A Guide to Kiting [Archive] - EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

Rian18

05-05-2005, 06:54 AM

<DIV> A Guide to Kiting…(warning very long) This is something I wrote on another site and was asked to cross postthis here. So here you go hope it helps some. This goes out to my friends on AB who have asked me to put together a guide on kiting. This is the first guide; I’ve ever tried writing so if it’s not fully informative or if my grammar is off, well blame my High school and college English professors. Very often I find myself kiting while waiting for a group. Even more often I find myself sitting afk while explaining to a fellow ranger exactly what it is I was doing, and how to do it effectively. Coming from EQ 1 kiting is not a new concept to me. I guess it still shocks me a bit that so many have no idea exactly what it is. So I’m going to write down some basics I’ve learned in my days as a ranger to help those who may have questions perhaps get a little more out of their class. Part I Basics- My qualifications or why the hell is an only level 33 ranger writing this guide? Well I come from EQ 1. There I played a Paladin to 70, a Ranger to 65 and a Druid to 70. Kiting is something every Eq1 player is very familiar with. And tho it has changed in eq2 the basics remain the same. Now I’m not here to pat myself on the back or claim kiting is foolproof. Because if your looking for a fool proof way to kill something go read something else. I die a lot. Expect to die a lot while kiting even when you have it down. My KVD is barely over 100, yet I’ve managed to solo my way to 33 (solo about 75% of the time) and have killed to quote a friend of mine “some outlandish [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]’. To date I normally xp in zek by soloing level 39 and 40 Protectors, Elites, Centurions and such. I’ve managed to take down 2 group yellows like Vallon savages and Centurions. And Heroic Reds like the Sullon Lt and his minions. Yet the thing that I believe was the toughest kill was duoing Moog the overlord a level 40^^ with another ranger via bounce kiting. What is Kiting? The word kiting comes from Eq 1. Back then it was a way for classes, mainly necro’s, druids, bards and to a small extent rangers (very very small) to solo effectively. Kiting is very effective for classes that can either increase their own movement speed during battle and/or slow down opponents. The basics behind kiting involves using high damage abilities (direct damage and/or Damage over time) to kill a mob while it follows you around unable to get close enough to hit you. In EQ2 this is more challenging due to the anti-kiting code which will have a mob break encounter if you stray it too far away from its spawn point or outdistance it Too greatly. Therefore EQ2 players have had to improvise by running smaller routes and using more finesse. How do I Kite? Kiting is something that is easy to learn and hard to master. There are several different types of kiting that you can use dependent on whether you are soloing or duoing. Also the amount of foes you face is a factor. 2 mobs are twice as hard to kite as 1. And 3 twice as hard again. The more you add the harder it gets. Once you get it down though. It will get to the point that the only thing between if you will win or won’t is the amount of arrows you have. There are several types of Kiting which I will discuss a bit later on. The most popular is solo kiting, or what most people know. This involves picking out a foe slowing its movement speed and running elliptical circles while your bow ca’s and poisons do the work. There is also bounce kiting, for when you are duoing with another ranger. Or my favorite and the toughest to learn sweet spot kiting. Yes it is possible! Remember the key to kiting is NOT to get hit. If that means holding off on your Ca’s a moment while you maneuver around a rock or tree so be it. Keep yourself steady first, shoot second. All the damage in the world isn’t going to help you if you back peddle into a wall and have a pack of reds on you. What do I need to Kite? Ah good question. The first thing you need is to be comfortable at your desk. Seriously. I’m left-handed, so I use the arrow keys to move and keep my mouse in my left hand. When Kiting I keep the down and right or left arrows keys pressed down with my control key to move in a circle, I use the mouse for course corrections and to keep scrolling out as needed so I don’t accidentally backpedal into a creature that most likely will not have a strong liking of me. I keep all my kiting Ca’s on the number hot bar so all it takes is a quick second to jam down 1, 2 for a quick flameshot/tripleshot combo. Set your hotkeys up appropriately. Ok got that. Now smoke a cigarette before you start because once you do your not going to be able to smoke or type until you’re done. Well you can but you’ll probably crash into a wall and die and then come back posting here that I suck and don’t know what I’m talking about. Well at least I’d do that. Ok so now you have your hotkeys all set up. Your smoked your cigarette told all your friends you’ll be kiting so won’t be able to type and are all ready to go! Wrong. There are a few essentials you need to kite effectively. <OL> <LI>A BOW- Yes go ahead and laugh. But If I didn’t mention it I’m sure people would be out there trying to kite using their daggers =). Ok seriously you need a bow, and a good one. Preferably a long bow (high chance of procs) even better an imbued longbow (more procs!).</LI></OL> 2. Poisons- When kiting you need to realize one thing. Half your damage is going to come from poisons and procs. So the more numerous and better quality you have the faster you kill. In general you will want to use 3 poisons. A debuff to poison resistance, a High Damage low dot poison and a Low damage High dot one. Why 2 different types of damage poisons since they don’t stack? Easy. Each poison is an additional chance to proc from my understanding. So if you have 1 poison at (using random numbers here) a 5% chance to proc if you have 2 poisons you have two 5% chances to proc. The high Damage poison is for that additional zing when you hit the mob. Nothing like seeing 140 damage from poison hit on top of your CA. The high dot one is for continuous damage. See High damage upfront poisons have smaller dots so they are used just for initial damage. In an ideal world, Your flameshot procs your high dd and then your regular bowshot procs your high dot one which overwrites the dot portion of your high dd one and does even more damage until your proc again. Wow I just read that and am as confused as you are. But trust me on this one. The debuff poison stacks with either of the two and will make them land much more frequently and for greater damage. On top of poisons having damage procs like gleaming strike especially on a longbow (your using a longbow for greater proc chances) will give you even more additional damage. There is nothing like seeing your triple shot hit with a double proc of your high DD poison on the first two arrows and your high dot one on the last coupled with a gleaming strike proc. Is it common when that happens? Not at all, all the more reason you cherish those moments. <OL> <LI>Good drink- I cannot stress the importance of having good handcrafted drink. More power means more Ca’s which means more damage. You really want to try to avoid situations where you are out of power and kiting, then you’re just relying on bow damage, procs and poisons which is cutting your dps in half at least. Having high level handcrafted drinks helps avoid this (go hug your local provisioner). On a side not the PGT (polished granite tomahawk) is invaluable. Its still procs off bow shots (shush don’t tell anyone) and the added power makes a world of difference. With a pgt and good drink you’ll rarely be out of power.