Errrr .. Kitting? huh

[z3oslo]

<DIV>I see this word every so often, usually combined with words like solo and heroic encounter.</DIV> <DIV>BUT .. as a 30 ranger i have no idea what kitting means, or how to perform this in action.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Would someone be gentle enough to explain?</DIV> <DIV>As plain as possible too, i already scratches my head over the 30 or so spells i have, and how to use them all <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[ubercheer]

<DIV>The term "kiting" was born back in the day of EQ Live.  It involves rooting (immobilizing), snaring or using some sort of debuff that lowers the mobs movement speed, then using things like spirit of wolf, or for rangers, the self 5% movement buff and pathfinding.  You then run around in circles using whatever ranged attacks you can use while moving, effectively doing high damage to the mob but not to yourself.  Its quite a concept.  Be sure not to run into other mobs though =P.</DIV>

[z3oslo]

<DIV>Hm.</DIV> <DIV>I guess i have to get off my high (beatiful white) horse, and start running in harmonic circles</DIV> <DIV>So .. sniping shot decreases mob movement with 30% or so (right?)</DIV> <DIV>And i play with dolls (masculine guy i am) and if i activate one of them, it adds another 30%, they do stack dont they?</DIV> <DIV>Do i have to keep it snared or something? or will the debuff last to the end of the fight?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have to try this.</DIV> <DIV>My main is a conjuror, and quite familiar with the concept of running (for his dear life most of the time)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by z3oslo on <span class=date_text>04-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:23 AM</span>

[CloakV]

<span><blockquote><hr>z3oslo wrote:<div></div> <div>My main is a conjuror, and quite familiar with the concept of running (for his dear life most of the time)</div> <div> </div><p>Message Edited by z3oslo on <span class="date_text">04-07-2005</span> <span class="time_text">04:23 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote> Lol, me too, it's normaly accompanied by me swearing, something like, "F'n useless MoFo'n pet and its F'n POS hate generation. ! f'n spell and half of TS is chasing my stunted little gnome *$%#&! from here to tower 4..."</span><div></div>

[Bayler_x]

<DIV>I suppose the metaphore is that the mob is a kite, following behind you on a string.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A few things to note:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1. Use poison.  If you're kiting without using poison, you're a glutton for punishment.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2. Use a longbow.  They proc more than shortbows on our combat arts.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3. It's not necessary to keep the mobs snared; they'll still hit you less if you're moving than if you were standing still.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4. Triple Shot and Open Shot (or thier upgrades) are your bread and butter, since they can be used on the run.  Impale and Leaping Cut work too, if the mobs gets close enough.  And ranged autoattack helps, of course.  Of course, you can start the combat at a distance with nice stationary high-damage attacks.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>5. You can mix melee and kiting together.  For instance, you might start a fight with Sniping Shot, Wounding Arrow, Flaming Arrow, and Triple Shot, and then melee for a bit.  When the timer is up on Flaming Shot again, you can start running backward some more and fire it off.  (Why would you want to?  To make your poison proc.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>6. Be aware that if you lure a mob too far from its home territory, the encounter will be broken and the mob will become invulnerable and go home.</DIV>

[Jay]

<P><FONT size=2>Bayler makes all the key points, as usual. I'd add to the kiting > melee > kiting idea that it can help to finish melee with Impede and even Cheap Shot - that few seconds of stun will leave them standing still while you backpedal and put some space b/w you and your target. Using that technique, I back off a short distance, stop, then use one of my stationary bow attacks like Wounding Arrow before backpedaling again and using Triple Shot and Open Shot / Flaming Shot while on the run. </FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2>Just make sure you don't kite in a direct straight line, cuz you will break the encounter if you pull them too far. Run backwards in a long ellipse, or make several straight passes that double back on one another. It'll take a bit of practice, but you'll find that kiting can immensely increase your solo potential. Good luck. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT></P><p>Message Edited by Jay42 on <span class=date_text>04-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:57 PM</span>

[Sollum]

I've just received Flaming shot and thats got a 3 sec cast time. How can you use that with stun or Kiting? It must be far too long a timer to be of use. Also, the damge it does is not really that impressive compared to triple shot, etc. I was dissapointed when I received it.

