DPS

[foolsparidise]

<DIV>I have read some of the post about the kind of dps some inq are doing. I wanted to ask those who are excited about the battle cleric could they post info about what kind of dps they are doing with what kinds of stats. Feel free to tell battle stories.  :smileyhappy:</DIV>

[quasigenx]

Mums the word if you don't want to get nerfed.<div></div>

[Demoniac]

our dps ain't really overpowered at all. there is nothing really we can't talk about it. my CA dps can't beat my spell dps in kos yet. it's really easy to do 600-700 dps by using CAs. also i'v never seen I can do 1000+ dps like what i did in kos.<div></div>

[quasigenx]

I think our DPS relative to other classes is more impressive in a group setting than a raid setting. But I'm still worried it will get nerfed.<div></div>

[Ssinu]

<div><blockquote><hr>quasigenx wrote:I think our DPS relative to other classes is more impressive in a group setting than a raid setting. But I'm still worried it will get nerfed.<div></div><hr></blockquote>What weapon are you using, what is your normal group make up and what gear do you normally use?I haven't really seen where we are unbalancingly good at anything, even in group.</div>

[Tarta]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ssinurn wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quasigenx wrote:<BR>I think our DPS relative to other classes is more impressive in a group setting than a raid setting. But I'm still worried it will get nerfed.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>What weapon are you using, what is your normal group make up and what gear do you normally use?<BR><BR>I haven't really seen where we are unbalancingly good at anything, even in group.<BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Same here. I've got a nice hammer (2h fabled from vyemm) 350+ str and some of the new CAs to level 3. I know I need more AAs to use them to their potential, but they have come to a grinding halt with no new discoveries <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </P> <P>I can heal OK, I can dps OK but I also noticed that I'm typically lower on power in groups than I ever was before eof was released - even without using yaulp. Against caster mobs, I have to nearly chain-heal and cure to keep my group alive. Melee mobs seem wimpy by comparison.</P> <P>Don't worry about inquisitor DPS nerfs - several furys are touting 1200+ dps parses in normal groups. I think we're safe for now - you can come out of hiding :smileywink:</P> <P> </P>

[Ssinu]

<div><blockquote><hr>primaryKey wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr><hr> </blockquote> <p>Same here. I've got a nice hammer (2h fabled from vyemm) 350+ str and some of the new CAs to level 3. I know I need more AAs to use them to their potential, but they have come to a grinding halt with no new discoveries <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p> <p>I can heal OK, I can dps OK but I also noticed that I'm typically lower on power in groups than I ever was before eof was released - even without using yaulp. Against caster mobs, I have to nearly chain-heal and cure to keep my group alive. Melee mobs seem wimpy by comparison.</p> <p>Don't worry about inquisitor DPS nerfs - several furys are touting 1200+ dps parses in normal groups. I think we're safe for now - you can come out of hiding :smileywink:</p> <hr></blockquote>Yep, heh, exactly my feelings. We are ok, we aren't the worst and definitely not the best in any situation. I don't think anyone is yelling about Inquisitior DPS, even when you don't have on heal/resist gear and have on DPS gear. I don't think we will be seeing a nerf, and if anything, we need a boost. When I parse on raids and compare ourselves to other healers in various areas often times given the same amount of casts (or button-clicks) we just are not as efficient at what we do as some other classes. When I'm going all out I'm still not the top healer DPS.<font color="#ffccff"><b> IMHO it should be balanced that if a healer (any of us) does all out DPS (casting/melee no or negligible healing), then we should top the DPS parse for healers. That really doesn't happen. Due to the nature of things, I can be all out DPSing with no heals and a Warden or Fury will be decent on the heal parse and still beat me DPS wise. Shaman probably need a boost as well</b></font>. I near top the heal parse if given a group of melee who are taking a beating, but if I'm in a group with another priest even going all out due to nature of reactives (and no lotto healing) I just come in middle ground for the whole night with the occaisional nuke.This has been my experience on raids, and please if you see differently, <font color="#ffccff"><b>I would love to see some parses and gear/group setup info. I'd be willing to show mine as well. I think these discussions are great, but often not backed up with any raw facts. I think it would be a great discussion if folks saying we are getting nerfable DPS show what they have, and others who encounter everyday situations post data.</b></font>I asked Dymus about the power thing in beta, and he said that its because people are taking more damage now than ever before. To me, it feels like going up a difficulty setting or two on a console game healwise with how fast people die vs my heal timers refresh and mana runs out.</div>

