A heroic mob that is immune to the effect of mez and stun

[Dufre]

<div></div><div>I don't want to give too much away on this encounter but he is now immune to the effect of stun and mez.</div><div>I read that they made the zone harder which is fine but I wish they said that they made Korgo immune to</div><div>mez and stun effects before clearing the zone.  </div><div> </div><div>The change was probably needed as the zone was too easy the first time.  Now the zone is very hard</div><div>but i still feel kind of sleighted that I can't stun stifle or mez on this mob.</div><div> </div><div>(1140865046)[Sat Feb 25 05:57:26 2006] Korgo the Vault Keeper is mesmerized!(1140865046)[Sat Feb 25 05:57:26 2006] The vegetative tangle around Korgo the Vault Keeper disintegrates.(1140865046)[Sat Feb 25 05:57:26 2006] Kunobio draws upon nature's healing powers.(1140865047)[Sat Feb 25 05:57:27 2006] Kunobio's Wild Growth heals Reix for 390 hit points.(1140865047)[Sat Feb 25 05:57:27 2006] Korgo the Vault Keeper hits Reix for 2170 points of slashing damage.</div><div><img src="http://av.dvrdns.org/uploads/korgo.jpg"><a target="_blank" href="http://av.dvrdns.org/uploads/korgo.jpg"></a></div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div> </div><div>This is what is in my log. </div><div> </div><div>I'm not too mad about them doing it just best if they told us ahead of time before clearing the zone for 6 hours.</div><div> </div><div> </div><div>(1140865249)[Sat Feb 25 06:00:49 2006] YOUR Sap Will confounds Korgo the Vault Keeper draining 0 points of power.(1140865249)[Sat Feb 25 06:00:49 2006] Korgo the Vault Keeper collapses with weakness!(1140865249)[Sat Feb 25 06:00:49 2006] Korgo the Vault Keeper hits Reix for 5061 points of slashing damage.</div><p>Message Edited by Dufrest on <span class="date_text">02-25-2006</span><span class="time_text">03:48 AM</span></p>

[Xalibur]

<div>soon heroics will be immune too against our control spells</div><div> </div>

[Manyak]

<div>so the one thing i suggested is very possible, no way to deny it</div><div> </div><div>to make certain raid mobs immune to certain things, and stick it into the strategy</div><div> </div><div>so now that they do it to heroics, we are [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] in raids and *becoming* [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] in groups? thats really the end of it for me, dunno if i can take any more BS from them</div>

[Parsleybi]

<div></div><p>I agree that this is an extremely worrying trend. There are so many other ways of making an encounter harder, but making more and more mobs immune to our class defining abilities is very disturbing.</p><p>If they feel that are making players think harder about strategies then they are wrong. All people will do is pack the groups with MORE HEALERS-THAT'S IT, no subtle tactics at all.</p><p>Would they make raid mobs/heroic immune to taunt?</p><p>Would they put anti-healing fields in zones?</p><p>After feeling a little disappointed about the lack of CC in the raid environment, I was looking forward to the big group encounters in the new instances offered by the expansion. What a shame =(.</p><p> </p><p>Aora</p><p> </p>

[Chrysostom]

I hope this is just a bug.  On epics you get a message that the creature is too powerful.  Here it seems that the spell lands, just has no effect. However, if it does become the trend that enchanters cannot act as enchanters even in heroic content, that will be very bad.  I enjoy the heroic instances much more that epic fights because I can acutally be an enchater in them.  If they take the heroic battles from me as well then there will be nothing left for me in this game.

[Pins]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Chrysostom wrote:I hope this is just a bug.  On epics you get a message that the creature is too powerful.  Here it seems that the spell lands, just has no effect. However, if it does become the trend that enchanters cannot act as enchanters even in heroic content, that will be very bad.  I enjoy the heroic instances much more that epic fights because I can acutally be an enchater in them.  If they take the heroic battles from me as well then there will be nothing left for me in this game.<hr></blockquote>Is the mob a templar?  Or a bruiser?  Watch out for those types of named, I bet they have their immunity spells included in their tables now.