[Bayler_x]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sollum wrote:<BR>I've just received Flaming shot and thats got a 3 sec cast time. How can you use that with stun or Kiting? It must be far too long a timer to be of use. Also, the damge it does is not really that impressive compared to triple shot, etc. I was dissapointed when I received it. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Both Flaming Shot and Triple Shot can be used on the run.  Just keep running backward while firing.</P> <P>You're right that it's not as impressive as Triple Shot - particularly in solo fights.  But it has some armor-ignoring properties, and Triple Shot stops as soon as one of the arrows misses.  So on tougher fights (group fights), Flaming Shot starts to look better.</P> <P>Either way, though, it's important to realize that even if the damage of the shot itself isn't very high, there's a good chance that it will proc your poison for a hefty amount of damage.</P>

[RangerCalis]

<P>Yeah, always pull them with your positional (sniping shot) CA at max range and fire off as many stationary CAs that you can before you need to start running away from it.  I don't run backwards though, I just run forward. To use wounding arrow, triple shot, and flaming shot you don't even need to be facing the mob while you're running around.  This allows you to keep a good distance from your mob and avoid running into stuff that'll add, though your archery auto attack won't activate.  But if it's a big deal, then just turn to face the mob for a brief second while still running in the same direction and get an arrow off if you need to.</P> <P>Anyhow, I run around in a big circle firing those off with my snares, cheapshot (if the mob hits me), and the few melee CAs and debuffers that can hit from an extended distance.  I rarely ever face the mob if I am kiting.  For those meaner mobs it may take a while, but it gets the job done...eventually. :p</P> <P>I only fully kite when the mob hits way too hard for me to handle (like a 10 seconds to death toe to toe fight).  On non named/below-even-con heroic fights I do a combo of both.</P><p>Message Edited by RangerCalis on <span class=date_text>04-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:37 AM</span>

[Bayler_x]

Whoa!  Good tips Calis!

[Kthaara]

<P>Haven't tried it, but I think that if you disable "Auto-face MOB when attacking" it will make it easier to kite, since your character will not always try to turn around while you are running. </P> <P>Kwent</P>

[Flust]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kthaara wrote:<BR> <P>Haven't tried it, but I think that if you disable "Auto-face MOB when attacking" it will make it easier to kite, since your character will not always try to turn around while you are running. </P> <P>Kwent</P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>This is true.. however if you don't face the mob yoru auto ranged attack will not work. which also leads to more mob hits if they get close enough.  Since, running withour backs to them disables Ripo and Parry.</P> <P>There are sometimes that its more important to watch where you are going.  For example, I don't back peddle as often when kiting in Lavastorm, due to how the mobs are layed out and the fact you touch lava, you die.  </P> <P>The whole kiting term comes from the fact it looks like you are running around flying a kite.  The mob is just chasing ya.  Root Rotting, is usually a mage thing, or EQ1 druids who could do both. </P>

[VisualFoundry]

<DIV>Hey all, I'm a 36 ranger and just recently (over the last two weeks) have begun to use kiting as a strategy for soloing. I agree with all posters that it seems that this is an almost mandatory technique, and I'm surprised I didn't start using it sooner. My question to all who read here is this; have any of you received complaints about your kiting? Recently a fellow guildie was confronted by a berserker in Zek who ranted for five minutes about how kiting was an exploit and he had reported my friend to CS. I haven't heard many complaints beyond that, in fact none in game, mostly just here on the boards occassionally. So what's the verdict on this? Is kiting an acceptable approach to soloing? If the answer is yes, what do you tell someone who sees things otherwise? Thanks all in advance for your replies.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hask, 36 Ranger 33 Weaponsmith</DIV> <DIV>Knights of the Alliance, Neriak server</DIV>

[Gareorn]

<DIV>Kiting is not an exploit.  Not my preference.  For me it's boring and I think I get better experience with the rinse and repeat method anyway.  But if you like kiting, ignore the whiners and go about your business.  The game is all about having fun.</DIV>

[Jay]

<P><FONT size=2>Kiting an exploit?? That's like saying rooting is one, or mezzing. Or backstabbing...it's just a tactic, right? One that IMO is vital to our ability to solo. LOL, what are we supposed to do, fire one arrow and then stand there while that Buick-sized insect thrashes you?? </FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2>No...we're given bows and snares and slows and stuns and speed boosts for a reason. If confronted by ignorance about this, calmly explain that two of our primary bow CA lines are useable while moving. If the gods didn't intend for rangers to kite, we wouldn't be given bow attacks that fired while running. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT></P>

[z3oslo]