</LI></OL> <OL> <LI>Some open space! If your going to try to kite in runneye, or stomhold or any dungeon well your either suicidal or should be writing this guide yourself. Kiting is for outdoor areas. At first you may need a lot of open space to do so effectively. As you grow more accustomed you can do so in smaller and smaller areas. For example I’ve kited Trial 2 of the SBS quest, by just moving around and using my jump key to avoid things. It took a few tries but I did it.</LI></OL> <OL> <LI>Spacebar is your friend- Learn your jump button. Love your jump button. It will save you more then you can ever imagine. I actually put on quite a show when kiting. You’ll see me jumping over rocks and other obstacles and rarely letting them interfere with my art (and yes kiting is an art!). Proper use of your jump key and mouse will let you avoid any and all obstacles and keep the flow of the fight in your favor.</LI></OL> <OL> <LI>Proper buffs! - Ok real important as well. You must keep all your buffs up when possible. Things like steady aim, Natural Instinct and especially adroit and Foresters insight are invaluable. Forester’s insight gives you a 5% movement increase while IN combat. That is a huge huge advantage which cannot be understated. Bladeflurry should always be active (especially now that it’s fixed again) it’s another chance to proc more damage and therefore proc more poisons and dd’s! However with all that said and done the single most important buff to keep on yourself at all times is survival instincts/adroit. You will eventually get hit. And having that additional chance to parry is huge. I can’t count the amount of times adroit has saved me from being smeared into a wall because I parried away a swing or two when they got too close.</LI></OL> 7. Arrows! - Make sure you have lots and lots of arrows. The worst feeling in the world is when you go to hit that CA and get the missing component message. Make sure if you plan on kiting you have a huge stack of arrows ready to go. As a reference point I normally carry around 15-20 Stacks and mash makeshift whenever I can. Part II The Art of Kiting- Ok so now you have your poisons set up. All your buffs are ready to go, and you have enough arrows to take out a large group of infantry. Now the fun stuff. How to maximize your damage. There are several Ca’s as a Ranger you will use during your fight for ease of writing assume depending on your level which version to use (IE Backshot/Snipingshot/Culling the herd) These are: Sniping shot Flameshot Tripleshot Wounding arrow Miracle shot Trickshot Leaping cut Lunging thrust Corner. Ensnare. Flameshot/tripleshot/leaping cut/lunging thrust/corner are going to be your staples as all can be executed at a safe distance while moving. Sniping shot will be used to start the encounter and to dish out that first dose of high damage. Wounding arrow should always always be your second follow up arrow as the now perturbed creature charges at you. Wounding arrow will allow your following attacks to hit more often. You should be able to get off a 3rd stationary CA at this time I normally use Trickshot as it requires line of sight where as Miracle shot does not and can be used further out. You should follow these up by starting an HO’s and using corner/leaping cut to finish for some additional damage. So now you have an Ho’ done and the mob dotted from your leaping cut as well. Now keep moving in a circular route while watching behind you as you land lunging thrust to further decrease piercing mitigation and do a bit more damage. Ok now it’s really mad. You’ve proc’d poisons a few times and have done a bunch of damage. So now we chain our big hitters while the mob is still debuffed and flameshot/Tripleshot IN THAT ORDER. Never fire tripleshot first especially against healer type foes. I’ll explain. You see you may take away 80% of a mobs life by using tripleshot first, but if it’s a healer type by the time your 4 second cast time openshot fires it will have healed itself so now your tripleshot may not kill it. However if you fire openshot first the 1 second cast time on Tripleshot does not allow enough time for a mob to heal itself, and many times that small subtle change is the difference between an outright kill or another 30 seconds of kiting. Ok so now you’ve fired off all your ranged Ca’s. So its time to rinse and repeat firing them off as they become available. From here on in its pretty basic if you choose this route, run in a circle and continue pouring out the damage using those Ca’s. When possible snare the mob to slow its movement speed get some distance and fire off a stationary CA like wounding arrow or miracle shot. Pretty basic right? Ok but there is another way to add more damage by using your short range melee attacks and other Ca’s. I’ve chosen to include these strategies separately as they take some practice to get use too and many involve stun kiting with cheapshot. Ensnare/stalk/Hiddneshot combo- The easiest of the following. Simply enough ensnare and the stalk line can be used while moving, though stalk will slow your run speed substantially. You need to make sure you have enough distance to get all 3 off or it’s wasted. The best time to do this is in the straightaway portion of your elliptical circle as then is when you have enough room. Wait until you are mid turn and cast impede/ensnare and Queue up Stalk. It will slow it down enough where the moment you stealth you can stop and fire off hidden shot for some big extra damage. It is possible to move slightly while firing stationary CA’s so if its getting a bit close move back a tiny bit as you cast, you’ll learn via trial and error how much is too much. Also keep in mind if the big bad guy is getting too close its better to cut your losses and run then stay and get hit. If you can get it off great! If not continue along your kite. Corner/Ensare/Cheapshot/sniping shot combo- This is a bit harder to get down. And quite frankly I only succeed a portion of the time. Yet is a great way to get sniping shot in again once it refreshes. The best time to get this off is during the turning portion of your loop as that is when the mob is closest to you. You want to start with corner to lower defense, just before you begin your turn, then in midturn cast ensnare/ queue up cheapshot and turn off attack. The moment cheapshot casts RUN Past the mob and turn firing off sniping shot. You will get it off if your timing is right (comes with practice) Once you fire your sniping shot get to moving again. On a side note if your going to get hit this is when it will be, so make sure adroit is up when you attempt this. Luckybreak/Ensnare//Cheapshot/Shadowlunge combo- Similar to above but we substitute shadowlunge our high damage backstab for snipingshot. You will use this at the same time you would use the cheapshot/sniping shot combo. Shadowlunge has nice range on it from behind so use the same concept. If you’re going to do this might as well start an HO and take advantage of some additional damage (hopefully) while doing it. Lucky to start /cheapshot to continue and lunge to finish. Ensnare/Cheapshot/pouncing attack/shadowflame combo- Ok first things first. You’re going to get hit. End of story. No way around it. I tend to use this most against solo mobs of even con or yellow I just want to finish off quickly. The concept is simple once again just before you begin your turn snare the mob and stun it. Immediately move to the Side of the mob (side is closer then behind) and hit shrouded strike or pouncing attack. This will break the Stun, however if your fast enough on the buttons you will have shadowflame qued up and if the mob misses you, you’ll hit for even more additional damage. At this point you can either continue kiting or slam down melee ca’s to finish off the fight. Do not use this early on or midfight against creatures which can quickly stun and kill you. The only exception is if using a pgt and your ward just procced and can absorb some damage. Then it maybe worth it. It’s your call on that one. These are the basic chain Ca’s I use when fighting Solo mobs. Keep in mind these are all ineffective when there is more then one as your going to get hit and then things become a bloody mess. Using any of those