[quasigenx]

Well, since you all seem to think there isn't a nerf coming... The last few raids I've parsed as high as second on individual trash fights in Labs, as well as fourth or fith on a number of occasions, maybe 7 or 8 total in 3 runs.Group-wise, I can squeak out the top spot 50% of the time in my regular group that includes a brigand, necro and the occasional ranger.Over the course of an entire instance or raid zone, my DPS tends to drift to the middle of the pack. This is because invariably I have to stop DPSing and kick in as a backup healer past certain encounters.But the point is, I would consider myself T2 DPS if I can concetrate 100% on DPSing, and I'm not maxed out yet by any means. I think some other players in my guild even are surprised I can either get close to the top of the DPS parser, or close or even top the heal parse, depending on what I feel like we need the most. I max out at about 800 DPS if I get lucky and procs are good.I love that versatility personally. I'm just worried it's not balanced.I'm sure people will say our raid DPS must suck, etc. True, we're not maxed out and fabled/mastered 100%. I would say we are between a casual guild and a raiding guild; we do raid 2 times a week.I don't think our over-all DPS is too sucky; we did about 12k average over the last Labs run. I do see T1 DPS people in our guild get as high as 1400 or 1500 DPS on single fights, but even that is rare. Usually it's right around 1k to top the parse.<div></div>All by DPS numbers are using extended DPS from ACT, which is why some people think they are low. IMO, eDPS is just more accurate than raw DPS.

[Ssinu]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div>Yea - this is exactly the sort of information I mean. Thanks. I think in order to get some facts & answers and a good discussion we should be specific. It helps a ton to hear raid config, gear, setting etc. It helps to know you aren't talking of full fabled - just some fabled with lab being one of the highlights of your raiding. The situation I was discussing would be DPS currently in EoF groups/raids with full KoS fabled. I haven't been back to Labs since the very beginning of EoF beta, so we very may well be doing well there. We are not T2 DPS in EoF even when I had max Achievements in beta.Here are our consistent expected DPS ranges. This is not get lucky stuff but normal fight in KoS:A) T1 DPS on our raids would be 1100-2000+B) T2 DPS on our raids would be 800-1100. C) T3 DPS on our raids would be 800-400D) T4 DPS on our raids would be 400-0.I will post some logs to back this up, but so far in EoF things are much much lower, and I will post those too.So in your case, with 1000 being the top for a T1 dps and occaisionally going to 1400-1500 we aren't even talking about the same thing really. Perfect example why information is so helpful. With our EoF raids, Inquisitors and other healers are often in group D on most stuff. If they go all out maybe group C. With Druids able to get into group C solidly while healing under optimal conditions but always near top of D even when healing. Shaman sit at D constantly and only very rarely hit group C. Templars going all DPS are are able to reach group C much easier than shaman and surprisingly pretty much easy as we do. In beta, full Acheivement with melee CA I hit ~600-700 dps tops on solo blues (keep in mind I don't have proper melee gear), and 400-600 dps on solo blues casting spec'd. Nothing stellar as a Fury can easily do 1000-1300 DPS full Achievement spec'd at the end of EoF Beta. Time will tell in the few months where we all stand with full Achievements, but this is why we are not worried about a nerf. A warden can easily hit 600+ dps as well as Templars. I have yet to see a shaman do over 400. So in answer to your worry, doing spike damage in labs for 800 is not a nerfable thing, since other priests will still pass you. Also keep in mind you may not think you are maxed, but most DPS enhancing items are not top tier of KoS, they are quest rewards and lower. I don't know what gear you use but you may very well be at the "top" for KoS. Most of my stuff is from labs/DT. EoF still has secrets gearwise for us.These are rough ballpark, but if you post a parse, usually all of group A gets posted, and some of group B. I'll try and post some parses later showing some of what I mean. I'll take a look at groups more closely, but I can run raid stuff off the top of my head.In places like Lyceum or DT where I don't have to worry about healing outside of some of the bosses, I parse zone wide 400ish (this is mainly pre EoF, but I hit 464 zone wide in ToS recently) using a Maul of the Warden's Fist, Orb of Invoker, Fitzpizzle's, Droag Mastery as my gear. (I'm lazy and have not completed my BCG). I'm typically in the offtank group, sometimes in mage group. I typically have low STR and modest INT (~300).Top parse with this gear is around 600-700 on the rare fight (again, pre EoF). Now on your raid, 400-500 DPS would be excellent, with the occaisional 600-700 spike putting you solidly in T2 DPS for you. For the full fabled folks it would not.Now I have a Vraksakin's Claw Club and I'm working on having a back up set of STR gear, in addition to getting BCG /adornments/ EoF Acheievements. I haven't played with the Club enough to know the optimal configurations yet.I want to do a post/information sharing thing for healing with similar numbers but that will take more research so I am not making up numbers.P.S. All my numbers are extDPS also.<p>Message Edited by Ssinurn on <span class=date_text>11-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:03 PM</span>

