What spell should i Upgrade to Adept III?

[Si]

Hi! Iam a High Elf Warden lvl 29. I have upgrade the following spells to Adept III. Regrowth Effloresce Chill What more should i Upgrade, or shall I wait ? <div></div>

[SunDra]

<div></div>Bloom. Quick heal for 247 + ticks for 35ish (Don't quote me on that) that stack with all other HoT effects. Low mana cost, too. Edit: It still has its uses at 50, so it is not like you have to worry about replacing it with another spell down the road. <div></div><p>Message Edited by SunDrake on <span class=date_text>06-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:29 PM</span>

[Unmask]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SinX wrote:<BR>Hi!<BR><BR>Iam a High Elf Warden lvl 29. I have upgrade the following spells to Adept III. <BR>Regrowth<BR>Effloresce<BR>Chill<BR><BR>What more should i Upgrade, or shall I wait ? <BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Nature's Caress.<BR>

[Puppyf]

No brainer. Nature's Caress. <div></div>

[Spag]

<DIV>You can also get BotG at adept 3, it heals for about 106 or so every 3 seconds when maxed out.  This spell at adept3 alone, allowed me to solo many ^^ mobs in my 20s and at lvl 30 in Zek I was able to solo the heroic groups of 5 lvl 32s or 33s of foragers or warpriests, and raiders, without having to touch any of my instant heals.  It was well worth the cost.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you can afford to do so, get all your heals up to adept3.  Except maybe the group heals.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>[Edit: Fixed HP value for BotG, had the Regrowth number in there]</DIV><p>Message Edited by Spagma on <span class=date_text>06-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:00 PM</span>

[Thibor24]

<DIV>Another one for Natures Caress, I'm 46 and still using it constantly.</DIV>

[POX67]

I have BotG, Nature's Caress and Nature's Refuge all at Adept 3. Haven't regreted spending the money on any of these. If I had to pick and order for getting them upgraded I would start with Nature's Caress, then BotG and finally Nature's Refuge. <div></div>

[Spag]

<DIV>I actually have:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Regrowth</DIV> <DIV>Bloom</DIV> <DIV>Winds of Renewal</DIV> <DIV>Sylvan Wind</DIV> <DIV>Effloresce</DIV> <DIV>Blessing of the Grove</DIV> <DIV>Frost</DIV> <DIV>Blessing of the Earth</DIV> <DIV>Healing Breeze</DIV> <DIV>Nature's Caress</DIV> <DIV>Summers Flame</DIV> <DIV>Winds of Frost</DIV> <DIV>Natures Embrace</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The only ones I would say I regret, are the group HoTs and possibly the group instant heals, they have come in handy, but probably could have done without having them at adept3.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As you can see I like having my Warden decked out, and  I plan on getting all my single target heals to adept3 as I level.  The Damage spells, I might do as well.  Now that I think of it, I probably will.</DIV>

[Arielle Nightshade]

Yup yup...bloom and regrowth are a heal stack that can't be beat - for many Tiers to come.   If you have the rare for Nature's Caress, I say go for it - then get the coral for Bloom.  Well worth it!

[Si]

Whats the stats for BotG Adept III? I have Adept I alredy. <div></div>

[LordOlr]

imo u dont need a single adp3 for exping. i did fine with adp1s up to lvl50 even when being the only healer in my group, the limit of my healing power was _never_ the amount i could heal but the aggro i created (maybe adp3s cause the same aggro than adp1s ?? in that case adp3s would have increased my healing powers ofc). so imho the only upgrades u should do are the ones u still need at lvl50+ for tier2 thats <div>Bloom (a must) </div> <div>Sylvan Wind (nice to have coz of the shorter cast time compared to the t5 group heal) Stinging Swarm (pathetic dmg but at least it works on most raid mobs. upgrade isnt that big but its cheap) </div> <div>Effloresce (quite a few ppl seem to use that one. personally i dont) </div> <div> </div> no tier3 spell. tier4 only the spells that do no get an upgrade at tier5: for all of these spells the dif between adp1 and adp3 is rather small so not upgrading t4 at all is an option. Summers Flame (sucky dmg i know but its ur only fire based dmg spell and with all the raid mobs being either cold resistant or immune u gonna love it) Neireids Kiss and Bramblecoat (the dif between adp1 and adp3 is very small so its prolly not worth it) Frostbite (very small dif as well and most raid mobs are cold immune anyway) conclusion: except for Bloom there is _no_ t1-t4 spell where the adp3 is really worth it. <div></div>

