Ward Stacking - Information and Issues

[Sokolov]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div>This is a thread made to collect information about and examine the behaviors of Ward stacking. <u><b>Reactives and Wards </b></u>Reactive Heals will proc even if the Ward fully prevents the incoming damage.  The proc will fire even if the target is undamaged, and while there is no displayed message, yet a charge is still consumed.Bane/Shielding line of the Defiler (a reverse ward proc debuff) will proc through Wards even if the target is not actually damaged.(Need info on other proc buff/debuffs.) <u><b>Order of Casting </b></u>This is a fuzzy issue to explain, much less observe, but it basically amounts to this question: if there is more than one Ward active, how does the game decide which Ward covers that damage? Some preliminary findings, which may or may not be correct: <ul> <li>wards casted first seemed to be used first</li> <li>Spiritual Circle appears to cast a new ward on each member with every cycle</li><li>Shroud line of regenerating ward buff are absorbed first as though casted first even with a new regen</li> </ul> <div></div><p>Message Edited by Sokolov on <span class="date_text">05-04-2006</span> <span class="time_text">07:49 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by Sokolov on <span class="date_text">05-04-2006</span> <span class="time_text">12:32 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by Sokolov on <span class="date_text">05-05-2006</span> <span class="time_text">11:34 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by Sokolov on <span class=date_text>05-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:52 AM</span>

[EQAditu]

<div></div><blockquote><font size="2">(1146721763)[Thu May 04 01:49:23 2006] Turnip has been healed by the power of truth.</font><b><font size="2">(1146721763)[Thu May 04 01:49:23 2006] Morphale's Malignant Shroud absorbs 1026 points of damage from being done to Pwent.</font></b><b><font size="2">(1146721763)[Thu May 04 01:49:23 2006] Pantrilla hits Pwent but fail to inflict any damage.</font></b><b><font size="2">(1146721763)[Thu May 04 01:49:23 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer critically heals Pwent for 554 hit points.</font></b><b><font size="2">(1146721763)[Thu May 04 01:49:23 2006] Pwent's Thornstorm hits Pantrilla for 41 points of piercing damage.</font></b><font size="2">(1146721763)[Thu May 04 01:49:23 2006] Robba tries to pierce Pantrilla, but misses.</font></blockquote><font size="2">The above would seem to indicate that fully absorbed hits <i>do</i> allow some other things to react.  The second line being the ward absorbing the hit.  The third line indicating that the entire hit was absorbed and did no damage. The fourth line being a reactive heal procing.  The fifth line being a damage shield reacting to Pwent being attacked.  (The first and last lines just to show no more related info was there)  BTW, I've noticed in the past that things like damage shields will not proc reactive heals, even though they can be absorbed by wards.I can't comment on the second half as I only have one ward in total =)</font><div></div>

[Sokolov]

<div></div>Interesting.  I couldn't find a timestamp where my Ward went off at the same time as a Reactive, but I obviously just missed it.Btw, great work on ACT =D  Is there to way to make it show when a spell was casted?<div></div><p>Message Edited by Sokolov on <span class=date_text>05-04-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:51 AM</span>

[EQAditu]

<div></div><div></div><div></div>I think that spell emotes indicating a cast appear when the cast is complete, for yourself... but appear when the person starts casting for observing others.  Anyhow, while its possible in controlled settings, it gets confusing in raids with more than one of a class.  Also collecting spell emotes is very time consuming as there is no database of them.  Why were you interested in tracking when a spell is cast?On a note more related to this thread, maybe...  the only bug I can find regarding ward absorbtion messages is when a shared pool group ward protects someone other than the ward's caster.  Group wards that apply a ward to each person(like Templar's Aegis of Faith) do not seem to suffer from this problem.  An example of the bug incase anyone wants to /bug it =)<blockquote><font size="1">(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] A warden of the Trial is struck by a frenzy of attacks.<b><span>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] Morphale's Carrion Bulwark absorbs 2443 points of damage from being done to Morphale. </span></b><i><b><span><span>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] a warden of the Trial's Decree hits Bada but fail to inflict any damage.</span></span></b></i>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer heals Bada for 434 hit points.(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] Bada was interrupted!<b><span>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] Morphale's Carrion Bulwark absorbs 858 points of damage from being done to Morphale. </span></b><i><b><span><span>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] a warden of the Trial's Decree hits Morphale but fail to inflict any damage.</span></span></b></i>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] a warden of the Trial tries to smite YOU with Decree, but YOU resist.<b><span>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] Morphale's Carrion Bulwark absorbs 47 points of damage from being done to Morphale. </span></b><i><b><span><span>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] a warden of the Trial's Decree hits Pwent for 1506 points of divine damage.</span></span></b></i>(114671533<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Thu May 04 00:02:18 2006] Elocin's Vengeful Faith critically heals Pwent for 602 hit points.</font></blockquote>Lines in bold show the caster and victim as the same person, while lines in bold/italic show that the damage wasn't directed there.  It also shows more examples of cleric reactives working for full absorbs and partial absorbs =)<p>Message Edited by EQAditu on <span class=date_text>05-04-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:04 PM</span>

