inquisitor future

[Demoniac]

<div>just my personal feeling or daydreaming something please don't take it seriously:smileyvery-happy:</div><div> </div><div>so.. the KOS coming soon. I feel bad about this really. We are healers we got 3 spells updated they are " group direct heal " " single reactive " and " group reactive ".  all healers are probbly the same thing. and we all get a new spell. we inquisitors got a new debuff spell if I am not wrong.  I really feel this class is becoming more and more useless.</div><div> </div><div>reason 1. buffs they are still the same line following by this :  )</div><div> </div><div> </div><div><img width="1239" src="http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Eirgorn/PriestBuffs.gif" height="715"></div><div> </div><div>Reason 2. heals.</div><div> </div><div>since we always stay out of the MT group and our reactive doesn't stack. there is no way to beat any healers in the mt group. ( we open up 3 lines " fast heal " " large heal " and " single reactive " they open up 4 lines that's group reactive or group ward regen stuff ) Well, our heals still 2seconds and 3 seconds.. they are morer than less the same thing.  hope we won't have to argue about all the healers have the same healing per seconds.  and you think 1500 heals / ( cast timer 0 seconds + recaster timer 11 seconds ) = 1500 heals / ( caste timer 11 seconds + 0 recaste ) meaning exactly 0 cast time 11 recast, heal 1500 and 11 cast time 0 recast 1500 heal are the samething caz they got the same healing per seconds.. raids will nolong need us any more.. another healer will place us well anyways.. crap again.</div><div> </div><div>Reaons 3. AAs they are pretty good actually. I love it. but rumor says there are 3 ways you can get you AA. " killing raid targets " " discover the new places " and " kill heroic mobs "  once you max the Heroic mob exp you will not get AA xp again by killing more heroic mobs.</div><div> </div><div>anyways... really got bad feeling about this... what you guys feel?</div>

[Jaradcel]

Well I look at it like this:Inq's were probably never meant for main group raids (At least, I've never seen THAT happen on my server = I wonder how it'll work out on PVP servers... ouch) Instead, we've always been put as secondary, emergency healers, or for those few guilds who've stumbled upon the miracle that is Zealotry w/o a troub to back up the haste cap (Got to love that ballad spell....) and dump us in the dps group. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />As such, while I'm worried about the manner in which we are being defined by SOE, I'm not terribly surprised.Also, I'm wondering how the AA's will work out. I'm wondering if we can retroactively get some (such as by thwacking grey mobs) though I doubt what I said will happen.Still, I'm going to see how to max out my AA's asap

[rek6779]

<div>I disagree for a wide variety of reasons...</div><div> </div><div>1. Any cleric who relies on reactives while raiding is smoking crack. 3k hits can't be made up with reactives. We have the fastest largest and fastest recast times.</div><div> </div><div>2. Our debuffs are superior; Forced Obedience + Debase will still be very sweet as was the previous Forced Compliance + Vitiation. Include our Sentence upgrade mit dropper stacked with SK mit dropper, Brigand dispatch, and it's huge.</div><div> </div><div>3. Fantasticsm is huge. It's going to be an awesome group with a troubie and spell casters. Faster damage, Aria, + hate reduction.</div><div> </div><div>4. Verdict is cool, until it gets swung at with the nerf bat.</div><div> </div><div>5. See #1 and remember that we are the only healer atm who has a spell that gives us power. Put Chilling Inquest on a zerker, brigand (who can avoid AEs), or a ranger and you're golden.</div><div> </div><div>6. We still buff stamina + HP and our DPS boosts of Consecrated keep the DPS flowing. Include Act of Conviction and it's even better.</div><div> </div><div>Are we the best MT healer, no. Can we do it, yup. I've done it often.  I don't think there's anything negative in our future and I woudln't pick another class, ever.</div>

[Keldo]

With Zealotry 2 we are basically THE dps group healer.  We have fast casting heals for the start of battles, decent but not great debuffs and we bring more to the table from a DPS standpoint than any other healer.  Sure druids may deal more damage than us directly, but indirectly you could influence the DPS of your raid by a good bit in the right group.<div></div>

[Jaradcel]

I totally agree with Keldoth. I realized it the moment I was awakened to the uses that Zealotry could really use.As I said and maintain, putting us in grp 3 or 4, letting us fast cast heals at the beginning of battle, then throwing debuffs etc and then now hitting zealotry (with stifle so I can move no less) and toggling it off for a quick heal or AE heal just screams "DPS healer" all over the bank.

