EoF AA's

[Kizee]

<DIV>What do you want to see for AA's when EoF releases? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would like to see some +% to healing, buffing abiltity trees mainly.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If they give us more DPS trees I think I will flip out. :smileysad:</DIV> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><p>Message Edited by Kizee on <span class=date_text>09-26-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:09 AM</span>

[Nari]

<P>I'd like to see a line where you get an encounter nuke, another where you get this awesome DoT, a line where you could dual wield hammers at an amazing attack speed, one that gives you an AE nuke where you could damage multiple encounter, and most of all a line that ends with your templar launching its armor pieces at the all enemies in the zone as a rain of enchanted metal!</P> <P> </P> <P>Just kidding.  I wonder if we will get more control type abilities?  My guess is that whatever the difference between a templar and an inquisitor is, I think it will become more apparent with the next round of AAs. <FONT size=1>I apologize in advance for my ignorance of inquisitors.</FONT></P>

[Eriol]

An ability you could pop that would double (or more) your heals and heal effects (so your reactives are that much more powerful) for 20 or 30 seconds would be cool. Kind of an "oh crap" button. May be better to have that as a cast-time reduction, though that doesn't really benefit reactives as much.Some type of "divine cleansing" that cures all effects of all types in the group (even the un-curable ones, except for a few special script effects of course (fitz in DT I mean) ). Re-cast is considerable of course, but still, would have its uses.Extra tics on reactives as a passive ability. 2 extra wouldn't be overpowering I think, but just more power-efficient healing.A straight-out percent increase mitigation passive. More points, more percent increase over what your existing buffed mitigation is. Yes buffed, so that this ability stacks at the END on top of everything, to make you more durable. Also have a similar line (hopefully in the same "line" as this) buffing resists by a percent.Distribute Damage buff. Think "spirit link" from WC3, where the damage the main target takes is shared between group members. Keep a tank up even better, though thinking about it, this seems like a great off-tank ability, rather than for us.And maybe a passive ability so that the higher your mitigation, the less interrupts you get. Oh wait... they said they'd do that at Fan Faire for the plate healers... but never did. (and yes, I was THERE)

[kcirrot]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kizee wrote:<BR> <DIV>What do you want to see for AA's when EoF releases? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would like to see some +% to healing, buffing abiltity trees mainly.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If they give us more DPS trees I think I will flip out. :smileysad:</DIV> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P> <P>Message Edited by Kizee on <SPAN class=date_text>09-26-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:09 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Then they'll just balance all content around it and everyone will be the same.  I hope they never add a significant healing/buffing tree to any priest class.  All priests are designed to be able to handle healing duties now.  Why does any priest need more?

[Quijonsith]

I wouldn't mind seeing a tree that eventually allows us to parry with our weapons.  This would piggy back off of shield ally nicely.  Summoners have an achievement path that gives them parry, why not us.  <div></div>

[CrazyMoogle]

Something that lower recast timers.  I don't mean some "here we'll shave a tenth of a second off the recast" joke.  I mean something truly substantial and worth spending points on.Increased raw heal number.Increased heal crit chance.Something that helps to keep monk tanks alive in challenging content.Something that makes us better at dealing with healing against AoEs.<div></div>

[Kizee]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> kcirrot wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kizee wrote:<BR> <DIV>What do you want to see for AA's when EoF releases? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would like to see some +% to healing, buffing abiltity trees mainly.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If they give us more DPS trees I think I will flip out. :smileysad:</DIV> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P> <P>Message Edited by Kizee on <SPAN class=date_text>09-26-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:09 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Then they'll just balance all content around it and everyone will be the same.  I hope they never add a significant healing/buffing tree to any priest class.  All priests are designed to be able to handle healing duties now.  Why does any priest need more?<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Fine... all priests are designed to handle healing duty now but why shouldn't people have a choice to be alittle bit better than others. </P> <P>After all it is that persons choice on what path they take.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Nari]

