EoF AAs (pics)

[menelaus109]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/InqAA-1.jpg"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/AA1.jpg">The first pic is the AA tree, the second is a mouseover of the abilites, ive tried to organise it in the same order as the actual AA tree should be and added the interconnects inThe AA lines are divided into 3 branchsEnhancementsBattlePunishmentsEDIT: Some easier to see screenshots of the abilities, this is about as big as i can get them as photobucket scales them down if i try any larger, should be a bit easier to see<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/aaaa.jpg"><font color="#ff0000"><font size="5">Red is the Enhancements line<font color="#6633ff">Blue is the Battle line<font color="#00cc33">Green is the Punishments line</font></font></font></font><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/Enhancements-1.jpg"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/Punishments-2.jpg"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/Battle.jpg"><div></div><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class="date_text">11-04-2006</span> <span class="time_text">02:32 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class="date_text">11-04-2006</span> <span class="time_text">02:42 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class="date_text">11-04-2006</span> <span class="time_text">02:43 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class=date_text>11-04-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:09 AM</span>

[menelaus109]

<div></div>The enhancement line reduces various cast and recast timers and primarily affects emergncy heals, rezzes and utility spells. It does not affect any of our main heals. The final ability increases the range of all our spellsThe battle line changes several of our spells into melee abilites (affected by the % crit from KoS AA) and adds the ability to remove the stifle part of Fanaticism there is a significant cost to this though (this is likely to change so i wont post the details). The final ability increases crushing, mitigation and reduces power costsThe punishments line increases the effectiveness and/or duration of several debuffs and reactive curses. It also contains an ability that allows verdict to be cast on a mob before it reaches the required health threshold and triggers verdict when the mob passes the required health threshold (for example the max duration is 10 sec, you can verdict and if the mob passes the threshold of 50%, 25%, 10% or 2% based on strength then verdict will be triggered). The final ability increases the duration of all the punishment spellsIssues already identified on BetaThe enhancements line is largely useless, people go days without using the emergency heals and reducing a 15 min recast by  2.5min really doesnt help that much. The reduced casting time on the rezzes is again largely useless as rezzing on raids is usually done by necros, pallys etc The final ability is pretty weak as well it wont allow you to avoid any of the larger AoEs and the smaller range ones can be avoided anywayIm testing the battle line now and it looks like an Inq buffed for melee can do more in autoattack damage for no power cost instead of using the CAs, also the CAs will not trigger spell proc items,  from which a significant part of our DPS came from. There is also an issue with the new CA having a higher power cost than the equivalent spells but i think this is a bug and will most likely be fixed<p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class=date_text>11-03-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:37 PM</span>

[Torbas]

Wow I can't read that at all <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Niende]

<DIV>Would love to check these out but they are so tiny I can't make out anything. Tease.</DIV>

[menelaus109]

<div></div>Yeah i kinda noticed that problem after i posted, ill try and post something a bit easier to seeIn the meantime save the image to your comp and then open with paint or something and zoom in and you can see the abilites okayEdit: Added some larger screenshots of the AA's, also a screenshot showing the 3 pathways<div></div><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class=date_text>11-04-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:11 AM</span>

[Demoniac]

good post.. big thanks for the OP <span>:smileyvery-happy:</span> /cheer<div></div>

[Gwyniveth]

<P>I hope you are all as angry and frustrated with these AA's as I am .. if we don't want to be stuck with them, we better make our voices heard now, or we will be eating these AA's at expasnion launch. It is insulting that a healer class is stuck with rez's and dps ..</P> <P>Where are our heals ??? </P>

[Tarta]

<P>It's hard to find anything worthwile in the emergency line... and the battle line, well.. I, for one, am kinda excited about the removal of stifle from Fanaticism/Zeolatry AA. I'd love to know badly it nerfs healing while it's up as well as how much more power the rest of the spells take... I'm sure all that balancing will be in flux leading up to the release.</P> <P>So, unless something quite drastic happens with those lines, I'm sure I'll be plunking most of my points into the punishment line, and even those aren't much to whoop and holler about, I'm afraid.</P> <P> </P>

[LardLord]

I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone got any significant healing AAs.  The enhancements for Act of Conviction, Fanaticism, and Fervent Focus seem nice to me.

[Listad12]

<DIV>Enchancements? C'mon, the EoF AAs are a lil stirred away from our main abilities. The punishment tree is ok I guess, but aside from that the rest is BS. The emergency tree is useless for our class, this doesn't make any sense at all. If I wanted to be a rezzer in group/raid/game, I'd role a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] Dirge or something else for this matter.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The battler tree is umm, ok if you want to be a dps class.. Once again is this really a top priority in class?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There are a few things missing here. I'd rather see an enhancement in the inquest line (power tap), or cons line (hp+dps mod). Even something for Convert. But c'mon now SoE, you gotta be kidding me on these new AA abilities. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/discuss plz</DIV>

[Gwyniveth]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LardLord wrote:<BR> I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone got any significant healing AAs.  The enhancements for Act of Conviction, Fanaticism, and Fervent Focus seem nice to me.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Well, since the lifting of the NDA, I can tell you that you are mistaken. Wait til you see the templar AA's then see how you feel about ours . </DIV>

[menelaus109]

The Beta patch of 04/11 increased the effectiveness of some of the AA's considerably, mainly the punishments lineThe base value was increased from 3% to 7% on all the punishments line except Heresy, so with 5 points the effect is increased 35% now instead of 15%<div></div>

[Demoniac]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> primaryKey wrote:<BR> <P>It's hard to find anything worthwile in the emergency line... and the battle line, well.. I, for one, am kinda excited about the removal of stifle from Fanaticism/Zeolatry AA. I'd love to know badly it nerfs healing while it's up as well as how much more power the rest of the spells take... I'm sure all that balancing will be in flux leading up to the release.</P> <P>So, unless something quite drastic happens with those lines, I'm sure I'll be plunking most of my points into the punishment line, and even those aren't much to whoop and holler about, I'm afraid.</P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>yes it does moved your stifle. but :smileywink:</P> <P> </P> <P>All your spell caster timer will be x 1.5 ( note: spell haste will no effect after this.. so 2 seconds.. that's 3 seconds timer.. 5 seconds that's 7.5 caster timer ). all your spells costs will be  x 1.5 as well.. all your heals will be decreased to 50%...</P> <P> </P> <P>after you cast fanaticism. your single reactive will become like this 254 power cost, 3 seconds cast, heals for 225-275.. I think my 30 reactive looks better than this. it doesn't help you. it curses you. if they make it like this way. I would never use this spell again.</P><p>Message Edited by Demoniac on <span class=date_text>11-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:43 AM</span>

[menelaus109]

<div></div>Screenshots of the new Punishments line and also screenshots of the spells affected, this time with 5 points in every ability<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/121.jpg"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v498/Madandy101/122.jpg">Notice the change to Heresy and also the additional of a duration to VerdictAll my spells are Ad3 on Beta until i can copy myself across again, Int was around 90 for the screenshots<div></div><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class=date_text>11-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:01 AM</span>

[quasigenx]

<div><blockquote><hr>Gwyniveth wrote:<div> <blockquote> <hr> LardLord wrote: <div></div>I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone got any significant healing AAs.  The enhancements for Act of Conviction, Fanaticism, and Fervent Focus seem nice to me. <hr> </blockquote>Well, since the lifting of the NDA, I can tell you that you are mistaken. Wait til you see the templar AA's then see how you feel about ours . </div><hr></blockquote>Whoa, she's right. Take a look at:<a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=13&message.id=28409&jump=true" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=13&message.id=28409&jump=true</a>Looks like all their lotto heals are getting an increased proc %, and the <i><b>cures are adding a reactive heal component.</b></i></div>

[quasigenx]

<div></div>How many points to you have to put into a tier to unlock the next tier? Also, how do you unlock the final tier? Those abilities appear to be disconnected from the graph.<div></div><p>Message Edited by quasigenx on <span class=date_text>11-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:13 AM</span>

[Demoniac]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quasigenx wrote:<BR> How many points to you have to put into a tier to unlock the next tier? Also, how do you unlock the final tier? Those abilities appear to be disconnected from the graph.<BR> <P>Message Edited by quasigenx on <SPAN class=date_text>11-05-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:13 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>you have to put 3 points to be able to unlock the next tier. it seems each line has 1 final ability. you have to put 15 points in the same line to be able to unlock the final the ability in this line.

