Lore Questions

[Starshelle]

<div></div>I'm working on the back story for several of my characters, but I'm having trouble with the timeline of events.In the present game, how long ago in years was the Shattering?How long ago was it since Neriak was destroyed?Has there been more detailed information written up about what happened with the erudite transformation? I've found bits and pieces of it but I'd like to learn more.Why did so many of the races from Faydwer go to Qeynos? Is there an lore reason why Kelethin is going to suddenly be available when Echos of Faydwer is released?I'd greatly appreciate it if anyone can help me with these questions. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />—Anemoreth<div></div><p>Message Edited by Starshelle on <span class=date_text>08-20-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:52 PM</span>

[Cusashorn]

<FONT color=#ff0000></FONT><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Starshelle wrote:<BR> <P>I'm working on the back story for several of my characters, but I'm having trouble with the timeline of events.<BR><BR>In the present game, how long ago in years was the Shattering?</P> <P><FONT color=#ff0000>15 years at most. honestly, for an event that only happened so recently, it's never been talked about just how long ago it happened. it's always "between 12 and 15 years ago".</FONT><BR><BR>How long ago was it since Neriak was destroyed?</P> <P><FONT color=#ff0000>Never officially stated. Most of the events that happened in the 500 years have never been stated on a chronological scale or record.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff0000>*EDIT*:</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff0000>Actually, I can add a bit more to this. It is revealed that Leatherfoot raiders took advantage of Neriak's lowered defenses while most of the Dark Elven armies were over on Feydwer fighting the Elves in the War of the Fey. It was never stated when the War of the Fey happened either though.</FONT><BR><BR>Has there been more detailed information written up about what happened with the erudite transformation? I've found bits and pieces of it but I'd like to learn more.</P></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#ff0000></FONT><FONT color=#ff0000>Other than the transformation happening after both Erudin and Paineel decided to join together in unification to build a temple in the Stonebrundt Mountains to perform this cerimony, no other information has been revealed about it yet.</FONT><BR><BR>Why did so many of the races from Faydwer go to Qeynos? Is there an lore reason why Kelethin is going to suddenly be available when Echos of Faydwer is released?</P> <P><FONT color=#ff0000></FONT><FONT color=#ff0000>With the exception of gnomes and Half Elves, who are neutral, all the races on Feydwere were Good alligned from the very start. After the 2nd Rallosian War, many Dwarves, Wood Elves, High Elves, and Gnomes were requested to help rebuild the cities of Qeynos and Freeport (well, some of the gnomes for Freeport anyway). When the Rending occured, it made travel back to Feydwer impossible if not suicidal. Kelethin and most of Feydwere avoided the destruction of the Shattering, so Kelethin still stands as it is a city in the trees, and not even the Rending would destroy something that grows as fast as wood does.</FONT><BR><BR>I'd greatly appreciate it if anyone can help me with these questions. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR><BR>—Anemoreth<BR><BR><BR><BR></P> <P>Message Edited by Starshelle on <SPAN class=date_text>08-20-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:52 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR><p>Message Edited by Cusashorn on <span class=date_text>08-21-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:33 AM</span>

[Starshelle]

<div></div>Thanks  Cusashorn!   Another quick question.  Is the Shattering and the Rending  two different names for the same event or do they refer to seperate ones? <a href="../view_profile?user.id=97040" target="top"><span></span></a><div></div>

[IrishWonder]

<DIV>The Shattering and the Rending are two seperate events. The Rending refers to the massive earthquakes that tore the land apart and made the Norrath that we see today. The Shattering was the explosion of the moon of Luclin, which rained chunks of that planet down onto the surface of Norrath.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And a quick note... it states somewhere that the Fae "rebuilt" Kelethin. So Kelethin quite possibly was destroyed in the Rending/Shattering.</DIV>

[Starshelle]

Did the Rending take place the same time as the Shattering? I always thought they did for some reason, but now I'm not so sure.<div></div>

[DreamerClou]

