First pass at wizard changes

[goboy]

<DIV> <P><FONT color=#ff0000>EDIT ALERT - I did not catch last night, but INTELLIGENCE affects max spell damage.  For all of my Damage Numbers - my buffed int is 199.  For example, Ball of Flames was 1374 at 199, 1304 at 162. </FONT></P> <P>Here is my first sleepy post in the feedback section fo the combat upgrades:</P> <P>Wizard feedback:</P> <P>Direct damage spells are up across the board - however, like spells are now linked.  I can no longer cast ball of flames followed by ball of fire.  This was problomatic at first, but, I have found other spells to fill in gaps.   I was killing white mobs easily by the end of the session.</P> <P>DOTS are useless.  at level 49, 40 point dot is pitiful.</P> <P>Stuff I liked.</P> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <P>Ball of Flames (adept 3) - 916-1374 damage.  Nice increase.</P> <P>Ice Flame - 395 cold and fire damage and 85% slow</P> <P>Paralyze (app IV) - 668-1114 damage as well as stun</P> <P>Flamestirke (adept 1) - 495-605 damage.  It is nice for its 2 second cast and 3 second recast.</P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Now for the things that hurt:</P> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <P>Piercing Icicles (adept 3) 39-47 DD, 39-47 every 4 seconds.</P> <P>Canni spells are on same timer - no longer chainable.  Vital flow (adept 1) gies 137 power for 227 health.  Not sure if this is usefull.</P> <P>Protoflame - 49 single down arrow pet for 1 minute.  It was doing 5 poitns of melee damage a strike.  Not very usefull</P> <P>All similar roots are on same timer.  Frozen manacles is now level limited.  Only one root can be effectively used at any one time.  Single target roots last for 12 seconds, recast is 16 seconds.  <FONT color=#ff3300>Forgot to mention, roots that tethered now snare on root termination.  Damage does not break root.</FONT></P> <P>Ring of cold - 15 second duration with 45 second recast.  Not sure when this would be useful any longer.  I am surely not going to root an encounter with it (well maybe in some groups). <FONT color=#ff0000>  Actually, you can use this and the single root line - does buy time.</FONT></P> <P>Fiery surge is now a self buff casting flametongue on wizard.  It is not a power pump.  Essential intromission is still a power pump.</P> <P>Dazzling seal and hand of tyrant on same timer.  This was to be expected - all like spells on same timer it seems.</P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Now for the stuff that made me scratch my head:</P> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <P>Magi shielding takes 3 concentration points.  It does have a 71 point self ward (never expires), increase max health by 168, defense by 5, mitiation by 245.  I am not sure it is worht 3 concentration points.</P> <P>With Magi shiedling, Augmentation (new), and Hand of tyrant up I use up all my concentration points.</P> <P>Kazlo's Accession woudl not cast. </P> <P>The following spells all take 1 concentration point.  This limits who we can cast on and we have to remove buffs to use:</P> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <P>All see invis spells</P> <P>Altered Vision  </P> <P>Fiery Grandeour buff</P></BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#66ff00>Consolidating my posts:</FONT></P> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr> <P>Immolation (adept 3) appears to not have changed.  267-362 dd, 134-181 every 2 seconds.  This spell feels underpowered now compared with our other spells, max potential damage is 1086.  It is faster - 2 second casting time.  Recast is 6 seconds.</P> <DIV>Inferno (adept 1) 518-700.  I missed this last night - not bad.  Spell also lists effect radius of 7.5 meters.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Icy Wind (adept 1) 419-512 dd and 419-512 every 4 seconds.  Hmmmmmmmm, i might actually like this spell.  4 second cast, 16 second recast, 16 second duration, 10 meters, 5 targets.  Am <FONT color=#ff0000>I reading this right - potential damage per target of 2500?</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Shocking Flash (adept 1) For some reason now it is level 50.  I bugged this (I hope).  3-4 DD, 3-4 every 2 seconds.  I would list time and all, but obviously spell is a bit borked.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Augmentation (app Iv) group spell, Max power +240, cold mit +431, heat mit +539</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bind sight (app I) 10 minute duration.  Allows you to see through a target ally eyes.  Breaks in combat.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>enfeeblement (app IV)  Interrupts target, stifles target (10%), HEALS target 17-29.  Instant cast, 16 second recast.  1 second duration.</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To other questoins.  I do not know if freeze has a cap still.  However, all similar spells have same timer.  If you have an upgrade, might as well use the upgrade.  Paralyze is now in my lineup - it also has a spiffy DD component.</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> <P>Message Edited by goboy on <SPAN class=date_text>08-05-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>09:10 AM</SPAN></P> <P>Message Edited by goboy on <SPAN class=date_text>08-05-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>09:13 AM</SPAN></P> <P>Message Edited by goboy on <SPAN class=date_text>08-05-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>09:14 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by goboy on <span class=date_text>08-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>09:14 AM</span>

[dark_vizi]

if you have time could you please tell us about immolation, inferno, fiery pulse and icy wind ? great post btw <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> thx for the heads up. <div></div>

[Cecil_Stri]

<DIV>How was augmentation changed?</DIV>

[FlasHBurN20]

Do you know if Freeze still has a level 34 cap on it?<div></div>

[Kalta]

<div></div><p>Do you know if Freeze still has a level 34 cap on it?------------------------------------------------------------------They put a cap on both freeze and blazing Intimidation in a past update so I doubt they will remove these.Further, from the information above Paralyze is being improved to a certain degree which is the replacement stun in the chain of freeze -> blazing intimidation -> paralyze.They probably will be putting a cap on incinerate too which is the only debuff we have for the many RAID dudes who are immune to cold.These nerfs to the our root spells are going to eliminate the possibility for our class to truly solo which I like to do from time to time and is becoming more vital with the decrease in population.  Losing frozen manacles, decreasing RoC to 15 seconds, and decreasing the damage of our DoTs will make successfully soloing any ^^ impossible.Currently, when I use safe tactics killing a blue ^^ it almost takes two rounds of RoC.  Being safe I mean not attacking the target after the first RoC has worn off and either truss or frozen manacles holds them while the recast timer for RoC runs down.  If the mob breaks the truss which seems to happen quit often I have frozen manacles or paralyze as a back up.With the mentioned revamp the frozen manacles will have a level cap and thus be unavailable and since Truss has a 3 second cast time we only have 12 seconds to do any damage to the target and we can not debuff the mob with our DoTs because that takes time and will break the Truss.  If any of our roots gets resisted we only have paralyze to save us since frozen manacles is not longer available and this stun has a 3 minute recast timer so we are screwed if another resist occurs.  With the single roots only lasting 12 seconds and having a 16 second recast time what is going to hold the target for the remaining 33 seconds for RoC to reset?  NOTHING!  Thus SOE eliminates the chance for any wizard to take out even a ^ mob.</p>

[123467]

<DIV>No surpirse that protoflame wasnt fixed....</DIV>

[Dejah]

<DIV>I rolled up a test toon and got citizenship so i could visit the scribe in qeynos harbor and check out the app2 versions of our spells.  Unforunately, since they all conned red to me the damage/mitigation and other such quantities were not correct like it is right now on live server.  I thought that now that spells didn't grow with levels that we would all see the same thing when inspecting spells?  Anyways, it isn't working now on test if that's how its going to work, so I only have descriptive text to go by.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Here are some notes, I'd post screenshots but my web server is being flaky tonight.  Please note that all these notes were taken from examining the app2 version of the spell.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Ice Comet</DIV> <DIV>There are some new added affects.  Casts knockback on termination, this "Increases Blurs Vision of target by 4.5"--I don't know if thats just for PVP or what--, "Throws target back"--this could be good or bad, and "Stuns target (resists chance increased by 10%)", doesn't say anything about epics or level limit, so maybe we have ourselves a epic stun now. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Enfeeblement</DIV> <DIV>Does dmg now, not sure how much, I think its low.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Icebound Gift</DIV> <DIV>Looks like this has been changed completely.  It now adds extra dmg and slow target whenever we cast a non-heat, non-phsyical spell.  Not sure of the duration, but the recast is 90sec now.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Augmentation</DIV> <DIV>Seems like the stat increases were removed.  Just buffs power and heat/cold mitagation now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Fiery Surge</DIV> <DIV>"For a short time, the wizard is granted a chance at additional heat damage with every heat spell that strikes an enemy.  This consumes a small amount of power every time it triggers."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Mail of Forst</DIV> <DIV>Ward is still there.  But now instead of a hate reducing proc, it looks like there is a dmg/dot proc.  Exactly the opposite of what we want.  The description still says hate reduces, so I'm not sure which part of it is bugged, the description or the effect... </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Paralyze</DIV> <DIV>Looks like there is damage on this spell now.  recast time is now 30 sec as well.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Truss</DIV> <DIV>No longer has the tether effect, when root breaks the mob is just slowed, no back up root anymore.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Vitalic Harvest</DIV> <DIV>Now this spell charges you up gradually instead of all at once.  You can cancel it early now too.  I like this change.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Once again, please not that I haven't tested out these changes, I've only looked at spell descriptions.  I figured that there are probably a lot of wizards out there eager to get as much information as possible, so I'm glad to do my little part.</DIV>

[drajev]

<DIV>Well, overall this stuff is maybe not so bad. Think about this - a 50% increase in BoFl means we can do more damage and with RoC on we have time to cast 2 times BoFl and once Immolation in between, so with the following cycle - RoC - BoFl - Immolation - BoFl - Paralyze - BoFl - Ice Commet we could still be able to take down some big ^^ mobs as this means we do 1200 + 2000 + 1200 +1000 + 1200 + 3300 = approximately 10k damage without being in danger as these are average numbers from adept 3 spells as all mines are. Another problem is to hope nothing gets resisted, but only time will show this, hope SOE thought about us. So guys don't start complaining yet as i think we can still be the game's solo kings. On a side note i was wondering how this revamp would affect our cousins, the warlocks? Anyone got information about this?</DIV>

[Kasai]

<P>To the above poster there is some Warlock Combat revamp info in thier board....also ANY news on the end game raid resists?</P> <P> </P> <P>EDIT: WOOOOT </P> <P>You are looking at one wizzie(errrr...reading one wizzies post) who is very happy about this revamp.  Finally some balance between the sorcerors =D</P><p>Message Edited by Kasai259 on <span class=date_text>08-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:26 AM</span>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Currently, when I use safe tactics killing a blue ^^ it almost takes two rounds of RoC.  Being safe I mean not attacking the target after the first RoC has worn off and either truss or frozen manacles holds them while the recast timer for RoC runs down.  If the mob breaks the truss which seems to happen quit often I have frozen manacles or paralyze as a back up.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>It was quite late last night when i drafted this.  However, one thing to make abundantly clear - ^^ mobs of any flavor are not doable.  I was killing blues and whites last night.  The first yellow i tried [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] near ate me - I escaped.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> dark_vizier wrote:<BR>if you have time could you please tell us about immolation, inferno, fiery pulse and icy wind ? great post btw <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> thx for the heads up.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Immolation (adept 3) appears to not have changed.  267-362 dd, 134-181 every 2 seconds.  This spell feels underpowered now compared with our other spells, max potential damage is 1086.  It is faster - 2 second casting time.  Recast is 6 seconds.</P> <DIV>Inferno (adept 1) 518-700.  I missed this last night - not bad.  Spell also lists effect radius of 7.5 meters.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Icy Wind (adept 1) 419-512 dd and 419-512 every 4 seconds.  Hmmmmmmmm, i might actually like this spell.  4 second cast, 16 second recast, 16 second duration, 10 meters, 5 targets.  Am I reading this right - potential damage per target of 2500?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Shocking Flash (adept 1) For some reason now it is level 50.  I bugged this (I hope).  3-4 DD, 3-4 every 2 seconds.  I would list time and all, but obviously spell is a bit borked.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Augmentation (app Iv) group spell, Max power +240, cold mit +431, heat mit +539</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Bind sight (app I) 10 minute duration.  Allows you to see through a target ally eyes.  Breaks in combat.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>enfeeblement (app IV)  Interrupts target, stifles target (10%), HEALS target 17-29.  Instant cast, 16 second recast.  1 second duration.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>To other questoins.  I do not know if freeze has a cap still.  However, all similar spells have same timer.  If you have an upgrade, might as well use the upgrade.  Paralyze is now in my lineup - it also has a spiffy DD component.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[goboy]

<P>Ok,</P> <P>I ran through SP upper tunnels on very stupid difficult this morning.  I only had to run 1x.  </P> <P>NUMBER 1 thing, relearn tactics.  I heard a lot of grumbling in test channel, but, it took me 2 hours to get comfortable.  I also have to say, most spells (non-DOT) are useful now.  Example, flamestrike, while not huge damage is fast casting.  I never used flamestrike prior to patch.</P> <P>Here is what I started to do:</P> <P>SP Groups:  ROC, Icy Wind, Inferno (DOES NOT WORK), and then blast one target.  Finish other target.</P> <DIV>SP Singles:  Icy Wind (got to love 2.5k dot), Paralyze, Icy Prizon (think that is root name), BOF, Ice Flame, Flamestrike, and then BOF again (if needed).   Sometimes I would also drop ROC on after Icy Prison dropped just to buy some room.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>With these tactics, whites were easy.  Some yellows still had me hopping about - fricking bats stun too much.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I also used Magi Shielding - even though it is 3 conc.  The ward, while not huge helps.  It typically absorbed 75 pts damage.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am hearing reports that level 50s with Ice Comet are seeing 5.2k hp damage (236 int).</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>My biggest complaint is Concentration spells.  It is near impossible to buff group members. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Sorano]