[Demoniac]

<div>well... I still feel bad about it...</div><div> </div><div>I understand what you guys saying but this you guys should know.</div><div> </div><div>1. recast is really the fastest ??</div><div> </div><div>let's see  a few spells reactive & regen. they both 2 seconds cast <font color="#ff0000"><font color="#ffffff">6 seconds  recast.</font> </font><font color="#ffffff">let's try fast heal line. our cast timer is 2 seconds. recast 4 seconds. their cast timer is 1 second recast is 5 seconds. </font></div><div>our largest heal cast time 3 seconds. recast 8 seconds. their casting time 1.5 seconds recast 8.5 seconds.</div><div> </div><div>We slightly better than durids. but their cast time twice faster than us. if you talking about spam heal. honestly they should be the best spam heal class not us. once the mt drop the HP they can take a look the MT's hp and heal. we can't. if we have to start it earlier mostly, if you see the mt hp dropping you start to cast what gonna happened is either MT's gone or he's already full ( caz druid heal fast )</div><div> </div><div>2. about the attack speed</div><div> </div><div> I will give you an example class.</div><div> </div><div>let's pick up Assassian. this is the coolest melee dps class in this game. if you check out his dps log, use ACT prog. 85%-90% his damage are magical damage. 10%-15% are melee damage. meaning exactly his combat skills do the most his major damage. they are all magical damage. those 85%-90% combat ability depends on their recast timer NOT attack speed. and increase attack speed will NOT increase your proc chance at all. it depends on their weapon delay. ( there is a huge discussion thread on forum. and at the end everyone agree with this )</div><div> </div><div>Increase mob's 48% haste means that will increase 48% his total dps. that has been proved already. but for us increase 48% attack speed doesn't mean it will increase your 48% at all not even close :   ) I honestly hope I am wrong :smileytongue:</div>

[Daena]

Have to say I love my class, and I'll never play anything else (primarily, anyway).  I've healed in both MT groups and dps groups, and either way I make sure I pull my weight.  Yeah, our spells are definitely more geared towards the dps groups, but an inquisitor in a MT group = a MT group healer with a near-infinite power pool.  <span>:smileyhappy:</span>-Daenath X'Deus60 Teir'Dal InquisitorNektulos<div></div>

[Demoniac]

<div>Inquisitor never been in the MT group that won't work :   ) you can check out the buff window. it shows up why. if you got more than 4 healers, then it is a must to put inquisitor outside of the MT group. it's not a joke. </div><div> </div><div>for the dps group, you can compare a fury and a inquisitor in the same dps group. the fury group can always beat the inquisitor group even you always have zealory up. it's an always :  )  we are not even close :   )</div>

[Demoniac]

<div>I am talking about a raid force. if you can someone fit the spot better , why bother have to put you in:smileyhappy:</div>

[Krien the Wick]

<div>You're forgetting one thing, even though druids have faster casts, half of their direct heals are still regens. Ours are full straight on heal. So in our 2-3 seconds to heal, we get the full thing off, they don't.</div><div> </div><div>Also, I work fine as MT healer. I've done it before, I'll do it again, and we'll do fine.</div><div> </div><div>And unless every fury I have seen sucks, I can increase a groups dps by more than a fury. Just because my dps is lower, doesnt mean the groups is. The int plus haste makes a dramatic difference for scouts, rangers especially. Remember, their poison does more damage with higher int. Brigands, assassins, swashies even.</div><div> </div><div>And now that the new zealotry has casting haste, it's gonna be even better.</div><div> </div><div>Also, if you do your DSes and dots before zealotry, the int helps you do more damage too.</div>

[Demoniac]

<div></div><p>yes int is cool.. but take a look at this</p><p>we give 62 int to the group members snife us</p><p> </p><p>furies, they give 108 + 75 int :   ) like you said int is cool 8% int = 1% increase spell damage... and they are group buffs. they are not something like snife them  :  ) they can still do the dps.. they can still do the heal.. but we can't.. if we got any buffs can beat this that's cool i honestly hope I am wrong :smileywink: you think you can beat a fury show me the prove :  )  yes sometimes 62 int can beat 182 int. but 90% these are not:smileyhappy:</p>

[Keldo]

We give 30% DPS to melee dps permanently, that is better than any fury can do (except for the proc, which is short duration).Casters are already max int 99% of the time anyway, so buffing INT does nothing.For Swashbucklers, Brigands, Assassins and ALL fighters, melee auto attack is the #1 DPS almost 100% of the time.  Adding in haste for a significant portion of this WILL greatly increase melee DPS.  If you think it doesn't, you are wrong.And the reference to Zealotry 2, the upgrade at 70 - it decreases the recast time of all spells.  This is a boon for any DPS group, and furies can offer nothing compareable.and sure we can MT group, in fact we should be there any time a Templar is not present.  Templar's don't add that much over us, their mitigation adds raw HP instead of stamina, so with a brawler tank, it could be argued we are the better choice for maxing out HP.  The one real advantage they have is the divine shield, other than that it is pretty even.<div></div>

