The new math. Who are the top tier single target dps classes?

[SaintJere]

<DIV>Important disclaimer.  I have 50 warlock (boo hiss) and 30 wizard ( yeah!!).  i rerolled to wiz months ago when it became obvious that warlock was being changed to something that didnt appeal to me.  i posted the following message on the warlock boards a min ago but i think the question is valid here too.</DIV> <DIV><BR>With the new patch finally in i was wondering what peoples impressions were.<BR> <BR>obviously our aoe dps went up (warlock!!) and our single target dps went down (warlock  again!!) , and ill let you decide for yourself what that means.  but how far down did our single target dps go  (ahem, warlock)?  are we in second place now ( WAAAARRRLOCCKK)?  third?  fourth, sixth.<BR> <BR>i list the following classes as contenders for top spot in single target dps.<BR> <BR>Wizard, the official top dog, but only time will tell.<BR>Conjuror, Got some serious loving yesterday, i dont see how they cant be beating us in single target now, but that is just conjecture.<BR>Assasin, Long time dps beast and once more only just got a lot better.<BR>Ranger, another DPS powerhouse, did they finally move into the top tier?<BR>Necromancer, also got some serious loving yesterday but since conjurors are supposed to be better that begs the question how much worse are necros?<BR>Monk,  not even sure if they belong on this list.  are they high dps now?<BR>Bruiser, see monk.<BR> <BR>and of course warlock.   well i logged my 50 warlock on last night with all master or adept three spells and high end gear.  it felt like my single target dps was down about 30 percent.  assuming that conjuror and assasin became better then we must be at least 4th place but it could be as bad as 6th place.<BR> <BR> <BR>i would really appreciate some feedback on this?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>how do the wizards out there feel about dps rankings?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>yt</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>jeremy</DIV>

[Blindrage]

<P>After I logged on, respec'd and started to group in DoF last night, I had a 50 Guardian, Troub, Templar, Defiler, Ranger, Wizard for a group, myself being the wizard.</P> <P> </P> <P>I noticed a boost in wizard damage as compared with pre-dof.  We were running a parser last night and seeing the Ranger with equivilent gear to myself doing 2times the dmg.  On level 60^^^s that we were fighting his dps would be upwards of 600, while mine would be 350, only if I could use ice comet once per fight, which in most cases that would not happen because we would own the mobs  so quick.  The guardian was getting 250dps with a 1 hander.  I was usually around 300dps on single target mobs with a self buffed int of 300, and all adept III + spells.  I almost pushed 500 dps on AE encounters where I could let the AE dots tick away while using single target nukes aswell.  Resists seem to be less common than pre-DoF however I have not been able to test this on any Epic mobs.</P> <P> </P> <P>So to answer your question, I would classify the classes like so:</P> <P>1.Ranger</P> <P>2.Assassin</P> <P>3.Wizard</P> <P>4.Warlock</P> <P>Warlock and Wizard will switch places if it's an AE  encounter.  </P> <P> </P> <P>Overall I am displeased with the dps of scouts to casters as they can wear heavier armor, and when they run out of power they still have auto-attack dps, which has been raised.</P> <P>To correct this problem I would suggest putting ice comet on a 30 second recast time so it may be cast once per fight, and adding another tick to our Icy Wind spell.  In leu of that, Upgrade one of the warlocks nukes considerably.  Maybe make nil distortion on a 20 second recast timer with a damage scale of 2000-2500</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>Just some suggestions from a dissapointed wizard.</P>

[Jenj]

Some DPS numbers from last night (full fabled 50's against 59+++ mobs) <ul> <li>Ranger - 400 DPS</li> <li>Wizard - 350 DPS (from above post) </li> <li>Assassin - 300-350 DPS</li> <li>Monk - 250-350 DPS</li> <li>Guardian - 250 DPS (from above post) </li> </ul> As a monk, I probably had a slightly less DPS versus the Assassin. Also, the ranger said they could get around 700 DPS on group ae fights. -Jenjer <div></div>

