Skills that share timers

[Sinadi]

Closing in on 48 and then on to 50, so decided to make a list of our combat arts so people know which arts share timers. Hopefully this will be of some help when trying to decide which arts to get adept 3 of, etc. Let me know if you notice any errors and I'll edit in fixes. I haven't checked all our different self-only stealths to see which share timers but in general you want to use the highest level stealth you have anyway. A (T) means the art is received through the new Training skills.If an art is not listed, it has a unique timer.Dirty Tricks -- Knockaround -- Mug -- Locke's Ruthless Mugging(T) -- WrangleEvade -- Fiddy's Handy Distraction(T)Ensnare -- Tie Up -- SnagBackstab -- Elisi's Wounding Gash(T) -- Hidden Shiv -- Craven DelightGouge -- Locke's Kick(T) -- Vicious StabSmuggle -- Burgle -- Stealthy BurglaryQuick Flurry -- Vicious Flurry -- Aggravated Assault -- Elisi's Aggressive Stabs(T)Street Smarts -- Rough Skin -- AegisRash Advance -- Risky Advance -- Daring AdvanceCircular Strike -- Restitution -- Forceful NegotiationsBludgeon -- Disarming Thrust -- Concealed BladeStrangling Shot -- Maddening ShotDistracting Blade -- Bum Rush -- GambitRake -- Vicious Rake -- Murderous RakeTangling Strike -- Bushwhack -- Run ThroughBlackjack -- Sap -- SubdueCuss -- UpbraidBeg for Mercy -- Plead for MercySnarl -- TangleVicious Stab -- WaylayLow Blow -- Dirty BlowCraven Walk -- Lurk (shares timer with Snoop)Shank -- ShivLie Low -- Shadow SlipHamstring -- Disable <p>Message Edited by Sinadial on <span class=date_text>01-14-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:32 PM</span><p>Message Edited by Sinadial on <span class=date_text>01-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:02 AM</span><p>Message Edited by Sinadial on <span class=date_text>01-26-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:11 PM</span>

[ag]

You rock, Sinadial!Thank you VERY much.

[Mideo]

<DIV>I'm assuming that the evade style training skill also shares a timer with evade.  I'll test just to be sure.</DIV>

[Justin Sa]

<DIV>Am I the only that thinks that Sneak Attack should be added to the "Distracting Blade -- Bum Rush -- Gambit" chain, but that it's broken?</DIV>

[Grunar]

<DIV>I believe that </DIV> <DIV>Hanns's Quick Stab - An advanced form of Quick Strike. As a bonus to Quick Strike it costs no power. </DIV> <DIV>is currently on the same timer as Bludgeon......   I would have thought it was supposed to be the same timer as Quick Strike.</DIV>

[Gyilok]

<DIV>little correction: knave and fancy footwork have a different timer</DIV> <DIV>nice list btw</DIV>

[Dtrick]

<DIV>Some more that are replaced from our teens:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bludgeon -- Disarming Thrust</DIV> <DIV>Gouge -- Locke's Kick (T) -- Vicious Stab (better than Locke's kick)</DIV> <DIV>Ambush -- Tangling Strike</DIV>

[Sinadi]

I'm still here. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Thanks for all the added info.--Looks like I missed that Gouge -- Vicious Stab are on same timer. I'll double check tonight in game and correct the info in my original post. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> My testing was pretty unscientific and consisted of me hitting an art from my hotbar and then frantically paging through the combat arts on my knowledge page to check if any had blacked out, so I knew I was bound to get some errors!--Mideon if you could confirm that the Evade training skill and our regular evade skill share the same timer that'd be fantastic. Let me know the correct name of the training art too please.--Grunarch if you could test and confirm that Hann's Quick Stab shares a timer with Bludgeon I'll update. Does sound kind of like a bug to me, that's my next project but probably will wait till I'm 50.--Stizeyo, updated Fancy Footwork. I vaguely remember something odd happening with some of the buff timers, thanks for the correction.--Dtrick, will double check that combo and fix it. thanks again guys, and I hate to sound like I don't believe y'all, but if I'm going to put my name on something I want to make sure it's as correct as possible. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Mideo]

