The Supposed fix to Requiem of reflection

[pera]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div>Just updating this with the latest post on this subject because the orignal post imade is a bit out dated.<hr size="2" width="100%"><p>I really hope the dev's do understand the actual problem with this spell is not the fact that the proc triggers its the fact that once it is triggered rarely if ever will something be reflected.  In this spells current state honestly its no better than a fluff spell.  That may sound harsh but in usability its very true.Here is a small list, and I’ll empisize small, of problems with Requiem of Reflection.</p><ol><li>Non humanoid mobs (both group and solo) that have special abilities, none of these abilities can be reflected.</li><li>No Ae Attacks can be reflected.  Well i understand that problem that caused this to be turned off because the AE its self would be reflected and had a good chance to hit everything in the zone.  The fix was to just blindly turn off AEs from reflecting.  Which this is a completely wrong way to fix this.</li><li>The 30 second timer along with the chance to reflect creates a situation where your actual finally chance to reflect is 1-2%.  In most cases your chance to reflect is 0% because of the type of spells most mobs cast.</li><li>Once the proc has triggered there is a % chance to reflect the next non-melee damage spell.  Because this spell is a level 52 spell the % chance to reflect degrades as you level it started at 85% when we received this spell.  Now at 60 this chance to reflect has degraded down to 73%.  If this spell is not upgraded by the time we hit 70 its chance to reflect will be close to 55%.  Therefore making this spell even more useless.</li></ol><p>For over 3 months now and even in DoF beta people have been reporting bugs on this spell in numerous threads and bug reports.   Especially if you do not see a but anywhere in here at least fix the spell degrading as the Troubador increases in level, Or better yet removed the second chance to reflect and make it work like the dirges.Please do something, I appreciate the fact that you did at least make a effort to at least do something to this spell, but the chance that is currently on test of LU19 will not effect the actual bug with this spell.  There have been many possible solutions to fix this ability.  Please do something, either remove this spell complete and give us some another ability, or fix it.   This is just a slap in the face to all troubador’s by not fixing this ability.Requests -   Remove the 30 second time out on the triggered proc.   Remove the chance to reflect   Allow all spell damage to be reflected. - this really is not that hard. see below for example   If it makes the spell too powerful by reflecting spell damage remove the reflection and just have it absorb spell  damage that is not resisted.Example on one possible fix to how Requiem of Reflection(RoR) could work.// this unit would have to be used every time non-melee damage is received by a PC that has Requiem of Reflection on them.  Therefore this would include both normal non-melee damage spell casts and dots.   This is just a possible suggestion PDL on a fix that I’m sure would make a lot of people happier, to have this ability fixed.-Spell cast by MOB.-if Spell is not resisted by PC AND Requiem of Reflection (Troubador group buff version) is on pc.  - if Requiem of Reflection proc has not triggered      - random % chance to proc       - if (random % chance to proc == TRUE)             - Trigger Requiem of Reflection on PC        - else             // do nothing.  - else if Requiem of Reflection proc is on PC    - If spell ( NOT(instant-death) AND (does non-melee damage) )         - Make PC cast Reflection on Mob            - Reflection does [mob's non-melee spell damage] to MOB                // Only reflects the damage from the Mob's spell.</p><p><span>          </span>- Remove Requiem of Reflection proc from PC     - else        // do nothing- else  // do nothing</p><p> </p><p><b>We really need to get more of a voice about this ability so maybe we can get if fixed</b>.<span>  </span>It has been over 3 month since we received this spell.<span>  </span>And I’m sorry but I am not counting what was put into live update # 19 as a fix, because it does not address in anyway the problem with the spell.<span>  </span>This spell really needs to be looked into. Please!</p><hr size="2" width="100%"><p>Message Edited by perano on <span class="date_text">01-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">09:56 AM</span></p>

[Dali]

I wonder why they don't just change it to ABSORB one spell instead of reflecting it, much like the Dirge's Stoneskin proc. Then they could include all spells. Or maybe just a second resist chance.