[BlackAdderDr]

I have a 50 ranger and ran parsers on her.  I have no fabled gear, all bow CAs are master or adept III and all melee are adept I.  Ebon armor/weps etc.. I found my DPS on a decent fight in group was around 350.  I did not use my storm of arrows to bump the DPS on single targets.  But her DPS is 350ish when bow CAs are up and 220ish when not...  If you fight mob after mob after mob pretty fast the ranger cannot maintain the 350dps all the way thru ... its every minute we can alpha strike if u will with all of our ranged CAs.  Tactics are still being ironed out so I wouldnt say ranger number one as our tactics in groups havent changed drastically. Alaulai 50 Ranger of Nektulos Acelia 35 Wizard of Nektulos <div></div>

[hawk987]

Consistently clocking 450-500 dps last night with spikes well over 500. Miller 50 Ranger Toxx Dominion <div></div>

[SalBlu]

Eh... A guildie of mine got the 3rd highest worldwide melee hit last night using Condemning Blade.  He's an Assassin.  The hit was up to about 10,700 damage.

[Alfgand]

If the Scouts are going to out DPS Wizards and Warlocks, they had better make them wear robes !<p>Message Edited by Alfgand on <span class=date_text>09-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:50 AM</span>

[Darien al'Staff]

I have a post going on the "Spells and Abilities" board.  WIZARDS:  Please go there and voice your support. <div></div>

[Lady Uaelr]

<P>Last night against cyclopses PoF:</P> <P>Necro: 350- 430 dps + pet 2k extra damage </P> <P>Ranger: 300- 400 dps</P> <P>Wizard: 279 - 320 dps</P> <P> </P> <P>I think this has to do alot with ou recast times - if they were shorter duration we would be able to get off more spells.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <p>Message Edited by Lady Uaelrea on <span class=date_text>09-19-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:25 AM</span>

[Zcenicx]

<DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>You guys will have to excuse me, but vs 54-56 mobs I do spikes of over 500 dps with my 51 Wizard. Can consistently lay at around 425. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>59's tho... well, they do resist your spells exponentially, and take way too long to kill anyways. In a long fight, the predators may or may not overturn us - it's a matter of for us number of and percent resisted, and for them whether or not they proc poison and effects. It can go either way.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>I'd say the damage rating is quite different than the posted, but it does depend on the gear you're using. While I'm only using 3 fableds (+17 int pants, +16 int bracelet and +15 int shoulders) I havent seen many other that actually boost my INT much. Full Ad3+ spell line tho. My buffed INT with potion and food is 393. My experience tho is that we're all balanced enough, either of the four classes can take the crown in a fight, and all four can lie at the bottom too.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>I have however seen way too many Wizards that complain have a lot less INT than I do tho. Remember, fabled armor isnt the best just because it's fabled. The terms to count by are in order Power regen, Power and INT. I'm yet to see anything better than the GEBs, as an example using that logic. Same with the Ancient Rallosian, it's way better than the cryptic metallic or any other such junk.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Also, forget about proc gear unless you're soloing. Slip, baffle, proc x that procs when hit... forget them. If we get hit we die, end of story. Get INT and power instead so we can nuke for more and longer.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Adara Frostborn</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>L51 Wizard of Shadowhaven, Najena</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Co-Guild Leader, Guild Ambassador</FONT></DIV></DIV>

[OneBadAli]

<DIV>After parsing many fights, and most of the classes being fully fabled with masters/adept 3's</DIV> <DIV>Bruiser/Necro(especially on grouped mobs)</DIV> <DIV>Warlock/Assasin/Wizard/Conjuror (all of these are close to one another)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Noctide]

