Anyone Notice Master Tank Pet

[Viromage]

<DIV>Was tooling around for abit last night in the new pack and noticed my LVL 70 master 1 tank pet with all master 1 buffs in defensive mode was getting out right owned by lvl 60 ^^^ heroic green mobs.  Now I didn't expect it to be a super easy fight but he was down in 5 sec with Master 1 consumption on him.   I haven't gone back to the old zones to see if this is world wide but are the mobs way under conned in the pack or was out pet that nerfed or what am I missing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Yes I know a heroic mob was not meant to be soloed but at 10 lvls lower it should be a fairly easy task to manage wit a lvl 70 master 1 pet with all master 1 buffs.?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just wondering....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Forgot to mention mob was pulled with T7 rare doll (reduce atk speed) and it stuck.</DIV><p>Message Edited by Viromage on <span class=date_text>06-15-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:32 AM</span>

[Kraven Coldblade]

I haven't noticed that but I'm going to give it a go when I get home. Pre-patch I have been able to solo green con heroics altho I had to use [Yedahds Caduceus] staff to heal pet in addition to consumption and other heals. In some situations I also had to cast undead tide to finish off the mob. I also have M1 Tank pet with M1 buffs etc etc. I hope the difficulty you faced was due to the type of mob you engaged. It'd dishearten me quite a bit if this turned out to be true with any green con heroic.

[Xtrik]

Yea kind of pethetic .. I thought soloing Heroics at 9 or 10 levels below you was bad before ... now its worst. I think they went over board with this rebalance ! Their are other classes that can solo Heroics 5 level below them and even a few that can solo Heroics a few levels below them. I don't want them rebalanced, I just think the went over board here. I am starting to question my characture choice :smileysad: I played a Shadowknight for a while and relized they were underpowered, now Necro IMO ...

[Greenie]

<DIV>My pet is having issues holding aggro now.  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I'm level 46 Adept 3 pet and Master 2 defensive.</DIV>

[Rousso]

<P>Ahh the changes aren't that bad. Necros weren't supposed to do DPS or solo well. I for one am happy with these changes because I love the class. We were way overpowered and If you aren't happy with the changes I suggest you roll another character.</P> <P>Heh just thought I would get that in before Plaguereaver, Zald and Jalek jumped in to tell you that if you are complaining you obviously are a crappy necro.</P> <P>This nerf broke the necro class. Yeah there will still be some around, and some 70 necros that people still invite on raids and respect - the same way you respect the old pathetic broken down prizefighter who won the world title 15 years ago. "Yeah champ, you da man!" But lets face it, our day is over.</P> <P> </P>

[Meist]

<div></div>Darn even though they didn't mention it, I knew they'd mess with our ability to solo heroics <span>:smileymad:</span>Oh well. Guess I'll have to enjoy one of the million other things I can do.<div></div>

[Uanelven]

<div></div><div></div><div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Rousso wrote:<div></div> <p>Necros weren't supposed to do DPS or solo well. </p><hr></blockquote><span>:smileysurprised:</span></div><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p>Message Edited by Uanelven on <span class=date_text>06-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>06:28 AM</span>

[Jal]

Ive never said people need to learn to play ive just stated the truth that this patch hasnt been that bad. I went out and tested soloing, grouping and hopefully soon raiding and ive not come across anything that makes me want to stop playing yet or have a tantrum.Necros are still good dps and have good utility whether solo or grouped.

