Upgrading to adept III

[loramil]

<DIV>I managed to loot 2 corals in the past few days (and thankfully, i'm a scholar so i can make the ink & runes myself) so i'm trying to decide what abilities to upgrade to adept III. I have all the advanced scrolls through 19 scribed so i''m not really limited on what i can make.  I'm just trying to decide on what makes the most sense. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wounding Arrow is a level 19 scribe, so it should LAST the longest as a usefull ability, but i dont use that as much as other abilities. Backshot as it's yellow to me at 21 and since i pull solo with Backshot - wounding arrow - Open Shot, it would seem to make sence to upgrade the opener. The other two things i've been considering are Impale and/or Pierce. (Yellow and Orange respectively). I'm leaning towards impale since it has a faster re-use.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anyone have any thoughts on this?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Loramil</DIV> <DIV>21st Ranger/19th Scholar</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[ume]

<DIV>I too have been trying to decide and at 23 I have had corals and silvers and palladiums sitting in my bank for over a month.  I don't want to upgrade a spell that I get a "natural" replacement for but I have not taken the time to disect the CA List to see if there are any we don't get upgrades for.  If anyone can compile a list of our abilities that DO NOT get natural upgrades that would be great.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>However, I might just sell them or get some upgrades for my alts.  11 necro and 11 chantie.</DIV>

[-vali]

i play as a 25 ranger, and group-wise, your debuffs are most usefull.. for example, in groups, i: corner->impale->bleed->wounding arrow->drop bombsits also intensely useful to have a adept3 or master hunt as wellso i recommend going adept3 with your debuffs, then with your super attacks... dont bother with shadowblade, you get a replacement for that soon.

[Aza]

i would perhaps go qith hunt> impale> backshot in that order.... hunt and backshot dont get an replacement till 30ish (hunt>huntsman trap at 31 backshot>sniping shot at 29). Hunt is your stealth (allways good to have as high as possible) while backshot is one of your big hits... impale is nice damage with a piercing debuff and apparently source to most of our dps according to some parsed logs.

[Bayler_x]

For what it's worth, I can't find a recipe for Hunt Adept3. I believe I have all of the scholar books, but there seem to be holes. Has anyone else found it?

[Neec]

<DIV>To be honest DONT waste the coral yet.. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Shadowblade --- > Shadowlunge</DIV> <DIV> <DIV>Open Shot ---- > Flame Shot</DIV> <DIV>Ensnare ----- > Impede</DIV> <DIV>Stalk ---- > Shadow</DIV> <DIV>Bleed --- > Leaping Cut </DIV> <DIV>Dirty Tricks ---- > Corner</DIV> <DIV>Hunters Instinct --- > Foresters Insight</DIV> <DIV>Reconoiter --- > Natural Instinct</DIV> <DIV>Impail ----->  Lightning Strike or Lunging Thrust (cant remember)</DIV> <DIV>Pierce ---- > lunging thrust or lightning Strike (Cant remember)</DIV> <DIV>Back Shot ----> Sniping Shot</DIV> <DIV>Hunt ---> Huntsman trap</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>im level 32 i would upgrade one of the above NEW skills probably Shadow Lunge, Lightning Strike, Snipe Shot etc.. then you have something your not going to replace with app1 when you level anytime soon..</DIV></DIV><p>Message Edited by Neecha on <span class=date_text>12-15-2004</span> <span class=time_text>03:35 PM</span>

[Aza]

thing is you CANT upgrade 20+ skills with coral coral is only for skills lvl 10-19... so no sniping shot upgrade with a coral, you would need paladium or jasper for that

[duc7]

<DIV>Ahh thanks Azaar for clearing that up, was about to post that very question as i understood it to be:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Tier 1 rares only good for 1-9 arts</DIV> <DIV>Tier 2 rares only good for 10-19 arts </DIV> <DIV>Tier 3 rares only good for 20-29 arts and so on</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>thanks</DIV><p>Message Edited by duc748 on <span class=date_text>12-15-2004</span> <span class=time_text>08:13 AM</span>

[Kafnaz]

<DIV>Before investing the time and money an upgrading to Adept 3 you should very carefully study 2 things:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1. Timing of an updated ability</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <DIV>Too many times I've heard people in my guild complain that they've just spent 10+ gold to upgrade to Adept 3 only to have the ability they upgraded replaced by a new one 2 levels later that has about the same effectiveness at Apprentice levels. Ask a higher level character, or hit a web board for an ability inventory by level. That will help you get the maximum bang for your buck over time.</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>2. Cost vs. realized improvement</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <DIV>Honestly, I don't see the need to upgrade any pre-30 ability to Adept 3, as the full efficacy of your major nukes is not realized until you have all of your buffs and procs, which happens around level 28. At 34, I currently have Adept 3's of Sniping Shot, Natural Instinct and Shadow Lunge. This allows both abilities to hit for 600+, as apposed to 400-425 with Adept 1 and 250-325 with Apprentice 3. Most of my other abilities are at Adept 1, which is fine for what they do, i.e. defense debuff, parry debuff, movement speed/agi buff... things where a few more points don't make an incredible difference in fight outcomes or on total DPS over time.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Adept 3's are nice to have but are by no means a requirement, and if you are in pursuit of class maximization, no substitute for Master scrolls. I would be more inclined to watch the market carefully every day for Master scrolls for my class than to spend too much time out there harvesting or too much money on materials for upgrading every skill to Adept 3. For the skills you find yourself using at least once per fight while grouped or those that can determine the outcome of a solo battle, it might be worth the investment.</DIV>