[EQAditu]

<div></div>I just noticed your question: "(Do they proc for 0 if the target is undamaged?  Or does it only proc if the target is damaged?)".It seemed to me in the past that reactives would use up charges regardless of if they did any healing (they would not show 0 healing, just not show).<blockquote><font size="1"><b>(1146705223)[Wed May 03 21:13:43 2006] Aditu prays for your group to receive Dire Intercession.<font color="#ccccff">(1146705225)[Wed May 03 21:13:45 2006] Morphale's Malignant Shroud absorbs 229 points of damage from being done to Pwent.</font><font color="#ff0000">(1146705225)[Wed May 03 21:13:45 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent for 1449 points of crushing damage.</font><font color="#9966ff">(1146705225)[Wed May 03 21:13:45 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer heals Pwent for 475 hit points.</font><font color="#ff9900">(1146705230)[Wed May 03 21:13:50 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent but fail to inflict any damage.</font><font color="#ff0000">(1146705232)[Wed May 03 21:13:52 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer's Vicious Cut hits Pwent for 152 points of slashing damage.</font><font color="#9966ff">(1146705232)[Wed May 03 21:13:52 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer heals Pwent for 152 hit points.</font><font color="#ff0000">(1146705233)[Wed May 03 21:13:53 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent for 1067 points of crushing damage.</font><font color="#9966ff">(1146705233)[Wed May 03 21:13:53 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer heals Pwent for 456 hit points.</font><font color="#ccccff">(1146705233)[Wed May 03 21:13:53 2006] Morphale's Malignant Shroud absorbs 822 points of damage from being done to Pwent.</font><font color="#ff9900">(1146705233)[Wed May 03 21:13:53 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent but fail to inflict any damage.</font><font color="#ccccff">(1146705234)[Wed May 03 21:13:54 2006] Morphale's Malignant Shroud absorbs 957 points of damage from being done to Pwent.</font><font color="#ff9900">(1146705234)[Wed May 03 21:13:54 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent but fail to inflict any damage.</font><font color="#ccccff">(1146705235)[Wed May 03 21:13:55 2006] Morphale's Malignant Shroud absorbs 10 points of damage from being done to Pwent.</font><font color="#ff0000">(1146705235)[Wed May 03 21:13:55 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer's Raging Blow hits Pwent for 592 points of crushing damage.</font><font color="#9966ff">(1146705235)[Wed May 03 21:13:55 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer critically heals Pwent for 541 hit points.</font><font color="#ff9900">(1146705235)[Wed May 03 21:13:55 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent but fail to inflict any damage.</font><font color="#ff0000">(1146705236)[Wed May 03 21:13:56 2006] a Thulian fear-devourer hits Pwent for 835 points of crushing damage.</font><font color="#9966ff">(1146705236)[Wed May 03 21:13:56 2006] YOUR Supplicant's Prayer heals Pwent for 451 hit points.</font>(1146705236)[Wed May 03 21:13:56 2006] Your Fateful Intercession is over.</b></font></blockquote>Dire Intecession, my L70 group reactive can proc a maximum of nine times before expiring.  In the above example, you can see it healing in blue, but there are only five healing messages.  In orange, you can see the tank receiving no damage four times.  Added up, that's nine times that Pwent took a hit of zero or more damage.  So with everything accounted for, this seems to show that reactive heals will use up charges(proc) if the target takes no damage.<div></div>

[Sokolov]

<div>And why I never saw the reactive procs when my ward absorbed was prolly just a coincidence in that between my Wards and the Warden's regens, the tank was never damaged very long, thus I never saw a Reactive proc that healed (which are the only ones that can even get parsed.)Good info! And I want to know when spells are casted to determine which Ward landed when.  I can kind of extrapolate it based on the parsed data, but it's not the same as having the timestamp of when it was first casted.  But it does sound messy to do.</div>

[Lyasa]

after watching my logs last nite when healing, noticed that Dire Shroud (or equvalent) was taking magic damage, then so on and so forth. still haven't noticed Bane proc's so i'll have to look into those. so in light of that i bring you.... observations i could never confirm before, but now are readily apparent: -1st ward cast = 1st ward used, shroud is always on, so it counts as first, even after regenerating. <div></div>