[Galerius Antonin]

I concur with Jalek. I was out last night testing the changes and to be honest I don't notice much difference. <div></div>

[3cho]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Viromage wrote:<BR> <DIV>Was tooling around for abit last night in the new pack and noticed my LVL 70 master 1 tank pet with all master 1 buffs in defensive mode was getting out right owned by lvl 60 ^^^ heroic green mobs.  Now I didn't expect it to be a super easy fight but he was down in 5 sec with Master 1 consumption on him.   I haven't gone back to the old zones to see if this is world wide but are the mobs way under conned in the pack or was out pet that nerfed or what am I missing?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Yes I know a heroic mob was not meant to be soloed but at 10 lvls lower it should be a fairly easy task to manage wit a lvl 70 master 1 pet with all master 1 buffs.?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just wondering....</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Forgot to mention mob was pulled with T7 rare doll (reduce atk speed) and it stuck.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by Viromage on <SPAN class=date_text>06-15-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>06:32 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>In my experience, the higher the tier, the less likely you'll be able to defeat heroics (even 10 levels down).  Fighting a level 60 heroic at level 70 is not going to nearly as easy as fighting a level 30 heroic at level 40... but as I say... that's only in my experiece.  My highest level toon is only 63.</P> <P>Even with a master 1 tank pet with all master 1 buffs... I wouldnt say it's a garauntee (given the different types of mobs may be harder to kill).  Do you know what class mob you were fighting?  Maybe it had higher disease/poison resists.  Maybe it was a guardian/berserker and had a ton of hit points?  Just some suggestions.</P>

[dcoh]

i definitely noticed the difference with the tank pet since the patch.. 9 & 10 level below heroics were fairly easy before with moderate healing.. now it seems like i'm only there to be a healer for my pet.. i have to worry that if i chose to use a damage spell instead of another heal on pet will i fall behind and die.. i don't think the nerf went as bad as we thought it would, but thats the only problem i see with soloing now..

[Uanelven]

<div></div><div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Galerius Antoninus wrote:I concur with Jalek. I was out last night testing the changes and to be honest I don't notice much difference. <div></div><hr></blockquote>What were you hunting?    Before patch,  first named in nest straight up tank pet fight (rightly or wrongly not even a sweat droplet).   After patch - two goes one in offensive = Dead pet/FD,  One in Defensive = dead pet/dead me,  logoff - pub time.I swear one of the undead tide mobs tanked better while I was FD.There maybe a way around it or perhaps could work it much harder but "not much difference" is wrong.</div><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p>Message Edited by Uanelven on <span class=date_text>06-16-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:45 PM</span>

[Tokam]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Uanelven wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Galerius Antoninus wrote:<BR>I concur with Jalek. I was out last night testing the changes and to be honest I don't notice much difference. <BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I swear one of the undead tide mobs tanked better while I was FD.<BR><BR>There maybe a way around it or perhaps could work it much harder but "not much difference" is wrong.<BR> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>hehe - those tide tanks really kick it <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR>

[Dak]

<P>I can understand the way you feel. The Dirrges got it bad as well. I could solo lvl 40 heroic ^^^ with my lvl 50 Dirge, now can bearly handle a lvl 50 even. This LU has nurfed a lot of our classes.</P> <P>At least you can root, our root gets us killed.</P> <P>lvl 42 Heroic opponent took me out with three hit of over 4k damage doing 1254 wihile rooted, then charged me. My daze did good too, took 1500 after dazing the opponent.</P> <P>Don't feel lonely out there.</P>

[LiquidFlex]

<div><blockquote><hr>Rousso wrote:<div></div> <p>Ahh the changes aren't that bad. Necros weren't supposed to do DPS or solo well...</p><hr></blockquote>Uhh... since when are we NOT supposed to be able to solo well?</div>

[Jerr]

<P>ROFL--well according to most people who understand the game, Necro's are one of the top soloing classes---HELLO.</P> <P>Your posts lose credibility when you put these absurd stuff in them.</P> <P>Cheers,</P> <P>Jerril</P>

[Uanelven]

<div><blockquote><hr>Jerril wrote:<div></div> <p>ROFL--well according to most people who understand the game, Necro's are one of the top soloing classes---HELLO.</p> <p>Your posts lose credibility when you put these absurd stuff in them.</p> <p>Cheers,</p> <p>Jerril</p><hr></blockquote><img src="http://images.google.co.uk/images?q=tbn:wrI1_VGhOVictM:uplink.space.com/attachments/270850-DoNotFeedTroll.jpg"></div>

[Nainitsuj]

Pre LU24 master level dreadnaught could take Mr Fyst with no problems.  Post LU24 ... I'll never try to take on a grey epic again.  It was nearly as jaw dropping as the time I accidently sent my pet on Naggy and wiped the group.