[VericSauvari]

<div>Thanks for the update..unfortunately this means it will still be kept out of my toolbars...this spell <em>had</em> a ton of potential</div>

[Jehannum]

<div>While I agree the song's not living up to potential and seems unlikely to do even with a whopping 3% increase in its initial proc rate (bearing in mind that equates to a +25% to its current chance) it's still got at least a little bit of utility in certain fights.  For example, the fire witch nuked herself for 2k last night and we've seen Goliathan slap himself around a bit too.  Yes, I know as well as you that 500 on an auto-attack, a couple grand on a Static shock or a fire nuke doesn't equate to the proc being worthwhile.</div><div> </div><div>It's hardly a spell that's generally useful, or even worthwhile overall, but it does currently have some minimal value in certain fights.</div>

[VericSauvari]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Jehannum wrote:<div>While I agree the song's not living up to potential and seems unlikely to do even with a whopping 3% increase in its initial proc rate (bearing in mind that equates to a +25% to its current chance) it's still got at least a little bit of utility in certain fights.  For example, the fire witch nuked herself for 2k last night and we've seen Goliathan slap himself around a bit too.  Yes, I know as well as you that 500 on an auto-attack, a couple grand on a Static shock or a fire nuke doesn't equate to the proc being worthwhile.</div><div> </div><div>It's hardly a spell that's generally useful, or even worthwhile overall, but it does currently have some minimal value in certain fights.</div><hr></blockquote>unfortunately i do not get much time in the main tank group (Who am i kidding..i NEVER get main tank group time anymore..) so i do not have any stories like this...the one time i was in the MT against the queen  i did get the spell to proc..but the maintank died before the mobs followup spell could be cast..only further enforcing the idea i do not help the MT<p>Message Edited by VericSauvari on <span class="date_text">01-16-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:00 PM</span></p>

[pera]

I really believe it would be great if the dev's would allow poeple to  /copychar to the test server. This way there would be a more diverse player base than just a handfull of people which for the most part are below level 40.  How is some of the high end content supposed to be tested if there is no one there to test it.Are there any 52+ troubadors active on test at all ?  I would defiently play and test items on there, but i dont have the time or will to grind a nother charater to 60 for testing.  In simple the test servers population is way to small to provide any really testing support for higher end mobs, spells and encounters.  So much stuff goes live with out ever being tested properly.  If we were allowed to have a copy of our toon on test this probably might be eased.<div></div>

[ForgottenFoundling]

<div></div>They don't allow copying toons because it would ruin the community that is being built up.  Yes, it's small, but those that play are committed to working things out rather than jumping on at each test patch checking one thing and then hitting the boards to complain.  Exp is doubled there, so it's not that hard to work a toon up to the level cap.

[Mulilla]

<div></div><div>I have to reply to this thread since the post Perano wrote in the spells forum was closed (<a target="_blank" href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=spells&message.id=3821">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=spells&message.id=3821</a>)  because "<p>The same discussion is being held on the Troubador forums, if anyone is interested in contributing to this."</p><p>That means SOMEONE (although StarryEyedElf is a moderator) has read that post regarding the issues with RoR.  As we say in my country, hope is the last thing you lose, so i am forced to contribute to this issue just in case any dev reads this thread by mistake and looks into this spell.</p><p>Requiem of Reflection procs, thats not the issue with the spell.  It doesn't proc so often, but at least does.  The real issue is the one that Perano states: the spell procs, but doesn't reflect anything.  Since the combat changes, 30 secs is little time to reflect a spell, and since later changes, it doesn't reflect some habilities, and AoEs.  Most of the time you see that it proc'd and see that nice icon for 30 secs and then fades.</p><p>Thank you for the increase in the proc rate, but that doesn't fix the spell (wich is an ancient 52 spell and should be class defining).  Please, make it reflect.  There are tons of ideas in the troub issues post about this spell, and i think none of them is increasing the proc rate.  Lower the proc rate if you wish, but make it so it reflects the next spell, with no timer.  This way is harder to exploit as happened with the enchanter's line.  The randomness of the proc can't be used to reflect a charm, or anything that it is not intended to be reflected (possible, but highly unprobable).  Please, take a look at the toub issues post, there are great ideas there to make this spell usefull.  Please, listen to us, can't you see we are trying to help you??</p><p> </p></div>

