play ranger because it is fun.</blockquote></div>

[LoreLady]

<div><blockquote><hr>You can however say things like.  On average, on encounter X, a decent Wizard with legendary type gear does 900-1400 DPS.  on the same encounter a legendary equiped decent Ranger does 600-1200 DPS .. <div></div><hr></blockquote><font color="#ff0000">Thats what we are saying.. Wizards do a medium of 1500-2500.. - Also 1000 on a 8 min fight. Assassins do 1800-2200 medium Rangers have welll.. a 1100-1400 medium.. Both wizards and assassins have a 2k medium..<a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=25467&page=2" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=25467&page=2</a>^ Doesnt support my numbers, these are questions on how to achieve higher DPS, on how to reach the 2k mark. Illusive thoughts is helping them out, and he is quite clear where he stands on the longterm and short term and how wizards are with there thresholds as to where they stand with there group setups.<a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=40&message.id=14557&view=by_date_ascending&page=3" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=40&message.id=14557&view=by_date_ascending&page=3</a>^- Assassin parsings at varius raids. The average is 1500-2k.. Please note the duration on some of these.. Theres even one that lasted 16 mins long - and the assassin held 1k dps.</font></div>

[KnightOfTheWo]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>EomerFarstar wrote:<div><blockquote><hr><font color="#ff6600"><b> </b></font><div></div><hr>Each time I read these posts it make me wonder if the OP players for fun or to some uber pwnzor PvP/PvE death machine.I play rangers because I find is the only unique profession in the game and it is fun to play. I don't play EQ2 to be able solo instances etc.I guess if you want to be a bit l337 then betary and go Assassin. <b><font color="#ff3300">But I will contine to play ranger because it is fun</font>.</b></blockquote></div><hr></blockquote>And that's the whole point. The uber raiders cannot have fun unless they are masters of the high end raiding game. That's their playstyle and their choice. If on the other hand you are having fun, take Sirlutt's advice and ignore the parsers.</div><p>Message Edited by KnightOfTheWord on <span class=date_text>07-30-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:50 AM</span>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LoreLady wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <BR><BR><BR>You can however say things like.  On average, on encounter X, a decent Wizard with legendary type gear does 900-1400 DPS.  on the same encounter a legendary equiped decent Ranger does 600-1200 DPS .. <BR><BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><FONT color=#ff0000>Thats what we are saying.. Wizards do a medium of 1500-2500.. - Also 1000 on a 8 min fight. Assassins do 1800-2200 medium Rangers have welll.. a 1100-1400 medium.. <BR><BR>Both wizards and assassins have a 2k medium..<BR><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=25467&page=2" target=_blank><BR>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=25467&page=2</A><BR>^ Doesnt support my numbers, these are questions on how to achieve higher DPS, on how to reach the 2k mark. Illusive thoughts is helping them out, and he is quite clear where he stands on the longterm and short term and how wizards are with there thresholds as to where they stand with there group setups.<BR><BR><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=40&message.id=14557&view=by_date_ascending&page=3" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=40&message.id=14557&view=by_date_ascending&page=3</A><BR>^- Assassin parsings at varius raids. The average is 1500-2k.. Please note the duration on some of these.. Theres even one that lasted 16 mins long - and the assassin held 1k dps.<BR></FONT></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I think these posts should support your point LoreLady</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=25760&page=2" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=25760&page=2</A>  (at the bottom)</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2</A> (page 2 and 3)</P> <P> </P> <P>oh yeah and the 8 min fight was 1150dps <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>i had 800 dps on a 17 minute fight (damned azlid prime!)</P><p>Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on <span class=date_text>07-30-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:05 AM</span>

[Myrrhia]

 If playing a Ranger no longer gives you the enjoyment you once had then by all means, become an Assassin.  If the class doesn't suit your playing style anymore then find one that best fits you.  I personally love playing Rangers since the days of pen & paper D&D so having the opportunity to play one in MMO's is great for me.  Granted, some things need some fixing for the class but it doesn't deter me from playing my Ranger main(she's only 60 atm).  Still, things could be worse for Rangers...remember EQ1 and when the Kunark expansion came out?  I hope you find fun and enjoyment if you switch classes!