[menelaus109]

Jina is rightThe first series of screenshots were arranged into the order they appear to show the interconnections and progression, the updated ones i just took screenshots of to show the differencesCheck out my first few posts to see how the punishments tree looks, and check out the new and improved abilities in the more recent postsWhen the next big beta patch hits ill update all my screenshots and repost<div></div>

[scivias]

<div><blockquote><hr>quasigenx wrote:<div>Whoa, she's right. Take a look at:<a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=13&message.id=28409&jump=true" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=13&message.id=28409&jump=true</a>Looks like all their lotto heals are getting an increased proc %, and the <i><b>cures are adding a reactive heal component.</b></i></div><hr></blockquote>Yes, thats the most embarassing thing I've ever seen. Innoruk as Tunares pendant, together with the battlepriest aa-line will finally make us tanks with healing capacities and our stepbrothers, templars, get the full benefit of healing improvements. I dare say it's a dumb idea to make up aa-lines that add to the core function of priests, and hand them out to some, not all. It's cool to be different, but that now is just over the edge, by a large margin. I hope that the inquisitor AAs get a second look before release, or shortly after.. but as they are now our inquis consider betraying or going into exile, to get the tunare deity.</div>

[ronboga]

So I take it one can use the connecting lines between the buff to move say down the punishment line then over to the battle line to get the enchance: Fanaticism ability?

[menelaus109]

<div><blockquote><hr>ronbogard wrote:<div></div>So I take it one can use the connecting lines between the buff to move say down the punishment line then over to the battle line to get the enchance: Fanaticism ability?<hr></blockquote>yep thats right</div>

[Listad12]

<P>I don't get how some of you are raving about the Fanatacism line. Sure you can cast your heals and other spells while stifled now with changes, but tell me this.. How many times are you going to be able to do this. During a typical raid mob which takes more time to kill, yes this can be beneficial or can work the other way depending how you drain your power and such.</P> <P> </P> <P>The tweak on this line is once again, not beneficial to us at all. What it's doing is that its working againts our strenghts with our ability to tap power (inquest) and over all cost of power from our spells.</P>

[Kadurm]

Yeah we definately got pooped on with the AA lines compared to the Templars, we dont get any enhancements to heals other than our emergencies which if you are using them, its about over anyway. I like the increased duration of the debuffs and such, but seriously, I would have much rather gotten some healing love on this one.

[menelaus109]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Listad12 wrote:<div></div> <p>I don't get how some of you are raving about the Fanatacism line. Sure you can cast your heals and other spells while stifled now with changes, but tell me this.. How many times are you going to be able to do this. During a typical raid mob which takes more time to kill, yes this can be beneficial or can work the other way depending how you drain your power and such.</p> <p>The tweak on this line is once again, not beneficial to us at all. What it's doing is that its working againts our strenghts with our ability to tap power (inquest) and over all cost of power from our spells.</p><hr></blockquote>The change to Fanticism is a new ability, it was only introduced to Beta on or around the 25/10I agree with you that it is more of a hindrance in it current form and i think it will get changed before it hits live@Kadurmi agree with you totally, the longer duration and increased effectiveness of the debuffs is nice but i would have preferred some healing love or a boost to InquestI think there will be at least one more large patch to beta before it hits live, so hopefully they will listen to what every Inq is saying and boost our healing rather than DPS</div><p>Message Edited by menelaus109 on <span class=date_text>11-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:59 PM</span>

[Giral]

<DIV>is there any real way for anybody to achieve all these befor it goes Live ? i'm not sure how you gain these abilities yet ? quests,grinding? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>templars already have the biggest heals in the game why would they give them even Larger heals , this just makes a bigger gap and pushes one healer class way out in front , my Master 1 lvl 70 group heal is i believe Less then a Templar adept 3 group heal , </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>supposedly our re-actives are biger heals then a templars? (not sure just what i read somewhere)  so should we Atleast get a line that Increases our Re-active's  equivelantly to Templars heals ? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>or a Big BUFF for the MT and a extra Group buff , something to even out the healing between Temp/Inquisies to keep it near equal ? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>i played a Inquis to be a healer , my main intrest is in keeping the MT and the group alive , by Heal's, Buff's,Re-actives  if i wanna CHOSE to increase the other things thats fine BUT i should have a choice also to increase my healing capacity , i have to work for these Special Abilities , if im going to put in the time and effort i would like to be able to Chose something that would benefit me as a Healer above all else </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>so i have to Betray freeport and live as an outcast to stay near equal with a Templar? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Listad12]

<DIV>I am sure that there will be something to make up for lost grounds in terms of healing. Adding adornments to armor slots will have an effect/boost to our healing. This will benefit both Templars and Inquisitors. With this in effect, I can take these changes and walk away smiling, in a way I guess.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>How bout having to take out the bonus %/proc to the Vengeance/Repentance line and dump that to our reactives instead ? No reason to add more triggers for these spells, if it doesn't proc that much at all... Oh wait, SOE fixed that crap so now they can actually say that adding these new AA ability for EoF is USEFUL ! Very smart move, these 2 spells rarely trigger now and for some reason they get an enchancement and an additional new AA ability because SOE decides to FIX them in a very sneaky way...Why not have them trigger more to begin with so that putting these AAs in EoF would actually make sense ? And to add to insults, Heresy ? Do I need to say more ? This freaking spell doesn't even trigger for EPICS !!!!!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>SOE stop playing with my emotions, I'm seriously disappointed on these changes. Inquisitors are fine until I found out about these changes. It clearly makes us sub par to other heal classes. These AAs does not benefit nor enhance our strengths in game. I'm asking you to please take a second look at these. Adding a reduce casting timers to our emergency reactives is pointless, unless you're planning on having 20 minute encounters.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Inquisitors, please discuss or post anything new.. ty</DIV>

[ronboga]

Can any one post a picture of the enhance: verdict? Or knows what knows what the additional effects are?

[menelaus109]

<div><blockquote><hr>ronbogard wrote:<div></div>Can any one post a picture of the enhance: verdict? Or knows what knows what the additional effects are?<hr></blockquote>You can see a pic of it in the screenshots i posted of the updated Punishments line a few posts agoThe Enhance:Verdict adds a duration to Verdict, you can cast before a mob hits the required health level and when mob passes the trigger percentage it fires, the basic duration is 5 seconds, however if you put 5 points into punishment it will go to 10 secondsSo you can cast Verdict and have upto 10 seconds for the spell to trigger if the mob passes the required healthIt does not affect the percentages for the spell to triggerThe duration increase of punishment is currently bugged and only adds 50% instead of 100% atm but will hopefully be fixed soon</div>

[menelaus109]

