Early reports

[roblinb]

<div>Aite check it out... some people must be on now.  Any of you all have any initial reports on how we're faring?</div>

[GrayStorm]

<div></div>I logged in and tried to take down a grey mob.  I shot an arrow at it and it caught it in it's teeth.  It laughed at me and said, "puny ranger, I no longer fear your kind" and then he devoured me whole.

[King Leor]

<div></div><p>Literally it's that bad, I went to a lvl 46 down arrow mob in SS, used triple arrow and didn't  even kill the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] thing..lol. It would normally kill ^ mobsin one shot let alone down arrow ones. WE ARE GIMPED TO THE MAX NOW></p><p>LeoricLevel 60 ([Removed for Content]) ranger</p>

[roblinb]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>King Leoric wrote:<div></div><p>Literally it's that bad, I went to a lvl 46 down arrow mob in SS, used triple arrow and didn't  even kill the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] thing..lol. It would normally kill ^ mobsin one shot let alone down arrow ones. WE ARE GIMPED TO THE MAX NOW></p><p>LeoricLevel 60 ([Removed for Content]) ranger</p><hr></blockquote>I listen to what you say Leo, because you seem to know what you're talking about.  I'll have to see for myself.

[Morti]

<div></div><div>Its pretty wretched IMO i tried to take out a 24^^^ at  lvl 47 with hidden fire master2 and triple shot didnt get him out of the green  sad day in my book</div>

[mighty_fc]

<div></div><p>its really really really really bad, imma have to get all master's now if im going to keep playing this [Removed for Content], anyone who says this wasnt a nerf of great magnitude is on crack imo</p><p> </p><p>ull notice it first fight with whatever con mob you choose its THAT much of a differ</p>

[Its Da Ranger]

<div>Im afraid to log on now <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Bayler_x]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>mighty_fc wrote:<div></div><p>its really really really really bad, imma have to get all master's now if im going to keep playing this [Removed for Content], anyone who says this wasnt a nerf of great magnitude is on crack imo</p><p> </p><p>ull notice it first fight with whatever con mob you choose its THAT much of a differ</p>sigless ,appearently quoting blackguard isnt popular<hr></blockquote>Mighty_fc - if the mods removed your sig, it isn't because you were quoting Blackguard.  It's because you were making libelous remarks about his sexual practices in them.  If you want to criticize the man for the remarks he's made in his official capacity, that's one thing.  But calling him names is poor form.  (Oh, and by the way, I'm one of the people who clicked on the "report this post" link.)</span></div>

[kartikeya]

<div>Lag is killing me on top of the nerf, so I can't really speak to difference in solo damage yet, except that I've definitely noticed a difference in my ranged combat arts.</div><div> </div><div>Debilitating arrow now interrupts when you move.</div><div> </div><div>For some reason my snare is listed as lasting for 1.0 seconds. It seemed to last longer than that on the mob, however.</div><div> </div>

[Zeijandi]

I soloed a named 54 heroic encounter.  Reports of ranger incapacitation are vastly and pathetically overexaggerated.  L2P, kkthxs.<div></div>

[mighty_fc]

<div>"Mighty_fc - if the mods removed your sig, it isn't because you were quoting Blackguard.  It's because you were making libelous remarks about his sexual practices in them.  If you want to criticize the man for the remarks he's made in his official capacity, that's one thing.  But calling him names is poor form.  (Oh, and by the way, I'm one of the people who clicked on the "report this post" link.)´"</div><div> </div><div>i didnt say anything about his sexual practices it was a quote from him and his name in question form not a statement just a question if he should be knows as "<a target="_blank" href="mailto:iplayvirtualvalerie@worksoimclueless">iplayvirtualvalerie@worksoimclueless</a>??" how is that a personal attack ?</div><div>just a simple question if he does ,cause his statements makes me think he actually does. thats what i personally think if you are offended by that ? .. yeah beats me why you should be</div><div> </div><div>friend of yours ? if so tell him to "you know what".</div>

[TwistedFaith]

I'm finding it very tough in the new zones, the mobs hit like tanks and have a load of HPs.My friend who is a 60 wizard is nuking them down in 2 shots (solos), my ranger is just taking forever to kill them.Bow shots seem so underpowered.

