Like the CC's, but ***VERY*** concerned about wizards vs other classes.

[Darien al'Staff]

I like the combat changes, don't get me wrong. But the more I experience, and the more I read, I'm seeing that we are once again left behind in regards to DPS. Where's that BS about us being the "TOP" Dps class with warlocks?  Pah. If you guys have been following my posts, I've been a big advocate for the changes, so no flames about me whining please.  Fact is:  WE SHOULD BE THE TOP DPS CLASS, ALONG SIDE WARLOCKS.  SoE has said this.  And frankly, with our pitiful utility, very light armor, generally low avoidance, and no parry?  We need it.  I'm tired of being out dps'd by necros, assassins, rangers, the occasional beserker and monk...Rediculous. Let's get some numbers parsed, and move on SoE. My ideas?  I have alot of simple things that I think will help. Slightly lower the power cost on our spells. Unlink a few..not alot...just a few. PLEASE GOD close the varience gap by raising min damage. Perhaps increase the int-effect a bit?  I'm not noticing near that much of an increase of damage, and I have *alot* of int (240ish) for a level 41 wiz.  Increase the DOT damage on the Immolation line.  (Immolation, Breath of the Tyrant, etc) SLIGHTLY reduce some of the cast, and recast timers (IE:  Ball of Flames.  And by slightly, like 1-2 seconds) <div></div>

[Zyphius]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Darien al'Staff wrote:<BR>I like the combat changes, don't get me wrong.<BR><BR>But the more I experience, and the more I read, I'm seeing that we are once again left behind in regards to DPS.<BR><BR>Where's that BS about us being the "TOP" Dps class with warlocks?  Pah.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>If you guys have been following my posts, I've been a big advocate for the changes, so no flames about me whining please.  <BR><BR>Fact is:  WE SHOULD BE THE TOP DPS CLASS, ALONG SIDE WARLOCKS.  SoE has said this.  And frankly, with our pitiful utility, very light armor, generally low avoidance, and no parry?  We need it.  <BR><BR>I'm tired of being out dps'd by necros, assassins, rangers, the occasional beserker and monk...Rediculous.<BR><BR><BR>Let's get some numbers parsed, and move on SoE.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>My ideas?  I have alot of simple things that I think will help.<BR>Slightly lower the power cost on our spells.<BR>Unlink a few..not alot...just a few.<BR>PLEASE GOD close the varience gap by raising min damage. <BR>Perhaps increase the int-effect a bit?  I'm not noticing near that much of an increase of damage, and I have *alot* of int (240ish) for a level 41 wiz.  <BR>Increase the DOT damage on the Immolation line.  (Immolation, Breath of the Tyrant, etc)<BR>SLIGHTLY reduce some of the cast, and recast timers (IE:  Ball of Flames.  And by slightly, like 1-2 seconds)<BR><BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>^^ Agree, 100%!! ^^

[Darien al'Staff]

**PLEASE** if you agree with this go to the "Spells, etc" board and voice your ideas under the copy of this post there.  It is there that we will get SoE to notice this.  PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE. One Voice. <div></div>

[Zyphius]

Done.

[Darien al'Staff]

I saw, and thanks <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[Daga]

<P>I don't have the numbers, but are you seriously seeing doing less damage than the other classes?  In xp groups, and in the couple raid mobs I've been on, I've yet not to do massive amounts of damage.  I'm in the top 2 classes each time, with a combat parser, with warlcok being ahead of me, but not by much.  Nothing to get my panties in a bunch like it was pre-DoF.  Are you seriously seeing a downgrade?</P> <P>EDIT:  It should be known, it the groups I'm doing also, I'm not trying to maximize my DPS, I'm using Immolation, Piercing Icicles, heat Convulsions, etc so as not to draw agro, as well as protoflame (whcih I do not think is taken into account on the combat program).  So I'm not casting Ice Comet off the bat and trying to maximize damage, I'm trying to minimize agro.  And I have seen other classes outdamage me, yes, but those are usually resuling in group wipes, since taunts effectiveness are down.  In my "good" groups, where I try to manage agro, and not wipe, but do good damage, I'm number one or number two in damage output.</P> <P>Message Edited by Dagath on <SPAN class=date_text>09-16-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>08:46 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by Dagath on <span class=date_text>09-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:46 AM</span>