<DIV>Sorry, woulda had the info way sooner but I haven't logged in for awhile now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The skill is called Fiddy's Handy Distraction and when you use it Evade does get greyed out, but Fiddy's Handy Distraction only has a 20 second reuse timer as opposed to Evade's 30 seconds.</DIV>

[DSArmagedd]

I wanted to give you some help and increase the helpfullness of this thread, so don't mind my edits <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Dirty Tricks(<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> -- Knockaround(22) -- Mug(36) -- Locke's Ruthless Mugging(T)(40?) -- Wrangle(50)Evade(4) -- Fiddy's Handy Distraction(T)(10)Ensnare(9) -- Tie Up(23) -- Snag(37)Backstab(10) -- Elisi's Wounding Gash(T)(20?) -- Hidden Shiv(24) -- Craven Delight(3<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Gouge(15) -- Locke's Kick(T)(20) -- Vicious Stab(29)Smuggle(11) -- Burgle(25) -- Stealthy Burglary(39)Quick Flurry(12) -- Vicious Flurry(26) -- Aggravated Assault(??) -- Elisi's Aggressive Stabs(T)(??)Street Smarts(13) -- Rough Skin(27) -- Aegis(41)Rash Advance(13) -- Forgot the name(T)(20) -- Risky Advance(27) -- Daring Advance(41)Circular Strike(14) -- Forgot the name(T)(20) -- Restitution(2<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> -- Forceful Negotiations(42)Hann's Quick Strike (T)(10)(bug) -- Bludgeon(15) -- Disarming Thrust(29) -- Concealed Blade(43)Strangling Shot(16) -- Maddening Shot(30)Distracting Blade(19) -- Bum Rush(33) -- Gambit(47)Rake(20) -- Vicious Rake(34) -- Murderous Rake(4<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Ambush(7) -- Tangling Strike(21) -- Bushwhack(35) -- Run Through(49)Blackjack(22) -- Sap(36) -- Subdue(50)Cuss(24) -- Upbraid(3<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Beg for Mercy(26) -- Plead for Mercy(40) Snarl(2<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> -- Tangle(42)Vicious Stab(29) -- Waylay(43)Low Blow(30) -- Dirty Blow(44)Snoop(17) -- Craven Walk(31) -- Lurk(45) (Sneak is NOT on this timer)Shank(32) -- Shiv(46)Lie Low(33) -- Shadow Slip(47)Hamstring(??) -- Disable(50)A few skills that appear to be on their own timer:Quick Strike(1) (Due to a bug, should be with Hann's)Sneak Attack(5)Cheap Shot(6)Fancy Footwork(1<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> -- Knave???(32)Ruse(21)I added levels to the list so you can know if the upgrade you are about to buy is worth the gold, or if you are going to replace the skill soon.If anyone could help us out with any corrections we'd greatly appriciate it.

[Kende]

<DIV>So, at 50th (or close), which of the lower level arts (that don't have an upgrade) do you still use?  I imagine most after 35-40(?) are still used, but what about the low ones?  And your reasoning please.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Still use at 50th?</DIV> <UL> <LI>Quick Strike (1) (bugged seperate timer? still use it anyway?)</LI> <LI>Evade (4) (more than likely)</LI> <LI>Sneak Attack (5) (does damage scale up enough to be useful?)</LI> <LI>Cheap Shot (6)  (why isn't Blackjack and up an upgrade for this? and is it still used?)</LI> <LI>Fancy Footwork (1<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></LI> <LI>Ruse (21) (if not at 50, when does it become trashed?)</LI> <LI>Vicious Stab (29) (no higher upgrade?)</LI> <LI>Maddening Shot (30) (highest ranged, so probably)</LI> <LI>Snag (37) (why use instead of group snare?)</LI> <LI>Craven Delight (3<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> (highest backstab? so I'm guessing yes)</LI> <LI>I imagine everything from here up is still useful at 50th?</LI></UL> <P>Any lower ones I missed still used?</P> <P>Thanks for your input.</P> <P>Kend, 24 Brigand, Black Talons, Najena server</P>

[Grunar]