combo’s while doing a group often leads you in a panic to hit your escape key, and well your kite just got eaten by Charlie brown’s tree. The Art of Sweet spot Kiting- This is only only effective against Solo encounters. I stress this. Try this against 2 or more and it’s a swift invitation to beating time. Ok we all have heard of the sweet spot. That elusive area where you can fire off both melee attacks and bow ca’s without having to move. It can be tough to find when you’re stationary; it’s harder when you’re moving. It is possible though. This will allow you to work in more ca’s you would normally not have access too when kiting such as mastery strikes, rip, Lightning strike, quickstrike etc. I often wonder if it’s worth it considering how dangerous it can be. But then I proc a gleaming strike /poison proc combo off rip and grin like an idiot. If anything is going to get you killed while kiting this is it. I highly advise mastering kiting first then moving on to this. To SS kite (should be SoS kite lol) you need to maintain the mobs height difference in-between you. This is the maximum melee distance. Coming from EQ 1 where as a raid leader I spent ¾ of my time Shouting MAX MELEE to everyone it wasn’t that hard to get accustomed too. If you can keep that distance mid kite while fighting you’ll be able to work in a few extra ca’s for added damage. I can’t really describe how this is done. It’s really more of just a touch thing. Practice on gray mobs and you’ll eventually be able to get this down to a reasonable level of success. Just remember two things. <OL> <LI>Always keep adroit or its line up.</LI> <LI>Its better to retreat and live to fight again then to get mauled like an idiot.</LI></OL> On a side not if your timing Is impeccable it is possible to get off melee Ca’s while kiting by stopping (yes stopping) mid kite queuing up a lightning strike moving into the sweet spot and just as its about to hit move back out of the mobs melee range. It’s hard to do but can be worth it. If you make sure to err on the side of safety you shouldn’t get hit. Much. Group Kiting or OMG there are 4 of them!- Ok remember all those pretty combo’s you learned for solo fights? Forget them. Every single one of them. Their no good here. Also you might as well put your ensnare/impede key away because no sense in snaring only 1 of 3 mobs it will just keep it out of range of your extended range melee ca’s like lunging thrust and leaping cut while the other 2 or 3 bare down on you. When group kiting I have one strategy mainly and that is dot kiting (unless there is a healer or caster in the group then you want to burn that one down ASAP before dot kiting). Dot kiting involves switching from mob to mob to make sure you have as many of them poisoned and therefore taking damage at the same time as possible. For those that don’t know the Tab key is your friend. It allows you to cycle through creatures engaged in the fight. You want to open up one mob with a flurry of Ca’s as if it was a solo mob. When this is done, in all likelihood it will be poisoned, now you want to move onto the 2nd one in the group and stay on it, until it is poisoned. Use leaping cut and lunging thrust as available. Once the 2nd one is poisoned move to the next one. The key is to keep as many poisoned and therefore taking damage at once as possible. Yes that does mean you will not kill one super fast and therefore have a greater chance of not surviving a stun/collision. But we’re kiting so we’re not getting hit in the first place right! Keeping all mobs dotted will substantially reduce the time and arrows needed to win the fight. Once you have cycled through pick the lowest health one and finish it off. Then rinse and repeat. Once you’re down to one treat it as a solo mob and unleash on the hapless thing. Bounce Kiting!-Or how to duo with another Ranger People have asked me, what is my favorite class to duo with? That’s easy. Another Ranger!. Bounce kiting is about as safe and flawless as it can get. As long as you have 2 people who know what their doing. To understand bounce kiting you need to know how agro works. Aggro is a number basically. Everything you do buff, hit, heal, Ca’s gives positive agro. In a group the person who has the highest agro number is the one who the mob will be beating on. Bounce kiting takes advantage of this flaw by rapidly switching agro back and forth between two people. It can take some practice, but [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] is it effective (This is how myself and a 34 ranger took down a 40^^). Ok example. You and your ranger buddy find a very tough, very red foe in front of you. One of you sneaks behind him at max distance and the other in front of him about halfway to him. The Ranger behind unloads with snipingshot/wounding arrow and as many other Ca’s stationary Ca’s as possible. This will anger him quite a bit and now this bloody beast is heading straight for you! So now your partner in crime opens up himself with the same combo, plus another high damage CA like Tripleshot!. Guess what the extra CA will overcome (normally) the initial agro bonus and it will turn right back around towards him! Now he begins his kite and as he does so you fire off your high damage CA’s like tripleshot/flameshot etc. The moment your CA’s are done your partner evades/stalks etc to drop agro. Guess what? 9 out of 10 times he will turn around and make a beeline back to you. Now your partner runs behind him unleashing ranged melee ca’s like Shadowlunge as you kite. Eventually you evade/stalk and wait for him to get agro back and then begin to unleash more of your now refreshed CA’s like sniping shot/hidden shot!. You keep up this ridiculous pattern until either the mob is dead or they nerf the hell out of it. This allows 1 of the 2 rangers to always have the creatures back to it as the other kites. There by doubling your damage. A few keys are knowing how and when to use agro reducers (evade/shadow etc) and making sure you are using complimentary poisons. Work these things out before hand and bounce kiting can be a very effective way to win what seems like impossible fights! Ok, so now about 90 minutes have passed and I can’t type anymore. I by no means claim this to be the end all be all guides to kiting, its just a few tricks and tips I’ve learned in my day. Many people may feel a lot of what I’ve stated is pretty basic. This is true. Hopefully this guide helps out a couple of people and makes their time on Norrath more enjoyable. Kiting is not an efficient way, to make xp. It can be time consuming. And you will level faster in groups then soloing. However for those times when you just can’t find a group or don’t have long to play, buff up pull out your arrows and go to work knowing you can still get something done and have some fun while doing it. Kiting is an art. And as with most arts the more you practice the better you become. Be prepared to die a lot early on. Be prepared to get frustrated. Be prepared to have people screaming at you to call for help as you kite around 3 reds. And finally be prepared for that moment when you drop that heroic group of oranges or that yellow double up and turn to those people and say “sorry I was kiting and couldn’t type but thanks for the offer of help!” Those are the moments that make being a Ranger supreme. Remember you are a Ranger, master of long distance combat. Use that to your advantage and I promise you’ll accomplish things that will leave you and those around you in shock. Well now I’m off to Norrath, if you see a crazy ranger with a backpack full or arrows running around in a panic while being chased by a group of Reds, that’s me and no I don’t need help =). Nial Bladestorm 33rd Ranger Antonia Bayle Disclaimer- Avoid Orange con casters like the plague. Especially Mystic types. If you can’t burn them down with 2 or 3 ca’s they’ll tear you apart every time. I promise.</DIV> Message Edited by Rian18 on 05-04-2005 07:55 PM Message Edited by Rian18 on 05-04-2005 07:57 PMMessage Edited by Rian18 on 05-04-2005 07:58 PM