[VericSauvari]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Mulillla wrote:<div></div><div>I have to reply to this thread since the post Perano wrote in the spells forum was closed (<a target="_blank" href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=spells&message.id=3821">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=spells&message.id=3821</a>)  because "<p>The same discussion is being held on the Troubador forums, if anyone is interested in contributing to this."</p><p>That means SOMEONE (although StarryEyedElf is a moderator) has read that post regarding the issues with RoR.  As we say in my country, hope is the last thing you lose, so i am forced to contribute to this issue just in case any dev reads this thread by mistake and looks into this spell.</p><p>Requiem of Reflection procs, thats not the issue with the spell.  It doesn't proc so often, but at least does.  The real issue is the one that Perano states: the spell procs, but doesn't reflect anything.  Since the combat changes, 30 secs is little time to reflect a spell, and since later changes, it doesn't reflect some habilities, and AoEs.  Most of the time you see that it proc'd and see that nice icon for 30 secs and then fades.</p><p>Thank you for the increase in the proc rate, but that doesn't fix the spell (wich is an ancient 52 spell and should be class defining).  Please, make it reflect.  There are tons of ideas in the troub issues post about this spell, and i think none of them is increasing the proc rate.  Lower the proc rate if you wish, but make it so it reflects the next spell, with no timer.  This way is harder to exploit as happened with the enchanter's line.  The randomness of the proc can't be used to reflect a charm, or anything that it is not intended to be reflected (possible, but highly unprobable).  Please, take a look at the toub issues post, there are great ideas there to make this spell usefull.  Please, listen to us, can't you see we are trying to help you??</p><p> </p></div><hr></blockquote><p>just means a forum mod..someone who is essentially useless for ingame changes (a sad fact) is doing their job in clearing out posts.</p><p> </p><p>sadly until we actually get dev/mod acknowledgment we will continue to be basically ignored each and every single update</p><p> </p>