[roblinb]

<div></div><p>I can concur that I took out four separate single up-arrow blue (one level below me... 57) con mobs with relative ease.  Each fight my health was in the yellow range by the end.  Ummm... yeah debilitating arrow interrupts BUT I am happy to say kiting still does decent base damage and I use store bought indiums.  My base damage for all the CA's was still good, but triple arrow seemed to do less damage.  Proc's are less for sure, though.</p><p>My initial impression is that we can still solo, but the days of blasting away triple up arrow mobs is over.  We'll still be decent as long as we keep within our abilities and realize that the super proc glory days are over.  Some will cry, but others should see that you can still play the class.  I need to play more to make a better account of all of our abilities, though.</p><p>Good luck everyone.</p>

[kartikeya]

<div></div><p>Damage is so random now.</p><p>On some mobs, if I can get off two bow shots (mobs run very fast it seems), I'm close to what I was doing before. Other times, I'll proc in melee and do decently.</p><p>On the other hand, there are times when I don't proc, and I get eaten alive by no arrow mobs that are even con or below.</p>

[FunkBudd]

<div></div><p>my imbued pants now do more damage per fight than my offensive stance(quick shot). in some fights quick shot doesn't even go off. it's nowhere close to the 30% it claims to be. it also looks like the debilitating arrow was changed so that it can't be fired while moving, or maybe it was just the lag.</p><p>quick shot and adestes now equate to about 12-22% of my damage against a white mob. i was barely able to solo yellows, but it is doable at 58.</p><p> </p><p> </p>

[Guy De Alsace]

Not really noticed much of a difference myself. Still seemed to be as random as ever. I've never been able to take down a ^^^ mob that wasnt green anyway so I dont expect to in KoS either. Dont know how u guys do it...I die in 2 to 3 hits from blue con heroics no problem.<div></div>

[Sphiriah]

<div>Well .. lets see..</div><div> </div><div>I like the changes.</div><div> </div><div>I don't do enough damage to grab agro right away, but i don't do too little damage to not be welcome in a group.</div><div>I also don't run out of poison as fast as i use to.</div><div>I can still solo the mobs i use to, just not as fast.</div><div> </div><div>Now, i'm only level 50 and haven't raided at all so i can't say much from a raider's perspective .. but i like the changes.</div>

[Carna]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>kartikeya wrote:<div></div><p>Damage is so random now.</p><p>On some mobs, if I can get off two bow shots (mobs run very fast it seems), I'm close to what I was doing before. Other times, I'll proc in melee and do decently.</p><p>On the other hand, there are times when I don't proc, and I get eaten alive by no arrow mobs that are even con or below.</p><hr></blockquote><p>This really is the heart of my limited experience.</p><p>As I mentioned in another post I parked a low level Ranger and Swashbuckler in Zek (both 29th) so I could see what things were like for both soloing yellow mobs pre and post lu20.</p><p>The Swashbuckler is consistent, and walks through the mobs comfortably.</p><p>The Ranger is very very patchy now. Some mobs he'll finish in the green half at least he'll be in the yellow, some will leave him orange and a ^ will nearly kill him.</p><p>I also noticed something else... ranged CAs are parried far far more than melee CAs. If I had a Ranger as my main I would be sure to parse the difference between range and melee CA parrying, because I think it's absolutely "bugged", and this is was leads to such streaky soloing at low level.</p><p>Lastly the Swashbuckler could comfortably take on a group 3 orcs with no expectation of failure. The Ranger had and 80% expectation of failure on a group of 2 yellow orcs.</p><p>Soloing outright sucks as a Ranger... if a Ranger were my main I'd be doubly [Removed for Content] to be paying for arrow for sub par performance.</p><p>Sorry chaps, you got slapped silly.</p>

[Tumbas]

<div>Man, my ranger SUCKS now.  Im not sure what was up but my poison, other than my stun wouldnt proc at all....I took on a blue mob, hit it with triple arrow master 2 and it was still green..again, poison didnt hit at all.  I really hate that soe feels they need to nerf things to an extreme.  We did to a lot of damage before so I understand maybe lowering the proc off the weapons some but not the poison.  Like others I put a lot of time into this guy but now I might start in on one of my alts..I just dont see the ranger being a fun class anymore.</div>

[leafnin]

<div>Well I guess they were right IF poison procs we're ok if not we'e hurting.  Problem is we shouldn't have to pray everytime we enter combat  that a low chance action takes place to be able to play.  No other class has to go through that. I took on a ^^^green in PoF one fight it was pretty good fight I finished at 40% next fight I evac at 20% he's at 60%.  Same mob type and level.  If they want us meleeing they need to give us some REAL DD melee skills not this two mixed DD/DOTs and two moderate DD skills for melee.  Personally I'd rather they give us a way to either stay at range or to be able to escape to range...snares are too unreliable and cheapshot isn't it either.  This is all soloing I haven't seen grouping issues yet as soloing matters alittle more to me.</div><div> </div><div>Falcon</div><div>60 Ranger</div><div>Kithicor</div>