Thanks for posting all this info Goboy. One question though. Do our dots like Piercing Icicles and Icy Wind, still have an elemental mitigation debuff on them? What about Incinerate? Does that still work on any level mob?<BR>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sorano wrote:<BR> Thanks for posting all this info Goboy. One question though. Do our dots like Piercing Icicles and Icy Wind, still have an elemental mitigation debuff on them? What about Incinerate? Does that still work on any level mob?<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I will look when I get home tonight.  I don't remember that spell - is that a lower or higher level?  I am 49 atm.</P> <P> </P>

[Sorano]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> goboy wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Sorano wrote:<BR> Thanks for posting all this info Goboy. One question though. Do our dots like Piercing Icicles and Icy Wind, still have an elemental mitigation debuff on them? What about Incinerate? Does that still work on any level mob?<BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I will look when I get home tonight.  I don't remember that spell - is that a lower or higher level?  I am 49 atm.</P> <P> </P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Incinerate is a sorceror spell, so yes it's a lower lvl spell. It's also the only heat based debuff we get, so is currently fairly useful for  all those pesky cold immune mobs.<BR>

[Tanit]

Did heat convulsions change? <div></div>

[brow27]

<div></div>First off, I would like to say a huge Thank You to goboy for getting the information and posting it up on the boards here.  People like you will help us be prepared for what is to come, as well as being able to provide valuable feedback to Sony about the changes. I know it would probably be a HUGE inconvenience, but how would you feel about taking screenshots of all the wizard spells and posting them here on the board?  Maybe you could do like I saw a guy do with his master spells, fit as many of the examined spells on the screen and take a screenshot of that.  That way you'd only have to take a limited amount of screenshots.  Just a suggestion, if you don't want to do that, I wouldn't be surprised at all. Keep up the good work, and thanks again! edit: Forgot to ask about this.. How is our avoidance now?  I know we've lost parry, but supposedly cloth armor is supposed to have better avoidance than other armor types.  I know my avoidance ranges between 47-52% at level 45.  How is it for you on test now? <div></div><p>Message Edited by brow27 on <span class=date_text>08-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:51 AM</span>

[Stavenh]

Looking over at the warlock forum, seems like they got an over all decrease on damage. Seems like wizards and warlocks are much closer to each other in the damage they do. Kinda like I said would happen.

[illy586]

<DIV>I really could care less about DoTs and ball of flames/fire on same timer, tho its alittle upseting. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I just hope that they did something with Ice Comet and resisting on epic encounter's because that hurt's us the worse in the end-game.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And thanks for posting the info!</DIV>

[roarfrost]

<DIV>The changes to Roots sound absolutely horrible...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Tar~Palantir]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Stavenham wrote:<BR><FONT color=#ff3300>Looking over at the warlock forum, seems like they got an over all decrease on damage</FONT>. Seems like wizards and warlocks are much closer to each other in the damage they do. Kinda like I said would happen.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Handel's Hallujah chorus is playing through my head as I type. Whoot! My goal in this game is achieved.<BR>

[Dae]

<div></div>Seems like you guys will come out ahead on single target damage whereas we'll have the advantage with AE damage. Our single target dps is probably going to end up significantly lower than it is now. Only time will tell. I'm waiting to see if the changes will provide us with a functional single target root. Then again none of this is finished and we're only getting first impressions at the moment. I just hope they fix raid resists. We'll see. So far it looks like most our useless spells will now be useful. Edit: How did you guys come out in terms of defensive abilities while soloing? RoC looks like it took the same hit as BG. We also lost our 9 second stun line and none of us can parry any more... Tar-Palantir if you feel the need for a new crusade I'd be very grateful if you could persuade the UK government to set up a cheesecake delivery service. <div></div><p>Message Edited by Daerv on <span class=date_text>08-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:10 PM</span>

[SalBlu]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Tar~Palantir wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Stavenham wrote:<BR><FONT color=#ff3300>Looking over at the warlock forum, seems like they got an over all decrease on damage</FONT>. Seems like wizards and warlocks are much closer to each other in the damage they do. Kinda like I said would happen.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Handel's Hallujah chorus is playing through my head as I type. Whoot! My goal in this game is achieved.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>This is really unnecessary.  So you entire goal of ever coming on these forum has been to upset every Warlock out there, and nerf their abilities because you have a little envy?</P> <P>Way to make us look good. /sarcasm.</P>

[Huu]

<P>who cares what damge the dots do, they were never meant for dps, and if that was why you were using them, then your not doin anything right.</P> <P>the Dot's each had 1.2k elemental resist debuff, stacking for close to 2.5k when both are ad 3. Pretty much the only way to get any decent damage out of ice comet on epics that aren't ice immune. So plz let us know what happened to that.</P> <P>well guess i can't solo heroic arena anymore or prolly kill pit champ at that now that roots are completely pajooned.</P> <P>Fiery grandeur now take a concentration point? they better have increased the proc to 100% or increased the damage on it or i'm never using that spell again.</P> <P>and Invis now take conc, are you kidding me, not only was it single target only and not as good as enchanter invis, but now it takes conc, they better remove the 10% movement reduction then.</P> <P>for you immolation was only doing 250-350 damage per tick at adept 3? man the test server sux, it never hit for less then 400 and sometimes 600 when mobs are debuffed on najena. so that is a significant dps reduction indeed.</P> <P>Icy Wind now a dps spell? with no heat/cold debuff?</P> <P>shocking flash? never even heard of this spell.</P> <P>enfeeblement 1 sec duration? why even make it stifle, why not jsut make it an interrupt</P> <P>so far the only change i like is Ice comet now apparently stuns. but increase resists by 10%? so i have my disruption at 260 now, am i gonna have to get it up to 270 to have it land on any freakin mobs.</P>

[stepha72]

<P>I agree this is totally unnecessary.  I think most wizards out there would agree we were hoping for more of a balance.  But, I personally was hoping they would do this without nerfing.  I know this was a dream but it was what I was hoping.  I just hope that when all is said and done both groups are happy with the class they chose.  </P> <P>Tar~Palantir grow up.  Your goal should have been to work towards wizards getting fixed not for Warlocks getting nerfed.  </P> <P> </P>

[Kestrill]

Have you gotten Bind Sight (a new spell that allows us to see though someone else's eyes) to work? I tried it today, and nothing. <div></div>

[Tabemo]

All spells scale with the amount of int u have.  I haven't tested past 300int, but from 251-272 int, there is a noticeable difference (ice comet @ 251 = 4085-4993 | @ 272 = 4168-5094).  Heat convulsions does 105 damage, and 105 damage every 2 seconds.  It says it has a chance to stifle in the description, but not in the effects.  Bind sight is broken.  Shocking flash = lightning flash, magi's shielding >> el'arad's shielding. <div></div>

[Tanit]

<span><blockquote><hr>Huuma wrote: <p>for you immolation was only doing 250-350 damage per tick at adept 3? man the test server sux, it never hit for less then 400 and sometimes 600 when mobs are debuffed on najena. so that is a significant dps reduction indeed.</p><hr></blockquote>Only 6sec recast and 2 sec cast now though. Guess that makes up for the decrease in dmg. </span>Fiery grandeur seems useless now, unless they changed it into something awesome (which i doubt) <div></div>

[Tabemo]

rath'adran's fiery efflux still feeds mana, but it doesn't stun you afterwards.  I think all the character traits are still being revamped <div></div>

[Tanit]

<span><blockquote><hr>Tabemono wrote:rath'adran's fiery efflux still feeds mana, but it doesn't stun you afterwards.  I think all the character traits are still being revamped <div></div><hr></blockquote>Yeah, i guess it'll be changed into something completely different (now that fiery surge changed) </span><div></div>

[SalBlu]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Tabemono wrote:<BR>All spells scale with the amount of int u have.  I haven't tested past 300int, but from 251-272 int, there is a noticeable difference (ice comet @ 251 = 4085-4993 | @ 272 = 4168-5094).  Heat convulsions does 105 damage, and 105 damage every 2 seconds.  It says it has a chance to stifle in the description, but not in the effects.  Bind sight is broken.  Shocking flash = lightning flash, magi's shielding >> el'arad's shielding.<BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Oh man... i have 336 INT right now from equipment and self buffs.  Given that I'll still be able to keep close to what I have now if the equipment doesnt change and buffs stay a bit similar, I'm really interested to see my INT to Damage Ratio.

[trysta]

<span><blockquote><hr>SalBluee wrote:<blockquote> <div></div> <hr> </blockquote>Oh man... i have 336 INT right now from equipment and self buffs.  Given that I'll still be able to keep close to what I have now if the equipment doesnt change and buffs stay a bit similar, I'm really interested to see my INT to Damage Ratio. <div></div><hr></blockquote> Might wanna recalculate your INT. We only have one INT buff now that buffs for 30-something. Descry is now only a See Invisible buff.</span><div></div>

[SalBlu]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SalBluee wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE>Oh man... i have 336 INT right now from equipment and self buffs.  <STRONG><EM><FONT color=#99ccff>Given that I'll still be able to keep close to what I have now if the equipment doesnt change and buffs stay a bit similar</FONT></EM></STRONG>, I'm really interested to see my INT to Damage Ratio. </BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Yep =) that's why I said this in my post.  </DIV>

[Mystild]

<P>4100-5k ice comet with around 280 int or whatever?</P> <P>Is this at adept 3 or master? I know on live master IC does about 3700-4500 (god I wish I had that).</P>

[Za'Had]

<P>I must have been one of the only wiz's that did not complain. I know warlocks did more DPS and threre were problems with epic mob resists.</P> <P>Now what is the result of all this :</P> <P>1) Wiz DPS got up (and perhaps Warlock DPS got nerfd)</P> <P>2) Our single most usefull solo spell (RoC) is killed, slashed, butchered</P> <P>Do you know what happens if a yellow fighter mob hits a Light Armor (even Rare) sucker twice ?</P>

[Nacoa]

<span><blockquote><hr>Za'Hadum wrote:<p>Do you know what happens if a yellow fighter mob hits a Light Armor (even Rare) sucker twice ?</p> <div></div><hr></blockquote></span><span>One thing to keep in mind: The con system was supposed to change too, so that it was much closer to reality (as in yellows are supposed to be hard).  So even with the DPS boost, we really shouldn't be expecting to solo yellows easily anymore....or for that matter, any 'heroic' mobs.</span><div></div>

[Sotha]

<DIV>Well i dont know what you guys have been hearing, but ive heard from a warlock on the test server that he now does more damage than before. Im not fussed, aslong as we do approx equal im a happy man. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Any info in epic resists?</DIV>

[Tar~Palantir]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> stepha72 wrote:<BR> <P>I agree this is totally unnecessary.  I think most wizards out there would agree we were hoping for more of a balance.  But, I personally was hoping they would do this without nerfing.  I know this was a dream but it was what I was hoping.  I just hope that when all is said and done both groups are happy with the class they chose.  </P> <P>Tar~Palantir grow up.  <FONT color=#66ff00>Your goal should have been to work towards wizards getting fixed not for Warlocks getting nerfed.  </FONT></P> <P> </P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>The end has justified the means.</DIV>

[IllusiveThoughts]

any word on the power costs? were they adjusted?

[Tar~Palantir]

<DIV><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Mystildur wrote:<BR> <P>4100-5k ice comet with around 280 int or whatever?</P> <P>Is this at adept 3 or master? I know on live master IC does about 3700-4500 (god I wish I had that).</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV><BR>I am also interested to see how noticeable our int effects spells. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This completely justifies the hours myself and others spent browsing the broekr for int gear.</DIV>

[trysta]

<span><blockquote><hr>IllusiveThoughts wrote:any word on the power costs? were they adjusted? <div></div><hr></blockquote>As far as I can tell, they did absolutely nothing to power costs. HOWEVER, they did nerf our power harvesting lines pretty badly. Naedra's is now on the same timer as the Painful Meditation line. Vital Flow now only returns ~120 power at Adept I. Vitalic Harvest is now a power over time spell, that not only stuns you, but slowly drains away your health in return for 15 power every 4 seconds or so. Now we are not only stunning and cannibalizing in between battles, but also during battles just to stay as effective as we can.</span><div></div>

[DI2AG]

<div></div><div></div>changes look nice but i liked the dps i could get out of stacking single target debuffs on mobs <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> anyways i got 366 int self buffed so my dps should be pretty sweet <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> any word on changes for ice comet? damage on the master 1 if possible <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> and sif take ring of cold and root stacking away, solo'ing iceberg was much fun. AND GOD DAMNIT FIX PROTOFLAME ALREADY! an adept III lvl 48 spell and it does 10 dps, i would of thought it'd be one of the first to be fixed when combat changes were released on test *sigh* <p>Message Edited by DI2AGON on <span class=date_text>08-05-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:58 PM</span>

[Cecil_Stri]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> DI2AGON wrote:<BR> changes look nice but i liked the dps i could get out of stacking single target debuffs on mobs <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR><BR>anyways i got 366 int self buffed so my dps should be pretty sweet <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> any word on changes for ice comet? damage on the master 1 if possible <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><BR><BR>and sif take ring of cold and root stacking away, solo'ing iceberg was much fun. AND GOD DAMNIT FIX PROTOFLAME ALREADY! an adept III lvl 48 spell and it does 10 dps, i would of thought it'd be one of the first to be fixed when combat changes were released on test *sigh*<BR><BR><BR><BR> <P>Message Edited by DI2AGON on <SPAN class=date_text>08-05-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>10:58 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Alot of our int buffs were nerfed.. and removed</DIV>

[Dejah]

<DIV>Here's those few screen grabs I took that have spell descriptions:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><A href="http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000070.jpg" target=_blank>http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000070.jpg</A></DIV> <DIV><A href="http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000071.jpg" target=_blank>http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000071.jpg</A></DIV> <DIV><A href="http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000072.jpg" target=_blank>http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000072.jpg</A></DIV> <DIV><A href="http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000073.jpg" target=_blank>http://web.syr.edu/~lgkelly/eq2/EQ2_000073.jpg</A></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I hope a high level wizard could take screen grabs of all the spells so that we can see the real dmg/resist/etc values.</DIV>