[Darien al'Staff]

Yes.  Very seriously, and I'm not the only one. <div></div>

[stepha72]

<P>I would agree with you Dagath in the groups I have been in I have been to top DPS and when I'm not it has been a warlock.  I've actually had people comment they cant believe how much damage Ice Comet does.  When I'm in a group with a warlock and we are hitting group encounters that is when I find myself behind the warlock in DPS.  Understand me correctly I am not complaining that a warlock is outdamaging me, I'm just stating that in group encounters warlocks are doing better DPS which is what SOE intended.  </P> <P>I also had not problem with aggro so I was going full out with my spells on orange Triple arrow ups.   I group with a pally and he put his spell Amends on me and I never got aggro the entire time we were grouped.</P> <P>The big question to all those feeling like they are not doing the top DPS.  What is your intelligence at?  What level are your spells?   This all makes a big difference now.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Daga]

<DIV>I also think some damage parsers aren't taking things into account.  Protoflame I think isn't taken into account.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'll have to check with my Paladin guildie and get him to come along and try that.  Everytime I cast na Ice Comet, even fro a split second, that mob turns to me if I am alsot casting all my highest nukes insted of pacing myself.  And yea, it was insane what the warlock would do to multiple mobs.  Overall I'm happy.  Tweak, maybe.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>At least we aren't a priest.  They IMHO are the broken ones.  Felt bad for one as he was soloing a down arrow and losing.  Ice Commeted the thing when he almost died.  Bad juju there.</DIV>

[Fingle]

<div></div>I know protoflame is not taken into account by combat stats, and that's not bad damage by itself.   Not sure if frost shield taken into account too, and thats 1500 dmg there each cast. I think the OP was level 41 so it may be a DPS problem at that level.  I haven't been able to compare to other DPS classes at my level yet, but I'm quite happy with my damage so far.  The only thing that worries me is power consumption, which is fine in groups but I'll be in trouble in a raid situiation I think. <div></div><p>Message Edited by Fingle on <span class=date_text>09-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:31 AM</span>

[brow27]

<div></div>Darien I think your getting a little borderline obsessive about the DPS issue here.  Pretty much every time you post its about us having to be the top DPS class.  Sony said we are in the top TIER of dps, they never said wizards will always be number 1.  Wiz, Warlock, Assassin, and Ranger are all in the top tier, and they said there will be times some have the advantage over others.  You are still only level 41, and thus shouldn't be complaining about our class being broken when you really haven't hit the high levels.  The damage really scales up a lot from 41 to 50.  The replacement spells for all the ones you are using now go up a LOT in damage.  Freaking out about other classes dps from reading posts isn't going to get us anywhere. edit: I'd also like to point out that the above poster is right about damage parsers not always picking up all of our damage. <div></div><p>Message Edited by brow27 on <span class=date_text>09-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:38 PM</span>

[Cobramaci]

<DIV>Incorrect, Wizards and Warlocks are in their own top tier thank you, then follow scouts, then conjurors/necros etc etc, he is voicing his concern because once people in the game realise what is happening they will inveriably get a class which has the same dps or more than us but much more utility and value to the group.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Conjurors seem to be top dog atm, followed by scouts, then wiz/warlock, as posted on another thread, in a recent raid, conjuror air pet was out dpsing everyone else in the raid, the pet alone.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bruisers are currently within my wizard's capabilities,  my son plays one and we group together, i beat him most times in burst dps, but he walks away with sustained dps over say 20 mob kills.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My sons bruiser has been within 10 dps of me for most fights, often coming as close as 2 dps short and sometimes beats me, i don't think that is how it should be to be honest.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I've been using combatstats for the above parsing as i've done for most my fights, its part of my fun as a wizard.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>PS: when you guys want to do accurate damage parsing, i suggest you ask the other classes to play their chars to the max as you will be doing, its pointless for one to run a parser and notice one's high dps compared to rest of group due to rest of group's relax approach.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by Cobramacius on <span class=date_text>09-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:33 PM</span>