<DIV>Yep, Hanns's Quick strike is on same timer as Bludgeon.  Probably should be same timer as Quick Strike instead.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRIKE>Also, even though Street Smarts and Rough Skin are on the same timers, their duration is much longer than the recast.  And they stack.</STRIKE></DIV><p>Message Edited by Grunarch on <span class=date_text>02-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:00 PM</span>

[Ratt]

<blockquote><hr>Grunarch wrote:<DIV>Yep, Hanns's Quick strike is on same timer as Bludgeon. Probably should be same timer as Quick Strike instead.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Also, even though Street Smarts and Rough Skin are on the same timers, their duration is much longer than the recast. And they stack.</DIV><hr></blockquote>Handy little [FaarNerfed!]-bit there while it last's <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Thanks mate!

[Zagur]

<DIV>I do not think Steet Smarts and Rough Skin stack. If I remember correctly you can cast them and have both skills show up in your buff list, but only the first one cast takes effect. I confirmed this (if I remember correctly) by watching the impact on my Strength and Agility. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also I believe no one mentioned Escape, which as far as I know is never replaced.</DIV>

[DSArmagedd]

<blockquote><hr>Zagurim wrote:<DIV>I do not think Steet Smarts and Rough Skin stack. If I remember correctly you can cast them and have both skills show up in your buff list, but only the first one cast takes effect. I confirmed this (if I remember correctly) by watching the impact on my Strength and Agility. </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>Also I believe no one mentioned Escape, which as far as I know is never replaced.</DIV><hr></blockquote>Escape, Pathfinding, and tracking were not included as there are no upgrades for these skills. If you buy a player made upgrade, you have done nothing other than (potentially) increase your casting cost.But speaking of tracking upgrades.... Has anyone taking a tracking racial trait? I'm begining to wonder if that would A) increase tracking range or B) allow players to track red cons.Anyone know?

[Sinadi]

Thanks DS, those were good edits. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Regarding skills used at 50, some of that will depend on what upgrades you have. In my case, I still use Hidden Shiv over Craven Delight because my Master I Hidden Shiv outdamages app2 Craven Delight. (Haven't found higher upgrade yet <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ) Same thing with Bum Rush. I don't have Quick Strike on my hotbar anymore since the damage it does is pretty sad now but it'd definately be useful as a non-positional art to complete your HO while soloing. From what I remember, Sneak Attack doesn't really scale up enough to be worthwhile. Still use Cheap Shot. Ruse is still your most damaging 1-hit skill at 50, and it gets even nicer when you can pair it with Debilitate.Range attack is Blunted Arrows at 44, I need to double check the timers since I rarely use those skills. Accidental omission on my part, sorry.As for snares, I so rarely use them. I keep both the encounter snare and single target on my bar though-the encounter snare came in very handy when doing the Feerrott jboots run back when it wasn't grey and there was no one to group with to grey the zone out. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Without an icon on screen though, it's hard to know what the difference is in duration-I *think* the group snare leaves the icon but the single target does not.

[b3taha]

<blockquote><hr>Sinadial wrote:Closing in on 48 and then on to 50, so decided to make a list of our combat arts so people know which arts share timers. Hopefully this will be of some help when trying to decide which arts to get adept 3 of, etc. Let me know if you notice any errors and I'll edit in fixes. I haven't checked all our different self-only stealths to see which share timers but in general you want to use the highest level stealth you have anyway. A (T) means the art is received through the new Training skills.If an art is not listed, it has a unique timer.Dirty Tricks -- Knockaround -- Mug -- Locke's Ruthless Mugging(T) -- WrangleEvade -- Fiddy's Handy Distraction(T)Ensnare -- Tie Up -- SnagBackstab -- Elisi's Wounding Gash(T) -- Hidden Shiv -- Craven DelightGouge -- Locke's Kick(T) -- Vicious StabSmuggle -- Burgle -- Stealthy BurglaryQuick Flurry -- Vicious Flurry -- Aggravated Assault -- Elisi's Aggressive Stabs(T)Street Smarts -- Rough Skin -- AegisRash Advance -- Risky Advance -- Daring AdvanceCircular Strike -- Restitution -- Forceful NegotiationsBludgeon -- Disarming Thrust -- Concealed BladeStrangling Shot -- Maddening ShotDistracting Blade -- Bum Rush -- GambitRake -- Vicious Rake -- Murderous RakeTangling Strike -- Bushwhack -- Run ThroughBlackjack -- Sap -- SubdueCuss -- UpbraidBeg for Mercy -- Plead for MercySnarl -- TangleVicious Stab -- WaylayLow Blow -- Dirty BlowCraven Walk -- Lurk (shares timer with Snoop)Shank -- ShivLie Low -- Shadow SlipHamstring -- Disable <p>Message Edited by Sinadial on <span class=date_text>01-14-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:32 PM</span><p>Message Edited by Sinadial on <span class=date_text>01-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:02 AM</span><p>Message Edited by Sinadial on <span class=date_text>01-26-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:11 PM</span><hr></blockquote>Great post, desirves a sticky ^_^Here you go! Up and away! ^^^^^

