wards v reactives

[Mecrushu]

<DIV>Mystics already have a high agro job trying to slow and debuffs a mob or groups of mobs,  But why do our wards have to add agro to us every time the tank is hit.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Reactives for druid classes and cleric classes all say in the spam</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>tank heals tank  for 100</DIV> <DIV>tank heals tank  for 100</DIV> <DIV>.....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>our ward spam is like this:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>"the person that just slowed and debuffed you" now is healing the person that is kicking the crap out of you.</DIV> <DIV>or actually </DIV> <DIV>mystic wards tank for 100</DIV> <DIV>mystic wards tank for 100</DIV> <DIV>....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>IMO this is the thing that makes me most ineffictive on a group.  If its a single target its np but when it is a multi-mob group or if we have more then one group of mobs, I end up with the agro.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If they would just assign the agro for the ward to the tank like the other healing classes do,  we would be better off.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The hate reducing spells are useless.  I have yet to see a mob stop atacking me when I use quelling spirits.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Generally I look for groups where I am the second healer or they have a good chanter.   To me that is the only way to be successful in a dungeon like runnyeye.  </DIV>

[Banditman]

You are completely wrong. Right now, a Ward adds aggro to the person the Ward is active on. Note the spam:  "Your ward absorbed xxx points of damage." This spam only appears in the chat of the person upon whom the Ward is cast, and they receive all aggro from the "heals".  The ONLY part of the Ward that adds to a Mystic's hate is the INITIAL cast. <div></div>

[Zav]

It's a rare occurance that I get aggro from a ward. It's a rare occurance to get aggro period with a taunting tank. Warding during the pull instead of before is one of the few ways I've ever aggroed with a ward.

[Mecrushu]

<P>Ok so lets help me figure out what i'm doing wrong.  Maybe im having to heal too early becuase im too low for the group/tank im healing. </P> <P>5 gobs come chasing the tank back to the group</P> <OL> <LI>target tank</LI> <LI>AE slow</LI> <LI>AE debuff  >> I usually get agro here but I know the tank can get them off with a ae taunt<<</LI> <LI>ward tank</LI> <LI>heal tank </LI> <LI>single target debuff/slow as able</LI> <LI>if things are going very well then dot/nuke</LI></OL> <P>I expect to get agro ae slowing and debuffing that is what shamans do.  The agro im concerned about comes when after I start the healing steps.  If I put a ward on someone and I dont get initial agro then a mob peels off to come after me then I see that as my the warding causing the agro not the initial cast. </P> <P>I guess it really happens most is when im in a group as a solo healer and im having to heal to fast,  but this I can understand.  I also agree that their are some tanks it happens alot less with.</P> <P>It is too easy to dismiss the problem to the tank or to the fact that our heals suck and now our debuff do too.  If there were NO successful mystic out there, but there are and they play with the same spells I do.  So I must need some tips.</P>

[Banditman]

The problem is your tank. I do something very similar and never get aggro, though I do skip the whole Ward part since it's worthless and inefficient. <div></div>

[GuardianKing]

yeah your tank needs to Hold the line when your in an AOE group or AOE taunt right off the bat. pisses me off that tanks at lower levels hardly ever AOE taunt at the begining of fight <div></div>

[Puppyf]

Initial cast builds agro for you. Every ward absorbtion builds agro for the tank. *THIS* is why its so hard playing a druid because WE are the only ones who always generate agro for ourselves. Our heals are currently better, but if they buff you up too much, or make your wards mitigate damage, then you'll be by far the best healers and druids will be back to last place. <div></div>

[FelixDomesticus]

<span><blockquote><hr>Puppyfat wrote: Our heals are currently better, but if they buff you up too much, or make your wards mitigate damage, then you'll be by far the best healers and druids will be back to last place. <div></div><hr></blockquote>Same envy all the time... remember that devs promised that all healers are EQUAL in healing power? You do? Good.</span><div></div>

[Badaxe Ba]

<P>My advice, for what its worth, is this.  Change the order of your casting, in one way, move the ward to #2.  This is more effective because it allows your tank to set the hook, so to speak.  A good tank will start with a taunting attack, followed by an HO with a taunt as well.  Casters who 'step' into this process with an offensive spell can disrupt and pull from almost any tank.  This order also should be flexible, depending on how many mobs you are fighting!</P> <P> </P> <P>Kaleos</P> <P>Lvl 24 Mysitc, Toxxulia</P> <P> </P>

[Spag]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> FelixDomesticus wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Puppyfat wrote:<BR>Our heals are currently better, but if they buff you up too much, or make your wards mitigate damage, then you'll be by far the best healers and druids will be back to last place.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Same envy all the time... remember that devs promised that all healers are EQUAL in healing power? You do? Good.<BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>There is always going to be one class "more equal" than the rest.  I think what Puppyfat was leading to is that a ward is more usefull, as it has 100% scalability to mob DPS, where as a HoT does not.  Now wards need mitigation, no argument there.  Wards are also of a lower HP than reactives and regen, I think this needs to stay this way, else wards will become much more powerful than the other class specific heals.  They can put the heal back that is supposed to go off at the expiration of the ward as well without overpowering wards.</P> <P>Just my thoughts.</P>