[The-Plethora]

<div></div>Ice comet 33 - 44 damage? not the best description. I really like the sound of these upgrades and I think its only right that ring of cold got the nerf being able to solo 50^^ stuff without getting hit probably was not intended but I will miss it though. Our AOE sounds like it got a huge upgrade so it might be time to upgrade those. Hope my level 8 storm of lightning master 1 hasnt got a level limit <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> any details on this spell? also any details on conflagration? this has always felt a bit of a low hitter for me even at the level its intended for (have AD3) Paralyse now looks like its going to be an excellent spell, it was already a lifesaver as it is and fiery pulse the upgrade to plasmatic pulse looks to have got  a well needed upgrade as it was pretty much beaten by level 15 ice spike. Some things I dont like The AOEs (Apart from storm of lightning) are all upgrades of previous spells and you would expect they will continue to get new versions of these so any rare you use to make these spells adept 3's will feel a little wasted when its beaten by the app 1 version of the upgrade. I think there should be a work around on some spells. A lot of people still like using freeze or its upgrade but it wont hit anything over 34/35 it would be nice if it still did the damage but didnt root enemies over that level and so not make them useless. Its nice to throw something other than ice comat, immolation and ball of flames into the mix every now and then. From what I can see enfeeblement now does not have a level limit? and inflicts 0 - 1 damage on opponent? whats the use of 1 damage or am I missing something?. I would be interested in this as I have master 1 enfeeblement so feedback welcome. The power harvest lines all seem to tie in now. Painful meditation (I have master 1) was on a seperate timer to all other non stun conversion spells. Does this now share the same timer with our highest level non stun conversion?. Thanks for the heads up info and any help on the spells I mentioned would be appreciated <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Oh and the Magis shielding spell with its 70 point or whatever ward? Yeah thats really going to help the Kra Thuk hit me for 15905 damage yesterday.... <div></div><p>Message Edited by The-Plethora on <span class=date_text>08-06-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:59 AM</span>

[Stavenh]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> The-Plethora wrote:<BR> Ice comet 33 - 44 damage? <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>The person posting those screen shots aren't high enough level to see what they really do. Which really should be gone, since spells don't scale.<BR>

[Skwor]

<P>Overall very good changes <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. IMO it's more a return to eq 1 style of gameplay. Encounters are tougher and slower, mana management is an issue again for all classes(like it should imo), classes fill unique roles and for the most part they even match the SOE description for the class functions. This game could really get back up off the ground and run from here.</P> <P>Now if only they can fix the loot tables so named mobs and raid mobs drop some real loot.</P>

[goboy]

<P>To answer 3 specific questions:</P> <P>Sorry, I do not have time to capture pictures of all the spells.  I wish SOE would just post them on their boards.</P> <P>Incinerate:  26-32 damage - 26-31 every 3 seconds.  No debuff.</P> <P>Heat Convulsions:  75 damage, 75 every 2 seconds.  Chance to stifle.</P> <P> </P>

[curtlewis]

A non heroic yellow in teh current game is defeatable solo.  A ^^ nearly grey green mob usually is not.  A non heroic yellow mob barely moves my blue xp bar. So if yellows are a lot more work... I better see a [Removed for Content] JUMP in my xp bar. Especially since with the massive nerfage to our roots.  That's essentially killing ALL soloing for wizards.  Without the ability to layer roots and have roots that last more than 15 seconds, you're going to be tanking quite a bit.  And guess what?  Robes don't make very good plate armor, do they?  And let's not forget that all mob special abilites cannot be interrupted, but you can be.  And will be.  Often. Goodbye soloing.  Take out the Arena Champion now while you have a chance, guys.  If you haven't already. Sure, the bump in a few nukes is nice for grouping.  Of course, our only hate reducing spell got the hate reduction removed, so we'll draw aggro easier and not be able to remove it. I dont' care for these changes at all.  For a supposedly powerful class, we can't solo worth squat and lack any form of aggro control at all.  So if you cant' get in a grp with a tank that has a decent taunt (happens to me fairly often), go to sleep and nuke once or twice on the mob or you're going to die alot.  Of course, the grp will notice you aren't carrying your weight and you'll be groupless shortly. But that's ok, you can always go sol... oh... wait.... nm. I fail to see how this is a balancing.  It's a poorly thought out massive set of changes to the system. Time to cancel the acct... sigh... and I had such hope for this game.  It's SOE.  I shoulda known better.... <div></div>

[Keegant]

<DIV>So many people complained about leveling so fast, that it wouldnt suprise me if this stays the way you are expierencing it and it will take many many months to get a char to 50.</DIV>

[Sotha]

<DIV>Hmm what does it mean by (resist chance increased by 10%) exacly</DIV>

[cairnsb]

<P>I know it is a bit late but I do hope they rethink roots - especially Ring Of Cold.</P> <P>Sure there are wizards out there with 300+ int and able to solo a heroic 50^^ when they are lvl 40 (sarcasm).</P> <P>But I am a casual player...and my experience with this game has been a soloing nightmare for wizards. I end up grouping with friends for fun, and because wizard is near impossible to solo for any <STRONG>good</STRONG> xp.</P> <P>IOR - soloing was easy but tricky, frustrating that a goblin beats me up but I see other classes soloing bladefin without breaking a sweat.</P> <P>Tier 1 - solo was easy at times and hard at times, dependant on roots, lots of running away.</P> <P>Teir 2 - solo was ok at times and hard at time, dependant on roots, got very hard tward 20.</P> <P>Teir 3 - hard to solo, if the root breaks or resists a blue mob kills me in 2 to 3 hits...I hated this teir.</P> <P>Teir 4 - impossible to solo (unless I like fighting greens) at the start, get a little easier but not much- one hit from a blue basically kills me - if the root breaks or resists I might as well get coffee and run back to my shard...meanwhile other classes are soloing green ^^ (yes I know thats the whole point of these changes)...really glad I bought a horse...I canceled my account and played mages and shadow priest in World of Warcraft and loved them...got talked back into this game by friends. I am not a huge fan of blizzard but if it was not for friends in this game I would still be in w.o.w - note to self I have not canceled my w.o.w account - probably keep it active until I see the changes in this game.</P> <P>Teir 5 - To be honest, I was ready to delete my wizard until I got Ring of Cold...it is not perfect, but it roots long enough for me to kill it or decide to run - sometimes it resists, so far has only broken on heroic and epic encounters. And to be honest if I try a group of 2 mobs and one resists I find that I end up running...but at least I can solo now...kinda (I find that I miss my w.o.w mage more and more). For instance in Zek harvesting and accidently double clicked a grey orc that happend to walk buy - 1/2 my health was gone when he hit me once...I ended up running from a grey solo mob and bearly lived to tell the tale.</P> <P>Like I said I am not a super uber power gamer - all my equipment and spells are upgraded to lvl (tailor with sage and jeweler friends).</P> <P>I just think it is a bit unfair about the ROC duration being cut in half when I am already running for dear life...from grey mobs.</P> <P>Don't get me wrong, I am not the games worst player, I have defeated red mobs and even double ups prior to getting ring of cold.</P> <P>But those were pure luck, some very lucky HOs, and long long long long long (did I mention LONG) battles.</P> <P>It is just hard for a class that already dies in one or two hits to have its only defence (roots) nerfed or out right taken away.</P> <P>Lets face facts, most roots are a joke to begin with and looks like they are getting worse.</P> <P>As a side note I am happy to see the dps go up, now if only I could wear full plate and carry a huge sword :smileyvery-happy:</P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P> </P> <P>Message Edited by cairnsb on <SPAN class=date_text>08-07-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>03:53 AM</SPAN></P><p>Message Edited by cairnsb on <span class=date_text>08-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:54 AM</span>

[goboy]

<P>Another answer - protoflame:</P> <P>Protoflame does a maximum of 5 pts per hit.  Now for the interesting thing.  A couple of times, I was able to get the mob to attack protoflame (I had not nuked it yet).  Protoflame has a buttload of HP.  I have no idea how many since the minute expired before the mob beat it down below 95%.  It also has very good avoidance - it was getting hit 50% of the time.</P> <P>Now, when the minute expired - it damaged the mob for 240 points. </P> <P>Basically worthless to cast.</P> <P> </P>

[FrostP]

<P>Reading information from various posts including this one I have to say Im not looking forward to the changes....</P> <P>Firstly putting both BOF on the same timer is a backwards step they seperated the timers because we just couldn't do enough damage using only one. Sure they have added a few hundred extra damage to BoFlames but BoFire used to land for about 5-650 aswell as 7-900 with BoFlames So roughly speaking we seem to be losing about 2-300 damage from both spells by only having one slightly buffed up. Of course then you think if that one spell gets resisted thats also a complete resist where as two spells have twice the chance.</P> <P>Secondly reducing the timers and effectiveness of roots means we will more then likely root nuke then be forced to toe to toe exchange blows while being interupted, stifled, silenced and stunned between casts. We have poor defensive skills why are we being forced into tanking mobs more often by the root nerf, yes roots where effective but thats because if they arn't effective we die a lot. No parry, poor avoidence, poor mitigation and now we can't even keep enemies at arms length if we want to attack them it seems.</P> <P>Lowering our dot damage on Piercing Icicles and its duration dosn't sound good either, now we will have less of a window to debuff and take advantage of it before it wears off. </P> <P>Reducing power feed from instant to over time Im not sure what kind of effect that has, I can only imagine its like having a temporary Battlement of the mind buff or something but I dislike not being able to dump power onto a tank or priest in an emergency.</P> <P>I hate investing so much time and money in upgrading all my usefull and effective spells only to have ALL the spells redesigned just before the most crucial time (when we will need them to advance in DOF).</P>

[Cecil_Stri]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> FrostPaw wrote:<BR> <P>Reading information from various posts including this one I have to say Im not looking forward to the changes....</P> <P>Firstly putting both BOF on the same timer is a backwards step they seperated the timers because we just couldn't do enough damage using only one. Sure they have added a few hundred extra damage to BoFlames but BoFire used to land for about 5-650 aswell as 7-900 with BoFlames So roughly speaking we seem to be losing about 2-300 damage from both spells by only having one slightly buffed up. Of course then you think if that one spell gets resisted thats also a complete resist where as two spells have twice the chance.</P> <P>Secondly reducing the timers and effectiveness of roots means we will more then likely root nuke then be forced to toe to toe exchange blows while being interupted, stifled, silenced and stunned between casts. We have poor defensive skills why are we being forced into tanking mobs more often by the root nerf, yes roots where effective but thats because if they arn't effective we die a lot. No parry, poor avoidence, poor mitigation and now we can't even keep enemies at arms length if we want to attack them it seems.</P> <P>Lowering our dot damage on Piercing Icicles and its duration dosn't sound good either, now we will have less of a window to debuff and take advantage of it before it wears off. </P> <P>Reducing power feed from instant to over time Im not sure what kind of effect that has, I can only imagine its like having a temporary Battlement of the mind buff or something but I dislike not being able to dump power onto a tank or priest in an emergency.</P> <P>I hate investing so much time and money in upgrading all my usefull and effective spells only to have ALL the spells redesigned just before the most crucial time (when we will need them to advance in DOF).</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Flame strike is replaceing ball of flames.. it does about the same damage and has much much faster cool down and cast time<BR>

[goboy]

<DIV>Should have updated this sooner.  Immolation has a much faster cast/recast.  2 second cast and a 6 second recast. </DIV>

[Yadylia]

<P>Quote cairnsb: Teir 5 - To be honest, I was ready to delete my wizard until I got Ring of Cold...it is not perfect, but it roots long enough for me to kill it or decide to run</P> <P align=center>--------------------------------------------</P> <DIV>Same here, eventho I wasnt really thinking of deleting her I didnt like her that much, compared to many of my guildies she was very weak but I continued playing her hoping for better days, I finally started liking her when she got Ring of Cold, it changed everything, finally she *is/was* able to solo and feel halfway *powerful* as a wizzie should, especially since pure casters can't take hits the root helped a whole lot, now I read that not only are they nerfing my favorite and most useful root but also we are loosing parry, my next most useful root is also getting nerfed, not to mention the changes to buffs and dots, its just all very discouraging.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Also I was hoping you would make it slower from level 50 to level up but now you are penalizing everybody who are not level 50 yet just like you did with the tradeskill changes. </DIV>

[Tar~Palantir]

Penalizing people who ahve yet to experience a hallmark is SOE's trademark it seems.