MistDragon

05-05-2005, 10:20 AM

<DIV>I have'nt yet finished reading it but from what I have read this is a very good guide.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would like to add one thing I did'nt see or maybe did not get to yet,, Think about getting a "Pristine shadow imbued ruckas hex doll" it's an activatble item that has 10agil & a clicky effect that slows your target by 22-26%, I'm assuming it means it slows movement rate as I hav'nt had a chance to buy one yet. I see them priced around 35gp.</DIV>

Jay

05-05-2005, 08:51 PM

<DIV>Nice guide, well done! Mind if I clean up your typeface, formatting, and spelling? <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Not to nitpick, you've got a lot of good content there, it's a shame that in the current format it's kinda hard (for me) to read. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sorry... tech writer by day. I'll stop now. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Great job!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Kae</DIV>

Rian18

05-05-2005, 09:20 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Jay42 wrote: <DIV>Nice guide, well done! Mind if I clean up your typeface, formatting, and spelling? <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Not to nitpick, you've got a lot of good content there, it's a shame that in the current format it's kinda hard (for me) to read. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sorry... tech writer by day. I'll stop now. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Great job!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- Kae</DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> By all means. Feel free to tidy it up. I wrote that over the course of 90 minutes pretty much free hand so I'm sure it has countless grammer and formatting mistackes. Nial Bladestorm 33 Ranger Antonia Bayle