[Urkra]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LordOlrik wrote:<BR>imo u dont need a single adp3 for exping. i did fine with adp1s up to lvl50 even when being the only healer in my group, the limit of my healing power was _never_ the amount i could heal but the aggro i created (maybe adp3s cause the same aggro than adp1s ?? in that case adp3s would have increased my healing powers ofc).<BR><BR>so imho the only upgrades u should do are the ones u still need at lvl50+<BR><BR>for tier2 thats<BR><BR> <DIV>Bloom (a must)<BR></DIV> <DIV>Sylvan Wind (nice to have coz of the shorter cast time compared to the t5 group heal)<BR>Stinging Swarm (pathetic dmg but at least it works on most raid mobs. upgrade isnt that big but its cheap)<BR></DIV> <DIV>Effloresce (quite a few ppl seem to use that one. personally i dont)<BR></DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV>no tier3 spell.<BR><BR>tier4 only the spells that do no get an upgrade at tier5:<BR>for all of these spells the dif between adp1 and adp3 is rather small so not upgrading t4 at all is an option.<BR><BR>Summers Flame (sucky dmg i know but its ur only fire based dmg spell and with all the raid mobs being either cold resistant or immune u gonna love it)<BR>Neireids Kiss and Bramblecoat (the dif between adp1 and adp3 is very small so its prolly not worth it)<BR>Frostbite (very small dif as well and most raid mobs are cold immune anyway)<BR><BR><BR>conclusion: except for Bloom there is _no_ t1-t4 spell where the adp3 is really worth it.<BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>For T2 add Regrowth, it doesn't stack with Chloroplat at high level but the different refresh timer allows you to have two regen spell going on two different people.</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Faeoren]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Urkraft wrote:<BR><BR> <P>For T2 add Regrowth, it doesn't stack with Chloroplat at high level but the different refresh timer allows you to have two regen spell going on two different people.</P> <P><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Not to mention Regrowth adept 3 and Bloom adept 3 are great for when you mentor down!</DIV>

[LordOlr]

cant check that part about regrowth atm as the servers are down but even if it works i fail to see to relevance at lvl50+. do u really use regrowth at that lvl? in raids? <div></div>

[Arielle Nightshade]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LordOlrik wrote:<BR>cant check that part about regrowth atm as the servers are down but even if it works i fail to see to relevance at lvl50+. do u really use regrowth at that lvl? in raids?<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I use the Bloom/Regrowth stack as a very low power 'heal' for folks using the manastone.  It's also nice to have available for those times when you are out of mana for the bigger heals, but have enough for either one of these.  I have had it make a difference - the MT was still standing at the end of the fight (granted, he had maybe 2 HP left...but he was standing!!).  <BR></P> <P>I definitely do not depend on it for main heals - but it's very nice to have in reserve for this reason.</P>

[Urkra]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LordOlrik wrote:<BR>cant check that part about regrowth atm as the servers are down but even if it works i fail to see to relevance at lvl50+. do u really use regrowth at that lvl? in raids?<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Yes, When healing MT between refresh from Sylvan Water and Verdant Raptures (you have about 1.5 seconds if chaining) i use regrowth often on other group members using manastone ... or even on myself, while keeping Chloroplast going on MT constantly.

[neble]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Puppyfat wrote:<BR>No brainer. Nature's Caress.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>After I saw lvl 29, this is literally word for word what went through my head.

[Spag]

<DIV>At 32 I did Natures embrace, and now at 33 it heals 610+164 + 109 (every 5 seconds, not sure how many ticks).  This spell still has a long way to grow for me as well, and is close to double Natures Caress.  Not sure of the power cost difference between them.  Will have to check it out.</DIV>

[Unmask]

<P>The big heal is roughly twice the power of the smaller heal.  The difference in casting time and the recast is also an important difference.</P>

[Unmask]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Urkraft wrote:<BR><BR>Yes, When healing MT between refresh from Sylvan Water and Verdant Raptures (you have about 1.5 seconds if chaining) i use regrowth often on other group members using manastone ... or even on myself, while keeping Chloroplast going on MT constantly. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>I use mossy tincture - a nice cheap group hot that works zonewide in a raid instance.  Too often other casters will be out of healing range for a single target spell.