[cairnsb]

<P>This game is kinda a switch from the norm...</P> <P>I mean most all game wizards and caster types are very weak at the beginning but we deal with that knowing that once we are higher level we are killing machines.</P> <P>I hate to compair this game to WOW but there is little to compair it to that will make my point obvious.</P> <P><STRONG>My WOW mage</STRONG> - low levels very hard died alot / at high levels most things die before they know what hit them. But it was a LONG grind before he came to power and was the<STRONG> bud of many jokes at lower levels</STRONG>.</P> <P><STRONG>My Eq 2 wizard</STRONG> - low levels very hard died alot / at higher levels things just get harder and I die before I know what hit me. And it was a VERY LONG grind just to be the <STRONG>bud of many jokes at higher levels</STRONG>...my wizard is nicknamed the "one hit wonder" - because he dies in one hit.</P> <P>(don't even get me going on healers...I have a high level shadow priest in WOW, and that my friends is a killing machine in every sence of the term)</P> <DIV>My point is that we deal with the cloth armor and lousy avoidance all the while hoping that once we hit the higher levels we are rewarded for months and months of hard work and constant death...only to find there is no reward at all, and what little compensation we had is being nerfed...reminds me of the jedi I had in SWG.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just does not seem like a fair trade off, and make me wonder why I still play this class...my zerker and assassin seem to be getting more and more attention, and I hate to say this but if they do not address these issues there will be a lot less caster types in game after the patch goes live.</DIV>

[blynchehaun]

Curtlewis: < And let's not forget that all mob special abilites cannot be interrupted, but you can be. > A Mobs specials can be Stifled. In the middle of T4: Benumb + Tongue Twiset = 14 seconds of no specials from mob. Include Stuns, and the mob doesn't get specials. assuming I wait to cast these til *after* my Root has broken, the mob doesn't last 20 seconds.... Either learn to play the game, or go whine elsewhere. Cairnsb: < impossible to solo (unless I like fighting greens) at the start, get a little easier but not much- one hit from a blue basically kills me - if the root breaks or resists I might as well get coffee and run back to my shard... > Perhaps if you outlined your strategy, the wizards on this board who find soloing to be really really <b>easy</b> in T4 could explain what you are doing wrong. Given that a Yellow (lvl 35) Orc in Zek specials for about 300-350, and I have 1500 HP, 1 hit from them is <b>standard</b>. "If root Breaks" - If? IF? Root will break. Root will *always* break. If Root didn't break, then Wizzies would have risk-free XP all the way to 50. Bbbbbbbbbbbbooooooooooooooooooorrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggg gggggg. <b>When</b> root breaks. As I cast every spell, my mouse immediately moves over to where Benumb/Freeze/Blazing Intimidation is parked. If the Root breaks at that point, they get hit with one of them. Usually Benumb. I don't really care about being hit for 80-100 per punch if I'm lining up for a couple stuns + Ball of Fire. I'm only going to be hit once or twice. Hot tip: A lvl 35 Sentient hits for *waaaay* more than a lvl 35 Animal. Yes, they are both yellow. But a Yellow Vallon Lugger isn't the same as a Yellow Sand Snapper. So much whinging on this board, it hurts..... Casting strategy for boring boring soloing: Frozen Manacles/Tether -> Heat Stroke -> Icy Coil -> Incinerate -> Freezing Whorl -> <font color="#ff3300">HO Starter -> BoFire -> Ice Spike -> Whatever. <font color="#ffffff">[repeat red bit as needed)</font></font> Benumb/Freeze/Tongue Twise/Blazing Intimidation as needed. Assuming low resists (and I rarely see 1 resist, nm more than that), this kills everything I've fought to date. I routinely fight my lvl +2 creatures, and occasionally my lvl +3. Soloed a group of 3 34-- Vallon Grunts in Zek today (white to me). Anyone who has issues soloing *blue* cons clearly hasn't a <b>clue </b>how to use the class. Brilyn. lvl 34 Wiz, proud owner of <b>zero </b>Fabled items and about 2 Adept 3 spells. Everything else, bog standard Adept 1 and App4. <div></div>

[Ghostbeard]

<span><blockquote><hr>curtlewis wrote: Goodbye soloing.  Take out the Arena Champion now while you have a chance, guys.  If you haven't already. I fail to see how this is a balancing.  It's a poorly thought out massive set of changes to the system. Time to cancel the acct... sigh... and I had such hope for this game.  It's SOE.  I shoulda known better.... <div></div><hr></blockquote> /amenbrother Ring of Cold is the spell that's made life as a Wizard bearable for many of us. It's a greed-grab - pure and simple. Someone has apparently gotten the (extremely misguided) idea that eliminating classes soloing abilities and forcing them into group situations is somehow going to grow server populations. Let me assure you that nothing could be further for the truth.  It will cause a mass exodus. I'm not going to cancel the account... UNTIL I see if the changes actually go live and see if they actually are misguided enough to nerf the one truly important spell we get. Maybe they won't actually do something this damaging. I believe them when they say they'll get the wizard changes right. They wouldn't lie to me <b>298</b> times in a row... <i>would</i> they? -GB- </span><div></div>

[curtlewis]

================================================== ====== blynchehaun said: A Mobs specials can be Stifled. In the middle of T4: Benumb + Tongue Twiset = 14 seconds of no specials from mob. Include Stuns, and the mob doesn't get specials. assuming I wait to cast these til *after* my Root has broken, the mob doesn't last 20 seconds.... Either learn to play the game, or go whine elsewhere. ================================================== ====== Spells yes.  Specials, no.  At least that's what tanks tell me... that their specials are uninterruptible. ========================================== "If root Breaks" - If? IF? Root will break. Root will *always* break. If Root didn't break, then Wizzies would have risk-free XP all the way to 50. Bbbbbbbbbbbbooooooooooooooooooorrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnggggggggggggggg gggggg. <b>When</b> root breaks. ========================================== RoC has never broken on me.  Although it does expire a few seconds early everytime based on it's icon in the maintained spells bar. Other roots either break on the first nuke or MAY break when the mob takes damage.  At least now... apparently that may be changing????? ========================================== Casting strategy for boring boring soloing: Frozen Manacles/Tether -> Heat Stroke -> Icy Coil -> Incinerate -> Freezing Whorl -> <font color="#ff3300">HO Starter -> BoFire -> Ice Spike -> Whatever. <font color="#ffffff">[repeat red bit as needed)</font></font> ========================================== After Heat stroke you cast, the root most likely is broken.  Even Incinerate breaks Frozen Manacles often on me.  Also note that the debuffing spells you use only last 24 seconds and you're wasting quite a bit of time casting them and risking a root break.    A more advisable spell chain would be: root-->Immolation--> Init HO --> Ball of Flames--> Ball of Fire (or Icy Coil depending on HO) --> retrigger HO and repeat cycle adding in a quick nuke if the HO hasn't refreshed yet.  This works quite nicely if you have Ring of Cold.  If you don't, Blazing Intimidation is great to stun them long enough to allow you to recast the root.  At least once.  If it breaks again... well... My previous comments about roots may be invalid based on new information.  The original post has been updated to indicate that roots don't break when you nuke now.  This means you can alternate roots (at least 2 of them once you get RoC).  There is the problem of two 15 sec roots and a 45 sec recast.  IE: 15 secs of 2 hits and you're dead.  You can buy 3 sec with a stun (supposedly 6 with paralyze, but that's the fastest 6 sec I've ever seen).  Not sure where you're going to get another 12 seconds..  And this is WITHOUT resists.  So unless you can DROP the mob in 15 seconds (3 nukes), it's gonna be pretty tough in the new world. However, in grouping our new challenge will be aggro management.  But I'll bet that my LFG tag won't be up long with the improved dmg output.  That will certainly be nice.  But that still won't let me beat the Pit Champ. <div></div>

[cairnsb]

<P>It is not whinning - it is pointing out the obvious...</P> <P>We do not want to be a utility class.</P> <P>Because our roots are horrible pre-ring of cold we end up becomming a utility class.</P> <P>Once we get ring of cold, we can solo a bit...not nearly as easy as other classes.</P> <P>Now the upcomming changes are forcing us into a utility class from 1 to 50 (soon to be 60) or become very very good at the following technique....</P> <P>Root</P> <P>DOT</P> <P>Nuke</P> <P>Get Hit</P> <P>Root</P> <P>DOT</P> <P>NUKE</P> <P>DIE</P> <P>Run to shard with a LFG tag up</P> <P> </P>

[trysta]

<span><blockquote><hr>curtlewis wrote: However, in grouping our new challenge will be aggro management.  But I'll bet that my LFG tag won't be up long with the <b>improved dmg output.</b>  That will certainly be nice.  But that still won't let me beat the Pit Champ. <div></div><hr></blockquote>Wrong. Since they removed practically everyone's debuff abilities (especially ours - we only have one debuff, piercing icicles, that only debuffs for 472), I'm parsing numbers that are <b>LOWER </b>than the numbers I see in live.</span><div></div>

[Dramadon]

<div></div>One thing I'm tired of hearing people cry about. When you target a mob, and it has a ^ or ^^ and says "heroic" in the target box (assuming you are using the advanced targeting system), that means the <b>mob was not intended to be soloed</b>. There are mobs in the game that say "solo". These are the mobs that are intended to be soloed. Quit crying because you can no longer kill a yellow, ^^, heroic mob solo. You were never supposed to be able to kill those in the first place. And, this isn't just a wizard problem, all classes are crying about this (most notably Pallies). <div></div><p>Message Edited by Dramadon on <span class=date_text>08-07-2005</span> <span class=time_text>06:53 PM</span>

[blynchehaun]

< Spells yes.  Specials, no.  At least that's what tanks tell me... that their specials are uninterruptible. > The tanks are *wrong*. In Zek, vs Tallon Grunts, or whatever: They throw out a 300pt Barrage. Or Seamist Faeries throw out Wild Swing for x damage. Specials. While Stifled, they <b>can't</b> use their specials. Spells & Combat Arts = Specials. < Other roots either break on the first nuke or MAY break when the mob takes damage. > Clearly I play a magical game where Frozen Manacles doesn't break on the first nuke. (Frozen Manacles: Adept 3) The only Root that breaks *every* time is Tether, and it says so in the description. It drops to a 9-second 'might break' root once the mob takes damage. < After Heat stroke you cast, the root most likely is broken. > Nope. I've seen it break *once* after Heat Stroke, in the last 2 levels or so (ie almost never). < Even Incinerate breaks Frozen Manacles often on me. > Again: nope. No one spell breaks Frozen Manacles any more than any others. < Also note that the debuffing spells you use only last 24 seconds and you're wasting quite a bit of time casting them and risking a root break. > So what? I mean, I have plenty of time to cast Benumb or Blazing Intimidation while the mob runs to me. At which point I cease debuffing (the DoTs on the Debuffs add up to a decent amount of damage by the by), and nuke the target into the ground. End result: mob dead. I'm not seeing the problem here. Nor am I seeing how a single hit from a Blue mob kills you? <div></div>

[Marvolo62442]

<P>I tend to do something similar, except I can never use Blazing Intimidation, as it seems to resist 90% of the time for me.</P> <P>But when you tether someone, you can always get your first DoT in, I go</P> <P>Tether - Freezing Wind - Heat Stroke - Icy Coil - HO - Ice Spike - Plasmatic Pulse - Stun/Stifle - Ball of Fire - repeat HO until mob dies</P> <P>This is for a lvl 34 Wizzy, I kill yellow solo mobs fairly easily with this, usually end up at around 1/2-3/4 health. Root usually breaks while I'm casting Icy Coil, though they don't usually get to me before I get the spell off. Ice Spike & Plasmatic Pulse(hope they've fixed this one) are fast casting spells, so I can get a HO off in a very short space of time before I need to stun the mob.</P> <DIV>I use Freezing Wind first because I have a Master of it. Creatures in EL are MUCH easier than Orcs in Zek, and the xp is exactly the same, though the loot is generally better in Zek.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh, and by the looks of it, only effects like stun/mez/root can be resisted anymore, DD and DoT's CANNOT be resisted, as Spell Avoidance no longer exists as a skill.</DIV>

[blynchehaun]

Why Freezing Wind first? I use Heat Stroke because it's a *[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]* long casting time.... <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Minor-Wish list: I'd like an Icon for Heat Stroke, and some explicit and obvious indicator that the Mob is Stifled (spotting the little green thing isn't easy much of the time). < Plasmatic Pulse > Anyone notice that the DoT is going off on that more than often? I was using it about 2 weeks back, and the DoT was going off 50-60% of the time. *Still* not enough (Heat Stroke replaced it on my hotbar), but it seems someone tinkered with it. Can anyone on Test take a look at Plasmatic Pulse? < I use Freezing Wind first because I have a Master of it. > Nice. Me, I'd still use it second. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> < <b>Creatures in EL are MUCH easier than Orcs in Zek, and the xp is exactly the same, though the loot is generally better in Zek</b>. > QFE. < DD and DoT's CANNOT be resisted, as Spell Avoidance no longer exists as a skill. > Hmmm... not too sure if that's intended. Don't get me wrong, it'll be nice to see a full line of my DoTs/Debuffs on every creature everytime, but *zero* resists on those? Sounds too good to be true..... <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[adamflanagan]

<span><blockquote><hr>Marvolo62442 wrote: <div> </div> <div>Oh, and by the looks of it, only effects like stun/mez/root can be resisted anymore, DD and DoT's CANNOT be resisted, as Spell Avoidance no longer exists as a skill.</div><hr></blockquote>Spell avoidance had NOTHING to do with resists... of course MOBs will be able to resist spells! If resists are calculted the same for PCs as NPCs the most a spell acn be resisted will be 80%.</span><div></div>

[brow27]

Spell Avoidance had nothing to do with resists?!  WRONG!  Your casting skill is checked against their spell avoidance to determine chances of a resist.  How it will work after the revamp I do not know, but that is how it works now. <div></div>

[Alfgand]

<P>I see some people happy with the DPS boost and a bunch of people quite worried about the nerf to roots.</P> <P>The nerf to roots does scare me. </P> <P>My question is how far down the road to the final revamp are we?</P> <P>Can I assume this is just the first pass at the changes and maybe quite a bit of "adjustment" will occur yet before it goes live?</P>

[trysta]

<blockquote><hr>Alfgand wrote:<div></div><p>I see some people happy with the DPS boost and a bunch of people quite worried about the nerf to roots.</p><hr></blockquote>One thing that I've pointed out before is that although they have increased the damage on our nukes, they have removed almost ALL of our ability to debuff. Other classes also have taken severe hits to their debuff ability. Because of this nerf, our nukes are hitting actually LOWER than they do on live servers.