[Darien al'Staff]

thank you cobra. And [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] STRAIGHT i'm obsessing.  That's what wizards and warlocks are..DPS machines and *nothing* else.  Unless you want to show me your utility, tanking, or healing wizard? Rangers and assassins wear MEDIUM ARMOR Rangers and assassins HAVE PARRY Rangers and assassins CAN SPIN HO'S Rangers and assassins DON'T GET THEIR TOP ARTS RESISTED/INTERRUMPTED HALF AS MUCH Rangers and assassins DON'T GET TWO HITTED ON A REGULAR BASIS All that, and I'm supposed to only have my dps **ON PAR** with them?  Give me a break. <div></div>

[Wu'Ta]

<P>Its very simple in DOF as a High level wizard.</P> <P>When parser is running - No doubt every fight here are the hard cold facts.</P> <P> </P> <P>If it is a 1 mob encounter </P> <P>WIZARD OWNS DPS (On single target mob I avg 350 to 400 dps)  Highest was a bit over 600!</P> <P>if it is a Multi mob encounter</P> <P>WARLOCK OWNS DPS  (my guldie did 29k damage in less than 60 seconds on a group of mobs in Pillar of Flames)  - he rocks</P> <P>- One thing I have seen is that 1 out of every 10 to fights an Assassin or a Ranger might rock it hard, but not fight in fight out consistent pulling of mobs. -</P> <P>Merlock     ~ 51 Wizard ~<BR>Proud Officer of     ** THE BROTHERHOOD **</P><p>Message Edited by Wu'Tang on <span class=date_text>09-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:33 PM</span>

[stepha72]

<P>Darien al'Staff Can I ask you what spells you are using?  Please list the spells you use.  Because seriously, in every group I have been in I have been the top DPS on single targets.   Also are you using Icebound gift and Frost shield?  These really help add to the DPS, but as someone else stated the DPS goes to whomever you put the spell on.   </P> <P>Another question what level are you and what level is your intelligence at?  This really makes a big difference now.  My intelligence was bugged the other day and I had to relog.  I could not believe the difference in my DPS with intelligence.  With the bug I could only get my int to 125 and Ice comet would only hit for about 2000+ after I relogged my int was up where it should be at 313 and I was dropping Ice Comet at 4000+.   Also make sure all your spells are Adept 3 or Master this makes a difference now too!!</P> <DIV>This is what I have been doing and I have had not problems with DPS.</DIV> <DIV>Just before Tank pulls - Cast Icebound gift and Frost shield - when the tank is hit it procs DPS</DIV> <DIV>Cast Piercing Icicles to debuff</DIV> <DIV>Cast Ice Comet</DIV> <DIV>Cast Paralzye - This is a DD spell now!!!</DIV> <DIV>Cast Ball of Flames (I have ball of Incineration and its awesome)</DIV> <DIV>Cast Flamestrike</DIV> <DIV>Cast Immolation</DIV> <DIV>Cast Ice Flame</DIV> <DIV>Rinse and repeat when timers are up.</DIV> <DIV>(This is on a triple arrow up orange because if it was just a regular mob forget everything else cast Piercing Icicles to debuff and Hit Ice comet and its dead.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I suggest you have a tank that can put a buff on you that can take some of your hate.  If not, your DPS wont matter anyway because you will be dead. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We have had a good improvement since revamp went live.  I'll admit I wish we had shorter recast timers on Paralzye, Ice Comet and Ball of Flames.  But, then what would everyone else in the group do? :smileyvery-happy: .  But Seriously, they cut the time way down for when a spell is resisted, you dont have to wait the whole 45 seconds if your Ice Comet is resisted.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Lets take this all into prospective.  Wizards are improved.  We have more DPS and if you say you dont you are playing it wrong.   I have read your other posts and you say your guild and others have told you your one of the best wizards.  While this may be true, all of us had to relearn how to play our characters.  The first day I went out and played without really learning what had changed with my character because I just wanted to play the new game, and I was happy with the DPS.  After I took the time the next day to sit down and read and learn what all the changes were to spells I was really very impressed with my DPS. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You keep asking others to post parses.   Please post them yourself so that we can see what your DPS is. </DIV>

