Sorry Cusahorn, someone else now talks about a dragon and luclin blowing up

[Duhulk]

<DIV>Some of the lunatics and prophets at prophets peak babble many intersting things. One thing they say talks about seeing a dragon in the sky, and then the moon exploding.</DIV> <DIV>Though, of course, I must conceed, these ARE lunatics and halfdead crazies =p. Still though....it's adding up ;></DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Renita_Serafim]

<P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><p>Message Edited by Astralmage on <span class=date_text>11-28-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:07 AM</span>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>ooh. ouch. That pwning hurt. it hurt me so bad. Ouch. look at me. I can barely stand up. ooh yes. ouch that hurt. Uh huh. that really hurt. I just got pwned by crazy desert loonatics. yes. Will I ever be able to recover from this severe pwning? I don't know. Oh god that hurts. Yes. Yes indeed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/sarcasm off.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They're desert loonatics. Thier own credibility is even more questionable than both Nagafen and that other guy who contradicts him.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>PWNING overruled.</DIV>

[Renita_Serafim]

<div></div><p> </p><p><img src="http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/313/eq20000613ev.jpg"></p><p>Nagafen himself claims that Kerafyrm destroyed Luclin to save dragonkind. Also, Nagafen's mortal enemy says....</p><p></p><hr><p>Sage of Ages said:-</p><p>You have entered Antonica.The Sage of Ages says to you,"Greetings, adventurer! I am pleased to see that you still live. Did you speak to Lord Nagafen?"You say,"Hail, The Sage of Ages"You say to The Sage of Ages,"Yes. He says he is not responsible for the Drakota's attacking you. He asks that my companions and I seek to restore Vox to life. "The Sage of Ages says to you,"Restore the Lady Vox to life? Nagafen must know that mortals do not have sufficient power or knowledge to resurrect an elder dragon from the dead. I do not trust him. The King of Fire is deceitful and sinister. His forked tongue only speaks lies. This must be why he wants me destroyed. He means to put his plots in motion and knows that I am aware of his trickery."You say to The Sage of Ages,"If that is true, then why does he want me to kill his Drakota and reclaim Vox's essence shards?"The Sage of Ages says to you,"Those Drakota must have rebelled against him and stole the shards for their own grab at power. Nagafen is still too weak from the Truthspeaker's attack to go after them himself, so he remains safely in his lair while he gets mortals to do his dirty work. "You say to The Sage of Ages,"Who is the Truthspeaker? "The Sage of Ages says to you,"The Truthspeaker was an agent of the Ring of Scale. It was he who risked his life to lead the Drakota, the same Drakota that Nagafen now commands, in an attack to stop the mating of Nagafen and Vox, a mating that would result in utter doom for all of Norrath! The Truthspeaker's Drakota were able to destroy Vox to prevent the union, but Nagafen was able to retreat to the safety of his lair."You say to The Sage of Ages,"Why is the mating of the Lady Vox and the Lord Nagafen so dangerous? "The Sage of Ages says to you,"It is forbidden among dragonkind for dragons of differing elements to mate and bring forth offspring. The combination of the elements result in a prismatic dragon, a creature of immense power and energy. Only one prismatic dragon has existed on Norrath, the Sleeper, Kerafyrm. Nagafen must believe he can control a prismatic offspring, but it seems he cannot even fully control the Drakota he wrested from the Truthspeaker."You say to The Sage of Ages,"How powerful are prismatic dragons? "The Sage of Ages says to you,"Look to the sky, child. The destruction you find there is the doing of the Sleeper simply as a display of power and a reminder to all living beings of his supremacy. Do you realize the danger now? Nagafen wants the power to do just that. Imagine an army of dragons that could each do that with Nagafen and Vox reigning king and queen over them. It is well that the Truthspeaker succeeded in his task to destroy the Lady Vox."You say to The Sage of Ages,"Now Nagafen wants me to help return her to life. "The Sage of Ages says to you,"Yes and that part worries me. He must know that no mortal possesses the ability to return an elder dragon to full life. There must be another reason why he wishes you to attempt this."You say to The Sage of Ages,"He also asked if the Drakota we defeated were in possession of a glowing orb, an Orb of Omnipotence he called it. "The Sage of Ages says to you,"An Orb of Omnipotence? I have not heard of such a thing. Did he say why he wanted it?"You say to The Sage of Ages,"No, just that it belonged to him and he would double our reward if we brought it to him. "The Sage of Ages says to you,"If the Lady Vox knew the location of this orb, it might be Nagafen's plan for you to resurrect the spirit of Vox long enough to discover the whereabouts. Even though Nagafen is using you, the best course of action would be to follow his plan so that we can learn of the orb's location before he can lay his claws upon it. Find this orb and bring it to me. We will foil the Lord Nagafen's villainous plot."] You say to The Sage of Ages,"Are you sure this is the best thing to do? "The Sage of Ages says to you,"It frightens me to say this, but yes, this is the course of action we need to take. This orb will fall into Nagafen's claws in due time unless we act to prevent it. He may already have other groups searching for it. The orcs you encountered while collecting the runes may be one such group."say to The Sage of Ages,"I understand. "Your quest journal has been updated.Your quest journal has been updated.The Sage of Ages says to you,"Follow Nagafen's instruction in resurrecting Vox's spirit, but only in this. Do not trust his words. He will deceive you with lies and fallacies. He will twist the truth and double cross you in the end. Do not let him do this for he means to bring about the destruction of this world."You say to The Sage of Ages,"I will resurrect Vox and learn the location of this orb. "</p><hr><p></p><hr><p>The Tome of Destiny says:-</p><p>She smiled faintly as she stared straight ahead with sightless eyes. "The moon was so clear. It was alive with energy flowing through every part of it. Then it was as if something in the center broke loose and leapt outward, like a bird of prey hatching from an egg. I couldn't turn away. It was so beautiful."</p><hr><p>Sounds like the Sleeper to me.</p><p></p><p></p><hr>Duhulk wrote:-<p>Some of the lunatics and prophets at prophets peak babble many intersting things. One thing they say talks about seeing a dragon in the sky, and then the moon exploding.</p><div>Though, of course, I must conceed, these ARE lunatics and halfdead crazies =p. Still though....it's adding up ;><hr></div><p><span class="time_text"></span> </p><p>Message Edited by Astralmage on <span class="date_text">03-14-2006</span><span class="time_text">09:31 AM</span></p>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>Ok. Seriously. Singling me out just to prove a point is flat out Abuse. Stop it. Now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Neither Nagafen or that sage guy is specifically telling the truth. I mean how would they know? were they on the moon when it happened? Nooooooo. Was Nagafen or that Sage speaking to the gods when it happened? Nooooooo. They're both mortals just like everyone else and was sealed off from contact from them just like the rest of Norrath, so how would either of them know what the gods were planning?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Your so-called "Evidence" is only the stories of two mortals who weren't on Luclin when it happened or near Kerafyrm when it happened, or with or communicating with the gods when it happened. It's just two stories and a bunch of desert crazies. That's not evidence. That's not proof.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Cusashorn on <span class=date_text>11-27-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:14 PM</span>