<P>I think that is what they were trying to get away from when the rebalanced us.  If they added that option to every healer subclass, that would be fair.  I would say the same about the cures.  Other than the raid "cheating which wasn't really cheating" I think the fact that we healed so much and were able to cure more impairments than the other priests is what caused all of the templar envy pre LU13.  It should have come from the fact that we wear plate <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>I would like to see those things too, though.  Even if they might not want to give it to us, I still want it!</P> <P>My greatest enemy at this point is spell damage.  Our wards help out some, but it can get pretty inefficient healing damage that gets through the reactives.</P>

[afrikaner]

<DIV>I wouldnt mind seeing our buffs get improved. And instead of every healer being able heal the same id rather like to see healers become more specialized...but thats an entirely different can of worms. casting timers, heal crit %, and possibly more ticks on the reactives all sound great, and if like to see a competent templar that didnt go down the sta and int line. we really didnt have a choice, and i'd like to see one, again with the specialization. I dont want to be like every other templar...or like every other healer, i picked this class to be different...otherwise they should just make one healer class. ...again...sorry for opening the can of worms.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*edit* and please understand i realize we are different...its just not enough for me.</DIV><p>Message Edited by afrikaner07 on <span class=date_text>09-27-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:23 AM</span>

[Xerxess]

I wouldn't mind seeing Ice Comment as one of our choices...<div></div>

[rtoub]

<P>I would like an ability that reduced recast timers by 50%.  Give it a recast timer of 5-10 minutes.  Wouldn't work on anything with a recast timer 5min or above.  So if you cast all your heals and were waiting on timers you could kick it off.  If the recast timer of an ability was 40sec it would take 20 sec of the currenly running timer of the ability.</P> <P>The mechanics would be dificult I think so I doubt we would see it.  Don't think it would be unbalencing.  Maybe the devs could think of something simular that would work with the current mechanics.</P>

[Quijonsith]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div><blockquote><hr>afrikaner07 wrote:<div></div> <div>I wouldnt mind seeing our buffs get improved. And instead of every healer being able heal the same id rather like to see healers become more specialized...but thats an entirely different can of worms. casting timers, heal crit %, and possibly more ticks on the reactives all sound great, <font color="#ffff00">and if like to see a competent templar that didnt go down the sta and int line. we really didnt have a choice, and i'd like to see one,</font> again with the specialization. I dont want to be like every other templar...or like every other healer, i picked this class to be different...otherwise they should just make one healer class. ...again...sorry for opening the can of worms.</div> <div> </div> <div>*edit* and please understand i realize we are different...its just not enough for me.</div><p>Message Edited by afrikaner07 on <span class="date_text">09-27-2006</span> <span class="time_text">08:23 AM</span></p><hr></blockquote>Ok, I'm about sick and tired of reading this kind of complete nonsense (the highlighted part).  You want to see a competent templar that didn't go down sta/in.  I know several on antonia bayle who are very competent raid templars and we intentionally didn't take the int line.  One's choice in achievements does not determine or reflect one's competency in playing their class.  You say you don't want to be like every other templar or every other healer.  If YOU choose to take the same paths as "everyone" else that's your own choice.  The options are there for the taking.STA/INT is a great raid setup if you play your templar like a caster, which admittedly we are.  I and many other players, however, did not roll templar to be pure casters.  We have plate and we use it.  We are battle clerics built for as much melee strength, if not  more than our casting strength.  Not just offensively with damage, but defensively with ally protection and debuffing.Enter the pure raid battle cleric build.  4/8 STR 4/4/4/8 AGI 4/4/4/8 STA with one point left over.  Here you have eight points in skull crack for a debuff that effectively lowers a mob's casting and melee skills by SIX levels.  Then shield ally providing the tank a 60% chance of using our aviodance for another check when his/hers fails, effectively allowing you to cast a second stone skin on the tank.  Finally the ever handy healing critGranted that this is not the build I have because I solo and group as much as I raid.  I'm planning for 4/8 STR 4/4/7/8 AGI 4/4/7 STA to balance out my solo and group dps with my raid capability.So in reality, we DO really have a choice.Getting back on topic, I wouldn't mind seeing an achievement that increases the rate at which all of our procs go off such as Glory of Combat.  That would help alot when it comes to healing the rest of the group.</div><p>Message Edited by Quijonsith on <span class=date_text>09-27-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:45 AM</span>