[Rousso]

<P><FONT color=#ffff66>ROFL--well according to most people who understand the game, Necro's are one of the top soloing classes---HELLO.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffff66>Your posts lose credibility when you put these absurd stuff in them.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffff66>Cheers,</FONT></P> <P>"Most people" could just about find their [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] with both hands. Just curious, where is it written that necros are the solo kings? Sure in EQ1 we were gods...but this game? I have a wizzard and bezerker alt and both of them solo much much better than my necro. Especially after LU 24. Seems to me that SOE has gone well out of its way to ensure that necros do not have a huge advantage soloing. People who quote "most other people who understand the game," usually talk nonsense.</P> <P>Cheers,</P>

[feelgo]

<DIV>"Seems to me that SOE has gone well out of its way to ensure that necros do not have a huge advantage soloing."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and yet they continue to reduce our effectiviness</DIV>

[subari]

<P>Don't know, what some of you are crying about, not to be able to solo. Yesterday i was in bonemire (necro lvl66), hunting lvl66 - 70 Solomobs without getting troubles, while looking brasil - japan in tv. Even a named 1 up lvl 70 was no challange for me and i don't wear a lot of fabled gear, most is common or legendary and i don't have masterspells, mostly adept 3. Taking out heroics ist possible but after LU24, it has become harder to keep the pet alive or to stun root recast, if it gets killed. I don't see why i should go hunting heroics, because it takes a lot more time to kill it, xp and loot isn't worth to kill green heroics. While i'm still in downtime after a heroic fight i could slay some even or yellow solomobs. When you are grinding blue or green solos you don't even have to take a short breath in between, just to recast the pet, when its power is consumed.</P> <P>I have a lvl59 ranger too and this klass is atm not fun to play solo. Compared to the ranger i don't have to fear yellow solomobs, they can only kill my necro, when i make mistakes or get to much add. Necros don't have any reason to cry about soloplay.</P>

[Rousso]

<P><FONT color=#ffff00>Yesterday i was in bonemire (necro lvl66), hunting lvl66 - 70 Solomobs without getting troubles.</FONT></P> <P>If you are happy soloing solo mobs - more power to ya bud! These nerfs were for you! Of course I don't think there is a class in the game that cant solo those. Proves my point, really. We are simply average soloers now. Those of you who think that necros are the solo kings are still living in eq1.</P> <P>Woot Woot - SoE's balance for teh win!</P>

[ca]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Rousso wrote:<BR> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>Yesterday i was in bonemire (necro lvl66), hunting lvl66 - 70 Solomobs without getting troubles.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#3333ff size=4>If you are happy soloing solo mobs</FONT> - more power to ya bud! These nerfs were for you! Of course I don't think there is a class in the game that cant solo those. Proves my point, really. We are simply average soloers now. Those of you who think that necros are the solo kings are still living in eq1.</P> <P>Woot Woot - SoE's balance for teh win!</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Huh? I um thought that solo mobs are meant to be soloed...and...correct me if I am wrong...heroic mobs that say "this encounter is best suited for a team of 3 or more" are not meant to be soloed... maybe I missed the day SOE changed that but since I play every day i don't think I did, but the way I see it is that I am not "supposed" to play EQ2 at work but I do anyway and don't get in trouble, but if my boss came up to me after I had been playing 5 nights a week for 2 years and said "hey you can't do that anymore, next time youll get in trouble" I would...and this is the tricky part...stop and not complain since I know i shouldn't have for the last two years but that was a nice bonus.</P> <P>The nice little stealth nerf to our tanks is irritating, yes, and it definetly makes soloing non-solo material much harder it is still not meant to be soloed, heck if SOE decided to impliment a one hit kill for all heroics regardless of con to anyone not in a group I would be irritated but at the same time I would accept it as the intent of the dev team since day one.<BR></P>

