How Do You Troubadours Get Such High DPS?

[Cygnu]

<DIV>I have read a few posts over the past few weeks where high level troubadours suggest they are managing to ouput a DPS value of around 700 and I am sure someone mentioned a value of over 1000.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What I would like to know is how are troubadours getting this sort of DPS, and are they still achieving this since the proc changes went live?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would not consider myself uber, but I do have all my spells/CAs at adept III and some at Master level. I have quite a few Fabled T7 items and almost fully equiped with Nightcord or Relic armour, apart from a few pieces of Melodic crafted armour.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When raiding in an average group setup (a few casters, a few melee and a healer) with a single target to beat down on, I seem to pull off DPS of around 450. If the encounter contains a few targets that are being off-tanked away from each other my DPS can drop to around 300.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now compared to the 700 etc being quoted this seems a little dissapointing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dont think I am doing anything wrong but maybe someone will suggest otherwise:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- I cast my bow attacks as the mob is incoming (the threat reducing AA line bow attack and the stifle bow attack)</DIV> <DIV>- Followed by DOTs and Debuffs</DIV> <DIV>- Then cast Jesters Cap on myself and run into melee range</DIV> <DIV>- Debuf the targets mental resist</DIV> <DIV>- Start with PoM</DIV> <DIV>- Followed by spamming all the spells I have, then the melle attacks (including bump from the AA line and any master strikes)</DIV> <DIV>- then just generally try to keep all debufs on the target while spamming spells and CA's</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My INT and STR are usually maxed at 510 or over.</DIV> <DIV>I have completed the WIS AA line to get DKTM.</DIV> <DIV>I have the STR AA line for 5 points just to get the AOE imunity CA</DIV> <DIV>I am currently working on the AGL line to get the poison attack (spent 11 points on line so far so almost there)</DIV> <DIV>I very rarely run out of power.</DIV> <DIV>For my dual wield weapons I am using 2 legendary daggers both with a DR above 50.</DIV> <DIV>As we are talking about raiding here I am always positioned behind the mob.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So can anyone suggest how to increase my DPS here?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Does having all Master level spells really make that much difference?</DIV> <DIV>Are there better AA lines to take than those I have stated above?</DIV> <DIV>Are the high DPS values being quoted from people that were in the "perfect" troubaour group at the time?</DIV> <DIV>Any better gear out there for increasing our DPS?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Any input greatly appreciated and hopefully this thread can be usefull for other level 70 Troubadours trying to squeeze every last little bit of DPS out of the class :smileyhappy:</DIV><p>Message Edited by CygnusX on <span class=date_text>05-10-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:43 AM</span>

[Pik'ee]

Personally the only times I've seen my dps that high is on the huge groups in PP:R - PoM and group debuffs. If any fight lasts longer than those your dps is going to go down.So I would say that we can do that sort of dps, but only very occasionally and very situationally. I am probably wrong, being blonde and all....and I'm certainly no uber troub <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Sanju]

<div><blockquote><hr>CygnusX wrote:<div></div><div>So can anyone suggest how to increase my DPS here?</div> <div> </div> <div>Does having all Master level spells really make that much difference?</div> <div>Are there better AA lines to take than those I have stated above?</div> <div>Are the high DPS values being quoted from people that were in the "perfect" troubaour group at the time?</div> <div>Any better gear out there for increasing our DPS?</div> <div> </div><hr></blockquote>Yes, Master spells do make a difference.Yes, I'm sure there are better AA lines to take if you want to increase your personal DPS.I don't think I'm ever in the "perfect" DPS group, as my Conjurer rarely (read: almost never) procs me.Yes, there's always better gear. (Your weapons are especially bad.)I don't claim to be the highest DPS Troub in the world, but I hold my own (600-800 on single target, and yes I can hit over 1K on groups of 3+ mobs (and I'm not talking about the "huge groups" in PP:R, HoF, etc.)). Sorry, no avanced strats. You can look at my gear on eq2players if you like, but I do switch things out semi-often.PS: The only time I EVER cast Jester's on myself is for Evac or Call.</div>

[Dove Falconha]