[Mordock of the Highwynd]

<P>Gotta agree with Cusa here.  Just because two evil dragons who have their own intentions tell you that the sleeper blew up the moon doesn't make it true.  The lunatics go without saying...</P>

[Mary the Prophetess]

<P>I think I will have to disagree with Cusashorn and Mordock on this one.</P> <P>Don't misunderstand.  I really do not know how Luclin was destroyed, or by whom.  I will leave that to you all to discuss.</P> <P>What I disagree with is the role of NPCs in the distribution of lore to players. </P> <P>If we are to assume that such and such an NPC is 'lying' or making up the equivilent of NPC 'fan-fiction', then we must question the veracity of information we get from any and all NPCs in the game!!</P> <P>Does this NPC have knowledge of an event?  Does that NPC have an alterior motive for recounting this story?  Is this one deliberately lying, or is that one making an honest mistake?</P> <P>I believe that we must make a leap of faith in this regard, and assume that in the absence of any contradictory NPC story line, that the developers will not allow NPCs to disseminate false information.  If we assume otherwise, then NONE of the lore previously presented has any more validity than the fan fiction we as players may choose to make up.</P> <P>At least this is the way I see it.</P> <p>Message Edited by Mary the Prophetess on <span class=date_text>11-27-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:24 PM</span>

[JDragon]

<div></div><div></div>^Above poster posted at the same time and I wholeheartedly agree with them^ Original Message: In all honesty I see the Devs pointing at the lunatics in the future and saying, "They told you all he did it!" As nice as it would be for the story to be so deep that they put three sources of false information in, I don't think that's reality. <div></div><p>Message Edited by JDragon on <span class=date_text>11-27-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:21 PM</span>

[Renita_Serafim]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>Cusashorn wrote:</P> <P><BR> </P> <DIV>Ok. Seriously. Singling me out just to prove a point is flat out Abuse. Stop it. Now.</DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>OK, I apologize if you were seriously offended by last, game show themed, post. It was to me just a humerous way to point out the staggering amount of evidence in favour of the Kerafyrm Luclin destruction theory and how you've refused to except a word of it from day one despite that. I've yet to see anything with the word "pwned" in it that is seriously offense to anyone and I'm sorry if it was here.</DIV>

[Calthine]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> JDragon wrote:<BR> As nice as it would be for the story to be so deep that they put three sources of false information in, I don't think that's reality.<BR> <P>Message Edited by JDragon on <SPAN class=date_text>11-27-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:21 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I dunno, the way gossip and innuendo runs, I think it's entirely possible.</DIV>

[Saroc_Luclin]

I disagree with the assumption that the NPC's must ALWAYS be truthful. This is foremost an RP Game, where the NPC's are supposed to be living, breathing creatures living in the Norrathian world just like the PC's are. That means they should have their own goals, desires, and their own independant knowledge of what happened and what they believe. Just like IRL, we (the players) have to weigh what the NPC's tell us against what we know from other sources (both about events in question and the NPC's reliability) and make a judgement call that way about the validity of that NPC as a source. Since everyone will weigh those comments differently, therein lies the source of the various discussions that come up.And you can be very certain that the Lore-keepers at SOE purposefully set up various red herrings and contradictory information in the game(s) specifically to make us (the players) consider and debate the details on the lore.Personally, my truthfullness scale, as in which sources I consider more reliable than others generally goes:1. Reports listed from the Gods (GM's) viewpoints, such as the Lore Background released with EQII to set up the world are the most trustful. 2. In game books. I generally trust the lore listed through the books, but they are considered written by people within the game, so there are possible discrepencies and tainted points of view.3. NPC dialog.

[Mary the Prophetess]

<P>Theoretically, I agree with what you are saying about NPCs being individuals and having their own personalities, biases, agendas and factions etc.  However practically speaking, this would leave we, the players, with know way of knowing what is true and what is not in game terms; particularly if such information deals with subjects that are long past, or for which we have no means for independant verification.</P> <P>Say for instance, that an NPC dialogue gives you, the player, a set of instructions for a quest; or gives you some vital piece of information needed to complete an in-game task.  We take it as a matter of faith and trust in the developers that they are not wasting our time by deliberately sending us on a wild goose chase.  That would be very poor game theory, and would quickly result in a very angry (did I mention PAYING) customer base.  In short, a recipe for disaster.</P> <P>Now it may be entirely possible to design NPCs to be dishonest and lie, but NOT without giving players some rather clear indications that this may be the case.  This is even more true when they are recounting stories (such as the destruction of Luclin) for which we have no alternative source of information.  By default we MUST accept their account as factual if we are to be able to form any believable volume of lore at all.</P> <P>So, yes, NPCs <EM>could </EM>(possibly <EM>should</EM>), act more like unique individuals, but from a gaming stand point, they cannot practically do so, (or can only do so under the types of constraints I have listed).</P>

[Saroc_Luclin]

