Swash or Dirge Duo?

[Configt]

<DIV>Which duo would be a better parring...Swashy or Dirge with a Mystic?</DIV>

[Banditman]

Berserker.<div></div>

[Configt]

And if you had to choose between a Swashy or  Dirge? <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[jimmythenun]

<DIV>"And if you had to choose between a Swashy or  Dirge?"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Then I'd choose a conjuror<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Swashy.   Group invis to get where you need to go, more dps, some aoe stuff.     </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Honestly though, I duo a conjuror/mystic combo.     Summoner/healer is likely the best duo due to a pocket tank, good dps and little need for positioning.     A tank/healer fits better into a group (on pvp server, tanks are more difficult to find than healers).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you are 2 boxing, scouts are a bad choice.   If it's a buddy, play what you think will be the most fun.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Configt]

<DIV>Appreciate the input...this is for a buddy and myself.  Just wanting to see if a scout class and a mystic had a chance as a duo but also be viable to groups.</DIV>

[Terq]

Just about any combination is "vaiable."  The combination that you are suggesting just is not "optimal."  In the end, play what you enjoy. 

[Banditman]

I'm sticking with Berzerker.Why would you want a Scout?  Well, typically to do a lot of damage.  I'm down with that.You state that your goals are to duo together but still be useful to a group.  Ok, worthy goals.Now, a Mystic plus a Berzerker *is* a group!  You only need to add "anything" to it.  You don't require any further players to take on Heroic content really, it will simply be slow.  Add *any* other DPS player to the mix and you can take care of most any Heroic content.A Berzerker can do a LOT of damage.  A great deal of their ability to hold aggro is based upon their ability to do damage.  A Berzerker can outdamage a Dirge and situationally he can run neck in neck with a Swashie.  If the Berzerker kits out to be a damage dealer, he can easily fulfill that role.In a duo situation, a Berzerker provides MORE than enough damage to quickly dispatch whatever solo content you may choose to engage.  When building a group to engage Heroic content, you've already got EVERYTHING you need.I just cannot think of a situation where I'd want to duo with a Scout as a Mystic if given the chance to start from scratch.  It may seem functional in the first 20 or 30 levels, but by the time you get to L35 and hit the real meat of the level staircase you'll be wishing you had chosen a Berzerker instead.<div></div>

[mR_jOHNNO]

Must say I have to agree with a bezerker.. Im currently levelling up my zerker while 2 boxing my mystic and i've been amazed with what I can do with that combo..Yellow ^^^'s go down quick enough to get decent xp and at a push if you get adds its possible to take out 2 yellow ^^^'s at the same time.. With 2 different players atthe controls I could see it being a lot better than what I can do boxing.. Another options a monk or bruiser.. you get feign death which can get you a lot deeper into dungeonsa lot quicker than fighting your way through..and with decent dps its a good combo for getting the job done.. But to put things into perspective by the time I get my zerkerto lvl 66/67 I reckon i'll be able to 2 box mobs that I cant do with my monk/mystic at 70<div></div>

[MilkToa]

Between those 2, I would choose a swashbucker. A dirge and mystic would have pathetic DPS. A swashbucker can also tank to some degree (with good equipment and the right AAs) and has group invis.<p>Message Edited by MilkToast on <span class=date_text>06-28-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:32 AM</span>

[Eepop]

I play a mystic.  My wife plays a troubador (close enough to dirge for arguments sake). Theres a berzerker of the same level in our guild that has leveled with us the whole way. Duoing with mystic/troubador is slow, and the best we can usually take out our groups of blue heroic ^ ^ Duoing with mystic/berzerker is fast, and we can take down just about anything you can see.  We can kill an orange heroic ^^^ faster than the mystic/troubador can take out that encounter of blue heroic ^ ^ s. Shaman/Bard is workable...but shaman/zerker works well. If the person is really dead set on swash or dirge....it basicly comes down to Think about your entire future play times together.  Taking the entire time into account, what is the average number of people in your group? The lower the number, the more Swashbuckler is better. The higher the number, the more the dirge is better. <div></div>

[Configt]

My concern with going Zerker is there are lots of them out there, but Banditman brings up a good point that the zerker and mystic are a good group and therefore might be easier to find a DPS instead of a scout/mystic trying to find a group.  Appreciate the candid replies!

[MilkToa]

<DIV>It's a valid concern - they're are way to many bezerkers so if you want to raid at some point this can be a problem. I think a lot of people underestimate what you can do with a swashie and a mystic. </DIV><p>Message Edited by MilkToast on <span class=date_text>06-28-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:29 AM</span>

[Munter78]

Of the two classes you mentioned, Id say go with the swash and mystic.   I (mystic) group with a swash alot, and he is pretty much well a tank with all the buffs a mystic can give him, and with alot of dps.

[Banditman]

I think too many raid guilds underestimate the DPS a Zerker can do.  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Krieg]

Zerkers need to be hit to go berserk (aka DPS).  Mystic wards keep them from being hit.  Kind of counterproductive don't you think?  Go with a swashy for your duo.  They're semi-tanks.

