Please help with Class Selection: The real deal when Brigands and Swash solo

[hayaikaze]

<P><SPAN>Hi all,</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>I am looking for some advice regarding class choice and hope you can help. </SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>My question is more from a PVE perspective (on Nagafen), specifically the ability of Brigand or Swash to solo. I have a baby at home and won’t have much time for grouping, so being very solid when it comes to solo play is key.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>After reading several posts I have come to understand that both classes are among the best for PVP, but what about solo ability from the PVE perspective? I have found some info on this as well, but some things are still not clear to me.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>1)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Some have said that a Brigand can solo better than a Swash because:</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>-<SPAN>          </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Brigands are better at single target damage. My question here is a Swash has a number of AOEs, so based on that wouldn’t they be better at solo play? Pull several mobs, when one is dead, the others are at 50% which is correct?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>2)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>I think read that a Brigand has more stuns than a Swash and can therefore get off more positional attacks than a Swash. So, while a Swash may be able to do a <SPAN>     </SPAN><SPAN>     </SPAN><SPAN>      </SPAN>bit more damage in a group setting, a Brigand can do more because they can stun a move and move behind with greater frequency to get off back attacks. Is this true?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>-<SPAN>     </SPAN>Brings have how many stuns and what does a Swash have in that regard….fewer stuns, mezz?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>3)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>I know a Brigand has great buffs that increase their mitigation; therefore they can take a beating, what about a Swash? What do they get….the same type of Mit buff, so they are on par with a Brigand when it comes to being sturdy?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>4)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Debuffs, again from what I have read a Swash debuffs targets offenses, while a brigand debuffs mitigation….do they play out in about the same way when going solo?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>Thanks so much in advance!</SPAN></P>

[Sier]

<DIV>after 40 swashie for me at least fell by the wayside in the solo department. I dont really know about brigs however.</DIV> <DIV>swashies by lvl 40 have </DIV> <DIV>ambush- stealth attack that lets you get off your 2 backstabs</DIV> <DIV>stun- if your quick can get off both backstabs</DIV> <DIV>Mez- allows u to slip into invis and get off ambush and 2 backstabs</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and while brigs buff mit and debuff enemy mit</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>swashies Buff attack and debuff enemy attack</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>From what my brig friend tells me he gets more stuns then me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>however when we were messing around out side of CT we were killing things in about the same amount of time.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>were swashies shine is against low green group encounters our AOE gives us the edge there.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But yeah solo wise all the scout classes are weak</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1 for the melees when we run out of stuns or if mob has high mit and lots of HP we die/ run away</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2 for the ranged aspect/ kiting it can cause a headaches when it come to Adds</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3 you cant ambush mobs that can see through stealth, this limits where we can exp</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4 no heals... none... and screw buying potions etc they cost to much</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Aside from that Group wise swashies are more sexy imho plus we get Hurricane cant mess with that.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>but if you dig the brig thing be a brig.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>if you want to solo try SK, Inq, Zerker, or paly. tried paly and inq they were not my style took to long to kill stuff as for SK my alts an SK and well solo wise he leaves somthing to be desired when i play swashie. However scouts cant be beat when it comes to DPS, sept bard but they do nice numbers and have nice buffs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>People rave about Zerkers have not played one so dont know but through it in there cus people say they are gr8.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>then you have your mages Conj/Necro or chanters  the summons kill way faster the chanters stay alive and do it well some say thy can get through a fight wit out being hit once... but they are slow. played necro to 12 had master level bat thing... still was to slow for my liking and Adds were a pain so had to be very careful.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>hope some of this helps you.</DIV>

[Bootstwadd]