[Audabon]

<DIV><FONT color=#ff00ff>id say youre crazy if you think we are done lol i parse 1k -1.5k  most of the time after the lu24 nerf.. i teeked a fe aa's and got more +disruption gear, nothing to it. as for the hard timewith mobs id say 2 box with a defiler, 'lock or sk <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT></DIV>

[seetzle]

<P>I definitly noticed a down grade in my pets.  Now, mine arn't masters, my war is adept 3 and the others are adept 1's. I went into the new expansion to do the solo quests, not only to just do it, but to see the real capability of my 'new' pets.  Since I've heard so many saying 'I didn't notice much difference' and 'It's just as easy as before'. </P> <P>The quest gives you 30 min to kill 75 solo mobs.  Using my war pet on my first try, I got 32/75 and I died because my pet couldn't keep agro.  When I sent my pet in, the mob usually came after me instead and pet had a hard time getting agro back.  As well as having to stop often to heal my pet, or because after healing my pet, I needed to wait for me to heal.  "Okay", I thought "Maybe I'm [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn], and am not doing this right."</P> <P>Second try. I put on my health rgn items I usually save for raids, equiped the staff that heals pet 40% every 15 min. Got 37/75 and didn't die. Pet still didn't keep agro, and I sorta 'kited' them about (old eq1 trick). </P> <P>Third try. Okay, so maybe wrong pet? Used scout pet.  Poor chick got the snot beat outta her. After a few mobs, I thought "Okay, this not working", swiched back to war pet. Started root/dot, keeping pet back until root broke 2 secs later, then used snare to slow it down while it was coming after me (old eq1 Druid tactic). Pet would finish it off, and saving its health. Got 45/75 this time. </P> <P>I decided to stop trying, to get some food, when a guildie (lvl 67 dirge) asked for help in sos completing 'vanishing rewards' quest.  I asked if it was just us, he says 'yes, your pet can tank'.  Thinking of how well my pet 'tanked' against solo mobs, I was worried, but then thought "Hey, he a healer, he can keep pet alive and I'm not going solo against lvl 62 ^^^ mobs." So, I agreed to help him.</P> <P>We get in there and I tell him "Keep close eye on pet, he don't tank well anymore." The first herotic mob (63 ^^^) my war pet went against near died within the first 3 hits, my guildie healing good, then the mob ignored my pet, and when after him (pet still beating on mob).  We finally killed it, and got another. We got an add, pet died, I FD guildie tires to run, dies.  With face planted on the floor, he says, "I thought your pet could easily tank these." I told him, "I told you to keep eye on pet, he not a 'tank' anymore." His reply, "Wow, you really got nerfed, I can tank better than him." We pretty much ended it a few minutes after that.</P> <P>So, I gave the new 'balanced' necro a good try, both solo and as the 'sub' tank it used to be and I have found it 'Lacking'.  I am rather depressed with having to use 'Druid' tactics against 'soloable' mobs, and having herotic mobs run over my pet like the lil druid bear pet in eq1.  But, honestly I don't think it will make any difference what we have to say about it.  SOE will leave it the same, patting themselves on the back for a job well done, and give use cute clothes to wear (LU 25). </P> <P>Sorry for making post so long.</P> <P>Cyla</P> <P>69 (Druid) Necromancer</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[kenji]

luckily. i gave up my tank pet long time ago... from LV 50 i started tanking myself with dps... and let the rogue attack from behind... which end up easier for my shaman friend to keep me alive... <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[pyrotechn]