Ah but you need to distinguish between the Task information and the Lore information. Take the wheel quest in Commonlands. The NPC's go on about it and you think it might be some big important wheel that you are helping to reassemble. Turns out it is something very trivial in the end.Assuming the quest isn't broken, what the NPC sends you out to do should work for the quest. But the LORE behind the task can be questionable.For a theoretical example. An NPC might give you a task to prove that Lucan is really Groundskeeper Willy. He can send you on a quest to gather a rake from near the citadel, to watch a groundskeeper outside Freeport and trail him till he enters a side gate of the citadel, to question various people around and get more information. And the result of the quest is the NPC proclaiming that Lord Lucan is REALLY Groundskeeper Willy (moments before being dragged away by the guards). Now the quest worked completely well, and was completeable. But we all know that the Quest giver was completely bonkers to suggest such a link, and the connections and conclusions he drew from the results of your quest are completely off the wall. So here, the LORE is clearly a lie, but the TASK text works perfectly fine.

[i3ry]

You mean there are people that don't think Kerefym destroyed Luclin?  Wasn't that one of the basic story elements given out like two years before this game even came out? <div></div>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> i3ry2k wrote:<BR>You mean there are people that don't think Kerefym destroyed Luclin?  Wasn't that one of the basic story elements given out like two years before this game even came out?<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>No. It was never stated what specifically happened to Kerafyrm. Moorgard said that he's still alive on Norrath but that was a long time ago, and it wasn't revealed what blew up Luclin, even in the Tomb of Destiny story that covers it.</DIV>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Astralmage wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>Cusashorn wrote:</P> <P><BR> </P> <DIV>Ok. Seriously. Singling me out just to prove a point is flat out Abuse. Stop it. Now.</DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>OK, I apologize if you were seriously offended by last, game show themed, post. It was to me just a humerous way to point out the staggering amount of evidence in favour of the Kerafyrm Luclin destruction theory and how you've refused to except a word of it from day one despite that. I've yet to see anything with the word "pwned" in it that is seriously offense to anyone and I'm sorry if it was here.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Edit your post and remove my name and the big PWNED at the end of your post and I'll call it even.

[Renita_Serafim]

OK, gone back and edited the earlier posts.

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>Thank you.</DIV>

[Espyderman]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR> <DIV>Ok. Seriously. Singling me out just to prove a point is flat out Abuse. Stop it. Now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Neither Nagafen or that sage guy is specifically telling the truth. I mean how would they know? were they on the moon when it happened? Nooooooo. Was Nagafen or that Sage speaking to the gods when it happened? Nooooooo. They're both mortals just like everyone else and was sealed off from contact from them just like the rest of Norrath, so how would either of them know what the gods were planning?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Your so-called "Evidence" is only the stories of two mortals who weren't on Luclin when it happened or near Kerafyrm when it happened, or with or communicating with the gods when it happened. It's just two stories and a bunch of desert crazies. That's not evidence. That's not proof.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by Cusashorn on <SPAN class=date_text>11-27-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>08:14 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Honestly, although they are labelled Crazy, you have to admit their part of the story which seems to be corraborated by other NPC's is odd, although they may be lying its also a safe assumption to think they may be telling the truth and gone mad knowing this.</P> <P>Fact is no one knows for sure, the quoted post proves the frustration of the responder, and the fact the OP picked one person in his title to pick on proves also this is a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] measuring contest and not a search for the truth.</P> <DIV>Why do MODS own the civil, but disagreeable posts, but wont own posts that are abusive to one person? Seems odd and immoral IMO.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Espyderman on <span class=date_text>11-28-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:23 PM</span>

[Renita_Serafim]

<DIV>I think if 4 different sources all give the same piece of lore information then there has to be at least some truth behind it. After all, Nagafen, the Sage of Ages, the Teir'Dal from the Tome of Destiny (forget her name) and the loopy prophets all claim that either Kerafyrm or an extremely big winged creatue smashed into Luclin, meaning that it is very likely that Kerafyrm is the one responsible. I seem to remember Zebuxoruk making some kind of prophecy alluding to Kerafyrm and Luclin also but I forget what it is.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The reason I made such a big deal out of Cusashorn argueing against the Kerafyrm destruction theory is simply because there's so much evidence in favour of it.</DIV>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>You know I gotta wonder, physically, Kerafyrm is a Prismatic dragon.. realistically, how is it possible to see him flying through the sky if light just passes and bends through him? Especially if the starry night sky isn't giving off any light at all?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just a musing.</DIV>

[NightGod473]

Kerafyrm was kinda glowy and opaque rather than see-through and it wouldn't be hard to imagine sunlight adding to that effect. <div></div>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>Opaque means he's completely solid and light cannot pass through him, and he deffinitly doesn't glow. The correct word is translucent but he's still hard to see.</DIV>

[Renita_Serafim]

I guess SOE wern't paying too much attention to the laws of science when they wrote that piece of lore. After all, EQ is hardly scientifically accurate as it is.

[xentavius]

<div></div>Doesn't the rest of the quest play out as the Sage of Ages was the lying [Removed for Content] that wanted the power to destroy 'moons' himself? If anything, it shows at the least Kerafym did destroy the moon and The Sage is after the same power. That leads me to believe the facts in the story are true, but people's motivations are not as they seem. Big difference there. <div></div><p>Message Edited by xentavius on <span class=date_text>11-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:04 PM</span>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Astralmage wrote:<BR>I guess SOE wern't paying too much attention to the laws of science when they wrote that piece of lore. After all, EQ is hardly scientifically accurate as it is. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>And yet they followed scientific theories and accuracies to accurately portray what happened to Luclin when it blew up from the inside out. It didn't just explode to pieces. Just by looking at it, you can see that most of it's continental plates are in tact and that the explosion was released mainly from one good side of the moon.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At the same time, you can see the surface is blacked and grey, which means everything on the surface was ignited in the explosion. Furthermore, the explosion only broke up the moon, but it still has enough mass to maintain it's own gravitational pull and orbit.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Again. Just a musing.</DIV>

[i3ry]

Kerefym having nothing to do with the destruction of Luclin is like the Norrath version of the "Tupac Shakur is still alive!" conspiracy in real life. <div></div>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> i3ry2k wrote:<BR>Kerefym having nothing to do with the destruction of Luclin is like the Norrath version of the "Tupac Shakur is still alive!" conspiracy in real life.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Ok I am sorry but that just flat out doesn't even make any sense.