<P>Don't have a Swashy...but as a Brig I like to spy on their board...so I'll add my 2c</P> <P> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> hayaikaze wrote:<BR> <P></P> <P><SPAN></SPAN></P><SPAN><SPAN>1)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Some have said that a Brigand can solo better than a Swash because:</SPAN> <P><SPAN><SPAN>-<SPAN>          </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Brigands are better at single target damage. My question here is a Swash has a number of AOEs, so based on that wouldn’t they be better at solo play? Pull several mobs, when one is dead, the others are at 50% which is correct?  <FONT color=#66ff00>I can tell ya, as a Brig, I have no problems soloing whatsoever.  We get a nice big single target attack (Ruse...best soloing skill ever) so single mobs go down fast, two mobs isn't a problem either...three?  Not so much fun.  Brig's only get the one AoE, and it's on a pretty long timer.   </FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>2)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>I think read that a Brigand has more stuns than a Swash and can therefore get off more positional attacks than a Swash. So, while a Swash may be able to do a <SPAN>     </SPAN><SPAN>     </SPAN><SPAN>      </SPAN>bit more damage in a group setting, a Brigand can do more because they can stun a move and move behind with greater frequency to get off back attacks. Is this true?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>-<SPAN>     </SPAN>Brings have how many stuns and what does a Swash have in that regard….fewer stuns, mezz?  <FONT color=#66ff00>Here's the thing...Brig's have more stuns (At least 3), and more positional attacks.  Swashies have less stuns and less positional attacks.  A Brig definitely has to jump around alot, but if you go with the AGI AA Walk the Plank they just turn their back to you.  </FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>3)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>I know a Brigand has great buffs that increase their mitigation; therefore they can take a beating, what about a Swash? What do they get….the same type of Mit buff, so they are on par with a Brigand when it comes to being sturdy?  <FONT color=#66ff00>Don't got a Swash, so I won't answer...but Brig's are quite hardy yes (Even more so if you build him as a BrigTank).</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>4)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Debuffs, again from what I have read a Swash debuffs targets offenses, while a brigand debuffs mitigation….do they play out in about the same way when going solo?  <FONT color=#66ff00>From a Brig point of view, we don't get our big Mit debuffs until 50-ish, but they are pretty darn good.  Can't tell ya what a Swash does. </FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>Thanks so much in advance!</SPAN></P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>My first char was an SK, and he could solo like there's no tomorrow single target and group mobs.  The lifetaps rule.  But my Brig is far more fun to play...I like having to be active and bouncing around.  All that said, I haven't had any problems soloing with my Brig, and I imagine a Swash would be about the same.  Yes, there are better soloers, but I'd throw the Rogue at the high end of the middle of the pack (stealth and tracking rule for soloing). <BR></P> <P>Hope that helps out a little...and, in closing...roll a Swashy.<BR></P>

[hayaikaze]

<P>Thanks for responding, i appreciate the info!</P> <P>I suppose a Brig might have the edge when it some to playing solo with a few more stuns and positional attacks, but I am still not sure <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Also the extra Mit buffs (Brig) seems like it might be better for solo play as opposed to the Swash Agi buff. Still I am not certain....</P>

[Bootstwadd]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> hayaikaze wrote:<BR> <P>Thanks for responding, i appreciate the info!</P> <P>I suppose a Brig might have the edge when it some to playing solo with a few more stuns and positional attacks, but I am still not sure <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>Also the extra Mit buffs (Brig) seems like it might be better for solo play as opposed to the Swash Agi buff. Still I am not certain....</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>You could go the Strength and Stamina AA lines as a Swashy and get more benefits than the one Brig buff..I think.   As for more stuns, Brigs have at least 6 positionals so we need a lot of stuns...Swash's have less, so you wouldn't need as many, 2 would probably be enough.  Keep in mind getting behind a mob in a tight dungeon can be very detrimental to your health.  <BR>So, toe to toe I would say the swashy is better as toe to heel is where the Brig needs to be most of the time.  Either way, you'll be fine soloing...the edge would come with how well you learn to play your character, the level of your spells, and the equipment you got on.