[Kyo]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>rek6779 wrote:<div>I disagree for a wide variety of reasons...</div><div> </div><div>1. Any cleric who relies on reactives while raiding is smoking crack. 3k hits can't be made up with reactives. We have the fastest largest and fastest recast times.</div><div> </div><div>2. Our debuffs are superior; Forced Obedience + Debase will still be very sweet as was the previous Forced Compliance + Vitiation. Include our Sentence upgrade mit dropper stacked with SK mit dropper, Brigand dispatch, and it's huge.</div><div><font color="#99ffff">Dispatch alone "supposedly" maxes out.. Meaning our additional 515 (sentence at master II) won't do much. However, it's easy to keep it on indefinately as opposed to dispatch which can't. </font></div><div> </div><div>3. Fantasticsm is huge. It's going to be an awesome group with a troubie and spell casters. Faster damage, Aria, + hate reduction.</div><div><font color="#ccffff">Only good thing coming as far as i'm concerned.. Not a new spell, but a new effect so basically new.. </font></div><div><font color="#ccffff"></font> </div><div>4. Verdict is cool, until it gets swung at with the nerf bat.</div><div><font color="#ccffff">How on earth could they nerf this? /boggle Our only completely new spell for T7 and not that bad.. could be better. Too bad upgrades don't raise the percentages. </font></div><div><font color="#ccffff"></font> </div><div>5. See #1 and remember that we are the only healer atm who has a spell that gives us power. Put Chilling Inquest on a zerker, brigand (who can avoid AEs), or a ranger and you're golden.</div><div><font color="#ccffff">Unless changed before it goes live, brigands will avoid AEs no longer. </font></div><div> </div><div>6. We still buff stamina + HP and our DPS boosts of Consecrated keep the DPS flowing. Include Act of Conviction and it's even better.</div><div><font color="#ccffff">Wouldn't mind if they switched stamina with strength.. or intelligence. </font></div><div> </div><div>Are we the best MT healer, no. Can we do it, yup. I've done it often.  I don't think there's anything negative in our future and I woudln't pick another class, ever.</div><div><font color="#ccffff">I agree. We can do the MT group, quite well. Also, I wouldn't pick another healing class either <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Nothing negative, but I certainly think there should be more positives. </font></div><hr></blockquote>

[Demoniac]

<div></div><div></div><p><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/fjjslag/primfury.gif"></p><p> </p><p>no offence to ya hope this will tell you something... and at level 70 they furies offer increase 2200+ mitigation during 30 seconds :  ) so there is something compairable</p><p>Message Edited by Demoniac on <span class="date_text">02-14-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:37 AM</span></p>

[DevontheGnome]

yeah its  anice spell, but see, can only be cast on one target. if your in a DPS group with 4-5 scouts, then the 26%DPS (adept 3) buff +hp on each of them, in addition to zealotry haste/int adds more damage as a collective group.i have heard that furies can make a dps group do more damage but i haven't seen the parsing of the same dps group with a fury and with an inquisitor. Certaintly this one spell is not enough to accomplish this effect. I'd like to know how they do it.60 inquisitor52 dirge<div></div>

[Demoniac]

<div>for the int.. heh heh</div><div> </div><div>I think you missed my point, sir.  like I said during the raid if an assassin doing 50000 total damage only about 5000-7500 damages are melee damages. increase attack speed and increase dps they talking about increase 5000 x 30% = 1500 damage</div><div> </div><div>the other rest of them they are all none-melee damage. so that's 42500 - 45000. int will effect them :   ) hope those scouts not really maxed their int.</div>

[Demoniac]

<div></div><p>yeah its  anice spell, but see, can only be cast on one target. if your in a DPS group with 4-5 scouts, then the 26%DPS (adept 3) buff +hp on each of them, in addition to zealotry haste/int adds more damage as a collective group.</p><p>well yes.. but our spell are single target as well.. you can cast on each of them otherwise you wanna cancel your 2 mitigation buffs :   ) Zealotry is cool but don't forget you don't do anything during zealotry but swing the mob. and Fury dps can break 300 pretty easy :   ) 400+ are not impossible. ( our fury break 500 before ) we mostly like 200-250 ( I only have 1 spell adept III the other rest them they all master Is sorry just too rich:smileytongue: ) so that's a lot of different as well.</p><p>i have heard that furies can make a dps group do more damage but i haven't seen the parsing of the same dps group with a fury and with an inquisitor. Certaintly this one spell is not enough to accomplish this effect. I'd like to know how they do it.hope we can do a few test. mostly fury stays in the mt group. hope we can test more and more information for this. I really hope I am wrong in this case.</p>

[DevontheGnome]

i don't think those numbesr are quite fairassuming 50k base damage and assuming the lower end of your scale 5k coming from melee we have30% DPS + 50% attack speed (zealotry master). so 80% of 5k is + 4000k damage. zealotry also grants +62 int. I think you said every 8 int points is +1% damage. so that is +7.75% damage. 45k magic damage that is + 3375 damage.so that is +7375 damage to an asasssin doing 45k base magic damage and 5k base phys damage. unless i'm wrong in my math somewherevs 160 int buff which grants a 20% boost in magic damage meaning 9k boost.so yes fury still better given this scenario but not as much as you stated. I haven't parsed any of this. But it seems in some situations it will be pretty close and in others more lean toward fury<div></div>