[Jida]

how bout an AA that allows you to cast offensive spells while moving.<div></div>

[kcirrot]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kizee wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> kcirrot wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kizee wrote:<BR> <DIV>What do you want to see for AA's when EoF releases? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I would like to see some +% to healing, buffing abiltity trees mainly.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If they give us more DPS trees I think I will flip out. :smileysad:</DIV> <P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P> <P>Message Edited by Kizee on <SPAN class=date_text>09-26-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:09 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Then they'll just balance all content around it and everyone will be the same.  I hope they never add a significant healing/buffing tree to any priest class.  All priests are designed to be able to handle healing duties now.  Why does any priest need more?<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Fine... all priests are designed to handle healing duty now but why shouldn't people have a choice to be alittle bit better than others. </P> <P>After all it is that persons choice on what path they take.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>That's not a real choice.  It's amazing to me since you had this exact situation with EQ1, but if you give people an option to be better healers, then that becomes the "required" path.  Choice is gone.  </P> <P>The only way you can have a healing option is if you do it like they did with the KoS achievements.  For instance clerics and druids have an achievement that ups your crit healing ability from the Stamina line (I assume the shaman have it too).  However, it's in the middle of the STAMINA tree and it doesn't help all that much.  But it does make you a "little bit better" as a healer.   But really you don't want achievements that make you a "little bit better".  You want a tree that devoted to healing so you can be A LOT better.  But that's just a bad deal for everyone, including you.</P> <P>A path like that removes choice because its so good.  Plus if it's so good then they have to balance around it which makes it even more required.  Then we're back to square one.  Except no one can take the other paths lest they not have enough power to heal around the new content designed to deal with the healing path.  It's a tautology that we're well rid of.</P> <P><BR></P>

[Nari]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Jida wrote:<BR>how bout an AA that allows you to cast offensive spells while moving.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I'd like that!  I also wouldn't mind healing while moving. (Sort of a run-by heal would be nice.)</P>

[Archill]

I'd like to see our debuffs become encounter based through the EoF AA lines.. and maybe a boost to their proc chance for invol healer.<div></div>

[Jida]

<div><blockquote><hr>3devious wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Jida wrote:how bout an AA that allows you to cast offensive spells while moving. <div></div> <hr> </blockquote> <p>I'd like that!  I also wouldn't mind healing while moving. (Sort of a run-by heal would be nice.)</p><hr></blockquote>Healing while moving may turn templars into overpowering... our dps with 0 aa's is so bad that i don't see the run/nuke too bad of an option.</div>

[Waking]

AE heals, AE reactives, AE "When target dies" spells.AAs that can only be gained by doing group quests and getting the group AA for it, AA that can only be gained by doing raid quests and then getting an "Epic" AA for it.Focus and Specialization on specific spells. ie focus on duration of reactives so they have more time and more ticks, even by 1 or 2 ticks. Increased effectiveness on any ability by 10 20 50 percent etc(such as increasing the hp on buffs, the proc chance on an ability most spells should be able to be focused on) maybe link this to concentration slot, so that you can work multiple specialization trees but have a limited number active at a time. Make the specializations balanced by making generally weaker spells a lot better while making say reactives only moderately better. A lottery AA, that at varying strengths will change your healing style. Quickening would make heals halved but with 1/3 power and 1/3 time, bulwark would make our heals(and by heals anything that increases health) double with more power cost and slower cast/recast/recovery. Change the names or effects, make it a cooldown of sorts ora proccable ability to be turned on or off(the maintained part that is).The ability to gain more concentration by working down an AA tree.Medium term AA application, that is if I want to switch some AAs(Instead of an achievement counsel), i must cease using said medium term AAs for a 24 hour period and then change to the new one, both of which I would have to earn but only one of which could be used at any given time.Avoidance/mitigation AAsmore to come<div></div>

[Waking]