<DIV>Woot!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What a difference.</DIV> <DIV>After some practice (and after making some minor mistakes, like autotarget guards and such) i can now solo heroic encounters 2 levels above me</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It takes time, and its not something i would do on a regular basic, but if im stucked, and cant get a team to help me, i will most certainly use this tactic.</DIV> <DIV>Hm .. maybe i should try a named as well.</DIV> <DIV>Just need to find a spot where i can run ... well forever <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Found that the first instance of D'morte was a good practice area.</DIV> <DIV>After killing all the solo mobs, i went for the guard captain, a lvl 34 heroic encounter (why did they place a heroic encounter in a solo instance anyway)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Worked like a charm.</DIV> <DIV>Then i went for all the different heroic encounters from the gravestones, they were all lvl 35 (im lvl 32 btw)</DIV> <DIV>I died once to a necromancer, couldnt lose the rats, and they hit cracy fast.</DIV> <DIV>But all in all, it went much smoother than i imagined.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Im now in Caverrot, seems like lvl 35 and up.</DIV> <DIV>Had no problem so far with the solo ones, even though they con orange to me.</DIV> <DIV>I can meele for quite a while. Gotta love PGT <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also found a master triple shot and master huntmans trap.</DIV> <DIV>Sniping shot, triple shot and flaming shot, add 2 high damage poisons and its dead on arrival <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV>Also, use impede ALOT. slows them down so much that i can run so much faster that i get behind them instead, so i can fire off one of the backshots (cant remember name atm)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My only problem so far is my arrow budget :/</DIV>

[Sirlutt]

have to say i started doing this last night in EL.. i can finally finnish my briar paw bag on my own.. lol.. take a bit.. but i find the 1.8% i get over 2 minutes of kiting > 0.2% i get in a 30 second fight. <div></div>

[Gareorn]

<DIV>Odd.  If I stay away from the greens, I get at least .5% a kill.  Maybe ya just picking the wrong mobs.  Anyway, kiting is important and all rangers should know how to do it and practice it.  I do it when I have nothing better to do.  I enjoy the group aspect of the game much more.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, when your healer runs out of mana, which is often, you can gain aggro and kite the mob around while the rest of the group beats on him from behind.  It's an old trick I learned playing an SK in EQ1.  Taking aggro from a bonafide tank in EQ2 is a little difficult, but it can be done.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Kthaara]

<P>It is funny that a Zerker would cry about kiting, since they were one of the only classes that could easily solo in the 20's and early 30's.  </P> <P> </P> <P>Kwent</P>

[Davilan]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kthaara wrote:<BR> <P>It is funny that a Zerker would cry about kiting, since they were one of the only classes that could easily solo in the 20's and early 30's. </P> <P> </P> <P>Kwent</P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>LOL I learned a long time ago people will cry about anything. I usually laugh those people out of the zone :smileywink:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ive been trying to test makeshift arrows and homemade various carbonite arrows, and Im not seeing much of a difference in damage. I seem to hit over 200 regardless of what arrows I use. Do arrows affect DMG % instead? Wondering if I should just keep summoning instead of wasting crafting supplies on arrows for now. I know arrows make more of a difference in the end game.</DIV>

[Jay]

<P><FONT size=2>I think the current understanding on arrow type in relation to damage is that the CA damage is about even across different types of arrows. Higher-quality arrows will cause more damage when using your ranged auto-attack, and arrows that do different types of damage will work better on named or raid mobs that are immune to a certain damage type. </FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2>Personally, I'm still using nothing but makeshift carbonite or Ripped feyiron at 33. I haven't purchased arrows in months. </FONT></P>

[Davilan]

Thanks Jay that makes sense, I will save some homemade for kiting cause thats the only time Im using ranged autofire :smileyhappy:

[Fedayki]

I basically consider myself an expert on Kiting, since I have perfected the techinque where I can kill lvl 50 Heroic encounters (I am 46) farely easily. A few tips: 1. Buy Iron and Tin arrows if you are going to be kitting a lot, since a high level Heroic (at least at 45+) will take about 70-100 arrows. The damage of the arrows is irrelevant, since most of the damage you will be lealing is related to the spells, triple fire and Sharp Shop to be precise. 2. Dont forget to use your poison!! it will make your kite about 20% shorter 3. If you can already weild a PGT, use it even if its blue or green to you...the power proc really helps, using the PGT in one hand + SSoY and an imbued cedar bow i've managed to kite lvl 50 Heroic encounters and finish them in less than 4 minutes with full power and full health. 4. Find an area where circling around is not hindered by rocks or trees...it really sucks when you are running backwards facing the MoB and you suthenly hit a tree...then the nice heroic encounter hits you for half your life and stuns you for 3 seconds. 5. Beware of certain procs, since they are AoE and will draw agro from bystanders. 6. Last, but not least, dont kite too much...killing yellow or orange heroic encounters and getting 10% xp every 7 kills is not something we should be doing too much...for it makes other classes cry. Hope it helps Fedaykinn, lvl 46 Ranger of Faydark and kitter extraidinaire. <div></div>