[neble]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Spagma wrote:<BR> <DIV>At 32 I did Natures embrace, and now at 33 it heals 610+164 + 109 (every 5 seconds, not sure how many ticks).  This spell still has a long way to grow for me as well, and is close to double Natures Caress.  Not sure of the power cost difference between them.  Will have to check it out.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Nature's Embrace is the big heal as Unmasked said.  This and Nature's Carress are the heart of your heal spells in your 30s since they are on different recast timers with NC healing faster but for less over NE.</P> <P>It's good to have both at Adept 3 if you can, they are different tier spells and require different resources to upgrade (Jasper for NC and Opal for NE?)</P>

[Ravenmi]

<P>I'd go with NC before upgrading NE for sure personally.  I used adIII NC even over the level 40 training version of NE.</P> <P>Fast cast time, just a hair over 100 power per cast, and it was healing for around 460ish + 200ish then 165 per tick.</P> <P>Pretty sure those numbers are right.. I'll have to double check tho.</P> <P>Overall seems to be a more effecient heal then NE.  Fast recast timer on it also which makes for good spamming if the need arises.  I tended to use NE then throw in a quick bloom while the recast timer of NE was down then hit em with it again.</P>

[Si]

Thanks for all the tips. I guess I will upgrade "Nature's Embrace" to Adept III. Then I want to know how the stats are for: Oakskin Adept III Summer's Flame Adept III Winds of Frost Adept III Blessing of Wild Adept III Anyone who have the stats? Iam at 32.1 now, and I think i will reach lvl 33 tommorow. Anyone who have the stats for it or can tell me witch of them who is worth to upgrade tp Adept III ? <div></div>

[Arielle Nightshade]

Cillan has an awesome post where he lists all the Adept 3's he has....can't find the thread though, but have it bookmarked at home.   I'll post it if someone else hasn't already when I get back.

[Spag]

<DIV>I can check Summers Flame and Winds of Frost at some point.  I have them both, even got a discovery for making Winds of Frost.  I am currently at 33.</DIV>

[Spag]

<P>Ok heres the numbers at lvl 33.5 with a Natures Refuge skill of 168</P> <DIV>Summers FLame Adept3</DIV> <DIV>Power 61</DIV> <DIV>Require 155 Mastery 205 - Natures Refuge</DIV> <DIV>Inflicts 134-165 damage on target</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Winds of Frost Adept 3</DIV> <DIV>Power 166</DIV> <DIV>Require 160 Mastery 210 - Natures Refuge</DIV> <DIV>Inflicts 235 Damage on target encounter</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>For comparison:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Frost Adept 3</DIV> <DIV>Power 61</DIV> <DIV>Require 125 Mastery 175 - Natures Refuge</DIV> <DIV>Inflicts 201-246 damage on target</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Basically Summers Flame is just not a very powerful spell, although it has a way to improve for me still, I don't think it will be as powerful as Frost will be.  But then again, I have been told its our only heat damage spell, and is useful for any mobs with high cold resists.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Both the recast timers on Frost and Summers flame are very short, which is nice for chain nuking.  Though you will find yourself waiting on the HO recast timer.</DIV>

[Unmask]

<DIV>EXactly.  Your cold based spells will be getting more powerful as you get newer ones but summers flame will max out and will never be as good as frost.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Of the four daily instanced epics (Permafrost - Drayek, Commonlands - King Zalak, Antonica - Arch Lich, Feerrot - Overlord Somethingorother and Phawt Whatshisname), all these mobs are immune to cold (the Antonica epic is the Arch Lich but also includes the twins enounter of which one of the twins is immune to cold and the other immune to heat).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Other epics (contested mobs like Vox and Solusek's Fist as well as non daily instanced zones like K'Dal in Maiden's Gulch and Tremblar Behemoth in Zek) will vary based on the mob.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oddly enough, if a mob is immune to a spell, he can still resist it and if he doesn't resist it will still work with respect to HOs even if it has no effect on the mob.  So unless you are going to cast summer's flame throughout the fight, there's really no point in using it just to finsh HOs (smite works just fine for that and for a lot less power).  This is one reason I never bothered upgrading summers flame past adept 1.</DIV>