[Spoof]

<div></div>Well, I respec'd for DPS mid-week to give it a go and it was fun for awhile, especially parsing higher than a Fury. But then the Fury put his foot down on the pedal and we nearly lost the raid tank trying to out dps each other. It was fun for 5mins.Tonight I'm respec'ing back to debuffs - if I have any points left over then I'll plop a few into the CAs for fun, but that's not where our role lies IMHO. For me the EoF Inquisitor is a healer first, debuffer second and dps third. The power penalty for maxing your dps by using Yaulp and Fanaticism is too much, especially as they've nerfed Chilling Inquest (I'm surprised nobody has mentioned this, but it is indeed nerfed - our one, true class defining ability - again my opinion).On another note, if we really want to get some DPS credit why not petition to have Verdict listed in the logfile as parsable damage. When we took him down last night, The Overlord in Halls of Seeing had over <b>3 million</b> hitpoints... which makes Verdict worth up to <b>60,000</b> damage! I'd rather have that than this power-sucking hammer-swinging lark.<div></div>

[Israphil]

Can we nix this conversation? Christ, this is not going to make anyone better, it doesn't improve us, and all it does is give other classes ammunition to throw at us, and devs reason to nerf our class.<div></div>

[LokiHellsson]

<P>Can you contribute significant DPS (>100) while healing, curing DoTs and debuffing the mobs?  I sure can't.  I suppose, if I stop healing, curing and debuffing, I might be able to DPS, but what's the point?  </P> <P>If my group doesn't need me healing, curing and debuffing, my group is fighing easy stuff and we're not going to get anything rewarding out of it.</P>

[Catseyes]

i m amazed that as CLERICS we re talking about DPS.  For me, and since ages, it was the 2 opposites roles . The two sides of the dollar.If u re sending all your dps stuff, meanwhile u re not doing your real and expected job.  And Sadly, any other classe will come outdps you doing their job.I still dont understand why we re going to subpar pallys , to less-good-than-everyone healers .  Where is the balancing in that between each priest class ? ...Ymrir, 70 inqui befallen<div></div>

[Israphil]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Catseyes wrote:i m amazed that as CLERICS we re talking about DPS.  For me, and since ages, it was the 2 opposites roles . The two sides of the dollar.If u re sending all your dps stuff, meanwhile u re not doing your real and expected job.  And Sadly, any other classe will come outdps you doing their job.<font color="#ff0000">I still dont understand why we re going to subpar pallys , to less-good-than-everyone healers .  Where is the balancing in that between each priest class ? </font>...Ymrir, 70 inqui befallen<div></div><hr></blockquote>I'm amazed that you can say the same thing in 90% of your posts and never get tired of hearing yourself.</div><p>Message Edited by rckmer on <span class=date_text>12-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:15 AM</span>