[Crono1321]

OP: You must not be: A. level 50+ and B. have good scribed levels for your spells.  I say this because my good friend is a 51 wizard, we kill giants every night that are 56-60, he is ALWAYS on top when we are both actively trying.  Protoflame/ Netheros adept3 do an easy 20-40dps now by themselves and is a 2s cast you can keep up the entire battle (since the recast is now 25s instead of 2minutes).  On average I do around 300dps to single target, and he does around 350-500dps, these are numbers without protoflame/netheros.  We have parsed the pets both (at adept3) and they are doing around 1000-1500dmg per 30second battle, coming in a 25-40dps.  Wizard and Warlock are both growing into their new roles, by 60 I have no doubt that we will both be even more efficient at our said role.  In AE battles btw...Wizard is still doing approx 450-500dps.  Icy Wind is the [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] and I'm glad that I can group with a wizard and duo heroic groups with ease. 51 Warlock, <div></div>

[Darien al'Staff]

300-500 dps you say? Ok Go check the warlock and bruiser forums.  see the kind of numbers posted there.  500?  pah.  Many bruisers are putting on average (orange, tripple up) 600's.  Some even reported 1100, which is DEVISTATINGLY sick.  <div></div>

[Lady Uaelr]

<P>I have to also agree.</P> <P> </P> <P>I am ok with my character now and it's abilities but sad fact and here it is.</P> <P> </P> <P>I grouped with a necro level 50 we were hunting harpies lev 55 ^^^</P> <P>Parsed:</P> <P>Necro was doing 9k - 11k + 2k (pet)</P> <P>I was doing max 6k-10k and it would vary quite a bit.</P> <P>My power is 4046 with self buffs and a couple of fabled main pieces. My int was 339.</P> <P>This went on for 4 hours.</P> <P>So we are not at the top at the dps hierarchy. I have all adept 3 for all my main spells. I used everything that was a DOT, DD and did not use ROC to maximize my dmg output.</P> <P>Please let me know if you guys have exp this also.</P> <P>I don't care at this point - SOE has onec again not kept their word.</P> <P>I suggest everyone forget about this and kill this discussion it is pointless.</P> <P>I just plan to have fun with my friends - they do not care that my wizard is not the most effective dps they know I can contribute some extra damage and that is good enough for me.</P> <P> </P> <P>I wish you luck - if you guys can help our class I would more than welcome it.</P> <P> </P> <P>Take Care - Please Note: Necro's are great and should not be nerfed, Warlocks the same. I am just happy that these casters can add the damage to help end the fight and win that I am not able to provide.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[Jadr]

They have actually made wizards more one dimentional and less DPS then EQ1 wizards, I honestly cannot belive it. <div></div>

[SalBlu]

<P>Damage is fine, but if you cant manage it because you're stealing aggro away from a tank, then it doesnt matter at all.  I can sit in front of a mob for half the fight, then cast Ice Comet on him and steal aggro away from the tank.  That's after letting him build up enough hate from taunts and attacks to supposedly sustain his hate level, yet I unleash 5000 damage on the mob, and woops... aggro is on me and I have to Paralyze and Incinerate to hopefully live to tell the tale.</P> <P>You fail to realize that if you cant sustain yourself in a fight by NOT getting aggro, you're worthless.  No group is going to want you if you just chain cast spells like there is no tomorrow, making more work for everyone else in the long run.  </P> <P>I cant even cast to my full potential now... why would I want more damage?</P>