<div><blockquote><hr>Giralus wrote:<div>is there any real way for anybody to achieve all these befor it goes Live ? i'm not sure how you gain these abilities yet ? quests,grinding? </div> <div> <font color="#cc0000">Im not sure what you mean, on Beta we just hail someone who gives us a choice of what level we buff to and what equipment we want (full relic and some jewellery) and gives us 100AA points, we can respec any time we want for freeIf you mean on Live you acquire them the normal way</font></div> <div> </div> <div>templars already have the biggest heals in the game why would they give them even Larger heals , this just makes a bigger gap and pushes one healer class way out in front , my Master 1 lvl 70 group heal is i believe Less then a Templar adept 3 group heal ,<font color="#cc0000">They are narrowing the gap between M1 and Ad3 and reducing some spells effectiveness, this will hopefully narrow the gap between us and Temps a littleOther than that i agree with you totally</font> </div> <div> </div> <div>supposedly our re-actives are biger heals then a templars? (not sure just what i read somewhere)  so should we Atleast get a line that Increases our Re-active's  equivelantly to Templars heals ?<font color="#cc0000">Reactives are the same for both of us</font> </div> <div> </div> <div>or a Big BUFF for the MT and a extra Group buff , something to even out the healing between Temp/Inquisies to keep it near equal ? </div> <div> <font color="#cc0000">Personally id prefer a boost to Inquest or Aura, but i rarely find myself in the MT group</font></div> <div>i played a Inquis to be a healer , my main intrest is in keeping the MT and the group alive , by Heal's, Buff's,Re-actives  if i wanna CHOSE to increase the other things thats fine BUT i should have a choice also to increase my healing capacity , i have to work for these Special Abilities , if im going to put in the time and effort i would like to be able to Chose something that would benefit me as a Healer above all else </div> <div> <font color="#cc0000">The adornments will affect our healing, remember that with convert up we are in effect casting 2 heals every time, and each one is affected by the adornment bonusThe adornment effect is currently bugged on Beta atm but as soon as they work out the kinks ill post details</font></div> <div>so i have to Betray freeport and live as an outcast to stay near equal with a Templar? </div> <div> </div> <div> </div><hr></blockquote></div>

[Gobbwin]

<P>After the 11-4 update, I'm relatively pleased with the Punishment line.  Overall it fits with the flavor of our class rather well (ebil toons are typically more offensive and our strenth IS debuffing).  The increased effectiveness and durations will make them worth while.  Don't know about the rest of you, but continually refreshing Forced Obedience and Debase while trying to cure/heal and keep fanaticism running all at the same time is frustrating on many epic mobs.  However, the change to Verdict is only a minor 'woot', it does help to solve the timing issue so you don't have to hit it in that exact window, but I personally would have much rather seen an affective % increase (e.g. 1-3% increase before triggering).  </P> <P>The enhancements line is very disappointing.  I doubt many, if any, will invest points into it for the simple fact that most of those spells are emergency spells and as others have stated, maybe get used every few days or so on average, so recast timers is a non-issue.  Personally, I would much rather see that entire line changed to our heals and buffs rather than the spells that it currently focuses on.  Increase our reactive # of procs (3-5 points for an extra proc or two) an increase in duration wouldn't hurt either, or increased overall heal effectiveness of all heals.  Increase the potency of our buffs, I mean seriously would increasing Fanatic's Faith by 3-15% be game breaking?  "OOOoooo, my Mental/Magic resists are now 1200/1600 higher rather than 800/1200!!!"  OR Pious wouldn't hurt by increasing the mitigation and stamina by a bit.  The one point I will disagree with is the max cast range affectiveness, I can think of a few encounters where increasing max cast range by 5meters can make a difference (Talendar anyone?).  However, a 2 meter per each AA increase would be much more enticing for a final ability IMHO.</P> <P> </P> <P>Edit: Later realized that I didn't even mention the battle line.  My only question here is are the new CAs on the same recast timers as the spells they are replacing?</P><p>Message Edited by Gobbwin on <span class=date_text>11-06-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:36 AM</span>

[auvii]

OK so I look at the Templar forums and compare our suck [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] enhancments to theirs. WOW. I cant believe not one person has commented on the fact we receive not one bonus for our heals or buffs!!! We get these ridiculous dps and debuff enhancments. I'm sorry but [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]? I have been on my Inq since day one now and I am actually considering betraying. We don't even get the Cure enhanments. How is anyone happy about these changes? As a full time raid healer this is going to just kill me. My debuffs, even with these enhancments are not going to be anything compared to the other classes with their superior debuffs for epics. And dps, [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] do I care about that for, yeah I solo sometimes, but thats it, sometimes. To me it seems SOE looks at us as the hybrid healer class not as true clerics. <div></div>

[Israphil]

Honestly, I don't see AAs in this expansion being horribly consequential for anyone, and I think the greater benefit was placed upon the blessings/miracles of the gods. I'm more annoyed with us being hosed on those, but double it with being hosed compared to templars on aa, and I'm feelin a bit unloved. As it stands now, we will be the ultimate healers for dealing with yard trash....but I can totally see myself rotated out "sorry Isra buddy, we're up to the boss now, and you know how tough he is...we need real healing power." Okay, maybe not, but I feel like we're being hurt here, since even though it's the templar support heals (the proc crap and cures and other bs) that's getting updated...raising proc chance from 20 to 30%, and raising the heal amount that results from others is pretty freakin powerful. 30% proc chance is HUGELY better than 20%.The only thing that still gives me hope is that convert will effectively give us a 2 for 1 benefit on all symmetry (+healing) items. That makes me happy to no end, but it also makes me lament that we will have to be constantly running convert, which is horrendously expensive, but will be needed for us to even hope to make up the margin between us and others.All-in-all, I really feel like the current aa system comes closer than I would have hoped to augmenting my current playstyle, and with a few tweaks I really won't be terribly unhappy with it. Currently my role in raids is to debuff the mob, buff my group's dps hellaciously, and keep them alive while still sustaining better dps than most healers could while doing all of this. Sure, I toss the occasional heal on the main tank (don't get me wrong), but that part of my role is much more limited than, say, a templar's is, and so I place a somewhat lower priority on increasing our healing abilities than some inquisitors seem to. With that said, I would really love to have seen us thrown at least one bone to suppliment our healin via AAs. Having to run convert 24/7 will nix yaulp, which was super for our dps, but I can deal with that. All in all, I really think not getting anywhere near the healing benefits that Tunare will present is much more hurtful to us than anything else, and AAs seem to be of much less benefit to everyone.<div></div>

[Einsteinb]

<P>The problem seems to be an idea that looks good in your head. And perhaps on paper. But in the real game counting <U>every</U> one of the abilities enhanced by the emergency line, they made up 1% of my healing on my last raid. Even the heal proc on my peacock weapon took up a larger share. And devs, that is not evidence they need an increase.</P> <P>The developers need to be reminded that, "Inquisitors and Templars are two sides of the same coin" (thank you to Magdi and Tal'Cice for that one). You can't call one side an American dollar and the other side a Canadian dollar. We can be unique, like a picture of the queen and that of a beaver on opposite sides, but we both have to be worth the same at our intended purpose (healing).</P> <P>A very simple summary of my thoughts on the new AAs:</P> <P>If you want a golden retriever, invite a Templar. If you want a mutt, invite an Inquisitor.</P>

[Demoniac]

drop my 2 coins here... it's a large project to rethink about all the new AAs. every single healer got something new... templars they got cure reactive, mastic got melee damage ward ( slashing crushing.. ) elemental ward poison/disease ward. defiler got like new power convert 25% hp convert to 10% power... 20 mins recast timer ( so that means 30% power every min?? ) what we got? 1 self emergence reactive + some less new lower damage CAs.  they are good for pvp, for pve, you just totally [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ed up.well, anyways, I do believe sony will make some changes... like they did it before...<div></div>

[Listad12]

<DIV><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Demoniac wrote:<BR>drop my 2 coins here...<BR><BR>it's a large project to rethink about all the new AAs. every single healer got something new... templars they got cure reactive, mastic got melee damage ward ( slashing crushing.. ) elemental ward poison/disease ward. defiler got like new power convert 25% hp convert to 10% power... 20 mins recast timer ( so that means 30% power every min?? )<BR><BR>what we got? 1 self emergence reactive + some less new lower damage CAs.  they are good for pvp, for pve, you just totally [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ed up.<BR><BR>well, anyways, I do believe sony will make some changes... like they did it before...<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV><BR>Yes, this is exactly what I'm talking about. The effectiveness of what we are stuck with is useless imo. Its a utility spell in which we hardly depend on in key situations, yeah about every 15 minutes of the "omg, the MT is about to die <cast radiance>" Every other healer class gets something "useful" to their roles as healers, I don't think this is the way to go for us. Having to cast while stifled with Fanatacism is NOT an enchancement. Getting a reduce timer for our emergency reactives is NOT an enchancement. Inquisitors are not known for these buffs, well maybe except Fanatacism.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm still throwing the red flag for changes. SOE take another look before the release. TY</DIV><p>Message Edited by Listad12 on <span class=date_text>11-06-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:20 PM</span>