[Xanoth]

<div></div><p>considering they messed with the con system so its now impossible to tell what epic con something REALLY is other than by dropping or adding groups to a raid...</p><p> </p><p>it could well be a weak x2 mob, rahter than a strong heroic.</p><p> </p><p>gnoll captains in the raid part of silent city are "heroic" in the old x2 area, they can't be mezed either.</p><p>thats my guess anyway.</p>

[Dufre]

<div></div><p>The mob is a Paladin.  We killed him on Wednesday.  My thought is that the person who designed the zone</p><p>did not want it to be beaten that easy.  I know a couple other people beat the mob on Thursday so on Friday</p><p>they beefed up the whole zone.  They could label him as epic x2 if they want and make him too powerful for</p><p>this spell.  Instead the spell lands but does nothing.</p><p> </p><p> </p>

[Belizarius]

<div>/sigh</div><div> </div><div>adding  immunities to named heroics.</div><div>What next?</div><div> </div><div>I guess it's time to roll a wizard.  SOE doesn't seem to want chanters in the game.</div>

[MyChatBot]

Agreed.Designers, you have done NOTHING except make it more difficult, or more useless, to be an illusionist.NOTHING. Name ONE thing. And in fact you make the changes without even bothering to let the class players know.What justification for any of this? Designers have been completely silent on the subject. They simply keep fiddling with the class and refusing to explain any reason or rationale.<div></div>

[Manyak]

<div>found more mobs immune to mezz...the little drakota that u get to when u go down the stairs in the halls of fate</div>

[Ebarel]

<div>it would nicely fit into the scheme that troubs or other classes mezzes work ....</div>

[Manyak]

<div>Who cares if the other classes mezzes work? No other class is based on CC the way we are (well, us and coercers). gives us the same problem in groups as we have at raids.</div><div> </div><div>plus, if half the mobs in the zone are immune to stuns (and possibly stifles as well), why the hell would any1 wanna take a chanter there? its almost the same thing they did with SWG, where certain players werent able to get to certain content.</div><div> </div><div>nxt thing u know some1s gonna find a solo mob thats immune to stuns, and then we gnna have a blast.</div>

[Einy]

<div></div><div></div><div>There are tons of mobs like this in Halls of Fate group version. All the nameds and even alot of trash mobs deep in like all the huge Droag centurions and dracotas. I can understand why some lvl70-72 nameds might be immune to mez and stun but every single mob of at least 2 different types???</div><div> </div><div>The real bug is that mez and stun icon actually lands and they just keep moving. It should really say immune and not land so you don't think it might be mezzed. I can understand why "Sap Will" and "Drain Thought" icons would land since they also have the powerdrain component but Dazzling Array and mezzes have only that effect and should not show up at all if its not working.</div><p>Message Edited by Einyen on <span class="date_text">02-28-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:38 AM</span></p><p>Message Edited by Einyen on <span class="date_text">02-28-2006</span><span class="time_text">11:39 AM</span></p>

[Manyak]

<div>even sap will and drain thought shouldnt give an icon, since the power drain is instantaneous.</div>

[Pins]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>DaMutation wrote:<div>even sap will and drain thought shouldnt give an icon, since the power drain is instantaneous.</div><hr></blockquote>They actually "stick" and give the icon.  Try it vs. a bruiser or a templar with their immunity spell up, you'll see that they land, stick but they can still move/cast/etc.

[merkla]

<div>posted by mistake:/</div><p>Message Edited by merklarx on <span class="date_text">02-28-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:34 PM</span></p><p>Message Edited by merklarx on <span class="date_text">02-28-2006</span><span class="time_text">06:35 PM</span></p>

[Belizarius]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>DaMutation wrote:<div>Who cares if the other classes mezzes work? No other class is based on CC the way we are (well, us and coercers). gives us the same problem in groups as we have at raids.</div><div> </div><div>plus, if half the mobs in the zone are immune to stuns (and possibly stifles as well), why the hell would any1 wanna take a chanter there? its almost the same thing they did with SWG, where certain players werent able to get to certain content.</div><div> </div><div>nxt thing u know some1s gonna find a solo mob thats immune to stuns, and then we gnna have a blast.</div><hr></blockquote><p>LOL</p><p>The 'scheme' he's referrring to I'm sure, is the elimination of chanters from the game...</p><p>have we all rolled our bards yet?</p>

[SkarlSpeedbu]

<div></div><div>Jeez, what a weak way to make the encounter tougher.  BTW, devs, Cazel is mezzable, so you may want to make him immune, that way there will be one less zone illusionists can feel useful in.</div><div> </div><div>Brilliant.</div>

[Manyak]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Pinski wrote:<div></div><blockquote><hr>DaMutation wrote:<div>even sap will and drain thought shouldnt give an icon, since the power drain is instantaneous.</div><hr></blockquote>They actually "stick" and give the icon.  Try it vs. a bruiser or a templar with their immunity spell up, you'll see that they land, stick but they can still move/cast/etc.<hr></blockquote><p>actually, i meant that vs epics <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>yeh on immune mobs and players the spell sticks with no effect</p>

[Slu]

I ran in to the mobs in Halls of Fate who were immune to mez/stun last night. It was pretty heartbreaking to see the big plus I bring to a group completely locked out of being useful. My only hope is that MAYBE it's not a hard locked thing and through levels and +subjugation gear I can potentially being to surpass those immunities.I'm not holding my breath though.