[Lady Uaelr]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SalBluee wrote:<BR> <P>Damage is fine, but if you cant manage it because you're stealing aggro away from a tank, then it doesnt matter at all.  I can sit in front of a mob for half the fight, then cast Ice Comet on him and steal aggro away from the tank.  That's after letting him build up enough hate from taunts and attacks to supposedly sustain his hate level, yet I unleash 5000 damage on the mob, and woops... aggro is on me and I have to Paralyze and Incinerate to hopefully live to tell the tale.</P> <P>You fail to realize that if you cant sustain yourself in a fight by NOT getting aggro, you're worthless.  No group is going to want you if you just chain cast spells like there is no tomorrow, making more work for everyone else in the long run.  </P> <P>I cant even cast to my full potential now... why would I want more damage?</P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>agree....</P> <P> </P> <P>My issue is not more damage - I would not be able to handle the aggro - we should have a fire based spell like ice comet though and a magic based one.</P> <P>The dps issue is that SOE stated wizards and warlocks would be at the top - instead we are not.</P> <P>If that is what SOE wants - then we should get our mana tranefers and canni spells back to how they were and we should have buffs that contain vs slashing, piercing, crushing and frostsheild, fiery granduer, icebound gift should all be 15 min duration.</P> <P>We should also have Mail of Frost increase in ward absorption and have the recast reduced - this has saved me quite a few times but could have saved me more.<BR></P> <P>If SOE does adjust things and make use top dps with warlocks (how it should be) then wizards robes should have similar armor class and mitigation as light armor.</P>

[stepha72]

Well said,  I once again agree with SalBluee!! :smileyhappy:

[Zcenicx]

<P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Every single group I've been in I've been the king of single target dps. I have spiked over 600 DPS, granted only twice, but still. Normally at 350-400, in burn sessions 450 or so. Depends on the tank. Paladins are better than guardians when doing a lot of damage too... the 25% hateshare rocks.</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>(If anyone don't know what that does, it's a fun little spell that makes the mob turn to the paladin when you IC it... well, at least some times :smileywink<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Multi-target, it's prolly a 80-20 between warlock and wizzy with the new damage our AEs do. Ours respawn faster than the warlock versions do and a fizzle on devastation (which do happen, ask any warlock) will cripple them. Relying on 3 relatively strong spells is better than relying on 1 very strong in my book.</FONT></P> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>I've only ever been passed by rangers or assassins when targetting high orange or red mobs since the resist rates get bad, but orange/red mobs arent effective for XP either. Yellows go down so much faster.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Adara Frostborn</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>L51 Wizard of Shadowhaven, Najena</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Co-Guild Leader, Guild Ambassador</FONT></DIV>

[Lady Uaelr]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Zcenicx wrote:<BR> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Every single group I've been in I've been the king of single target dps. I have spiked over 600 DPS, granted only twice, but still. Normally at 350-400, in burn sessions 450 or so. Depends on the tank. Paladins are better than guardians when doing a lot of damage too... the 25% hateshare rocks.</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>(If anyone don't know what that does, it's a fun little spell that makes the mob turn to the paladin when you IC it... well, at least some times :smileywink<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Multi-target, it's prolly a 80-20 between warlock and wizzy with the new damage our AEs do. Ours respawn faster than the warlock versions do and a fizzle on devastation (which do happen, ask any warlock) will cripple them. Relying on 3 relatively strong spells is better than relying on 1 very strong in my book.</FONT></P> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>I've only ever been passed by rangers or assassins when targetting high orange or red mobs since the resist rates get bad, but orange/red mobs arent effective for XP either. Yellows go down so much faster.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Adara Frostborn</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>L51 Wizard of Shadowhaven, Najena</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Co-Guild Leader, Guild Ambassador</FONT></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Can you please share what spells you are using and in what order. I would like to try it out and at least see myself doing 600dps for once.</P> <P>Thanks.<BR></P>

[Zcenicx]

<DIV>Did so in another post.</DIV>

[Stavenh]

You know whats fun? Tagging a mob, regardless of type, with ice comet on the pull in. With the 1.5 stun, I fire off truss right after. There have been times the mob dies from Ice Comet before it gets back, which always makes people laugh. Lets see, kill a mob in one hit, before anyone else gets a chance to hit the mob, wonderful. That means everyone elses DPS was, oh lets see, ZERO.