[Marvolo62442]

<DIV>My apologies, I didn't make myself clear. Namely because EQ2 uses the same word for magic mitigation as it does for total avoidance of a spell.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I said we didn't have to worry about our DD & DoT spells being resisted, I meant being totally avoided. As in, the word "Resisted" comes up above the mobs head.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Of course, the other "resists" are still there.. we still have to worry about them..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>-------</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Oh, and Freezing Wind has the same casting time as Heat Stroke, 4 secs. And as my Master Freezing Wind does more damage than my Adept III Heat Stroke, it gets cast first. I'd cast Icy Coil next, as it's also more powerful than Heat Stroke, but as it can be cast much faster, it goes 3rd. Freezing Wind (and I presume later on, Icy Wind) is a must when fighting the group type mobs, as it's an AoE DoT. Wish we had more of em...</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I do hope they take another look at debuffs, by the sound of it, they've seriously overnerfed that aspect of our class.</DIV>

[blynchehaun]

< Oh, and Freezing Wind has the same casting time as Heat Stroke, 4 secs. > Ah, I didn't check the casting time on it, as I mainly just use it against groups. A long casting time in groups suits me just fine. The longer the cast, the more hate the Tank has built up by the time the spell finishes..... <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> < Freezing Wind (and I presume later on, Icy Wind) is a must when fighting the group type mobs, as it's an AoE DoT. Wish we had more of em... > Totally agree. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[stepha72]

Not only is icy wind an AoE DoT but it is also a debuff.  I hope it does not change for the new combat system.  I really love this spell.  It is very useful

[trysta]

Yes, it has changed. It's now similar to what Immolation is, but it's a group spell. The debuff portion of this spell has been removed.

[stepha72]

So what debuffs will we have at level 50?  Just piercing icicles?  My ice comet works so much better and so do most of my other spells when I use the debuff first.  So do we not need debuffs anymore?  Did they add more debuffs?

[Cecil_Stri]

<P>All combat arts and spells no longer work if the mob is stifled... By specials the tank proly ment stuff like King drayeks special kick.. dragon breath.. ect.. all epic mobs special attacks go through but things like crushing blow...  quick strike ect do not work when stifled.</P> <P> </P> <P>Wizards are still powerful.. we can't solo double ups anymore but most classes can't.  Insteed of using root to perma root a mob its gonna take abit more effort and tactics...  Like for example stuns (which does a hefty amount of damage now) ice comet (which stuns and knocks back)... For solo group encounters like in splitpaw we have very very nice AoEs now.</P> <P> </P> <P>Till you ACTUALLY play these changes you shouldn't make assuptions that wizards are just horrinble.  </P>

[trysta]

<blockquote><hr>Cecil_Strife wrote:<P>All combat arts and spells no longer work if the mob is stifled... By specials the tank proly ment stuff like King drayeks special kick.. dragon breath.. ect.. all epic mobs special attacks go through but things like crushing blow...  quick strike ect do not work when stifled.</P> <P> </P> <P>Wizards are still powerful.. we can't solo double ups anymore but most classes can't.  Insteed of using root to perma root a mob its gonna take abit more effort and tactics...  Like for example stuns (which does a hefty amount of damage now) ice comet (which stuns and knocks back)... For solo group encounters like in splitpaw we have very very nice AoEs now.</P> <P> </P> <P>Till you ACTUALLY play these changes you shouldn't make assuptions that wizards are just horrinble.  </P> <hr></blockquote>Hi, I HAVE played these changes, and I am TELLING you they are just horrible. They nerfed our debuffs, but most of all they nerfed our roots. Sure, you might be able to get a Paralyze in there now, but with increased Stifles, Interruptions, and removal of our parry ability we're dead before we can even get the paralyze off. Ring of Cold now breaks on damage, lasts 12 seconds, and has a 45 second recast timer. The only other root we have lasts 12 seconds, has chance to break on damage, and has a recast timer of 16 seconds. Whereas an Enchanter can now keep a Red mob charmed for an extremely long duration and use it as a pet, we now can no longer keep a GRAY rooted for more than 12 seconds.<p>Message Edited by trystaad on <span class=date_text>08-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:48 PM</span>

[cairnsb]

<DIV>Because I am a higher level wizard, I have "see future adept III".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If these changes went live, there will be fewer "finger wigglers" after the patch.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wizard will become like the enchanter class - meaning you only see a wizard once in a blue moon, they are typically very low level, or are at 50th level and they just logged in so they can craft items for their alt, or they are in a raiding guild, or they just like to feel pain and dispair.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There will be fewer mid level wizards - because lets face it.... mid level wizards had it bad before the patch.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There will be 5 instances of the Isle of Refugee...please note that the majority of the people there will be ex-wizards, ex-warlocks, ex-zerkers, ex-rangers.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Personally I am glad they are changing some things, but I wish they would just fix the broken things and leave everything else alone.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This patch, like so many other "combat revamps" in other MMO games is a time sink and nothing more.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There will be a period of less complaints - until we have all had time to find the new bugs introduced by this patch....and then there will be patches for the patch...and possibly a 2nd and 3rd revamp.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> trystaad wrote:<BR><BR><BR>Hi, I HAVE played these changes, and I am TELLING you they are just horrible. They nerfed our debuffs, but most of all they nerfed our roots. Sure, you might be able to get a Paralyze in there now, but with increased Stifles, Interruptions, and removal of our parry ability we're dead before we can even get the paralyze off. Ring of Cold now breaks on damage, lasts 12 seconds, and has a 45 second recast timer. The only other root we have lasts 12 seconds, has chance to break on damage, and has a recast timer of 16 seconds. Whereas an Enchanter can now keep a Red mob charmed for an extremely long duration and use it as a pet, we now can no longer keep a GRAY rooted for more than 12 seconds. <P>Message Edited by trystaad on <SPAN class=date_text>08-08-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>12:48 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>ROC does not break on damage - it has the potential to break on damage.  I have had it break on the first nuke, I have also had it last the whole time through my nuking.   </P> <P>I play Jaly on test (49 wizard).  I have been parsing our avoidance vs 46-52 level solo mobs.  Starting at yellow, they hit a bit hard so I don't mess with them too much.  White and below, I normally let them eat me for a minute before I kill them.  There is no real reason to root a solo mob - they are weak as all hell.  This is in both EF and LS.  I actually think solo mobs are too weak.  Most of my fights last 12-15 seconds if I go all out.</P> <P>Now, heroic mobs will rip me a new one.  I don't even try soloing them any longer.  No class was ever suppossed to be able to solo heroic mobs, it is something we will have to adjust to.  </P> <P>The problem is with duo's.  How is a non-tank duo (or trio) suppossed to kill a mob?  Heroic mobs have more hps (I believe this regardless of what the devs have said), they hit harder then normal mobs and miss less often.</P> <P>Jaly</P> <P><BR> </P>

[Tar~Palantir]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> cairnsb wrote:<BR> <DIV>Because I am a higher level wizard, I have "see future adept III".</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If these changes went live, there will be fewer "finger wigglers" after the patch.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wizard will become like the enchanter class - meaning you only see a wizard once in a blue moon, they are typically very low level, or are at 50th level and they just logged in so they can craft items for their alt, or they are in a raiding guild, or they just like to feel pain and dispair.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There will be fewer mid level wizards - because lets face it.... mid level wizards had it bad before the patch.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There will be 5 instances of the Isle of Refugee...please note that the majority of the people there will be ex-wizards, ex-warlocks, ex-zerkers, ex-rangers.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Personally I am glad they are changing some things, but I wish they would just fix the broken things and leave everything else alone.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This patch, like so many other "combat revamps" in other MMO games is a time sink and nothing more.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>There will be a period of less complaints - until we have all had time to find the new bugs introduced by this patch....and then there will be patches for the patch...and possibly a 2nd and 3rd revamp.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>On a personal level, fewer wizards gives those of us who will tough it out a sense of.....gratification.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Practically, this could hurt the game even more.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I agree there probably will be 5 instances of the isle of refuge and guess what, people will realize no class is better off than the wiz, warlock etc they just abandoned.  And guess what, they'll then abandon the game entirely.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Edit: what kind of sick freaks tail me for months 1 starring.  </DIV><p>Message Edited by Tar~Palantir on <span class=date_text>08-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:24 PM</span>

[cairnsb]

<HR> Tar~Palantir wrote:<BR>agree there probably will be 5 instances of the isle of refuge and guess what, people will realize no class is better off than the wiz, warlock etc they just abandoned.  And guess what, they'll then abandon the game entirely. <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <P>I agree with that, my biggest issue that SOE has a tendancy to ... well... let be blunt...not test things enough.</P> <P>You are right this is a sink or swim situation for SOE, but there will always (and I mean always) be those die hard players that will stay with a game through thick and thin no matter how bad things are.</P> <P>Just hoping they test this and test it over and over and over - after all we could be having this conversation again in six months if they decide this combat revamp failed and they need a new one.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[curtlewis]

If RoC is breaking on damage.. /bug it on the Test server. Based on what <a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=2" target=_blank>Moorguard posted</a> it shouldn't be and neither should any other root for that matter. This offsets the shared timer issues and the shorter duration (somewhat). It will be more comforting to know that if you cast a root and the mob stops in its tracks that you have 15 sec (or however long they'll wind up lasting - I'd vote fore 24 sec personally... like THAT will happen)."Root, stun, stifle, fear, and mez spells are now either resisted or not based on the target's resistance to the damage type of that spell. Duration is no longer mitigated, so if the spell successfully lands, it sticks for the full duration."<p>Message Edited by curtlewis on <span class=date_text>08-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:10 PM</span>

[trysta]

Actually, they changed Ring of Cold. In the spell description itself, it says that "every hostile spell or damage received by the target has a chance at breaking the effect." Still only lasts 15 seconds with a 45 second recast. <div></div>

[vkingsofnfl]

<DIV>Stepha72 I know you only had the Warlocks feelings in mind but I disagree. Although I dont think rejocing a class getting nerfed is something I would do. I do believe that Sony made the right choice. I have found EQ2 very chananging as a wizard (lvl47 now) and I would not want Sony to make it any eaiser else I may lose interest. Anyway what I am saying is this given that Sony should have made the 2 classes even I believe that Nerfing the Warlock is a better way to go because if you made us more powerful you would just have to do the same to all the creatures of Norath.<BR></DIV> <DIV>Anyway thats my 2 cents and Warlocks trust me you will have more fun if you can't steam roll everything you come across.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Edit: Humm it looks like the message I was replying to does not show up in my post automaticly....anyway this is a reply to the last message on the 1st page.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by vkingsofnfl on <span class=date_text>08-08-2005</span> <span class=time_text>10:18 PM</span>

[Marvolo62442]

Don't know why anyone would think a mid-level Wizard would struggle, sure, we get no Nukes from lvl 27 until lvl 35, but I've not had any real problems soloing. But I can still level 4x faster than I did with my SK. Sure, it'll get harder after the combat changes, but I very much doubt it will make a big difference. The big change is that you can't solo heroic mobs anymore, and you never should have been able to. The nerf to roots was inevitable, we should never have had the ability to perma-root in the first place. <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wizards and Warlocks are still going to be the highest DPS class in the game, and if they modify the raid mobs resists correctly, we'll be able to do a lot more in that respect as well.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Hardly anyone has noticed the one big change, spells can no longer be avoided, by us or the mobs. Only effects can be avoided, like mez, root, fear, stun, etc. You can't avoid a DD spell. That means everytime you launch that Ball of Flames, all that matters is how much that mob can mitigate, he can't avoid it completely anymore.</DIV>

[QQ-Fatman]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> curtlewis wrote:<BR>If RoC is breaking on damage.. /bug it on the Test server. Based on what <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=2" target=_blank>Moorguard posted</A> it shouldn't be and neither should any other root for that matter. This offsets the shared timer issues and the shorter duration (somewhat). It will be more comforting to know that if you cast a root and the mob stops in its tracks that you have 15 sec (or however long they'll wind up lasting - I'd vote fore 24 sec personally... like THAT will happen).<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>"Root, stun, stifle, fear, and mez spells are now either resisted or not based on the target's resistance to the damage type of that spell. Duration is no longer mitigated, so if the spell successfully lands, it sticks for the full duration." <P>Message Edited by curtlewis on <SPAN class=date_text>08-08-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>05:10 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>You misunderstood what he said. Root spells now on live server can be mitigated. For example: Ring of Cold has a 36sec duration. If a mob has high cold resistance (let's say maybe 50%), RoC breaks at 18sec. The change is actually to make the duration not to be affected by target's resistance.<BR> <DIV>Roots that may break if the target takes damage will still break under this change. Ring of Cold on the test server has been made a breakable root (1/2 chance lower than other roots, however.)</DIV>

[curtlewis]

I didn't misunderstand what he said.  Here's the important part: "if the spell successfully lands, it sticks for the full duration." It didn't say, if the spell lands, it sticks for the full duration unless the moon is blue and it's tuesday (or the target receives damage). If it's behaving as intended, they should correctly state the behavior.  I'd /bug it anyways to make sure they're aware of either the behavior difference or the documentation problem. If all of our roots are 15 sec AND break on nukage... that's just ridiculous.  It'll be nigh impossible to solo with roots that would NEVER break since the durations have been 'nuked.' Come on Sony... PLAY a [Removed for Content] wizard.  Just cuz that Bard in EQ1 got owned by a wizard in PVP doesn't mean wizards are overpowered.  It probably means he sucks at playing his class and has a childish vendetta. <div></div>

[myaz]

<P>I've been eagerly awaiting the combat changes so we wizzys can finally deal out the damage that we should have been doing from day one but reading through some of these changes, I'm sitting here scratching my head worrying I'm going to quit playing entierely.</P> <P>Nuke upgrades - great, we need a damage boost.  Now if I can just nuke an epic mob on a raid I'll be happy :smileyvery-happy:</P> <P>Roots - I figured RoC would be nerfed as it was a powerful spell but before RoC, I had a difficult time soloing anything.  I have never tried soloing a ^^ that was near or above my level as these mobs are heroic and shouldn't be able to be soloed. Now, with the changes, it seems I won't even be able to take on a group of greys or a ^^ thats 15 levels lower than me.  I enjoy soloing, it has been a big part of the game for me.  It seems that will be out the window. </P> <P>Debuffs - what's up with making them nearly useless?  It sounds like Icy Wind will be good and that is it.</P> <P>Buffs - why nerf these?  Why make 1 buff take 3 consentration points?  I just don't get it.</P> <P>Mana regen - why are these now linked??  They sound nearly worhless now...stupid.</P> <DIV>I just don't get the nerfs and then the increase to damage.  Some of these changes are very disappointing.  I hope things change as the tests continue.  I enjoy playing and I do love the wizzy but some of the changes I've been reading about make me worry about the future of wizzy's in general. </DIV><p>Message Edited by myaz69 on <span class=date_text>08-09-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:29 PM</span>

[Keegant]

Myaz, dont forget to take in the other parts of the change and not just the numbers on our spells. Solo mobs are easier and group mobs are tougher. From what I am reading you dont need roots to take solo mobs of white or less.  Grey mobs, even heroic grey mobs will be cake as con color greatly affects a mob being able to hit you. So yes, you will be able to take ^^^ mobs 15 levels below you.