[Keldo]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div>Only thing that int effects for scouts (besides bards) is poison damage, which at best is 10% of their total (unless they are a ranger).There is no doubt that Fury's porcupine is a great spell, in the MT group, but it does jack in a DPS group.As for your trolling of melee DPS numbers, let me clue you in.The easiest scout to buff is a Swashbuckler.  They get innate haste which will put them within 30% of the haste cap.  With proper DPS buffs and haste stacked on top of this, 33 to 40% of a Swashbuckler's output is melee auto attack.  This is what I like to call maximum potential output, on most targets Swashbucklers have max + dps and max + haste, thus they define what is the upper bound for a melee DPS to deal in auto attack damage.Looking over my own parses on my Swashbuckler, I often average approximately 800 to 1000 DPS on raid mobs.  That means MPO from melee auto attack is 250-400 DPS.  As an Inquisitor you offer the most potential to reaching that number for all other melee in your party.  You offer 62% haste, and +30% dps.  The only classes that come close to offering that much are enchanters.  Thus, you offer the best opportunity for melee on your raid to reach their auto attack MPO.A self sufficient melee DPS group made up of Dirge, Berserker, Inquisitor, and 3 Assassins offers the assassins +80% DPS and +80 % haste they would not normally recieve.  This increases your 5k number (which is extremely low, Assassins in my raid party parse 15 to 20% of total DPS in auto attack), by nearly 3 times.A fury and their intel buffs cannot do this.  At best a +170 to int is going to increase a scouts output by 5 or 10%, most casters won't even see the effects.  It looks nice to have all that int, but in practice, 80% of a scouts output is based on STR, not int.  That is of course discounting Troubador's and rangers with their buggy proc rate.In a ground pounder DPS group, we are king now.  And once were at 70, were king for casters too.Just to note, as well - thanks to SOE never fixing how reactive procs work, we can out DPS any priest on a lot of raids thanks to Vengence / Coerced firing for each person they hit (20+ times when AE hits entire party).  Since fights rarely last longer than 1-3 AEs anyway except in cases with a few orange mobs, anyone with decent gear just eats it and speeds up the fight.  Use your imagination as to how much that is going to do DPS wise and how much casting outside of Zealotry it requires.<div></div><p>Message Edited by Keldoth on <span class="date_text">02-14-2006</span><span class="time_text">12:23 PM</span></p>

[Demoniac]

<div>agree...</div><div> </div><div>that's the reason I am worried about inquisitor's future. they no longer needed by the raid any more. and more inquisitors just waste the spot. :smileysurprised: I really hope I am wrong. see what sony can do for the new expansion. if they can't handle this well, Vanguard will be incoming soon :   ) I will just see you guys there. I will problly play a cleric. opps.. I have to stop before those MIB guys move me to some cold and dark room.</div>

[mtime]

Well first of all demonaiac i agree with you alot about us not having much of a future in raids for the un-informed. We are number 1 under-rolled, under-used class (as far as healers are concerned). Therefore, since we are not around people develop strategies that don't involve us and don't require us. Therefore when we come along there is no need to even think twice about us. However, we will outheal any person guaranteed in a fight. I will freaking guarantee that if you know what your doing you should never not be on top of the heal list. Now this is subject to being in the main tank group for group reactives and group heals because alot of heal power comes from that and since we will not usually be in the MT group we will usually place 3rd or 4th on the heal list. In the MT group, which I have been, I always am on top of the pile.Here are those reasons...1) Convert      Behold the awesome power that is convert. It accounts for roughly 20% of my heals in any battle. You can't wish for power like this little sucker. The 227 (Master I) seems small but it adds up quick, fast and in a hurry.2) Chilling Inquest      The number one reason why inquisitors can outheal anybody as long as their is a single swinging melee in the group. At adept 3 this little sucker goes off roughly every 7th hit in my experience and gives me 127 power. On average for a raid boss fight it procs 20-30 times (this is on long fights). Thats 2,540 - 3,810 power gain. That's right folks. Plus manastone, overflowing vessel, necro/conjuror stones, and potions we have roughly 2x the power pool we start out with.  This means we can heal more often and longer than any other healer. While other healers pace themselves for a long fight I can mash every heal key keeping the tank up in the green. Don't believe me? Then you are not playing this class right.And to maximize your power with Chilling Inquest follow these rules.1) Rangers = teh win.      Rangers are the best choice for Inquest. Bows have a delay of about 7.0 and proc rates are increased the larger the delay on the weapon. However, since 80% of rangers attacks are ranged this and combat arts are not on a 7 second delay rangers can shoot just as often as any other melee but with greater proc rates. Since we are a dps healer anyway its as easy as sending the raid leader a tell asking for a ranger in your group.2) When no ranger is around Brigands are 2nd best choice.      Not because of proc rates but because they can always be attacking within AEs.3) The main or secondary tank is the next best choice because they will always be swinging they will never go down because if they do the raid is already starting to wipe usually.4) When none of the above are available any scout works or even a fighter. I have not confirmed but suspect that inquest does not go off for off-hand attacks and 1 handed weapons gain a bonus for procs so a sword+shield paladin might be superior to a swashbuckler or other non-ranged scout. Again, I am testing this atm but feel free to experiment.So in closing while inquisitors may be underappreciated in raids let your raid leader know your power. Or direct them to this post. It is the truth.<div></div>