[WhiteFr]

<DIV>A great addition to your list could be the level we get it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ex:</DIV> <DIV>Gouge(14 or so) -- Locke's Kick(20 T) -- Vicious Stab(29)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Beside that it's very cool. Thanks</DIV>

[Dtrick]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> WhiteFrog wrote:<BR> <DIV>A great addition to your list could be the level we get it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ex:</DIV> <DIV>Gouge(14 or so) -- Locke's Kick(20 T) -- Vicious Stab(29)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Beside that it's very cool. Thanks</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Check DSarmageddon's post.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Dtrick on <span class=date_text>02-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:01 PM</span>

[Grunar]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Zagurim wrote:<BR> <DIV>I do not think Steet Smarts and Rough Skin stack. If I remember correctly you can cast them and have both skills show up in your buff list, but only the first one cast takes effect. I confirmed this (if I remember correctly) by watching the impact on my Strength and Agility. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also I believe no one mentioned Escape, which as far as I know is never replaced.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <STRIKE>Just tested it again.  Agi (and AC now) went up once with the first buff, then again with the second buff.  Only increased by 4 with the second buff...<BR><BR>Although yesterday when I was recasting Stree Smarts while both were active sometimes wouldn't restart the timer and it would keep ticking down.  Not all the time, just every once in a while.</STRIKE><p>Message Edited by Grunarch on <span class=date_text>02-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:00 PM</span>

[Grunar]

<DIV>sorry, I'm an idiot.  I appeared to go up again cuz I started with street smarts.  Its the same bonus stacked as if it was just rough skin.  they do NOT stack.  my bad</DIV>

[Gyilok]

<DIV>a little addition I (and probably others too) have found out about Fancy footwork and Knave</DIV> <DIV>so:</DIV> <DIV>you fire it up (any of them) the timer doesnt black out, until you fire one of them off again , but after that the timers of both black out, meaning: you can have them stacked (will check stats later if they really stack) or if they don't stack you can fire off knave once more before it expires= 1minute knave</DIV>

[Sinadi]

Yeah I've noticed some of our buffs are ... weird. I'm guessing that fancy footwork and knave are *supposed* to share a timer but there's some issue with the recast time or something that makes it possible to 'stack' them. The same thing happens with Blackguard and I suspect our self haste is the same way. (Not in game, just woke up and can't recall the name of the art, sorry! Deceit maybe? lol)Personally I won't be bug reporting those issues till poisons are made functional at my level.

[Zagur]

<DIV>Not high enough to have Knave, but you can cast Fancy Footwork twice all by itself. In other words:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1. Cast FF</DIV> <DIV>2. Wait until the buff is about to expire</DIV> <DIV>3. Recast FF before the buff expires</DIV> <DIV>4. When FF is recast the timer on the buff resets itself</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If I remember correctly if you cast it a second time the buff has even a longer timer. Something like 30 seconds for FF the first time you cast it but 45 seconds if you reset it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, once you cast it the second time, it immediately greys out and starts the 60 second timer to reuse it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At least that is my experience =)</DIV>

[Mideo]

<DIV>Yeah you can use Fancy Footwork twice before it greys out as long as you do it again before the buff wears off.</DIV>

[Korelen]

<blockquote><hr>MideonV wrote:<DIV>Yeah you can use Fancy Footwork twice before it greys out as long as you do it again before the buff wears off.</DIV><hr></blockquote>You can do this with Risky Advance as well.