Short term targetted or personal mitigation increase.Mana burn, but for heal instead of damage, that is at a certain ratio burn as much mana as it would take to full heal target(if power is available).A high heal, very low tick(maybe 2 ticks total) reactive. In order to deal with spike damage specifically spell nukes.Encounter wide effects for debuffs as someone mentioned earlier, but also utility debuffs such as soothe.Another "when target dies" spell with a reactive tick attached to it, in fact that makes me think...       Added effects to many or all of the spells we have, for instance           A slight power regen tick on our reactives           Slight avoidance debuff to our mitigation debuff          Half or one stoneskin tick attached to our point heals, small and large respectively.          Fate line dispells any status effect(CC) on group members as target dies.          Warring (DoT) line could have a snare.          AAs to make our fluff pet actually do something useful, even if its attachment to the pet is only aesthetic.                 (Healing randomly, any of our heals on any group target)                    A shield pet in addition to our hammer."wizards duel" since we have such long stuns this might fit us, a long duration stun that also stuns caster for same duration, alternately stifle instead of stun.An ability that for a very short duration will cause the target to be healed for the amount of damage they are doing.Specialization for efficiency on a specific type/line of spells. simply... spells cost less in your specialization.EoF AAs that build on top of KoS AAs.Alternately you could have AAs tailored to sacrifice heal, buff, debuff power in order to gain melee dps or nuking power. Just reverse many of the ideas listed.Probably more to come<div></div>

[Kendricke]

<blockquote><hr>Kizee wrote:<BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>kcirrot wrote:<BR><BR><BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Kizee wrote:<BR><DIV>What do you want to see for AA's when EoF releases? </DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>I would like to see some +% to healing, buffing abiltity trees mainly.</DIV><DIV> </DIV><DIV>If they give us more DPS trees I think I will flip out. :smileysad:</DIV><P><SPAN class=time_text></SPAN> </P><P>Message Edited by Kizee on <SPAN class=date_text>09-26-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>09:09 AM</SPAN><BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Then they'll just balance all content around it and everyone will be the same.  I hope they never add a significant healing/buffing tree to any priest class.  All priests are designed to be able to handle healing duties now.  Why does any priest need more?<BR><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>Fine... all priests are designed to handle healing duty now but why shouldn't people have a choice to be alittle bit better than others. </P><P>After all it is that persons choice on what path they take.</P><P> </P><P> </P><hr></blockquote>Because...as he said...they'd have to start balancing encounters around the concept. Keep in mind that that's likely one of the reasons you don't see so many items that increase or proc targetted heals, either. Healing is one of the, if not the most powerful concepts in the game. Raids don't wipe because of a lack of DPS typically. They wipe when tanks start to drop and ping-pong starts to occur.That said, I wouldn't mind more buffing strengths. Maybe an "Aegolism" Achievement that increases the strength of our buffs and blessings in some way.Perhaps another percentage/resist ward similar to the old Bulwark of Vie.I'd LOVE to see an additional spell haste spell similar to the old Templar Blessing of Reverence/Blessing of Devotion. This could be a concentration blessing, able to be cast upon others or oneself and which would stack with current spells.Remember Blessed Armor of the Risen/Armor of the Zealot? I do, and would love to see a version of it brought back which could provide a divine damage shield on oneself.I wouldn't mind seeing an Achievement based on the old Pacification spell which would act as an encounter based Soothe.What about the old spell "The Silent Command" which was an area of effect short term stun?We have Mark of Kings/Celestial already. What I'd love to see is a return of Mark of Karn (though, to be fair, this sounds more Inquisitor-ish).

[Dillin]

I just hope they get a little imaginative, like a line that at the end lets us use something from another class. Like at the end of the line you can use a kite shield. Of course, it would have to be expensive AA wise. Just something that really allows 1 toon to stand out from others of it's class if they want to.