<div></div>Heya... About the DPS claims... TRUE. <font color="#ccff33"> </font><font color="#ccff33">I've belonged to the top guild in Lavastorm and parsed their troubador printing detailed reports after each raid, checking how many spells he can squeeze in each encounter comparing to the number of spells I can trigger. Running average damage chart comparisons and just plain staring at him during battle to learn the ropes. He was my obi-wan.</font><font color="#ccff33"> </font><font color="#ccff33"> </font><font color="#ccff33">Now I am applying to the top guild in Nektulos (one of the top worldwide). The reports I printed from their troubador made my jaw drop to the floor. He hits around 650-800 DPS in Halls of Seeing and broke the 1.2k DPS barrier on some encounters. These are not BURST encounters, mind you. I'm talking a minute-two minute battles.</font><font color="#ccff33"> </font><font color="#ccff33"> </font><font color="#ccff33">We troubadors are a rare breed and normally I would not spill the beams but I will point you in the right direction. First of all, NEVER cap yourself in a raid setting just to increase your DPS. Hit one of the healers on calls, the summoner on calls and place it on the wizard during rest periods. Capping yourself is just plain silly... and selfish. Time to compare notes... in my humble opinion here is what a professional Troubador should do:</font> <font color="#ffffff">Open with mental resist debuffer then Kians (which will also trigger auto attack) then PoM. When you cast Precision of the Maestro, string ALL your debuffs and AoEs - by stringing I mean you cast, cancel and recast all of them in cycle (there is a correct order to max PoM + Aria triggers but Ill let you figure it out). As PoM wears out, make sure all green debuffs stuck to the mob.</font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff">Also keep the mental debuff ON at all times. </font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff">Once you land all your debuffs and PoM is cooling down, songshift from Aria to another buff (group Haste, if it is not on). Keeping Aria UP 20 seconds within battle is a waste, since most grp debuffs were already cast the proc chances are greatly reduced.</font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff">Defense debuff - followed by - Bump+midnight tempo and dancing Blade</font><font color="#ffffff"> </font><font color="#ffffff">Mental debuff - followed by -  ALL mental attacks except Thunderous Drumming, which I save to close HOs.</font> <font color="#ffffff">Save the second round of PoM to  land after DISPATCH is called midbattle if it is a long fight.</font> Spam HOs in your routine to keep melee bonuses up. Have the mage spam HOs too and if your settings allow, watch his hands to SIMULCAST elude, lore or guviena to instantly shift it into a group HO. Have a dedicated window display HOs and watch for: Bravo's Dance and Shower of Daggers: STOP everything and macrotell the ranger/swashie in your group the line "Rare is up!" If he sees Bravo's UP, he will complete to gain around +40% haste +40% DPS for 6 minutes. I havent seen Shower of Daggers in ages but if it is up, the macro tell warns the other scout(s) in grooup NOT to flip it. On good days I can flip to Bravo once an hour, on real bad days, at least once a raid. There are tricks here and there you can pull but dont focus on DPS alone. Parsers dont really tell the tale. If you like to crunch numbers, add the lines PRECISE NOTE and DISSONANT NOTE from everybody in your grp, add to your total damage and divide but encounter duration... then use advanced mathmatics to figure out that you also contribute by: Reducing casting timers by 6.7%, add 7.5% chance to every crit and are SHAVING PRECIOUS time from Decapitate, Fusion, uberheals... This is just the second time I post here. I've always hated people complaining about nerfs... Troubadors are still VERY important in every raid setting. We get a bad rep because there are not many of us... ... and even fewer REALLY have knowledge of their classes. Most raid officers tell troubs their ONLY role is to  keep mana regen and deaggro up, so I can see why so many just sit pretty and do nothing to really figure out a way to maximize their contribution to the raid as a whole. Shame on you!! If you read this far and said to yourself, "so much work! I won't do it!!"... ... do us all a favor and alt a DIRGE. Stop making Troubadors look bad by being lazy. PS. Masters DO make a difference. INT cap is a MUST if you aim to max DPS output. You wont average 650 DPS unless you have fabled duals running with procs at 23% item haste (+song haste) but if you print reports, focus on maximizing the number of times you cast Perfect Shrill and Dancing Blade per minute. Also pay close attention to the "HITS" registered by Precise Note. The high DPS mentioned is not a pipe dream. My new mentor hit 624.31 DPS on the Shade of Ghazi. I will score high too once I gear up... if accepted by Dissolution, that is. <span>:smileyhappy:</span> <p>Message Edited by Dove Falconhand on <span class=date_text>05-10-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:02 AM</span>

[Mawie]

DPS wise... I am usually at the low end of most groups and raids, which always surprises people seeing as I am a scout. <div></div>

[Trabbart]

