Agro problems

[Darkmage6]

As i get closer to 40 i seem to have a problem with grabbing agro from mt , i then use deagro song but still the mob is stuck on me i have to stop auto attack and backup.I cant seem to output damage very well i have to hold back on tough mobs so i dont end up taking a dirt nap.I wish we had a song that dumps agro like ranger has and takes no conc.I have upgraded my int big time now my damage is pretty high half my songs are master and 2 master II's.Any tips other than hold back on damage to increase my dps without taking a dirt nap.Most of the mt are 40-42 rangers in my party dont have my problem go fiqure.

[Zoolin]

What songs are you running when this happens? Are you running health regen? Are you mashing CA's as soon as you can?Also, you shouldn't back up, just stand your ground and use evade. That way the tank doesn't have to chase the mob and you won't move out of the healer's range.

[WooTast]

<span>As Zoolin writes, backing up once aggro is on you is not the most productive thing, because once you are at the top of the aggro list, backing up isn't going to help much and it just makes life more difficult for other group members.  Aggro *is* related to distance from the mob, however, and so staying just inside melee range before you pull aggro would help keep you below the MT on the aggro list.Troubs do get an aggro reducing song for the group.  Also, wait just a little longer before doing your highest dps.  I start with debuffs, and then only start doing damage CA's after all debuffs have stuck.  That might help you.<blockquote><hr>Zoolin wrote:What songs are you running when this happens? Are you running health regen? Are you mashing CA's as soon as you can?Also, you shouldn't back up, just stand your ground and use evade. That way the tank doesn't have to chase the mob and you won't move out of the healer's range.<hr></blockquote></span><div></div>

[Kulaf]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Darkmage666 wrote:As i get closer to 40 i seem to have a problem with grabbing agro from mt , i then use deagro song but still the mob is stuck on me i have to stop auto attack and backup.I cant seem to output damage very well i have to hold back on tough mobs so i dont end up taking a dirt nap.I wish we had a song that dumps agro like ranger has and takes no conc.I have upgraded my int big time now my damage is pretty high half my songs are master and 2 master II's.Any tips other than hold back on damage to increase my dps without taking a dirt nap.Most of the mt are 40-42 rangers in my party dont have my problem go fiqure.<hr></blockquote>I'm confused by that last sentence.  Are you saying your MTs in the group are Rangers?  If so that is why you are not getting a good effect from our group deagro.....Rangers are not Fighters. If not then try this.  Let the MT have 3 seconds after pull to get some agro.....then toss debuffs......then begin your attack and spam your personal deago every time it pops.  If you still get agro, find a new tank because they don't know how to taunt.

[Balmung of the Azure Sky]

<div></div><p>There's a few things here. Even at 70, I seem to be drawing much more aggro than in DoF or Old World. Yes, I do indeed use all my abilities the instant they pop because unless im running all the debuffs it doesn't look like I'm doing anything. SO I tap the key each time it's up and on occassion now I tend to pull the enemy away from our tank. I found there are a few remedies for this...</p><p>--As soon as you peel, stun the enemy and back out of melee range. I have noticed in more than a dozen times that if you do NOT generate an extreme amount once you get to the top of list, you can bypass anti-aggro by moving out of range. It's easier to switch targets than for an enemy to run 20-30 meters.</p><p>--Use your anti-agro after you use a few abilities, roughly 3-5. Diluting your agro so soon will give a large step to any tank to hold enough agro to carry throughout the fight against bard aggro.</p><p>--If you went down the wisdom line for AA abilities, pickup the Harmonizing Shot. In which case when you stun the enemy and back off, you should have nough time to pull off a harmonizing shot to help get it off of you.</p><p>Yes, there will be some cases where you will draw too much aggro and it may chase you down but in time you will be able to dump into encounters non-stop once you figure out where to breakdown your agro gain.</p>

[Balmung of the Azure Sky]

<div></div><blockquote><p></p><hr><p>Kulaf wrote:</p><p>I'm confused by that last sentence.  Are you saying your MTs in the group are Rangers?  If so that is why you are not getting a good effect from our group deagro.....Rangers are not Fighters. If not then try this.  Let the MT have 3 seconds after pull to get some agro.....then toss debuffs......then begin your attack and spam your personal deago every time it pops.  If you still get agro, find a new tank because they don't know how to taunt.</p><p></p><hr></blockquote>You can have other scouts as tanks and take full advantage of the Alin's ____ Serenade Agro reduction line. I have had a brigand, swshy, and ranger tank on several groups without any problems. THe way to take advantage of it is to let that player know to cancel Alin's ____ Serenade off of them so that they will generate normal hate while the rest of the group is set back xx%

[Darkmage6]

My party was a guardian,inquisistor,ranger,brigand,wizzyother was 2 pally,ranger,monk and wizzy.and 2 sk's,swash,inquis,conjI kept pulling agro i would wait till mob was down 1 bubble and let loose and pull agro every time i was firing off my ca's from debuff's then lowest to highest damage.At the end i would play the de-argo song but mobs still beat on me, if i backup they stop and go to tank.Whats funny is the ranger was going all out and not getting agro he was doing more damage than me.Yes i was playing the hp regen song maybe the agro is building from that?.