<DIV>1) Make sure you have adept 3 Frost Shield, keep it up on tank...thats an easy 1500 damage per cast with 100% proc</DIV> <DIV>2) ProtoFlame, another cast and forget, pet does extra dps for you and lasts a minute.</DIV> <DIV>3) Debuff!  Mobs no longer mitigate, so elemental debuffs apply a negative to the mobs for your spells, so you actually do more damage now, my IC can hit for 6100 with debuffs up.</DIV> <DIV>4) Get in close range next to tank, use Inferno since it hits ALL mobs in a 7.5 radius of you, getting close also allows you to use the Ice spell as well since it has such a short cast distance but it is on a seperate timer and adds another 800sh damage.</DIV> <DIV>5) If you have a paladin in group, ask him to use the hate siphon skill on you =)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am enjoying my wizard alot now, learn all the new spells and use each to its fullest.  I have no problem with the roots or their timers just learn which spells break the roots quicker.  Remember all roots now hold for their full duration if they are taking no damage.  Paralyze is now your best friend when mob breaks root and is heading to you.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Lady Uaelr]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Zcenicx wrote:<BR> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>You guys will have to excuse me, but vs 54-56 mobs I do spikes of over 500 dps with my 51 Wizard. Can consistently lay at around 425. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>59's tho... well, they do resist your spells exponentially, and take way too long to kill anyways. In a long fight, the predators may or may not overturn us - it's a matter of for us number of and percent resisted, and for them whether or not they proc poison and effects. It can go either way.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>I'd say the damage rating is quite different than the posted, but it does depend on the gear you're using. While I'm only using 3 fableds (+17 int pants, +16 int bracelet and +15 int shoulders) I havent seen many other that actually boost my INT much. Full Ad3+ spell line tho. My buffed INT with potion and food is 393. My experience tho is that we're all balanced enough, either of the four classes can take the crown in a fight, and all four can lie at the bottom too.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>I have however seen way too many Wizards that complain have a lot less INT than I do tho. Remember, fabled armor isnt the best just because it's fabled. The terms to count by are in order Power regen, Power and INT. I'm yet to see anything better than the GEBs, as an example using that logic. Same with the Ancient Rallosian, it's way better than the cryptic metallic or any other such junk.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Also, forget about proc gear unless you're soloing. Slip, baffle, proc x that procs when hit... forget them. If we get hit we die, end of story. Get INT and power instead so we can nuke for more and longer.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Adara Frostborn</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>L51 Wizard of Shadowhaven, Najena</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Co-Guild Leader, Guild Ambassador</FONT></DIV></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Please share what spells you are using and in what order.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thanks.</DIV>

[DethOrGlo]

I'm a 50 wiz and I used to be [Removed for Content] at dps of rangers/assasins coming close and often beating us.  Now though since 9/12, I have been with assasins and rangers of equal level and I have consistently been the one to draw aggro.  I need to start up my combat stats, but I would be very suprised if rangers/assasins were now within 10-20% of wiz/warlock now.  Our roots were nerfed pretty badly, but our grp damage spells are faster now and do more damage it appears.  They linked a few key spells (ball flames/ fire and a few quick ice spells, some roots linked).   But overall, I'd say damage wise we are more powerful now, but we need help because we can die even easier now too, plus roots suck [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot].

[BoinkTheClown]

<DIV>I am a 51 wiz, all adept 3 and legendary gear, no ranger is getting better dps than me in the groups I've been in, this is not counting frostshield I cast on the MT that is doing around 1000 damage, the tank gets credit for it. The rangers tend to be about 20 to 25% less dps overall. Keep in mind I am not all out nuking as this gets me agro very quickly.</DIV>

[Zcenicx]

<DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>The spells I use are the following for a heroic while in a group. I start with a chain then follow with whatever respawns first.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Note that our MT is usually a Paladin who likes to cast Amends on me instead of any other groupmember.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Frostshield - just before pull.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Piercing Icicles</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Enfeeblement - saves the tank from the initial knockdown/knockback or initial spells.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Paralyze - gives the tank time to taunt once or twice.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ball of Flames</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ice Flame</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ice Comet</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Frostshield - refresh</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ball of Flames</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Piercing Icicles</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>If nothing's up at the end here I use the new Icy Wind.. dont remember the new name. When done Flamestrike and Paralyze will have respawned again.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>This chain should put you in the 400s, how high depends on spell quality and intelligence. None of the above spells are lower than Adept 3. Forget Immolation btw, it's more effective to use the AE DoT now since it does 4x the damage, even if it sucks mana.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Adara Frostborn</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>L51 Wizard of Shadowhaven, Najena</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Co-Guild Leader, Guild Ambassador</FONT></DIV>