[Israphil]

<div></div><div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Listad12 wrote:<div></div><div>Yes, this is exactly what I'm talking about. The effectiveness of what we are stuck with is useless imo. Its a utility spell in which we hardly depend on in key situations, yeah about every 15 minutes of the "omg, the MT is about to die <cast radiance>" Every other healer class gets something "useful" to their roles as healers, I don't think this is the way to go for us. Having to cast while stifled with Fanatacism is NOT an enchancement. Getting a reduce timer for our emergency reactives is NOT an enchancement. <font color="#ff0000">Inquisitors are not knows for these buffs, well maybe except Fanatacism.</font></div> <div> </div> <div>I'm still throwing the red flag for changes. SOE take another look before the release. TY</div><hr></blockquote>Inquisitors also are not known for the healing...I know we heal, I know we may want to be, but just sayin...What I would have liked to have seen in our AAs is, rather than an "emergency" line that we have right now, a "buff" line.First rank could be something trivial that we rarely if ever use...upgrade to Pious, or giving better saves/hp combination to our Symbol line.Second rank would increase our Act line, as it stands now.Third could increase whichever of the pious/symbol was not addressed in the first rank (more sink points to make people commit in order to get the really good stuff)Fourth could increase the % of haste and intelligence granted by Fanaticism, in accord with the raising of skill caps and haste caps.Fifth to decrease the power consumption of Convert (say, 5% per rank). Since symmetry is going to increase the healing power of it, I don't think the healing needs to be further addressed, but a moderate decrease in power consumption seems in line.Sixth to increase the dps modification of our consecrated aura line (say, 3% per rank). This would put our m1 at 45% haste modifier, which seems huge but considering the cap is now 200% with diminishing returns, I'd say it's roughly in line with what it used to be.Seventh would be whatever end-line ability they want to give us.I would be very satisfied with this. Sure, I'd also love to see an inquest line aa in there somewhere, but that ability is already so amazingly wonderful, I don't really expect them or want them to change it. If they changed the emergency line to this "buff" line, it would give us 3 relatively viable lines to go down, instead of us having a completely dead line. The soloers and small groupers would have the stronger debuff/damage line for their grouping needs, and hardcore raiders with their spell damage equipment could avoid the dps line, instead focusing on the debuff line (which would also increase our dps moderately) and the buff line, which would help us out immensely in raiding. Finally, the PVPers would have whatever they wanted, be it the melee dps line to make themselves more feasible and competitive in PVP, or the other two lines for any of the aforementioned reasons.Honestly, I don't think this will happen, as much as I'd like it to, and as much sense as it would make. Why? Because I don't think the AAs are designed to benefit our classes as much as the first 50 were. I feel like they are merely something to throw at hard-core players to give them something to grind for. No matter how resentful we might be of other class AAs,  none of them are really that groundbreaking in my opinion. I don't feel that our spot on raids is realistically being threatened, and I don't feel like the AAs are diminishing our capabilities in anything. They merely aren't currently addressing what I would be most happy seeing them address. And the above line seems to deliver best what I'm looking for. Let the templars have their increased debuff healing and their cure reactives; I've been pushing for them to get something more class-defining than simply sanctuary for a long time. They <i>should</i> be better healers than us in my opinion, because we're better at so much else. And I know that might get me crucified here, but it's how I feel. We don't have to be the best at everything. My problem is that they are already benefitting disproportionately from the new diety system, as Tunare is set to throw them many better bones than we have thrown to us. I don't think they should double up, both with AAs that suit themselves better, <i>and</i> a heinously powerful healing diety.</div><p>Message Edited by rckmer on <span class=date_text>11-06-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:02 PM</span>

[Listad12]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> rckmer wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Listad12 wrote:<BR> <BR> <DIV><BR>Yes, this is exactly what I'm talking about. The effectiveness of what we are stuck with is useless imo. Its a utility spell in which we hardly depend on in key situations, yeah about every 15 minutes of the "omg, the MT is about to die <cast radiance>" Every other healer class gets something "useful" to their roles as healers, I don't think this is the way to go for us. Having to cast while stifled with Fanatacism is NOT an enchancement. Getting a reduce timer for our emergency reactives is NOT an enchancement. <FONT color=#ff0000>Inquisitors are not knows for these buffs, well maybe except Fanatacism.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm still throwing the red flag for changes. SOE take another look before the release. TY</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Inquisitors also are not known for the healing...I know we heal, I know we may want to be, but just sayin...<BR><BR>What I would have liked to have seen in our AAs is, rather than an "emergency" line that we have right now, a "buff" line.<BR><BR>First rank could be something trivial that we rarely if ever use...upgrade to Pious, or giving better saves/hp combination to our Symbol line.<BR><BR>Second rank would increase our Act line, as it stands now.<BR><BR>Third could increase whichever of the pious/symbol was not addressed in the first rank (more sink points to make people commit in order to get the really good stuff)<BR><BR>Fourth could increase the % of haste and intelligence granted by Fanaticism, in accord with the raising of skill caps and haste caps.<BR><BR><FONT color=#ff0000>Fifth to decrease the power consumption of Convert (say, 5% per rank). Since symmetry is going to increase the healing power of it, I don't think the healing needs to be further addressed, but a moderate decrease in power consumption seems in line.<BR></FONT><BR><FONT color=#ff0000>Sixth to increase the dps modification of our consecrated aura line (say, 3% per rank). This would put our m1 at 45% haste modifier, which seems huge but considering the cap is now 200% with diminishing returns, I'd say it's roughly in line with what it used to be.</FONT><BR><BR>Seventh would be whatever end-line ability they want to give us.<BR><BR>I would be very satisfied with this. Sure, I'd also love to see an inquest line aa in there somewhere, but that ability is already so amazingly wonderful, I don't really expect them or want them to change it. If they changed the emergency line to this "buff" line, it would give us 3 relatively viable lines to go down, instead of us having a completely dead line. The soloers and small groupers would have the stronger debuff/damage line for their grouping needs, and hardcore raiders with their spell damage equipment could avoid the dps line, instead focusing on the debuff line (which would also increase our dps moderately) and the buff line, which would help us out immensely in raiding. Finally, the PVPers would have whatever they wanted, be it the melee dps line to make themselves more feasible and competitive in PVP, or the other two lines for any of the aforementioned reasons.<BR><BR>Honestly, I don't think this will happen, as much as I'd like it to, and as much sense as it would make. Why? Because I don't think the AAs are designed to benefit our classes as much as the first 50 were. I feel like they are merely something to throw at hard-core players to give them something to grind for. No matter how resentful we might be of other class AAs,  none of them are really that groundbreaking in my opinion. I don't feel that our spot on raids is realistically being threatened, and I don't feel like the AAs are diminishing our capabilities in anything. They merely aren't currently addressing what I would be most happy seeing them address. And the above line seems to deliver best what I'm looking for. Let the templars have their increased debuff healing and their cure reactives; I've been pushing for them to get something more class-defining than simply sanctuary for a long time. They <I>should</I> be better healers than us in my opinion, because we're better at so much else. And I know that might get me crucified here, but it's how I feel. We don't have to be the best at everything. My problem is that they are already benefitting disproportionately from the new diety system, as Tunare is set to throw them many better bones than we have thrown to us. I don't think they should double up, both with AAs that suit themselves better, <I>and</I> a heinously powerful healing diety.<BR></DIV> <P>Message Edited by rckmer on <SPAN class=date_text>11-06-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>11:02 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I can not agree with you more on this.  These are our staple buffs and what we're known for. Chilling inquest is also can be upgraded along these lines or another. Is that too much to ask ? </P> <P> </P> <P>Whether it be a hardcore player or casual, it doesn't make sense to put these AAs in effect where it'll be mostly useless to the class. Its a waste of time and effort and what's sad is that a lot of players will have no choice but to grind to 50, and be left out with options that were not thought of when put in game. </P> <P>There are reasons why players picked an inquisitor as a class. We are not the "pure" healers in game and that point is taken. Instead we're given buffs to better a group and raid force. We have great debuffs and are one of the best managing our power with the inquest line and low cost of power to heal and such. </P> <P>So why stir our abilities to different directions with these new AAs ? </P> <P> </P>