[loramil]

<DIV><FONT color=#ffffff>I want to thank everyong for their advice....still haven't made up my mind though . :smileyvery-happy:</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kafnazzo....you may be correct about there not being a NEED to upgrade to adept 3 abilities, but there are 2 overriding factors in this case. 1, all of my abilities are still App3...nothing higher than that.  and 2, more importantly, other than 15 minutes or so to make the ink and do combines, it will probably  cost me than a silver for fuel and liqued costs (all ready have a stack of Iron Spikes in the bank as a scholar), so there's no reason NOT to upgrade.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This isn't a question of 'man...i just GOTTA upgrade this stuff'.  This is, i CAN upgrade stuff and it will cost me practically nothing. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Lormail</DIV>

[Aza]

as i said i would go with hunt and backshot as they will serve you till the late 20s perhaps impale as that is a nice high dmg/debuff attack (dont know when it gets replaced by an ability on the same timer)

[Pil]

<DIV>I don't mean to be the naked capitalist here, but you might realize a larger benefit by selling the corals, and spending the proceeds on improved weapons and armor, if you are past your AQ armor.  From a raw combat performance standpoing, the increased stats or damage might be the most bang for the buck.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There are lots of considerations about what to do with Rares.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Good luck with the decisions.</DIV>

[JaxxVa]

<DIV>putting the value of rares aside for a minute...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>why not upgrade everything? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am just lvl 20, but I still hit every combat art i can during combat, despite the fact that it has a "replacement" that devalues it.  The cost in battle is so small for quick strike why wouldn't I use it?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I usually solo and when I do group i still like to use all CAs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Soloing I try to do this...</DIV> <DIV>1) Pull with Backshot</DIV> <DIV>2) kite with Open Shot.</DIV> <DIV>3) Start HO with Lucky Break</DIV> <DIV>4) Dirty Tricks (continues HO)</DIV> <DIV>5) Bleed (completes HO, good DOT for early in fight)</DIV> <DIV>6) Spam thru</DIV> <DIV>7) Quickshot (I use it here to ensure its ready for next HO)</DIV> <DIV><img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Pierce</DIV> <DIV>9) Impale</DIV> <DIV>10) Cheap Shot</DIV> <DIV>11) Combat Off (jump mob)</DIV> <DIV>12) Sneak Attack</DIV> <DIV>13) New HO with Lucky Break</DIV> <DIV>14) Evade (does making the hate lower give any benefit while soloing?)</DIV> <DIV>15) Quickshot (completes 2nd HO)</DIV> <DIV>then kinda improvisng and repeating above</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[-vali]

<blockquote><hr>JaxxVain wrote:<DIV>putting the value of rares aside for a minute...</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>why not upgrade everything? </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>I am just lvl 20, but I still hit every combat art i can during combat, despite the fact that it has a "replacement" that devalues it. The cost in battle is so small for quick strike why wouldn't I use it?</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>I usually solo and when I do group i still like to use all CAs.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Soloing I try to do this...</DIV><DIV>1) Pull with Backshot</DIV><DIV>2) kite with Open Shot.</DIV><DIV>3) Start HO with Lucky Break</DIV><DIV>4) Dirty Tricks (continues HO)</DIV><DIV>5) Bleed (completes HO, good DOT for early in fight)</DIV><DIV>6) Spam thru</DIV><DIV>7) Quickshot (I use it here to ensure its ready for next HO)</DIV><DIV><img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Pierce</DIV><DIV>9) Impale</DIV><DIV>10) Cheap Shot</DIV><DIV>11) Combat Off (jump mob)</DIV><DIV>12) Sneak Attack</DIV><DIV>13) New HO with Lucky Break</DIV><DIV>14) Evade (does making the hate lower give any benefit while soloing?)</DIV><DIV>15) Quickshot (completes 2nd HO)</DIV><DIV>then kinda improvisng and repeating above</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><hr></blockquote>First ill answer this post, then give suggestion on adept3...First off, why are you using impale after pierce? Get the debuffs in first, they make your other skills more effective <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Second, instead of cheapshot-sneak attack, consider cheapshot-stalk-shadowblade/lunge.... Can use your nuke attack instead of outdated sneak attack. (which is good, but there's better options in this situation)I totally agree with you about the replacement skills. If I can still use the original skill after the replacement (ie. it doesnt reset both timers), I use them both. More skills = more damage, even if its a little. And no, hate doesnt matter in solo combat. Hate is how the monster decides what to attack. In a group, the person with the most hate is the person getting attacked. Taunts increase hate, evades do the reverse. Stalk operates like a evade as well. So if you're solo, the only time you want to use evade is when you're trying to get the monster to attack your hawk (wink)---------As far as what skill to replace - replace shrouded strike. I've parsed my logs and notice one of my biggest damage dealing moves is shrouded strike, and there is no replacement for it for a while. I'm level 27 and still using it, and probably will be using it for a couple levels to come.In fact, i'm looking for a coral so i can take it from app3 to adept3 as we speak... <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />