Ruinous heart line and wondering if devs will.....

[FTL]

<DIV>Just a quesion and hoping that a dev doesnt think that this request is to much to ask, but do people think it would be fair that if u fail to send a heart to someone who has one already, (i.e they hit there macro by mistake asking for one etc) that the reuse time on it is not reset as they have not actually had a new one off you and therefore, u have not managed to successfully managed to cast the spell, or even lower the recast time down to 15 secs  like when a spell is resisted the time is reduced dramatically.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> Oh and anychance the problem with the  pet not being able to attack  from stairs in alot of the raid zones (hos being the biggetst prob)could be fixed anytime soon, in alot of raid zones pets wont attack if u are on stairs, and u have to move to ground level and that just screws up alot of the enconunters.</DIV><p>Message Edited by FTL on <span class=date_text>05-28-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:59 PM</span>

[Sarkoris]

<P>Good calls on both. Unable to accept an item should be considered the same as a resist and trigger the shortened cool off period.</P> <P>While we are at it for hearts wish list, can the range on the stupid thing be changed from 3 inches to something more reasonable. I know Devs are trying to force us to run into aoe range but no way for this scaley little lizard.</P> <P>As for the pets on slopes, stairs, 1 unch raised floor bug, yes a fix would be appreciated. I spent 10 levels soloing in The Silent City and it worked fine. Now if you walk down the steps or tell the pet to attack a mob down the bottom he runs the long way via the ramps. Its just plain silly and life threatening if you get a  pop on you.</P> <P> </P> <P>Sark. </P>

[Solaran_X]

<P>I'd like a few changes to the Ruinous Heart line...</P> <P>1) If you cast Ruinous Heart on someone and they already have one of a lesser quality or of the same quality but with charges used, the fresh Ruinous Heart will overwrite the old one. IE: If a person has an Adept I Ruinous Heart on them and I cast Master I on them, the Master I overwrites the Adept I and thus destroys the Adept I. Or if a person has a Master I Ruinous Heart with 1 charge left and I cast Master I Ruinous Heart on them again, the fresh one with three charges should overwrite the one with one charge left.</P> <P>2) If you attempt to cast Ruinous Heart on someone, but they have one of higher quality (regardless of charges) your spell is resisted, and has a drastically lowered reuse timer.</P> <P>3) Keep the 30 second reuse, but make Ruinous Heart spells group-wide. So to give the entire raid Hearts, it only takes four casts of Ruinous Heart instead of 24 (or even 6-8, if I'm just Hearting the healers).</P>

[FTL]

<DIV> <P> </P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/view_profile?user.id=146587" target=top><SPAN>Solaran_X</SPAN></A>  Said<BR></P> <P>3) Keep the 30 second reuse, but make Ruinous Heart spells group-wide. So to give the entire raid Hearts, it only takes four casts of Ruinous Heart instead of 24 (or even 6-8, if I'm just Hearting the healers).</P> <P>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________</P> <P> </P> <P>Sorry but i doubt devs will ever make ruinous heart group wide (i for one can live without it being a groupwide spell) but certainlt lowering the resuse timer if spell fail because they have one would be a simple but very good effect and i think all necros out there could agree that its not to much to ask for and wont unbalance our class at all, well at least increase the range, 5ft or whatever it is is really pointless, whole point of a mage in any type of conflict is to be the artilery and at the back, not running and getting killed by the mobs kb/ae etc.</P></DIV><p>Message Edited by FTL on <span class=date_text>05-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:53 AM</span>

[Payneal The Great]

I comletely agree with the original post. If the target already as the item, therefore never recieves an item, the spell was not succuesfuly casted, and there shouldnt be a recast timer.<div></div>

[Uanelven]

Good calls.  Both of them.   Fear the stairs!  <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Bamfa_dexter]