[brow27]

I know things are much easier on the Island of Refuge, but I was able to solo the ^^ goblins that were there without too much trouble.  The fact that Arcane Bindings is 2 second cast now is very nice.  I was NOT able to take named ^^s.  I think the reason I was actually able to take the ^^ gobs is twofold:  First reason, a ^^ is now a 'small group' mob, for 2-3 adventurers, and a mob for a group of 6 is a ^^^.  The other reason I think I was able to do good was because of Magi's Shielding.  It gives you a ward, more health, physical resists, and +5 defense.   +5 defense at low levels is HUGE.  It doesn't scale as you go up thought, at least from what I've seen.  Also I'm a Froggie there, so I had good agility. As far as solo mobs go, I was able to take whites fairly easily, as well as a yellow 1-down.  Both no-arrow and 1-down mobs are considered solo, though I'm not sure as to the difference in difficulty between the two. <div></div>

[trysta]

<span><blockquote><hr>Keegantir wrote:Myaz, dont forget to take in the other parts of the change and not just the numbers on our spells. Solo mobs are easier and group mobs are tougher. From what I am reading you dont need roots to take solo mobs of white or less.  Grey mobs, even heroic grey mobs will be cake as con color greatly affects a mob being able to hit you. So yes, you will be able to take ^^^ mobs 15 levels below you. <div></div><hr></blockquote>Where are you finding that solo mobs are easier? I have difficulties taking down level 46 solo mobs with this combat revamp, and I'm level 50...</span><div></div>

[brow27]

how are you having so much trouble trystaad?  Seems like a cast of Ice Comet, BoF, then immolation should do the trick on a level 46 mob <div></div>

[goboy]

<P>Trystaad are you on test or in beta?  And could you tell me if you were in beta heh.</P> <P>I am on test, level 49 wizard - 204 intelligence and am killin solo mobs with zero problem.  These mobs are in EF and LS.  My normal routine, pull a mob with Icy Wind and let it eat me for a minute.  After it chews on me for a minute I kill it off.  The reason for this is I am trying to parse avoidance - I think it is wrong.</P> <P>I have yet to find a blue-white mob that I cannot do this with.  Now, level 46 mobs should be dam near insta kill for you with Ice Comet.  Most of the level 46 mobs I am killing in EF/LS have around 4k hp.  What mobs are you soloing that are giving you problems?  Maybe I need to try a differnce place of operation to see how they work out.</P> <P>My gear is average with one good item (Robe of the invoker).  Everything else is Tundra Walker or quested.</P> <P>My avoidance is listed at 27.5% (yeah right) and mitigation at 26%.  Intelligence is 204 (buffed).</P> <P>Jaly, 49 wizard test.</P>

[Akira]

<DIV>Heres a question I have about a few spells:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Piercing Icicles: Worth upgrading from adept 1 to adept 3? Dmg sucks I heard but is there still a mitigation debuff?</DIV> <DIV>Fiery Pulse: I have not read about this spell yet (I think). Is there a big damage upgrade like inferno on it also and is it worth upgrading to adept 3 also?</DIV> <DIV>Enfeeblement: Worth upgrading from app 4 to adept 3? I know paralyze is with its new damage</DIV> <DIV>Augmentation: worth upgrading to adept 3? its not right now.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Essential Intro/Vitalic Harvest/Vital flow: any of these worth upgrading to adept 3 also?</DIV>

[myaz]

<P>True Keeg, thanks for the heads up.  I was rushing through my post as my boss decided to hang out in front of my desk for a while and I didn't get to go back and study some more posts or edit mine. :smileywink:  I love my wizard and have solo'd a ton in this game which I enjoy doing when I'm not with the guild on a raid or such.  I would hate to see that aspect of our characters fade away with the class changes.  The only thing I thought our class really needed was a slight increase in damage and the ability to be more than just a "mana battery" on raids, since most of our spells don't seem to effect epic mobs...i.e. paralyze, enfeeblement, cold/heat immune mobs, etc.. oh and of course making Protoflame more than just a useless icon in our spellbooks :smileyhappy:  It seems like they are nerfing us more than I expected I guess.</P> <P>Shadowrising Overmoon - 50 Wizard (The Atratus Brootherhood)</P>

[Mystild]

<P>I don't know what everyone is complaining about. Yeah, we're getting nerfed a bit, ROC mainly... but dont you think a 36 second permanent root was a bit overpowered anyway?</P> <P>I'm no wizzy fanboy. Or at least, I wasn't until I read about these changes. Our DPS is going to be changed where it should be - and that's all that's important.</P>

[Cecil_Stri]

<DIV>Nothing is getting nerfed cept our parry and root.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thing are getting moved around but in general our damage increased by a ton.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe the people having problems aren't increasing spells quality?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dunno</DIV>

[Conequis]

<span><blockquote><hr>Cecil_Strife wrote:<div>Nothing is getting nerfed cept our parry and root.</div> <div> </div> <div>Thing are getting moved around but in general our damage increased by a ton.</div> <div> </div> <div>Maybe the people having problems aren't increasing spells quality?</div> <div> </div> <div>I dunno</div><hr></blockquote>The problem is that while our damage on the spells is being increased, our ability to debuff is being decreased which also decreased the overall damage.  so it does no good to increase spell damage if we can't debuff because we will still hit less than before. </span><div></div>

[brow27]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Conequis wrote:<BR><SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Cecil_Strife wrote:<BR> <DIV>Nothing is getting nerfed cept our parry and root.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thing are getting moved around but in general our damage increased by a ton.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Maybe the people having problems aren't increasing spells quality?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dunno</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>The problem is that while our damage on the spells is being increased, our ability to debuff is being decreased which also decreased the overall damage.  so it does no good to increase spell damage if we can't debuff because we will still hit less than before.<BR><BR><BR></SPAN> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>From what I've read, the mobs have less HP than they used to also.  Why don't we leave the rampant speculation (mine included) at the door?<BR>

[Ghostbeard]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Mystildur wrote:<p>I don't know what everyone is complaining about. Yeah, we're getting nerfed a bit, ROC mainly... but dont you think a 36 second permanent root was a bit overpowered anyway? </p> <hr></blockquote> Everyone of you Wizards or Warlocks who are actually GLAD that the one spell that guarantee's your soloing ability has been nerfed or are crowing from the rooftops that it was "overpowered anyway" and SHOULD  have been  nerfed should simply accept the changes as they are and go play. You won't miss RoC or Bony Grasp because you apparently never liked (or used) it much anyway. Truth is - there are a handful of individuals who are posting about how it SHOULD have been nerfed that have actually never even USED it because they aren't high enough level. I see a few posters here who apparently have Wizard ALT's in the low 30's posting at length and proselytizing about spells they've never even <i>seen</i> much less actually <b>used</b>. The bottom line for me is that I... like ALL mage-class players... have armour made of recycled paper products. When you marry paper thin armour with an absolutely pathetic HP pool you get a player who is BY DESIGN not intended to take damage. Period. Most of the mobs in zones that are high 40's - where Wizards with RoC actually camp - hit extremely hard.  Some of the Numbfoots in EF hit for 1300+. Many of the giants can double for almost 400. Hell the stags have butted me for 300+ before. The ones that are linked 'heroic' do this damage X2. Or X3. Or sometimes more. A root that allowed me to manage this damage effectively and deal with encounters with multiple mobs was - quite frankly - one of my classes few truly utilitarian spells - and allowed me to gain xp at levels comparable to other classes.  It made grouping something I did because I wanted to. Not because I HAD to.  Now... it's apparently going to be gone. You can bet that the rest of us - who actually realize how damaging and ill-advised the nerf is - are going to continue to voice our concerns. Regardless.  </span><div></div><p>Message Edited by Ghostbeard on <span class=date_text>08-10-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:42 AM</span>

[Eldarath]

<P>Ok I see lots of speculation and debate over spells, what I have not yet seen is anyone but a low lvl Wizard post actual screen shots of spells they can not cast.  Would it be possible for someone to post a few screen shots of the Wizard spells at lvl 50 so we can see what we are going to have to work with.  I know this is common in other class forums let us see an over all view of what is comming.</P> <P> </P>

[OneBadAli]

What we really need right now is for wizards that are testing the changes to get on the <DIV>combat Test Feedback forums and express all of our concerns and problems with our spells, i see a warlock topic expressiing concerns that are 6 pages long. I really dont see much on those forums about Wizards. They will be the ones that get their problems looked at, not us....</DIV> <DIV>So again, if your on the test server and are high enough level wizard, then please please create another thread stating the problems we feel need to be addressed.</DIV> <DIV>Debuffing,</DIV> <DIV>RoC/Roots in general</DIV> <DIV>Buffs & Concentration</DIV> <DIV>Protoflame</DIV> <DIV>etc etc.</DIV>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> OneBadAlien wrote:<BR> What we really need right now is for wizards that are testing the changes to get on the <DIV>combat Test Feedback forums and express all of our concerns and problems with our spells, i see a warlock topic expressiing concerns that are 6 pages long. I really dont see much on those forums about Wizards. They will be the ones that get their problems looked at, not us....</DIV> <DIV>So again, if your on the test server and are high enough level wizard, then please please create another thread stating the problems we feel need to be addressed.</DIV> <DIV>Debuffing,</DIV> <DIV>RoC/Roots in general</DIV> <DIV>Buffs & Concentration</DIV> <DIV>Protoflame</DIV> <DIV>etc etc.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>I started a thread ages ago, unfortunately, no other wizard (who is testing) listed their problems.  What I see is not necessarily what others are seeing.  Link is <A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=961" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=961</A></P> <P>I did add protoflame and root to the list.  </P> <P>Protoflame is outright borked.  Roots, I only have one problem with.  My problem is ROC should last 36 seconds but still have a chance to break on damage.  The rationale:  this would allow us to root adds or solo multiple mob (the solo variety ie SP).  Right now, 16 seconds is not long enough to buy a group much time.</P> <P>I do not know if others are having problems soloing - I am not.  I just hit 50 last night.  I soloed for a couple of hours in EF, south of the Giant Cave.  I killed everything non-heroic that passed by me.  Average fight length was 15-18 seconds.  Some fights were shorter, some were longer (hate when resists are back-to-back).  I never in that time got less then 50% health on any mob.  Well, that time I accidentally targeted a heroic mob /shudder.  </P> <P>For those thinking I am a decked out wizard - you obviously do not play on test.  My gear ranges from tundra walkers to splitpaw drops.  I use some quested (stein of moggok, and necklace of glowing shards).  Besides my robe of the invoker, everything is average or below average gear.  As a test, I equipped a tundra walkers robe for an hour.  I did not notice a difference (might have had to wait on mana regen more often /shrug).   If my equipment is above average for a normal server - I would be honestly shocked (maybe people blow by the levels so fast they outgrow their gear).  I do harvest a ton, I do have a few rares and am a 50 sage - so I was using Ball of Flames at adept 3 during leveling.  None of my other standard use spells are upgraded.  I am not upgrading anymore spells until I know what the spells will settle at.</P> <P>After hitting 50, I took my ice comet out and was single cast killing all of the non-heroic mobs.  None of the mobs I killed lasted more then one cast.  At 204 int, ice comet (adept 3) does 4700 pts maximum damage.  Another wizard on test has 230+int and said her ice comet (adept 3) was doing 5200 points of damage.  I need to work on my intelligence.  </P> <DIV>My bottom line.  I cannot solo any heroic mobs, and yes, I was before the combat changes.  I can solo any solo mobe I have attempted in EF or LS.  The only mobs that give me any problems are the Splitpaw Bats.  Their stun is just too much.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[blynchehaun]

Cheers Goboy, you do good work. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <div></div>

[papabear0]

<P>i think it's a great change.  more dps for a weaker root.</P> <P>if RoC stays the same, its way too overpowering.  you can still solo group mobs which your not suppose to.  if we can solo group mobs, other classes will want to also, then whats the point of grouping?  to kill epic and named mobs only?</P> <P>debuffing: pretty sure this is going to affect all classes, not just wizards.  if it's across the board change, then thats pretty fair IMO. </P> <P>protoflame:  i haven't used this spell since........i forgot, it's been a long time.  but even without this spell, we can still do some amazing damage.</P> <P> </P>

[Araina Arrowney]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <SPAN><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Mystildur wrote:<BR> <P>I don't know what everyone is complaining about. Yeah, we're getting nerfed a bit, ROC mainly... but dont you think a 36 second permanent root was a bit overpowered anyway?<BR><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR></SPAN>     No, no I don't.  I think the spell is exactly and entirely appropriate for a high-level wizard to have.  As someone who has played a wizard for sixty levels in EQ and nearly fifty levels in EQ2, and knows all the ins and outs about the class there are to know, I have just this to say:</P> <P align=center><STRONG>LEAVE OUR #%@*%@ ROOTS ALONE!</STRONG></P> <P>     I mean, seriously, what in the &!@$ are you supposed to do during a twelve-second root?  Make out a will?  If you don't want people soloing Heroic creatures, simply make Ring of Cold not work on Heroic creatures.  But otherwise, our roots aren't broken, SoE.  Please don't try to "fix" them.</P> <P>     I suggest everyone who feels the same way about this make their voices known.  It was bad enough when they ruined our AoEs by sextupling the recast time some months back, but taking away our roots is completely unnecessary and grievously injures our class.</P></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>

[trysta]

<span><blockquote><hr>Araina Arrowney wrote:<div> <blockquote> <div></div><span> <blockquote> <hr> Mystildur wrote: <p>I don't know what everyone is complaining about. Yeah, we're getting nerfed a bit, ROC mainly... but dont you think a 36 second permanent root was a bit overpowered anyway?</p> <hr> </blockquote> <p></p></span>     No, no I don't.  I think the spell is exactly and entirely appropriate for a high-level wizard to have.  As someone who has played a wizard for sixty levels in EQ and nearly fifty levels in EQ2, and knows all the ins and outs about the class there are to know, I have just this to say:<p></p> <p align="center"><strong>LEAVE OUR #%@*%@ ROOTS ALONE!</strong></p> <p>     I mean, seriously, what in the &!@$ are you supposed to do during a twelve-second root?  Make out a will?  If you don't want people soloing Heroic creatures, simply make Ring of Cold not work on Heroic creatures.  But otherwise, our roots aren't broken, SoE.  Please don't try to "fix" them.</p> <p>     I suggest everyone who feels the same way about this make their voices known.  It was bad enough when they ruined our AoEs by sextupling the recast time some months back, but taking away our roots is completely unnecessary and grievously injures our class.</p></blockquote></div><hr></blockquote>I agree with you whole-heartedly. I've even suggested making RoC not work on heroics before, but I don't think anyone paid attention to it.</span><div></div>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <SPAN> <P>    I mean, seriously, what in the &!@$ are you supposed to do during a twelve-second root?  Make out a will?  If you don't want people soloing Heroic creatures, simply make Ring of Cold not work on Heroic creatures.  But otherwise, our roots aren't broken, SoE.  Please don't try to "fix" them.</P></SPAN> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>Lets see, assuming the root does not break (bad assumption) I believe we can launch 3 dps spells.  I know I can get off 2 dps spells.  I guess I can try to gather some data, but I rarely bother with roots on solo mobs anymore - they have reduced NPCs more then people realize (or they have messed up the mobs on test somehow).  Now some of the bears hit hard and a few others.  I can normally AE DoT and BOF before root breaks.  I have yet to find a solo mob that is not under 30% after doing this. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Testing these changes shows no adverse affects (except against heroic mobs) at levels 49/50.  The one suggestion I have made is to bump ROC back to 36 seconds but leave it breakable.  This would give us some control over multiple mobs, while reducing its effectiveness for the "free" kills.  You may not appreciate other peoples opinions, however, I have always felt that ROC was overpowered. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And yes, I have played eqlive for years as well.  What I miss are useful snares.</DIV>

[LordNic]

<DIV>trystaad and goboy, you seem to be the only lvl 50 wizards on test posting here. Therefor I ask if you could do the rest of us wizards a huge favor and post screenshots of our higher lvl spell discription? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/LordNicke</DIV>

[goboy]

<P>I can try man.  Maybe I will take few.  Anyone have a place to host them?  This week has been horrendous at work - 60-70 hour weeks until December.  I am getting 2-3 hours a night testing, but I have not had much of a chance to take screenies.</P> <P>Trystaad, you experiences do not seem to be the same as mine. To me, solo NPCs are pathetically easy.  Are you on beta or play at weird hours?  I only know of one other level 50 wizard on test.  It would be interesting to know if test and beta experiences are not the same.  Feedback is only valuable if more then one person is giving their impressions. </P> <P>  </P>

[Araina Arrowney]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <DIV>Lets see, assuming the root does not break (bad assumption) I believe we can launch 3 dps spells.  I know I can get off 2 dps spells.</DIV> <DIV> <HR> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>True, I exaggerate.  My point is that cutting our root duration to a third severely handicaps us.  Our root line was absolutely fine before.  As wizards, we have no hit points and no armour class. so we depend on our firepower for offense and our roots as defense.  Reducing our root duration does not improve our class, it does not help any<EM> other</EM> class, and does not improve in any ways I can see the game as a whole.  It's just, in my opinion, unnecessary.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <HR> You may not appreciate other peoples opinions, however, I have always felt that ROC was overpowered. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And yes, I have played eqlive for years as well.  What I miss are useful snares.</DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>     We're wizards, though.  As the masters of magic, excellence should be standard and standard should be unacceptable.  Ring of Cold IS a powerful spell, but it is appropriate for a high-level wizard.  I do agree with you about snares.  I never played EQ Live, so I can't speak as to the spells there, but in EQ1, we had Bonds of Force and Atol's Spectral Shackles, two group snares that were an essential part of our class.  As quad-kiting isn't a viable strategy in the new Norrath, there would have to be some differences, but I wouldn't mind some sort of snare, besides the couple of snare aftereffects that we currently have (which last about a second and a half, hardly useful for anything).<BR>

[Dejah]

<DIV><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=1673#M1673" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=1673#M1673</A></DIV> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blackguard wrote:<BR> <P><STRONG>Summoned Pets:<BR></STRONG>- Fighter pets (such as the Tellurian Recruit) should tank and hold aggro better.<BR>- Scout pets (such as the Shadowy Stalker) should do significantly more damage, but take more damage in return.<BR>- Mage pets (such as the Grim Terror) should do roughly the same damage as before, but have less health.<BR><FONT size=5>- Dumbfire and swarm pets should do more damage, but have reduced health.</FONT><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Does this cover Protoflame?<BR></DIV>

[Mystild]

<DIV>http://imageshack.us</DIV>

[goboy]

<P><BR> </P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Dejah wrote:<BR> <DIV><A href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=1673#M1673" target=_blank>http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=comtest&message.id=1673#M1673</A></DIV> <DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Blackguard wrote:<BR> <P><STRONG>Summoned Pets:<BR></STRONG>- Fighter pets (such as the Tellurian Recruit) should tank and hold aggro better.<BR>- Scout pets (such as the Shadowy Stalker) should do significantly more damage, but take more damage in return.<BR>- Mage pets (such as the Grim Terror) should do roughly the same damage as before, but have less health.<BR><FONT size=5>- Dumbfire and swarm pets should do more damage, but have reduced health.</FONT><BR></P> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Does this cover Protoflame?<BR></DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>I doubt it.  These changes have only been pushed to beta, so I have not had a chance to see them on test yet.  On the positive side, interrupts being reduced is a major bonus.  That was one of the few problems I had vs some mobs (see SP bats).  Mob HP reduction should really help duo's, and GoD willing, Raids.  We tried a few raid targets last weekend.  Was depressing to not be able to kill of any of the flunkies.  Well, part of that was the stupid heal aggro. </P> <P> </P>

[trysta]

<blockquote><hr>LordNicke wrote:<DIV>trystaad and goboy, you seem to be the only lvl 50 wizards on test posting here. Therefor I ask if you could do the rest of us wizards a huge favor and post screenshots of our higher lvl spell discription? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/LordNicke</DIV><hr></blockquote>I have taken screenshots of these spells and posted them in the appropriate forums, but I'm not on test, I'm in um.. something else.. and therefore I can't take screenshots and post them. I can only talk about the combat changes, because people on test are experiencing the same combat revamp as we are.

[Robsco]

<P>My concern is that many of my T5 Rare VLA and fabled items have useless stats now on them. It  took me tons of hours Harvesting and raiding to get these items.</P> <P>I was browsing the market the last few days and it seems the items with the highest INT or grey to me. Their are Items with low ac, no hp and some mana with 15 int on them. Why should I wear T5 Rear VLA with 9 int when I can wear a Grey item thats worth a few gold that has 15 int on it.</P> <P>I Hope soe seriously thinks about changing stats on some of these items before revamp.</P> <P>Thanks</P> <P>Robsco The Humble Gnome Steamfont</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> trystaad wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> LordNicke wrote:<BR> <DIV>trystaad and goboy, you seem to be the only lvl 50 wizards on test posting here. Therefor I ask if you could do the rest of us wizards a huge favor and post screenshots of our higher lvl spell discription? </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>/LordNicke</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I have taken screenshots of these spells and posted them in the appropriate forums, but I'm not on test, I'm in um.. something else.. and therefore I can't take screenshots and post them. I can only talk about the combat changes, because people on test are experiencing the same combat revamp as we are.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>sounds to me like your beta testing desert of flames.</P> <P> </P> <P>how do you like the new zones? *wink*<BR></P>

[trysta]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>goboy wrote: <p>Trystaad, you experiences do not seem to be the same as mine. To me, solo NPCs are pathetically easy.  Are you on beta or play at weird hours?  I only know of one other level 50 wizard on test.  It would be interesting to know if test and beta experiences are not the same.  Feedback is only valuable if more then one person is giving their impressions. </p> <p>  </p> <hr></blockquote>Ok, I've been over-exaggerating. Tonight I logged in and was able to take out level 51 single solo mobs succesfully. The only tactic that can be used is "Nuke first, nuke hard, pray you don't get resisted." However, if I even got a single add, there was no hope for survival. On another note, group solo mobs (not heroic, multiple mobs in a solo encounter) are [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] near impossible. Doing an instanced zone, I had four blue mobs spawn on me (all the same encounter, I *think* three arrows down on each). Totally [Removed for Content] me. Dead before I could get a single spell cast. I went back, and since I knew what was coming, I had my mouse ready to click Icy Wind. Got that off, hit Ring of Cold (which broke, by the way), then ran around the arena like a nut praying that Icy Wind would kill the mobs before I died. Even green multiple-mob solo encounters give me difficulty. Died a couple of times to them a week or two ago. And to IllusiveThoughts: What new zones? I have no idea what you're talking about <span>:smileywink:</span> </span> <div></div><p>Message Edited by trystaad on <span class=date_text>08-10-2005</span> <span class=time_text>08:54 PM</span>

[Aeva]

<DIV>personally I would prefer roots that are unbreakable, duration is less important to me than knowing what to expect from my spell. I prefer a game of tactics to a game of russian roulet.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>as for the idea of ROC not working on heroic, that would be an ok fix if this were intended to be THE spell that allows us to solo, but I think what they had in mind with this was more along the lines of CC (although at 12sec or whatever... sure the group will move out of the way and kill the other heroic during 12sec, haha). pretty useless now, but I would still like the group functionality</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ROC- I would like to see 20 sec duration, insta-cast, unbreakable, 35+ sec recast. would make it a handy "Oh-poo" spell, in addition to being useful for the grouped solo encounters but not allow you to hold heroic long enough to kill them.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anyone know if anything happend to our Mez line? they can have that one, as it stands I havent used one of those garbage Suicide spells in a Very Very long time. someone was sniffing glue when they came up with this line of spells.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>PS. thanks for all the Info Goboy</DIV><p>Message Edited by Aevarr on <span class=date_text>08-11-2005</span> <span class=time_text>12:34 AM</span>

[Lanadad]

<P>Thanks a lot for testing and posting your findings on this forum. :thumbs:<BR>These changes look rather good imho. Some interesting new tactics will have to be developed though.</P> <P>As I look at our new found spells and skill, I think:<BR>We now need to be much more specific as to which buff we will load up due to the concentration slots<BR>- Nice, I like this change, it will force me to think about matching certain buff setups vs. encounters.<BR>Damage up accross the board<BR>- Yay! No complaints here!<BR>Ring of Cold has a shorter duration<BR>- I can live with this. It will not be as easy as before though. I would be interested to see if Proto Flame has a nifty hate build up so it can be used at the end of a root and buy us time to re-root. I think I saw a shorter recast? (will browse back up, I read the whole post, but its getting kinda long)</P> <P>Still have my hopes up. =)</P> <P>Kelpie<BR>50 Wizard on Splitpaw<BR><A href="http://www.synergy-eq2.com" target=_blank>www.synergy-eq2.com</A></P>

[Stavenh]

I have to say, the whole idea of spells being linked is really stupid. I know spells aren't going to grow as you level anymore, but they should. If two spells do the same thing, just at different levels, it's not really a new spell. As it is, just make one version of roots. You have Arcane Shackles, which does damage, and can be mitigated. Then Tether and Truss. Just make them one spell. And then don't put any level restriction on it. As it is, trying to land spells on a red con mob isn't going to happen that much. If your level 20, trying to root a level 40 mobs, it isn't going to work.They took out level and access restrictions to different zones, because they wanted people of the wrong level to avoid those areas because they were dangerous to them, not because of artifical barriers.Use the same logic with spells. Why have artifical caps on spells? It's just not thinking.First, since more spells are being linked now, yet another artifcial barrier, who cares if they have level limits? If I cast arcane shackles, I can't cast any of my other roots untill the recast timer runs it's course. So I won't be able to chain cast roots, so there is no need for a level restriction on effected mobs.They are trying to hard to limit what mages can do, to be fair. But mages have always gotten the short end of the stick in many areas.