[Sunfire]

<P>This may be helpful for some:</P> <P>Benison of the Wild - Adept I vs Adept III at lvl 48</P> <P><A href="http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mac2j/detail?.dir=710a&.dnm=8ac7.jpg" target=_blank>http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mac2j/detail?.dir=710a&.dnm=8ac7.jpg</A></P> <P>Spirit of the Oak App I vs Adept I vs Adept III at lvl 48.</P> <P><A href="http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mac2j/detail?.dir=710a&.dnm=215c.jpg&.src=ph" target=_blank>http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/mac2j/detail?.dir=710a&.dnm=215c.jpg&.src=ph</A></P> <P>Let me know if the links dont work and I'll just post the stats....  seems you get very little stat upgrade and mostly mitigation/proc improvements.  I have Summer's Flame Master I and its grey to me - I'll post the stats tomorrow if I can.</P>

[neble]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SinX wrote:<BR>Thanks for all the tips. I guess I will upgrade "Nature's Embrace" to Adept III. Then I want to know how the stats are for:<BR><BR>Oakskin Adept III<BR>Summer's Flame Adept III<BR>Winds of Frost Adept III<BR>Blessing of Wild Adept III<BR><BR>Anyone who have the stats? Iam at 32.1 now, and I think i will reach lvl 33 tommorow. <BR><BR>Anyone who have the stats for it or can tell me witch of them who is worth to upgrade tp Adept III ?<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Just understand that Nature's Embrace is a higher tier spell so it uses different resources.  My advice would still be to upgrace Embrace and Carress because any good Warden uses both.

[Ravenmi]

<DIV>You may use both but I think I used NE maybe 10 times between levels 30-44 and thats about 5 more times then I've had someone die on me between those levels that wasn't a mage. (or when I wasn't mentoring, heh)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[neble]

You must have some extremely impressive tanks you group with then.  I use NC and NE together constantly, but then I find myself hunting a lot of orange/red grouped mobs in pick up groups where tanks may not keep their gear current.  NE is a slow recast, but it's a fast way to recover health from a single damage spike... far better than Nature's Carress.  The fact they're on different timers also makes NE compliment NC nicely - big heal, little heal.

[Ravenmi]

<P>I could count the amount of times I've been in a pickup group or non guild group since I started playing on one hand and still have fingers left I think.  Does have some to do with it I'm sure, heh.</P> <P>My usual routine for someone taking moderate to heavy damage was (training HOT, Ad3 NC, Ad3 Bloom.  Then NC again if they really needed it still) but usually could just cycle those heals and make use of the regens to keep the tanks I've grouped with in good health.  By the time Bloom is done casting you can cast NC again already.  (and of course making use all of the debuffs and buffs we can)</P> <P>But I could see how with a Tank/ group thats not as good or not as well equiped that the healing would probably be a bit more unstable.  </P> <P>Spend a large amount of my time duoing with a Ranger too and in those cases I'm the tank.  Our usuall target is either orange solo/small group encounters or blue heroic encounters and I've never used NE then either.  But doubt many use NE soloing or when tanking cause of the cast timer.</P>

[neble]

Pulling off a NE solo is about as much fun as pulling off Winds of Frost solo.  Yep, I have bloom and Chloro in my heal linup with NC too, but sometimes it's just not enough in those pick up groups.  :smileysad: <p>Message Edited by neblehK on <span class=date_text>06-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:31 PM</span>

[Spag]

I pull off NE and Winds of Frost solo regularly.  But I stack my AGI like crazy too.  Its a good 15% higher than my Wis. <p>Message Edited by Spagma on <span class=date_text>06-15-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:52 PM</span>

[Gravewolf]

So looking at just Tier 4 stuff (just mined a Ruth cluster <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> ) the best choice would be Nature's Embrace, yes? <div></div>

[Unmask]

NE is a good choice but it does get replaced.  Frostbite and Bramblecoat do not get replaced (currently) and are T4 as well.  They are not your core spells but it is something to consider.

[Shortbea]

<DIV>The most lasting spell I use is bloom adept 3.  I use it at level 50 because it doesn't share any re-use timers as any of my current heals and it does well when I need to patch heal in group or on raids.  Chlroplast adept 3 + bloom adept 3 + tank = duo iceberg</DIV>

[Ravenmi]

<DIV>If I had the choice of upgrading one and only one t4 spell it would be Frostbite without a doubt.  We have no upgrade to it and its a great source of damage for us.  NE gets upgraded.  I never upgraded NE and I never missed it one bit or wish I had.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Arielle Nightshade]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Unmasked wrote:<BR>NE is a good choice but it does get replaced.  Frostbite and Bramblecoat do not get replaced (currently) and are T4 as well.  They are not your core spells but it is something to consider. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I agree with Un..I like this one in Master very much.  Adept 3, I think is not far behind that in performance.  And, of course, there's always Verdurous Journey.  (Okokok..I'm just kidding about verdurous journey)...</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Gravewolf]

Thanks for the input <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Sounds like Frostbite is a solid choice then. <div></div>

[Sunfire]

<P>Here are some more stats:</P> <P>Summer's Flame Master I (grey con)</P> <DIV>Power 84</DIV> <DIV>Refuge (155)</DIV> <DIV>Disruption (205)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Inflict 206-251 on Target.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-------------------------------------------------------</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Steward of the Forest App I vs. Adept I vs. Adept III at lvl 48 (orange con)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All are Required (243) to Mastery (293)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All Shapechange</DIV> <DIV>Vicious Bite - 10% chance to Inflict [155] or [208] or [228]  (Warden of the Forest Master I is 259)</DIV> <DIV>Increase See Stealth by [71] vs [75] vs [76]</DIV> <DIV>Increase Max Power by [155] vs [168] vs [172]</DIV> <DIV>Increase Max Health by [239] vs [259] vs [266]</DIV> <DIV>Increase Physical Mitigation by [282] vs [300] vs [306]</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So overall very few advantages to the Adept I to Adept III upgrade at lvl 48.</DIV>

[Arielle Nightshade]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SunfireII wrote:<BR> <P>Here are some more stats:</P> <P>Summer's Flame Master I (grey con)</P> <DIV>Power 84</DIV> <DIV>Refuge (155)</DIV> <DIV>Disruption (205)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Inflict 206-251 on Target.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-------------------------------------------------------</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Steward of the Forest App I vs. Adept I vs. Adept III at lvl 48 (orange con)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All are Required (243) to Mastery (293)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>All Shapechange</DIV> <DIV>Vicious Bite - 10% chance to Inflict [155] or [208] or [228]  (Warden of the Forest Master I is 259)</DIV> <DIV>Increase See Stealth by [71] vs [75] vs [76]</DIV> <DIV>Increase Max Power by [155] vs [168] vs [172]</DIV> <DIV>Increase Max Health by [239] vs [259] vs [266]</DIV> <DIV>Increase Physical Mitigation by [282] vs [300] vs [306]</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So overall very few advantages to the Adept I to Adept III upgrade at lvl 48.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Wow..THANK you for posting these. I'm <-> far from getting Steward - and was thinking it'd be an excellent use of a ruby...now, I'm not so sure.  A Master drop from the sky would be very cool - but yeah..that'll happen   <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR>

[Sunfire]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Arielle Nightshade wrote:<BR><BR>Wow..THANK you for posting these. I'm <-> far from getting Steward - and was thinking it'd be an excellent use of a ruby...now, I'm not so sure.  A Master drop from the sky would be very cool - but yeah..that'll happen   <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I'll try to keep posting stats as I upgrade things ... I upgraded several T5 buffs to Adept III (Spirit of the Bat, Benison of the Wild, Steward of the Forest, and Spirit of Oak) but the differences between the Adept I and Adept III versions have been a bit underwhelming ... for some I'm hoping that changes with the expansion when the cons drop from orange to white.</P> <P>I should also mention I only have one T5 master - Nature's Reprieve - but it was a big upgrade actually.  Chance to proc went up from 50% to 75% and the amount of the heal and regen increased more than 30% over the Adept I version.</P> <P>Of course its hard to count on anything with the changes they have planned for the spell system....<BR></P>