[Jakov]

<span><blockquote><hr>FunkBuddha wrote:<div></div><p><b>my imbued pants now do more damage per fight than my offensive stance</b>(quick shot). in some fights quick shot doesn't even go off. it's nowhere close to the 30% it claims to be. it also looks like the debilitating arrow was changed so that it can't be fired while moving, or maybe it was just the lag.</p><p>quick shot and adestes now equate to about 12-22% of my damage against a white mob. i was barely able to solo yellows, but it is doable at 58.</p><p> </p><p> </p><hr></blockquote>LMFAO <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span>Oh did I need that laugh.  I'm still waiting for the bloody patch and I'm on an excellent high speed connection.If what you say is true, at least I will still have something to contribute in a group or raid.  My fancy pants of despair.</span><div></div>

[mighty_fc]

<div></div><p>as the other thread where i commented about it was locked ill do it here</p><p> </p><p>people seem to have forgotten the fact you use twice the amount of arrows for 1 single kill now, im going through stack upob stack right now, half hour hunting and 5g worth of arrows poorer</p>

[Sirlutt]

I spend 100 times the coin on poison than i do on arrows... arrows are free from 2 of my abilities ... poisons are not.<div></div><div></div><p>Message Edited by Sirlutt on <span class="date_text">02-21-2006</span><span class="time_text">10:01 PM</span></p>

[Greymar]

Dont listen to the hotheads and naysayers.Our DPS has decreased a little, but you can still solo successfully. The kids who complain are spoiled brats.I am 55th level and I was soloing regular (no up or down arrow) 56 and 57 mobs in the Tangled Jungle with a little bit of downtime between each mob.

[Garlicyesterday]

<div>Greymarch , your a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing idiot and you dont know how to play a ranger if you think we can still solo successfully !</div><div> </div><div>Oh hey Leoric , you got any new infos on VANGUARD ? im really looking for infos too!</div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div>PLEASE post infos about VANGUARD !</div>

[Loktha]

<div>Well, despite there is a lot of negative feedback about the ranger class after LU20. I just created a wood elf ranger yesterday when the servers went live again.</div><div>I have played a paladin to level 23 and wanted to try out another class.</div><div>Although i am now only level 6 and i havent experienced the ranger before LU20, i cant say that im not impressed. I can solo the white mobs in the beginnersareas quite well.</div><div>So i guess ill try it a bit further.</div>

[pharacyde]

<div></div><p>Rangers did loose alot of proc dps for sure, they also lost their stun procs and their debuff procs at the same time.  </p><p>The fact that the stun poison doesn't proc as much anymore is the main reason why rangers got a way harder time to solo heroic mobs now then before. Our dps got nerfed also, which comes in second place why it's harder to solo. The dps decrease is the main reason why killing solo mobs is alot harder.</p><p> </p><p>Things you have to remember, it was never meant to be that a class is able to solo heroic mobs. Rangers still can do it with ALOT of risks.  Rangers due to being T1 dps should still pwn solo mobs, which isn't the case now. It's even hard to kill solo mobs. It took like 2-3 CA's MAX to kill solo mobs before, now it takes like 2-3 ranged CA's plus alot of melee fighting.</p><p> </p><p>I feel like rangers were overpowered merely cause of the stun poison procs but never because of the dps procs. The fact htat SoE nerfed both procs made the ranger completely gimped.</p>

[Morgonn]

<div></div>Never mind....parking him.  Good luck all.<div></div><p>Message Edited by Morgonn on <span class="date_text">02-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">05:13 AM</span></p>

[Nimana]

<div>Having experimented some  in SS with my lvl 50 ranger, I think rangers' soloing ability (at least at that level) is okay. Group encounters are challenging, but even conned solo mobs doesn't make me sweat. I find that I'm able to kill lvl 50 one arrow up heroics like sinister ghouls without too much hassle.  I'm also able to deal with lvl 50 2 arrow ups heroics like Anaz Mal carcasses without getting in trouble. I have to kite these mobs of course, which always involve the risk of adds. I have tried soloing the exiled Kromtorrs (lvl 50 heroics, 3 ups) and the specters (lvl 47/48 heroics, 3 ups) without any luck. I don't consider myself a good soloer though, and as I'm in a guild with no alcemists and there were no stun poisons available for sale on Spiltpaw when I was experimenting, it may be doable (brought some of these mobs into orange before dying). My ranger has only adept 1 CAs and no pristine/fabled gear.</div><div> </div><div>How our dps compares to other classes in groups/raids I have not had the chance to test out yet.</div>

[Nimana]

<div></div>I probably should add that just like before the update, my poisons do NOT last long. I have mostly been using Translucent Torment of Rijacki, Trans. Kendricke's Stifling solution and Trans. explosive resentment (no level appropirate heat debuff poisons for sale on broker).