<P>Master tank pet mitigation = apprentice tank pet mitigation = apprentice assassin mitigation.  </P> <P>That's why your master pet gets owned, he has no mitigation about.  Master makes no difference.  His combat arts go up, not his mitigation, thats why your pet getting owned vs heroics 10 levels lower then him.   Pets kinda useles except to dps, tank pet only to tank against solo con mobs...wish it weren't so.</P> <P>Tank pet kinda useless in group situation.  A mob that is virtually harmless to a buffed equal level tank in your group (I now play a guard btw), will make short dispatch of your buffed tank pet, transfer the pet's agro to you, and then wipe you or force you to feign death.   Tank Pet not even good for off tanking an add, better to use control spells (stun/fear/root).</P> <P>Problem is that tank pet seems designed to only be able to absorb enough damage vs. solo con mobs, to allow you time to do enough damage to defeat them.  The way it accormplishes this is by having a relatively large hp pool, with no mitigation.  The downside, is no heal, wards, etc, is going to keep up when your pet gets wacked for 5k damage, as will happen vs. heroics, even when your pet is fully buffed.</P> <P>Developers should balance pet classes tank wise...if we were meant to be 2nd tier dps (say 75% effective at dpsing as a dps class, we should be 75% effective as a tank class at tanking when our tank pet is up)  I mean bezerkers get it that way (2nd or arguably 1st best tank in game, and also dps), they can switch on the fly, don't see why pet classes shouldn't get somethign close to that...</P><p>Message Edited by pyrotechnic on <span class=date_text>06-25-2006</span> <span class=time_text>03:35 AM</span>

[Nainitsuj]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> pyrotechnic wrote:<BR> <P>Master tank pet mitigation = apprentice tank pet mitigation = apprentice assassin mitigation.  </P> <P>That's why your master pet gets owned, he has no mitigation about.  Master makes no difference.  His combat arts go up, not his mitigation, thats why your pet getting owned vs heroics 10 levels lower then him.   Pets kinda useles except to dps, tank pet only to tank against solo con mobs...wish it weren't so.</P> <P>Tank pet kinda useless in group situation.  A mob that is virtually harmless to a buffed equal level tank in your group (I now play a guard btw), will make short dispatch of your buffed tank pet, transfer the pet's agro to you, and then wipe you or force you to feign death.   Tank Pet not even good for off tanking an add, better to use control spells (stun/fear/root).</P> <P>Problem is that tank pet seems designed to only be able to absorb enough damage vs. solo con mobs, to allow you time to do enough damage to defeat them.  The way it accormplishes this is by having a relatively large hp pool, with no mitigation.  The downside, is no heal, wards, etc, is going to keep up when your pet gets wacked for 5k damage, as will happen vs. heroics, even when your pet is fully buffed.</P> <P>Developers should balance pet classes tank wise...if we were meant to be 2nd tier dps (say 75% effective at dpsing as a dps class, we should be 75% effective as a tank class at tanking when our tank pet is up)  I mean bezerkers get it that way (2nd or arguably 1st best tank in game, and also dps), they can switch on the fly, don't see why pet classes shouldn't get somethign close to that...</P> <P>Message Edited by pyrotechnic on <SPAN class=date_text>06-25-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>03:35 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Master Tank pet + Master defense stance = 12.5k hp with 1k mit. + Sta line + Wis line.  He should have the mitigation of a scout + the HP of a plate tank.  Why doesn't he behave like it?</P> <P>Throw a defiler in the group, have the defiler buff the pet and the pet does as well as a SK or pally. in regards to hate and tanking capabilities.</P> <P>And the devs have already reniged on the class tier chart.  Stop living in the past.</P>

[Suraklin]