<DIV>Why did so many of the races from Faydwer go to Qeynos? Is there an lore reason why Kelethin is going to suddenly be available when Echos of Faydwer is released? <P><FONT color=#ff0000></FONT><FONT color=#ff0000>With the exception of gnomes and Half Elves, who are neutral, all the races on Feydwere were Good alligned from the very start. After the 2nd Rallosian War, many Dwarves, Wood Elves, High Elves, and Gnomes were requested to help rebuild the cities of Qeynos and Freeport (well, some of the gnomes for Freeport anyway). When the Rending occured, it made travel back to Feydwer impossible if not suicidal. Kelethin and most of Feydwere avoided the destruction of the Shattering, so Kelethin still stands as it is a city in the trees, and not even the Rending would destroy something that grows as fast as wood does.</FONT><BR></P> <P>-----------------------------------------------------------------------</P> <P> </P> <P>Hmm, I thought the mighty Dark Elves help burn the city of Kelethin down to the ground??</P></DIV>

[IrishWonder]

<DIV>The Rending happened anywhere from 300-500 years ago... I'm not sure if it's ever been stated exactly. The Shattering happened much more recently... 12-15 years ago.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for Kelethin, it states that the Dark Elves took over control of the High Elf marble city of Felwithe, but never completely defines how they fared in the Faydark/Kelethin portion of the War of the Fay. It does hint, though, that Kelethin was destroyed somehow. The Features section on the official EoF website (<A href="http://www.echoesoffaydwer.com" target=_blank>www.echoesoffaydwer.com</A>) states that the Fae helped to build a "New Kelethin".</DIV>

[ke'la]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IrishWonder wrote:<BR> <DIV>The Rending happened anywhere from 300-500 years ago... I'm not sure if it's ever been stated exactly. The Shattering happened much more recently... 12-15 years ago.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As for Kelethin, it states that the Dark Elves took over control of the High Elf marble city of Felwithe, but never completely defines how they fared in the Faydark/Kelethin portion of the War of the Fay. It does hint, though, that Kelethin was destroyed somehow. The Features section on the official EoF website (<A href="http://www.echoesoffaydwer.com/" target=_blank>www.echoesoffaydwer.com</A>) <FONT color=#ff0000>states that the Fae helped to build a "New Kelethin".</FONT></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>The Devs have also refured to the Feydwar city as New Kelethin wich would imply that somehow the origanal was destroyed probly in the War of the Fey.</P> <P>Also my understanding is that Feydwar did not, for the most part suffer from the Rending, as such it should be geographicly speaking be mostly intact.</P>

[Kyvthuhlu]

<hr size="2" width="100%"><font color="#ff0000">Actually, I can add a bit more to this. It is revealed that Leatherfoot raiders took advantage of Neriak's lowered defenses while most of the Dark Elven armies were over on Feydwer fighting the Elves in the War of the Fey. It was never stated when the War of the Fey happened either though.</font><hr size="2" width="100%"><font color="#ff0000"></font><div></div>I will admit EQ 1 is my forte, not as much EQ 2 (I'm getting there though, fear me mortals), but doesn't an NPC in Qeynos specifically stated that that was 400 years ago?

[Mirander_1]

<div><blockquote><hr>Kyvthuhlu wrote:<hr size="2" width="100%"><font color="#ff0000">Actually, I can add a bit more to this. It is revealed that Leatherfoot raiders took advantage of Neriak's lowered defenses while most of the Dark Elven armies were over on Feydwer fighting the Elves in the War of the Fey. It was never stated when the War of the Fey happened either though.</font><hr size="2" width="100%"><font color="#ff0000"></font><div></div>I will admit EQ 1 is my forte, not as much EQ 2 (I'm getting there though, fear me mortals), but doesn't an NPC in Qeynos specifically stated that that was 400 years ago?<hr></blockquote>That sounds about right.  The War of the Fey was supposed to be one of the first of the events to happen between the end of EQlive and EQ2; and, from the sound of it, it happened long enough ago that Faydwer managed to largely recover from the war before the attack on the Nexus happened </div>