[Tasye]

Rijacki has 4 uses per charge.<div></div>

[KudLenka]

<div></div><p>i didnt have much time to test as splitpaw went down in 30 minutes, but my first experience is far from good. Ivl 22 ranger with T3 imbued rare bow using carbonite arrows with T3 storebought poisons, my wounding arrow is adept 1, other abilities are not upgraded yet.</p><p>I was able to solo same level one arrow down mobs with ease before LU20 as long as it was single mob. After the update i was in antonica harvesting and shooting some lvl 16-18 mopobs - bears and other animals. In more than half encounters creatures as much as 5 levels below me were getting to me with about 50 % of their health. They would be dead in a sexond before LU20. I got owned by intoxicated pirate 3 times in the gadnpa grumble or whatever instance in TS - 50 % health after woundig arrow and heatedshot - single one arrow up mob blue to me at that time. what would it do to me as of now? Would i even scratch it with my ranged skills?</p><p> </p><p>I dont think i have to instantly kill méob at my level, but i would like to have at least fair chance to seriously damage it before it gets to me. Or give me a druidic pet or something to keep my foes at bay.</p>

[Nimana]

<div></div>Thanks Tasye! That explains it! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Zeijandi]

<span><blockquote><hr>Greymarch wrote:Dont listen to the hotheads and naysayers.Our DPS has decreased a little, but you can still solo successfully. The kids who complain are spoiled brats.I am 55th level and I was soloing regular (no up or down arrow) 56 and 57 mobs in the Tangled Jungle with a little bit of downtime between each mob.<hr></blockquote>This is truth.  You whiners are extremely bad players if you can't play without that broken easymode fantasy rangers have been living in since DoF released.</span><div></div>

[Nimana]

<div></div><div></div><p>While I agree that some claims as to how hard rangers have been nerfed seem a bit exaggerated and there no doubt is a lot of dissatisfaction being expressed on these boards atm, please let's refrain from name calling, Zeijandi!</p><p>Even though this is "only" a game, people tend to get quite emotional about it. Let's show each other respect and try to evaluate the situation post LU20 with a calm mind! Flame wars won't benefit anyone!</p><p>Message Edited by Nimanael on <span class="date_text">02-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">07:05 AM</span></p>

[Venzule]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>GrayStorm wrote:<div></div>I logged in and tried to take down a grey mob.  I shot an arrow at it and it caught it in it's teeth.  It laughed at me and said, "puny ranger, I no longer fear your kind" and then he devoured me whole.<hr></blockquote>[Removed for Content]!  :smileyhappy:

[leafnin]

<div></div><p>Also there is a difference between mobs in DoF and KoS.  KoS mobs seem significantly harder then their same level counterparts elsewhere.  I originally didn't order KoS did some testing in several areas found that it wasn't too bad. Then I went into TT I really didn't see many soloers other then mages and the odd fighter.  Almost all healers and scouts were in groups or LFG.  Soloing is harder, not as much room (not that it matters now).  Mobs seem to swarm over most of TT.  Lag is horrid on the first isle but noticeably better elsewhere.  You can solo, but chain pulling is out of the question.  Downtime is very needed.</p><p>Falcon</p><p>60 Ranger</p><p>Kithicor</p>

[Ai064]

<div></div><em>This is truth.  You whiners are extremely bad players if you can't play without that broken easymode fantasy rangers have been living in since DoF released.</em><div></div><p><em></em></p><div><em>Zeijandi Thunderstalker of the Shard55 RangerAggro Fish Guppy of DeathNeriak </em></div><p> </p><p>Quite simply, KISS MY ASZ. It's not worth responding to your ignorance more.  God give me an ignore function for the board idiots.</p>

[Shaulin Dolamite]

<div></div>Im all for balance. But grouped last night with a conj. and consistantly the conj. was parsing the same as me, Without a pet!