[DreamerClou]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> i3ry2k wrote:<BR>Kerefym having nothing to do with the destruction of Luclin is like the Norrath version of the "Tupac Shakur is still alive!" conspiracy in real life.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Ok I am sorry but that just flat out doesn't even make any sense. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>It makes sense, he is referring to denial.  And we're not talking about the river in Egypt either.<BR></P>

[NightGod473]

<span><blockquote><hr>Cusashorn wrote:<div>Opaque means he's completely solid and light cannot pass through him, and he deffinitly doesn't glow. The correct word is translucent but he's still hard to see.</div><hr></blockquote>Fine, translucent, I still stand by him being glowy (not glowing, glowy).  He didn't actually glow, but he refracted all the light around him and it made him look kind of like he was lit up. Since we never saw him out in the sunlight, I'm going with the notion that he looked pretty amazing in full light-he was glowy.</span><div></div>

[Duhulk]

<P>Whoa whoa, hold the phone, hold the phone.</P> <P>You took this 100% the wrong way Cusahorn. I always considered this a fun little disagreement, and this was in no way an attempt to "pwn" anyone. I thought YOU might find it interesting. I guess not :smileysad:</P>

[Duhulk]

<P>I would also like to add that I am very hurt that so many of you were so quick to assume this was somehow a **** measuring contest, or that this was meant in anyway but fun.</P> <P>It was just another piece of evidence. I singled out Cusahorn because he/she are obviously the most vocal poster in this forum, and I have a great deal of respesct for him/her.</P> <P>If you think the fact that such contraversal topics are coming from the mouths of liars, deceptors, and madmen is a coincident, it's my opinion that you are sadly mistaken. My gues is this was done deliberarly to provoke these exact type of debates. I am enjoying. It seems clear that others would just perfer everone agree with them and assume abuse and personal attacks where none exist oncesoever. :smileysad:</P> <P>That said...</P> <P></P> <HR> <P>That's not evidence. That's not proof.</P> <P></P> <HR> <P>You're right, it's not proof, but it is most certainly evidence.</P> <P>You have a single passage that suggests the Dresolik (sp?) was on Luclin.</P> <P>I point out that this even is not something out of ancient history, but an event which occured in past two decades. Many people witnessed the explosion.</P> <P>So they're crazy, so what? That doesn't mean they're wrong.</P> <P>I would also like to remind you that both of our theories can exist in complete harmony. The Dresolik could have been there, it could have had a role in Luclin's destruciton. It is also entirely possible that at th same time Kerafyrm was involved.</P> <P>I could be right, you could be right, we both could be right, we both could be wrong. It's fun to talk about it imho.</P>

[Cusashorn]

<P>Its just not very nice to single someone out like that just to add new info to a point that was made months ago out of the blue like that.</P> <P> </P> <P>You have a point about the Harmony thing.</P> <P> </P> <P>I'm still sticking to my theory about the Dresolik Crystal blowing up Luclin, with or without Kerafyrm's involvement. I just think that not even he could just blow up the moon like that, so even if he was involved with it, I still think the Dresolik Crystal is the factor that actually caused the moon to blow up.</P>

[xentavius]

<span><blockquote><hr>Cusashorn wrote: <p>Its just not very nice to single someone out like that just to add new info to a point that was made months ago out of the blue like that.</p> <p>You have a point about the Harmony thing.</p> <p>I'm still sticking to my theory about the Dresolik Crystal blowing up Luclin, with or without Kerafyrm's involvement. I just think that not even he could just blow up the moon like that, so even if he was involved with it, I still think the Dresolik Crystal is the factor that actually caused the moon to blow up.</p><hr></blockquote> </span>Dresolik Crystal  - What's that? <div></div>

[NightGod473]

Info about the Dresolik, straight from EQLive lore: http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=19067 Jiva the Reckless rests now that his work is done. With the knowledge afforded to him by wise Arlyxir he was able to create a tear in the planes between the Tower of Solusek Ro and The Plane of Fire. Arlyxir has always been trusted go-between for Solusek and his father Fennin. However, Arlyxir has decided to form alliance with Solusek. The decision of direct confrontation against the populace of Norrath was not an easy one to make. They both know that Fennin would not agree to such a hostile act, because the Pantheon would not condone it. After many hours of incantations a great well marked with runes of fame appeared and began to pour the very essence of the Plane of Fire into The Tower. The Guardians of Dresolik, the Great Shard, watch over the pulsating crystal has it harnesses the power being syphoned from the Plane the Fire. Only time stands between us now. Those that I once walked with soon learn of the mistakes in their transgressions. I can hear Xuzl in his Tower, always working on his conjurings.  The crackle of the animated regiment of flaming swords can be deafening. Xuzl does not take any time to rest; for he knows as will all do that the time draws near. Greater fiends has been constructed by Solusek to spread their curse upon any that survive the initial destructive force from Dresolik. The seven fiends will be generals of the army being conjured by Xuzl. Solusek has also placed his trust in two elemetals. These elementals have coalesced into the form of wyverns. I must say that I am quite partial to their new forms, and have formed a kinship with them. Together with them we will exterminate any dragonkind that are resistant enough to flame to save them from onslaught that Dresolik will provide. Dresolik pulses with extreme power, it will soon be powerful enough to scorch Norrath. I can only hope that my voice and praise of Solusek will be enough to give the others the strengh needed to continue. <div></div>

[i3ry]