[Lanfeare]

<div></div><p>What  a great post....that will be cut and psted and given to raid leaders all over I am sure.</p><p> </p><p>Thanks again</p>

[RedFeather]

<div></div><p>I made a level 60 fury on KOS. I thought I'd have a blast, but dearly missed the 'iron fist control' an inquisitor has in non-raid battles. I felt like I was just taking hits, regening and waiting for my offensive spells to recharge. Wait, I was. Wasn't my cup of tea.</p><p>I respect the furies out there. They don't have it as easy as I thought.</p><p>In short I picked an inquisitor for some melee damage, crowd control, and precise healing. I got it. :smileyvery-happy:</p>

[scivias]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Demoniac wrote:<div> </div><div>let's see  a few spells reactive & regen. they both 2 seconds cast <font color="#ff0000"><font color="#ffffff">6 seconds  recast.</font> </font><font color="#ffffff">let's try fast heal line. our cast timer is 2 seconds. recast 4 seconds. their cast timer is 1 second recast is 5 seconds.<font color="#6666ff">But "they" don't get convert, which makes the faster heals a lot more efficient and thus the inquisitor the lead figure in spamheals</font></font></div><div>We slightly better than durids. but their cast time twice faster than us. if you talking about spam heal. honestly they should be the best spam heal class not us. once the mt drop the HP they can take a look the MT's hp and heal. we can't. if we have to start it earlier mostly, if you see the mt hp dropping you start to cast what gonna happened is either MT's gone or he's already full ( caz druid heal fast )<font color="#6666ff">Hardly, I for example, when necessary, start to cast the big heal and after 2 seconds, when the MT is green, simply sit down and start the casting again. When push comes to shove I daresay the initital heal of my inq isn't much further away from furies.</font></div><div> </div><div>2. about the attack speed</div><div> </div><div> I will give you an example class.</div><div> </div><div>let's pick up Assassian. this is the coolest melee dps class in this game. if you check out his dps log, use ACT prog. 85%-90% his damage are magical damage. 10%-15% are melee damage. meaning exactly his combat skills do the most his major damage. they are all magical damage. those 85%-90% combat ability depends on their recast timer NOT attack speed.<font color="#6666ff">That is only true when you can constantly kill mobs with your CA, and repeatedly so. Either your tank is pulling real slowly or your raidmobs are more of the greenisch/blueisch type.</font>and increase attack speed will NOT increase your proc chance at all. it depends on their weapon delay. ( there is a huge discussion thread on forum. and at the end everyone agree with this )<font color="#6666ff">I beg to differ, and everyone agrees that haste does in fact increases the proc "rate" if not the proc "chance".  Chances are high that you mean actually one of my own threads, but maybe you misunderstood. The proc chance "per hit" depends on weapon delay only. But since more haste would mean more net hits over time (this is true even for using a hell of a lot of CA, since it means inbetween two CA your weapon has its delay gone and throws in the autoattack damage.And in many relevant cases to raids the assassin is empty powerwise pretty soon, provided he just spams CAs (and chances are he got agroed meanwhile) and his autoattack damage is still among the highest ones.And while the assassin has an innate dps buff of about 58% he seriously lacks haste. An inquisitors zealotry is among the best thing an assassin could ask for.</font></div><div> </div><div>Increase mob's 48% haste means that will increase 48% his total dps. that has been proved already. but for us increase 48% attack speed doesn't mean it will increase your 48% at all not even close :   ) I honestly hope I am wrong :smileytongue:<font color="#6666ff">It would mean an increase in 48% for autoattack only, and in cases where the assassin has no self-haste at all.</font></div><hr></blockquote></span></div>

