A question about death

[Siufu]

I know that if we killed a raid mob in a raid instance just for treasure, the raid mob is not actually dead. I would think of it as we defeated the creature and he went away. For example, if you kill Malkonis in GoAA, he is not actually dead. He could still appear in the future storyline.But how about a quest asked us to kill a specific creature? For example, we killed Darathar in Fire and Ice quest. Is he dead then? However we did killed Venekor in Spirit of the Lost for the quest to release the spirit of Froglok, he appear recently in the Halls of Seeing. Also in Capturing Day and Night quest, we killed Barakah and Siyamak. And they appeared again in the Pedestral of Sky. I supposed Godking is killed, how about the dragons in KoS (Harla Dar, Lord Vyemm, Talendor, Gorenaire), as Nagafen asked us to kill all of them in the Deathtoll access quest.<div></div>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>I try not to think about what the Game Mechanics has to do with the lore of the game like that. It might be better if you just don't.</DIV>

[Renita_Serafim]

<P><EM>"I can't die, it is impossible!"</EM></P> <P>Seriously though, if the character is important to the plot, they will continue to return until SOE deem them defeated for good (if ever).</P><p>Message Edited by Astralmage on <span class=date_text>05-17-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:17 AM</span>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>At least they did the Everfrost/Lavastorm access quest right. the Drakota went and flew off at 20% of his life.</DIV>

[MakhailSamma]

<P>Whenever you kill something it just respawns at its bind point like we do <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>They do not even have to go after their shards anymore.. there has been a ton of whining on the Mobs boards about making death too easy, so perhaps we will see a change later.</P>

[WarShe]

<P>They should give us exp loss and corpse dragging, then we would all be Happy. /sarcasm_off</P> <P>There really is a big lack of death penalty in game in my opinion, No one really fears death any more.</P> <P>Back to topic, If I killed it its dead but since I already helped kill Cazic Thule and Rallos Zek ect ect ect...  in the past bringing them back will be some thing my character will just refuse to accept as fact.</P> <P>Sure there are stories of how what we killed are just Avatars sent to represent the being we think we killed by the original form of the being, but try telling that to my characters heh.</P>

[Hamervelder]

We're told on the tutorial isle that death is only temporary in Norrath.  I tend to follow that guidline.

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Hamervelder wrote:<BR> We're told on the tutorial isle that death is only temporary in Norrath.  I tend to follow that guidline.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Game mechanic. Why do you think there are graves of dead people and undead running around if death is only temporary? Nobody would ever die if they just came back to life after they died.

[Pyrrhon]

<div><blockquote><hr>Cusashorn wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Hamervelder wrote: <div></div>We're told on the tutorial isle that death is only temporary in Norrath.  I tend to follow that guidline. <hr> </blockquote>Game mechanic. Why do you think there are graves of dead people and undead running around if death is only temporary? Nobody would ever die if they just came back to life after they died.<hr></blockquote>I think that's a cop-out. You shouldn't assume that it's an inconsistency when there are easily plausible explanations extant -- <i>viz</i>. the creation of zombies, vampires, and liches. If these undead can be created through specific means, it's counterintuitive to assume that the creation of ghosts is some sort of <i>deus ex machina</i> rather than the outcome of certain conditions being fulfilled. Norrath is whatever the developers say it is, and they've offered the groundwork for a system of metaphysics with that simple comment on the tutorial isle. </div>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Pyrrhonic wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Hamervelder wrote:<BR> We're told on the tutorial isle that death is only temporary in Norrath.  I tend to follow that guidline.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Game mechanic. Why do you think there are graves of dead people and undead running around if death is only temporary? Nobody would ever die if they just came back to life after they died.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>I think that's a cop-out. You shouldn't assume that it's an inconsistency when there are easily plausible explanations extant -- <I>viz</I>. the creation of zombies, vampires, and liches. If these undead can be created through specific means, it's counterintuitive to assume that the creation of ghosts is some sort of <I>deus ex machina</I> rather than the outcome of certain conditions being fulfilled. Norrath is whatever the developers say it is, and they've offered the groundwork for a system of metaphysics with that simple comment on the tutorial isle. <BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>....... That is absolutly 100% NOTHING that I was talking about...

[Pyrrhon]

<div><blockquote><hr>Cusashorn wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Pyrrhonic wrote: <div> <blockquote> <hr> Cusashorn wrote: <div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Hamervelder wrote: <div></div><font color="#ffff00">We're told on the tutorial isle that death is only temporary in Norrath.  I tend to follow that guidline.</font> <hr> </blockquote><font color="#ff6600">Game mechanic.</font> Why do you think there are graves of dead people and undead running around if death is only temporary? Nobody would ever die if they just came back to life after they died. <hr> </blockquote>I think that's a cop-out. You shouldn't assume that it's an inconsistency when there are easily plausible explanations extant -- <i>viz</i>. the creation of zombies, vampires, and liches. If these undead can be created through specific means, it's counterintuitive to assume that the creation of ghosts is some sort of <i>deus ex machina</i> rather than the outcome of certain conditions being fulfilled. Norrath is whatever the developers say it is, and they've offered the groundwork for a system of metaphysics with that simple comment on the tutorial isle. </div> <hr> </blockquote>....... That is absolutly 100% NOTHING that I was talking about...<hr></blockquote>As you can see, Hamervelder responded to the question of death in Norrath by citing actual <i>in-game lore</i>; that is, information presented by NPCs. You then dismissed it as a "game mechanic", and claimed that the existence of both temporary death AND ghosts in Norrath was contradictory if viewed from the perspective of lore. You clearly imply that the only way to reconcile the two is to relegate temporary death to nothing other than a simple game mechanic, something we must disregard when analyzing and discussing lore. I replied, essentially, that this was like saying, "The earth is flat just because it is. God made it that way, and it might not make sense, but that's the way it is, so don't bother <i>trying </i>to make sense of it." "God", in this case is, obviously, the developers. How is this not related to your comment above?</div>

[Zabjade]

<font color="#66ff00">I figure if you were to do it fanfictionwise, after a certain ammout of time after you die and arn't rezzed. you rise as undead.  Being restored from undeath requires more powerful resurrecton rituals.  That is if a Necromancer or Shadowknight doesn't get to you first. I'll let Cusa figure out the tents. </font><div></div>

[Coniaric]

For Capturing Day and Night ... it's more like you are capturing, not killing, Barakah and Siyamak because the Djinn Master wanted to kill them himself to gain their powers.