Well I have clamed down a bit

[Inquisiter]

<DIV>Whilst I did post the - "Dont accept our new role" post,  I am not obstinate in my opposition. I have read some more positive things about the changes and an Illusionist acquiantance on my server said, and I quote, "we rock" after going off to DoF beta ( he didnt break the NDA just told me stuff that was also on test).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So having calmed down, I am switching to a wait and see approach. I know for a fact I am not going to miss cracking 24 people continously on raids. And fundamentally I do support the combat revamp, it was badly needed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Inq</DIV> <DIV>50th Illusionist of Najena</DIV>

[Lante]

<P><FONT color=#6633cc>Honestly, I think the botton line is it depends on how well you play the character in the end. I`ve been reading posts from various classes/subclasses and they ALL talk about how their class is terrible, and then their are still those that say that its the greatest thing since sliced bread.  </FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#6633cc>Of course, its hard to say what will happen post-revamp, but I guess we can only hope that it will be for the better.  I mean, in the case of Illusionist, what else can they possibly take away from a class that seems to rely on groups?  </FONT></P>

[PigLick]

I think I tend to agree Lant. Not to say that there aren't some major issues still to be worked out for some classes, but I'm starting to get the feeling that there are two major categories of complainers. The inexperienced reactionaries- ie people who haven't even tried the changes, and are only comparing the "on paper" stats between current and revamp abilities. That's a natural reaction, but not a very useful one, these changes are too extensive to analyze in that way. The other group are the people who have tested the changes, but don't like them because the game actually gained some modicum of balance and difficulty. These are the people who have foind the "best" strategy for their class and repeat it over and over, not wanting true challenge or to enjoy the game for it's own sake, but just want to win. Now, those "best" strategies may not work as well, and perhaps their class was brought down a notch or two to be in line with everyone else, and now they're no longer having fun because they can't get the easy win they're used to. I know this is a vast generalization and probably unfair, but the more I read the more accurate it seems. As I said, there are definitely still some issues for some classes, and I hope they get addressed. I also think that thorough testing with polite, intelligent, concise, constructive posts and feedback to the devs is the best way to bring about those wanted/needed changes, but threats of quitting or calling the devs idiots and proclaiming this as the end of the game like so many are so quick to do is not only useless, but actually hurts the cause by burying important issues in seas of useless complaining. PigLick <div></div>

[RaoulDu]

<DIV>There have been many changes since the initial combat patch on test. I spoke about high resists to mez and root after the first patch came out. This is no longer a issue. Even though the recast and duration on mez's have been modified unfavorably, I hardly ever get a resist. I again can keep 3 to 4 mobs mezd. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Our Damage is so much better now. If you use all the nuked/dots/pets/ available to you, it adds up to a good deal of damage. It is not the same as the other mage classes, but it is very aceptable. I have even been drawing agro because of my damage. Learning to control that better now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>They reduced the recast timer for invis so it only takes around 30 seconds (dont rememer exact time off hand) to recast after it drops or is canceled. Much better then after the initial patch when it took forever to recast, especially if someone cast and broke invis right after you applied it.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Soloing, well i expressed how much i loved it in my first post. And I still do. Soloing is great. If I cant find a group, I have no issues with soloing for exp. Our doppleganger and construct along with nukes and dots enable us to solo very well. Using the right strat, you can even take out named heroics. It takes a LONG time, but it can be done. I got firetoad down to 1/4 health once, and I am sure I can kill him solo. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I still think we could use more group abilities. We can add decent damage and mezing is good from time to time. but more stuns and maybe another agro reducer would be great. All the concentration slot needs for my buffs are also a drag, but its something I can live with.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Overall, my impression since my last post as greatly improved. I am enjoying playing my Illusionist since the first patch and there are still some more tweaks and adjusts to go.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Again  these are just my impressions, not combat or spell stats.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>first post <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=1419" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=1419</A></DIV>

[MilkToa]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> PigLickJF wrote:<BR>I think I tend to agree Lant. Not to say that there aren't some major issues still to be worked out for some classes, but I'm starting to get the feeling that there are two major categories of complainers. The inexperienced reactionaries- ie people who haven't even tried the changes, and are only comparing the "on paper" stats between current and revamp abilities. That's a natural reaction, but not a very useful one, these changes are too extensive to analyze in that way.<BR><BR>The other group are the people who have tested the changes, but don't like them because the game actually gained some modicum of balance and difficulty. These are the people who have foind the "best" strategy for their class and repeat it over and over, not wanting true challenge or to enjoy the game for it's own sake, but just want to win. Now, those "best" strategies may not work as well, and perhaps their class was brought down a notch or two to be in line with everyone else, and now they're no longer having fun because they can't get the easy win they're used to.<BR><BR>I know this is a vast generalization and probably unfair, but the more I read the more accurate it seems. As I said, there are definitely still some issues for some classes, and I hope they get addressed. I also think that thorough testing with polite, intelligent, concise, constructive posts and feedback to the devs is the best way to bring about those wanted/needed changes, but threats of quitting or calling the devs idiots and proclaiming this as the end of the game like so many are so quick to do is not only useless, but actually hurts the cause by burying important issues in seas of useless complaining.<BR><BR>PigLick<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Lol, so according to you there are no valid complaints and the complainers are either obstinate and/or ignorant. I would definitely call that a gross and unfair generalization.</P> <P> </P>

[PigLick]

No, I didn't say that at all. In fact, I specifically stated multiple times that there are real issues that need to be dealt with. I also didn't say every person who plays/posts must fall into one of those two categories, just that they are two major categories. And, even all that said, I still admitted it was probably somewhat unfair, yet also somewhat accurate. PigLick <div></div>

[Lante]

<FONT color=#6633ff></FONT> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff>The sad reality sometimes is that when I`m playing EQ, I`d rather play along side the newbies because they aren`t as negative as many of the vets.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff>As I said in my OP, there are many players who bash EQ for one reason or another, and then there are those that just want to have fun (hey, remember..."<EM>fun</EM> in games"?). </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff>As we <STRONG>ALL</STRONG> know...there are many issues with EQ2 that still need to be worked out, but bashing, whining, kicking, screaming, stabbing, and tearing the heart of the game right out of the chest of SOE isn`t going to make them fix these problems any quicker. The only thing SOE is seeing with posts like that are a bunch of spoiled brats who, if they don`t get their way, will hold their breath until they turn blue. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff>If ppl <EM>played</EM> the game as much as they complained about it...oh wait...I guess they do.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#6633ff></FONT> </DIV>