[pera]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><p>I would have to agree with a post earlier that a nice change to Requiem of Reflection might be to absorb the next non-melee damage similar to the dirges ability.  Thought the idea of reflection is really cool, but if it makes RoR too powerful compared to the our counterpart's, because it does damage back to the mob, then maybe just absorption would be a way to go. Our counter parts ability is very well balanced with other classes, and their own abilities.  This is mainly due to the fact that all mobs melee, and in most cases for 5-9k dmg ever 2-5 seconds per hit.  This allows the dirges ability to take some of the ease off of the tank, but without giving them an advantage over other classes.Now the troubadors buff on the other hand is not very useful especial in raids, and for the most part not in groups or solo.  I know spells probably shouldn't be geared towards raiding, but they still should be effective at some cases during them.There are a few major factors that prevent this spell from being effect, this included the believed change that is on test.</p><ul><li>Too many non-melee abilities of a mob can not be reflected by this spell.</li><ul><li> I completely understand charms, mezzes, stuns, stifles, and insta-death abilities not being able to be reflected.  This became very evident with the exploit that was being used that allowed raids to charm/insta-kill mobs with an enchanters spell shield.   These abilities defiantly should be non-reflectable, but there should be no reason that X damage can not be reflected back on the mob. </li></ul><li>With the current way mobs cast the 30 second duration of the proc is much too small, the rarely against raid mobs will you see a non-melee ability that is reflecttable with the current system cast with in 30 seconds of previous ability.</li><ul><li>Maybe if the limitation on what can or can not be reflected was lifted to include all non-melee damage and aes (other than insta-death) the 30 second duration probably would be good.</li></ul><li>Aes can not be reflected</li><ul><li>I really don’t see the reason Ae non-melee damage can not be reflected.  Ae melee damage can be absorbed by the dirges spell.</li></ul><li>Usability in raids. With the position of the troubador in raids, not very often will this spell have a chance to be used because of the troubadors buff line normally puts them in dps groups.</li><ul><li>This could either be left the alone and still be just a group buff, but aes should be reflected (rarely will you get aes sooner than ever 30-45 seconds so it would be nice to have the proc duration increased.</li><li>Or the buff could be changed to a single target raid or group member.  Only one target and cost a con slot.  (the ability would be toggelable.)</li></ul><li>Reflection, possibly more powerful than it should be.</li><ul><li>If the problem is that the ability to reflect damage back to a mob is overpowering, with i can see it could be compared to the dirges ability just absorbs.  The spell could be changed to ward(absorb) X damage of the next non-melee damage.</li></ul><li>The spell degrades in effectiveness as we level</li><ul><li>It started out at about 85%ish chance to reflect now at 60 is 73%,  Basicly the spell degrades in effectiveness as we level.  Following this trend there will only be about a 50% chance to reflect a level 70 spell at adventure level 70.   Why should a spell become crappier as we level, is this a bug or intended.   It is a general consisce that the ability should not have a second % chance anyways, namel because our counterpart only has one % chance.  (yes i know i'm basing a lot of these suggestions of the dirges ability, but mainly thats because theirs works correctly and ours doesnt work hardly at all)</li></ul></ul><p>Maybe RoR could look something like this, upgrading the spell would increase % to proc and X amount of damage that can be reflected.  Since there would be a cap on the amount of damage that can be reflected the % to proc can be higher.15% chance to reflect(or ward against) the next the next non-melee damage (proc last for 30-45 seconds.)  if proc is active it can not be refreshed until the duration has expired or a non-melee damage is reflected, which ever comes first.   - Up to x dmg  x is based of int of troubador (probably in the range of 3000 to 5000) i say this because there is no limit on the damage that the dirges ability can absorb, so if there is a cap on ours it should be pretty high   - if non-melee damage does not mez, stun, stifle, charm, insta-death type.  (this shouldn’t even be needed anyways because all of these types to deal non-melee damage they are spells).These are just a few of many possible changes/fixes that could be made to Requiem of Reflection.  A few of these suggestions probably should be applied to the enchanters version of this spell, such as. ability to reflect all non-melee damage, including Ae, but not insta-death type damage, (if the spells only have the ability to reflect/absorb non-melee damage, all other types of spells can be excluded with out worrying about an expliot).  Maybe give the enchanters a bonuses and allowing theirs to absorb stun, stifle, mez, charm spell types, and it would just count as a resist.  Of course unresistable spells should not be able to be absorbed.I don’t expect this ability to be overpowered compared to the enchanters or dirge, but i would like to hope that the spell would be at least made useful in general game play like the dirges,  I could see this spell being "THE" class defining ability of a troubador, this and PoM is what we are.   The troubador is "A Shield of Rhythm, with a Blade of Notes."Hope these suggestions make it somewhere :-p.</p><p> </p><p>Message Edited by perano on <span class="date_text">01-17-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:48 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by perano on <span class="date_text">01-17-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:50 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by perano on <span class="date_text">01-17-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:57 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by perano on <span class="date_text">01-17-2006</span><span class="time_text">01:58 PM</span></p>

[WorldsAway_Nybor]

<div></div><div>I like your suggestions, they show that there are a lot of things that could be changed to make this spell workable! Absorbing rather than reflecting damage is something I'd be happy with for sure, would certainly make the troubadour more of a viable choice when selecting a a bard for a MT group. Outside of raiding it would be something worth using con for as well. :smileyhappy:</div><div> </div><div>If the reflection actually worked though that would be great also</div><p>Message Edited by WorldsAway_Nybor on <span class="date_text">01-17-2006</span><span class="time_text">02:50 PM</span></p>

