Newbie Brigand looking for thoughts/experiences on the stamina/tanking line

[Bladewind]

<DIV>Hello everyone,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I recently started up a brigand and am having a blast with him so far.  I'm looking for input on the stamina line of AAs as I think it migh tbe fun to play a finesse tank.  I'd like your thoughts or experiences on two things specifically:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1)How well have the skills in the stamina line helped you to tank?  Has this also translated to more efficient soloing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2)If you took stamina, what did you pair it with?  I am perosnally looking at stamina/wisdom, or stamina 4444 wis, 44 str.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks for your input!</DIV>

[Jida]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Bladewind wrote:<div>Hello everyone,</div><div> </div><div>I recently started up a brigand and am having a blast with him so far.  I'm looking for input on the stamina line of AAs as I think it migh tbe fun to play a finesse tank.  I'd like your thoughts or experiences on two things specifically:</div><div> </div><div>1)How well have the skills in the stamina line helped you to tank?  Has this also translated to more efficient soloing?</div><div> </div><div>2)If you took stamina, what did you pair it with?  I am perosnally looking at stamina/wisdom, or stamina 4444 wis, 44 str.</div><div> </div><div>Thanks for your input!</div><hr></blockquote>Take this with a grain of salt <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />I think if your soloing.. WIS/STR would be a better combo than STR/STA.My reasoning is, wisdom's end ability gives something like +17 defense at 70. (and to all offensive skills, therefore this is better than using a sheild).Also the 3rd teir STR ability gives +defense. This is a deadly combo.What this equates to is more avoidance.You would be in essence be monkish and avoid most attacks. I personally get most of my MIT from gear/selfbuffs (if it isnt higher mit/resists than i have .. i ignore the loot).I effectivly tanked den at 67 with 1 healer with this setup.However, I had to change my lineup due to raids (had to take TS at the end of str line).Here is my toon's aa lineup <a target="_blank" href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer_achievements.vm?characterId=391941203">http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer_achievements.vm?characterId=391941203</a>I hope that helpes.</div>

[noetici]

<DIV>I tried the sta line, since more often than not  I love to tank. The taunt was pretty cute, but... well.... I don't exactly have a need for it. I can easily hold aggro with no problem at all. I think the only thing that's ever stolen aggro from me was a necro's pet, which happened once because I was being lazy. I stole it back, np.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The sta line DID help with getting my health up there, had 8k HP in a pretty non-buff-filled group. That can be gained with sta equipment of course, however, without wasting the AA's.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Overall I found the sta just enhanced things I didn't need enhanced because they worked fine prior.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>~Balance, 70 Brigand, Crushbone</DIV>

[Bladewind]

<P>Thanks for the great info.  If anyone has time or could point me to a resource, I'd be curious what bonuses a lvl 70 brig gets from rank 4 in the parry/riposte skills in wisdom, rank 4 in the defense skill in str, and the bonuses in the end line skill in sta?</P> <P>I'm basically looking to make a finesse tank similar to my monk, but different enough to keep things interesting <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I was hoping this would be possible, and your responses seem to indicate that it is.</P>

[Jida]

I dont believe the STA and Wisdom line stack.Wisdom require freehand empty.STR requires a sheild =<div></div>

[Malad]

<P>I went down the Stamina line for sometime as I duo with a templar a lot.</P> <P>Here are my observations.</P> <P>If fighting things that come in groups the taunt starts to shine.  I compared my brigand taunts to my paladin taunts and believe it or not the brigand taunts stack up well.  If you add in Formation the final STA ability your hate generation is really on par with a tank that has only adept 1 or so taunts.</P> <P>The extra health, using a shield, fighting in defensive, using a nice 1h, with the DPS bonus from the AAs worked out well for me when solo.  I went out of my way to get master in defensive stance but I would often compare myself to other random tanks and I would often to find my self to compare in my mind well.  Generally my mitigation and health was a bit lower but my avoidance was higher.</P> <P>If you fight creatures that come in singles you can tank just as well without the STA AA for most part.  You have a bit less health but you can hold aggro well for most part.  Using a shield/defensive does help you tank in the damage you take, and my templar friend notices the difference too, so having the STA line is icing if you plan on fighting that way.</P> <P>I thought about pairing wisdom and stamina also because Coule and Formation do stack which would be nice but nothing else in the line stacks.  That is a lot of wasted points.</P> <P>I think either the Agil or the Str line is the best option.   Int and Wisdom do not pair as well with Sta.</P> <P>In my case though I found it was too niche to continue using.  Even though you can tank say Halls of Fate as an uber Brigand nobody really wants a Brigand as a tank unless it is friends/guildies and you are suck without a tank type.  This left me with only using my tanking skills not enough to make the investment worth it.</P> <P>So if you find yourself in a group of friends a lot and have no true tank and want to fight multiple mob pulls STA line really does shine.</P> <P> </P> <P>--edit--</P> <P>Wanted to add one other thing.  It someways you do not give up a lot of damage over dual wield.  Since most of our damage comes from combat arts, this really shows in short fights, using a single weapon over dual wield does it make a large difference in damage.  Where it starts to show though, at least for me, was as I got higher and often got into longer fights where weapon damage made a larger portion of my dps.  Also I noted in an earlier post that at level 65 I will have 2 weapons to dual wield that add up to about 100dr and the best 1h I have found with the DPS AA bonus added in placed me about 80dr.  This large disparrity in dr only started to show for me though in my 60s.</P><p>Message Edited by Maladen on <span class=date_text>05-31-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:25 PM</span>