[Mideo]

<DIV>Yeah I actually noticed that for the first time earlier today after I made that post.</DIV>

[Gyilok]

<DIV>maybe a little off topic here, but according to the description knave should also increase str, yet it does no stat change</DIV>

[Kende]

<DIV>This list has proven quite useful to me, so I'm sending it to the top again.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Any updates?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks,</DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>28 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server</DIV>

[Dimidri]

<DIV>You can't continually recast the buffs anymore. For example, I casted Risky Advance and I can't recast at all because it turns light gray, so I wait until it wears off, but then the recast starts and the macro turns dark grey and slowly becomes yellow again.</DIV>

[Hexfa]

<DIV>Thanks for all of this!!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I spent an hour or two at work this weekend going through the skill lists and figuring out which skills were in the same lines - had a few wrong which I've cleared up now since seeing this thread!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Great info!  </DIV>

[Sinadi]

Now that we get so much more information when we examine our skills, I was thinking of posting the complete stats for each skill, with the skills on the same timers ('upgrades') posted side-by-side. Would there be any interest in this? It'd take me a bit of time and I'll have to try upgrade some of my higher level skills if I can find a jeweler on my server (oh the joys of a really small population server!). Others could add to it by posting stats for different upgrade levels so one could compare easier and judge if that upgrade is really worth the price you're getting asked to shell out...

[Zerim]

<DIV>That would be very much appreciated Sinadial</DIV><p>Message Edited by Zerimar on <span class=date_text>02-28-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:15 PM</span>

[Grunar]

<DIV>Yay! upcoming patch to fix timers...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>- <FONT color=#66ff00>Scout</FONT> changes:<BR>  - Quick Strike will now share a reuse timer with Hann's Quick Stab, Denon's Deafening Strike, and Hager's Befuddling Strike.<BR>  - Ambush will now share a reuse timer with Elaa's Relentless Ambush.<BR></DIV> <DIV>- <FONT color=#66ff00>Rogue</FONT> changes:<BR>  - Hager's Befuddling Strike will now share a reuse timer with Quick Strike.<BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66ff00>- Brigand</FONT> changes:<BR>  - none for timers</DIV></DIV>

[Kende]

<DIV><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV> <DIV>I suck at formatting, etc. so please be forgiving :smileyhappy:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I changed Quick Strike (3) and Hann's Quick Stab (T10) to be on same timer (coming from Test soon).</DIV> <DIV>Only ones I didn't include were Hamstring (36) --> Disable (50) as those are Swashbuckler arts?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Feedback/changes are appreciated.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Still waiting on Sinidial's updated list with complete stats, etc. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>29 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server</DIV>

[Kende]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Grunarch wrote:<BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV>- <FONT color=#66ff00>Rogue</FONT> changes:<BR>  - Hager's Befuddling Strike will now share a reuse timer with Quick Strike.<BR><BR> <HR> </DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I realize you just cut and pasted, but...</P> <P><BR></P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P> <HR> <P></P> <P><STRONG>Predator (Level 10)</STRONG></P> <UL> <LI>Hager's Befuddling Strike - An advanced form of Quick Strike. As a bonus to Quick Strike it prevents the target from casting for a brief time. </LI></UL> <P><BR></P> <P> <HR> <P></P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Not Rogue <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>EDIT: I see they messed up the Test Update notes for Predator too...says Hann's Quick Stab.</P><p>Message Edited by Kendera on <span class=date_text>03-01-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:32 PM</span>

[Sinadi]

That's cool kendera <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> My browser doesn't seem to like it though <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I'll try open it using IE.Hamstring, etc are *skullduggery* skills, which means they're shared between us and Swashies. But I do think something is not right with those 2 skills because the game didn't automatically grant them to me. I bought Hamstring because I saw I could use it when I was looking for some other spell upgrades, and the other dropped as an adept while I was grouped.I'll work on getting the rest of that info, hopefully by the weekend. I'm fighting off the flu though so forgive me if it's not till some time next week.