[Catseyes]

The big black point in this point of view ( we are not best healers but we are debuffers and such ) is everything we re doing is better done by another class. EVERY single side thing is better done.  What is our purpose then ?Our debuffs ?  - Mitig  < T7 doll < Brigs- Stats < T7 doll < Defilers- Melees skills ? dunno really- Resist ? < Mages Our Buffs ?  - adding 67 sta < zerker grp buff < other priests hp buffs  (67 sta doesnt give 677 hps to wars and even less to other classes)- adding mental / divine resist < bards buffs < mages buffs < mitig templars buffs - 30% Dps ? woott... What role do we can sustain better than anyone ? non at all .  I really enjoy sending 2K+ crit heal , i really enjoy seeing 600+ crit reactive single hit,  but...that doesnt compare to 8K wards,to army of heal/mitig procs templars have, to  heal speed of druids , to hp buffs of druids and shamans. Our primary role, offensive or not, freeport or not , is CLERIC. And it has been forgotten by devs so far....Ymrir, 70 inqui befallen<div></div>

[Gobbwin]

<DIV>Reading through all of these posts, there seems to be almost a concensus as to what would best benefit our class (replace the Emergency line with something useful).  For the most part, no one is asking for anything that would be game breaking or over powering.  Is anyone in the Beta relaying these thoughts and ideas to the devs?  All we can hope for is a last minute change for the better (not likely, but hey, won't know until you try). </DIV>

[Demoniac]

ok... I am in beta.. I think i really have to get some information for you people. first of all, they are still in beta.. you can't really tell. I do believe that devs are working on.good news.1. chilling inquestit can be enhanced by your gear, by your adornments. my inquest does 10% 251 drain/ 290 gain ( 371 intell ). i am sure it will be nerfed <span>:smileytongue:</span>2. Convertthis spell wasn't that great in dof kos. it's a healing boost but cost you a lot of power. now it changed.  for the first part, this spell is a part of bettle priest spell line. the power cost can be decreased 25% which means it was 56 power cost in dof/kos. now it's 42 power. second part. this spell can be enhanced by the adornments my convert does 454 heals 42 power cost. which is awesome heal rate... I am not too sure.. i think they will nerf this.3. all healing spellsall the healing spells can be enhanced by the adornments. so besically your heals will be increased about 130-170 like that..I can't really tell you the number it depends how you use your adornments. but i can tell my reactive does 665 - 762... it's not just for our inquisitors.. it's for all heals..4. gear I do believe that the new cleric set can increase your spell cast by 33% ( 6 of them or 7 not sure.. please check out the inquisitor armor post ) so far so good...bad news.1. dps enhanced... actually, these new things doesn't really increase our dps at all. I am 100% sure they will be super useless AAs for all pve inquisitors. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------a simple example. russless invocation sayCA  damage 500, spell damage 500CA    dps 500/(10+0.5) = 47.6spell  dps 500/(2+3)= 100----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------CA damage 1000 spell damage 500CA    dps 1000/(10+0.5 ) = 95.2spell  dps   100----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------back to the topic.... you think soe will make CA damage do double spell damage?? it's never gonna happen. wardens they got the same problem.2. emergence lines..I am really really sorry to tell you guys. that these AAs can't be swiched. Beta inquisitors have complained about it since day 1 in beta. it's not about our AA sucks. it's about every single priest has that type of AAs.  we got the whole useless line though. they designed this way. and they won't change it. so just look up the bettle priest line and punishment line.3. Enhanced Fanaticismit's not like what you think. omg they removed stifle. actually  here comes the screenshot.<img src="http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/4895/fanazk8.jpg">problem 1. the power cost. problem 2. cast timer ( it will ignore your spell haste ) 3. healing changed. 4. fanaticism will cost 29 per tick instead of 22Nov.4 beta update.Nov. 7 beta update in-coming. an update always brings good news and bad news... let's see<div></div>

[Demoniac]

double post... sorry about it.. /edit<p>Message Edited by Demoniac on <span class=date_text>11-07-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:52 AM</span>

[Catseyes]

thanks for infos...*sigh* *turns back and leaves in despair*Ymrir, 70 inqui befallen<div></div>

[Gwyniveth]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <BR><BR>1. chilling inquest<BR><BR>it can be enhanced by your gear, by your adornments. my inquest does 10% 251 drain/ 290 gain ( 371 intell ). i am sure it will be nerfed <SPAN>:smileytongue:</SPAN><BR><BR>2. Convert<BR><BR>this spell wasn't that great in dof kos. it's a healing boost but cost you a lot of power. now it changed.  for the first part, this spell is a part of bettle priest spell line. the power cost can be decreased 25% which means it was 56 power cost in dof/kos. now it's 42 power. second part. this spell can be enhanced by the adornments my convert does 454 heals 42 power cost. which is awesome heal rate... I am not too sure.. i think they will nerf this.<BR><BR>3. all healing spells<BR><BR>all the healing spells can be enhanced by the adornments. so besically your heals will be increased about 130-170 like that..I can't really tell you the number it depends how you use your adornments. but i can tell my reactive does 665 - 762... it's not just for our inquisitors.. it's for all heals..<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P> </P> <P>The problem with adornments, while very nice, will benefit all preists, not just us. So they really can't be factored into the equation of the discussion of these miserable AA's. A Templar should NOT be a better healer then an Inquisitor plain and simple  We are BOTH clerics. and as Uddo so elegantly stated, we are 2 sides of the same coin. The coin should not change value depending on which side of the coin is placed in front of a merchant. It is absurd that we have to continiously look for a silver lining in the rubbish they throw at us. If you were to start a new healer today with the information you have, would you chose an Inquisitor ? I sure wouldn't. I'm frankly tired of being an after thought. I am sick to death of SoE not knowing exactly what to do with our class and throwing usless stuff at us in an attempt to find a use for us. As Ymrir said, every other class already does what we do, only better. Sure we debuff, but guess what.. many do it better. Sure we buff, but many others do that better too. And as for dps ? Who cares ? We made healers, not a dps class. </P> <P>I want to play an evil cleric.. to HEAL.. why is that so much to ask for. Why are we contionously thrust into the position of being almost equivilent to a Templar.. but not quite. Stop accepting the position of second best ! Get rid of the mantle of "well.. we don't have a Templar, we can use the Inquisitor til one shows up " With their current AA line ,Diety choices , and yes , adornemnts, where exactly in the food chain do you think that leaves us ? </P> <P>I'm in beta too, and most if not all of the suggestions from these boards have been expressed on the beta board discussion. Will it fall on deaf ears ? I have placed my faith in SoE for a long time , always assuming that eventually things would even out. But now , I'm not so sure . I hope they listen to our wishes.. guess we wait and see... </P> <P><BR></P>

[ericshaitan]