[Lydiae]

<P>What's an AA?</P> <P>oh...</P> <P>I want a pet that actually does something, like shamans have.</P> <P>+1 for not adding Achievements that directly improve healing.  When they tune encounters to them, you are gimped without them, thus there's no choice.</P>

[Eriol]

<blockquote><hr>Cybst0rm wrote:I just hope they get a little imaginative, like a line that at the end lets us use something from another class. Like at the end of the line you can use a kite shield. Of course, it would have to be expensive AA wise. Just something that really allows 1 toon to stand out from others of it's class if they want to.<hr></blockquote>If you have one AA that's completely awesome, then you need 5 AAs that are completely awesome, or everybody in your class will take the same ones, and again, you're not unique anymore.The best AA-like setup I've ever seen was for Warlocks' talents in WoW. They actually had more than a half-dozen different builds that were ALL viable, though for different playstyles, and usually even a couple (at least) PER EACH playstyle. Obviously we don't want to copy WoW in this aspect, but it's something to look at to see HOW they gave lots of choices. Now of course, anybody that played WoW also knows how badly they screwed up in other classes' talents (more than one), but I'm just giving an example of how it IS possible to make multiple viable choices.

[dancemice]

<P><STRONG>MGB. </STRONG></P> <P>The only ability <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>-B-</P>

[CrazyMoogle]

<div></div>I'd be happy if they would get rid of the 50AA limit.  Let people max all the lines out if they're willing to put in the time to do it.<div></div><p>Message Edited by CrazyMoogle on <span class=date_text>10-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:02 PM</span>

[GimliidaWarri]

<P>I cant say anything except " Lack of Creativity and imigination " .  That can truly describe what I have seen thus far.....</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[NummieSh]

<P>I like the EQ1 style of AA progression.... lots of choices and the ability to continue gaining.  After getting x# of AAs in one section you could then move to the next section or continue adding more.... very cool on allowing choice.</P> <P>Also the person's idea about splitting up Group AA vs Raid/Epic AA is another good one.</P> <P>I dont know about you guys but the one AA i LOVED in EQ was the Perma Indoor SOW.....   :smileyvery-happy:  Easiest 3-5 points I ever spent</P> <P> </P> <P>Even though I hate to admit when an enemy's right... Waking has a lot of very good ideas.</P> <P>Shortterm AE stun would be reason to respec immediately for me!!!  Warring Axiom with snare..... /drool  Good stuff man.......  see you on the battlefield  :smileywink:</P>

[Kendricke]

I'd love to see more creative achievements in general, I would think.<p>Message Edited by Kendricke on <span class=date_text>10-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>05:57 AM</span>

[Sirenta]

<P>Actually as mentioned in other posts in other threads,<BR><BR>AAs should be funny or twisted, and should at least be viable to think about.</P> <P>first off, things i would like to see:</P> <P>- Raid-Odyssee<BR>- Reverse Call of the Hero (i can call myself to a group friend)<BR>- Raid-wide healing<BR>- Raid-Rezz without sickness (sure would come in handy sometimes)<BR>- Full heal (Maybe sacrifice my life to fully reset the MT...)<BR>- Reactive Stones (just like the life stones of the Shaman...)<BR>- Raid Group Heal (Group heal for AN OTHER GROUP)<BR>- Mending restoration (Heal some Armor =) )<BR>and billions....</P> <P>but...</P> <P>If the scheme doesn't change...</P> <P>Starter ability: </P> <P>Refuge Altar: Summons an immovable Pet that allows everyone praying to regen Mana/HP 20% faster</P> <P>STR-Line: <BR>1) +x str (Caps are raised so why not have a stat to start)<BR>2) one-hand mace attack lowering resistances<BR>3) melee proc<BR>4) +x Ministration/ordination (this will lower manacosts, right?)<BR>5) Everyone praying at the Altar gets +x to Mit, lasts 30 Min, only one Altar Buff per char</P> <P>Agi<BR>1) +agi<BR>2) Shield buff-> adds +schieldfactor for x minutes<BR>3) melee haste<BR>4) evac<BR>5) Everyone praying at the Altar gets +x to Avoid, lasts 30 Min, only one Altar Buff per char</P> <P>Sta<BR>1) +Sta<BR>2) 2h : interrupts and dazes for short<BR>3) hit chance+<BR>4) double-heal chance (Hey, there is double-attack)<BR>5) Everyone praying at the Altar gets +x to HP, lasts 30 Min, only one Altar Buff per char</P> <P>Wis<BR>1) +wis<BR>2) Symbol: Cleanse... cure everything on target recast?<BR>3) something unnecessary with damage<BR>4) Spreadheal: heals ...4k... if target has e.g. 1000 Damage, the remaining 3k leap to the next viable target (did i love DAoC)<BR>5) Everyone praying at the Altar gets +x to resists, lasts 30 Min, only one Altar Buff per char</P> <P>Int<BR>1) +Int<BR>2) 2h Staff: don't know<BR>3) debuffcrits<BR>4) Reduces Reuse-Timers<BR>5) Everyone praying at the Altar gets +x to Mana, lasts 30 Min, only one Altar Buff per char</P>