[leafnin]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>King Leoric wrote:<div></div><div>VANGUARD FTW!! again any info on this plz post :0)</div><div> </div><div>Leoric</div><div>Level 60 ([Removed for Content]) ranger</div><hr></blockquote><p>Don't plan on being a ranged Ranger.  From what I've seen posted by a dev is that they aren't putting much effort to making ranged combat interesting/effective.  That's from the very little information I could get of the class.  They may have changed their minds as this was 2-3 months ago.  I'm also not looking forward to corpse runs, but if my class is effective there I won't have to die as much there as opposed to here.</p><p> </p><p>Falcon</p><p>60 Ranger</p><p>Kithicor</p><p> </p><p> </p><p>Message Edited by leafnin on <span class="date_text">02-22-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:49 AM</span></p>

[Nimana]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>leafnin wrote:<div></div><p>Also there is a difference between mobs in DoF and KoS.  KoS mobs seem significantly harder then their same level counterparts elsewhere.  I originally didn't order KoS did some testing in several areas found that it wasn't too bad. Then I went into TT I really didn't see many soloers other then mages and the odd fighter.  Almost all healers and scouts were in groups or LFG.  Soloing is harder, not as much room (not that it matters now). </p><p></p><hr><p>Based on reports from beta and my own experiences post LU 20, I was suspecting there might be a problem particularly with the mobs in KoS. I see no reason why rangers should be worse soloers than the other classes in tier 1. Both sorcerors and rangers were soloing well before LU20. Now rangers have been "nerfed". Thus either sorceror (and probably necro/conjuror) solo ability should be adjusted accordingly, or ranger solo ability should be upped.</p><p>However, before making such a claim we need reliable data to substantiate it!</p></blockquote>

[Arhan]

<div></div><p>Were not near as good at killing stuff as we were before.  We can still kill things though.  Basically by the time were 70 we might be as good as we were pre KoS.   Ouch... The delbirating arrow nerf is what hit home to me that was one attack other then culling we could fire on move.  A sad time for rangers...were still a fun class though :</p>

[Bayler_x]

For my part, at level 48, I could still do the same Everfrost solo writs as I did before: Galebreaker Pilgrims and Kromrize Hermits.  In both cases, the mobs were white- (white cons, with one down arrow).  However, most of the time I felt like I had gone back to my predator days, when I only had two ranged CAs and had to do most of my fighting by melee.  It wasn't nearly as satisfying of an experience for me, as a ranger.In the cases where I was able to start the fight at max bow range, if I stood still, I'd get off two or three attacks.  (Stealthed shot, leg shot, double shot; or back shot, double shot, and maybe a miracle shot or something.)  The mobs would reach me with 40-80% of their health left - usually around 60%, I'd say.  If I backpedaled and snared, I could get off another shot or two, and take them down to 20-30% mostly; then I'd have to melee, or else go into serious kiting mode.In cases where I didn't have my full range to work with and room to run, I'd only get my opener and maybe a double shot.  The mobs would generally reach me with 80% of their life left, and then I'd have to melee.  (Example: the ice floats in Everfrost limit your attack positions, and where you can run to.  This is especially true if you need to worry about adds, like Icegills and bears.)The damage was streaky though.  Sometimes I'd kill them before they got to me.  A surprising amount of the time, though, I couldn't kill green--'s before they reached me (assuming I stood at max range).I didn't have a chance to try a no-arrow or up-arrow mob, but I imagine they're pretty tough.  Likewise, getting jumped by a mob unprepared is probably pretty risky now.  And in both of those situations, again, we don't really get to be rangers - we're reduced to being pre-20's predators again.If we're deprived of the ability to kill quickly at range, I'd like to see us gain the ability to keep an enemy at range.  Give us a root - like sorcerers have - or an at-range stun with a pretty quick recast.  We're supposed to be able to fight from a distance, but right now we don't have it unless we kite to some extent.(If it matters for perspective, I'm a 48 ratonga ranger with a legendary player-made bow, nearly all adept3 and master ranged CAs and buffs, HQ weapons, and assorted levels of armor quality.  I was using pre-LU20 legendary very-high-DD T5 poison.)<div></div>

[leafnin]

<div></div><p>If I had the ability to work out some kind of strategy to solo I could work around the damage.  There's the other problem we don't have that ability.  It's 2-3 shots then melee.  It's more effiecient to stay melee then to attempt to escape to ranged.  We have no room for change it's the same boring routine over and over.  I dread to see what grouping is like 'hit autoattack and throw in the occasional CA so they don't realize I'm playing PS2' <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.  Not that they would notice if I didn't</p><p> </p><p>Falcon</p><p>60 Ranger</p><p>Kithicor </p>