<DIV> I've noticed at times I can totally kick a low level green heroic mobs butt using my tank pet and other times he acts like he's got the HP and mitigation of my mage pet against the same exact mob. I don't know if there's a HP bug or not. I have posessed my tank pet to check its HP and it'll say something like 12900/8400 and other times while posessed it'll be 12900/12900(not sure the the exact high number is that high but I know it's over 12000) </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, I'm thinking that somehow when this HP displays like 12900/8400 that somehow once the pet gets hit the first time the HP bar plumets to match that lower number HP display. Just really have noticed it since LU24 too because I upgraded to a Master 1 Undying Dreadnought after LU24 and you'd think the much larger HP pool would make the fights as easy if not easier than before LU24 using a Master tank pet. If it's the same mob you'd think the fights would all pretty much be the same or close every fight not sometimes losing your pet in 10 seconds one time, and him lasting til the mob is almost dead others. Maybe it's just luck of combat arts or spells being resisted one fight and not resisted other fights but the HP display looks fishy to me.</DIV>

[Nainitsuj]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Suraklin wrote:<BR> <DIV> I've noticed at times I can totally kick a low level green heroic mobs butt using my tank pet and other times he acts like he's got the HP and mitigation of my mage pet against the same exact mob. I don't know if there's a HP bug or not. I have posessed my tank pet to check its HP and it'll say something like 12900/8400 and other times while posessed it'll be 12900/12900(not sure the the exact high number is that high but I know it's over 12000) </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So, I'm thinking that somehow when this HP displays like 12900/8400 that somehow once the pet gets hit the first time the HP bar plumets to match that lower number HP display. Just really have noticed it since LU24 too because I upgraded to a Master 1 Undying Dreadnought after LU24 and you'd think the much larger HP pool would make the fights as easy if not easier than before LU24 using a Master tank pet. If it's the same mob you'd think the fights would all pretty much be the same or close every fight not sometimes losing your pet in 10 seconds one time, and him lasting til the mob is almost dead others. Maybe it's just luck of combat arts or spells being resisted one fight and not resisted other fights but the HP display looks fishy to me.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I think that was a bug a long time ago.  Like LU 8.  But it was with actual players.</P> <P>Gonna have to keep an eye out for that.</P>

[ca]

<DIV>I've been noticing this bug a lot lately, all my pets will show wrong numbers when I posses them, ex 11600/6900 and it is insanely irritating that the TANK pet has the same mitigation as the mage pet, I guess that means that if you slapped a few more HPs on the mage it could tank?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Big issue with tank losing aggro is because of the casting order, sometimes I see my tank toss a taunt as its first CA and at others it is cast well after I have aggro, I think this is something that should be fixed, there should be a casting order with the tanks set always starting with a taunt, also the solo trial mobs are insane, the entire Adv pack is supposed to be hard especially these trials, most classes can't get close to finishing them although honestly the only trouble I have had is with actually finding them all, i rarely ever lost aggro and always got within a few of winning, just couldn't find those few before time ran out, and I have only adept 3's. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anyway a new thread needs to be started to show the bugs in HP and to go nuts about this aggro issue, I'm gonna get some screenshots together and see if I can get one rollin. (also I agree with a previous poster, it does seem like at the first hit the tank is reverting to the lower HP numbers wich would go a long way toward explaining why so many of us are noticing the tank get owned while others don't since I don't always see the HP bug when I posses)</DIV>

[Audabon]

<P><FONT color=#ff00ff>I dont know about you all but im soloing the nest of the great egg atm and not having a problem.. hint for killing groups for you noobs  chain one down and move out of casting range and target the rest and sick pet on them you should be able clear them before the last mob becomes free. </FONT><FONT color=#cc0000><3</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#cc0000> </FONT><FONT color=#ff00ff>you have options with aa's id suggest the wisdom line as a must to max out everything if you solo alot.. the pet ward now works well and correctly so it helps alot!</FONT></P>

[Audabon]

<FONT color=#ff00ff>OH and if you are higher level and have both drawing of souls, and loathsome mark, cast a chain/ root on a solo mob, cast those two then snare it as you send your pet on it.. alot less damage is given out since you are lowering the mobs STR INT STA and WIS = hits softer, casters dont hit as hard, mob has less hp and less resists. =]</FONT>