[Mecrushu]

<DIV>I have been playing  with my slow/debuff stacking and I have been quite surpised how much the mobs DPS drops.  I need to put a parser on it but I sure didnt have a problem keeping up with heals.  This works best on single target group mobs because you have a single target to stack spells on and the length of the fight makes it worth casting all of them.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>my cast pattern was as follows:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ancestral Ward (adept III)</DIV> <DIV>howling haze (adept III)</DIV> <DIV>mourning soul (adept I) yes is is a Pain in the Butt because of the root but seem to be worth it</DIV> <DIV>Grim Lethargy (adept III)</DIV> <DIV>Umbral Trap (adept III) when it was up</DIV> <DIV>Spiritual Healing (adept III)</DIV> <DIV>Ancestral Ward ( adept III)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Berserker was tanking and rarely got below 60%.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>He did almost die once but I couldnt see target and when i tried to run to him in bear form i got messed up  because of how they messed up 1st and 3rd person view in animal form.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I guess RE was just not a good place for me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks for the suggestions~</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Venomj]

<DIV> <DIV>i do agree that regen ticks should give the tank agro instead of the druid. but given the added utility druids posses over other healers im not sure how much room they would have to gripe if they end up in 3rd. its a bit like saying a monk should keep their dps, fd, mend, and out tank warriors / knights.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i think wards takeing dmg after mitigation is all the fix they need.. im not sure i want to see them add the insta-heal to the end of wards, as that may cause balance issues with other spells... to echo spagma, wards are already below reactives in heal/power ratio, which they should be due to wards being the greatest heal/sec in primise. atm reactives are 2-3x more efficient on a plate tank than wards all because of mitigation, which is way sad imo. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>debuffs are nice, but im dissapointed in slow as many melee mobs with power bars arent slowed down much because of their combat arts. its alot like slowing a caster, it looks pretty but dont do a lot.</DIV></DIV>

[Spag]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Venomjak wrote:<BR> <DIV> <DIV>i do agree that regen ticks should give the tank agro instead of the druid. but given the added utility druids posses over other healers <BR> <HR> </DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>What utility might that be?  Also each class should have the same or very similar aggro/HP healed ratios.  I see no reason to make an imbalance on aggro.  It just does not make sense why 100 HP healed by one priest would anger the mob more than 100 HP healed by a different priest.   Please explain your point of view so I may better understand it.<BR></DIV> <DIV>It does not seem right that you want the priest class with the lowest Armor class and mitigation % to get the most aggro, and in hence take the most beating, where is the balance in that?</DIV><p>Message Edited by Spagma on <span class=date_text>04-27-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:16 PM</span>

[Banditman]

[Removed for Content] Circle of Seasons rocks.  Saved our butts on Ar'ticae.

[Venomj]

<DIV> <P>spagma</P> <P>root, snare, grp evac, grp invis comes to mind. perhaps im mistaken and other healers have an answer to those.</P> <P>i think you misread what i typed..im not sure what you misunderstood about "give the tank agro instead of the druid" . the druid should get a small bit of buffing agro just like the other 2 healers when they put a ward/reative on.. but then the regen every tick should cause the tank/target agro, just as wards/reactives do when they get hit.</P> <DIV> </DIV></DIV>

[Banditman]

Evac is Warden only. Invis is Fury only. Root and Snare are of extremely low value in EQ2.

[Spag]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Venomjak wrote:<BR> <DIV> <P>spagma</P> <P>root, snare, grp evac, grp invis comes to mind. perhaps im mistaken and other healers have an answer to those.</P> <P>i think you misread what i typed..im not sure what you misunderstood about "give the tank agro instead of the druid" . the druid should get a small bit of buffing agro just like the other 2 healers when they put a ward/reative on.. but then the regen every tick should cause the tank/target agro, just as wards/reactives do when they get hit.</P> <DIV> </DIV></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Heh read that like 5 times and still read it wrong.  Man I am getting old.  Yeah I though you were saying it should give the druid aggro and that their utility makes up for it, sorry my error.    With that in mind, you can see why I was confused.</DIV>

[Venomj]

<DIV>yeah, i was talking about 2 differant subjects at once, my bad.. after re-reading i see how you came to that conclusion. i should have quoted and replied individualy.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i dont like to seriously talk about balance at this point. with so many spells that are broken its hard to tell where a class would realy be. so its just conjecture on my part.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>wards need fixed.. fact we can all agree on.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Venomjak on <span class=date_text>04-29-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:06 AM</span>