<span><blockquote><hr>I would also like to remind you that both of our theories can exist in complete harmony. The Dresolik could have been there, it could have had a role in Luclin's destruciton. It is also entirely possible that at th same time Kerafyrm was involved. <div></div><hr></blockquote>The Dresolik crystal was there.  I don't know why this is such a debate because it is so obvious.  Solusek and Rallos' plan was to use the Nexus to port the Dresolik down to Norrath to destroy it, a battle was fought in the nexus, and while it happened Kerefym attacked Luclin and destroyed the Crystal, the moon, and the plans to destroy Norrath.  The only thing there is to debate about is Kerefym's motives and whether or not he survived it. </span><div></div>

[Duhulk]

<HR>  I just think that not even he could just blow up the moon like that, so even if he was involved with it, I still think the Dresolik Crystal is the factor that actually caused the moon to blow up. <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My complete theory has always been this.</DIV> <DIV>Yes, Dresolik is on the moon. Whatever baddies are up there planning on using to focus a death beam at Norrath and burn it to a cinder, or something similar to Sol's old plans.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kerafyrm doesn't want this to happen, he causes the Dresolik to release it's energy all at once, seft-destruct (before you ask how he could do this, it might just be a matter of crushing it in his hand. Just  because it's immensely powerful doesn't mean it can't be delecate), or otherewise kamakazi (as opposed to the focus beam plan) which results in the blatent destruction of all of Luclin (explosion from the core, that seems right consdiering how it looks now) and Kerafyrm was destroyed in the explosion. I mean, even The Sleeper i gonna have a hard time surviving the self destruction of dresolik.</DIV>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> i3ry2k wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> I would also like to remind you that both of our theories can exist in complete harmony. The Dresolik could have been there, it could have had a role in Luclin's destruciton. It is also entirely possible that at th same time Kerafyrm was involved. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>The Dresolik crystal was there.  I don't know why this is such a debate because it is so obvious.  Solusek and Rallos' plan was to use the Nexus to port the Dresolik down to Norrath to destroy it, a battle was fought in the nexus, and while it happened Kerefym attacked Luclin and destroyed the Crystal, the moon, and the plans to destroy Norrath.  The only thing there is to debate about is Kerefym's motives and whether or not he survived it.<BR><BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Not entirely accurate. The invasion of the Nexus happened over 400 years ago. Luclin didn't blow up untill 15 years ago.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The Tome of Destiny told the stories in chronilogical order. The moon didn't blow up untill after the 2nd Rallosian War, and then the Rending.</DIV>

[NocteBla]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>i3ry2k wrote:</P> <P><SPAN>The Dresolik crystal was there.  I don't know why this is such a debate because it is so obvious.  Solusek and Rallos' plan was to use the Nexus to port the Dresolik down to Norrath to destroy it, a battle was fought in the nexus, and while it happened Kerefym attacked Luclin and destroyed the Crystal, the moon, and the plans to destroy Norrath.  The only thing there is to debate about is Kerefym's motives and whether or not he survived it.<BR></SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Not entirely accurate. The invasion of the Nexus happened over 400 years ago. Luclin didn't blow up untill 15 years ago.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Just because there is a large timespan there doesn't mean this could not have happened.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>First, you have to consider that we don't know the outcome of the battle in the Nexus. It's pretty obvious that the people that were there were all destroyed (except those that escaped) by Sol Ro and his folks, but <STRONG>some</STRONG>thing stopped him from porting the crystal down to Norrath as planned. I don't see it as too far-fetched that Kerafrym went to stop them, and has been guarding the crystal since then (or trying to harness it's power, since he was a bit of a power-trip). Then, possibly, either Sol Ro was able to remote-detonate it later on, or Kerafrym set it off somehow - either on accident or so that he could be sure it wouldn't get to Norrath.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This would make sense for the "bird of prey hatching" that the dark elf saw. The irony is that, under my theory, the bird of prey (Kerafrym) was dying as opposed to being born.</DIV>

[Saroc_Luclin]

Or the Goddess of Shadows, Luclin could've noticed that the Nexus teleportation magics were being used to send an invasion through, and decided to shut down the Nexus herself and/or re-seal access to the moon. Sol Ro's forces, stuck in the Nexus, spent the time trying to figure out how to get out, or were defeated by forces from across Luclin.Fast forward a few centuries and something else happens; maybe a long term project of Luclin comes to fruitition, or something else. It's hard to know for sure what happened. Maybe a dwarf mining party broke into the remains of the Nexus finally, and a gnome accidentally triggered the crystal and it blew.

[Cusashorn]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> NocteBlanc wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>i3ry2k wrote:</P> <P><SPAN>The Dresolik crystal was there.  I don't know why this is such a debate because it is so obvious.  Solusek and Rallos' plan was to use the Nexus to port the Dresolik down to Norrath to destroy it, a battle was fought in the nexus, and while it happened Kerefym attacked Luclin and destroyed the Crystal, the moon, and the plans to destroy Norrath.  The only thing there is to debate about is Kerefym's motives and whether or not he survived it.<BR></SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Not entirely accurate. The invasion of the Nexus happened over 400 years ago. Luclin didn't blow up untill 15 years ago.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Just because there is a large timespan there doesn't mean this could not have happened.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>First, you have to consider that we don't know the outcome of the battle in the Nexus. It's pretty obvious that the people that were there were all destroyed (except those that escaped) by Sol Ro and his folks, but <STRONG>some</STRONG>thing stopped him from porting the crystal down to Norrath as planned. I don't see it as too far-fetched that Kerafrym went to stop them, and has been guarding the crystal since then (or trying to harness it's power, since he was a bit of a power-trip). Then, possibly, either Sol Ro was able to remote-detonate it later on, or Kerafrym set it off somehow - either on accident or so that he could be sure it wouldn't get to Norrath.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This would make sense for the "bird of prey hatching" that the dark elf saw. The irony is that, under my theory, the bird of prey (Kerafrym) was dying as opposed to being born.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Actually I'm pretty sure the Tome of Destiny mentions in one of the stories that teleportation and the invasion of the Nexus happened at least 2 hundred years ago. And then the 2nd Rallosian War Happened.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The Destruction of Luclin story with the dark elf mentions that its after the war. Besides, Kerafyrm's a mortal like everyone else. I really find it hard to believe that he would just... Know.... what happened on Luclin like that.</DIV>