[Daga]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Stavenham wrote:<BR>You know whats fun? Tagging a mob, regardless of type, with ice comet on the pull in. With the 1.5 stun, I fire off truss right after. There have been times the mob dies from Ice Comet before it gets back, which always makes people laugh. <BR><BR>Lets see, kill a mob in one hit, before anyone else gets a chance to hit the mob, wonderful. That means everyone elses DPS was, oh lets see, ZERO.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>LOL, ice comet for the win.  :smileyvery-happy:</DIV>

[Zcenicx]

<DIV>LOL, yes, I don't count the insta kills... hard to do... 5.5k / 0 is infinity, which is way too much :smileyvery-happy:</DIV><p>Message Edited by Zcenicx on <span class=date_text>09-19-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:08 PM</span>

[Lady Uaelr]

<DIV>Do you think if they decreased wizard/warock  recast timers we would be doing way more damage and be on top?</DIV>

[Daga]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Lady Uaelrea wrote:<BR> <DIV>Do you think if they decreased wizard/warock  recast timers we would be doing way more damage and be on top?</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>We'd probably be dead.

[adamflanagan]

<span><blockquote><hr>Dagath wrote: <blockquote> <hr> Lady Uaelrea wrote: <div>Do you think if they decreased wizard/warock  recast timers we would be doing way more damage and be on top?</div> <hr> </blockquote>We'd probably be dead. <div></div><hr></blockquote>exactly. there is now way i can chain cast any more without getting aggro. our dps is fine</span><div></div>

[TheKraken]

<P>I'm having flashbacks to before our wizard + warlock upgrade, I forget what patch it was; the one where they upped damage on many spells, and unlinked several, and made a few quicker to cast.  They seem to have reversed much of this, except or course for the damage part, which I must say has gone up quite a large amount.  Having massive attack, however, doesn't count for much when my group grinds down a mob so fast, that a 3 sec ball of flames doesn't even have time to go off.  Ice comet is worse, you don't dare through it first in group situations, you wait a bit, and inevitably, I barely get it in at the end, if at all.  Four second cast time is forever in combat, watching melee types generating a whirlwind of dps.  I'm having to push myself to go as quick as possible, and risk agro, just to make it so that I contribute in a fight, and actually get off a decent number of attacks while the mob is still alive.  I haven't had this frustration since before that patch we loved so much.  </P> <P>Soloing is no problem, to that I will admit. Few solo mobs can survive ice comet + paralyze + ball of incineration.  But in groups, I do feel my dps is falling behind unless I can get that ice comet off in a timely manner.  Perhaps DoF mobs are just way easier than they should be, I have gotten that impression.  Not a week has passed since its release and I'm seeing level 53s and 54s here on Oasis.</P>

[Stavenh]

<P>See, for smaller easier mobs, I kinda expect to be outdamaged. Melee classes hit much faster and more often. How many hits does a scout get in while I'm casting ice comet? That adds up. And I'm ok with it. I consider that one of those situations where I will be out damaged just because the mob is weak. But if you want to go after harder mobs, you will need a wizard. </P> <P>Now, lets say your group is trying to get a mob to spawn for a quest. Like the carpet quest, when you have to get a highway leader to spawn. Wizards rock. Root, ice comet, retarget, root, protoflame, root another one. You can generally kill 3 while the rest kill 2. You can just pick them off left and right, increasing the chance of getting a leader to spawn. </P> <P>Wizards are doing fine, in my book. It's not always how you play the class, it's how you also think about the class. Some times, with some mobs, you just don't need heavy fire power. </P>

[brow27]

Kraken, if you're group is killing stuff so fast you don't have time to cast Ice Comet, you need to move on to bigger and better things lol.  Either that or you need to pull and solo a second one while your group is killing one.  As Stave asid, if your group is kililng solo mobs, just branch off and take down multiple ones at the same time.  You'll increase your overall exp gain significantly. If you are killing slightly harder mobs and you hardly get ice comet off, cast sooner.  Depending on the con of the mob, I'll often start casting it about halfway through the fight .. it'll likely be down to 40% by the time IC lands, dropping it down to between 10-20% usually.  Hit it with one more spell as your group is whittling it away and you're done.  I wouldn't complain about not getting to cast as much, though, because you save mana this way and your group can likely chain pull and be fine. <div></div>