[pera]

During our raid last night to get eyes in Silent city we killed Goliathan(sp) twice both time i happened to be in the MT gourp( woot one more for the troubs :-p).  During the encounter i was using Requiem of Reflection because i have been reading that goliathan is one of the few mobs that still hits with non-melee damage.  Well a short story made shorter  RoR proced about 8 times 6 on the tank 2 just because of the people were in range of his ae when it fired.   Not a single time was anything reflected, so unless i just got unlucky or RoR is now one more mob to being completely broken.   All 6 procs on the tank timed out.  We only had 2 and 1/2 groups so it took a bit longer to kill him than normal.([Removed for Content] dps'ers :-p).I really hope the devs understand the problem with this abiliy is in no way the amount of times it triggers(procs).  Let me repeat that,  THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE AMOUNT OF TIMES IT PROCS.  The only problem with this ability is that when it does proc it doesnt do a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] thing.  It will just sit there for 30 second duration and time out. I gave up using this while solo or grouped because in all of the encounters its better to use avoidance and/or hpregen because they will provide a better result than this spell.  why you may ask, well all mobs melee so that 5% of the time that a mob is actualy casting is nothing compaired to the beating the group or you solo is taking.  When i do use this in groups or solo, extreamly rare unless i just want to test it out hoping a ninja change was put in, maybe 1 spell is reflected ever 2-3 fights. depending on type of mob.  That spell that does get reflected 99.9% of the time is a dot for 50-150 damage.  In no way does that warent using a con slot on this ability when avoidance increases the groups avoidance by 7-9% and will be avoiding melee damage of 300 - 600 a lot more often.Even with the change to how often RoR will trigger that only increases RoRs chances of reflecting to 10% instead of 8%, and that is bases on the assumtion that all non-melee damage spells can be reflected which is completely false.  Depening onthe type of mob and encounter(solo/group/raid)  the amount of abilites that can NOT be reflected and how often they are used are 95%(raid) - 10%(solo) (solo and group most abilites can be reflected unless your fighting beast or non-class bases mobs because NONE of their abilites can be reflected.Also, i know this is starting to rant a bit but this part really needs to be said.  What is up with the spell degrading as the troubador progresses in level.  When we got this spell at level 52 there was i believe about a 85% chance to reflect a even level mob's spell.   Now at level 60 that % chance to reflect has gone all the way down to 73% chance to reflect. By the time we hit 70, unless this spell is upgraded, our % chance to reflect is going to be [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] near 50% on a even level mob.   I personaly do not know any classes that have abilites that get worse as you level up shouldnt the % chance to reflect stay the same reguardless what our level is for an even con mob!!!!!<div></div>

[Sanju]

I -think- the "reasoning" behind the spell seemingly degrading as you level is that it's based on the spell leve, not the troubador's level. RoR is a level 52 spell, and has an 85% chance to reflect a level 52 spell. At level 60, it still has an 85% chance to reflect a level 52 spell, but a lower chance to reflect a level 60 spell.Regardless, the spell is completely worthless. If everything else remained the same, but they removed the concentration requirement, I still wouldn't bother casting it -- ever.<div></div>

[Spo]

<div></div><div>As mentioned above, the problem with this spell is not the proc rate, it's the ability to actually do what its supposed to do, reflect. I have seen it proc like crazy on multiple group members at the same time only to sit there and watch it time out on every one of them every single time. It doesn't matter what group I'm in, caster, MT, whatever,  it always does the same thing -- time out, time out, and time out. The devs REALLY need to look into this. Increasing the proc rate is useless, it will just make for more icons in my " Maintained " for me to annoyingly watch time out. </div>

[VericSauvari]