[Mirander_1]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>IrishWonder wrote:<div>The Rending happened anywhere from 300-500 years ago... I'm not sure if it's ever been stated exactly.</div><hr></blockquote>It definately wasn't that long ago, probably closer to 100 years ago.  I'm sure we would have noticed it if it was 500 years ago, as that was the year Kerafyrm was awakened; I'm sure some of the players would have noticed a catacylsm happening <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span></div>

[Nocturnal Aby]

<P>As was mentioned, shattering happened roughly 15 years ago.  The Shattering (being the moon, Luclin, exploding) added to stirring up the seas, as Norrath was pelted with a monumental meteor shower.  The seas were probably just beginning to settle down from the Rending.  The Rending describes a series of massive earthquakes that have taken place over the past three hundred years, or so.</P> <P>The sealing of Neriaks was also roughly three hundred years ago, as is indicated by an NPC who talks about it in Longshadow.</P> <P>The War of the Fay began roughly 500 years ago, during which, orc and dark elf forces burned the majority of Kelethin to the ground.  After the Teir'Dal forces were repelled, Felwithe (which was sacked and partially destroyed by Teir'Dal forces) and Kelethin were rebuilt.  Not all of the platforms of the tree city were destroyed, but the ones that remained didn't exactly hold much.  The rebuilding of Felwithe was lead by the new queen, Lenya Thex, as Tearis was killed when the Teir'Dal sacked Felwithe. This information can be gotten first hand by an eyewitness to these events who lives in Willow Wood, she usually chills by the little graveyard thing, there</P> <P>I have actually posted on the Erudite changes...not sure where, exactly, though.  The information I obtained was from a kerra Stonestair Byway.  I know I've gotten some elsewhere, but the exact location fails me, sorry.  Essentially, the two factions put aside their differences, and joined forces, thus you have the Quellithulians, the unity of those who followed Quellious, and those who followed Cazic-Thule.  They built a large compound in the Stonebrunt Mountains.  A great mist settled over the entire island, a spooky, unnatural mist.  After it cleared it was very quiet, and the kerra thought the high men had finally killed themselves.  When an erudite finally was seen again, they appeared as they are now.  They say that they further imbued themselves with a natural arcane affinity, to the extent to where their inner characteristics began to transcibe certain runes on their outward appearance.</P> <P>During the rise of the second Rallosian Empire, the city of Qeynos sought aid from its allies in Faydwer.  Visions also appeared to some of the elves, and to the Erudites as well, which is why some of them journeyed to Qeynos.  After the Rallosian forces were no longer a threat, the dwarves, elves, gnomes, and erudites remained in Qeynos to help rebuilt the damage caused during the conflict.  It was then that the Age of Cataclysms began with the first tremors of the Rending.  These were only a warning of the massive quakes to come.  The quakes caused by the Rending rendered the seas impassible.  The wizard and druid portals were also out of commission, since the Nexas was cut off by the forces of Rallos Zek and Solusek Ro (see the Tome of Destiny prelude to EQ2).  It looks like the Quellithulian Spires (Ulteran Spires) were in place BEFORE the Rending, and possibly even before the Rise of the Rallosians, since there are broken spires under the sea in Everfrost, that would not be necessary, if there was no city in Everfrost to go to (such as Halas) and I doubt they would have put them underwater, as well.</P> <P>It isn't until now that the tumultuous seas have been sailable once more, it has been long enough since the last quakes that once again, the seas are calming, and sailors can safely travel the vast, now uncharted oceans, since there is a lot more water than there used to be <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[IrishWonder]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> Mirander wrote: <DIV>It definately wasn't that long ago, probably closer to 100 years ago.  I'm sure we would have noticed it if it was 500 years ago, as that was the year Kerafyrm was awakened; I'm sure some of the players would have noticed a catacylsm happening <SPAN>:smileyvery-happy:</SPAN><BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>The cataclysms from the Rending lasted a very long time. If the Rending started only 100 years ago, it most likely would have just ended. Due to official lore sources, we're led to believe there was more time than that between the Rending and the Shattering. It's not proven anywhere, but the most popular (and most easily reinforced with current knowledge) theory is that it happened between 300-500 years ago. That doesn't have to mean exactly 500 years ago. The 500 is just a marker to help encompass the timeframe when it could have occurred.