Axxon

05-06-2005, 08:10 PM

EDIT: This should be stickied! This is a great guide. I also took what I knew from playing Druid, Ranger and others in EQ1 and applied it to EQ2 mechanics. I have done most (but not all) of what you set out here. Believe him - it does work. Very well done post. As a side note, you can group kite but like the man said, it is tricky. At around level 27, I soloed the Outland Brigade quest in TS. It ends with fights against 3 waves of centaur invaders. I had no problem with the first 2 - one of them was even grey. When the last one came, I got off my first shot before I realized that they were white con HEROIC - the first 2 groups were not - and there were about 5 of these buggers after me. Well, I did not want to blow the quest and start over, so I went to work with the tab key and kiting techniques just like the ones descibed in here. About 10 minutes into it, I got a tell from a templar who had been watching me asking what I was doing. I explained it as quickly as I could in between turns, and she loved it - stayed and watched until it was over. In the end, I was left standing, still in the yellow (although barely) and the mobs were all dead. It was my most fun solo moment in EQ2 yet. I love my Ranger! Message Edited by Drakkonius on 05-06-2005 12:11 PM

IsleWit

05-07-2005, 12:00 AM

<blockquote><hr>Rian18 wrote: Disclaimer- Avoid Orange con casters like the plague. Especially Mystic types. If you can’t burn them down with 2 or 3 ca’s they’ll tear you apart every time. I promise. <hr></blockquote>2 or more blue casters will wipe you out too. God i hate casters. I wish we had a good stifle CA. Great guide. Mods please sticky this thread. <div></div>

Jay

05-07-2005, 12:49 AM

Rian, I'm about halfway thru the editing pass; I haven't really changed much actual content, mostly just cleanup. I'll try to send it to you in a PM when I'm done. Later <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Ulta

05-09-2005, 04:11 PM

Great guide! I love kiting things around, the only problem is when I lose concentration and get stuck in a bit of wall or something similar <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> As others have mentioned, meelee mobs are nice and easy, but casters can be horrible, especially the ones that can stop you using your CAs... <div></div>

Kyriel

05-10-2005, 12:01 AM

Seriously nice guide, but the best class to duo within my opinion is not another ranger but a troubador, First the buffs alone are worth it towards ur damage, second they can keep aggro and do dots at the same time while u are behind them hitting the mob which sniping shot as the reuse timers clears, u can use stalk or and equivalent to gain stealth wait for troub to put mob in place and hit crippling blade. I done this with a buddy of mine who sadly stayed on RE when i moved to Toxx, at lvl 42 we were kitting in permafrost the glacier doods who are lvl 48 heroics. One bad thing of kiting with a ranger is the annuling each others spells. I hate it when i lot of people say they cant dish out dps as a ranger, even if you are kiting alone, we put up some nice damage, just a tip on kitting with troubadors passing lvl 40(preferable since they get a mana song and healing song) , their buffs become insane and their dps stands extremely close to ours. their dots work like our Ca's , they can use while moving <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Landacet LvL44 Ranger Of toxxulia</DIV>Message Edited by Zemfira on 05-09-2005 01:03 PM

Rian18

05-15-2005, 10:34 PM

<DIV>Possibly but the key to bounce kiting is too have an equal class alongside you.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its much easier to measure and balance out aggro with 2 people of the same class.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It gets much harder to bounce aggro and skip the mob around at range when you are comparing two classes with different skill sets.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I've duoed 42^^ as a 34 Ranger with a 35 Ranger. I'm sure it could be done with a troub or a dirge, I just imagine it would take a different skill set. And lots of straight kiting by the Troub while the Ranger attacks from behind. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bounce Kiting is a beautiful thing and we've taken out lesser foe's like Muugu (35^^) with out him ever doing anything more then just running in a line inbetween the two of us, while we both unleashed on the poor thing.</DIV>

Nulad

05-16-2005, 03:37 PM

Just like to point out that drinking while kiting is utterly pointless as drink and food benifits are suspended during combat. Nul. <div></div>

Rian18

05-18-2005, 09:40 PM

Yes but good food and drink (especially drink) allow you to move right on to the next kill rapidly as opposed to waiting longer to get full power again. I added that section, because It still shocks me to see how many people use summoned drink and such for power regen. When I kite I use alot of power, and even with pgt and manastone I often am low when done so having good drink really cuts down on my downtime.

Vimy

05-19-2005, 01:33 AM

I only have one issue with kiting. Especially in a small area.... It makes me dizzy! :smileyhappy: It's funny though, since reading this guide, I think I've forgotten how I fought before. I mean, even the solo mobs get kited now, at least until I've worn them down a bit. Can't believe that I was ignoring my ranged attacks, and all the DPS they bring because I thought kiting wouldn't work. /doh Now if only I had more vitality so that I didn't burn through it so fast.... <div></div>

conmcb

05-25-2005, 05:39 PM

Ok this maybe a dumb question but how do you use three poisons with just two activatable slots? Im using a high DOT low DD poison right now and a debuff, I think its the one that lowers strenght and makes the target more susceptable to slashing damage, but I would have to check. Am I missing something? I do a bit of kiting myself at my level in Antonica. Using a combo of backshot, open shot. Im lvl 19 Predator right now. Message Edited by conmcb25 on 05-25-2005 09:52 AM

