How are Wizards accepted in groups ?

[Araw]

<DIV>I come from DAOC where only certain classes are deemed acceptable to xp  with. My favorite,a wizard, was frequently NOT on the list deemed "worthy" to group with by some uninformed elitest.In general how are wizards viewed by people wanting to group ? How well do they solo ?</DIV>

[-Immolatu]

wizzies suck, roll a scout<div></div>

[Francois d'ass]

<P>Heya Arawon,</P> <P>Welcome to EQ2!!!  To answer the first question, if there is a DPS spot open, we are the logical choice.  Last night we were 3 wizzy in the same group... So I can say that acceptance is fairly good!!! <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />).  As for raid spot, well acceptance largely vary from one raid to another depending on the makeup of the raid/group...  Some other peeps can confirm that better then me since I do not raid often...</P> <P> </P> <P>Second question, we solo pretty well...  Altho there is a gap of soloability between 30 and 40.  After that you get your second root(ring of cold line) and at 50 Ice Comet, our signature spell up to lvl 70...  From there you can solo single target easily with the old Root(root again to be sure) nuke nuke rinse and repeat old trick... Been soloing white ^^^ heroic with ease.</P> <P>Have fun with your wizzy!!!</P> <P>Zeheenae</P> <P>Bald wizard of Oasis</P> <P>Founder of Cursed Crusaders</P>

[Psychochimpy]

People in DAOC have had it hard in pve forever since the game has become so top heavy in the 5 years it's been out. I'm surprised if you even got a group on your way up to 50 in this day and age :pWizards are thrown into the dps pile when people are picking groups, and since dps of any sort is required in the group makeups if xp is a goal, they get groups. The dynamic of group setup is much more general in EQ2 than DAOC. Unfortunately, that setup makes for a setting where xp is much harder to get, unlike Malm/Modern groups with 5 SM's, 2 healers, and a shaman, or Necros at orcs pling.So good luck getting used to the system, it took me awhile, but I believe you'll be happier with it than daoc in the long run ^_^<div></div>

[BSbon]

wizards are always welcome in my groups. 2 of my best friends play wizards and there's nothing like seeing the big nukes land.

[Didi]

I find wizards are generally quite welcome in groups.  We aren't always #1 DPS but we are certainly among the top and always welcome.  (Whether we are the top or not seems to vary a lot depending on the type of fight and the relative equipment and levels of the other group members.  From what I've observed we seem to do best in medium length fights, particularly with grouped monsters -- too short a fight and we only have time to get one or two spells off, and the melee damage types tend to outdo us.  Too long a fight and we may slow down at the end as power gets short.)  But yes, a well played wizard is generally welcomed in groups and don't forget we can also do other useful things like emergency evacs, stuns, and spot mezzes.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[-Immolatu]

But seriously... we suck, roll a scout!<div></div>

[Francois d'ass]

C'mon Imodium, we do not suck... But there might be a point to his ranting.... There is a lot of wizzy out there, maybe our friend imodium dont want anymore competition...

[BlackAdderDr]

I switched from a scout(Ranger) to my alt wizard a few months back.  I concur with previous posters that group acceptance is quite good when filling the DPS slots.  I caution you however we are very very common.  You will find that due to large wizard populations that cost of gear and master spells is quite high.  However, armed with decent spells you will be an excellent soloer capable of taking down named mobs to help earn the money you will need to build a solid wizard.  Secondly we have serious agro issues.  Some groups wont mind if you pull agro, and will keep you up while the last bits of a mobs health are burned down.  Others will be so rude as to let you die.  So learn early how to control agro and work with a group.  My friends are gracious enough to let me pull agro at will when I want to have fun.As far as raid acceptance,  it may be hard to get into a raid guild simply because there are so many of us out there.  If a guild needs a wizard they can really shop around.  I have found though that they recruit on character and not how many masters you have.  So make friends, play nice and the guilds will come......eventually  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />Welcome to EQ2,-Acelia 70th Wizard of Nektulos<div></div>

[ShreddedWhe]

<DIV>Way too common, for obvious reasons.  Too many times you go lfg and see in the chat channel another lvl 70 wiz looking.  Pickup groups are sometimes pretty bad though, so I rarely join them unless I know either the tank or the healer or just completely in guild.  I've been in groups with wizards before, and its kind of fun, but at this point on any character I never group with someone my same class in case a master drops. </DIV>

[BlackAdderDr]

<P>I think its part of the SOE contract that there must be at least 5 wizards LFG in the 60-69 channel at all times.  Its embarassing, I avoid going down this road at all costs.  Oddly enough none of these wizzies ever want to duo, and wizzy duo is som much fun if your named hunting or beating up heroics.  I dont think you realize how good pickup groups are in the 60-69 range until you start an alt and get pickup groups in the early tiers,  those can be pure comedy gold or torture depending on your mood <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <P>-Acelia</P>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> BlackAdderDrop wrote:<BR> <P>I think its part of the SOE contract that there must be at least 5 wizards LFG in the 60-69 channel at all times.  Its embarassing, I avoid going down this road at all costs.  Oddly enough none of these wizzies ever want to duo, and wizzy duo is som much fun if your named hunting or beating up heroics.  I dont think you realize how good pickup groups are in the 60-69 range until you start an alt and get pickup groups in the early tiers,  those can be pure comedy gold or torture depending on your mood <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <P>-Acelia</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Thats because most of the wizzies who are lfg cant or dont know how to solo named and heroics.  </P> <P>I'd like to one day put together an all Wizard death squad, and pwn everything.  </P>