[Kyvthuhlu]

<hr size="2" width="100%">That sounds about right.  The War of the Fey was supposed to be one of the first of the events to happen between the end of EQlive and EQ2; and, from the sound of it, it happened long enough ago that Faydwer managed to largely recover from the war before the attack on the Nexus happened<hr size="2" width="100%"><div></div>I don't know if they ever recovered per se, the NPC in Qeynos who talks about it (specifically citing it as 400 years ago) said that Kelethin was completely destroyed.

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>The Rending happened over the course of about 200  years btw. It didn't just Happen and that was it. It took place over the years.</DIV>

[RaphaNissi]

I just wanted to point out that Thayare Faystrider states that the orcs set much of the Faydark on fire and doesn't say Kelethin itself was on fire.  Is there another source for this?  <div></div>

[Mirander_1]

<div><blockquote><hr>RaphaNissi wrote:I just wanted to point out that Thayare Faystrider states that the orcs set much of the Faydark on fire and doesn't say Kelethin itself was on fire.  Is there another source for this?  <div></div><hr></blockquote>I can't remember where I read this, but I recall something about the orcs managing to cut or burn down something like three of the trees that Kelethin was built in.  So they damaged the city, but they didn't destroy it completely</div>

[Nocturnal Aby]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> RaphaNissi wrote:<BR>I just wanted to point out that Thayare Faystrider states that the orcs set much of the Faydark on fire and doesn't say Kelethin itself was on fire.  Is there another source for this?  <BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>The History of the Wood Elf, and the History of the High Elf touch breifly on the War of the Fay, and the necessary rebuilding of Kelethin.</P> <P>The first quakes of the Rending initiated the dawn of the Age of Cataclysms, after the Age of War.  Most likely 100-300 years ago.  500 is impossible, as the quakes would have been taking place all through the Age of War, and outside the ground opening up around Qeynos to swallow the orcs (said to have been done by the avatar of Brell), there is no other record of massive earthquakes during this time.  In fact, one might even argue that the ones that swallowed up the orcs may have been the beginning of the Age of Cataclysms, but even that was after both the War of the Fay (which began about 500 years ago) and the rise of the Second Rallosian Empire, making it probably 100-150 years after the Age of Turmoil (EQ1), so 300-350 years ago.</P> <P>You know, this debate has been going on for some time, and I can never help but wonder if the devs even have an actual timeline of events, like</P> <P>500-400 years ago: Beginning of the Age of War.  War of Fay: Kings of both Thexian kings die, Teleportation is cut off towards the latter end, Ulteran Spires appear just as the war is coming to a close.  Kelethin and most of Felwithe destroyed, Lenya Thex takes her place as Queen of the Koada'Dal.  Erudites unite together once more, becoming Quellithulians, and through arcane rituals, transform their physical bodies into what they are today.  Queen Cristanos Thex takes all royal power to herself, having eliminated all those loyal to her husband by sending them to Faydwer to fight his war.  Lucan kicks the followers of Marr out of Freeport.</P> <P>400-300 years ago:  The ogres begin their campeigns to take over the world, led by the Avatar of War.  The Avatar of Flame begins to unite the various Orc Tribes.  Destruction of Gukta, invasion of Splitpaw, sacking of the Aviak tree house, slaughter of Centaur herds, destruction of Halas, shipwrecked iksar are captured by the Overlord, the seige of Qeynos and Freeport, both of which call for help from various allies, drawing many inhabitants from Faydwer to Qeynos.  Battle of Defiance.</P> <P>300-15 years ago: Beginning of the Age of Cataclysms.  Rending begins, quakes continue, ripping many of Norrath's large land masses to peices, for something destroys the Ulteran Spires, Neriak is sealed off.  Races that stayed to help rebuild the cities of Qeynos and Freeport get stuck there as the seas become impassable.  Rivervale, and parts of Kithicor become corropted by denizens of the Shadowed Realm. The Shattering occurs.  The swamps of Innothule are boiled by molten chunks of Luclin, massive meteor showers spread destruction across the land, and help to stir the calming seas up some more.  Ratonga appear in Freeport.</P> <P>15 years ago-present: Beginning of the Age of Destiny, adventures strike forth to explore the Shattered Lands of Norrath.</P> <P> </P> <P>This is just my own, very basic interpretation, but you see what I mean.  I can't help but wonder if the devs have an actual, concrete timeline of events, or if they just sort of toss things in there, heh, "When did this happen?"  "Oh...a long time ago..yeah...that's it."</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Mirander_1]