<DIV> <P><BR> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> FTL wrote:<BR> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> Oh and anychance the problem with the  pet not being able to attack  from stairs in alot of the raid zones (hos being the biggetst prob)could be fixed anytime soon, in alot of raid zones pets wont attack if u are on stairs, and u have to move to ground level and that just screws up alot of the enconunters.</DIV> <P>Message Edited by FTL on <SPAN class=date_text>05-28-2006</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>12:59 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P> <P>This was a change they made some time ago. </P> <P>You use to be able to pull mobs from pretty much any where you wanted, it was  in some ways was considered and exploit. So the Devs changed it to where you could only send the pet in on mobs at the same elevation as yourself. </P> <P>Just run down a few steps, send pet in to attack, and back off and chill out with the rest of the mages. Its really not something that is broken, just have to adjust your play a bit. Its working as they want it to work.</P></DIV><p>Message Edited by Bamfa_dexter on <span class=date_text>05-31-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:44 PM</span>

[FTL]

<DIV>Bamfa_dexter wrote</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just run down a few steps, send pet in to attack, and back off and chill out with the rest of the mages. Its really not something that is broken, just have to adjust your play a bit. Its working as they want it to work</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have tried running to same level where mob is in certain raid zones like hos and dt on the slopes, but no its does'nt always work, and lets say for a second that it did, lol whats the point of being a mage aka "artillery"(at the back) if u have to rundown next to the mob and then send your pet in? The whole point of this part of what i am saying is that alot of those mobs have some form of ae/kb etc so i dont want my fragile little body having to stand next to them and take it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am asking that it be adjusted, for people whop created a massive game as eq2 is, i doubt it can be very hard for them to have it so that u are able to stand at the top of stairs and send your pet to either the bottom or middle, why do alot of things in this game have to be "all or nothing" </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Bamfa_dexter]

<FONT color=#ffffff size=3> <P>Learn to time the AoE is all I can say.  I agree it can tend to be a bit of a pain, but I have not ever had and issues of getting my pet to engage a mob in steps.  </P> <P> </P> <P>Ask the Dev's why they changed it, and I am sure you will find many Summoners were using their pet to do things that they were never meant to do.   Also if memory serves me correct this change was LU13 when they introduced the climbing walls into the game.</P></FONT>

[FTL]

<DIV>Sorry but on most non named mobs its not easy to time aoe as many will know as mobs dont tend to stay up long i just dont want to be getting hit because i have to be level with them in the first place, if i wanted to get up close and personal to a mob i would have played a tank <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV>

[Ealdiin]

<DIV>I like both the ideas.    The pet thing is really annoying.  Its not just steps, its anything that changes elevation however minor.  In living tombs, stand on a bench in the courtyard and you cant send your pet to attack anything.   Lavastorm beach if a lizard is partially in a rock  or your on a hill, you can't sent your pet in.   On a really bad day we were joking that  ohh  pet couldnt see the mobs big toe so thats why he can't attack.  Its really bad when have to melee the mob to get my pet to attack</DIV>

[Uanelven]

<div></div><div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Bamfa_dexter wrote:<div></div> <div><div> </div>This was a change they made some time ago. <p>You use to be able to pull mobs from pretty much any where you wanted, it was  in some ways was considered and exploit. So the Devs changed it to where you could only send the pet in on mobs at the same elevation as yourself. </p> <p>Just run down a few steps, send pet in to attack, and back off and chill out with the rest of the mages. Its really not something that is broken, just have to adjust your play a bit. Its working as they want it to work.</p></div><p>Message Edited by Bamfa_dexter on <span class="date_text">05-31-2006</span> <span class="time_text">12:44 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>Sorry but if they wanted to do that it should be proximity and accurate line of sight and not in situations where you can be two foot from the mob and still not see it.   Even just fighting in sos is a nightmare at times.   Yes we work around it but you shouldn't have to.  Its line of sight,  its a bug and it should be addressed.    Try getting your pet to tank for you or for a group in places like this.  It's just not funny at times.</div><p><span class="time_text"></span></p><p>Message Edited by Uanelven on <span class=date_text>06-01-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:40 AM</span>

[Shonin]

<P>I like the idea of the heart re-use time, I hate waiting 30sec in  a raid to cast another heart, cause the one I just cast didn't go anywhere,</P> <P> </P> <P>and as far as the steps, that is not the way I read the devs attempt to fix our ability to pull from accross a zone.  they said that we should have clear line of sight, if I can cast on it, my pet should be able to attack it.  I aggree that I shouldn't be able to pull a km away, but if it is one step below me, I should be able to send my pet, so Kaif go back and read the notes on that one.  It's not just timing aoes, and getting near the mob, as one poster said we are to be in the rear, not up front.  When I want to be near a mob, I play my zerker or assissin.  </P> <P> </P>

[FTL]

<DIV>Well hopefully, if enough people post thats its a postitive thing on this thread,(without flames) maybe the devs will do something about it, as its not to much to ask, and would bring it inline with spell failures and re-use timers and also the problem with pets being able to attack from stairs <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV><p>Message Edited by FTL on <span class=date_text>06-01-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:06 PM</span>

[Suraklin]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Solaran_X wrote:<BR> <P>I'd like a few changes to the Ruinous Heart line...</P> <P>1) If you cast Ruinous Heart on someone and they already have one of a lesser quality or of the same quality but with charges used, the fresh Ruinous Heart will overwrite the old one. IE: If a person has an Adept I Ruinous Heart on them and I cast Master I on them, the Master I overwrites the Adept I and thus destroys the Adept I. Or if a person has a Master I Ruinous Heart with 1 charge left and I cast Master I Ruinous Heart on them again, the fresh one with three charges should overwrite the one with one charge left.</P> <P>2) If you attempt to cast Ruinous Heart on someone, but they have one of higher quality (regardless of charges) your spell is resisted, and has a drastically lowered reuse timer.</P> <P><FONT color=#ff0033>3) Keep the 30 second reuse, but make Ruinous Heart spells group-wide. So to give the entire raid Hearts, it only takes four casts of Ruinous Heart instead of 24 (or even 6-8, if I'm just Hearting the healers).</FONT></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>I /feedback this everyday I log in. The heart line spells should be Group/Raid wide on one cast in my opinion. Since I feel like I'm the only one feedbacking this change(been doing it everyday for  6 months) I'm calling on all my fellow Necro's to /feedback this change as well.

[matyas]

<P>I think a group heart spell is warranted the same as they made rezzies group wide.</P> <P>As far as the pet bug, it is very very annoying, to fix it they should have put a max range on pet pulling vs a height restriction as we live in a 3d world not a 2d one, a distance restriction would have solved the problem much more effectively and not caused the headache that the height restriction does.</P> <P>One other point on this, is I can pet pull, no matter how far away the mob is, farther than the longest taunt, longer then the farthest bow, farther than the longest spell, even surveil cant match my pet pulling distance, so what did they fix.</P> <P>Corinthius 70 Necro Nektulos</P><p>Message Edited by matyas on <span class=date_text>06-03-2006</span> <span class=time_text>12:51 PM</span>

[FTL]

<DIV>Very good point about the pet pull and distance, shame u have to have your hand up someones bum to be able to give them a heart, as that range is like 5", do u think that a dev might answer these questions at all, as clearly it is something that is wrong and needs to be addressed, if a warlock could nuke from 1000metres away but could'nt cast root unless mob was 5" away i think that would be classed as a major bug, so why after so long do we still have these problems <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[LiquidFlex]

<P>Howdy all.</P> <P>Good points on all posts. However I'd like to say that the "glitch" with the steps is very annoying, and I can also say (not sure if this was acctually mentioned yet) that it seems to only affect my pet if I tell him to attack on a downward slope of steps. Anytime I'm looking upwards at steps, my pet can run into the fray with no problems at all.</P> <P>This I find backwards actually, as one would think you could see down the stairs easier than up the stairs.</P> <P> </P> <P>Comments?</P> <P>Tnx. L8rz</P>

[subari]

I was on a raid yesterday and most players just cries for a heart, but does not mention, which one. So you sometimes have to wait 25 sec. in the middle of a combat bevore recast the right one.  And because of the reuse timer for using the hearts, i do not unterstand, why soe give us a recasttimer so long. It takes a while, when i have to cast 24 x 3 hearts for a raid.