[Boli32]

From what I can gather through rumour and speculation 4th hand... the entire AA tree seems to revolved around new spells and improving old spells i.e. recast / cast time reduce on spells. If that is indeed the case I'm really curious which spells I would improve upon.... <div></div>

[Toilet humour]

<DIV>When is NDA lifted so we can see some screen shots and start making our choices?</DIV>

[Bjerde]

I can think of a few spells where I would like the recast/cast time reduced <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Kizee]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Toilet humour wrote:<BR> <DIV>When is NDA lifted so we can see some screen shots and start making our choices?</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I can't wait until NDA drops so I can "discuss" my utter discust for them. :smileyindifferent:</P> <P>Unless they change them totally... mystics and druids are getting better ones.....AGAIN.</P>

[Bjerde]

Man, I was seriouly hoping to see something decent in EoF. Very disheartening to see we will most likely get screwed again....<div></div>

[Supernova17]

<blockquote><hr>Bjerde wrote:Man, I was seriouly hoping to see something decent in EoF. Very disheartening to see we will most likely get screwed again....<div></div><hr></blockquote>Not exactly, some of the changes....err nvm [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] NDA. It should be lifted in the next week or so, Sony normally lets up on it about a week or two before release. <span>:smileywink:</span><div></div>

[quetzaqotl]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I can't wait until NDA drops so I can "discuss" my utter discust for them. :smileyindifferent:</P> <P>Unless they change them totally... mystics and druids are getting better ones.....AGAIN.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You must be joking... I saw what we'll get and its a bit of a mixed bag, but kos achievements.... cleric aas>druid aas hands down actually Id say kos cleric achievements are among the best achievements around imo.</P> <P>So yeah dont know what that "again" is all about, you're approaching everything so negatively like druids get good achievements to increase our heals or dmg or anything for that matter.</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>10-31-2006</span> <span class=time_text>07:17 PM</span>

[SenorPhrog]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quetzaqotl wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I can't wait until NDA drops so I can "discuss" my utter discust for them. :smileyindifferent:</P> <P>Unless they change them totally... mystics and druids are getting better ones.....AGAIN.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>You must be joking... I saw what we'll get and its a bit of a mixed bag, but kos achievements.... cleric aas>druid aas hands down actually Id say kos cleric achievements are among the best achievements around imo.</P> <P>So yeah dont know what that "again" is all about, you're approaching everything so negatively like druids get good achievements to increase our heals or dmg or anything for that matter.</P> <P>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <SPAN class=date_text>10-31-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>07:17 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>What's wrong with Druid AA's from KoS?  I've been happy with mine.  My Templar, increased melee crits, spell crits, heal crits....Druids don't get those?</P> <P>I'll end up agreeing with them on the new stuff being a little dissapointing I'm sure.<BR></P>

[Boli32]

<blockquote><hr>Radar-X wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> quetzaqotl wrote: <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <div></div> <blockquote> <blockquote> </blockquote> <p>I can't wait until NDA drops so I can "discuss" my utter discust for them. :smileyindifferent:</p> <p>Unless they change them totally... mystics and druids are getting better ones.....AGAIN.</p> <hr> </blockquote> <p>You must be joking... I saw what we'll get and its a bit of a mixed bag, but kos achievements.... cleric aas>druid aas hands down actually Id say kos cleric achievements are among the best achievements around imo.</p> <p>So yeah dont know what that "again" is all about, you're approaching everything so negatively like druids get good achievements to increase our heals or dmg or anything for that matter.</p> <p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class="date_text">10-31-2006</span> <span class="time_text">07:17 PM</span> </p><hr> </blockquote> <p>What's wrong with Druid AA's from KoS?  I've been happy with mine.  My Templar, increased melee crits, spell crits, heal crits....Druids don't get those?</p> <p>I'll end up agreeing with them on the new stuff being a little dissapointing I'm sure.</p><hr></blockquote>This is a perfect example... on our way to get crit heals you get the 'useless ability' of melee crits we get this: <img src="http://img323.imageshack.us/img323/2024/stamina39xn.jpg"> It increases to 4% at rank 4... duration remains the same.  No-one but druids know it even exists and even they forget as it just doesn't do ANYTHING. or at leats anythgin measurable<div></div>