[pera]

ITs almost some times that the deagro song is not being applied to us.  No profe but its just the way things are seemign, because through parses we arn't doing really much more dps really i'm still averaging about 300-350 on most non-ae fights.  But in groups I can peel agro away from the tank like its nobodies business.Evade and snare+harmonizing shot really have become very usefull.<div></div>

[Sanju]

The first thing I noticed is that you're using the de-agro song incorrectly. It's not meant to be cast only when you (or a groupmember) gain agro. It's meant to be used throughout the fight. Put it up and keep it up if you have agro problems.<div></div>

[Zapdafi]

<div></div><p> </p><p>another thing to consider is the level of the mob and the level of the tank, and your level.  mob was 66 heroic , tank was 61, i was 64. i was pulling aggro from him  on a constant basis till i started to use evade whenever it allowed. My guess is that i was able to land most blows while he may have had problems getting his attacks and taunts to stick consistently. it was a group heavy in melee so my songs were geared to a melee group.</p><p>i was never in danger of dying as the healers were doing a great job and i was usually able to dump aggro fairly quickly when i wanted too.</p><p> </p>

[911GT3]

Try not to use things like backstab right after another high dmg attack, spread out the dmg and the rate at which your using attacks, also throw in an evade every now and again, you dont have to wait for the mob to attack you for it to reduce your hate.<div></div>

[Jehannum]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Darkmage666 wrote:As i get closer to 40 i seem to have a problem with grabbing agro from mt , i then use deagro song but still the mob is stuck on me i have to stop auto attack and backup.I cant seem to output damage very well i have to hold back on tough mobs so i dont end up taking a dirt nap.I wish we had a song that dumps agro like ranger has and takes no conc.I have upgraded my int big time now my damage is pretty high half my songs are master and 2 master II's.Any tips other than hold back on damage to increase my dps without taking a dirt nap.Most of the mt are 40-42 rangers in my party dont have my problem go fiqure.<hr></blockquote><p>As others have said, have the Serenade line up at all times when grouping.  If it's not up, it's not reducing your aggro generation.  It takes concentration, but it's one of the best abilities <strong>any</strong> class gets for aggro management.  Don't fall victim to Ranger Envy.</p><p>Other than KoS spells most of mine are master 1+.  I can <em>choose</em> whether I want to take aggro, and unless the mages fight me it's mine.  That's with a guard tanking, with Serenade running, on a single mob.  I wasn't able to do that prior to KoS but that's not a sign of the de-aggro not working, it's a sign that it really <strong>was</strong> overpowered.  As to the rangers, if you're not actually playing Serenade until you take aggro and they're using their de-aggro full time, that'll be why they have no issues.  If not, it'll be because theirs and yours stack - they'll be shedding (say) 30 or so percent aggro themselves, plus another 20 or so thanks to you, for 50% total rather than the 30 you give yourself. (numbers totally made up but self-consistent)</p><p>Really though, the best way to dump aggro <strong>is never to take it in the first place</strong>.  You can have <strong>more</strong> hate than the tank without taking aggro, easily.  It takes a percentage more to pull aggro from #1 on the hate list, and once you've done it your tank needs that same percentage more than <strong>you</strong> have to get it back (distance seems to increase the required percentage).  Long fight, that just won't happen and if the mob doesn't die, you will.  Get used to using the Evasion line and if you choose wisdom line AAs, harmonising shot to reduce your aggro before things get to that stage.  The aggro shedding abilities will slow your dps a bit as well as reducing your total hate level to give your tank a head start, and as long as he's not getting stunned a lot you'll be <strong>unable</strong> to pull aggro in most fights.</p><p>As an anecdote illustrating this, I habitually mez-pull (nuke a mob, and mez it wherever we're engaging).  I've found that if I nuke, mez then use Elude, I don't need to worry about aggro.  I've also found that if I throw an Elude in just before I go nuts on dps, I stay below the "hate-level-1" threshold and the tank retains aggro, while - as I say - if I just go nuts, I end up tanking as Precision elapses.</p>

[Aienaa]

<div></div><p></p><hr><font color="#ffff00">As others have said, have the Serenade line up at all times when grouping.  If it's not up, it's not reducing your aggro generation.  It takes concentration, but it's one of the best abilities <strong>any</strong> class gets for aggro management.  Don't fall victim to Ranger Envy.</font><hr><p>Actually....  Right now having the agro song up is the WORST thing you can do... The song is broken and appears to be having the reverse effect from what it is suposed to be doing....  There are multiple threads concerning how this song is broken...</p><p>With the way that the song is right now, everyone holds agro better than the tank, and the tank is constantly fighting for agro...  If you turn off the song, you find that things go much better, but you will have to control your own agro, as will everyone else in the group....</p><p>Until they get around to fixing this, it's best to watch your agro and do what ever is necessary to control it...</p><p>Gwern - 69 Assassin  /  Parody - 56 Troubador  /  Nilla - 66 Alchemist</p>

[Cygnu]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Aienaa wrote:<div></div><p></p><p>Actually....  Right now having the agro song up is the WORST thing you can do... The song is broken and appears to be having the reverse effect from what it is suposed to be doing....  There are multiple threads concerning how this song is broken...</p><hr></blockquote><p>Strange. Thats not the way my group saw it last night. We were running through the Den Of The Devourer instance and our tank, on occasions, was loosing aggro towards the end of fights. I put the song up and we never had the problem again.</p><p>I never use the song unless the group is having problems. Waste of a concentration slot otherwise imho, but if its needed, leave it up.</p>

[Sanju]

<span><blockquote><hr>Aienaa wrote:<div></div><p></p><font color="#ffff00"></font>Actually....  Right now having the agro song up is the WORST thing you can do... The song is broken<hr></blockquote>No, it's not. It was ninja-fixed a while back.</span><div></div>

[Aienaa]

<div><hr><font color="#ffff00">No, it's not. It was ninja-fixed a while back.</font><hr></div><div> </div><div>Cool...  Had not played my Troub in a while as I was concentrating on my Assassin and Alchemist...  Glad they finially got his fixed....</div><div> </div><div> </div><div>Gwern - 69 Assassin  /  Parody - 56 Troubador  /  Nilla - 66 Alchemist</div>