Warlock-specific changes in proposed "Combat System and Stat Cap Improvement"

[hoosierdaddy]

<DIV>Well, fizzles won't exist anymore, but enhancing ones casting skills will soon (theoretically) show measurable improvement in some area. As a result, the value of one of our two class-specific self-buffs, the Seal Line, will be directly effected by this change, as it buffs casting skills and reduces ones chance of fizzling. We are one of two mage classes without a self-Intelligence buff and with the cap being raised to 1k+, will this change in the effecitveness of casting skills compensate for the amount of damage our fellow mages enjoy as a result of them more easily approaching the Intelligence cap with these self-Int buffs?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The warlock community for the most part agreed at the release of DoF that there weren't any measurable differences in casting with the Seal lines up, and that we were nerfed in the process of changing this buff from a STR/INT group buff to a pure skill buff. Some dev went out and made a terrible assesment in a limited experiment and concluded that the spell was working as intended. At what point did developers realize that skill buffs were largely meaningless and that warlocks had been correct in their original realizations? Why was it allowed to remain a mostly meaningless buff for the last 6 months+?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now that fizzles are being removed altogether will the Seal line be improved in any way, since half of it determined resistabilty and, the other, ones chance to fizzle? In short, do others see this change to skill/stat caps positively or negatively effecting the warlock class (i.e. will this improve or worsen our damage output)? Will the changes in melee skill/haste cap make it impossible for warlocks to keep up with predators/rogues/wizards on single-target raid encounters?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-Kai</DIV><p>Message Edited by hoosierdaddy on <span class=date_text>09-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>10:01 AM</span>

[Korpo]

I rarely worry about not having an int buff, because on a raid my warlock is with a wizard, necro, whatever, and gets their 85 point buff just like everyone else. The only time we don't get to leech a buff like that is in a small group with no other mages or when soloing, and in both those cases I really don't give two licks what my DPS is.As it is now, mage int buffs don't stack with each other. I'd rather have a wizard and warlock in the same group than two wizards, since the Seal buff adds some benefit, whereas the second wizard buff doesn't. It might be a good idea for them to remove that restriction as they raise the cap though.Overall, I just think the change is going to change the way raid groups are set up. They're actually going to stack int buffers in the mage group because no longer will you be able to assume that all the mages are capped. Personally, I want to see what happens to fusion when a wizard wearing 600 points of int gear + fury (109 + 75) + illusionist (85 + 16<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> + sk (145). Wait, I know, the wizard will die.<div></div>

[Araxes]

<div></div><div><blockquote><hr>korpo53 wrote:IWait, I know, the wizard will die.<div></div><hr></blockquote>And that's the bottom line of what most of the soercerers are saying in those 2 threads.  It  just exacerbates the problem we already have.  Whether we live for 5 hits or 10 more doesn't much matter ... we still generate insance hate and we will still die.  We'll just generate hate that much faster now.</div><p>Message Edited by Vicontessa on <span class=date_text>09-29-2006</span> <span class=time_text>02:26 PM</span>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> korpo53 wrote:<BR>I rarely worry about not having an int buff, because on a raid my warlock is with a wizard, necro, whatever, and gets their 85 point buff just like everyone else. The only time we don't get to leech a buff like that is in a small group with no other mages or when soloing, and in both those cases I really don't give two licks what my DPS is.<BR><BR>As it is now, mage int buffs don't stack with each other. I'd rather have a wizard and warlock in the same group than two wizards, since the Seal buff adds some benefit, whereas the second wizard buff doesn't. It might be a good idea for them to remove that restriction as they raise the cap though.<BR><BR>Overall, I just think the change is going to change the way raid groups are set up. They're actually going to stack int buffers in the mage group because no longer will you be able to assume that all the mages are capped. Personally, I want to see what happens to fusion when a wizard wearing 600 points of int gear + fury (109 + 75) + illusionist (85 + 16<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> + sk (145). Wait, I know, the wizard will die.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Illusioniost group buff doesn't stack with the wizard one, temp ones do, and the fury's group buff and vim both stack on the wizards int buff.  your going to see about 750-800 as the new average for intelligence, and temp buffs will have an impact on dps again.</P> <P>I'd agree with the o.p.'s concearns as I have too thought about this change.  Warlocks may be just fine on a raid envoirnment, but what about the other 2/3's of the game.  you know the guys who only read these posts, or dont even vist the forums at all, who are in treasured gear to mastercrafted?  what happens to them with no Int buff?</P> <P>25-30 more skill points would work out to about 4% less resists on the new scale from the warlock seal line.  4% isn't even noticable to the non parser casual guy, and even then debuffing a mob has a much larger impact on resistability than skill bonuses.</P> <P>they litterally need to double this buff to equal out to the increased int/str wizards get.</P>

[Korpo]

<div><blockquote><hr>IllusiveThoughts wrote: <p>Illusioniost group buff doesn't stack with the wizard one, temp ones do, and the fury's group buff and vim both stack on the wizards int buff.  your going to see about 750-800 as the new average for intelligence, and temp buffs will have an impact on dps again.</p><hr></blockquote>I'm aware of that, that's why I outlined the group the way I did.600 gear (keep in mind we're getting a second earring slot and cloaks, plus new ubar gear to find)085 illusionist buff160 sentiment075 fury buff109 vim145 death march1174 total (when all the temp buffs are up)0869 all the timeIllusionist because wizards don't get a temporary 160 point int buff. Wizard because illusionists don't get 20k nukes.</div>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> korpo53 wrote:<BR> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR> <P>Illusioniost group buff doesn't stack with the wizard one, temp ones do, and the fury's group buff and vim both stack on the wizards int buff.  your going to see about 750-800 as the new average for intelligence, and temp buffs will have an impact on dps again.</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I'm aware of that, that's why I outlined the group the way I did.<BR><BR>600 gear (keep in mind we're getting a second earring slot and cloaks, plus new ubar gear to find)<BR>085 illusionist buff<BR>160 sentiment<BR>075 fury buff<BR>109 vim<BR>145 death march<BR><BR>1174 total (when all the temp buffs are up)<BR>0869 all the time<BR><BR>Illusionist because wizards don't get a temporary 160 point int buff. Wizard because illusionists don't get 20k nukes.<BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>sorry i mis-read your post, I thought since you were grouped already with a wizard you wouldn't count illusionist buff 2x, kinda mental lapsed that your not counting it 2x.

[Tevilspek]

So for the PvP Warlock, how are people seeing these changes?Survivability? Damage vs Resists etc?I'd be interested to know what people are thinking in regards to these changes for PvP Warlocks.<div></div>

[RSZ]

Wouldn't expect too much for PVP....just roll a scout and be done with it.

[Tevilspek]

Hehe I'm having an absolute blast (mixed in with one shot death frustration) at level 30 now. Don't plan on going above 34 anytime before EoF.. if at all it seems.Every high level Warlock I've spoken to has wished they'd locked at 34.Though some are sure to disagree, I'm not going to risk going higher anytime soon.Which leads to me asking if anyone has one idea of how these changes could affect us.But yeah, some actual proper thoughts on the EoF changes anyone?<div></div>