[TricksyRaton]

<DIV>As of last night, Distracting Blade was on a different timer than Bum Rush, but Sneak Attack was on the same timer as Bum Rush.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Ratt]

<blockquote><hr>TricksyRatonga wrote:<DIV>As of last night, Distracting Blade was on a different timer than Bum Rush, but Sneak Attack was on the same timer as Bum Rush.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV> </DIV><hr></blockquote>Yeah distracting blade/sneak attack/Locke's Careless Sideswipe got switched/fixed a week or so ago now sideswipe isn't on the DB timer its on SA like the description said and DB is on its own. Which is good for us as now a greenish (at 25) replaces the grey and we get to use the yellow distracting blade <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Kende]

<DIV> <DIV>Updated chart: Bum Rush and Gambit now on same timer as Sneak Attack and Locke's Careless Sideswipe.  Distracting Blade on its' own timer.</DIV> <DIV>Added link to my signature.  Keep the updates coming, and thanks.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>EDIT: Added position information on far right-hand side of chart.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>29 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV></DIV><p>Message Edited by Kendera on <span class=date_text>03-03-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:41 AM</span>

[Dimidri]

<DIV>Oh, that's a pretty cool chart there Kendera. Thanks for that =)</DIV>

[Kende]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Dimidrius wrote:<BR> <DIV>Oh, that's a pretty cool chart there Kendera. Thanks for that =)</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I'm glad you like...hope it proves useful.  Credit is due to Sinadial for the original post and the other contributors to this thread.</FONT></DIV> <DIV></FONT> </DIV> <DIV>Post here with any adjustments/corrections and I'll try to keep the chart updated.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>30 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV>

[Kende]

<DIV>Updated chart:  <FONT color=#99ff00>Added links to screenshots of the Art info.</FONT>  Only up to level 30 so far.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0066><FONT color=#ff0000>NOTE:</FONT> </FONT> Since the Arts scale with level, the values you see on the screenshots may be different that what they may be for you depending on your level.  I will redo all the screenshots when I get to level 50.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>31 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV>

[Gn]

<DIV>It would also be cool if we had App I, Adept I, Adept III, and Master I info where available if someone can host this much material.  Obviously, this info varies a bit by level, but it should be pretty clear when an App I ->Master I upgrade is worthless.  Dates on the images would be good too since we can hope that some changes get implemented for at least some of the master spells.</DIV>

[Kende]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Gnef wrote:<BR> <DIV>It would also be cool if we had App I, Adept I, Adept III, and Master I info where available if someone can host this much material.  Obviously, this info varies a bit by level, but it should be pretty clear when an App I ->Master I upgrade is worthless.  Dates on the images would be good too since we can hope that some changes get implemented for at least some of the master spells.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Updated chart:  <FONT color=#99ff00>Added <EM><STRONG>date</STRONG></EM> and <STRONG><EM>level when screenshot was taken</EM></STRONG> to each screenshot. :smileyhappy:</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#99ff00></FONT> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV>Working on getting different tier (app, adept, etc.) info, ETA unknown.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>31 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV></DIV>

[Kende]

<DIV>Update: <FONT color=#99ff00>Sinadial has contributed screenshots for most of the Arts up to level 50 (taken @ level 50)!!</FONT></DIV> <DIV>Clicking on the name of the art goes to a page that shows all screenshots for that given art (app1, adept1, etc. but only ones for which I have a screenshot, of course).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There are still a few missing, and I'm working on getting them.</DIV> <DIV>Hann's Quick Stab (10T)<BR>Fiddy's Handy Distraction (10T)<BR>Locke's Careless Sideswipe (10T)<BR>Elisi's Wounding Gash (20T)<BR>Nestral's Relentless Advance (20T)<BR>Tani's Slaparound (30T)<BR>Nestral's Ambidexterous Display (30T)<BR>Locke's Cussing Gale (30T)<BR>Locke's Ruthless Mugging (40T)<BR>Nestral's Reflexive Knave (40T)<BR>Tani's Violent Rake (40T)</DIV> <DIV>Shank (32)</DIV> <DIV>Creature  Mastery Sinister Strikes<BR> --Gnoll (have Orc)<BR> --Skeleton, Ghost (have Zombie)<BR> --Centaur, Treant (have Giant)<BR> --?? (all the higher ones)</DIV> <DIV>Other Fun spells (Disguises?)</DIV> <DIV>Other racial arts/abilities? E.g. Gnomish racial evade, Dark Elven Rune, etc.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>31 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV>