[Flust]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Fedaykinn wrote:<BR>I basically consider myself an expert on Kiting, since I have perfected the techinque where I can kill lvl 50 Heroic encounters (I am 46) farely easily.<BR><BR>A few tips:<BR><BR>1. Buy Iron and Tin arrows if you are going to be kitting a lot, since a high level Heroic (at least at 45+) will take about 70-100 arrows. The damage of the arrows is irrelevant, since most of the damage you will be lealing is related to the spells, triple fire and Sharp Shop to be precise.<BR><BR>2. Dont forget to use your poison!! it will make your kite about 20% shorter<BR><BR>3. If you can already weild a PGT, use it even if its blue or green to you...the power proc really helps, using the PGT in one hand + SSoY and an imbued cedar bow i've managed to kite lvl 50 Heroic encounters and finish them in less than 4 minutes with full power and full health.<BR><BR>4. Find an area where circling around is not hindered by rocks or trees...it really sucks when you are running backwards facing the MoB and you suthenly hit a tree...then the nice heroic encounter hits you for half your life and stuns you for 3 seconds.<BR><BR>5. Beware of certain procs, since they are AoE and will draw agro from bystanders.<BR><BR>6. Last, but not least, dont kite too much...killing yellow or orange heroic encounters and getting 10% xp every 7 kills is not something we should be doing too much...for it makes other classes cry.<BR><BR>Hope it helps<BR><BR>Fedaykinn, lvl 46 Ranger of Faydark and kitter extraidinaire.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>1. Makeshift Arrow is free.  3 makeshifts can get me through just about any yellow con kite, I'm 45.  They changed a few of our Bow CAs.  Crippling Arrow and Culling the Herd (although not that useful while kiting) now can be cast while running.  As well, Leg shot, altthough small dmg, also does cast while on the run. </P> <P>2. High DoT dmg poisons are perferable plus haveing posion debuff on also will help increase the dot dmg considerably.</P> <P>3. Also don't forget about Hex dolls.  They are good to cast while waiting on Triple and Sharp to refresh.  The Snare one with Leg Shot, will allow you to get off stationary shots like Hidden Fire and Trick Shot.   They do descent dmg, but more importantly they can trigger procs.</P> <P>4. I kite in tight spots with rocks and trees all the time.  Only difference is, on those areas I don't back peddle.  It does make the kite take longer, but it usually makes the difference.  If its an open area, ya, then back peddling is great to do.</P> <P>5. Yup.</P> <P>6. Kiting is still ineffcient.  Plus, you go through to many arrows to keep it up for long periods of time. Unless you are willing to buy arrows.  In the time it takes me to get 10% solo kiting, I can get atleast 15% in my normal grind group.  Its still slower exp.  Right now, its really only good for Named and Quest mobs.  As well, it is still risker than grouping.   </P>

[Draughi]

<P>Kiting is perhaps the best thing that we can do as rangers.  At 42, I SOLOED one of the monks needed for the FBSS quest.  Normally, a group of 46s needed to take it down.  Granted, it took me 8 minutes and about 250 arrows, but nevertheless...soloed 8% exp.  The carbonite arrows are the best thing that we have.  Free, adept gives you 30 of them.  Whenever running, summon arrows when you see it refresh. I have one 24 slot bag and one 20 slot bag filled with nothing but arrows.  For some advice..though tough to leave, lvl 36-41 soloed those levels in the Obelisk of lost souls killing nightbloods.  Upon zone in there is a wide open area with ZERO blockage.  When Kiting, and runnning backwards, pan out on your character and mouse pan so it is 90 degrees ..you should be looking at the side of your ranger from a distance...it gives the best angle to kite and turn and run backwards.  Spamming HO's works well as most of them are ranged.  Keep the bow firing, poisons applied, and keep spamming your running bow skills.  BTW casters are a pain, but often doable...if you notice the mob stop...run ful backwards and do not turn..you often get out of their spell range.  Also, the reason behind panning out and going off the side for a view...as soon as you see the screen panning in towards your toon, it's time to turn as you are approaching a wall or something...learned that easily.  </P> <P>Having a proccing bow and a PGT is a must, the PGT will proc with your bow and give you that added power you need to keep blasting skills...also, if the mob does catch you, the ward it produces will absorb some if not all of the damage.  The 100+dd of the bow and a SSoY, plus poisons will knock heroic mobs down in minutes.  I solo usually 2 levels above me.  I have yet to try anything else as I haven't found a good place to kite at.  It doesn't matter if they are a group of heroics, singles, solo's whatever.  They are easy.  Just scout around for an area that is clear of add mobs and obstructions...pull and kite away.  </P> <P>I was getting semi upset seeing my friends solo heroic encounters that were green and dying in seconds when I tried.  Now I taunt them when I solo heroics yellows and they are still on heroic greens.  </P> <P>EXP soloing heroics is much faster than most people think.  If you find the safe area a load of heroic mobs and have a bag full of arrows, you'll be suprised how fast you burn your vitality down to nothing and your levels increase.  </P> <P>Start practicing at low levels in oakmyst with bears at around lvl 10.</P>