[Allegr]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div></div><font face="Comic Sans MS" color="#ff00ff">Some of you guys are completely understimating the full potential of our class.  I don't consider Zealotry my greatest asset... I don't and won't use it.  It's a ridiculous slap in the face spell.  I'm a <b><i>healer</i> </b>and I can't heal when I'm stunned giving dps classes, who would rather be grouped with a coercer or fury, haste.  Cuz guess what parses have consistently shown that I'm one of the top healers in my guild along with one of our templars and furies, and I can't heal when I'm stunned, rendering me useless.  While Templars offer a couple hundred more raw hit points in buffs and a percentage based random absorb buff, they are in no other way <i><b>better </b></i>than inquisitors for the MT group.  We're not some super dps buffers -- with my spell line up of group and self buffs I can give one other person the DPS/HP buff... while a fury can offer an array of spells that actually increases the entire group's DPS.  I do however provide the MT group with an emmense amount of healing power by being in it rather than sitting in the sidelines hasting dps classes and I guess not healing cuz I'm stunned?  Have some pride in your class, some of you sound pathetic.</font><div></div><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p>Message Edited by Allegrae on <span class="date_text">02-15-2006</span><span class="time_text">02:09 AM</span></p>

[Krien the Wick]

<div></div><p>If you're not using all the tools at your disposal, it sounds like you are underestimating our class. We all know we can do mass healing too, but we're not worthless in other areas either. We can fit into a dps raising role quite well, moreso than all other priests.</p><p> </p><p>BTW Chilling works really well on Berserkers I have found.</p>

[Allegr]

yep but some posters are crying and acting like all we can do is serve as dps boosters... like our healing and buffing are just so inferior.  That attitude is sickening.<div></div>

[Demoniac]

<div></div><div><font color="#ffffff"></font><div><font color="#6666ff">But "they" don't get convert, which makes the faster heals a lot more efficient and thus the inquisitor the lead figure in spamheals</font></div><div>Convert is something else. it burns more power. it is cool for some raids. but you can't have it up always. raids won't always have an enchanter ranger and a bard always group with ya.  don't forget you and a fury wear the same gear you always 1000 power less than them. ( because your hp is 1000 higher :smileytongue: ) And for convert the HPP is 4. we talked about it before long time ago. it's a way lower than the other healing spells. worth or not worth it depends on your own choise.<font color="#6666ff">Hardly, I for example, when necessary, start to cast the big heal and after 2 seconds, when the MT is green, simply sit down and start the casting again. When push comes to shove I daresay the initital heal of my inq isn't much further away from furies.</font></div><div>yes, they can take a look at MT's hp bar. once they drop they can start to heal caz they heal fast. our style is called spam heal. we have to sit here and watch the TV while pushing the button at the same time anyways. but they are in the MT group, no matter how do you try. in general, it's a " not impossible " to beat MT group healer stay out of the MT group. like I explain caz they open up 5 healing lines we open up 3 meaning exactly your group heal won't make any effect to the MT :smileysurprised:</div><div> </div><div> </div><div><font color="#6666ff">That is only true when you can constantly kill mobs with your CA, and repeatedly so. Either your tank is pulling real slowly or your raidmobs are more of the greenisch/blueisch type.</font>it is not. 100% logs they show up. all melee attacks their melee damages only 10-15% their total damage. some mobs are different like they drain your MT's power most the melee dps have to slow burn. that's something else I think because the dps will show up you only do 300-400 and 50% are melee damage. does it mean an assassian only can do 300-400 dps?? I don't think so. and some harder mobs they got AEs. you can't just stay there and use your melee attack. so your melee attack will be 3%-5% of your total dps as well. actually 10-15% is further way more than normal. most of the harder mobs you have to wait for the call. once your Raid leader call in, spam CA for 10 seconds then get out. your melee damages will be only about 5%-8% of your total damages or even less.</div><div><div> </div><div>I will open up some dps log for this.</div><div> </div><div>Mob name    class         duration    damage   Melee damage   None-melee    Healed   Hits  Swings    Damage taken</div><div> </div><div>( pure melee mob )</div><div>Brius lakado Ranger       1:36          35919            6661                 29258            0           78       87                0 </div><div>Brius lakado Assassian  1:19          43516          12422                 31094            0         170     184                0</div><div> </div><div>( AE mobs )</div><div> </div><div>Barakah     Ranger         3:50          44152          8577                  35575             0          94      110                0  </div></div><div>Barakah     Assassian    3:03          26594          2489                  24105              0          77        80                0             </div><div> </div><div><font color="#6666ff">I beg to differ, and everyone agrees that haste does in fact increases the proc "rate" if not the proc "chance".  Chances are high that you mean actually one of my own threads, but maybe you misunderstood. The proc chance "per hit" depends on weapon delay only. But since more haste would mean more net hits over time (this is true even for using a hell of a lot of CA, since it means inbetween two CA your weapon has its delay gone and throws in the autoattack damage.And in many relevant cases to raids the assassin is empty powerwise pretty soon, provided he just spams CAs (and chances are he got agroed meanwhile) and his autoattack damage is still among the highest ones.And while the assassin has an innate dps buff of about 58% he seriously lacks haste. An inquisitors zealotry is among the best thing an assassin could ask for.</font></div><div><font color="#6666ff">It would mean an increase in 48% for autoattack only, and in cases where the assassin has no self-haste at all.</font></div><div><div>cool... glad to hear that :smileyhappy:</div><div> </div></div></div>