[SenorPhrog]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> boli wrote:<BR><BR>This is a perfect example... on our way to get crit heals you get the 'useless ability' of melee crits we get this:<BR><BR><IMG src="http://img323.imageshack.us/img323/2024/stamina39xn.jpg"><BR><BR>It increases to 4% at rank 4... duration remains the same.  No-one but druids know it even exists and even they forget as it just doesn't do ANYTHING. or at leats anythgin measurable<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Useless is subjective.  I don't consider my melee crits useless.  Even healing and debuffing I can easily break 150 DPS at level 70.</P> <P>Druids don't need any more DPS.  An ability like this would mean you'd get hit less.  I can't see how that is bad.<BR></P>

[quetzaqotl]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Radar-X wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Useless is subjective.  I don't consider my melee crits useless.  Even healing and debuffing I can easily break 150 DPS at level 70.</P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Druids don't need any more DPS.  An ability like this would mean you'd get hit less.  I can't see how that is bad.<BR></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Hmm clerics can do very good dps with the right aas (the choice is yours ofc) and  can rival or even surpass druids in dps in some cases/situations as has been said/shown by multiple people on the boards.</P> <P>Druids not needing more dps, thats your opinion druids should always be the highest dps priest in any situation by a big margin imo I see defilers outdmging furies on grps of mobs on ocassion and inquisitors outdmging us on single target and thats wrong imo.</P> <P>Even on the way to some healing abilities theres some dps increasing ability along the way (as has been pointed out some people like kizee dont like that I suppose but dont know if you would like the ability boli linked instead of melee crits?).</P> <P>Of course we can hold different views but saying druids do enough dps and then saying you can easily break 150 dps (hmm ive seen larger figures but ok), well is a bit off (the dps difference between our classes isnt that big anymore tho there are some difference in buffs/debuffs cleric vs druid but thats another story).</P> <P>As for druid aas you should look more into em if you think a small chance on stun immunity for 3 secs is any good.. well I dont know can you imagine this ability proccing at just the right time for it to be useful? hmmm</P> <P>There are more borked abilities in the druid aas or abilities that dont make sense or have a very big penalty, to say druids get good achievements in kos well is wrong imo.</P> <P>The comparison between cleric and druid aas in kos and people saying clerics get the shaft compared to druids I dont get.</P><p>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <span class=date_text>10-31-2006</span> <span class=time_text>11:11 PM</span>

[Kyom]

<div><blockquote><hr>Kizee wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <hr> Toilet humour wrote: <div>When is NDA lifted so we can see some screen shots and start making our choices?</div> <hr> </blockquote> <p>I can't wait until NDA drops so I can "discuss" my utter discust for them. :smileyindifferent:</p> <p>Unless they change them totally... mystics and druids are getting better ones.....AGAIN.</p><hr></blockquote>I second the first part however I think most of the new aas are totally uncreative and each class has some they will never use.That said we have one or two that might be ok given the fact they actually work as intended...</div>