<div><blockquote><hr>Nocturnal Abyss wrote:<div></div> <blockquote></blockquote><p>300-15 years ago: Beginning of the Age of Cataclysms.  Rending begins, quakes continue, ripping many of Norrath's large land masses to peices, for something destroys the Ulteran Spires, <font color="#ff0000">Neriak is sealed off</font>.  Races that stayed to help rebuild the cities of Qeynos and Freeport get stuck there as the seas become impassable.  Rivervale, and parts of Kithicor become corropted by denizens of the Shadowed Realm. The Shattering occurs.  The swamps of Innothule are boiled by molten chunks of Luclin, massive meteor showers spread destruction across the land, and help to stir the calming seas up some more.  Ratonga appear in Freeport.</p><hr></blockquote>Pretty good overall, Nocturnal, only bit I see that's off is this bit in red.  Neriak was sealed during the Leatherfoot attack on Neriak, which occured either at the end of the War of the Fey, or right afterword.  Besides that, everything seems acurate</div>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Mirander wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Nocturnal Abyss wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><BR></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>300-15 years ago: Beginning of the Age of Cataclysms.  Rending begins, quakes continue, ripping many of Norrath's large land masses to peices, for something destroys the Ulteran Spires, Neriak is sealed off.  Races that stayed to help rebuild the cities of Qeynos and Freeport get stuck there as the seas become impassable.  Rivervale, and parts of Kithicor become corropted by denizens of the Shadowed Realm. The Shattering occurs.  The swamps of Innothule are boiled by molten chunks of Luclin, massive meteor showers spread destruction across the land, and help to stir the calming seas up some more.  Ratonga appear in Freeport.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Pretty good overall, Nocturnal, only bit I see that's off is this bit in red.  Neriak was sealed during the Leatherfoot attack on Neriak, which occured either at the end of the War of the Fey, or right afterword.  Besides that, everything seems acurate<BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Wait, where was it revealed that Innothule Swamp was boiled off by chunks of Luclin? I don't remembe ever hearing about that.</DIV>

[Zabjade]

<font color="#66ff00"><font size="2"><font face="Comic Sans MS">It's the first I've heard of that as well the only boiling I remember is Velious. The swamp might still exist as part of the Moors of Yekesha. </font></font></font><div></div>