[LiquidFlex]

<DIV><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/view_profile?user.id=142993" target=top><SPAN>subaridu</SPAN></A></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I fully understand the frustration of the recast time for an entire raid party. However, I haven't been in too many raids where the entire raid wanted a heart. I still find that alot of people underestimate the value of those squishy little things.</DIV> <DIV>Most who have grouped with me on a normal basis can testify to the fact that I'm quite adamant about passing them out and coercing people to using them and liking them. Usually to the point to where I become almost annoying, but mainly because I don't want to draw aggro from the meat shield because he/she looses power too fast and can no longer taunt. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I always shout "Who wants a mana heart? They are free so eat them like candy" (yes I know it isnt mana but you get the idea) Usually only a few people reply that they need the hearts, (unless they know me and have grouped with me previously) and a few others reply with "Ya ok I'll try one" As if it's a snack. And although I'm never the only necro in a raid, I am usually the only one with the Master hearts, so it is quite annoying to try and cast only to find out that the target already had 1/3 remaining in his/her inventory. I think it should at least replenish their stack, or have a shorter recast as though it was resisted. If you compare it to a spell that has been resisted, the recast counter is ungodly short for a resisted spell, but the hearts don't work the same way for some reason. I hope this is looked into a bit further in the future.</DIV> <DIV>As for the overal normal recast time, I guess I can deal with that, as it isn't that much of a problem for myself.</DIV> <DIV>I'm not sure how it works for the priest class, but I know that when a priest tries to give out flowers, it will let them/whoever know if they already have the item and cannot receive another.</DIV> <DIV>But then again, the priest spell is group wide, if I remember correctly, so I don't think it really matters to them in the first place.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I also find that alot of people don't realize when they should use the heart. If you wait until you need it... it's too late. I personally never really need to use my own hearts b'cuz of my Lich spell. (it's so uber I love it) And a little bit of food and drink go along way combined with the necro hearts.</DIV> <DIV>I think that alot of people still do not recognize that the heart is a more help than hinderance.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At any rate, I love the Hearts, and my Necro. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV>Hail to all other necys out there.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Lirel (66Necro/Mistmoore/Exiles of the Sun)</DIV>

[Colossaltitan]

Handing out Hearts to an entire raid party can be tedious, or more so in long fights/power drain fights when people dont use them as they need them, they begin clicking at the last minute, then I get 20tells all at once "/tell Malignx, Heart Please!" = Bad.  Then I have to prioritize, okay, main tank, healer, healer, healer, healer, dps, dps, healer, its cuts me down from top dps/t2 dps to t5.<BR><BR>If their is already a thirty second recast on each persons heart, what is the point in having a 30second recast on our end of the skill?  Oh and if someone "Failed to Accept the item" how bout lets not have a recast timer? (Same for rez'n, theirs a few times when you rez someone and someone just did it, your rez goes down, along with the other persons, and they take one rez). bleh<BR><BR>/rantoff

[Bamfa_dexter]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Shonin35 wrote:<BR> <P>I like the idea of the heart re-use time, I hate waiting 30sec in  a raid to cast another heart, cause the one I just cast didn't go anywhere,</P> <P> </P> <P>and as far as the steps, that is not the way I read the devs attempt to fix our ability to pull from accross a zone.  they said that we should have clear line of sight, if I can cast on it, my pet should be able to attack it.  I aggree that I shouldn't be able to pull a km away, but if it is one step below me, I should be able to send my pet, so Kaif go back and read the notes on that one.  It's not just timing aoes, and getting near the mob, as one poster said we are to be in the rear, not up front.  When I want to be near a mob, I play my zerker or assissin.  </P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><FONT size=2> <P>I am no expert on the game mechanics, but if I had to guess, our relative elevation to a mobs is what determines whether we can send pet to attack mob or not. The entire reason I even bothered to add to the original posters thread was to try and give MHO why pets won’t attack some mobs. </P> <P> Take a deep breath. It’s a minor annoyance if that. Clan of Shadows raids 5 nights a week and I find it to be a non issue. </P></FONT><BR><p>Message Edited by Bamfa_dexter on <span class=date_text>06-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:03 PM</span>

[FTL]