[Lakland]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> BlackAdderDrop wrote:<BR> <P>I think its part of the SOE contract that there must be at least 5 wizards LFG in the 60-69 channel at all times.  Its embarassing, I avoid going down this road at all costs.  Oddly enough none of these wizzies ever want to duo, and wizzy duo is som much fun if your named hunting or beating up heroics.  I dont think you realize how good pickup groups are in the 60-69 range until you start an alt and get pickup groups in the early tiers,  those can be pure comedy gold or torture depending on your mood <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P> </P> <P>-Acelia</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Thats because most of the wizzies who are lfg cant or dont know how to solo named and heroics.  </P> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>I'd like to one day put together an all Wizard death squad, and pwn everything.  </FONT></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Now that would be fun for sure. The object is after all kill the mob before it kills you <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> You don't healing if the mob is dead and still 50 feet away from you....<BR>

[Cremaster1978]

<div></div><div></div><div></div>Pre DoF, wizards where an OK class... we didn't have top DPS (warlocks i believe were best back then) and we were one of the best, if not THE best, soloing class...Then after DoF we got much more DPS and we where pushed up the DPS rankings.... and we got new ancient teching spells that where different and those made playing a wizard really fun... Our roots where nerfed to beaing breakable but the duration was long so it was still pretty easy to solo heroics... (i don't want any comments about that we are not supposed to solo heroics)...  But still we lost our awesome soloing ability... we where overrun immensly by Illusionists and summoner classes. but we had still one thing that kept us going: DPS.Sidenote: still after all those classes just completely smashing us in soloing ability, people still ranted about us being overpowered... lol... it was not me, but my illusionist friend that soloed Keeper of Silence when she was lvl 60.Then came KOS... well all scouts got humongous DPS burst... so did summoners,  and we suddenly dropped to 5-6th in DPS rankings... And with the recent shortening of root times we are so nerfed that it is sickening... we can't solo a group of mobs anymore... because the recast time is shorter than the duration of our group root... (well up until the T7 one which gives us 2 seconds time to recast the spell, wow).I have always loved playing my wizard... i have put down hundreds of days on him... but now i feel that wizards are one of the least useful classes in the whole game... I  mean in a raid... what do we do? what is it that we can help with? we can buff INT and STR.. ppl needing either of those have already reached their cap already... we can buff heat and cold resist... again the amount we add to those resists is laughable.... we can feed power.... 211 (ad3) every 20th second.... WOW... amazing <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.....what's left? we don't do top DPS anymore... scouts do at least 5-600 more DPS... summoners overrun us without even breaking a sweat... What kept me going before was that at least before i was there to DPS and i could solo pretty well... but now scouts/summoners are so much better at both.... not to mention chanters....All I am saying is that wizards have lost the "oomph" factor... nothing fun...I mean look at necroes for instance... they can do top DPS, they can resurrect, they can heal, they can give mana regen hearts and they can charm undead... so if you want to go a mage... go summoner... I am really sorry that i have lost the "fun" in my wizard...  <div></div><p>Message Edited by Cremaster1978 on <span class=date_text>07-07-2006</span> <span class=time_text>09:53 AM</span>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cremaster1978 wrote:<BR> Pre DoF, wizards where an OK class... we didn't have top DPS (warlocks i believe were best back then) and we were one of the best, if not THE best, soloing class...<BR>Then after DoF we got much more DPS and we where pushed up the DPS rankings.... and we got new ancient teching spells that where different and those made playing a wizard really fun... Our roots where nerfed to beaing breakable but the duration was long so it was still pretty easy to solo heroics... (i don't want any comments about that we are not supposed to solo heroics)...  But still we lost our awesome soloing ability... we where overrun immensly by Illusionists and summoner classes. but we had still one thing that kept us going: DPS.<BR><BR>Sidenote: still after all those classes just completely smashing us in soloing ability, people still ranted about us being overpowered... lol... it was not me, but my illusionist friend that soloed Keeper of Silence when she was lvl 60.<BR><BR>Then came KOS... well all scouts got humongous DPS burst... so did summoners,  and we suddenly dropped to 5-6th in DPS rankings...<BR><BR>And with the recent shortening of root times we are so nerfed that it is sickening... we can't solo a group of mobs anymore... because the recast time is shorter than the duration of our group root... (well up until the T7 one which gives us 2 seconds time to recast the spell, wow).<BR><BR>I have always loved playing my wizard... i have put down hundreds of days on him... but now i feel that wizards are one of the least useful classes in the whole game...<BR><BR>I  mean in a raid... what do we do? what is it that we can help with? we can buff INT and STR.. ppl needing either of those have already reached their cap already... we can buff heat and cold resist... again the amount we add to those resists is laughable.... we can feed power.... 211 (ad3) every 20th second.... WOW... amazing <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.....what's left? we don't do top DPS anymore... scouts do at least 5-600 more DPS... summoners overrun us without even breaking a sweat...<BR><BR>What kept me going before was that at least before i was there to DPS and i could solo pretty well... but now scouts/summoners are so much better at both.... not to mention chanters....<BR><BR>All I am saying is that wizards have lost the "oomph" factor... nothing fun...<BR><BR>I mean look at necroes for instance... they can do top DPS, they can resurrect, they can heal, they can give mana regen hearts and they can charm undead...<BR><BR>so if you want to go a mage... go summoner...<BR><BR>I am really sorry that i have lost the "fun" in my wizard...<BR> <BR><BR> <P>Message Edited by Cremaster1978 on <SPAN class=date_text>07-07-2006</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>09:53 AM</SPAN><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I have to disagree with what you said 100% of it.</P> <P>post dof wizard dps takes a dive in group settings, the further away from ice comet you move the lower your dps becomes as mob hp and player spells/combat arts are further upgraded.</P> <P>we really dont start to get it back until lvl 65 and then peak at lvl 70 with ice nova and firestorm.</P> <P>As far as what we bring to a raid, I suggest you read through this thread;</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2</A></P> <P>as you'll see we can do insane amounts of dps when given the support to do so.  (so much that I'm afraid we'll get nerfed because we are approaching the dps threashold that got rangers nerfed pre kos)</P> <P> </P>