<blockquote><hr>Gwyniveth wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>The problem with adornments, while very nice, will benefit all preists, not just us. So they really can't be factored into the equation of the discussion of these miserable AA's. A Templar should NOT be a better healer then an Inquisitor plain and simple  We are BOTH clerics. and as Uddo so elegantly stated, we are 2 sides of the same coin. The coin should not change value depending on which side of the coin is placed in front of a merchant. It is absurd that we have to continiously look for a silver lining in the rubbish they throw at us. If you were to start a new healer today with the information you have, would you chose an Inquisitor ? I sure wouldn't. I'm frankly tired of being an after thought. I am sick to death of SoE not knowing exactly what to do with our class and throwing usless stuff at us in an attempt to find a use for us. As Ymrir said, every other class already does what we do, only better. Sure we debuff, but guess what.. many do it better. Sure we buff, but many others do that better too. And as for dps ? Who cares ? We made healers, not a dps class. </blockquote> <p>I want to play an evil cleric.. to HEAL.. why is that so much to ask for. Why are we contionously thrust into the position of being almost equivilent to a Templar.. but not quite. Stop accepting the position of second best ! Get rid of the mantle of "well.. we don't have a Templar, we can use the Inquisitor til one shows up " With their current AA line ,Diety choices , and yes , adornemnts, where exactly in the food chain do you think that leaves us ? </p> <p>I'm in beta too, and most if not all of the suggestions from these boards have been expressed on the beta board discussion. Will it fall on deaf ears ? I have placed my faith in SoE for a long time , always assuming that eventually things would even out. But now , I'm not so sure . I hope they listen to our wishes.. guess we wait and see... </p> <p></p><hr></blockquote> Good post, my feelings Exactly!<div></div>

[ronboga]

OH if I had a penny for every time in labs I have been moved from the mt group when a templer shows up.

[ericshaitan]

Yea i used to be [Removed for Content] off when i got moved from the MT group or wouldn't be allowed to heal in the MT group cause stupid templars get there "good" buffs.  But now, im used to being in an off group and kinda like it.  /shrug <div></div>

[Demoniac]

<DIV>devs getting spamed like crazy... i am sure they will fix all of them.. that will take some time heh heh... from what i saw, most of them are like no life... even 3 am in the morning, you can still see a lot of forum mod and devs designers login in and out. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>the problem is not just us inquisitors.. it's all classes are not happy about their AAs... assassins complaining about who the hell needs purry, I want dps... monks are complaining about why deaggro? I want more hate...wizard complaing about what is the hell is the resistability I want more damage... inquisitors are complaing about lol who cares about dps.. I want heals...   so basically, devs will give you some " new " skills or abilities that does nothing to your major job, that will balance the game. people will quit complaining about some certain class are overpowered. :smileywink:</DIV>

[A-Dent42]

Why do I have a feeling they are trying to turn us into the Vanguard equivalent of an Inquisitor?<strong>The Inquisitor</strong> <b> The Inquisitor is a heavily armored fighter who combines raw physical power with psionic abilities. The Inquisitor's powers give him a distinct advantage over magic-using enemies. </b> What I dont think they understand is (as others have pointed out) we all chose this class to play an evil healer, if we had wanted to play a Templar we would have rolled one, if we wanted to play a tank oddly enough we would have made a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] tank why is it that two years into the game the devs have suddenly decided we were obviously mistaken in our class choice and feel a need to correct us.Now maybe I am mistaken but thanks to our choice of being evil we get no healing options from the gods and then just to make sure we have no group/raid appeal we get our combat spells converted to combat arts none of which are powerful enough to make us competitive in that field either it would appear that in order for us to remain effective viable healers we have to betray. <div></div>

[Israphil]

<div><blockquote><hr>A-Dent42 wrote:Why do I have a feeling they are trying to turn us into the Vanguard equivalent of an Inquisitor?<strong>The Inquisitor</strong> <b> The Inquisitor is a heavily armored fighter who combines raw physical power with psionic abilities. The Inquisitor's powers give him a distinct advantage over magic-using enemies. </b> What I dont think they understand is (as others have pointed out) we all chose this class to play an evil healer, if we had wanted to play a Templar we would have rolled one, if we wanted to play a tank oddly enough we would have made a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] tank why is it that two years into the game the devs have suddenly decided we were obviously mistaken in our class choice and feel a need to correct us.Now maybe I am mistaken but thanks to our choice of being evil we get no healing options from the gods and then just to make sure we have no group/raid appeal we get our combat spells converted to combat arts none of which are powerful enough to make us competitive in that field either it would appear that in order for us to remain effective viable healers we have to betray. <div></div><hr></blockquote>and all of this is based on what you've heard, from, what was that? oh, BETA. Stuff is going to be changed; we should be talking about what we can do to improve our class so it can be forewarded to the devs, and not merely despair about how our class isn't getting what it wants (yet) in the next expansion. I'm convinced that our boards are a thousand times more mature than the templar boards, and I believe we keep them that way by remaining civil and looking ahead, not merely griping. Let's keep it up; the more solutions we come up with, the better the chance they will be implemented and we will be back on track.</div>

[Israphil]

<div></div>sorry, double post.<div></div><p>Message Edited by rckmer on <span class=date_text>11-07-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:07 PM</span>

[A-Dent42]

What exactly is there to look forward too other than the chance to play a new class that tanks a bit and heals enough to solo?I am not going to get into a discussion on my new and spiffy dps because I am a HEALER I dont need or want to dps if I did I would be a Swashie, Brigand, Assassin, Summoner etc. but like it or not I rolled by choice a healer you know the whole ministration thing.Yes this attitude is based on information from the BETA but it is a beta that is going live in 7 days do you seriously think they are going to rewrite the entire Inquisitor program in 7 days because they have only just this minute read the board and discovered they screwed up and made us tanks by mistake?It would be nice to be able to deliver to the devs a plan to improve the class and I support the idea 100% but in a weeks time the will no longer be what it is today so what plan should we be developing one to make us a better dps class that will apply next week or one that makes a better healing class that we all thought we were playing last week?About the only thing I am looking forward to now is playing my Conjuror or Dirge in the expansion because I sincerly doubt my guild will have need for a second rate dps/healer class.<div></div>

[menelaus109]

<div><blockquote><hr>Gobbwin wrote:<div></div> <div>Reading through all of these posts, there seems to be almost a concensus as to what would best benefit our class (replace the Emergency line with something useful).  For the most part, no one is asking for anything that would be game breaking or over powering.  Is anyone in the Beta relaying these thoughts and ideas to the devs?  All we can hope for is a last minute change for the better (not likely, but hey, won't know until you try). </div><hr></blockquote>Everything that has been said on these boards has been mentioned more than once on the Beta boards, Inq from every playstyle from uberhardcore raiders to casual groupers have posted feedback, the punishments line was changed for the better based on this feedback, the stifle was removed from fanaticism and the battle cleric ability improved I believe the devs do listen and take our feedback into account, i think there will be another big update before EoF hits live and maybe some tweaking, as another poster mentioned the best thing we can do is remain mature and refrain from griping Inqs with different AA's have posted feedback and several players have spent a lot of time testing and feeding back the resultsOn the Priest beta board there are 23 threads for all the priest issues5 are devoted entirely to Inq issues (like specific problems and issues)5 are significantly related to Inq issues (like issues that affect us and other priests of which the inq issue dominates)And we get a mention in a few more, the remainder are about all the other priest issues. </div>