StealthM0

05-25-2005, 07:11 PM

Like to add something in regards to poisons...don't know if many know this but you can load out on as many poisons as you feel like. It just increases the chance one of them will hit with each turn/hit. I load up on 5 poisons with my level 18 predator (doing ranger sub-class quest now, sorta stuck, gotta check some hint sites). Acidic Goo Acidic Massage Crypt Sludge Curse of the Phantom (spellcheck might be the wrong one, its got a yellow cap) Blight of the eventide With the combination of these 5, at least one hits every other hit. And when they start stacking up with multiple hits, those DOTS really help. (If I am understanding correctly DOTS are the recurring damage). Add up the DOTS from those five poisons, its over 50 hp/round. Add that to the mass intitial damage from each of the five (well crypt, curse, and acidic massage), roughly 25-43hp initially, in combination with your combat abilities, and you have a very lethal character. <img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Teksun

05-25-2005, 08:50 PM

Well... I guess it's true... you learn something everyday! I don't think I've ever stacked damage poisons. I've been using them since day one and do use debuff poisons in group/raid but other than that... WOW, thanks <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

Kyriel

05-25-2005, 11:09 PM

the max is 4 actually that fifth on doesnt proc or show on ur buff window because the max is 4 <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Sulas

05-26-2005, 01:46 AM

Conmcb, you can use more than 2 poisons by moving new ones to your activatable slots an dthen using them. They don't have to be in the slot to work, just to 'apply' them. I keep up a few poisons up, but then move Totems into my activatable slots so I can quick cast HP/Mana regens if need be. I hope that helps. <div></div>

StealthM0

05-26-2005, 08:31 AM

<DIV>Zem see the other thread. I stacked 5 poisons they are all showing up in buffs...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But in combat it appears it only lets two poisons hit at any one time...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=39&message.id=8352" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=39&message.id=8352</A></DIV>Message Edited by StealthM0de on 05-25-2005 09:32 PM

Langel

05-27-2005, 01:39 AM

LaCalave

06-10-2005, 03:57 PM

Great GuideMessage Edited by LaCalavera on 06-10-2005 05:00 AM

Nolrog

06-14-2005, 09:07 PM

Very interesting guide. I kited a lot in EQ, but never considered it here because of the code changes to make it more difficult. I think I might give it a try now, though, and see. By the way, In EQ1, rangers were very effective kiters. There were things to kite all the way into the 60s (using panic animal and slashing away.)

Rikare

06-27-2005, 01:53 PM

<DIV>Great guide you made...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have been kiting, or trying to since I started my Ranger a few weeks back. In the beginnig everything was fine, I could deal with 2 con horics 2-3 lvl above me.</DIV> <DIV>Lately im having more problems. I load up my posion apply my buffs. The monsters and mobs "catch" up on me and are able to hit me a lot. on example is the Heroic Lashers in EL. I don't seem to run fast enough to keep distance between us. Most of the time I run with my front towards my enemy. A friend of mine (same lvl assasin) are able to solo much higher lvl mobs. Even some of the epic ones in Zek. He takes almost no damage, but when I try they will kill me due to many hits.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My AGI are over 170 now (im lvl 36), and rest of the items are yellow/orange. Avoidance is 61%. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>does weight matters as long as its below max? Should I run with my back towards the enemy? im I to close if I can hit them with my melee weapons while I run?</DIV> <DIV>Does animal/creatures run faster than human/ mobs on 2 foot? Does it matter what arrow I use? most of the time i use those who cost 7 or 29 C each.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Any help would be good</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

ADW123

06-27-2005, 08:49 PM

<DIV>I've actually been soloing in same spot as you at 32 and I have been having similar problems...its something about the lashers that are slightly faster than other mobs which I have no problem with. I can take them down but need to move around obsticles to screw up their pathing etc...As for your questions...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Weight doesn't matter long as you're below max</DIV> <DIV>-Run w/ your front towards mob, there is no speed difference either way and you can't use some attacks with your back to the mob.</DIV> <DIV>-If you can hit them with melee you are likely too close but in most cases you will be right on the boundry between being able to and not being able to, sometimes I can</DIV> <DIV> pull off close combat CA's and other times I'm too far away...As long as the mob can't hit you your fine.</DIV> <DIV>-Don't know if there is a difference between animal/human but I have noticed some creatures that move slightly faster than others (or so I think anyway...)</DIV> <DIV>-High quality arrows will give you better auto attack damage, Using tin I average about 30-40, using feyiron I hit 100+ most of the time. You'll have to decide whether its </DIV> <DIV> worth it to you to pay 80sp a stack over 2sp a stack...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hope this answered some of your questions.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sacrifice</DIV> <DIV>32 Ranger</DIV>

Rikare

06-27-2005, 10:37 PM

<DIV>Thanks a lot. Good to hear im not the only one with probs against lashers. And for the rest u gave me the info I needed.</DIV>

Lego

06-27-2005, 10:39 PM

Something else to keep in mind, especially if you have a low to mid range system like myself, is lag and latency. I have a more difficult time kiting in places like Zek, where I have more mobs on screen (I kite in 3rd person usually) and/or highly detailed environments. Keeping your settings turned down helps some, but you will get an occasional slight pause, which helps mobs catch up. Also I've found that turning tight circles, especially when kiting heroic groups, tends to get you hit about once every revolution. Thank god for Parry and the PGT <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

Gerrine44

06-28-2005, 04:43 AM

So far kiting has been fairly simple. I've stuck to using two diffrent poisions, only killing mobs that are 3 levels higher than me, and not trying to kill more than 3 at a time. The hardest part was getting the movement down, and learning when to jump. The timing wasnt so hard, very similar to that of kiting in EQ 1. Great guide, wouldnt have been able to figue out kiting on my own.