[Tanit]

<blockquote><hr>IllusiveThoughts wrote:<p>As far as what we bring to a raid, I suggest you read through this thread;</p> <p><a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2</a></p> <p>as you'll see we can do insane amounts of dps when given the support to do so.  (<font color="#ffff99">so much that I'm afraid we'll get nerfed because we are approaching the dps threashold that got rangers nerfed pre kos</font>)</p> <hr></blockquote>Doubt it since your numbers aren't higher than what for example necro's and assassins can do.<div></div>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Tanith_ wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote: <P>As far as what we bring to a raid, I suggest you read through this thread;</P> <P><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=23&message.id=24738&page=2</A></P> <P>as you'll see we can do insane amounts of dps when given the support to do so.  (<FONT color=#ffff99>so much that I'm afraid we'll get nerfed because we are approaching the dps threashold that got rangers nerfed pre kos</FONT>)</P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Doubt it since your numbers aren't higher than what for example necro's and assassins can do.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>last time I checked i was out dpsing the necro's and assasins rangers, warlocks, zerkers, monks, u name it, on those parses bud.

[Tanit]

<div></div>Yeah on your parses, but im comparing your dps to the dps from the necro's/assassins in my guild. They have no problem doing the same dps as you. <div></div>

[Ealan]

These kinds of conversations go the same way in every MMO and Ive been reading this stuff since I first started on UO almost 10 years ago.  People that actually play the game and have fun will have a 100% different experience from those who treat the game as an advanced mathematical modeling class and parse the last drop of fun out of the game.  The parse wars begin, the "dmg caster" spot is always at war with the "back stabber" spot and you get endless scientific analysis of data as if we were discussing the bacterial count of the LA metro water supply.Bottom line is, in my experience, wizards have no problem either grouping or soloing from 1-70.  Soloing as you get to the higher levels will become slow, inefficient and boring but, unlike EQ1, it is doable.  If you completely suck at the class, you will have trouble and come here whining (no one who sucks will ever realize or admit it, however).  If you are a parse madman, you will come here and endlessly engage in a cross server [Removed for Content] contest over who can sustain higher DPS and will ping pong between "wizards are broken" and "wizards r00l"I cant tell you how many times Ive seen a wizard groaning endlessly in the lvl chat channel how they can NEVER get a group and, meanwhile, the second my LFG flag goes up, Ill get a tell.  Why?  Because I try to be a fun group member, I dont AFK and autofollow for an hour and leach exp, and I actually play the class and use all of the classes abilities - DD, DoT, AoE, dmg shields, mana pump, etc.  For 99% of my life in EQ2 I wasnt even in a guild and yet I would consistently get into the exp groups of the hardcore raid players on my server.My only advice is learn how to play the class, keep your gear and spells up to par, be a cool/fun person to hang with, and you will be FINE.  When you've got nothing to do, try soloing and dont be afraid to die.  Times when I would play off hours I would grind on ^^^ heroics and it was risky and fun for maybe an hour at a time or so, but of course, if things goofed I would die.  Dieing isnt a really big deal in EQ2, so just experiment and find your solo skill level.  Not everyone will be able to handle the ^^^ heroics due either to luck, reflexes, gear, spell level or whatever.  There are plenty of standard solo mobs at most levels around anyhow. Grouping will always be more fun though.<div></div>