[Jaradcel]

Allagrae, I do hope you're not referring to me.I agree that Inq's can step up to the bat when needed to be a MH, but I also agree with Keldoth in regards to the idea that we're probably actually better off NOT being MH for the various reasons listed out.It'll be interesting to see how this plays out in PvP servers, where each side has to rely only on classes from its side (So Inq's will always become the new MH's for FP raids in them etc) to beat raids.Fortunately, I'll never have that issue. I'll keep raiding with a temp happily healing away in MG while I do backup healing and max dps'ing.......Ok, I admit it. I like hearing the raid leader shout "Burn the b^@(h down" and knowing my Zealing is gonna do even more to help that. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[scivias]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Demoniac wrote:<div></div><div><font color="#ffffff"></font><div><font color="#6666ff"></font></div><div><font color="#6666ff">That is only true when you can constantly kill mobs with your CA, and repeatedly so. Either your tank is pulling real slowly or your raidmobs are more of the greenisch/blueisch type.</font>it is not. 100% logs they show up. all melee attacks their melee damages only 10-15% their total damage.<font color="#6666ff">Ehm.. in the dps log you presented yourself against those CoAA Roamer it was </font><font color="#6666ff"><span>12422 melee damage from </span></font><font color="#6666ff"><span>43516 total damage, thats a whooping 29%Either your log doesn't show what you wanted to point out or you messed the numbers. AE heavy mobs is a different matter, of course.. but that's because the assassins inability to deal with those guys, not because the inqs buffs suck. Basically your whole assumption would fall apart if you replace the assassin with a brigand in those cases.And by all what's true and honest .. a 3 minute fight against Barakah with </span></font><font color="#6666ff"><span>2489 melee damage is not an assassin issue, someone was seriously slacking around. I get roughly 150 damage per hit with my assassin, Str around 350, inquisitor- and selfbuff for dps included. This fellow either managed to get like 20  actual hits with dual wield weapons in 180 seconds? Come on..is says he needed "</span></font><font color="#6666ff">80 swings" to do that. Was this mob red to the assassin? Was he stuck in defense stance? He died? He didn't care to move closer?</font><font color="#6666ff"></font><font color="#6666ff"></font><font color="#6666ff">I play a 60 assassin and a 60 inquisitor, and those numbers, especially the one on barakhar, probably orange to the assassin, are simply not fitting, trust me there.</font></div></div><hr></blockquote></span></div>

[rek6779]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Demoniac wrote:<div>well... I still feel bad about it...</div><div> </div><div>1. recast is really the fastest ??</div><div> </div><div>let's see  a few spells reactive & regen. they both 2 seconds cast <font color="#ff0000"><font color="#ffffff">6 seconds  recast.</font> </font><font color="#ffffff">let's try fast heal line. our cast timer is 2 seconds. recast 4 seconds. their cast timer is 1 second recast is 5 seconds. </font></div><div>our largest heal cast time 3 seconds. recast 8 seconds. their casting time 1.5 seconds recast 8.5 seconds.</div><div> </div><hr></blockquote><p>With druids though, most of their Direct heals have HOT components (especially Wardens) so they'll overwrite their own component on a spam. If you keep up Convert, and at Master I adds 227 to a heal, we still heal fast for a large amount. I frequently get told by the two active furies that I have that I can chain heal a single target faster without power issues than they. It's all a matter of perspective though. Group healing, clerics in general suck, but druids rule in. We're just a more reactive healer, as is our design.</p><p> </p><p> </p><blockquote><hr>Demoniac wrote:<div>well... I still feel bad about it...</div><div> </div><div>let's pick up Assassian. this is the coolest melee dps class in this game. if you check out his dps log, use ACT prog. 85%-90% his damage are magical damage. 10%-15% are melee damage. meaning exactly his combat skills do the most his major damage. they are all magical damage. those 85%-90% combat ability depends on their recast timer NOT attack speed. and increase attack speed will NOT increase your proc chance at all. it depends on their weapon delay. ( there is a huge discussion thread on forum. and at the end everyone agree with this )</div><hr></blockquote><p>Assassins are about big hits on single targets using CAs, and a bad example for attack speed.</p><p>Rangers however, can simply turn on their ranged attack and pound out the single target damage without every using a CA and the attack speed will help on their bows. Use a memwipe mob and a monk, and boost up attack speed and they'll snag it back almost every time on auto attack. Combine this with Act of Conviction (now Act of Faith) and each one of those hits can proc additional damage. If you look at one aspect of most spells, they suck, stack them together, and you get a bigger picture.</p><p>What Zealotry 2 (Fanaticism) will help most are mages/crusaders in your group who rely on int for damage and are casters. This allows them for bigger hits, and faster casts.</p><p>And it's not just all about our buffs, but what we can stack with others. Include a troubador in that group, throw up Zealotry 2 + Precision of the Maestro (extra damage for each spell attack) + Aria (% change for extra damage for each spell attack) + bard manasong, and you've got a rock solid caster dps group. Additionally, troubs get a song at 65 that will futher decrease cast time.</p><p>Unless things get nerfed, my troubador won't be leaving my group.</p>

