Troubs on PVP Server - roll call and tactic swap

[Meadso]

<div>Hi PVP Troubs</div><div> </div><div>Thought I'd start a thread to see how we are shaping up on PVP servers.</div><div> </div><div>I play on Darathar (level 28 right now) and am having a blast.</div><div> </div><div>Now in groups I feel I certainly pull my weight and we can cause some major mayhem and confusion.</div><div> </div><div>Solo, well it was tough from 20-26 but things are looking up since more abilities are coming on line.</div><div> </div><div>I hate taking on brigands, they stun like mad and rip me up and assasins seem to do the same if they get the drop (as to be expected)</div><div> </div><div>Only had one fight with a bruiser and it didn't go so well - but he couldn't catch me so...  </div><div> </div><div>Finger wigglers - I like fighting these, strangely. They don't like our bow line, it seems to panic them to hell which is a nice easy kill if they try and run. And if not they drop fairly quick in melee.  </div><div> </div><div>Healer - not sure, had a couple of indecisive encounters that I had to bail on because more peeps turned up to gank me.</div><div> </div><div>Chasing runners is my favourite sport - DD line is great - good range and strong enough to finish off most would be runners. Just wish we could use our charmline whilst on the move - may be semi-useful then (6 second cast - 13 second duration Bah!)</div><div> </div><div>So how the rest of you doing?</div><div> </div><div> </div>

[lodoss01]

hey,im 22 on venekor right now, got the slayer title and such so far and having a blast...this is my first toon on my first eq2 server lol and i am loving it, it is a great group class for lvling up and great for solo/group pvp as well, i just recently got my charm so my subjigation is super low, and i cant really figure out how to get it up quickly so its almost useless to me atm. but i am loving this class in solo and group pve/pvp. most other stealthers are a problem for me but thats really because shroud is totally lame for pvp, so easy to see...even people taht dont get see hidden or whatever. but i think the most fun are fights against good dirge's and paladins seem to give me pretty good fights, my armor is pretty crap atm since im new and all my friends are new, and if my mitigation was higher i would probably fair much better, but im using stuff about half the mitigation i should be using.class is awesome and i love it<div></div>

[Kazdun]

Troubadors own if you play em right.  I beat a bruiser 5 lvls over me 1 on 1 fight, he jumped me lol.  He must have been so mad to lose to a greeny.Any pure melee i can own..  how?  Snare and use your nukes on the run abilities, while running away from them lol.  Just pan your camera to make sure they dont stop chasing you and run.  Keep the snare/debuff on and you win. And always use the snare/debuff first.   And the defense lowering ability that makes them burn extra power is very nice too, especially vs people trying to sprint away or healers.<div></div>

[Meadso]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Kazdun wrote:Troubadors own if you play em right.  I beat a bruiser 5 lvls over me 1 on 1 fight, he jumped me lol.  He must have been so mad to lose to a greeny.Any pure melee i can own..  how?  Snare and use your nukes on the run abilities, while running away from them lol.  Just pan your camera to make sure they dont stop chasing you and run.  Keep the snare/debuff on and you win. And always use the snare/debuff first.   And the defense lowering ability that makes them burn extra power is very nice too, especially vs people trying to sprint away or healers.<div></div><hr></blockquote><p>Yeah those are good tactics and something I try to do, however it all gets a bit manic when other people turn up to spoil the fun -  can only keep one person snared effectively. But that's a whole new type of fun I guess.</p><p>I also found it best to turn off auto-bow attack to avoid snare breaking against melee - but I was runing around with a crappy bow so those measly hits seemed to be counter productive.  May have to review that policy since now I have a nice imbued fir longbow.  </p><p> </p><p>Lodoss - welcome to troubland. You made a good choice.</p><p>Advice on armour - until you finish your Aq's it is worth buying some store bought carbonite or brigandine (brigandine looks nicer) if nothing else is available on the broker.</p><p>Now if you can find a friendly armourer then do consider asking for some crude forged feyiron chainmail which is wearable at level 24 - the mitigation is the same as the pristine feyiron and the resists compare (maybe even exceed) the AQ's and the pristine carbonite. You will feel the difference.</p><p> </p><p>Message Edited by Meadsong on <span class="date_text">03-11-2006</span><span class="time_text">12:57 AM</span></p>