[SenorPhrog]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> quetzaqotl wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Radar-X wrote:<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Useless is subjective.  I don't consider my melee crits useless.  Even healing and debuffing I can easily break 150 DPS at level 70.</P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Druids don't need any more DPS.  An ability like this would mean you'd get hit less.  I can't see how that is bad.<BR></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Hmm clerics can do very good dps with the right aas (the choice is yours ofc) and  can rival or even surpass druids in dps in some cases/situations as has been said/shown by multiple people on the boards.</P> <P>Druids not needing more dps, thats your opinion druids should always be the highest dps priest in any situation by a big margin imo I see defilers outdmging furies on grps of mobs on ocassion and inquisitors outdmging us on single target and thats wrong imo.</P> <P>Even on the way to some healing abilities theres some dps increasing ability along the way (as has been pointed out some people like kizee dont like that I suppose but dont know if you would like the ability boli linked instead of melee crits?).</P> <P>Of course we can hold different views but saying druids do enough dps and then saying you can easily break 150 dps (hmm ive seen larger figures but ok), well is a bit off (the dps difference between our classes isnt that big anymore tho there are some difference in buffs/debuffs cleric vs druid but thats another story).</P> <P>As for druid aas you should look more into em if you think a small chance on stun immunity for 3 secs is any good.. well I dont know can you imagine this ability proccing at just the right time for it to be useful? hmmm</P> <P>There are more borked abilities in the druid aas or abilities that dont make sense or have a very big penalty, to say druids get good achievements in kos well is wrong imo.</P> <P>The comparison between cleric and druid aas in kos and people saying clerics get the shaft compared to druids I dont get.</P> <P>Message Edited by quetzaqotl on <SPAN class=date_text>10-31-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>11:11 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Well that was my point that Clerics can do decent DPS, but come on...you aren't really trying to say in general (not the time you were in Bonemire or that thread 3 months ago that showed screenshots) Clerics will out do Fury DPS.  It's not even close.  And in order to have said DPS, I have to give up the only real useful end AA we get if I want my Crit Heals chance.  </P> <P>I said I could break 150 DPS  WHILE healing and debuffing.  If I don't heal, of course I could easily exceed that.</P> <P>If Druids are in fact the weakest healers, then I have no problem with them being the highest DPS.  If that isn't the case, then them having the highest DPS is an unfounded class stereotype.  The defiler/inquistor scenarios are situational, and I group with a inq on a regular basis.  I don't see her DPS running that high, but I'd be interested to see it.</P> <P>I never said anyone got the shaft compared to anyone else.  I still have a Fury and have looked at the AA's.  Half of them are comparable to Cleric ones.  Increased chance of Crit heal, Increased chance of Crit spell dmg, Increased casting speed, <insert random ability that requires a certain weapon which will do X amount of damage>, etc... They aren't THAT different.  I don't remember your end abilities to be honest, but I'll take a look when I get home.</P>

[Dragonreal]

druids get no increased casting speed.. the only increased speeds on anything is in-combat movement speed, attack speed, and faster regen ticks. Our end-line AAs are a 10s recast melee attack, aoe immunity that stuns us and has a 3m range for grp members and requires a buckler, 30s stun immunity, auto-rez, and a buff that procs a small nuke on a target in AOE whenever we cast a beneficial spell. Personally I've found nothing useful in those.. possibly auto-rez but the rest of that line is a joke unless you're on a pvp server. <div></div>

[Timaarit]

<blockquote><hr>quetzaqotl wrote:<blockquote><hr> </blockquote> <p>You must be joking... I saw what we'll get and its a bit of a mixed bag, but kos achievements.... cleric aas>druid aas hands down actually Id say kos cleric achievements are among the best achievements around imo.</p> <hr></blockquote>Now this is true. But only if those achievements would have been given to any other class than a cleric.<div></div>

[SenorPhrog]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Dragonrealms wrote:<BR>druids get no increased casting speed.. the only increased speeds on anything is in-combat movement speed, attack speed, and faster regen ticks. Our end-line AAs are a 10s recast melee attack, aoe immunity that stuns us and has a 3m range for grp members and requires a buckler, 30s stun immunity, auto-rez, and a buff that procs a small nuke on a target in AOE whenever we cast a beneficial spell. Personally I've found nothing useful in those.. possibly auto-rez but the rest of that line is a joke unless you're on a pvp server. <BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>So both classes have one useful ending AA. *shrug*   Even the one ending AA I use which lowers cast time and refresh timers has 3 or 5 minute recast.  I've only found it useful for raids.