<span><blockquote><hr>Spoe1 wrote:<div></div><div>As mentioned above, the problem with this spell is not the proc rate, it's the ability to actually do what its supposed to do, reflect. I have seen it proc like crazy on multiple group members at the same time only to sit there and watch it time out on every one of them every single time. It doesn't matter what group I'm in, caster, MT, whatever,  it always does the same thing -- time out, time out, and time out. The devs REALLY need to look into this. Increasing the proc rate is useless, it will just make for more icons in my " Maintained " for me to annoyingly watch time out. </div><hr></blockquote>well one misconception is we (the troubador) never see solid proof of the reflect working...however if you have ever had it go off you will notice the reflect only shows for the reflector..not the troubadorie. i had static pulse set off RoR on the main tank, on the next pulse the tank noticed it in his maintained spells window while i saw nothing.. so we have no idea unless you look at the logs after or the tank notices (or i have my graphics down way too low)</span><div></div>

[Spo]

<div></div>Well correct me if I'm wrong but, as soon as RoR procs, we get an icon in our <maintained> bar saying who in our group the proc is on at that moment. The icon then goes on a timer. If they actually do in fact reflect the spell , you can see the word <reflected> as you would see <resisted> or <immune> above the mob, and then the icon disappears. If the icon just counts down to 0 and disappears, nothing was reflected.

[VericSauvari]

every time i have had it reflect i have not seen a -reflect- ...also the 'proc' for the reflect for me stays in my maintained window<div></div>

[Rampagious]

The times that I have actaully had it reflect, it does infact show reflect above tanks head like SS BP used to show, only time that I did use this was really when LnD autoed with disease and Goliathan with cold and it would reflect auto attack <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[pera]

Lol wonder why i never saw that before !?!?! *scraches his head* I've got it, it doesnt reflect!<div></div>

[Bartimaeus]

<div>So. . This age old debate. A few ideas how to make this work a little more effectively.</div><div> </div><p>Make it so that the reflect chance is a STRAIGHT reflect. Meaning: 12% chance to reflect all non-melee damage spells. It would still proc the same amount of times, but it would actually reflect something when it does proc, rather than having a buff up waiting for something to hit it so it can reflect.</p><p>Increase the timer on the procced-reflect buff to either 1 minute, or indefinite amount of time until one reflect proc occurs.</p><p>Allow multiple procs within the timer (This is not a very desirable change, but still would in theory be better)</p><p>Allow the damage of aoes to be reflected (They changed this, I think, because if you reflected a True AoE you would pull an entire zone, recalling a scrap with Borxx) But by allowing the damage only to be reflected back to the mob, that would not have this problem.</p><p> </p><p>Will add more when I think of them, Ive had a few other ideas before</p>

[Ballads]

<div><span><blockquote><hr><p>Allow the damage of aoes to be reflected (They changed this, I think, because if you reflected a True AoE you would pull an entire zone, recalling a scrap with Borxx) But by allowing the damage only to be reflected back to the mob, that would not have this problem.</p><p> </p><p>Will add more when I think of them, Ive had a few other ideas before</p><hr></blockquote>Haha had this happen one time on venekor with the old ss bp was funny as hell !! Well it was to me the raid leader didnt find it to funny .</span></div>

[pera]

It was funny to seet his happen with vox in perma.  Yeah the best fix for these abilites to still work instead of reflecting the actual spell just do damage back to the mob of equal damage taht was received and negate the damage recieved by the pc.<div></div>

[Spo]

<div></div>The biggest problem of all, as far as I have read is that there are very few, if any, high level Troubadours on test at the moment. I can't imagine how the devs are getting input from our class. Do the devs even look at these forums?? Heh, do they even care?? Just chalk it up as another one of the countless still to be fixed T6 bugs that we are gonna have to live with for the next few weeks when KoS, and it's own set of bugs is launched and the SoE money making train continues to pwn all.