[Keyh]

I've played a Brig up to 38 so far (going the stamina line).So far, the Brigand was easier to solo than the Swashbuckler was. The Swashbuckler I mainly duoed with but I'd solo every once and a while.Once a Swashbuckler hits lvl 50 though (and subsequently gets Inspired Daring) soloing becomes alot easier. I'd duo with a guardian and we'd take yellow heroics with no problem as long as I had Inspired Daring up.<div></div>

[NiteWolfe]

 Some on in here said we dont get heals.Pretty sure its at lvl 50 vitality breach posions become usable.i personaly use the lvl 62 one its something like 350 dd with a 350 heal procs 1.8 times a min average and i have had it proc a ton more depending on luck. That alone makes soloing very easy. I go defense stance stack stun, wis debuf and vitality breach and solo very well. So yes all scouts after level 50 have access to self heals.<div></div>

[liveja]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sieryu wrote: But yeah solo wise all the scout classes are weak <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Please speak for yourself only. My 66 Swash has no trouble soloing, period. Never has, never will. My best gear is only Legendary, & I've only got 3 M1 Combat Arts, so I'm not uber-raid-geared or anything. Blue-con group? Stealth up into them, select one, Sneak Attack > Backstab > Flank Attack, then immediately AOE1 & AOE2. The first mob is mostly dead at that point; auto-attack takes it down. The other two by that point are badly wounded & easily finished. Despite your assertion that Swashies "fall by the wayside" post-40, soloing actually gets EASIER, thanx to Inspired Daring & later, Hurricane. I've even taken out White-con groups using the strategy above, & I can solo any non-heroic up to 3 levels above me without much difficulty.</P> <P>My baby Brigand is only 16th level, but that character also has no trouble soloing. In 16 levels, he's died only once, & that when I took on an encounter I was pretty sure I was going to lose.</P> <P>Which one solos "better", though? I'm growing increasingly convinced there is no definitive answer, because it's entirely up to the player.<BR></P>

[Cocytus]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> hayaikaze wrote:<BR> <P><SPAN>Hi all,</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>I am looking for some advice regarding class choice and hope you can help. </SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>My question is more from a PVE perspective (on Nagafen), specifically the ability of Brigand or Swash to solo. I have a baby at home and won’t have much time for grouping, so being very solid when it comes to solo play is key.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>After reading several posts I have come to understand that both classes are among the best for PVP, but what about solo ability from the PVE perspective? I have found some info on this as well, but some things are still not clear to me.</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>1)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Some have said that a Brigand can solo better than a Swash because:</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>-<SPAN>          </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Brigands are better at single target damage. My question here is a Swash has a number of AOEs, so based on that wouldn’t they be better at solo play? Pull several mobs, when one is dead, the others are at 50% which is correct?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#cc0000>They are better at single target damage if you are basing this on a very short duration and excluding ancient teachings (specials). Swashbucklers do more but it takes them more time to do it. If you include ancient teachings, brigands can dish out a ton with their debuffs - but a swashbuckler can dish out a lot more with inspiration and en garde. Brigands are defensive debuffs (mostly), swashbucklers are offensive debuffs (mostly), both with DPS though swashbucklers have a tendency to do more IF the player behind them is good. It takes less skill to get high DPS witha brigand than it does with a swashbuckler, IMO.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>2)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>I think read that a Brigand has more stuns than a Swash and can therefore get off more positional attacks than a Swash. So, while a Swash may be able to do a <SPAN>     </SPAN><SPAN>     </SPAN><SPAN>      </SPAN>bit more damage in a group setting, a Brigand can do more because they can stun a move and move behind with greater frequency to get off back attacks. Is this true?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>-<SPAN>     </SPAN>Brings have how many stuns and what does a Swash have in that regard….fewer stuns, mezz?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#cc0000>Swashbucklers have a grand total of four stuns (don't think I'm missing any), most of which take skill to use. We have only two rear/flank positional attacks though, so less stuns doesn't really matter. Brigands have four or five rear/flanking attacks, and I believe two long-ish duration stuns, a short one, and a no-direction change ability. Swashbucklers have cheap shot, brazening (our sneak attack), our mez, and the dashing swathe AE line. I would go into specifics on stun durations but I'll need specific questions as they vary based on mob con.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>3)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>I know a Brigand has great buffs that increase their mitigation; therefore they can take a beating, what about a Swash? What do they get….the same type of Mit buff, so they are on par with a Brigand when it comes to being sturdy?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#cc0000>Swashbucklers have more avoidance instead of more mitigation. Brigands are more reliable, swashbucklers are more effecient.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><SPAN>4)<SPAN>       </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN><SPAN>Debuffs, again from what I have read a Swash debuffs targets offenses, while a brigand debuffs mitigation….do they play out in about the same way when going solo?</SPAN></P> <P><SPAN><FONT color=#cc0000>Yes, they play out well. a swashbuckler can get hit for less, and get hit less often when soloing...while a brigand can boost up how hard he hits significantly through mitigation debuffs.</FONT></SPAN></P> <P><SPAN>Thanks so much in advance!</SPAN></P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>