[Listad12]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Demoniac wrote:<BR>ok... I am in beta.. I think i really have to get some information for you people. first of all, they are still in beta.. you can't really tell. I do believe that devs are working on.<BR><BR>good news.<BR><BR>1. chilling inquest<BR><BR>it can be enhanced by your gear, by your adornments. my inquest does 10% 251 drain/ 290 gain ( 371 intell ). i am sure it will be nerfed <SPAN>:smileytongue:</SPAN><BR><BR>2. Convert<BR><BR>this spell wasn't that great in dof kos. it's a healing boost but cost you a lot of power. now it changed.  for the first part, this spell is a part of bettle priest spell line. the power cost can be decreased 25% which means it was 56 power cost in dof/kos. now it's 42 power. second part. this spell can be enhanced by the adornments my convert does 454 heals 42 power cost. which is awesome heal rate... I am not too sure.. i think they will nerf this.<BR><BR>3. all healing spells<BR><BR>all the healing spells can be enhanced by the adornments. so besically your heals will be increased about 130-170 like that..I can't really tell you the number it depends how you use your adornments. but i can tell my reactive does 665 - 762... it's not just for our inquisitors.. it's for all heals..<BR><BR>4. gear I do believe that the new cleric set can increase your spell cast by 33% ( 6 of them or 7 not sure.. please check out the inquisitor armor post ) so far so good...<BR><BR><BR>bad news.<BR><BR>1. dps enhanced... actually, these new things doesn't really increase our dps at all. I am 100% sure they will be super useless AAs for all pve inquisitors.<BR><BR>---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>a simple example. russless invocation say<BR><BR>CA  damage 500, spell damage 500<BR><BR>CA    dps 500/(10+0.5) = 47.6<BR>spell  dps 500/(2+3)= 100<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>CA damage 1000 spell damage 500<BR><BR>CA    dps 1000/(10+0.5 ) = 95.2<BR>spell  dps   100<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>back to the topic.... you think soe will make CA damage do double spell damage?? it's never gonna happen. wardens they got the same problem.<BR><BR>2. emergence lines..<BR><BR>I am really really sorry to tell you guys. that these AAs can't be swiched. Beta inquisitors have complained about it since day 1 in beta. it's not about our AA sucks. it's about every single priest has that type of AAs.  we got the whole useless line though. they designed this way. and they won't change it. so just look up the bettle priest line and punishment line.<BR><BR>3. Enhanced Fanaticism<BR><BR>it's not like what you think. omg they removed stifle. actually  here comes the screenshot.<BR><BR><IMG src="http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/4895/fanazk8.jpg"><BR><BR>problem 1. the power cost. problem 2. cast timer ( it will ignore your spell haste ) 3. healing changed. 4. fanaticism will cost 29 per tick instead of 22<BR><BR><BR>Nov.4 beta update.<BR><BR><BR>Nov. 7 beta update in-coming. an update always brings good news and bad news... let's see<BR><BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Eh, am I seeing this picture correct ? The casting timer for spells are increased w/ Fanaticism ?</P> <P>If this is the change for this spell, they can take it back. In the long run it's not worth having not being able to cast anything if we have to sacrifice much in power/casting/and spell effectiveness.</P> <P>Message Edited by Listad12 on <SPAN class=date_text>11-07-2006</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>03:41 PM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Listad12 on <span class=date_text>11-07-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:41 PM</span>

[menelaus109]

Yes, one of the drawbacks of using the enhance:fanaticism ability is longer casting times (currently x1.5) the longer casting time isnt affect by AA's that reduce cast times or items<div></div>

[Demoniac]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Listad12 wrote:<div></div> <div></div><p></p><p>Eh, am I seeing this picture correct ? The casting timer for spells are increased w/ Fanaticism ?</p> <p>If this is the change for this spell, they can take it back. In the long run it's not worth having not being able to cast anything if we have to sacrifice much in power/casting/and spell effectiveness.</p><p>Message Edited by Listad12 on <span class="date_text">11-07-2006</span> <span class="time_text">03:41 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>yes sir.. there are a lot problems... after you cast fanaticism, it will ignore your spell haste.. you can get a 33% spell haste. so 33% + 14.5 from AA that will make our spells like 50% (i guess i don't have those gear yet... so single reactive will be like 1 second? group reactive will be like 2.5 seconds.. so it doesn't really matter stifle or not.. just stop it and cast heals then recast fanaticism... that's better.. I've heard there is a big patch incoming.. new patch brings new hope<span>:smileyhappy:</span></div><p>Message Edited by Demoniac on <span class=date_text>11-07-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:13 PM</span>

[Spider]

ok can someone explain somethign about these new aa's ? are they using the the same 50 point aa pool as our normal aa or is this a new aa point pool ?

[Gwyniveth]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> lspiderl wrote:<BR> ok can someone explain somethign about these new aa's ? are they using the the same 50 point aa pool as our normal aa or is this a new aa point pool ?<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>You retain the 50 points you already have in your original abilities, but you must earn 50 new points to spend in your Inquisitor Tree.

[ronboga]

<DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV>Demoniac wrote:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I've heard there is a big patch incoming</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I hope there is a patch and a good one to make up for this aa tree.</DIV>

[Einsteinb]

I've seen alot of discussion regarding fanaticism's changes being useless. I'd argue to the contrary. I think the intent with removing the stifle was to allow to casting of the new CAs while maintaining fanaticism. Healing with it up is still being 'barred' in an implied sense by the changes. The CAs all have reduced power costs and faster casting times, offsetting fanaticism's decreases. It seems like the complaints are using salt for sugar.

[Gobbwin]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> menelaus109 wrote: <P>Everything that has been said on these boards has been mentioned more than once on the Beta boards, Inq from every playstyle from uberhardcore raiders to casual groupers have posted feedback, the punishments line was changed for the better based on this feedback, the stifle was removed from fanaticism and the battle cleric ability improved<BR><BR>I believe the devs do listen and take our feedback into account, i think there will be another big update before EoF hits live and maybe some tweaking, as another poster mentioned the best thing we can do is remain mature and refrain from griping<BR><BR>Inqs with different AA's have posted feedback and several players have spent a lot of time testing and feeding back the results<BR><BR>On the Priest beta board there are 23 threads for all the priest issues<BR><BR>5 are devoted entirely to Inq issues (like specific problems and issues)<BR>5 are significantly related to Inq issues (like issues that affect us and other priests of which the inq issue dominates)<BR><BR>And we get a mention in a few more, the remainder are about all the other priest issues.</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>REPRESENT! <BR></P> <P>However, Uddo's comment has me thinking, is there a reduced cast time/power cost for the new CAs while fanaticism is running?  If so how much shorter and how much less power?  (Apologies if this has already been discussed, I must have glossed over it.)  </P><p>Message Edited by Gobbwin on <span class=date_text>11-08-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:53 AM</span>

[ronboga]

<DIV>Was thinking if SOE would only change the Evidence of Fath and Radiance on the EoF AA tree to Penitent's Alleviation and Treatment I could live with this.</DIV>

[Demoniac]

it's not possible.. that will break the balance of all the priests' AA.quick suggestion :what about a new AA, it can increase 1 extra concentration, and make it cost you a concentration to be able to use it. so players will be very happy to get the no.6 con but actually it's still max at 5. it doesn't break the game balance... anyway  I am just joking... this is exactly how those devs design the game <span>:smileyhappy:</span>

[ronboga]

<DIV>Read that SOE has Revamped the Defiler AA tree. Hope there is some good news for us inquisitor's.</DIV>

[Ssinu]

