Any classes that make a lot of decisions in combat, similar to Enchanters?

[Ferguson]

Hello,I have a Coercer that I love playing.  However, I do like to have a change of pace, so I've been trying various alternate classes.  So far I've found them somewhat lacking.In group combat, with my Coercer, I have to regularly adjust my actions during a battle.  Deciding whether to mez or not (and lose out on AoE damage), or deciding whether to open with debuffing, damage output, reducing incoming damage with stuns/dazes/stifles, managing the group's power, curing magic....heck even having to decide which way to do the above depends from battle to battle.  And when things get really bad, knowing when to drop everything else and just get everything under control.In contrast, the alt that I've played the most is a Brigand.  Nearly every fight is the same:  open with stealth attack, two debuffs, two DoTs, then x amount of straightforward combat arts.  If there's more than one mob, an AoE attack will go in there.  Sometimes he gets to use some other stuff, but most fights it's the exact same order of button mashing.I've tried an inquisitor and Berzerker as well, not to much satisfation.  So could anyone recommend a class that has to make a lot of decisions in combat, other than Enchanters?<div></div>

[Dagator]

Well, I don't think you will ever find any class that will satisfy your tastes after your coercer, but that is just my opinion.  However, if you are a brave soul, you could try a dirge.  They do not solo well compared to a coercer, but in the high end of the game, I have to make alot of decisions when raiding, (I have a dirge as my main and coercer alt).  I mean, I can rez, heal, debuff, dps, and buff.  Dirges do not look good by themselves, but they make their groupmates shine, so it is kind of a selfless and thankless job.  Good luck with whatever direction you go, but remember, the coercer will probably be your first love and will not be replaced easily...

[Rythen16]

<P>The closest that I have played would be a healer. With healers you have to make decisions also. Some would be when to use damage spells and when to save power for healing, who to heal/cure and who not to heal/cure, when to call for an evac, etc. And there are no ninja afk's either (unless you want to be known as a bad healer).:smileywink:</P> <P>Now, notice that I said the closest. It still is not as involved as enchanters. When you don't have to worry about these type situations, there is a lot of button mashing. </P>

[Norrsken]

<div><blockquote><hr>Ferguson wrote:Hello,I have a Coercer that I love playing.  However, I do like to have a change of pace, so I've been trying various alternate classes.  So far I've found them somewhat lacking.In group combat, with my Coercer, I have to regularly adjust my actions during a battle.  Deciding whether to mez or not (and lose out on AoE damage), or deciding whether to open with debuffing, damage output, reducing incoming damage with stuns/dazes/stifles, managing the group's power, curing magic....heck even having to decide which way to do the above depends from battle to battle.  And when things get really bad, knowing when to drop everything else and just get everything under control.In contrast, the alt that I've played the most is a Brigand.  Nearly every fight is the same:  open with stealth attack, two debuffs, two DoTs, then x amount of straightforward combat arts.  If there's more than one mob, an AoE attack will go in there.  Sometimes he gets to use some other stuff, but most fights it's the exact same order of button mashing.I've tried an inquisitor and Berzerker as well, not to much satisfation.  So could anyone recommend a class that has to make a lot of decisions in combat, other than Enchanters?<div></div><hr></blockquote>I find my sk rather interresting, though, not much will reach the same level of required awareness as the coercer quite frankly. Though, the sk has some nice perks to it being one of the most self sufficient tank classes. And if you enjoy being in the smack middle of an ocean of angry mobs, this is definately the class for you. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Ferguson]

<div><blockquote><hr>Rythen16 wrote:<div></div> <p>The closest that I have played would be a healer. With healers you have to make decisions also. Some would be when to use damage spells and when to save power for healing, who to heal/cure and who not to heal/cure, when to call for an evac, etc. And there are no ninja afk's either (unless you want to be known as a bad healer).:smileywink:</p> <p>Now, notice that I said the closest. It still is not as involved as enchanters. When you don't have to worry about these type situations, there is a lot of button mashing. </p><hr></blockquote>Yeah, I had similar experiences with my inquisitor.  While sometimes things got hectic and I had to make snap decisions and prioritize, most of the time it was smooth (and dull) sailing.  Maybe I should play a healer and only join bad groups. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Ferguson]