[pera]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><p>I really hope the dev's do understand the actual problem with this spell is not the fact that the proc triggers its the fact that once it is triggered rarely if ever will something be reflected.  In this spells current state honestly its no better than a fluff spell.  That may sound harsh but in usability its very true.Here is a small list, and I’ll empisize small, of problems with Requiem of Reflection.</p><ol><li>Non humanoid mobs (both group and solo) that have special abilities, none of these abilities can be reflected.</li><li>No Ae Attacks can be reflected.  Well i understand that problem that caused this to be turned off because the AE its self would be reflected and had a good chance to hit everything in the zone.  The fix was to just blindly turn off AEs from reflecting.  Which this is a completely wrong way to fix this.</li><li>The 30 second timer along with the chance to reflect creates a situation where your actual finally chance to reflect is 1-2%.  In most cases your chance to reflect is 0% because of the type of spells most mobs cast.</li><li>Once the proc has triggered there is a % chance to reflect the next non-melee damage spell.  Because this spell is a level 52 spell the % chance to reflect degrades as you level it started at 85% when we received this spell.  Now at 60 this chance to reflect has degraded down to 73%.  If this spell is not upgraded by the time we hit 70 its chance to reflect will be close to 55%.  Therefore making this spell even more useless.</li></ol><p>For over 3 months now and even in DoF beta people have been reporting bugs on this spell in numerous threads and bug reports.   Especially if you do not see a but anywhere in here at least fix the spell degrading as the Troubador increases in level, Or better yet removed the second chance to reflect and make it work like the dirges.Please do something, I appreciate the fact that you did at least make a effort to at least do something to this spell, but the chance that is currently on test of LU19 will not effect the actual bug with this spell.  There have been many possible solutions to fix this ability.  Please do something, either remove this spell complete and give us some another ability, or fix it.   This is just a slap in the face to all troubador’s by not fixing this ability.Requests -   Remove the 30 second time out on the triggered proc.   Remove the chance to reflect   Allow all spell damage to be reflected. - this really is not that hard. see below for example   If it makes the spell too powerful by reflecting spell damage remove the reflection and just have it absorb spell  damage that is not resisted.Example on one possible fix to how Requiem of Reflection(RoR) could work.// this unit would have to be used every time non-melee damage is received by a PC that has Requiem of Reflection on them.  Therefore this would include both normal non-melee damage spell casts and dots.   This is just a possible suggestion PDL on a fix that I’m sure would make a lot of people happier, to have this ability fixed.-Spell cast by MOB.-if Spell is not resisted by PC AND Requiem of Reflection (Troubador group buff version) is on pc.  - if Requiem of Reflection proc has not triggered      - random % chance to proc       - if (random % chance to proc == TRUE)             - Trigger Requiem of Reflection on PC        - else             // do nothing.  - else if Requiem of Reflection proc is on PC    - If spell ( NOT(instant-death) AND (does non-melee damage) )         - Make PC cast Reflection on Mob            - Reflection does [mob's non-melee spell damage] to MOB                // Only reflects the damage from the Mob's spell.</p><p><span>          </span>- Remove Requiem of Reflection proc from PC     - else        // do nothing- else  // do nothing</p><p> </p><p><b>We really need to get more of a voice about this ability so maybe we can get if fixed</b>.<span>  </span>It has been over 3 month since we received this spell.<span>  </span>And I’m sorry but I am not counting what was put into live update # 19 as a fix, because it does not address in anyway the problem with the spell.<span>  </span>This spell really needs to be looked into. Please!</p><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p>Message Edited by perano on <span class="date_text">01-24-2006</span><span class="time_text">09:55 AM</span></p>

[WorldsAway_Nybor]

<div></div><p>I think we do need more of a voice on this issue, because it's so disappointing to see this spell wasted.</p><p>However, I think you have already summarized perectly what is wrong here Perano, and offered a wealth of good suggestions. I'm not sure what else to say except</p><p>/agree Perano</p><p>:smileywink:</p><p> </p>