[Noguks]

<div></div><p>We have some pretty good debuffs.  I try to land the stealth attack that debuffs Int, follow up with a stun and then use the Str/Agi debuff.  I then try to get off melee and short range attacks.  At this point I detaunt then start circling around at a bit of distance while getting off the running nukes and plucking arrows. </p><p>It seems like most of the time when you get the surprise on people they tend to run.  In this case I usually only can get them if they are green and perhaps blue.  The 12 sec snare usually isnt long enough to get someone who decides not to fight at all.  I have to remember to use the power % usage debuff and see its effect on runners.  That may be a good one.</p><p> </p><p> </p>

[Terabithi]

<div></div><p> </p><p>Don't let these bozos fool you. PVP with a troubadour is VERY VERY hard.</p><p> </p><p>I made a guy on Vox named Wiflred. He's a frog. I did this because I got 2 of my buddies from WoW to convert over, and they had chosen frogs, a templar and a conjuror. I picked a troub, because I figured I could enhance the trio.</p><p>I was right about this.</p><p>What I was wrong about, was having any chance at all out there against players who are white, yellow, or orange to me when I am solo. Now mind you, I'm only level 12, but the newbie areas are full of jerks killing newbies for kicks. I can't even get close to hurting them. The best I did was against an orange brigand. What is the problem you ask? Let me tell you, and then ask yourself if it sounds familiar....</p><p>TROUBS HAVE NOOOOOO DPS. NONE. ZIP. NADA.</p><p>I've played every class, and I am telling you, NOBODY is worse at DPS then us. Now....YES I know about our buffs. I know about the power-drainange, and I know that many troubs are not about the DPS anyway. I respect that.</p><p>However, on a PvP server, if I can't hurt someone enough, I cannot be expected to win. There are classes doing twice....and even THREE TIMES the damage I can produce. An example. I stun a guy, sneak around back, and nail him from behind. Take any other scout class and do the SAME THING, and you will be doing TWICE as much damage, at least. It's awful.</p><p>Now, I can only hope that this gets better with levels. So far my PvP experience has been a joke, with me getting picked off by players 4 to 8 levels above me. CONSTANTLY. I can dance, I can sing, I can buff, I can drain.....BUT I CANT HURT ANYONE!!!!!</p><p>HELP me. It's not about "just snare and run." Are you kidding me? What kind of coward-crap response is that? We should be doing the same damage the other scout classes do. I'd sacrifice the pros of the buffs for more offense (PvP-wise).</p><p>You guys out there with troubs who are really involved in solo PvP on the PvP servers....what OTHER advice besides "yeah, run like heck and hope you can slowly drain him dead" can you really offer me? No intelligent player is gonna be dumb enough to let you do this to them. I'm so frustrated. lol.</p>

[Kulaf]

<div></div><p>How does your Templar friend fair when he is solo?  :smileyvery-happy:</p><p>My guess is his DPS is significantly lower than yours.</p>

[modnar]

<div>I also made a troub and so far im not having any probs with PvP my score right now at lv 14 is 4 and 2 each kill was from someone up like 2-3 lvs from me and the deaths are from a guys who hit me from behind while invis then killed me and the second is from a group of 2 or 3 necros that were orange to me. I just stealth attack get behind him attack stun attack then when they start to run i use that thing where u yell at them lol.</div>

[Terabithi]