<div><blockquote><hr>roxer2b wrote:<div>I find my sk rather interresting, though, not much will reach the same level of required awareness as the coercer quite frankly. Though, the sk has some nice perks to it being one of the most self sufficient tank classes. And if you enjoy being in the smack middle of an ocean of angry mobs, this is definately the class for you. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div><hr></blockquote>I think I might go with a tank.  They seem to have to keep up with a lot.  Although they generally seem expected to lead the way through dungeons, and I unfortunately don't know my way around many.</div>

[Ferguson]

<div><blockquote><hr>Dagator wrote:<div></div>Well, I don't think you will ever find any class that will satisfy your tastes after your coercer, but that is just my opinion.  However, if you are a brave soul, you could try a dirge.  They do not solo well compared to a coercer, but in the high end of the game, I have to make alot of decisions when raiding, (I have a dirge as my main and coercer alt).  I mean, I can rez, heal, debuff, dps, and buff.  Dirges do not look good by themselves, but they make their groupmates shine, so it is kind of a selfless and thankless job.  Good luck with whatever direction you go, but remember, the coercer will probably be your first love and will not be replaced easily...<hr></blockquote>Really?  I don't mean to disparage your class at all, but I've only heard the exact opposite complaint from bards, in that they have too little interaction and decision making.  My friend (a troubadour) says that only two of his buffs require using (the others are put up once and stay up), and that the rest of his contributions are minimal.As far as enhancing others instead of being in the spotlight, that certainly doesn't bother me.  I also heard that the devs were looking into bards and their role, but that doesn't really mean much.</div>

[Kyriel]

<DIV>Bards are spelled with a capital B. And that B stands for Boreing. </DIV>

[Norrsken]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Ferguson wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> roxer2b wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR>I find my sk rather interresting, though, not much will reach the same level of required awareness as the coercer quite frankly. <BR>Though, the sk has some nice perks to it being one of the most self sufficient tank classes. And if you enjoy being in the smack middle of an ocean of angry mobs, this is definately the class for you. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR><BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>I think I might go with a tank.  They seem to have to keep up with a lot.  Although they generally seem expected to lead the way through dungeons, and I unfortunately don't know my way around many.<BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Just get eq2maps, that'll help you out. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <BR>And if you try it out, positioning and turning mobs are not too hard to grasp. After that, pulling in adds is pretty much what you will be doing. Tho, sometimes, as with whatever class you play, you do a mistake, with a tank that is a bad pull, and you end up with half a room on you. Will take a bit of work to keep them all on you, and still mainain a safe lockdown on adds. If you pull it off, your group will say woow. If not, well, you wipe. </P>

[schmee]

<div></div>just an added thought, a monk class might be in line with your desires. you can tank for groups for the challenge, you can solo great, you're the best puller in the game, with lots of unique abilties = lots of varied play if you want.as for bards, i think the challenge of the class is going to be dependent on how you play it. our small guild has two bards, one of which will pull in groups most of the time (not in raids obviously). by pulling, he has the toughest job in the group and is incredibly busy all night. having said that, he prolly only gets away with it because his tank is his wife and they are on vent in the same room. pick groups are not gonna let the bard pull.as for healers, the only way i find them challenging is to get in bad groups and even then the group will be predictable at some point to make it simple. i basically gave up on my 59 mystic for this reason. healers only get a challenge in a group that is doing stuff way too hard for them or in raids (or in very bad groups). using something like prophetUI makes it even easier.<div></div><p>Message Edited by schmee on <span class=date_text>12-19-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:32 PM</span>

[WasFycksir]

<P>Necromancer for the win!</P> <P>Necro's can do-</P> <P>Healing- but you transfer your own health which requires good timing and judgement, pet choice</P> <P>Crowd control- with charm undead (lev 55), pet aggro, stuns, roots</P> <P>DPS- DD, AOE, pet management (chosing the correct pet for the situation can make a big difference)</P> <P>With a good healer/group you can even substitute for a tank, well your pet can that is.  Your tank pet cannot handle the really hard stuff or mobs that are flaky, but run of the mill experience groups can do just fine with your pet tanking.</P> <P>Necro's have great depth if the player doesn't just send in their pet and go to the bathroom.  Get to lev 32 when you get your first scout pet and that's when things really get fun.</P>