[Lady Uaelr]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Zcenicx wrote:<BR> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>The spells I use are the following for a heroic while in a group. I start with a chain then follow with whatever respawns first.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Note that our MT is usually a Paladin who likes to cast Amends on me instead of any other groupmember.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Frostshield - just before pull.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Piercing Icicles</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Enfeeblement - saves the tank from the initial knockdown/knockback or initial spells.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Paralyze - gives the tank time to taunt once or twice.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ball of Flames</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ice Flame</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ice Comet</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Frostshield - refresh</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ball of Flames</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Piercing Icicles</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>If nothing's up at the end here I use the new Icy Wind.. dont remember the new name. When done Flamestrike and Paralyze will have respawned again.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>This chain should put you in the 400s, how high depends on spell quality and intelligence. None of the above spells are lower than Adept 3. Forget Immolation btw, it's more effective to use the AE DoT now since it does 4x the damage, even if it sucks mana.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Adara Frostborn</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>L51 Wizard of Shadowhaven, Najena</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Co-Guild Leader, Guild Ambassador</FONT></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Thank you.<BR></DIV>

[THuNDeRHe]

<span><blockquote><hr>Jenjer wrote:Some DPS numbers from last night (full fabled 50's against 59+++ mobs) <ul> <li>Ranger - 400 DPS</li> <li>Wizard - 350 DPS (from above post) </li> <li>Assassin - 300-350 DPS</li> <li>Monk - 250-350 DPS</li> <li>Guardian - 250 DPS (from above post) </li> </ul> As a monk, I probably had a slightly less DPS versus the Assassin. Also, the ranger said they could get around 700 DPS on group ae fights. -Jenjer <div></div><hr></blockquote>What damage parser are you using?  Maybe I don't know how to play my 50 wizard, but I have never seen DPS that high from a wizard, nor a ranger.  I was in Pillars of Flame with a full group on Thursday night, and the DPS parser was saying I was doing 150-200 DPS, while I was being out DPS'd by the monk around 200-300 DPS.  I read my spell book very carefully, and think I've got the changes down, but I besides the name changes to spells and cast/recast timers, my DPS doesn't seem to have changed much. Jaale Frostfire 51 Wizard Hands of Time, Oggok </span><div></div>

[Zcenicx]

<P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Example hits:</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ice Comet: 5000 damage every 50 seconds (45 sec recast, 4 sec cast, 0.5 sec recover) = 100 DPS.</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ball of Flames: 1250 damage every 12.5 seconds (9 sec recast, 3 sec cast, 0.5 sec recover) = 100 DPS.</FONT></P> <P><STRONG><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>(That's 200 DPS with two spells alone)</FONT></STRONG></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Flamestrike: 700 damage every 6 seconds = 115 DPS (Best pure DPS spell we get, very fast recast)</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Ice Flame: 400+400 damage every 33 seconds = 25 DPS</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Paralyze: 1000 damage every 23 seconds = 45 DPS</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Icy Wind: 350+350x3 damage every 21 seconds = 65 DPS (per mob hit)</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Frostshield: 350x3 damage every 22 seconds = 45 DPS</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>Immolation: 300+100x4 damage every 9 seconds = 75 DPS</FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Comic Sans MS" color=#ffff00 size=4>How the heck can you keep yourself at 150 DPS? :smileysurprised:</FONT></P>

[goboy]

<DIV>Different parser settings can influence the output.  I will check what EQ2 Companion is showing for me.  At 261 int, I think I am doing in the 220 area.  I primarily solo, so I am not sure how we do in a group.  I dont use frostshield much - I hate getting hit.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Aral]