<div></div><p> </p><p>you've been VERY lucky to only have fought 6 times at level 14. 4 and 2? egad. I died at least a dozen times yesterday morning in Oakmyst to a level 16 coercer and his 2 level 16 cronies. I was level 10. Mez WHACK Mez WHACK Stun WHACK. awwwwful.</p><p>as far as templar dps goes, I'd gladly take their ability to pacify over my ability to.....what? "stealth attack"? it's the whole "master of none" issue. Any respectable scout can kill a fellow white con in, say, 5 to 7 hits, tops. It would take me twice that, because I just don't hit very hard. </p><p> </p><p>but as I said, I'm only level 12 so far, so maybe down the road I'll get something useful. My main is a 49 sk, and I have never EVER had a problem with offense. I'm glad I can boost my group and all, but man oh man, I am SOO TIRED of being picked off by boneheads 6 levels above me.</p><p>Maybe it would help if Qeynos was actually defended. The other day, on Vox, the Fp's took all griffon towers, and were simply roaming around the front of qeynos, at their leisure. every newbie area is infested. In Oakmyst (I'm STILL ticked about this) I got killed by a guy about 5 levels above me, one on one. (the first one on one I'd had). I had 3......THHRRREEEE....healers all standing around watching. When asked, why the bloody hell didn't they heal me they said, and I'm quoting..."He's too small for us to engage". I responded, "I didn't ASK YOU to ENGAGE, WHY would you not HEAL ME, and stand there watching?!" Each one felt very sorry, and was somewhat embarrassed. They simply HADN'T THOUGHT OF IT.</p><p>So it's like, I can shine in a group, but when not in a group, I can't rely on people around me, because 9 times out of 10 they are too dense to do anything. So I gotta rely on my skills, all of which are dealing minimal amounts of damage. (though I'm happy with the power drain)</p><p>man. If I EVER learn how to use this guy effectively, I am going to dedicate my free time to [Removed for Content] the crap out of Freeport.</p><p> </p>

[modnar]

<div></div>It also sucks that CL has cross roads to run into and be safe(a little) and we don't have anything like that also why dose CL have a few more guards then Ant?

[Lachlan]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Terabithian wrote:<div></div><p> </p><p>Don't let these bozos fool you. PVP with a troubadour is VERY VERY hard.</p><p> </p><p>I made a guy on Vox named Wiflred. He's a frog. I did this because I got 2 of my buddies from WoW to convert over, and they had chosen frogs, a templar and a conjuror. I picked a troub, because I figured I could enhance the trio.</p><p>I was right about this.</p><p>What I was wrong about, was having any chance at all out there against players who are white, yellow, or orange to me when I am solo. Now mind you, I'm only level 12, but the newbie areas are full of jerks killing newbies for kicks. I can't even get close to hurting them. The best I did was against an orange brigand. What is the problem you ask? Let me tell you, and then ask yourself if it sounds familiar....</p><p>TROUBS HAVE NOOOOOO DPS. NONE. ZIP. NADA.</p><p>I've played every class, and I am telling you, NOBODY is worse at DPS then us. Now....YES I know about our buffs. I know about the power-drainange, and I know that many troubs are not about the DPS anyway. I respect that.</p><p> </p><hr></blockquote><p><font color="#ff6633">Ok, reality check.  Troubs are by no means the worst dps, just because you are getting ganked at lvl 12 by one-shot-wonders doesn't move Troubs to the bottom of the DPS list.  Try playing a guardian if you want to see bad DPS.</font></p><p><font color="#ff6633">There are a few classes who early on have the lead for delivering fast solo DPS, this is probably going to even out a lot because, well SOE made it that way.  If you want to be a great PvP troub, get in a group, roll with some casters who you can really buff and you'll find yourself doing fine.  Solo, we are not great, but the solution is simple, FIGHT DIRTY.  If you take some time to level up, learn how your CA's affect combat and generally get yourself accustomed to the mechanics of PvP, you can do pretty well, but Troubs are a bit more work than some classes in PvP but through the mid-30's I've found it a reasonable class.  If you measure your success mainly on how well you solo, re-roll a necro or ranger, etc.</font></p><p><font color="#ff6633">Just remember, recent changes made levels less important than the number of friends you have with you, troubs are  great in groups so we ought to work out fine.  </font></p><p></p><p>Message Edited by Lachlan on <span class="date_text">03-15-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:14 AM</span></p>

