Dieing Breed

[Toonmaster]

<DIV>Having played a Troub class in EQ and EQ2 for about 7 years - and with a 70 Troub now - here are my observations.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>First:</DIV> <DIV>There are not many Troubadors - many guilds have only only one.</DIV> <DIV>Second:</DIV> <DIV>Class defining has been speed - and a kind of jack-of-all-trades  the Swiss army knife of classes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Slowly the class is moving to an auto-follow-stat-battery.  Soon it will take not tallent at all to actually play one.  Twisting did take tallent (I don't miss it but I did like it's unique flavor.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What we brought to the party:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Stats</DIV> <DIV>Protection from some damage</DIV> <DIV>Run Speed</DIV> <DIV>Limited Tanking (prior to the last two expansions - there was a way to buff to gain agro)</DIV> <DIV>Charm (which has always been a toy imo)</DIV> <DIV>Mez - a major class distinction</DIV> <DIV>Moderate measurable damage</DIV> <DIV>and i guess powe draining however - I have drained a mob of ALL power and they still cast - I have never noticed a difference.  Also mobs have so much power they are not likely to ever be effected by Troub power drain.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>One by one each is going away.</DIV> <DIV>Run speed has only traveling benifit - mobs keep up once fighting</DIV> <DIV>Damage protection using protection songs make very little difference as far as ACTUAL resisting - stats go up but not frequency of resisting mobs casting hits</DIV> <DIV>Charm is a solo toy at best</DIV> <DIV>Any tanking is long gone</DIV> <DIV>and now Mez will be rendered useless</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Why I think Mezzing should be left alone:  Enchanters can mez a group of mobs at once.  Troub can only deal with one at a time - leaving the rest of the group to attack.  With the 10 sec recast - if you can target a sec mob - and get people to stop breaking mez with dots - you MIGHT get the second one mezed in 20 to 25 sec - more likely 30.  A third mob will take at least 10 more sec pluss casting time - so your 40 sec into the fight befor you have 3 mobs mezed or more.  In that time a chanter has them all mezed.   I DONT want to be a chanter but want to provide that death saving option on bad pulls etc.  Some might say that in theory being able to mez 4 mobs is unfair.  First - other classes do it - second - it takes close to a full minute to actually DO that.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I see that in the last post - the message was adjusted to just be more fuzzy.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I can not see what problem your trying to solve SoE - but you are distroying my interest in the class.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>(Tip: You might want to keep track of class in-game play time over the next few months.  if your goal was to have less Troub's on line - you just might succeed.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Cragger]

<div align="left">With the current mezz I can and often do lock down three of the four Stewards of the Seal in the Blackscale Sepulcher ring event. Perhaps this is more control then I should be allowed, though I'm doing nothing else but chain casting lullaby during this time. However, a wizard can do just as well in this role with their root. Keeping three of them rooted at once, so while the role of the enchanter COULD be filled, doing so sacrifices alot in recasts and we are by no means the only class that could do it.</div><div></div>

[Devira]

<P>i am, like the rest of the troub community, stunned and horrified that the devs even considered these changes to mez and charm, let alone that they will most likely make it through to live.</P> <P>i agree with your post Toonmaster, but our playstyles must be a bit different cuz charm is definitely not a toy for me. i can't count the number of times it's allowed me to win a solo battle that otherwise would have made mince-meat of me. if i take out a heroic group of three, i can pull with charm, mez another and then just fight one at a time, with the charmed pet helping kill his mates. used carefully charm almost never breaks, it's essential to the way i play.</P> <P>and as for taking on anything harder than a blue^^ i have to mez, then charm mid fight to recover health and reset my cast timers.</P> <P>Take these away and i'm left with no tactics to take on anything other than an even con (and probably barely surviving even that!)</P> <P>Devira, lvl 62 Troub</P>

[Jooneau]

<blockquote><hr>Toonmaster wrote:<DIV>Charm (which has always been a toy imo)</DIV><hr></blockquote>Umm, charm is not only not a toy, but it's a vital part of many troubadors' repertoire of abilities.

[spirit]

<P>By changed mez times will affect the troub's solo ability badly, i can solo a blue con 2 levels lower, without this ability i feel the class won't be worth leveling.</P> <P>Sit around with LFG on and searching for a group takes upto an hour and a half at present, at least for no i can solo some low level's whislt i  wait or do some solo quests. this to me was 1 of the tools that helped the troub be effective in killing, charm breaks to randomly to be of any use.</P> <P>if i pulled 2 linked mobs me being 60 and the mobs being 58, i could kill 1 and finish just as mez woud break on the second.</P> <P> </P>

[Myk]

<DIV>After hearing more about the LU changes, it sounds like the devs wanted to limit the amount of time mobs can be stunned and stifled.  People were keeping mobs almost permanenly stunned and stifled which made encounters trivial.  With the mob stunned or stifled, the mob is doing no or very little damage while the group is killing the mob quickly.  I understand the devs making this change.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The second reason for the LU changes was to make chanters more useful in certain situations, especially in raids.  I understand this change.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What I do not understand, however, is why troubs had their CC spells changed.  In regard to stuns/stifles, mezzing works much differently in that one can't damage the mob and keep it mezzed.  Being able to mez mobs was not making encounters trivial.  In regard to chanters, our mez is waaaay less powerful than the chanter mez. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Reduce our cheap shot.  Fine.  Reduce our stifling bow shot.  Fine.  But why change charm and mez?!!!  Can a Dev please explain this to us?  Please?</DIV><p>Message Edited by Mykin on <span class=date_text>05-23-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:02 PM</span>

[Snublefot]

<DIV>Not the solo ability, but the solo <STRONG>suviveability </STRONG>badly. We can forget about getting the extra dps from a charmed mob. Thats going to be a huge hit for a few Troubs (I never trusted the charmed mobs enough to use it this way). </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Solo something "harder then average" will still be pull-debuff-burst-mez-burst-mez-burst-repeat. The burst will be longer, so over the fight it will be lower dps vs damage taken. There is no longer the option of charming to regain power and health. And a resisted Mez can be complete disaster. That will be effectively 45 seconds of taking damage, with less then optimal dps.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And getting adds while soloing will be very bad after lu24.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There is still no word on the issue apart from general comments toward the general cc changes. And they all indicate the changes will be pushed on us no matter what cost it has to the fun of our loved class.<BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> spiritse wrote:<BR> <P>By changed mez times will affect the troub's solo ability badly, i can solo a blue con 2 levels lower, without this ability i feel the class won't be worth leveling.</P> <P>Sit around with LFG on and searching for a group takes upto an hour and a half at present, at least for no i can solo some low level's whislt i  wait or do some solo quests. this to me was 1 of the tools that helped the troub be effective in killing, charm breaks to randomly to be of any use.</P> <P>if i pulled 2 linked mobs me being 60 and the mobs being 58, i could kill 1 and finish just as mez woud break on the second.</P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV><BR></DIV><p>Message Edited by Snublefot on <span class=date_text>05-23-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:46 PM</span>

[Godzmodi]

dehate/manaregen/proc is our major things plus we do decent dmg. i parse in the top 10 alot <div></div>

[Raveller]

I decided to reroll my troub as a dirge.<div></div>