[Belizarius]

<div></div><div></div><p>This is fine.  Really it is.  I just hope it's been done in a balanced way.</p><p>Show me the mobs that are immune to taunt (and de-taunt), for example.  That would be fair, wouldn't it?</p><p>Message Edited by Belizarius on <span class="date_text">03-01-2006</span><span class="time_text">07:03 PM</span></p>

[Dufre]

The HoF mobs make this even worse.  It seems like all mobs above lvl 70 are immune.  They now have an immune message when you cast these spells that shows above the mobs head with the damage numbers.  Not only named mobs but trash mobs are immune now also.  Some of my greatest joy as an illusionist was group encounters because we could use all our tools.This trend is very worrisome to me.  At first I thought just a few select name mobs to make them more difficult.  Having zone trash in a group instance be immune to marque abilities does not feel fair.At some point maybe enchanters can get feedback on where the direction is headed.  As a stop gap I would request that we get a slow type spell for dps.  Something around 25-30% at master level.  There are plenty of classes with better dps that have a far better dps slow.  This is not exactly what I wanted as an illusionist but dps slow seems to fit inline with the game.  We are supposed to be utility and give up DPS for utility.<div></div>

[1ARACE]

<div></div><div>Well glad to see i'm not the only one having problems with mez/stun/stifle.  I seen a discussion in the zones and population that some people were saying same thing about HoF.  But, i've been finding mobs that ignore mez/stun/stifle in about every zone in KoS.  And I can see if mobs are epic or heroic named, or bruiser/cleric type mob, but blue/green con zerker/guardian types shrugging it off I don't get. </div><div> </div><div>Same deal here too, shows mez/stun/stifle landing in log and in maintained spells, but yet it still attacks.  Really hope this is a bug, I really don't like playing the guessing game on whether or not mez/stun/stifle is actually taking effect.  At a minimum,  if mob is immune or resists, don't put the icon in maintained spells window making you believe the mob is locked down.  Me personally, when I see the spell come up in maintained spells, I move to next target to mez/stun/stifle it, believing that mob is under control.  If this is the new trend, gonna take a lot longer to mez/stun/stifle if you have to double check each mob you cast on to be sure its working before moving on to next target.  In any regards, I hope dev's give some sort of answer to this. </div>

[Mobindi]

<div></div><p>Yes it IS a bit discouraging when you go into a zone, oh look, named, oh, lets try to make it a bit easier on us and mezz it......Bang, group dead.</p><p>Concidering I have been going into HoF with a group of 64-65s, mezz is a necessity for us to progress and explore the area.</p><p>Pity that we got [Removed for Content] by a lvl 69 mob who was immune to mezz.</p><p>Den of the Devourer, with its 69 mobs, on the other hand is doable and is LOADS of fun.</p><p>So all the devs got to do is try a balancing act between fun and "oh, lets make it bloody [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] for everyone to do"</p>

[Dravendar]

I think what most players are failing to realize is that certain bruiser/templar type mobs have a buff that allows them to be immune to mez/stun/root.  Just like player characters, the buff is not permanent and only lasts for 30s or so.  When facing these types of mobs, you have to survive until the buff wears off at which point you can mez/stun/root.  Try it.  Mirroring most others' thoughts here, I do feel useless when facing mobs of this type, BUT, haven't you felt the same way when dueling against a bruiser?  You mez/stun them and they keep coming after you like a trainwreck.  Your only hope at that point is to survive until the buff wears off. Do I like trash mobs having this ability?  Heck no.  It should only be reserved for a very few named, if not 1 or 2.  I do applaud the devs for implementing another layer of difficulty that makes this game challenging.  The hard part though is finding the balance to not anger the enchanter community. <div></div>

[Dufre]

The issue you present with mob types might be true but it's not consistant with what I see when playing.  If it is specific buffs the mobs have on then let us dispell it.Granted if a templar mob cast sanctuary on a pull it should be resistant to these effects and I would expect to see an icon reflecting this.  When you fight warden mobs you get hat sandstone or something that hits the whole group everytime someone attacks the mob.The mobs resistant to "our" control spells are not resistant to other similar type spells.  I am not interested in nerfing another class.  I think I know a little something about the Illusionist class.  The mobs were not resistant to any of these effects until the changes they put in on friday feb 24. Someone mentioned earlier on the Den that is a fun zone and there is no resistance to stun, stifle, or mez in this zone.  The nest of the great egg is another zone that we can use our tools to make it easier.These changes went in after the expansion came live and they didn't bother to mention that mobs will now be immune to our effects.  If it was just bruiser type or sanctuary type you would expect all levels of these mob types to have this immunity.  I would just like the enchanter community to really unite behind stopping the removal of our control abilities.  We have one ability left that is a short term mez. There are several other issues but this is prime in how I feel our class should work.  What I bring to a group was an ability to do amazing things with my tools.  If I was asked before this was the illusionist class overpowered I would surely say yes in group content.  Now we are underpowered in group content.  I do hope that with this change they are going to give us something for raiding.I just have this sinking feeling that all the talk about how the effects we have trivialize epics flowed over and they think we trivialize group content.  This is conspiracy theory because I feel that we are not getting enough communication from the staff.  Silence by human nature tends to make people think negative ideas.  Please have someone describe where they see the enchanter class falling into the game.  Did the illusionist in beta have any feedback from devs on the spell Phase.  I was wondering if there is any use to this spell.  I use it and it tends to just annoy people.<div></div>

[zit]

<div></div><p>Use for Phase?</p><p>I guess thats exactly the point.</p><p>They give us unmezable mobs with they intend to make phase useful.... :smileymad:</p>

[Manyak]

<div></div><p>update: certain mobs in HoF are 100% immune to stuns and stifles, but 0% immune to roots.</p><p> </p><p>so its not because its a 'templar or bruiser or sk mob', its cuz the immunities were built straight into them....hard coded. if it was one of these types of mobs, then it woulda been immune to roots too.</p>

[SunT]

<blockquote><hr>Slunk wrote:I ran in to the mobs in Halls of Fate who were immune to mez/stun last night. It was pretty heartbreaking to see the big plus I bring to a group completely locked out of being useful. My only hope is that MAYBE it's not a hard locked thing and through levels and +subjugation gear I can potentially being to surpass those immunities.I'm not holding my breath though.<hr></blockquote><p>Worst [art about these named is the stuns and stifles stick but have no effect.</p><p>If it just gave me a message I would quit casting but when I cast five times thinking I am being resisted only to find I am not and the guy is broken it pisses me off.</p><p>We have no ability on raids and super abilities on Heroics.  i guess the answer to balancing this is to remove our abilities on Heroics raither than fix us on raids.</p><p>It is bull[expletive haxx0red by Raijinn].</p><p>I bugged them and certainly hope it is a bug and not the way of the future or they may as well scrap the [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]ing class.</p>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>DaMutation wrote:<div></div><p>update: certain mobs in HoF are 100% immune to stuns and stifles, but 0% immune to roots.</p><p> </p><p>so its not because its a 'templar or bruiser or sk mob', its cuz the immunities were built straight into them....hard coded. if it was one of these types of mobs, then it woulda been immune to roots too.</p><hr></blockquote>Hrm, never saw the immune to stifle mobs, just the immune to stun mobs. Either way, annoying as hell, and it has nothing to do with the templar/bruiser/etc. immunity spells. This is just plain bullcrap.

[Morticus]

This isn't new actually, Korgo has been immune to stuns for quite sometime.

[Manyak]

hmm.....thx for a reply (im sure all illus are thankful when a dev pops in on this board).....but the last post on this thead was made on 3/6/2006, almost a year ago.......

[Pins]

<cite>Morticus wrote:</cite><blockquote>This isn't new actually, Korgo has been immune to stuns for quite sometime. </blockquote> Developer Morticus casts Revive on a thread dead from 11 months ago! And when the post was made, immune mobs were completely new to everybody.

[Morticus]

hehe, looks like I'm still getting used to the new forums.

[Zephanor]

Welcome to the club! LOL! I've done this before on new forums so I can't say much, heheh.

[Controlor]

Mez immune mobs = bad idea at heroic yes. But i guess we have to live with it to some degree. The mobs that REALLLLLLLLY get me are the ones who are PARTIALLY immune to mez. See first named mob in acad. He is immune to the stifle portion of mez. He stays put and doesnt melee but if yah get to close he will aoe you. A few epic mobs are like this as well. The most notable ones are the ones with the Overlord in HoS. all 4 of those punks are partially immune to mez and do their CA. Which isnt fun when trying to CC them.

[kelly]

<span style="color: #cc00ff">are the 4 adds in hos you are talking about the adds that seem to taunt even when they were mezzed. i was wondering why they were able to taunt and stuff while mezz i guess mezz wont stop there ca? if anybody knows plz tell me pixie</span>