[Eidolen]

<DIV>Illusionist =P<BR></DIV> <DIV>Honestly I was in the same situation as you. I played a healer in EQ1 and when I started EQ2 I figured It would be the same. Unfortunatly I was bored out of my mind by level 30 and took up the Coercer. Since then I have started a plethora of alts with none satisfying my need to be challenged. (Highest was a 33 Wizard/70 Alchem) Someone else mentioned in this thread that a tank has to be on his toes and think fast and I think that is an understatement. I think being a Tank would be a great challenge other than I would personally have troubles in the communication department. Good tanks are usualy the leaders and it requires alot of typing and coordination. Personaly not my strong suit as I have to look at the keyboard to type. If I could always play using Ventrilo or Teamspeak I think it would be a great class to play.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Alternatively, i think the Pally/SK route is a viable alternative since they are very utility based. Being able to solo well and are a great addition as a suport class to main tanks even on raids if no coercer/dirge is available. Of course they can play the role as MT as well if need be. To me they are many classes rolled into one. The first time my previous guild beat Tarinax was with a Pally tanking and guardian assisting him. Anyway, you would not be stuck playing one single role like a guardian and could ease into the MT role if that fits your needs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Personaly I think i've decided to make a Fae Illusionist alt after the newness of the expansion wears off. After watching the 2 Illusionists in my new guild take their class to such opposite extremes, it looks like it could be alot of fun. (One is DPS spec'd and the other CC. Both play those roles Superbly) If forced to pick something else I'd have to go with a Pally.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Cheers,</DIV> <DIV>Eidolen</DIV>

[Llars]

<div><blockquote><hr>Eidolen wrote:<div></div> <div>Illusionist =P</div> <div>Honestly I was in the same situation as you. I played a healer in EQ1 and when I started EQ2 I figured It would be the same. Unfortunatly I was bored out of my mind by level 30 and took up the Coercer. Since then I have started a plethora of alts with none satisfying my need to be challenged. (Highest was a 33 Wizard/70 Alchem) Someone else mentioned in this thread that a tank has to be on his toes and think fast and I think that is an understatement. I think being a Tank would be a great challenge other than I would personally have troubles in the communication department. Good tanks are usualy the leaders and it requires alot of typing and coordination. Personaly not my strong suit as I have to look at the keyboard to type. If I could always play using Ventrilo or Teamspeak I think it would be a great class to play.</div> <div> </div> <div>Alternatively, i think the Pally/SK route is a viable alternative since they are very utility based. Being able to solo well and are a great addition as a suport class to main tanks even on raids if no coercer/dirge is available. Of course they can play the role as MT as well if need be. To me they are many classes rolled into one. The first time my previous guild beat Tarinax was with a Pally tanking and guardian assisting him. Anyway, you would not be stuck playing one single role like a guardian and could ease into the MT role if that fits your needs.</div> <div> </div> <div>Personaly I think i've decided to make a Fae Illusionist alt after the newness of the expansion wears off. <font color="#ff3333">After watching the 2 Illusionists in my new guild take their class to such opposite extremes, it looks like it could be alot of fun.</font> (One is DPS spec'd and the other CC. Both play those roles Superbly) If forced to pick something else I'd have to go with a Pally.</div> <div> </div> <div>Cheers,</div> <div>Eidolen</div><hr></blockquote>Care to expound on this?  What did they do different from each other?</div>

[whytakemine]

<div><blockquote><hr>Ferguson wrote:<div><blockquote><hr>Rythen16 wrote:<div></div> <p>The closest that I have played would be a healer. With healers you have to make decisions also. Some would be when to use damage spells and when to save power for healing, who to heal/cure and who not to heal/cure, when to call for an evac, etc. And there are no ninja afk's either (unless you want to be known as a bad healer).:smileywink:</p> <p>Now, notice that I said the closest. It still is not as involved as enchanters. When you don't have to worry about these type situations, there is a lot of button mashing. </p><hr></blockquote>Yeah, I had similar experiences with my inquisitor.  While sometimes things got hectic and I had to make snap decisions and prioritize, most of the time it was smooth (and dull) sailing.  Maybe I should play a healer and only join bad groups. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div><hr></blockquote>That's funny, that's exactly how I feel when I'm playing my coercer.  If it's not a [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ty group, or one of the two tough zones, I'd rather be playing one of my other toons. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[Ardnahoy]

