What should our DPS be?

[D3CLI]

<DIV> <P><SPAN>I've read a lot of complaints about rangers here.  Some of these I agree with, some I don't, and others I just don't understand.  I would just like to say that I really enjoy playing my ranger overall though.  Now, to get to the point, one thing I hear a lot of complaints about is our dps in comparison to other classes.  I don't really know how to take this, because I have no sense of comparison really.  When I'm in a group and not suffering from crippling lag (due to my connection and not any problem with the game) I'm pretty happy with my dps and I've never really had any complaints from my guildmates.  In fact, they are occasionally quite impressed.  I'm a 31 ranger with what I think is decent gear for the most part.  A lot of my armor needs to be upgraded, but I don't think has a huge impact on my dps.  I dual wield a Poison Edged Stiletto and an Ebon Eye Short Sword, which both con orange to me.  My bow is Stormfire and up to this point I have pretty much only used the arrows you get from makeshift arrows.  I use poison and squeeze as many of my own HOs in during a fight as I am able while still giving other people a chance to use them as well.  Unfortunately, I don't use a parser, but a couple of my guildmates that I often group with do.  They will often post the results after every fight when they are using them.  From what I have seen based on their parsers, my average dps tends to be from 45-50 with an exceptional round being just under 70.  It seems from what I can recall that I usually have the high hit in the group and am usually the highest dps (sometimes by a significant amount).  I know there are a lot of things that can influence how this all turns out, ex: length of the fight, how many swindler's luck I get even when I flip it, etc.  I don't often group with other dps classes that are close enough to my level to make what I would consider to be a fair comparison.  I'm curious though how this stacks up to what others of you out there are doing though.  Could some people please share what their dps is?  Also, if any of you know what some of the other classes that are considered dps are doing at this level, could you please share that info?</SPAN><SPAN></SPAN></P></DIV>

[GoNom]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> D3CLINE wrote:<BR> <DIV> <P><SPAN> .  I'm a 31 ranger with what I think is decent gear for the most part.  </SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>This says most of it, the DPS problems, from what I have read are prevalent to 40+ Rangers.  The higher you get the more noticeable it seems to be.  That being said if your parsing in the 40-50 range, your not bad, but at your level I was frequently 60-80, with an exceptional round being in the the low 100's. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But, it has been quite a while since I've dusted off my parser, and the numbers can vary greatly based on the classes in your group.  For instance, if you have a Necro.Conj.  or Bard in your group, they throw damage procs on you that go off like poison, that can increase DPS some.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think I was using pretty much te same weps as you at your level, so you may want to adjust strategy, try openning with all your debuffs, and continuously throw them in when they refresh, they help out quite abit. Especially if you open with Shadow Lunge/Deft Lunge.  It can be the difference between openning for 285 and 485.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All in all I wouldn't focus too much on parsers right now, and what your DPS is/isn't.  Just be content that you enjoy your Ranger, and learn to maximize hinm/her with the skill set you currently have.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Good luck</DIV>

[Cex]

<DIV>Things are looking up...Your bow CA's now do better damage regardless of the arrows you have equiped. /small yay!</DIV>

[Sirlutt]

at 33.. i like my DPS .. expecially with the new CA's... i would like it if it scaled up to 50 like this.. i can quite easily steal agro from a tank who isnt being careful.. from the sound of it though the DPS tapers off post 40.. hopefully they fix that by the time i get there.. right now i am happy with my ranger.. they fixed the the cost of the DPS with arrows thing pretty much.. condolances to the 40+ though. <div></div>

[Imri]

<DIV>I think the biggest issue most rangers ave is not the group DPS, but the solo DPS. My wife plays and loves her ranger (especially once again now that stealth is fixed), but still has a hell of a time soloing anythign over white, where I play my templar and solo yellow effortlessly, and even manage +5 orange con mobs with little risk. The only risk is if I start trying to take on +6 orange conn. To me it shows that tall scouts aren't truly the 2nd highest DPS class unless grouped. Plus to know it gets tougher post 40, that worries me about her enjoying the character she loves. I know there is no way she is going to reroll, with the exception of when she dings 50/50 as she is a provisioner as well. I hope with the bugged skills getting fixed, their damage output gets looked at as it isn't anywhere close to an assassins.</DIV>

[Sirlutt]

<span><blockquote><hr>Imrill wrote:<div>I think the biggest issue most rangers ave is not the group DPS, but the solo DPS. My wife plays and loves her ranger (especially once again now that stealth is fixed), but still has a hell of a time soloing anythign over white, where I play my templar and solo yellow effortlessly, and even manage +5 orange con mobs with little risk. The only risk is if I start trying to take on +6 orange conn. To me it shows that tall scouts aren't truly the 2nd highest DPS class unless grouped. Plus to know it gets tougher post 40, that worries me about her enjoying the character she loves. I know there is no way she is going to reroll, with the exception of when she dings 50/50 as she is a provisioner as well. I hope with the bugged skills getting fixed, their damage output gets looked at as it isn't anywhere close to an assassins.</div><hr></blockquote>and thats because alot of our main DPS stuff is attacks that need to be stealthed for.. or from behind.. both are tougher to do in solo.. especially from behind.  We wont ever be able to effectively solo until its easier to execute some of our higher DPS attacks.. that and make our bow CA's not have a minimum range.</span><div></div>

[Flust]

<P>GoNomar give a good suggestion.  Useing your debuffs first will greatly help your dps, specially if you are using peirceing weapons.  We don't get a good slash debuff until Raven Embers which is mid 30s.  Also using player crafted poisons will help your dps.  They do more dmg and have a better resist rate.  Also, not sure what your CAs are at.  try and keep them all at App4 or Adept 1. </P> <P>At 41, I usually average around 115-125 dps, with streaks up to 160s.   </P>

[D3CLI]

<DIV>This sounds like some sound advice.  Thanks.  I almost always keep corner up, but find that I don't really use my other debuffs that often.  I'll have to take a look at my opening routine and see if I can find something that works better.  Most of the CAs that I use are Adept I, but I have a few App IVs that I'm always checking the broker for upgrades to.  I also didn't realize that player made poisons were better.  It's probably been a couple of months now since I looked anything up on poisons and at that time the general consenus seemed to be that they weren't worth bothering with.</DIV> <DIV>It's good to know that the dps problems are really at the higher levels.  I've been aware for some time now that the 40-50 range for rangers has some serious problems, but didn't realize that the dps issues were restricted to them as well.</DIV> <DIV>I've also come to the conclusion that our dps isn't that good soloing, but I refuse to give up hope yet.  I think that I am capable of putting out decent dps while solo, but simply need to learn to solo better.  It seems to me with the right strategy and gear we should be able to do pretty good.  I've read a couple posts about using bow CAs to maximum effect while soloing and I really think this is where our solo DPS is going to come from.  Don't get me wrong.  I don't think that we'll ever be as good as we are in groups, but I do think it is possible that we can be quite capable solores.  I just need to practice soloing more I guess.  If I could just get my hands on a severed fir, I'll have a PGT soon and I'm sure that'll help out a lot as well.</DIV> <DIV>As I mentioned in my first post, I have a great time playing my ranger.  To me, they are a very challenging class to play well and it is that challenge that makes it enjoyable.  This may be true for all the classes though, I haven't really taken the time to find out.</DIV>

[Polybi]

<P>Hello all.</P> <P>I'm a 43 Necro and frequently group with a Ranger who is 44.  I constantly run CombatStats (a dps parser) while we play mainly for myself.</P> <P>I have noticed our Ranger having awfully low numbers.</P> <P>For example - although I typically will be doing 100-150+ depending on the encounter - he's usually doing only 40-50 with some spurts into the 60s - many times he's doing less than our tank - the Gaurdian.  After seeing what Fluster posted I was thinking that maybe we (our guild) could give him some tips on how to increase his dps.  Maybe he's just not using the right combination of specials?</P> <P>I know nothing about the Ranger class.  Depending on the encounterI have a typical spell casting order I use for groups or single ^^ and it's rinse and repeat this combination each fight.</P> <P>So might you all suggest the order in which you cast your specials - what they are called - etc... so that we might be able to offer some constructive advice on increasing his DPS?</P> <P>Thanks</P> <P>[Edit: He's actually level 44 right now]</P> <p>Message Edited by Polybius on <span class=date_text>04-02-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:19 AM</span>

[hieronym]

<DIV>in reply to poly make sure he is using poisons first off. I always go for a low up front and a high DOT poison. Also no idea on his gear but the usual things of white or better gear and app4 or better for the spells. I use PGT which gives great power regen so I can go through the specials and still keep up the power. Also ssoy and sbd at lvl 42, i guess he has the same. Also i use a pristine cedar long bow as they are more powerful than the short bows</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In a group i normally do the following which seems to work for me</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>obviously fully buffed start with entrap followed by pick off then raven embers. Move back for crippling arrow then all the bow shots i have, move in and do crippling blade then spam the medium damage like deadly reminder and survival of the fittest until the first lot are up then rince and repeat. I have found that if pick off is missing from my buffs window then you do a lot less damage with crippling blade against the higer lvl mobs so before i ever do crippling blade I make sure pick off is up and 99 percent of the time even on mobs 7 lvls higher than me i hit them for 400 - 500 plus.</DIV>

[Flust]

<P>Heres my normal group routine on a ^^ mob, it does help if the mob is white or better, blues tend to die to fast in my trio group.</P> <P>First off, I use Withered Spirits for poison.. Its a low DD, high DoT player crafted poison.   Its gives me 133 per tic.  Unless, I have a chanter with me, I always use Blade Flurry.  I always have Veil of the Forest, and as timer allows me Steady Aim up.  Average lvl of my CAs are adept 1, I do have Adept 3 Raven Embers, Aadpt 3 Lightening Strike, and Master 1 Triple Shot.  My weapons atm are SBD main hand, PGT offhand.  </P> <P>Crippling Arrow</P> <P>Survival of the Fittest</P> <P>Pouncing Strike ->Raven Embers</P> <P>Pick Off</P> <P>Deadly Reminder</P> <P>Rip</P> <P>Lightening Strike</P> <P>Pouncing Attack -> Raven Embers</P> <P>Surviel -> the lvl 30 adpet 2 backstab, I forget the name.</P> <P>Survival of the Fittest (sometimes depending on lag, I can get SotF off before Surviel to backstab)</P> <P>Back up</P> <P>Sniping Shot</P> <P>Triple Shot</P> <P>Depending on Mobs Hp, If less than 10%</P> <P>Miracle Shot</P> <P>Trick Arrow</P> <P>If greater than 10%</P> <P>Pouncing Attack -> Raven Embers</P> <P>Lightening Strike</P> <P>Deadly Reminder</P> <P>Rip</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>