[Bladewind]

<P>More great information.  My duoing partner is an inquisitor, so I am guessing my play experience will be very similar to yours.  I love the last skill in the stamina line, but I also love the idea of playing a complete finesse fighter.  Right now, the decision for me seems to be if dumping half of my points into sta is worth it just to get that last box to use along with the wisdom/finesse line.  Luckily, the charatcer is a baby at lvl 10 still, so I have plenty of time to figure it all out.  My main is  amonk, so I know full well about tank stigmas and am wondering if it is worth it to try to fight that battle all over again with people.  Since brigs are classified as rogues, it will be even tougher than before <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Where I am at now is that I love the end-line boxes for both sta and wisdom, and I am trying to hazard out if taking both lines will be worth it given that none of the other boxes are complimentary.</P> <P>Thanks again everyone for the informative testimonials and insights.</P>

[Malad]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Bladewind wrote:<BR> <P>More great information.  My duoing partner is an inquisitor, so I am guessing my play experience will be very similar to yours.  I love the last skill in the stamina line, but I also love the idea of playing a complete finesse fighter.  Right now, the decision for me seems to be if dumping half of my points into sta is worth it just to get that last box to use along with the wisdom/finesse line.  Luckily, the charatcer is a baby at lvl 10 still, so I have plenty of time to figure it all out.  My main is  amonk, so I know full well about tank stigmas and am wondering if it is worth it to try to fight that battle all over again with people.  Since brigs are classified as rogues, it will be even tougher than before <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Where I am at now is that I love the end-line boxes for both sta and wisdom, and I am trying to hazard out if taking both lines will be worth it given that none of the other boxes are complimentary.</P> <P>Thanks again everyone for the informative testimonials and insights.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Want to point out since your partner is an Inquisitor the dps bonus he gives from buffs may make your dps bonus from the AA line not as important or even wasted if you get to the cap.  I do not fight with iquisitors much but I do know they buff dps just not sure to what amount.</P> <P>You can always do what I did and go down stamina and see how you like it.  I found it worked nice for me for a bit but as I got closer to raiding level I then changed to Strength.</P>

[Damari]

I tank fine without the sta line.  Just focus on your mitigation and tanking becomes a breeze.

[Malad]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Damari wrote:<BR> I tank fine without the sta line.  Just focus on your mitigation and tanking becomes a breeze.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>This is true with low number of creatures in a fight but what happens when you are in a fight with say a 5 man group?  Or even worse you get several different groups?</P> <P>The fact is that while we can handle being beat on just fine we do not have the best tools for holding aggro against multiple creature encounters or multiple encounters.</P> <P>The stamina line give you those tools with Swear and then finally Formation.  The fact that you have more mitigation, more avoidance, more block, more health, and will do more damage while wielding a shiled then another brigand without these AA is just icing on the cake .</P> <P>It still can be done without Stamina line but having one true aoe, one encounter wide snare, one taunt, and the mery line can make it difficult against high number of mobs.</P> <P>If you really want to tank and you are going to do it a lot and do not have a true tank in your group I recommend this line.  This line is all about holding aggro with multiple creatures and it makes that work like a charm.</P>

[Owwiee]

<P>Well here is my Take.</P> <P>i play on Venekor (pvp)  I started with the Agi line thinking walk the plank sounded cool but it had no real use in PvP.  Since it's all about survivability I respecd to Stam.  I have mostly crap equipement since the good stuff isn't redily avaliable and I am kind just trying to get through T6 and save my coin for true upgrades in T7.  I love the Stam line  The extra AOE taunt is a good send for PvE groups and I am currently saving up points for the end ability.  I am primary tank for our guild (were pretty small) and haven't found much that gives me a problem.  I have yet to tank high lvl ^^^ mobs yet though.  My guild is all lover lvl than me so If I am tanking 10 ^^ blues they are getting great exp and I can manage them quit well</P>

[Bladewind]

<P>It seems like taking stamina almost turns you into a monk with a sword <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>I'm going to try it just out of curiosity alone, but I really think I will enjoy it from what I have heard.  I love the style of a finesse swordsman and I also enjoy tanking, so it looks like a rogue with the proper AA lines selected will make that combo a reality for me.  As a monk, I know all about being gimped on area taunts.  We only have one and only one aoe attack as well (until the high 60s when we get a second on a long timer).  Monks proc hate by hitting things, which is great for single targets but keeps multi target encounters challenging for holding aggro.  I think the brigand with the full stamina line actually would have an advantage there (grumble from the monk in me) with the 'defensive hate proc' rolled into the end line skill.  I believe guardians proc hate by being hit like that as well.</P> <P>All in all, it sounds very simlar to monk tanking, but with the aesthetic of a finesse swordsman that I love.</P> <P>Thanks again for continuing to contribute, everyone <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I hadn't perused these boards prior to making my brig, and I am starting to feel like I was missing out on a great community to interact with.</P><p>Message Edited by Bladewind on <span class=date_text>06-02-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:20 PM</span>