Beta Tester Question

[Usermaat]

<DIV>Are there <STRONG>ANY</STRONG> response from devs/designers on any of the beta boards about charm? Other than the posts stating changes have been made. Any reason as to why, etc etc?</DIV>

[Mage-Apprentice]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> EJdev wrote:<BR> <DIV>Thanks for the detailed breakdown! Unfortunately, we're completely revising how and what training spells are in the combat revamp. I'll post more details once we have a solidified implementation, and we'll certainly use your post as a reference for Coercer concerns with training as applicable.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also, let me give some quick information on Coercer charm:</DIV> <UL> <LI>Charm should not be risk free. We're looking into some specific changes to duration and break chances as well as maximum con of creature.</LI> <LI>Charmed mobs <EM>should</EM> attack and use their specials (read: the current issue with charmed mobs doing zero damage is a bug)</LI> <LI>Charm should be a usable tool for the Coercer in most situations. This is in reference to having trouble finding charm-worthy targets in dungeons.</LI></UL> <P>As I make changes to charm, I'll notify Coercers via the update message and, if possible, in this thread.</P> <P>Message Edited by EJdev on <SPAN class=date_text>08-22-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>05:44 PM</SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> EJdev wrote:<BR>Rank reduces the periodic check to break percentage on Charm effects specifically. One benefit of rank for all spells is a reduction in resist chance.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV><BR><BR><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> EJdev wrote:<BR>A few clarifications to the current responses, and please keep in mind that I cannot respond to every reply as my main responsibility is actually making the changes.<BR><BR>Charm Duration: My original statement is too literal. Ten minutes is around the ideal point for charm duration in our opinion. It will likely range from 8 to 15 minutes depending on the level upgrades.<BR><BR>Charm Breaks: Each interval, the charm spell is re-applied to the target. This means that the target gets an additional resist check per interval. If they resist the re-applied charm, it breaks. Rank of the charm will directly impact the resist chance of both the initial application and the periodic check; making Charm spell rank extremely important. The current target interval is between 45s and 60s, meaning every 45 to 60 seconds it will try to resist the charm.<BR><BR>Charming Single-ups and Double-ups: They won't be exactly reduced to no-up arrows, just closer to no-up arrows. They will retain their Health and Power, as well as a portion of thier higher DPS. This is to account for the higher risk involved when such an opponent resists/breaks charms.<BR> <P> </P> <P><FONT color=#339900>I Have to add this post is early and atm doesn't hold that much truth, mostly towards the single/dubble ups, I only wanted a full quote, so you can see the difference with the reality posts<BR></FONT></P> <HR> <P> </P> <P><FONT color=#33cc00>I just quoted the most relevant post only, not sure in how far this answers your post, also note that these post are from the whole beta, and not from yester/today, some info might be less acurate.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#33cc00>As I see it charm HAS to have a risk, and the reason of downtearing is purely so you can use charm in sol E or any other dungeon, without to must to find a plain mob.</FONT></P> <P> </P> <P><BR> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Moorgard wrote:<BR> <P>As of today's update on Beta, a charmed mob will essentially have the same resources as a summoned pet. That is, it will use its abilities at the tier of the spell used to charm it, and it will have the health and power pools of a regular no-arrow solo NPC.</P> <P>So even if an enchanter does charm a named mob, it won't provide any additional benefit over charming a standard NPC.</P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR><FONT color=#339900>This is from an other post, however, some mobs can be no charm, but I read this post still as any mob becomes a plain mob reagardless of it's arrows</FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#339900></FONT> </P> <P><FONT color=#339900>this is a quote of blackgaurd from the update info "- Charmed pets now cast their spells and do damage based on the quality level of the spell used to charm them"</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#339900></FONT> </P> <P><FONT color=#339900>So the higher quality of the charm improoves the dps, and makes it possible that you control the mob longer</FONT></P> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#339900>Hope you enjoy with this information.</FONT><BR></DIV>

[PigLick]

Thanks for the nice sum-up of dev posts relating to charm Mage-Apprentice. I'm of the opinion that charm is fairly close to being right at this point. If I could find a higher rank of the spell it would be a lot easier to judge as well, because I only have AppI. Fewer breaks and more dps, which is apparently what spell upgrades will bring us, would be very nice, but without knowing how much the average duration increases and how much dps goes up, it's hard to evaluate. I also wonder about the statement that ^ and ^^ don't actually become no-arrows. I wish there were an easier way to test this, doing some parsing would help but that's not really my thing. If they are better, it's not noticeable, that I can say. The one thing that does need to be fixed is the power and health mobs lose when they're charmed. It's annoying to charm a mob and have it suddenly lose 20-25% of it's health and power. PigLick <div></div>

[Abado]

I did more testing today. I charmed a yellow con double up arrow elephant in commons (I'm level 14). I sent it into an encounter of a single down arrow blue elephant and a single down arrow blue elephant calf. The charmed pet basically took out both of them without my help. This did seem to be stronger than a typical yellow con charmed mob. The pet was near dead at the end so I killed it. I would really like them to give us a way of testing higher tier versions of spells and arts, it's the test server but we can't test things we can't get. All we have to base our charming on is apprentice 1 (which so far doesn't usually last beyond a couple of minutes for me). Higher tier versions may be much better as they are, but we have no idea since we can't actually get them. If they at least gave charm as an option in the training options then we could see what a master 2 is like and thereby get an idea of what the adept range of spells would be like. Also I too would like them to get rid of the 25% drop in health and power when you charm, infact all this really does is make it easier to 'reverse coerce' when I'm sure that isn't the intended use for charm. <div></div>

[Mage-Apprentice]

<P>New beta update/nerf</P> <P> </P> <P><STRONG>Charmed Pets<BR></STRONG>- If you charm an NPC with 1 or more down arrows, it will retain the health and power pools it inherently possesses.<BR>- If you charm an NPC with 1, 2, or 3 up arrows, it will have the health and power pools of a standard no-arrow NPC.<BR>- When a charmed pet is released, its health and power pools will return to their non-charmed values, taking into account any damage or healing sustained while charmed.<BR>- Charm will no longer break if you ask your pet to do something it isn't allowed to do.</P> <P> </P> <P>Still have to (beta)test, but it seems crystal clear to me.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Bloodtoo]

Basically, you do not gain benifit in charming ^ mobs but you are saddled with the increased risk when they break and revert to their more powerful state.  Same increased risk, little to no benifit. <div></div>

[Bravnik]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Usermaatre wrote:<BR> <DIV>Are there <STRONG>ANY</STRONG> response from devs/designers on any of the beta boards about charm? Other than the posts stating changes have been made. Any reason as to why, etc etc?</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I got a reply to a PM from EJDev stating that Early Break is here to stay and may be tweaked.....the very next Update they INCREASE the chance to break. They are tools which rymes with fools.</P> <P>Other than that....no we did not get any further response from the Devs. I even sent a tell to Moorgard asking for intervention and he didn't respond nor did anything change. </P> <P>Basically they have their vision and don't really care what the customers want. They don't play the class so they have NO IDEA of the reprocussions for such a stupid idea. </P> <P>I can't wait till later today and we see what happens once all the Coercer on all the servers get to test Charm first hand.</P>

[Azmode]

Rather have the spell removed from game than sitting unused in my spellbook like version 1 charm has been since release.   Its such a shame that things ended the way they did, but remember you do have a say.. just dont buy the expansion.