[Sokolov]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Fenrihr wrote:after watching my logs last nite when healing, noticed that Dire Shroud (or equvalent) was taking magic damage, then so on and so forth. still haven't noticed Bane proc's so i'll have to look into those. so in light of that i bring you.... observations i could never confirm before, but now are readily apparent: -1st ward cast = 1st ward used, shroud is always on, so it counts as first, even after regenerating. <div></div><hr></blockquote>If it's magic damage, Shroud took it even when other wards were up?(This may also explain why the spell line overwrites other Mit buffs.)</div><p>Message Edited by Sokolov on <span class=date_text>05-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:27 AM</span>

[sostrows]

Yeah, its a shame, when im in MT grp I have to drop Shroud as they wast the cleric mitigation buffs.  If shroud is up, it overwrites the more powerful mitigation buff of other healers.  So i put Portent on the Templar normally.As far as Bane line goes.  You have to actually take damage for it to proc.  It will not proc if another ward absorbs blow.  It does seem to proc through Circle though.Putting Bane on 3+ mobs in a raid will cause your toon to have a seizure doing the ward animation.<div></div>

[Lyasa]

healing in den ( no other healers in guild were on, so i got drafted, amazingly, i did ok) the perma-buff shroud would take precedence over all other wards. so mostly it went towards asorbing thornstorm. and that might be why it seems to take precedence over other priests mit buff, even if it's 61 master and i'm using my 47. <div></div>

[sostrows]

<div></div>Tested wards last night.Definatley FIFO (first in, first out)I got this cool item also "Enspelled Vultak Eye" from making Kettleleaders's head in Nest into it.  It is a 10% chance on every hostile spell to proc a 400 point ward on self. .  Basically you always have a 400 point ward on you, kinda nice.  Very nice item in my ranged slot.Bane proc'd through everyother ward 8-) whether it was solo/grp/pet/eye/instant.  Very happy camper.Can't wait to parse some raids using Bane.<div></div><p>Message Edited by sostrows on <span class=date_text>05-07-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:39 PM</span>

[TheBladesCaress]

Bane of Shielding is a great spell, procs plenty, and has a good duration, even gives time to get it on mutiple targets.  I usually put it on the named, switch to an add and put it on there too.<div></div>

[Sokolov]

<div><blockquote><hr>sostrows wrote:<div></div>Bane proc'd through everyother ward 8-) whether it was solo/grp/pet/eye/instant.  Very happy camper.<hr></blockquote><div><blockquote><hr>TheBladesCaress wrote:Bane of Shielding is a great spell, procs plenty, and has a good duration, even gives time to get it on mutiple targets.  I usually put it on the named, switch to an add and put it on there too.<hr></blockquote></div>Bane is now working properly thru Wards now? </div>

[sostrows]

Yep, must be some stealth update.I sat and killed Gorg's for an hour.  Used combinations of Bane/Single/Grp/Circle/item ward.<div></div>

[TheBladesCaress]

Been through the logs, I am very happy that Wards are all stacking correctly.Multiple wards work correctly...(1147009577)[Sun May 07 23:46:17 2006] Lord Vyemm unleashes a scream of chaos!(1147009577)[Sun May 07 23:46:17 2006] YOUR Purulence absorbs 2198 points of damage from being done to YOURSELF(1147009577)[Sun May 07 23:46:17 2006] YOUR Spiritual Circle absorbs 596 points of damage from being done to Elangore(1147009577)[Sun May 07 23:46:17 2006] YOUR Aura of Warding absorbs 445 points of damage from being done to Elangore(1147009577)[Sun May 07 23:46:17 2006] Lord Vyemm's Scream of Chaos hits Elangore for 722 points of crushing damage.Multiple Shammy wards work correctly.(1147011243)[Mon May 08 00:14:03 2006] Chynne's Torpor absorbs 520 points of damage from being done to Banin.(1147011243)[Mon May 08 00:14:03 2006] YOUR Purulence absorbs 2198 points of damage from being done to YOURSELF(1147011243)[Mon May 08 00:14:03 2006] Lord Vyemm hits Banin for 980 points of slashing damage.Wards working with reactives.(114700501<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Sun May 07 22:30:18 2006] YOUR Eidolic Ward absorbs 1157 points of damage from being done to Banin(114700501<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Sun May 07 22:30:18 2006] Chynne's Sacred Aegis absorbs 297 points of damage from being done to Banin.(114700501<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Sun May 07 22:30:18 2006] a Doomwing blackcoat hits Banin but fail to inflict any damage.(114700501<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />[Sun May 07 22:30:18 2006] Chesserheal's Supplicant's Prayer heals Banin for 337 hit points.<div></div>