[Dalaimoc]

<P>I am playing a 59 swashy and don't have any problem soloing, whatsoever,  doing Lv 64/65 quests in Loping plains.  What it boils down to between Swash and Brig is, that a Swashy shines against multiple opponents, whereas a Brig shines against solo mobs.</P> <P>Both classes share, that to solo effectively 5-6  level higher con solos, or heroics 4-6 levels below you have to set up your gear (including poison) the correct way and out some thinking into using your CAs. Firstoff, Vitality breach is your key to winning these encounters. It does NOT proc 1.8/minute as stated earier, but 5.0/ minute. That is ALOT ! Add to this a liftapping adornment on your weapon and a mastecrafted chest piece with reactive heal and you are almost set. When i fight Lv 63 mobs (no arrow), i often end up with almost full health.</P> <P>For Heroic and orange con solo mobs, you have to plan your CAs and have an alternative if things go awry. Bring in you debuffs early, and keep them constantly going. Save your Inspired Daring line, for when you can whack off afterwards your multiple attack CAs, as ID adds to each hit you get in. This often saved me in the reds, because i just mowed the mob down.</P> <P>Choose the correct stance ! This very important. For solo mobs, excluding nameds is recommend offensive stance. Even orange cons go down so fast, it is almost comical. Don't waste your time with def stance on them. You wont hit nearly as much, which usually gets you killed on orange mobs. For heroics, if you have the jump, open in off. stance to bring in your backstabs and offensive debuffs, then switch to def stance.</P> <P>These are just some points and by no means all, that will make your solo life much easier.</P> <P> </P> <P>And the choice between Swashy and Brig, well....remember, the grass is always greener on the other side</P> <P> </P> <P>Drasek Riven, 59 Swashbuckler on Splitpaw</P> <P> </P><p>Message Edited by Dalaimoc on <span class=date_text>01-10-2007</span> <span class=time_text>02:35 AM</span>

[hayaikaze]

<P>Thanks again for the advice and info...just what I was looking for. </P> <P>I suppose I will have to go with my gut and my experience so far, as they both seem like great classes to play.</P>

[Slapfish]

<P>I play a 59 Swash and have no trouble soloing. I'm not as ambitious as some of these guys, I don't go after heroics and such, but even so, I solo pretty easily. In reading through the thread and comparing to my experience, it seems to me that Brigand would require more stunning/jumping/strafing or a more active style of play. So I guess it would depend on your preferences as to which would be more satisfying. I guess I'm not especially coordinated because I never had any luck with stunning and jumping behind the MOB, so it seems a Brig would be a poor choice for me. </P> <P>I also love my AOE's. It's very satisfying to knock out almost half the hit points of a whole group with only two attacks. </P> <P>I don't agree with the poster who said the Scout classes are poor soloers. I've found the Swash to be a great deal of fun to solo. This thread pretty much addresses only the fighting abilities, but Scouts also have sneak and evac, and both of these make exploring and getting to difficult destinations a breeze. </P>