<P>A few things to remember.</P> <P>1.  Consider your Int vs the melee characters' strength.  Both have major impact on your arts. </P> <P>2.  Consider the debuffs being used.  These make a huge difference.  Rogues are your friend, if you didn't know yet.  Brigand (my char, I don't know the Swash debuff numbers) drops all magical (every type of resist ) 1530 every minute, and cold 1224 (fast recast, I believe 20 secs).   If the mob is being debuffed for physical (brigs, Sk's, others do this) but not magical, the melees will shine.   My wizard pal was getting constant 6k-7k IC's last night vs the 55 triple ups in Tombs, he hit a max of 8108 with just rogue debuffs in.  </P> <P>In general, subclasses that don't group buff, debuff the mob.  The latter is more important for your dps.  Int buffs are the other side of that coin, up to 7xlevel. </P> <P>While we try to keep silent about it, don't completely forget the rogues in the list <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Vs single targets, a brigand is very tough to beat for any melee, including monk or bruiser.  Crushing fury isn't the beast it used to be, and bruisers aren't getting 200+% haste any longer.  For multiple targets, the swash is quite strong, as are the brawlers.  Myself as 51 brigand, I only drop below 400 dps on single targets if I'm purposefully not using arts for aggro purposes, or to save up arts for a groupmate's HH the next fight.  My best vs those 55 triple ups was 500 last night, with just my physical mit. debuff in our group.  I can keep up 300 or better on groups, though it's a lot more work.   I don't see how any wizard could be doing worse than this, honestly.   Assassins and rangers will do more as well, if they use their arts in sync with my debuffs going in.  Communication regarding debuffs is going to become part of the art of grouping, since many classes now have fewer, but more monstrous, arts/spells. </P> <P>Time your spells with those debuffs and you'll see your numbers rocket up wizzies. </P>

[Zcenicx]

With a swashie debuffing cold and heat with poisons and arts, I shine in high 600s.

[goboy]

<P>Ok,</P> <P>Did my first group in a while last night.  We did the second phase of the carpet quest.  For the few hours we were grouped, we had 50 Wizard, 51 Assassin, 52 Conjurer, 50 Cleric, 50 Druid, 50 Cleric.</P> <P>My sustained DPS for the entire time (and I did not hold back) was 262.  Add in another 30 dps for frostshield (harder to parse) and I was right near 300 dps.  Frost shield did indicate a dps of 162, however, that was only during the times it was active.  Averaging it across the fight times dropped it closer to 30.</P> <P>The assassin was at 220 dps.  I do not know if she was going full out, but I suspect she was.</P> <P>Theoretically you can get 600+ dps on single targets, but that does not really show your sustained dps.</P>

[Lady Uaelr]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Zcenicx wrote:<BR>With a swashie debuffing cold and heat with poisons and arts, I shine in high 600s. <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>You should post the numbers from the parser you were using.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It would be interesting to see.....</DIV><p>Message Edited by Lady Uaelrea on <span class=date_text>09-25-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:44 AM</span>

[Violator]

Seriously, wizards are not the top DPS on single target, and nowhere near on mulitples. I have been meaning to post about it, but have not made the time for a well thought out post. BUT, i was tanking the other day in POF, and ran the parser to see how a wizard buddy of mine and a necromancer from my guild was doing on dps. Kept wondering why the necro would pull more aggro. The necro himself averaged 305dps, with the pet adding up to 200dps on mulitples. So, he can do 500 dps, while the wizard was doing good to stay about 250+. Both guys having all ad3's, similar int, and the necro had a master pet. Wizards can still solo well, but by all means, we are screwed when it comes to damage.... again. I will make a post later, and maybe find some of the parse logs and post them.

[QQ-Fatman]

I think our dps is fine now. The biggest problem here is our spells cost too much mana and take too long to cast. Even warlocks are much more mana efficient. They really need to lower our spells' mana cost, or at least increase the ratio of our canni spells (2hp:1mana at master1 is unacceptable!)