[Duhulk]

<DIV>Yes, but, EQ2 dragons are incredibly intelligent, and as you have said before, the invasion was 200 years ago and the explosion was onoy 15. That's a healthy chunk of time during which he could have learned what was going on up there. As far as transportation, it's entirely feasible he could have just flown through space. Mortal or not, it's clear prismatic dragons could have any number of interesting abilities that have never been explored.</DIV>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>At least 200.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Over 400 would probably be more accurate, but still, communication was completely cut off between both worlds. Kerafyrm would have to be psychic or have a mentality that exists in the other planes or something to know.</DIV>

[Duhulk]

<P>Just another story for SOE to tell ^_^. Given the brevity of explinations, the foreshawowing left by naggy's claim to have an army of prismatic eggs incubating, and the need for real resolution to the original "I propose a compromise" plan by Quellious, i'm sure we'll get it eventually =).</P>

[Anzak]

Not to get too involved in this but here is my 2cp for it is worth. 1) We know the Dresolik was taken to Luclin.  More than likely with the intent to move it to Norrath. 2) We know that Luclin was sealed.  This may have been an attempt by someone to stop the Dresolik from getting to Norrath.  If the defenders of luclin were able to destroy the ports on Luclin it may have the side effect of sealing the magic that allows transport to and from there. 3) We know this happened about 400 years ago. 4) We know the Luclin was shattered about 15 years ago. 5) When Luclin was shattered she claimed to see what looked like a giant bird of prey.  Now this is where you are making an assumption.  Is not also possible that when the Dresolik was activated the explosion from that far away could have taken that form? 6) We know Naggy is evil and will twist the truth to get his way. Now was the Sleeper involved.  I can't be sure maybe he activated the Dresolik.  Or maybe that was a last ditch effort to put a failed plan into place after 400 years of trying to find another way to get it to Norrath once Luclin was sealed.  Or maybe it was used as a weapon against the sleeper?  Lots of options here. <div></div>

[Renita_Serafim]

<P>OK, I think I've been PWNED this time. Check out this question and answer from OGaming's interview with Scott Hartsman.</P> <P></P> <P></P> <HR> <STRONG>OGaming: Recent adventures/expansions such as <EM>Desert</EM><EM> of Flames</EM> and <EM>Splitpaw Saga</EM> have introduced new realms, quests... What other additions do you have planned in the near future? What sorts of locales, adventures, storylines and enemies will they introduce?<BR><BR>SH: </STRONG>We can't get into too many specifics, but there are a few themes that we'll be expanding on in the future. Namely, what happened with the Gods in the Norrathian pantheon, <STRONG>and what really happened with the shattering of the world. As it stands now in <EM>EQ2</EM>, the dragons are telling people the story from their point of view. As highly intelligent creatures, sometimes they have agendas of their own.</STRONG><BR> <HR> <DIV>This sort of throws into doubt the story that Naggy and the Sage/Darathar have been telling us. One of the devs themselves has as good as said that their story is biased and it might not even be true. Just a draconic theory filled with the same narcissistic bias on themselves as everything else their race says. Sure, what the desert loons say sort of gives weight to the Kerafyrm/Luclin destruction theory, but this latest dev statement makes the whole story doubtful at this point.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Astralmage on <span class=date_text>12-10-2005</span> <span class=time_text>02:59 AM</span>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Astralmage wrote:<BR> <P>OK, I think I've been PWNED this time. Check out this question and answer from OGaming's interview with Scott Hartsman.</P> <P></P> <P></P> <HR> <STRONG>OGaming: Recent adventures/expansions such as <EM>Desert</EM><EM> of Flames</EM> and <EM>Splitpaw Saga</EM> have introduced new realms, quests... What other additions do you have planned in the near future? What sorts of locales, adventures, storylines and enemies will they introduce?<BR><BR>SH: </STRONG>We can't get into too many specifics, but there are a few themes that we'll be expanding on in the future. Namely, what happened with the Gods in the Norrathian pantheon, <STRONG>and what really happened with the shattering of the world. As it stands now in <EM>EQ2</EM>, the dragons are telling people the story from their point of view. As highly intelligent creatures, sometimes they have agendas of their own.</STRONG><BR> <HR> <DIV>This sort of throws into doubt the story that Naggy and the Sage/Darathar have been telling us. One of the devs themselves has as good as said that their story is biased and it might not even be true. Just a draconic theory filled with the same narcissistic bias on themselves as everything else their race says. Sure, what the desert loons say sort of gives weight to the Kerafyrm/Luclin destruction theory, but this latest dev statement makes the whole story doubtful at this point.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by Astralmage on <SPAN class=date_text>12-10-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>02:59 AM</SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>I've known this all along.</DIV>

[Duhulk]

<P>Meh, this changes nothing. I"ve said all along that, of course they might be lying, I simply had no perseonal reasons to believe they were at this point. Also, a skewed point of view doesn't necessarily mean they were lying about everyting. After all, while they (Nagafen and Darathar) both said kerafyrm was integral in the destruction of Luclin, both asserted different motives for him doing it.</P> <P>And by that recokoning, the next person to tell us will have their own point of view to cloud it as well =p.</P>

[Kryussius]

<P>Can you really call the Sleeper a mortal?  The first time that he was contained, it required not just Veeshan and the rest of dragonkind, but all of the gods to contain him, and even then he couldn't be killed.</P> <P>I highly doubt that (if he was involved) the destruction of Luclin could cause his demise.</P> <P> </P> <P>(( yeah, I know that he was killed on Rallos Zek, but that was a GM event - as far as the storyline Sleeper goes, he was unkillable in EQL ))</P> <P> </P>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>It wasn't a GM event. The GM's watched to make sure nothing went wrong.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Something did go wrong. An invisible and untargetable NPC from "Kerafyrm's Lair" spawned and started attacking Kerafyrm, so the GM's stopped the event so they could remove that NPC and let the players kill Kerafyrm without any help.</DIV>

[Duhulk]

<DIV> <HR> but all of the gods to contain him <HR> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Source? I only recall the 4 warders =p.</DIV>

[NightGod473]

I think that would have been better stated as "but all of the gods to put him to sleep and then four warders to keep him locked in slumber".<div></div>

[Saroc_Luclin]

Don't think the Gods were involved with knocking Kerafrym out. It was the combined might of Yelniak, the Claws of Veeshan dragons nad the Ring of Scales dragons that finally contained the Sleeper and locked him into his eternal (till those meddling mortals and their dog showed up!) slumber.