[SoMaKuTa]

<div>I am Miserable, lvl 62 Troub on Nagafen.  The comments on DPS really are subjective.  Solo we are a decient to a point, I haven't really had any good solo pvp fights because nobody is really solo that is around our level so its hard to tell.  Group wise we rock.  Dropping Maestro and having Aria up is quick burst DPS for the spell casting classes, having every resist song but disease and poison helps out everyone as well.  Using the defense, energy cost debuff helps on healers as well as our energy drains.  It really starts to add up even though it seems like a small amount.  In pve with our current group make up our DPS is actually pretty good, I am often at or above 200 dps, sometimes peaking at above 300 depending on the duration of the fight and this is on white average to yellow Tripple up Heroics.  All in all this has been a pretty fun class to play and will be more fun when more people get our level.</div>

[Meadso]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Terabithian wrote:<div></div><p> </p><p>you've been VERY lucky to only have fought 6 times at level 14. 4 and 2? egad. I died at least a dozen times yesterday morning in Oakmyst to a level 16 coercer and his 2 level 16 cronies. I was level 10. Mez WHACK Mez WHACK Stun WHACK. awwwwful.</p><p>as far as templar dps goes, I'd gladly take their ability to pacify over my ability to.....what? "stealth attack"? it's the whole "master of none" issue. Any respectable scout can kill a fellow white con in, say, 5 to 7 hits, tops. It would take me twice that, because I just don't hit very hard. </p><p> </p><p>but as I said, I'm only level 12 so far, so maybe down the road I'll get something useful. My main is a 49 sk, and I have never EVER had a problem with offense. I'm glad I can boost my group and all, but man oh man, I am SOO TIRED of being picked off by boneheads 6 levels above me.</p><p>Maybe it would help if Qeynos was actually defended. The other day, on Vox, the Fp's took all griffon towers, and were simply roaming around the front of qeynos, at their leisure. every newbie area is infested. In Oakmyst (I'm STILL ticked about this) I got killed by a guy about 5 levels above me, one on one. (the first one on one I'd had). I had 3......THHRRREEEE....healers all standing around watching. When asked, why the bloody hell didn't they heal me they said, and I'm quoting..."He's too small for us to engage". I responded, "I didn't ASK YOU to ENGAGE, WHY would you not HEAL ME, and stand there watching?!" Each one felt very sorry, and was somewhat embarrassed. They simply HADN'T THOUGHT OF IT.</p><p>So it's like, I can shine in a group, but when not in a group, I can't rely on people around me, because 9 times out of 10 they are too dense to do anything. So I gotta rely on my skills, all of which are dealing minimal amounts of damage. (though I'm happy with the power drain)</p><p>man. If I EVER learn how to use this guy effectively, I am going to dedicate my free time to [Removed for Content] the crap out of Freeport.</p><p> </p><hr></blockquote><p>Yeah, like some already said you wont see much joy solo-pvp at level 12. Like I said in my original post once you hit the late 20's when more of our abilites come on line you will see a different picture.</p><p>I'm at 33 now and doing pretty well. There is no class I can't take down and none that can't do the same to me. Often I've been handed my [Removed for Content] because I didn't have the right buffs running but then it works both ways.</p><p>We do have a comparative low DPS - but if we play it right we can still take down our foes.</p><p>With the snare thing - I find it best not to auto-attack when I snare someone since it will break the snare and a breaking a snare for 20 hp damge does not make sense (especially if they hit you right back for a high damage melee art) , just wait for the timer on the our big hit and lead the foe to a place of your choosing, ie - as far from the zone out as possible. 9/10 they will follow and by the time they realise you are going to wear them down they will be too far from zone to run :smileywink:</p><p> </p>

[Lukee]