<P>The only class that I feel is as fun to play as my Illusionist is my Shadow Knight.</P> <P>Fighters in general require a ton of concentration and decision making when actively tanking in a group situation. I'll admit that it is a blast to lead your group through a dungeon crawl, feeling like a general in charge of his troops. The only downside is that the whole thing can get very stressfull after a while since, like the main healer in a group, you can't take any time off.</P> <P>On my Guardian, main tanking is much easier than on my SK and requires way less work. You really feel like a powerful leader when driving the Guardian in a group setting. The SK requires a ton more work to be an effective group MT, and it can get tiring quick. The difference in those two is that the SK is one of the most fun classes to play, and is probably the top soloer within the fighter ranks. The Guardian is among the worst soloers in the game, and can be a drag to play unless you are grouped.</P> <P>As an MT, your role is not much different than an enchanter's. You are basically doing CC the whole time, only your main tool is the taunt. You want every mob locked on to you. Everything else relies on you locking those mobs onto you and only you. Also, as the floor general, you are in charge of proper pulling.</P> <P>Most decision making as the MT is reliant upon pulling the right mobs at the right times, positioning them properly, killing the mobs in a certain order, and having everything focused on you. If a mob peels off and goes after the overnuking wizzy, it is your job to pull him back to you. If a wanderer passes by, it is your job to lock on to him before he jumps your healer.</P> <P>The reason I suggest the SK over any other fighter class is that, for some reason, the SK is just a blast to play. I think it may be a simple case of SK spells having such disparate recast timers. Instead of mashing the same 5 keys over and over again, in the same order, SK spells require almost random sequences of spell casting. After a while, you realize that you are keeping up with separate timers in your head for different utilities. Your first mental timer is for your lifetaps, the second is for your stuns, the third is for your debuff and DoTs. If you are grouped, you keep track of your taunt timers in your head, and because SK taunts are so weak, you don't just spam them since you are forced to use or save them when appropriate.</P> <P>When you are not in a group, the SK can pretty much solo almost anything. They are not anywhere near as powerful enchanters when it comes to soloing, but you don't get a much better soloer than the SK when you shop around in the warrior subclasses. They get nifty utility spells (FD and Evac), and are pretty self-reliant. And nothing in this game says "taste dirt" better than a timely Harm Touch.</P>

[enchranter]

<DIV>my alt is a warden. nice mix of dps, plus you have to know when to use your regererative heals, understand the pulls, know what kind of damge is being dealt. Plus the cures are just plain fun, like playing one of those flash games on Yahoo or something, see something pop up and click it!</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As per someone elses question, illusionists can make their characters much more noticably diverse than coercers can. I made one so I could see how the STR line works. They get upgrades to their mez which coercers don't, plus can do a lot of dps themselves, where as a coercer can do more mana regen, but nobody notices that, they just think it is their leet gear keeping their power up. To the casual observer you can't really tell if a coercer is doing mana regen, stunning/stifling, or buffing dps/heal ability. But you can notice illusionists differences when one is mezing, one has a pet up, and another might even be doing melee.</DIV>

[laddich]

Illusionts with pet are wannabe conjurors. Period. If you want a real pet class go play frigging Necromancer. The group I play with can distinguish between me mezzing, stunning etc just by reading the buffs on the mobs. Coercer buffs always come first (Daze/Stifle/Mez) and so are easy understood. And I go to lengths explaining to groups who aren't used to having an enchanter with them. The thing about enchanters is that you turn a fight that looks horrible and bound to end in a wipe into a winning situation... even with half the group dead. I found that in no other class, and seriously doubt it is possible. Charm helps out with this, take the big yellow heroic out of the equation and things look a lot better instantly <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>