<DIV> <P> Bamfa_dexter wrote </P> <P>Take a deep breath. It’s a minor annoyance if that. Clan of Shadows raids 5 nights a week and I find it to be a non issue. </P> <P>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________</P><BR>Lol i love that "a minor annoyance" wel lto you it might be, but by the looks of the other people who have and are complaining about something so minor to be corrected, i raid 7 days a week and its a big very big annoyance and not just in raid zones sos/tos any zone with steps, its not much to ask to have it corrected.</DIV>

[Bamfa_dexter]

<DIV>7 days a week?  Are you talking about Unity?  They guild you joined only 1.5 weeks agao? Funny their web page says you guys raid 5 days a week.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Drop the "my dad can beat up your dad" [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn].  </DIV><p>Message Edited by Bamfa_dexter on <span class=date_text>06-05-2006</span> <span class=time_text>04:56 PM</span>

[FTL]

<DIV>Excuse me at what point did u feel u had to bring guilds into a NECROMANCER FORUM sorry but this is about ruinous heart/pets on steps  do yourself a favour and drop it, every person on here so far has agreed with me on this part, and u have to now lower it, bang out of order mate, there is always one on these boards who have to go against the flow of a nice constructive post thanks for making me realise that there are still some very childish people out there, and at no point did this have anything to do with amount of raiding days, ITS ABOUT RUINOUS HEART OR PETS ATTACKING FROM STEPS.</DIV>

[Jasuo]

First off the thread was started about the heart line of spells, nobody cares what or how many times your guild's raid...completely irrelevant.To the OP, I agree something needs to be done to our heart line, I like the idea of it being considered as a resist if the person already has one of your hearts.  I very much disagree with the over-writing idea case being that with more than one necro on the raid and having different tier hearts (legendary/fabled) it's nice that they can stack in the inventory giving that person one more power regen item and allowing the necros to focus more on dps or distributing to others who do not have any.As for the pet's Y axis attack bug, that has been in the game for a while now...it comes and go's.  Just last night my pet was attacking perfectly on the stairs as soon as I sent her (nightshade) while about a week ago she would sit out as if on strike when fighting on the stairs. Until they can learn what is causing that little bug (if they even care...doubtful, but here's hoping) I'm sure they'll fix it.  I tend to think the bug keeps us from doing the pulls on mobs we weren't intended. The bird in Silent City anyone?<div></div>

[Uanelven]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>Bamfa_dexter wrote:<div></div> <div></div><blockquote> <hr> </blockquote><font size="2"> <p>I am no expert on the game mechanics.</p><p><font color="#ff6600">/nod Few of us are.</font></p></font><hr></blockquote>Chill out.  It badly needs fixing and was so obviously gonna end up being a /feedback matter. Try telling a tank that it’s "a minor annoyance" he can't taunt on stairs.  :smileyindifferent:This has got nothing to do with how often you raid or if you even raid at all.    This effects <b>all</b> adventure gameplay in any zones/instances effected.I'm happy as others are to deal with it for now but it should be on the list of things that need attention.<span></span><span></span></div><p>Message Edited by Uanelven on <span class=date_text>06-06-2006</span> <span class=time_text>01:20 AM</span>

[Sarkoris]

<DIV>I can't bebgin to tell you how much the pet los bug annoys me. I spent many happy hours leveling in The Silent City, usually at the steps in front of the Snake Fountain where Battu the Lion tamer spawns. I used to be able to send my pet at mobs above and below me with no hassles at all. I still can. Just now he insists on pathing all the way to the end of the raised walkways to go up ro down. The steps must have an invisible "Pest implode if they touch these steps" sign on them that only pets can see. This isn't quite the refuse to attack hassle, but a good indication of how borked pathing and line of sight is.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And to reinterate my earlier post, lets give heart line.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1. Longer range.</DIV> <DIV>2. A shorter "failed to receive" recast timer.</DIV> <DIV>3. Make it group wide.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I think 1 and 2 are an obvious no brainer. I think 3 would be nice but not expecting it to happen.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sark. </DIV>

[Vici_Necromanc]

<DIV>I didn't read all the way through this post but Id like to see that spell hit all group members. What a pain for raids or even if multiple group members want one and you have to wait for the recast. yeah sucks for others who may not want it , but with no power regen player in group it cant hurt to have it. It has saved some oom members plenty of times.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks</DIV>