<DIV>I'm a newb troubadour. I play on Nagafen(PvP) and am level 15. I decided to level off of FPers from 15 - 19, so I can learn the basics of Troub. PvP for better or worse.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My record is 10-5 which isn't too bad. Only fought 2 guys lower level and a bunch of yellow/orange cons. I did jump into a couple of fights where I saw someone getting owned and the other guy wasn't really hurt, so I guess you really can't call that solo. lol</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Note to self: Orange con necros HURT really bad. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I love our shout line and AOE shout. Very handy when you are chasing someone and when you are trying to maintain your distance.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'll le you know how the next 4 levels go, but I am having a lot of fun. Track + Shroud is fun. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It's a change from being a Berserker with a big bullseye on your back.</DIV>

[Kajinryu]

I'm another newbie to the class.  Level 16 on Vox currently, mostly solo; and I get ganked constantly by people either 6-8 levels above me or only 3-4 levels above me with thier friend(s).  I'm assuming this will change in time.  To complicate my problem of being new to the class (although I think I'm picking it up rather well) I'm completely new to EQ2 also.So far, the little tactic I've used in 1v1 fights that I've managed, is that I lead with the 'from stealth' ability, then debuff, then HO starter using the stun, flanking/rear, (after making sure my HO is the dd one) deafening strike/single-target shout.  My abilities are all apprentice 2 currently and this has gotten a few casters near death to the point where I have to chase them down to finish em off.  It's looking like this will be the basis for most of my pvp experiences so far, it's almost exactly how I pull mobs.  I'm really looking forward to the charm/mez abilities to even things up a bit more in the future.One thing I haven't tried yet, can we use our ranged abilities without a direct line of sight (if I'm running can I use my shout on those chasing me?)  I'm assuming no.<div></div>

[Ranc]

I'm a 34 champion troubador on Nagafen and I've discovered a few things along the way: <ul> <li>Group with smart people who compliment your playstyle! For me, I have a few conjuror's that I group with that really work well with my buffs and playstyle.</li> <li>Understand that you are not a solo PvP class. Sure you can do it at lower levels, but the higher you get the less viable it becomes.</li> <li>Realise that your role is to debuff your opponents, and help keep your group alive. Your DPS is nice, but it's not that nice.</li> </ul> Keeping that in mind I highly recommend getting master versions of your debuff songs. In particular you want to master the STR/AGI debuff line. It reduces the Agility, and most importantly the STR of the entire group you use it on. When mastered, this will severly snare or pracitcally root any caster you use it against. Very few lvl 34 necros can have their STR debuffed by 81 and still walk around. Also remember to use your ranged attacks, including the bow stifle line, whenever possible. I actually do better DPS in hectic PvP combat using our ranged nukes and arrow attacks, than I would up close and personal (but by all means rotate all your melee attacks whenever cheap shot refreshes. Don't forget the flank attack line as it can be pretty decent if mastered). At 34 I routinely hit for 400+ with good arrows and stormfire (which will need to be upgraded soon). Nukes, debuffs, stifles, snares, arrows + all our buffs make us a very powerful group PvP class. <div></div>

[Lukee]

<P>Funny little story last night which is pretty much why I picked this class.</P> <P>I'm level a level 16 froglok hunting with a friend who is playing a level 21 Wizzy. We are moving around CL looking for marks. we've killed about 5-6 when we see two. They are level 15 and 16 and 20, My friend goes after the 20 while I attack the 16. Well, I hear from him in Ventrilo, "Crap, level 24 here as well".</P> <P>Well, they killed him quick, I'm in the orange and I start running. They are whittling me away. I get out of combat, yell for help, and now I'm moving at full speed and am regenning health. My friend was marveled that I escaped without dying. It gets better.</P> <P>I'm running to try to meet up with him when I run by an even con, who immediately starts chasing me. I am at full life and half power. I run a little bit more and notice that he sticks a weak DoT on me. I run through a river. Stop, turn around and went to town on him. I think the shock of me stopping and attacking him kinda caught him off guard. Well, he was an easy kill.</P> <P>I took Piercing Shriek as my Master II spell and have all my other spells as Adept I.</P> <P> </P>