[Kende]

<P>Update:<BR><FONT color=#ffcc00><FONT color=#ffff33>Added Shank (32)<BR></FONT></FONT><FONT color=#ffcc00><FONT color=#ffff33>Added our 'fun' spells<BR>Added what Creature Mastery screenshots I could.</FONT><BR></P></FONT> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <DIV>There are still a few screenshots missing, and I'm working on getting them.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hann's Quick Stab (10T)<BR>Fiddy's Handy Distraction (10T)<BR>Locke's Careless Sideswipe (10T)<BR>Elisi's Wounding Gash (20T)<BR>Nestral's Relentless Advance (20T)<BR>Tani's Slaparound (30T)<BR>Nestral's Ambidexterous Display (30T)<BR>Locke's Cussing Gale (30T)<BR>Locke's Ruthless Mugging (40T)<BR>Nestral's Reflexive Knave (40T)<BR>Tani's Violent Rake (40T)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Creature  Mastery Sinister Strikes:<BR> --Gnoll<BR> --Ghost<BR> --Centaur, Treant<BR> --Bixie, Fairy, Goblin</DIV> <DIV> --Lizardman, Nightblood, Shadowed Men</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Other racial arts/abilities? E.g. Gnomish racial evade, Dark Elven Rune, etc.<BR> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>Kend<BR>32 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A><BR>

[Kariena]

Awesome! The only thing is I don't see desperate thrust, just got it this lvl and was wondering what it was replacing <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Grisha]

The gnomish evade thing doesn't share any reuse timers, but has an insanely long one of its own. <div></div>

[Kende]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kariena wrote:<BR>Awesome! The only thing is I don't see desperate thrust, just got it this lvl and was wondering what it was replacing <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Desperate Thrust is there (look far down the list under tier 5).  From the info earlier in this thread, it appears to be on its' own timer.</P> <P>Kend<BR>33 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></P>

[Zagur]

<P>Kendera, thanks for putting that spreadsheet together. A couple of questions though:</P> <P>You have Knave as the final one in the Parry/Defense line. Is Blackguard not an upgrade? If it is not a mistake and they are on different timers then do the parry/defense bonuses stack?</P> <P>Thanks for any additional information you (or anyone else) can provide!</P>

[Damari]

<DIV> <P>You have Knave as the final one in the Parry/Defense line. Is Blackguard not an upgrade? If it is not a mistake and they are on different timers then do the parry/defense bonuses stack?</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>-was about to ask the same thing?</P> <P> </P> <P>Damari</P></DIV>

[AquaojoValdos]

Another useful page for brigand combat arts: http://www.thescoutssanctuary.com/brigand.php According to the descriptions, it would seem that blackguard is an upgrade for knave. Thanks for the spreadsheet though, I have both pages bookmarked, very useful. - Aqua <div></div>

[Kende]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> You have Knave as the final one in the Parry/Defense line. Is Blackguard not an upgrade? If it is not a mistake and they are on different timers then do the parry/defense bonuses stack? <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Well, I was hoping a higher level Brigand could confirm that Blackguard does indeed share the timer with Knave and Fancy Footwork.  Until they do, I'll leave it as is.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And I cannot answer the second question either, sorry :smileysad:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Keep those questions/comments coming!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kend<BR>33 Brigand<BR>Black Talons<BR>Najena server<BR><BR><A href="http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htm" target=_blank>Brigand Combat Arts upgrade paths (shared timers)</A></DIV>

[WuphonsReach]

FYI, the page at:http://baronken.com/files/EQ2BrigandArts.htmDoesn't render so well in Mozilla 1.7.(Also wondering if the original folks who posted this thread are still around to make updates?)