<div><blockquote><hr>Gwyniveth wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> 1. chilling inquestit can be enhanced by your gear, by your adornments. my inquest does 10% 251 drain/ 290 gain ( 371 intell ). i am sure it will be nerfed <span>:smileytongue:</span>2. Convertthis spell wasn't that great in dof kos. it's a healing boost but cost you a lot of power. now it changed.  for the first part, this spell is a part of bettle priest spell line. the power cost can be decreased 25% which means it was 56 power cost in dof/kos. now it's 42 power. second part. this spell can be enhanced by the adornments my convert does 454 heals 42 power cost. which is awesome heal rate... I am not too sure.. i think they will nerf this.3. all healing spellsall the healing spells can be enhanced by the adornments. so besically your heals will be increased about 130-170 like that..I can't really tell you the number it depends how you use your adornments. but i can tell my reactive does 665 - 762... it's not just for our inquisitors.. it's for all heals.. <hr> </blockquote> <p>The problem with adornments, while very nice, will benefit all preists, not just us. So they really can't be factored into the equation of the discussion of these miserable AA's. A Templar should NOT be a better healer then an Inquisitor plain and simple  We are BOTH clerics. and as Uddo so elegantly stated, we are 2 sides of the same coin. The coin should not change value depending on which side of the coin is placed in front of a merchant. It is absurd that we have to continiously look for a silver lining in the rubbish they throw at us. If you were to start a new healer today with the information you have, would you chose an Inquisitor ? I sure wouldn't. I'm frankly tired of being an after thought. I am sick to death of SoE not knowing exactly what to do with our class and throwing usless stuff at us in an attempt to find a use for us. As Ymrir said, every other class already does what we do, only better. Sure we debuff, but guess what.. many do it better. Sure we buff, but many others do that better too. And as for dps ? Who cares ? We made healers, not a dps class. </p> <p>I want to play an evil cleric.. to HEAL.. why is that so much to ask for. Why are we contionously thrust into the position of being almost equivilent to a Templar.. but not quite. Stop accepting the position of second best ! Get rid of the mantle of "well.. we don't have a Templar, we can use the Inquisitor til one shows up " With their current AA line ,Diety choices , and yes , adornemnts, where exactly in the food chain do you think that leaves us ? </p> <p>I'm in beta too, and most if not all of the suggestions from these boards have been expressed on the beta board discussion. Will it fall on deaf ears ? I have placed my faith in SoE for a long time , always assuming that eventually things would even out. But now , I'm not so sure . I hope they listen to our wishes.. guess we wait and see... </p> <p></p><hr></blockquote>Yep, all this stuff *is* being said in beta, but to be honest I get the feeling we are being drowned out by the din of all the issues in beta - Fae, zones, and achievements/deities for all classes.I think what's important and what will be listened to is parses. I personally went in with respecs and tried out all of the Acheivements, posted/bugged/feedbacked, and I'm sure others did too. We have to continue this. Personally, like Gwynieveth, I'm a healer so I'm more concentrated on that. But we need the folks with the big damage spec's to do parse comparsions and make points also. <b><font color="#cc99ff">Parses and numbers and logical arguments *MUST* be used to win our point. Whining about who heals more than us or CA's not being effiicent in text form is going to be ignored. We must have a solid, logical and to the point presentation of facts.</font></b></div>

[LardLord]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Demoniac wrote:<BR>ok... I am in beta.. I think i really have to get some information for you people. first of all, they are still in beta.. you can't really tell. I do believe that devs are working on.<BR><BR>good news.<BR><BR>1. chilling inquest<BR><BR>it can be enhanced by your gear, by your adornments. my inquest does 10% 251 drain/ 290 gain ( 371 intell ). i am sure it will be nerfed <SPAN>:smileytongue:</SPAN><BR><BR>2. Convert<BR><BR>this spell wasn't that great in dof kos. it's a healing boost but cost you a lot of power. now it changed.  for the first part, this spell is a part of bettle priest spell line. the power cost can be decreased 25% which means it was 56 power cost in dof/kos. now it's 42 power. second part. this spell can be enhanced by the adornments my convert does 454 heals 42 power cost. which is awesome heal rate... I am not too sure.. i think they will nerf this.<BR><BR>3. all healing spells<BR><BR>all the healing spells can be enhanced by the adornments. so besically your heals will be increased about 130-170 like that..I can't really tell you the number it depends how you use your adornments. but i can tell my reactive does 665 - 762... it's not just for our inquisitors.. it's for all heals..<BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>So adornments have a set amount they add to each heal?  That seems odd....</P>

[Gwyniveth]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P></P> <HR> <P>Ssinurn wrote:</P> <P><B><FONT color=#cc99ff>Parses and numbers and logical arguments *MUST* be used to win our point. Whining about who heals more than us or CA's not being effiicent in text form is going to be ignored. We must have a solid, logical and to the point presentation of facts.</FONT></B><BR><BR></P> <P></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Yes, I agree with this too and have plans on doing just that. But it does not make me any happier to have to prove anything to SoE when it is easy to see by simple Spell/AA comparison. Its basic logic.. if you improve heals and  distribute reatives on cures.. healing goes up on the class that has that ability, and stagnates on the class that does not. So, while I will do the required testing, posting, and demonstrations, I can't instill simple, basic common sense. Oh that it were that easy.<BR>

[LardLord]

<DIV>Maybe they're operating on the assumption that Inquisitors are currently slightly more powerful healers than Templars?  Thus, these AAs make sense because they help correct the imbalance?</DIV>

[ronboga]

An why would they think that Inquisitors are currently slightly more powerful healers than Templars? Ever raid I have been in if a templar shows up I get moved from the MT group. 

[Tarta]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> ronbogard wrote:<BR> An why would they think that Inquisitors are currently slightly more powerful healers than Templars? Ever raid I have been in if a templar shows up I get moved from the MT group. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed, and I don't believe any designer thinks we are stronger healers than templars unless they have no clue about their own game - and I don't believe that. Templars have so many ways to heal a group or individual as well as a stoneskin proc.<BR></DIV> <DIV>Personally, I am a fan of the punishments line. I am, for the most part, in "wait and see" mode on battle line and I have no clue what the emergency line is all about - seems pretty useless to me.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If designers want to stick with the concept of the emergency line and make AAs based on rezes and emerg. reactives, then to make this line a viable option, I think they need to make it a lot more attractive. That means bumping the rez benefits on rez AAs and SIGNIFICANTLY reducing the emergency heal refresh timer - something like 5-7 minutes would make me less gunshy about using them every once in a while.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I see some real inginuity in some AA designs so far - the defiler health -> ward conversion, the fury heal spell giveaway, the wiz manaburn, necro health -> nuke (x5), oh the templar one that boosts their dps if they haven't healed recently....  I'm not trying to whine about the inqui AAs . . . I'm just saying there's some good things out there that people really like. Maybe we need to come up with something the devs can run with (if it's not already too late).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[ronboga]

<P></P> <HR> primaryKey wrote: <P>....unless they have no clue about their own game ....</P> <P></P> <HR> <P>Some times I wonder. :smileytongue:</P>

[Catseyes]

think that was sacarstic <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I did a lyceum trash run last nite.   Yes, i was moved in rand_group_002 ,as we were having templar, warden,mystic in MT group.  Ok, i dont complain anymore, i know for sure that templars are waaaayyy better healer than us,  as skilled i can be, they just have some more ways to protect and heal : mitig buffs instead of stats boost,  heal procs instead of dmg procs, stoneskin etc... the only thing i have more than them it's the mana regen, and it's good as they have more wis than me with their own buffs.Sooo, i made my day , and tried to make them proud to have an inquisitor in raid. I was chain healing the MT , healing the other groups, group healing my group and in the same time kept debuffed the mobs with obedience, convict, debase,affliction... I did a good job and was happy to have some tells about that.  Then, a guildie said me the heal parses...  I did the lowest score : 500 K heal , templar went to 800 K healed, mystic to 700K aswell the warden... Where is the balance in that ? Even with the 2% crit of MoA, even with the 16% of AA line, even with my manaregen and all my masters heals , i m far behind in heals...and EoF AAs wont change this ... Ymrir, 70 inqui befallen<div></div>

[Gobbwin]

<DIV>I can relate to your pain Ymrir.  Situations similar to that have happened to me a number of times.  I've actually been told several times on raids or w/ groups in nasty zones to stop screwing off and start healing more...even though I was chain casting heals as fast as they would come available, while keeping the mob debuffed and the gru cured.  I've since stopped caring, I don't even try to compete w/ other healers anymore.  Instead I focus on debuffing, throwing out some quick spell DPS, and keeping fanaticism running while wailing away side-by-side w/ my Melee groupmates; I only heal and cure when necessary.  Honestly, the only times I've shined with regards to healing lately (outside of a few close calls where Absolution and chain healing was necessary) is when virtually all of the other healers on the raid are very low or completely out of power and I'm still at 80% + thanks to my mana battery.</DIV>

[menelaus109]

The AA's underwent a significant change on Beta, ive reposted all the AA's in a new thread and in a format easier to seeAlthough there is an interesting discussion on the merits of the battle line Vs nuking i think that deserves it own thread so im going to ask a mod to lock this and then ill post up some parses from beta to get that discussion rolling again<div></div>