[LodrinSt]

<DIV>When I was 14 and took master shrill, i thought I was on top of the world too when I could do half of someone's life with an on the run nuke when no one had any resists.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Then I kept leveling and became worse each level. You'll get your reality check soon enough. It's easier to reroll at your level though.</DIV>

[Lukee]

<DIV>I don't expect to be doing a lot of damage as I level up. Our CAs don't really increase with the same proportion that HPs do. I'm just enjoying this now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm sure we could still solo PvP a bit at later levels. I plan on grouping later anyways, it's just nice to be able to solo PvP a bit at low levels. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My Berseker couldn't.</DIV>

[Jait]

<DIV>I like to "Moonwalk".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I auto-bow, shrill, debuff, nuke em while running backwards just out of their melee range.  Our DPS is far too low to try and joust or hang toe-to-toe with most melee classes.  Against solo casters or small groups with a nuker, I sneak in and double tap Clara's and Dancing Blade (-pwr flankstab),</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>With full groups I tend to sneak, then join in after engagement has started on tank.  Debuff, Lores, bow, shrill, etc..  then finish off the healers/casters.  It's pretty straight forward for us.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Jait</DIV> <DIV>70 Troubadour, Venekor</DIV>

[Melmoth1820]

<DIV>"So far, the little tactic I've used in 1v1 fights that I've managed, is that I lead with the 'from stealth' ability, then debuff, then HO starter using the stun, flanking/rear, (after making sure my HO is the dd one) deafening strike/single-target shout."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>HOs don't work in pvp...  Neither does yelling for help which someone else mentioned doing to break combat in order to kite to win a pvp fight......</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Curious, what do you higher level troubs do against classes with decent/strong ranged weapon attacks, since if you snare/kite you'll get steadily plinked?</DIV>

[Jait]

<P>You dont.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>If you're caught alone against a ranged class, and they have the jump?  Get the hell outta there asap =p  Another potent weapon of the Troubadour is Selo+Snare+Escape.  But likely, if the ranged character has got the jump, you're already half dead and rooted/snared yourself.  Picking and choosing your fights is the first rule of any class in pvp.</P>

[Kajinryu]

"HOs don't work in pvp..."Good to know <span>:smileyhappy:</span> but just out of curiousity though, what about swindler's luck?  At least I think that's what it's called, it appears to buff melee skills for 3 minutes.  Do we recieve benefit of that buff in pvp?  If so I can just avoid the ringing blow HO and make sure that one is up instead.<div></div>

[smtj]

<P>Hi all, 47 Troub on Naga.  Just wanted to add how pvp is going for me.  Over half my spells and buffs are mastered (nice to be the low played class).  I have been pretty happy with the class in pvp.  </P> <P> </P> <P>The bad side-  I have done soso in 1 on 1 fights (vs even con), basicly I can beat most casters and have had some luck with bruisers and assassins but I really need the jump.  I can kite the tanks but still takes so long to kill almost not worth it depending on where you are fighting.  I have almost no luck with healers, they can out heal my dps and all have more power so they can out last me.  I can escape most classes except those with long stuns or stiffles.</P> <P> </P> <P>The good side-  We seem to really shine in group pvp.  I have both resist chants mastered so that adds 800+ mit to 5 resist of all group members, huge help as resist are major in pvp.  Our group constantly wins in fights vs higher lvl toons and/or fights we are out numbered.  Group with a mystic and you have all resist buffed (they buff poison and disease) plus with your focus chant and with their group wards you stand a chance in most fights around your level.  Assist tank and make sure to debuff enemy and good things happen.</P> <P>I am going the Stam AA line for the shield slam with knockback, which is awesome in pvp and can make a big difference.  Not sure if I will go any higher in this line or not.  I will prolly put some points into the wis line to help with my resist and I like some of the higher skills in that line.</P> <P> </P> <P>Flounder</P> <P>Brew Crew</P>