Pilo

07-19-2005, 09:36 AM

Silly question--I've read through this and I'm still a little confused. So basically, I'm running backwards the whole time? I've tried this a few times on my lower level ranger-to-be (praciticing for later) and my typical problem is that I'm not entirely sure where I'm going. If there's an obstacle (or worse, a cliff or some aggro mobs) I typically won't seem them until barely before its too late. Is there a better way to see where I'm going? <div></div>

Rikare

07-19-2005, 10:43 AM

<DIV>For the time beeing I have disabled the "auto face target" function. This gives me the chance to pan the camera around my char in 3. person without changing the direction I run in. At least this have helped me when I was at a low lvl in Nek and other places.</DIV>

gimpmas

07-19-2005, 10:50 PM

Im a lvl 40 ranger and this improved my kiting madly and here i thout i was good at it <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.

Rumbi

07-25-2005, 07:47 PM

I hate to say it, but after combat changes, KITING WILL BE NO MORE! Word on the street says that all range attacks will be done as a spell, and be interrupted if moving. On the plus side, you will be able to stand at maximum melee range to be able to MELEE and RANGE at the same time! Wohoo! :smileyhappy:

Rikare

07-27-2005, 05:06 AM

<DIV>If u are right about this, then I will be very sad. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kiting is not cheat, it's not exploit, it is an art form. </DIV> <DIV>Every proff, has a strong side and a weak side. Rangers and assassins got Kiting as a strong side. On the weakside, we are not great tanks, we can not heal others, and we struggle in tight areas. (at least I do, hehe).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Right now, I got thousands thoughts in my head, many words, but I think I leave it for now and see what happens.</DIV>

Kiluvi

08-05-2005, 12:34 AM

Come September 12, kiting will be no more. You will not be able to move and use archery Combat Arts simultaneously. Good guide though.

Sulas

08-05-2005, 08:36 PM

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Kiluvian wrote:Come September 12, kiting will be no more. You will not be able to move and use archery Combat Arts simultaneously.Good guide though.<hr></blockquote>Kiluvian,I see nothing in the last message about combat changes to support this. Is there additional information that I missed? I know you posted this before Moorgard made this post: <a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=2" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=2</a> It looks to me that we will be able to move and kite, but I've not yet tested it.Scout Changes<ul><li>The spell/art damage of Scouts has been increased.</li><li>Auto-attack damage for Assassins and Rangers has been increased.</li><li>Swashbucklers and Brigands received a slight health increase.</li><li>Rangers, Assassins, Swashbucklers, and Brigands now have both offensive and defensive stances.</li><li>Bards now have decreased cast times on some target encounter debuffs. </li><li>Assassins gain improved damage output of stealth attacks.</li><li>Ranger: Steady Aim is now a more powerful short term ranged skill increase.</li><li>Brigand: Beg for Mercy has changed to target a player that places a reactive spell effect on them. This reactive spell effect causes them to lose a massive amount of hate to the entire encounter.</li><li>Swashbuckler: Inspired Daring now grants a 100% proc that lasts for 13 seconds.</li><li>Dirge: Hyran's Angry Sonata allows the Dirge to target the group's Fighter to increase the aggro they gain.</li><li>Troubador: Alin's Soothing Serenade lets the Troubador decrease hate for all group members other than Fighters.</li></ul> edit: made link work<div></div>Message Edited by Sulas on 08-05-2005 12:49 PM

Kiluvi

08-05-2005, 09:00 PM

<DIV>Not everything was posted, and I have a character on the Test Server, you can't do anything other than ranged auto attack. Unless they give the Triple Fire, Sharp Shot, etc. lines instant casting times, than there is no kiting. You can't even Snare a mob down to a slow enough run speed without a Adept 1 or greater rank enough for it to matter, they can catch up still. It is not that big of a problem yet, most people should have at least one good snare at Adept 1 or greater anyways.</DIV>

Sulas

08-05-2005, 10:24 PM

<blockquote><hr>Kiluvian wrote:<div>Not everything was posted, and I have a character on the Test Server, you can't do anything other than ranged auto attack. Unless they give the Triple Fire, Sharp Shot, etc. lines instant casting times, than there is no kiting. You can't even Snare a mob down to a slow enough run speed without a Adept 1 or greater rank enough for it to matter, they can catch up still. It is not that big of a problem yet, most people should have at least one good snare at Adept 1 or greater anyways.</div><hr></blockquote> Well, if that's the case, please send them a carefully worded, scathing 'Feedback' for me. Ashatss. That news leaves me very disappointed in the Devs.<div></div>

Curati

08-08-2005, 02:25 AM

ok so here are my questions what does Ca mean I have never heard of poisons how do i get them and how do i use them? and how are rangers that dont surf messageboards suposed to know about them?

Teksun

08-08-2005, 05:45 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Curative wrote: ok so here are my questions what does Ca mean I have never heard of poisons how do i get them and how do i use them? and how are rangers that dont surf messageboards suposed to know about them? <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> CA is combat art, the spell effects you use in fighting The best poisons are player made. Go to your local broker and put up a search for poisons (first filter), and filter for skill level (I usually put orange to white). Most of them have 7 charges of 200 proc and will tell you what kind of damage. <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=31&message.id=1500&view=by_date_ascending&page=1" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=31&message.id=1500&view=by_date_ascending&page=1</A> Not sure where I learned to use poison, I have been for quite some time... Edited to add link to poison guideMessage Edited by Teksun on 08-08-2005 08:52 AM

Ecnomorc

08-12-2005, 04:25 PM

Well we can throw this book out of the window. It was a good guide but now none of it will be helpful. Cause we are assassin with a different name. Regardless of whatever anyone says kiting is and was an art. <div></div>