[rek6779]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Demoniac wrote:<div></div><div></div><p><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/fjjslag/primfury.gif"></p><p> </p><p>no offence to ya hope this will tell you something... and at level 70 they furies offer increase 2200+ mitigation during 30 seconds :  ) so there is something compairable</p><p>Message Edited by Demoniac on <span class="date_text">02-14-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:37 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote><p>Nice spell. Can only be maintained on one ally and one ally alone.</p><p>As far as porcupine, I think my guild has used that spell about once or twice while raiding. It offers a 2000 increase in mit, but let's tell the real story here. It lasts for 30 hits (regardless of the amount, a 1 pt hit and a 1000 pt hit each count as 1 hit) regardless and stuns, not stifles the fury.</p><p>Not only that, but it's a group friend spell. Do you REALLY want a MT healer stunned? Doubtful.</p>

[Tor]

I think the Inquisitor's power in a raid is that they can serve multiple purposes.  As a templar I have a hard time healing multiple targets quickly due to the recasts being so long.  An inquis can keep multiple tanks/dps patched up without having to hit the rez button.  Zealotry is awesome, there are many exp groups and raiding situations when the tanks just aren't getting beat up and dps is more important.  Having that as an option is a nice plus...and you can always click it off lol.<div></div>

[mtime]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Demoniac wrote:<div></div><div><font color="#ffffff"></font><div><font color="#6666ff">But "they" don't get convert, which makes the faster heals a lot more efficient and thus the inquisitor the lead figure in spamheals</font></div><div>Convert is something else. it burns more power. it is cool for some raids. but you can't have it up always. raids won't always have an enchanter ranger and a bard always group with ya.  don't forget you and a fury wear the same gear you always 1000 power less than them. ( because your hp is 1000 higher :smileytongue: ) And for convert the HPP is 4. we talked about it before long time ago. it's a way lower than the other healing spells. worth or not worth it depends on your own choise.<hr></div></div></blockquote>I don't care how inneficient Convert is. Keep it on. For the love of god keep it on. I never not have convert on. I have parsed with it off and with it on and though it is not the most efficient heal in the game it is powerful. Going off on every beneficial spell cast may not seem like alot but it is. This guy heals so much I was amazed when I read the healing parser numbers. It accounted for 20% of my heals. That's 20% more healing!  If i heal on average for t6 raid mobs of 30k lets say with convert I would only heal 24k without Convert. That's 6,000 hp. Sure its a bit of a power drain but your inquest should be helping with that and your manastone can pick up the slack all by itself. Manastone + Convert = free healing. You've already got inquest to cover the loss of your manastone. Just because you can conserve power while raiding and end the raid with twice as much power as the other healing classes doesn't mean you should. If you constantly end at about the same power as every other healing class take comfort in the fact that you just burned alot more healing.

[rek6779]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>mtime wrote:<div></div>I don't care how inneficient Convert is. Keep it on. For the love of god keep it on. I never not have convert on. I have parsed with it off and with it on and though it is not the most efficient heal in the game it is powerful. Going off on every beneficial spell cast may not seem like alot but it is. This guy heals so much I was amazed when I read the healing parser numbers. It accounted for 20% of my heals. That's 20% more healing!  If i heal on average for t6 raid mobs of 30k lets say with convert I would only heal 24k without Convert. That's 6,000 hp. Sure its a bit of a power drain but your inquest should be helping with that and your manastone can pick up the slack all by itself. Manastone + Convert = free healing. You've already got inquest to cover the loss of your manastone. Just because you can conserve power while raiding and end the raid with twice as much power as the other healing classes doesn't mean you should. If you constantly end at about the same power as every other healing class take comfort in the fact that you just burned alot more healing.<hr></blockquote>/Agree! I never don't have it up either, especially when raiding. It's great that it procs on cures and I hardly notice a mana hit, even when soloing.

[Adorya]

Convert is great, just not use it when fighting the Pattern Juggler (and on some ghetto raid config vs Black Queen) <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />And I agree about the multitasking Inquisitor, I am often asked to switch from debuff/dps to healing mode depending on the situation, but if you look closely you will see that every caster type have multi potential depending on what the circumstance are. Heck I even seen a coercer goes from mez to dps mode, so everything is not as unbalanced as the theory (but yes, multi stacking is still an issue for us and guardian too).<div></div>