[Cygnu]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><p>Just as another idea, perhaps the % value decreases as we level because as we level our INT cap is increased and unless we increase our INT as well, we get further and further from the cap value, making our spells less effective?</p><p>I know this is an issue with most casters and the DEVs are aware of it. I remember a quote from Morgard about it, let me see if I can dig it out.....</p><p> </p><p>[Editted to add link and more info]</p><p> </p><p>Well there is a thread about the problem with INT <a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=spells&message.id=3246&view=by_date_ascending&page=1" target="_blank"><font color="#ffff00">here</font></a><font color="#ffff00">.</font></p><p>A snippet from the thread:</p><p> </p><p><font size="2" color="#ffff00"><em>For those that don't play a mage, the problem is as such:</em></font></p><p><font size="2" color="#ffff00"><em>As you level up, the int cap increases. If you don't reach the int cap, your spells don't do maximum damage. So, if you are at level 50 and have 370 int (50 x 7 + 20 = 370 cap) and a given spell hits for 1000 damage, then you level to 55 and still have 370 int you are now below the cap (55 x 7 + 20 = 405 cap) and your spell may hit for 950. Basically, if you don't keep upgrading your gear to gain 5 int every time you level, your spell damage is going to go down (excluding new spells).</em></font></p><p><font size="2" color="#ffff00"><em>I'd assume the same problem exists for melee classes trying to max out their CA damage, but not having capped strength</em></font></p><p><em><font size="2" color="#ffff00"></font></em> </p><p> </p><p>Message Edited by CygnusX on <span class="date_text">01-26-2006</span><span class="time_text">08:49 AM</span></p>

[pera]

It is possible that the % of spell vrs even level mobs is in a way attributed to the massive bug of stat caps not working correclty as you scale up in levels.  I'm not sure its directly tied to the same problem becuase he % to reflect is un effected by any stat, (int ext.)But i personaly think its a direct bug related to how spells no longer scale with level after LU13.  That would directly effect the % to reflection of this spell to not change as we level up.Therfor when the spell was origanly created its % to reflect was scaled against what level of mob's spell was hitting the pc.  With this thinking in mind it looks like there was no thought into the player leveling and the spell progressing allong with the player.  Basicly reguardless of level the % to reflect was static scale based on the mobs level, and completely unreferanced to the player's.i.e.@ lvl 52 85% chance to reflect, @ 60 73% chance to reflectthis is assuming that the proc has already triggered.lvl 50 mob cast spell on a lvl 52 pc, the % chance to reflect is ~88%lvl 52 mob cast spell on a lvl 52 pc, the % chance to reflect is   85%lvl 55 mob cast spell on a lvl 52 pc, the % chance to reflect is ~80%lvl 60 mob cast spell on a lvl 52 pc, the % chance to reflect is   73%lvl 65 mob cast spell on a lvl 52 pc, the % chance to reflect is ~65%Samething goes for a lvl 60 person.lvl 50 mob cast spell on a lvl 60 pc, the % chance to reflect is ~88%lvl 52 mob cast spell on a lvl 60 pc, the % chance to reflect is   85%lvl 55 mob cast spell on a lvl 60 pc, the % chance to reflect is ~80%lvl 60 mob cast spell on a lvl 60 pc, the % chance to reflect is   73%lvl 65 mob cast spell on a lvl 60 pc, the % chance to reflect is ~65%Against a level 70 or above mob, (assuming this spell does not get upgraded) the % chance to reflect will be ~60% - 50% depending on the slop of the scale.Bear in mind with me here all spell cast level % except for 52 and 60 are estimants.<img src="http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/7718/chancetoreflectror0cb.jpg">lol yesh i know its a [Removed for Content] graph :-p<div></div>

[ForgottenFoundling]

<div></div>I actually reflected something back at the loremaster last night in Gates. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I don't know what it was or the effect (was lame most likely), but the spell actually worked for once.  Don't ask what I was doing in the MT group or why I was using the spell... lol