Jay

08-12-2005, 09:14 PM

<DIV>This has been a good guide that many have found helpful, including myself. After the combat revamp, a lot of this won't be relevent, but that doesn't diminish the value it has had for those who have learned from it. And after the combat revamp, we will learn the changes and other committed, enterprising rangers will write new guides to help their colleagues. A poor attitude isn't going to get anyone anywhere; let's wait and see how the revamp shakes out and then adapt and overcome like we always have.</DIV>

Ecnomorc

08-14-2005, 05:11 PM

I learned from this guide and yes it was a great one. <div></div>

Rian18

08-16-2005, 08:43 PM

Thanks for all the kind words on the guide I wrote a while back. I'm glad that it was able to help some of you (for a time at least) have a bit more fun while playing this game. Work has kept me from playing as much as I like, but hopefully soon enough i'll be back on more often. Since I wrote this guide parts of it have become outdated. Now it appears that the whole thing will be outdated. Some people will say that with kiting gone our only effective way of being able to solo is gone. I say players have always been more creative then game designers when it comes to finding ways to do things. So we'll just have to all work together and figure out a new and better way to be able to do things "they" say we shouldn't. Besides isn't it more fun to beat them at their own game? Nial Sunstorm Antonia Bayle

Ecnomorc

08-17-2005, 02:19 AM

I somewhat agree with you. <div></div>

Jay

08-17-2005, 04:41 PM

<DIV>Maybe I'm being naive, but I don't expect we'll need to find a workaround or exploit in order to continue kiting. I don't think we'll need to kite at all. We're only dependent on it for soloing b/c of current game mechanics. Several rangers who are actually playing the changes (not just reacting to the news that kiting is being removed) are saying that soloing is just as manageable, perhaps even easier, than it was before. Cheap Shot is a whole new line of skills that will scale, whose the duration has been multiplied several times over, so we can stun and get in several melee OR ranged CAs. We'll all have to adapt and learn some new tactics, but "No Kiting" does NOT equal "No Soloing," not when the whole context of the situation is changing.</DIV>Message Edited by Jay42 on 08-17-2005 08:41 AM

jacobag

08-17-2005, 07:13 PM

I don't think you are naive at all Jay. I have playing this game (and EQ1) for over 4 years now; and I have seen a number of changes, some good some bad. It is a living and evolving game. Sure the developers will make soem mistakes, but they are really on our side and do their very best to keep us happy. When you think about the enormity of the task involved, you have to admire the result on the whole. I have been happy with my ranger and I am sure that I will find the challange of living without kiting to be mind stimulating and exciting. I am sure that most of the folks who are crying and complaining today will soon be saying "Boy, this sure beats kiting!". Zeeman Ranger of the 49th season on Permafrost <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Jay42 wrote: <DIV>Maybe I'm being naive, but I don't expect we'll need to find a workaround or exploit in order to continue kiting. I don't think we'll need to kite at all. We're only dependent on it for soloing b/c of current game mechanics. Several rangers who are actually playing the changes (not just reacting to the news that kiting is being removed) are saying that soloing is just as manageable, perhaps even easier, than it was before. Cheap Shot is a whole new line of skills that will scale, whose the duration has been multiplied several times over, so we can stun and get in several melee OR ranged CAs. We'll all have to adapt and learn some new tactics, but "No Kiting" does NOT equal "No Soloing," not when the whole context of the situation is changing.</DIV> Message Edited by Jay42 on 08-17-2005 08:41 AM <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>

Teksun

08-17-2005, 10:49 PM

I remember from 30 - 40 I would pull a MoB and it would be at half health by the time it closed, and mages never made it if they tries to heal. If they make it like that at upper levels, who needs kiting? <div></div>

Grycks

09-15-2005, 06:24 PM

Good news! We can use Back Shot while moving! WHOOPEE! Because I'm always facing opponents who conveniently chase me while running backwards...

EverMan

09-15-2005, 08:13 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Grycks wrote: Good news! We can use Back Shot while moving! WHOOPEE! Because I'm always facing opponents who conveniently chase me while running backwards... <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>It meant for groups and raids so u can make the transion from melee to range and not lose dps. I love the change they gave us, we got some more ca while moving. SOE doesn't want us to kite its that simple and i can;t blame them why is one class able to kill named and other classes can't.Message Edited by EverMania on 09-15-2005 11:15 AM

110euph

09-23-2005, 07:41 PM

And after live update 13....... No more kiting. =( Sony was upset by the whole idea of kiting... have been for several years now... and they've been working on ways to get rid of it. I remember that they promised no one could kite in EQ2, and I was thrilled when I found out that Rangers could. We can no longer cast our most effective ranged CAs while running. Not even Leg Shot. =( And, since mobs hit harder, I've been unable to solo even white cons with any real effectiveness, which means that Rangers are now as group dependent as enchanters used to be. we ROCK in groups... wonderful DPS....but soloing is a very bad idea. /sigh Qwert Unrest server <div></div>

Cron

09-25-2005, 11:36 PM

I would recommend you browse the many threads talking about this right now in this forum. We have had many wonderful people give tips and clues on what it takes now to solo. There are plenty of us soloing and having a lot of fun doing so. The update made us change our tactics, but I'm using my arrows more than I ever did.... solo... Having even a bigger blast than I ever have in groups too. Group mates love seeing me poor on the arrows when it gets tough. <div></div>