[Mirander_1]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Cusashorn wrote:<div><blockquote><hr>Mirander wrote:<div><blockquote><hr>Nocturnal Abyss wrote:<div></div><blockquote></blockquote><p>300-15 years ago: Beginning of the Age of Cataclysms.  Rending begins, quakes continue, ripping many of Norrath's large land masses to peices, for something destroys the Ulteran Spires, Neriak is sealed off.  Races that stayed to help rebuild the cities of Qeynos and Freeport get stuck there as the seas become impassable.  Rivervale, and parts of Kithicor become corropted by denizens of the Shadowed Realm. The Shattering occurs.  The swamps of Innothule are boiled by molten chunks of Luclin, massive meteor showers spread destruction across the land, and help to stir the calming seas up some more.  Ratonga appear in Freeport.</p><hr></blockquote>Pretty good overall, Nocturnal, only bit I see that's off is this bit in red.  Neriak was sealed during the Leatherfoot attack on Neriak, which occured either at the end of the War of the Fey, or right afterword.  Besides that, everything seems acurate</div><hr></blockquote>Wait, where was it revealed that Innothule Swamp was boiled off by chunks of Luclin? I don't remembe ever hearing about that.</div><hr></blockquote>I recall hearing about a troll in Freeport who talks about Innothule boiling; but I don't think it was destroyed, just gave the frogloks a bit of a surprise <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span></div>

[Vollux]

<DIV> </DIV> <DIV>A Troll in Big Bend to be more specific.  He sends you on a food? quest If I remember correctly.   Talks about how he misses the swamp.  He remembers hearing the frog's screams as the swamp boiled.  Very vivid dialog as I remember.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>edit found the log: </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <DIV><BR>Grazzgrat says to you,"This place is no good.  It's too dry, too crowded, and there's nothing to hunt but rats.  No, this place is not so good as Grazzgrat's swamp."</DIV> <DIV>You say to Grazzgrat,"If you don't like it here, why don't you go back to your swamp?"</DIV> <DIV>"Ahh, you think you smarter than Grazzgrat?  Well, you not so smart because Grazzgrat would be in swamp now if he could.  But swamp was destroyed so long ago and Grazzgrat forced to live in dry, crowded place until he find new swamp."</DIV> <DIV>"What happened to your swamp? "</DIV> <DIV>"The swamp was destroyed in the Shattering.  Great fire rocks fell from the sky and boiled the swamp.  Everything died; Grazzgrat almost died."</DIV> <DIV>"Where was this swamp of yours?"</DIV> <DIV>"Swamp was to the south and ran deep for miles and miles.  It had lots of things to feed Grazzgrat, lots of frogloks for Grazzgrat and Grazzgrat's many children to eat, and lots of ruined rocks to make Grazzgrat's home.  Yes, that swamp was a good swamp.  Grazzgrat is... disappointed now that it's gone."</DIV> <DIV><BR>"How did you manage to survive?"</DIV> <DIV>"Ahahaha!  Grazzgrat is tougher than little snakes, lizards, and frogloks.  The boiling water only burned and blistered Grazzgrat while he swam to muddy shore.  That boiled too, the mud, but it was not so bad for Grazzgrat.</DIV> <DIV>"So there were other trolls in your swamp?"</DIV> <DIV><BR>"Yes, many brothers, sisters and children of Grazzgrat hunted frogloks in the swamp.  They were pleased with the swamp, as Grazzgrat was pleased, but no more.  They are probably dead, boiled or crushed by fire rocks from the sky."</DIV> <DIV><BR>"So that's what happened to the frogloks?"</DIV> <DIV>"Grazzgrat only know what he heard and smelled.  They screamed so loud in pain and fear and Grazzgrat could smell their skins melting in the swamp.  It was terrible and sad thing the frogloks' boiling alive, not that they died, but that Grazzgrat could not enjoy the slaughter."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>anyway to get the thread back on track from the minor derail. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have found <A href="http://lorenorrath.free.fr/timeline.php" target=_blank>Lumena's timeline</A> at Lore of Norrath extremely helpful.   The site is no longer updated, but it still contains valuable information.  Lumena estimated the Rending around 150 years prior to the Shattering.</DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV><p>Message Edited by Vollux on <span class=date_text>08-22-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:32 PM</span>

[Nocturnal Aby]

<DIV>Thanks for answering for me, Vollux <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  That is indeed my source for the boiling of Innothule.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As to the sealing of Neriak, as I said, it is a rough guess, possibly happened 400 years ago, but, as I was implying, everything I listed was pretty much guess work. Educated guess work, but guess work all the same.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>