<P>Dove,</P> <P>Thanks for the great info. Most of what you mentioned i was actually doing but not as disciplined. I can definitely use this tune up guide for my raiding.</P> <P>Your dps and strategies however are very focused on raiding troubs (that have GREAT gear). Which is fine. But for solo, casual and group troubs this can be seen as a confirmation that our dps/class design is only being based around other classes and raiding. Troubadors should not just be designed around all the other classes and for specific raid setups. </P> <P> </P> <P>SOE seems to have no clue what to do with the BARD classes in general and the troubador class specifically</P> <P>What bugs me, is that almost every other class out there brings the same or better utility to groups (And raids). Yet  we were the ones giving up dps solo BECAUSE we were adding such great group buffs and utility. Most of our buffs are useless because of caps and everyone else providing better. Not to mention the resist specific potions and items(bye bye resist songs), the evac potions, the sow potions, the invis potions, etc.  Our unique selling point has gone.</P> <P>Maybe it is an idea to have some solo buffs (conc slot) that will compete with group buffs so we can actually become a more independant and fun class solo and (small) group wise. Or add much more diverse and USEFULL group utility to us. </P> <P>But SOE seems to only sculpt stone instead of clay so its wasted bits of info.</P> <P> </P> <P>Ikikik 70, troub, Splitpaw</P> <P>Message Edited by Trabbart on <SPAN class=date_text>05-10-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>07:09 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Trabbart on <span class=date_text>05-10-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:10 AM</span>

[vinterskugge]

<DIV> <DIV>My INT and STR are always capped.</DIV> <DIV>I have completed the WIS AA line to get DKTM and the STR line to get Bladedance.</DIV> <DIV>I always run out of power (potions, manastone, vessel, heart and shards are your friend, as well as good drink).</DIV> <DIV>I use two fabled duel weild weapons with damage ratings of over 60.</DIV> <DIV>EVERY damage art or spell I have is of master quality</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV> <DIV>Generally I do this on a raid:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <UL> <LI>My buff setup on a raid is usually Raxxyls, Aria, Opus, Brias, Alins.  These are all masters except Opus and Brias.</LI> <LI>Jesters on Brigand.</LI> <LI>(on grouped mobs) Precision of the Maestro, all 4 group debuffs, Bellow, Alins.</LI> <LI>(on single targets) Zanders, Kians, Guvienia (snare), Lore's.  Only add the other debuffs in on named mobs.</LI> <LI>Use every single combat art as soon as it's up.  Always use the most damaging ones asap so the recast will be up faster.  I also use Guviena's (bow) whenever it's up as well because I'll always get a bow autoattack hit in too.  Master strike too, although the scouts should try and coordinate this as the debuff doesn't stack.</LI> <LI>If there are 3+ targets still alive I will use Alin's too.</LI></UL> <P>My group varies, but it's usually something like this:</P> <P>Troubador<BR>Brigand<BR>Necro/Conj<BR>Wizard<BR>Ranger<BR>Fury</P> <P>I don't have bump, but you should try and use Bump and Claras as a combo.  Also, you should use a haste item (I'm using the Deathtoll access reward).  Autoattack damage makes up a large part of my dps.</P>

[vinterskugge]

<DIV>Also, the Stamina line and a GOOD one hander will make your dps go through the roof.  8 points in Fortissimo will make you do huge dps, but personally I can't justify losing utility for dps.</DIV>

[Zapdafi]

<P> </P> <P>also look at what other group members are contribuitng, do you have group members who can max out your haste at 100% and put your dps MOD at 50%? it doesnt sound like it so you are about right.</P> <P>for example, check out what a dirge brings, add one to your group or move over to his  for a few rounds if they can spare it and then parse it, you will be amazed at the dps increase for that alone</P>

[Jeger_Wulf]

<DIV>I see people talking about capping their Int. What are the stat caps in EQ2? Are there any other caps to worry about?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks</DIV>

[thorvang]

the soft cap to stats is current level times 7 + base stat. so at 70 it's 490 + base. i.e. for my half elf this is a cap in str at 507 and int at 511.

[Jeger_Wulf]

Thanks Thorvang! What do you mean by "soft cap?" In what ways can it be exceeded?

[thorvang]

pushing str over the soft cap doesn't increase your damage but it increases your attack rating. don't know what's the AR cap though.<p>Message Edited by thorvang on <span class=date_text>05-11-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:45 AM</span>

[Dizank]

<DIV>Has anyone maxed out the poison AA? If so how much DPS do you find it adds to you? My Wis line is maxed out right now and I am currently working down the AGI line. </DIV>