[Jeger_Wulf]

<P>Go swashbuckler. Dirge DPS is too low. Get a swash, and the mob will be dead before the inferior tanking ability becomes too much of a liability. </P>

[Ordate]

<DIV>>>Zerkers need to be hit to go berserk (aka DPS).  Mystic wards keep them from being hit.  Kind of counterproductive don't you think?  Go with a swashy for your duo.  They're semi-tanks. <<</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is totally incorrect.  Wards do not stop a hit.  All effects that take place upon someone being hit still trigger while being warded.  This includs going berserk, armor effects, reactive heals, etc.  Wards absorb the damage of a hit, they do not stop the hit all together.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also if I remember correctly, zerkers go beserk on attack and on being hit.  I think the only thing that requires them to actually be hit is their in-combat regen.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[ecoskii]

<DIV>some excellent responses.  I have a 70 dirge and mystic - don't go this way unless your target is to get to 70 and raid (it is a longggg way to 70..) - then these classes will be welcomed with open arms.  If you primarily want to group - mystic/zerker is a no-brainer - the zerker health regen is the perfect balance to mystic wards and crappy direct heals.  Monk/Bruiser is another option but they provide few advantages (cheaper armour....!) and their poorer aggro control on group encounters just cause problems for mystics. </DIV>

[Eepop]

<blockquote><hr>Ordate wrote:<div>>>Zerkers need to be hit to go berserk (aka DPS).  Mystic wards keep them from being hit.  Kind of counterproductive don't you think?  Go with a swashy for your duo.  They're semi-tanks. <<</div> <div> </div> <div>This is totally incorrect.  Wards do not stop a hit.  All effects that take place upon someone being hit still trigger while being warded.  This includs going berserk, armor effects, reactive heals, etc.  Wards absorb the damage of a hit, they do not stop the hit all together.</div> <div> </div> <div>Also if I remember correctly, zerkers go beserk on attack and on being hit.  I think the only thing that requires them to actually be hit is their in-combat regen.</div> <div> </div><hr></blockquote>Just wanted to confirm that Ordate's correction is indeed correct.  I spend most of my time grouping with a berzerker and a templar.  And thier when-hit abilities all work. It was not always like this, but it was fixed in I think LU 13.  Also there are a couple abilities that are bugged and dont work in this fashion, but none are berzerker or even templar.  The only one I know of is a defiler spell.<div></div>

[Halade]

<DIV>Since my ranger was knocked back to the mortal level (reluctantly admit it was necessary)</DIV> <DIV>... </DIV> <DIV>I started boxing a Mystic/zerker duo... and it's sick.  I enjoyed reading others posts on this duo, as it affirms much of my own experience.  There is very little that can't be tackled.  At 44's, I can pretty much take anything in CT that i encounter.  Zerker is in full ebon, using either fabled 2h, or fabled kite shield and ebon slash.  Mystic is mostly Adept3's or M1's for spells.  Thinking I may respec the zerker AA's to the stamina line, the offensive bonuses are pretty tempting... currently am part way through the Wis line.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now for the true derail....I am curious to know how a bruiser/monk pairs up with a shammy... any thoughts?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Edit: deleted comments about disagreeing with ward preventing hits.  Seems to have been sufficiently corrected <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV><p>Message Edited by Haladeth on <span class=date_text>06-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:45 AM</span>

[Banditman]

The effectiveness of avoidance style tanking drops off the closer you get to end game, therefore, as you get to the tougher and tougher levels to grind, it becomes harder and harder to earn those levels with a Brawler tank.<div></div>

[juz]

<DIV>I'm sorry but the shield AA line for Bards is much better tanking-wise than the one for Rogues. I understand that Swashys get some taunts. Well Dirge with Hate Buff won't loose agro to a Mystic. Dirge/Mystic it is slow DPS but I could take white heroics with my Mystic froend healing me, and I've never been fabled equiped. Not sure how many positional attacks Swashys have as I only have played a Brigand, but Dirges don't loose too much DPS if they are tanking (meaning mobs is frontal to you).</DIV> <DIV>I'm not saying pick a Dirge over Swashy but just wanted to say the shield AA for Bards rock.</DIV><p>Message Edited by juzamaku on <span class=date_text>06-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:16 AM</span>

[Ordate]

<P>Eepop, Im just curious as to what spells/effects you know of that don't trigger because of a ward being in place.  Wish that wasnt the case at all, but until such things are fixed would like to know what isn't working properly.</P> <P>PS: Sorry about the slight derail.</P>

[Eepop]

I want to say Bane of Shielding line, but I cant find the evidence post now.  I dont have a defiler myself, so I can't test it. But looking now, thats not quite what we were talking about as Bane of Shielding is a debuff that makes an enemy proc wards on its target as opposed to a buff that procs something when hit. Defilers say the proc rate on Bane of Shielding is pathetic and not anywhere near what the description says, and I saw a post i believe with a log showing how it didnt proc when the target was warded. <div></div>