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>Yep. None of the gods were involved with Kerafyrm.</DIV>

[Naili]

<DIV>Actually the moon blowing up was just an illusion created by Luclin because she was tired of Vex Thal getting raided for loot all the time. Rallos Zek and Sol Ro were a part of this, using the crystal as a cover story to make it look like they actually had a powerful weapon capable of blowing something big up. Of course they lied and said they wanted to burn Norrath and whatnot but actually they just plugged it into the nexus to overload the teleportation system and disable people from transporting back up, because as those Scions were always saying no fighting in the nexus we don't know what a massive discharge of enegry will do. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>See Luclin thought the moon was safe after they disabled the nexus but people on the ground almost figured out how to get back up there, since after the 2nd Rallosian War they were kind of curious about what happened up there. So, they decided to go ahead and go with plan B, which was creating the illusion that the moon blew up by using a complicated system of mirrors created by the scales of the sleeper. There was a big fight with Lcea Katta, Seru, Emp Ssra, Greig, and a bunch of Vah Shir fighting him up there and they eventually killed him to make the mirrors. Once the mirrors were created, they cast the spell to fill the mirrors with the image of the shattered moon and now its beamed down to us every night, and the citizens of Vex Thal can sleep safely at night knowing their loots are safe. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Nagafan was PR control on the ground, saying that Kerafyrm blew the moon up to save norrath that way no one would ever bother trying to teleport to the moon again.</DIV>

[NightGod473]

And THAT is how Everquest 3 will begin...<div></div>

[Crolack]

So those are fake pieces of Luclin in the tutorial?<BR>

[Renita_Serafim]

<DIV>Curtesy of the Gigglegibber Corperation.</DIV>

[Kryussius]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR> <DIV>It wasn't a GM event. The GM's watched to make sure nothing went wrong.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Something did go wrong. An invisible and untargetable NPC from "Kerafyrm's Lair" spawned and started attacking Kerafyrm, so the GM's stopped the event so they could remove that NPC and let the players kill Kerafyrm without any help.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Actually yeah it was.  At least when it happened, that's what it was called.  The Sleeper was unkillable on any other server.  It was an off the cuff / not planned kind of thing, but they spawned a killable version (or just turned off his script so he didn't fly off) and a load of guilds on RZ killed the Sleeper. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In either case, it wasn't considered to be part of the Kerafyrm storyline that he was killed when awakened.  It was a GM thing in response to the players present wanting a shot at killing him.</DIV>

[NightGod473]

No, the GMs did nothing different-the script was setup that Kerafyrm wouldn't leave Sleeper's until all of the PCs in the zone were dead. I know of guilds that got him to 97% or so when they woke him up, before he wiped them all and flew off. But he was always (at least theoretically) killable, just he had such massive HP and regen it took years for the players to have the power to actually do it, and even then it took a ~200 player zerg rush to do so. No other server left him alive long enough to have the buildup of power to take him down (for instance, I'm reasonably sure that it would take ~75 people in Anguish gear to take him down these days, were he alive on any server).<div></div>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kryussius wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR> <DIV>It wasn't a GM event. The GM's watched to make sure nothing went wrong.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Something did go wrong. An invisible and untargetable NPC from "Kerafyrm's Lair" spawned and started attacking Kerafyrm, so the GM's stopped the event so they could remove that NPC and let the players kill Kerafyrm without any help.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Actually yeah it was.  At least when it happened, that's what it was called.  The Sleeper was unkillable on any other server.  It was an off the cuff / not planned kind of thing, but they spawned a killable version (or just turned off his script so he didn't fly off) and a load of guilds on RZ killed the Sleeper. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In either case, it wasn't considered to be part of the Kerafyrm storyline that he was killed when awakened.  It was a GM thing in response to the players present wanting a shot at killing him.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Dude.<FONT size=7> I WAS THERE!</FONT></P> <P><FONT size=7></FONT> </P> <P>I know exactly what happened when Rallos Zek killed Kerafyrm. I was there and witnessed it with my own eyes! It wasn't a GM event.</P> <DIV>Kerafyrm was technically never made "unkillable".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The GM's knew that Rallos Zek was going to prove that he could be killed. The Kerafyrm script alone shows that Lord Yelinak in Skyshrine is capable of knocking down about 10% of his life.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They monitored the situation to make sure nothing was going wrong. They weren't promoting it or supervising it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As I said earlier, something did go wrong. There was an invisible, untargetable NPC who spawned as part of "Kerafyrm's Lair" who was attacking Kerafyrm and aiding the players. The GM's saw this and had to put a halt to the raid. They appologized for halting everyone and said they would respawn Kerafyrm for them to try again after they removed that NPC from the zone. They gave everyone who died all the XP they lost back and 2 AA points for free.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2 days later, the 3 guilds tried again and killed him without a hitch. the GM's were watching again, but as I said, were not promoting or supervising the event.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kerafyrm was completely immune to all spells besides Manaburn and Harmtouch. If this was a GM event, He wouldn't be so resistant like that.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You need to read this: <A href="http://www.albrandes.com/skden/articles/sleeper.asp" target=_blank>http://www.albrandes.com/skden/articles/sleeper.asp</A> to learn more about the situation.</DIV>

[Duhulk]

