Coercer Raid AA and tactics question

[Vydian]

Ok, my guild leader is wanting me to respec all the way down the AGI line for raiding purposes (Currently 4,4,8,8 down both WIS and STA). Basically, he talked with another coercer in a different guild who says all they do during a raid is use chronosiphoning, and then spams our DD to interrupt the target non-stop (supposedly). I don't mind taking chronosiphing to 5, that way the only thing I lose is the 7.2% group hate decrease buff, and I don't see a whole lot of benefit to taking AGI all the way to perpetuality just for the interrupt spamming. So....1) I'm not too concerned about the DPS increase associated with running perpetuality, just how it may affect the interrupt spam.2) My gear isn't at the point where 800 to all magic resists is negligible (around 5k to everything raid buffed if I am not targeting a specific resist).3) After the combat changes when EoF goes live, I suspect that having the 42 Subjugation and Focus will be alot more important.Does anyone focus on just trying to interrupt on raids and if so, how much of a difference do you think it would make between Chronosiphoning 5 and going all the way to Perpetuality?<div></div>

[Roriondesexiest]

Yeah I have same spec as you. Usually I am in MT group so the dehate doesn't help too much, I was going to switch to INT or AGI, not sure yet but wanted to wait for EOF to come out to see how the new AA's look.   I figure they will be an add on but my AA's right now allow me to keep my decent resist and stat item in my offhand so I want to see what the new ones look like before I respec again. <div></div>

[MugnMo]

Personally, it bugs me to avail when someone pigeon-holes our class or any class into a single idea or purpose.Regardless, I'm specced 4-4-8-8-8 AGI and 4-4-8-1 STA (for crit heals) currently, however if your guild / raid leader wants you to do it so you can interrupt faster then that’s the wrong reason… The AGI line doesn’t reduce your recast time, so for you it takes cast time (1s), recovery time (0.5s), and then your recast time (3.0s) for a total of 4.5s before you can cast again. For me if I am at full perpetuality and chronosiphoning is up giving me 95% spell haste , it takes me cast time (~0.55s), recovery time (~0.38s), and the same recast time (3.0s) for a total time of ~3.93s.Take this over a minute time, you’ll be able to interrupt 13 times and I’ll be able to 15 times…big deal especially when you consider that raid mobs AOEs etc are instant cast, and most combat arts take 0.5s to cast.That being said, the AGI line is nice in that I can easily keep all 3 DOTs, all 3 reactives, all debuffs (including casting 2 hex dolls), and feeding power with no issues at all. However, I wouldn’t discount the fact that extra resists and casting skills may make a big difference one EOF comes out. If I was in your position, I would probably stay in your current spec for the next month and see what the changes bring.

[Iseabeil]

<DIV>Ill admit Im not playing a coercer or raiding as one so I might well be wrong, but looking at those cast times described, I think your raidleader is looking at the wrong place for interrupts. Im not sure on what other classes have in terms of interrupts but rogue's offensive stance has a 30% proc chance on melee to interrupt target wich when fully hasted adds to quite much. Coercers is one of my favorite classes to play along as a swashbuckler with and I keep feeling a tug to betray my illusionist for their utility, but I seriously doubt interrupts is somethin an enchanter should spec for. If perpetuality would increase the effectivness of your work in general its probably a good choise but for interrupts only? Doesnt sound right to me. If its to the point where you risk dying where you would have lived otherwise then whole raid will loose out on it with loss of both yer own dps/utility and all dps added via buffs.</DIV> <DIV>As I said, Im no expert on raiding coercers but I do think you'd get higher interrupt frequency with rogues as I know I proc it a *lot* myself when raiding as a swashie.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Tanatus]

<P>AFAIK skills do now and will do in EOF less then nothing then you fight anything that even or higher level - developers confirmed that it going stay same way.... so 42 subj - useless</P> <P>AGI greatly increase your DPS ... if you have a lot proc gear, it improve A LOT you CC ablity because mez and stun casting time reduced greatly.... With Perpentuality V + Chronosiphoning+Chronomotion all you CC spells have casting time less then 0.5s (save Sonic its slightly over 1s). Elimination cool down by 0.2s allow you recast spell spells if they resist nearly instantly. It useless for interupt thou ....</P> <P>7.2% hate decrease is less then nothing - you DONT want it if you are in MT group anyway - you have 23% raid wide amends - use it. </P> <P>STA is different story 14% crits to heals DO add some healing power thus you can't go full DPS way if you want keep that. You can go either INT/STA/AGI 4/4/4/8 4/4/8 4/8/1 or INT/STA/WIS 4/4/4/8 4/4/8 4/4/5. I am waiting for EOF but I tend to lose STA and WIS in favor full sized INT/AGI spec</P>

[feronia28]

<BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Tanatus wrote: <P>7.2% hate decrease is less then nothing - you DONT want it if you are in MT group anyway - you have 23% raid wide amends - use it.<BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Why wouldn't you want 7.2% hate decrease....and why DONT you want to use it in the MT group?  Last time I checked it doesn't deaggro the fighter class...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Roriondesexiest]

<blockquote><hr>feronia28 wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <blockquote> <hr> Tanatus wrote: <p>7.2% hate decrease is less then nothing - you DONT want it if you are in MT group anyway - you have 23% raid wide amends - use it.</p> <hr> </blockquote> </blockquote> <div>Why wouldn't you want 7.2% hate decrease....and why DONT you want to use it in the MT group?  Last time I checked it doesn't deaggro the fighter class.. </div><div> </div><hr></blockquote>The hate decrease if you are in a mt group usually isn't needed depending on how you are set up, usually it's Me, MT, 3 healers and dirge or assassin with hate transfer on MT. Who the heck in there is going to benefit from deaggro? It will mess up assassin's transfer I assume and if a dirge pulls aggro then we have other issues....<div></div>

[Vydian]

<div></div><div><blockquote><blockquote><hr>feronia28 wrote:<div></div> <blockquote> <blockquote> <hr> Tanatus wrote: <p>7.2% hate decrease is less then nothing - you DONT want it if you are in MT group anyway - you have 23% raid wide amends - use it.</p> <hr> </blockquote> </blockquote> <div>Why wouldn't you want 7.2% hate decrease....and why DONT you want to use it in the MT group?  Last time I checked it doesn't deaggro the fighter class.. </div><div> </div><hr></blockquote>The hate decrease if you are in a mt group usually isn't needed depending on how you are set up, usually it's Me, MT, 3 healers and dirge or assassin with hate transfer on MT. Who the heck in there is going to benefit from deaggro? It will mess up assassin's transfer I assume and if a dirge pulls aggro then we have other issues....<div></div><hr></blockquote>You are right in that it doesn't affect fighters in the group, but just from personal experience, if the MT group is setup correctly like dale pointed out, aggro for the MT group isn't a problem. Now, if you are a coercer that bounces between the MT group and DPS groups, then its pretty handy, but 9 times out of 10 I don't get shifted out.Anyway, I'm also replying to my own post because I did some log digging after a vlabs run the other night where I tested the interrupt spamming with only chronosiphoning 5:Stroke was casted 418 times the whole raid.I interrupted 10 times, 5 of which were on those erudite researcher mobs which are casters (hence they have cast times)Didn't interrupt any named at all, which isn't very suprising.While it was only a vlabs run, its pretty safe to say that speccing for interrupts won't get you a whole lot. What I plan on doing is just using word of force for my DPS and saving stroke for caster mobs.</div><p>Message Edited by Vydian on <span class=date_text>10-30-2006</span> <span class=time_text>08:03 AM</span>

[laddich]

I am a 70 coercer who is raiding high end T7 stuff (Deathtoll/Chel'Drak). My guild has 2 raiding coercers, so im either in with the MT or with a melee DPS based group. The coercer's end-possibilities are all weak, compared to what you can get in other lines. My spec is:STA 4-4-8-8 : Empathic Aura (Increase Heal crits) and Empathic Soothing (17.8% less hate for non-fighters)     STA is by far the most important line for coercers. The heal crits will make you loved by MT grp and support group while the de-agro means a lot for the scouts in your group that have your DPS buff.INT 4-4-4 : The usefull one being Savant Insight. When you take a hit you will become un-interruptable for a few seconds. Not only handy when solo-ing but with DOTs on you, you can still cast.WIS 4-4-5 : Daydream and Dream Barrier (higher resists & smaller social agro radius) are also among the essentials. Esp. with E0F coming out WIS will become more important. I will probably stack more into WIS when it does come out.<span class="mainmenu"><span class="mainmenu"><span class="postbody"> Notice that I did not pick any of the end capabilities: AGI-Line: fast casting (perpetuality). I find that this makes me: a) OOP a lot, b) there generally is no need for faster casting: my debuffs are fast only thing is that it could shave off 1.5 secs of casting a mez. Downside: must have 1H staff and other hand unequipped. Lose stats. WIS-Line: Hypnosis, short duration charm. Since coercers already have charm as a spell, this seems utterly useless. INT-Line: Voletile Magic. When under 25% power my damage increases. Sucks because a) I hardly ever get under 25% power and b) my dps will go up only 5-10%. Not going to make a noticable difference. And hey, i'm not here to DPS. STA-Line: Sever Empathy, Target encounter will not respond to allies from other encounters that are being attacked. Reduces hate towards empathic. If I get agro the tank is doing a lousy job. I don't need hate reduction, tanks need to taunt. STR-Line: Counterblade, Melee attack that counters the next spell cast if it successfully hits. Fock strength, i'm not here for Strength or melee damage.</span></span></span><div></div>