<DIV>Some of you aren't getting one thing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Content like Kerafyrm has to be taken in the context of the time it was implemented. When Velious was the latest expansion tehre was 0% chance of a guild killing the Sleeper (when they finall had it working right). Because Kerafyrm then despawns forever (as opposed for hanging around till the end of time) the story assumption is that the Sleeper is not dead.  SOE preffered not to use an arbirary means of ensure invulnerability, they simple pumped the stats up super high (later increasing them even more so newer servers couldn't kill him).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now, Rallos Zek didn't awaken it until much much much mcuh later than the content was designed. So, yeah, for fun, the guilds managed to kill the mob. As far as the overall EQ lore goes, the sleeper gets away.</DIV>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Duhulk wrote:<BR> <DIV>Some of you aren't getting one thing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Content like Kerafyrm has to be taken in the context of the time it was implemented. When Velious was the latest expansion tehre was 0% chance of a guild killing the Sleeper (when they finall had it working right). Because Kerafyrm then despawns forever (as opposed for hanging around till the end of time) the story assumption is that the Sleeper is not dead.  SOE preffered not to use an arbirary means of ensure invulnerability, they simple pumped the stats up super high (later increasing them even more so newer servers couldn't kill him).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now, Rallos Zek didn't awaken it until much much much mcuh later than the content was designed. So, yeah, for fun, the guilds managed to kill the mob. As far as the overall EQ lore goes, the sleeper gets away.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Actually the technically didn't have the code to make Kerafyrm flat out invincible (they wouldn't untill Gates of Discord and Omens of War), but you're right, he was made more powerful with each expansion to compensate the players getting stronger. He started out only quading for 4k with Velious, but when he was defeated on RZ after Lost Dungeons of Norrath came out he hit for 6999 per hit, so he quaded for 28,000.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>He always had over 2 Billion HP and as high a regeneration rate as the game would allowed no matter what expansion. So it would have actually taken even longer to kill him if someone attempted it in Velious than the 3 hours it took RZ.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As already mentioned as well, even by Moorguard himself back when I first broke news of Kerafyrm's death on the EQ2 boards back before Alpha started, one server's triumph didn't set the standard for the numerous other servers who already had awoken him, so in EQ2's timeline he nevered died (Officially).</DIV>

[Duhulk]

<HR> so in EQ2's timeline he nevered died (Officially). <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV>...gah, don't get me started again.  :smileyvery-happy:</DIV>

[Cusashorn]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Duhulk wrote:<BR> <HR> so in EQ2's timeline he nevered died (Officially). <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV>...gah, don't get me started again.  :smileyvery-happy:</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I was backing up your post with support.

[Duhulk]

Oh I know, I was just teasing =).

[Kryussius]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kryussius wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cusashorn wrote:<BR> <DIV>It wasn't a GM event. The GM's watched to make sure nothing went wrong.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Something did go wrong. An invisible and untargetable NPC from "Kerafyrm's Lair" spawned and started attacking Kerafyrm, so the GM's stopped the event so they could remove that NPC and let the players kill Kerafyrm without any help.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Actually yeah it was.  At least when it happened, that's what it was called.  The Sleeper was unkillable on any other server.  It was an off the cuff / not planned kind of thing, but they spawned a killable version (or just turned off his script so he didn't fly off) and a load of guilds on RZ killed the Sleeper. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In either case, it wasn't considered to be part of the Kerafyrm storyline that he was killed when awakened.  It was a GM thing in response to the players present wanting a shot at killing him.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Dude.<FONT size=7> I WAS THERE!</FONT></P> <P><FONT size=7></FONT> </P> <P>I know exactly what happened when Rallos Zek killed Kerafyrm. I was there and witnessed it with my own eyes! It wasn't a GM event.</P> <DIV>Kerafyrm was technically never made "unkillable".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The GM's knew that Rallos Zek was going to prove that he could be killed. The Kerafyrm script alone shows that Lord Yelinak in Skyshrine is capable of knocking down about 10% of his life.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They monitored the situation to make sure nothing was going wrong. They weren't promoting it or supervising it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As I said earlier, something did go wrong. There was an invisible, untargetable NPC who spawned as part of "Kerafyrm's Lair" who was attacking Kerafyrm and aiding the players. The GM's saw this and had to put a halt to the raid. They appologized for halting everyone and said they would respawn Kerafyrm for them to try again after they removed that NPC from the zone. They gave everyone who died all the XP they lost back and 2 AA points for free.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2 days later, the 3 guilds tried again and killed him without a hitch. the GM's were watching again, but as I said, were not promoting or supervising the event.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Kerafyrm was completely immune to all spells besides Manaburn and Harmtouch. If this was a GM event, He wouldn't be so resistant like that.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You need to read this: <A href="http://www.albrandes.com/skden/articles/sleeper.asp" target=_blank>http://www.albrandes.com/skden/articles/sleeper.asp</A> to learn more about the situation.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Decaf bro.  Look into it.</P> <P>I'm just going off of what I read in rehashes from people who were there as well.  Their recounting was different than yours.  That's all.  </P> <P>I wasn't talking a GM event like Bloody Kith or something like that - just that (in the retelling) after Sleeper was awakened and flew off, the GMs respawned him for the Rallos guilds to take a shot at.  If that ain't right, it ain't right - you're one of several who've told the tale, and it's the first time I've heard the version you're telling.</P> <P>Calm down before you blow out an o ring.<BR></P>

[Cusashorn]

<DIV>Sorry. It's just the context that you said it. When people say "GM Event", You tend to think that it's an event that the GMs and Guides set up for the server to participate in.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They only monitored the event, but didn't start it or anything. I mean the server was buzzing with word that they were going to try it, and If you're monitoring the server statistics and see 300+ players suddenly crowding into a raid zone from 2 expansions ago, It's bound to lift an eyebrow. Like a moth drawn to flame or something.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> (300 players, btw, is stretching the very limits of the zone. A few dozen more and the zone would have crashed, which would have gained attention from the Developers anyway.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They respawned Kerafyrm to make sure the players really did attempt to kill him all by themselves. There was an invisible NPC who was grabbing Agro and attention of Kerafyrm during the first attempt, so the GM's shut it down so they could remove that NPC who was interfering.</DIV>