[Zyphius]

<DIV>Lets see... early levels, soloing "solo" encounters wasn't too hard (even green heroics wasn't hard until they patched them). At mid levels, soloing became [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] near impossiple. Mobs were stronger, root kept breaking, and lil wizzie kept dieing. At high levels, soloing was completely impossible... until my current level (42) and got Ring of Cold. For the first time, since like lvl 21, I actually feel like I can effectively solo again. Single solo mobs, blue and green, were never "too" hard as long as I used frozen manacles, freeze (when FM breaks) followed with tether, and blazing intimidation when tether it breaks. However, linked solo mobs were extremely difficult. Tether one while nuking, while getting beat on, the other. With ROC I feel like I can solo linked solo mobs now, with just as much confidence as single solo mobs. Nerfing ROC will just make anythign other than a single green or blue completely unsoloable. I would never think about soloing a heroic, even grey heroics are impossible.</DIV>

[brow27]

<DIV>If for some reason you can't solo anything other than greens or blues without RoC, you need some serious help.  I can solo yellow con mobs (I'm 45) WITHOUT rooting.  Yea I get beat on a fair amount, but its doable.  Using tether/blazing intimidation/frozen manacles/enfeeblement, it's pretty easy to solo a yellow and barely get touched, if at all.  Greens and blues I don't even bother rooting at all unless its a group of them.  Honestly, RoC as it is now is WAY overpowered.  I don't think it should be nerfed quite to the point it is on test, but I see how its understandable.  I can currently solo white ^^ melee mobs without too much trouble if RoC isn't resisted, and my gear isn't even that great, only a few legendary pieces and the rest from blue-yellow con normal items.  I will miss being able to do that, but RoC trivializes just about any encounter you can land it on.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You can't take a single change like the nerf to RoC and say that is going to completely destroy soloing.  They are changing tons of other stuff at the same time, other spells will do more damage, the capabilities of mobs are changing, etc.  Understand that wizards AREN'T supposed to be able to take on stuff with no challenge.  I soloed fine from 18 all the way until 37, and from then on it just got rediculously easy.  I die most often from carelessness, because I'm expecting it to be super easy, but every once in a while I run into multiple groups or just space out on the fact I got resisted 3 times in a row.</DIV>

[Manohate]

<P>Aevarr made this statement in his post:</P> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc00>"personally I would prefer roots that are unbreakable, duration is less important to me than knowing what to expect from my spell. I prefer a game of tactics to a game of russian roulet."</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I agree with him 100%.</DIV>

[BadLieutenant]

<DIV>I don't understand what is going on here. I didn't think Wizard could get any worse but it turns out I may be wrong. The main problem with our class in my opinion is not our spells. My main problem with being a wizard doesn't even have to do with our class at all really. It has to do with the fact that 75% of the raid mobs are IMMUNE to cold. That being said, they can do whatever the hell they want with Ice Comet and it isn't going to help me that much. And what does it matter if they remove our debuffs or make them better? We can't cast them on most raid mobs either since they are cold damage based. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Not to get off on a rant of Wizard vs. Warlock here, but instead of seeing them get nerfed as I think they should a little, they get boosted in most cases. I'm pretty tired of seeing wizards get left out of raids because they don't do as much damage as a warlock. THE WHOLE PROBLEM IS THE RESISTS!!! I cannot stress that enough. I can buy cold based mobs being immune to cold, but using that logic then maybe they should take double damage to heat. And not to mention that most mobs end up resisting my fire attack anyway. Its rediculous. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If we can't solo with the new changes then so be it. Warlocks can't solo very well so I can deal with that. I didn't become a wizard so I can solo. I became a wizard so I can do mass damage and contribute to raids and contribute to whatever group I'm in. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm not even going to comment anymore on these new spell changes. If they don't adjust the resists of raid mobs it won't matter. So SOE please fix the real problem with being a wizard, make our fricken spells useful for us please. I will be extremely [Removed for Content] off when the expansion comes out if warlocks are still doing 4 or 5 times the damage as me on most raids. We need to be on par with Warlocks and not play some crappy utility role with [Removed for Content] dps. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anybody become a evac'er...I mean Wizard to become a weak utility character? I certainly did not.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Mimik</DIV> <DIV>Level 50 Wiz</DIV> <DIV>Lucky member of Atrocity</DIV> <DIV>Perma Server</DIV> <DIV> </DIV><p>Message Edited by BadLieutenant on <span class=date_text>08-14-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:45 AM</span>

[Tar~Palantir]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> BadLieutenant wrote:<BR> <DIV>I don't understand what is going on here. I didn't think Wizard could get any worse but it turns out I may be wrong. The main problem with our class in my opinion is not our spells. My main problem with being a wizard doesn't even have to do with our class at all really. It has to do with the fact that 75% of the raid mobs are IMMUNE to cold. That being said, they can do whatever the hell they want with Ice Comet and it isn't going to help me that much. And what does it matter if they remove our debuffs or make them better? We can't cast them on most raid mobs either since they are cold damage based. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Not to get off on a rant of Wizard vs. Warlock here, but instead of seeing them get nerfed as I think they should a little, they get boosted in most cases. I'm pretty tired of seeing wizards get left out of raids because they don't do as much damage as a warlock. THE WHOLE PROBLEM IS THE RESISTS!!! I cannot stress that enough. I can buy cold based mobs being immune to cold, but using that logic then maybe they should take double damage to heat. And not to mention that most mobs end up resisting my fire attack anyway. Its rediculous. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If we can't solo with the new changes then so be it. Warlocks can't solo very well so I can deal with that. I didn't become a wizard so I can solo. I became a wizard so I can do mass damage and contribute to raids and contribute to whatever group I'm in. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm not even going to comment anymore on these new spell changes. If they don't adjust the resists of raid mobs it won't matter. So SOE please fix the real problem with being a wizard, make our fricken spells useful for us please. I will be extremely [Removed for Content] off when the expansion comes out if warlocks are still doing 4 or 5 times the damage as me on most raids. We need to be on par with Warlocks and not play some crappy utility role with [Removed for Content] dps. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Anybody become a evac'er...I mean Wizard to become a weak utility character? I certainly did not.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Mimik</DIV> <DIV>Level 50 Wiz</DIV> <DIV>Lucky member of Atrocity</DIV> <DIV>Perma Server</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <P>Message Edited by BadLieutenant on <SPAN class=date_text>08-14-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>01:45 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>truly, if our spells are being buffed, it will not mean a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] thing if we get resist after immune after resist.

[Erow]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> trystaad wrote:<BR><BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Alfgand wrote:<BR><BR> <P>I see some people happy with the DPS boost and a bunch of people quite worried about the nerf to roots.</P><BR><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><BR>One thing that I've pointed out before is that although they have increased the damage on our nukes, they have removed almost ALL of our ability to debuff. Other classes also have taken severe hits to their debuff ability. Because of this nerf, our nukes are hitting actually LOWER than they do on live servers.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV><FONT color=#33ccff>Thats because when grouped, the debuffing classes can do their job and the Nukers get a group bonus... : )  Basically, SOE wanted groups to be more powerful than the sum of it parts.</FONT></DIV>

[SnowCajun]

<P>The changes may be needed but do they consider the $$$ we've spent in adept III'ing some of those spells they've just killed for us by making them useless now? Also the rares we'll now have to have to new adept III the changes for whatever is useful now. Bah!  </P> <P>I've watched this game evolve, watched the scarecrows in Antonica go from ^^ to no arrows, watched the same with the griffons and other mobs do the same,  I've watched them continually make the game easier and easier for the casual players, yet now they're going to take away the only fun I have as a Wizard by ruining my ability to solo, the very thing they've tried to make easier for so many, but will now ruin for me by killing my root spells. What's left, either group or die? This sure seems backwards to me. </P> <P>Cuddles</P>

[adamflanagan]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>SnowCajun wrote:<div></div> <p>The changes may be needed but do they consider the $$$ we've spent in adept III'ing some of those spells they've just killed for us by making them useless now? Also the rares we'll now have to have to new adept III the changes for whatever is useful now. Bah!  </p> <p>I've watched this game evolve, watched the scarecrows in Antonica go from ^^ to no arrows, watched the same with the griffons and other mobs do the same,  I've watched them continually make the game easier and easier for the casual players, yet now they're going to take away the only fun I have as a Wizard by ruining my ability to solo, the very thing they've tried to make easier for so many, but will now ruin for me by killing my root spells. What's left, either group or die? This sure seems backwards to me. </p> <p>Cuddles</p><hr></blockquote>which spells do you regret making adept3? the only spell i can think of that is no longer worth using is the mana transfer that stunned us. Also all those MOBs you mentioned being changed from heroic to solo are in the process of being changed back.</span><div></div><p>Message Edited by adamflanagan on <span class=date_text>08-16-2005</span> <span class=time_text>11:02 AM</span>

[goboy]

<DIV><BR></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> <SPAN>which spells do you regret making adept3? the only spell i can think of that is no longer worth using is the mana transfer that stunned us.<BR><BR>Also all those MOBs you mentioned being changed from heroic to solo are in the process of being changed back.<BR></SPAN> <P>Message Edited by adamflanagan on <SPAN class=date_text>08-16-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>11:02 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV>The only spell I regret making into an Adept 3 is Piercing Icicles.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I created Ice Comet (no brainer), and will probably create Paralyze and Icy Wind.  The only reason I am waiting is to make sure there are no other changes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And Cuddles, I have had relatively few problems soloing solo mobs in EF or LS.  I have no success soloing group mobs.  I am not in Beta, so I have no idea how those mobs are stacking up.</DIV> <DIV><BR> </DIV>

[SnowCajun]

<HR> <DIV>And Cuddles, I have had relatively few problems soloing solo mobs in EF or LS.  I have no success soloing group mobs.  I am not in Beta, so I have no idea how those mobs are stacking up.</DIV> <HR> </HU> <P>Our old Ring of Cold, our main root spell lasted 35 seconds, with a 45 second recast time. You could always make up that difference with Frozen Manacles to hold the mob for 9 seconds even if it was only a lvl 19 spell. Now that's Frozen Manacles won't be allowed after a certain lvl, surely out of reach at 50, and Ring of Cold is being cut to 15 second duration with 45 second recast. So, they'll be more than halving our main root and eliminating another totally. Care to take on The Blood Thirsty Leopard with what's left?? <P>Fiery Surge will no longer be useful to your group, only you and I wouldn't have adept 3'd that just for me when I have the Manastone! Piercing Icicles (adept 3) will only do 39-47 DD, 39-47 every 4 seconds compared to 296 - 360 and 95 to 116 every 4 seconds. <P>I dunno, SOE has a funny way of doing things, let you spend your money then change things around. My first horse I bought I paid a lot of money for, then they cut the speed down by 8%. They announced you could sell it back for full price as I remember, but when I went to do so I was going to lose over a plat in brokers fee refund. Hardly a good deal and asking via /petition brought no reasonable response. <P>I know some of the changes will be good, I don't argue that, but I just hate having wasted platinum or good rares making adept III's for stuff they're going to nerf in the end, that doesn't see right to me. I think the days or Wizard solo'ing may be numbered. Maybe not but it doesn't sound good if we can't root long enough to protect ourselves! <P>Cuddles</P> <DIV> </DIV>

[Tar~Palantir]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SnowCajun wrote:<BR> <HR> <DIV>And Cuddles, I have had relatively few problems soloing solo mobs in EF or LS.  I have no success soloing group mobs.  I am not in Beta, so I have no idea how those mobs are stacking up.</DIV> <HR> </HU> <P>Our old Ring of Cold, our main root spell lasted 35 seconds, with a 45 second recast time. You could always make up that difference with Frozen Manacles to hold the mob for 9 seconds even if it was only a lvl 19 spell. Now that's Frozen Manacles won't be allowed after a certain lvl, surely out of reach at 50, and Ring of Cold is being cut to 15 second duration with 45 second recast. So, they'll be more than halving our main root and eliminating another totally. Care to take on The Blood Thirsty Leopard with what's left?? <P>Fiery Surge will no longer be useful to your group, only you and I wouldn't have adept 3'd that just for me when I have the Manastone! Piercing Icicles (adept 3) will only do 39-47 DD, 39-47 every 4 seconds compared to 296 - 360 and 95 to 116 every 4 seconds. <P>I <FONT color=#ffff00>dunno, SOE has a funny way of doing things, let you spend your money then change things around. My first horse I bought I paid a lot of money for, then they cut the speed down by 8%. They announced you could sell it back for full price as I remember, but when I went to do so I was going to lose over a plat in brokers fee refund. Hardly a good deal and asking via /petition brought no reasonable response. </FONT> <P>I know some of the changes will be good, I don't argue that, but I just hate having wasted platinum or good rares making adept III's for stuff they're going to nerf in the end, that doesn't see right to me. I think the days or Wizard solo'ing may be numbered. Maybe not but it doesn't sound good if we can't root long enough to protect ourselves! <P>Cuddles</P> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I remember that travesty, now I will add any bad changes to my Spend and be nerfed! list....</DIV>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Care to take on The Blood Thirsty Leopard with what's left?? <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Not to pick on you entirely, however, most of the mobs I see people listing as problems are not solo mobs.  Leopards are heroic mobs - the bloodthirsty more so.  I saw numbfoot hunters listed earlier - again group mobs.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>When I say I can solo solo mobs easily and no group mobs, I mean exactly that.  If a mob is flagged as heroic or group, then it is out of the question.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Valdar]

<P>Please correct me if I'm wrong, but when I read this thread I get the impression that it's impossible to solo Heroic mobs?</P> <P>So where is the challenge in soloing then, if I also read here that all soloable mobs are instakills with Ice Comet or at best fights that last 15 seconds max.....?</P> <P>Personally I love to solo mobs that will kill me in 1-2 hits if the root breaks. There's nothing like having a ^^ Numbfoot rooted with RoC, getting a ^^ snowleopard add and then having to decide in a fraction of a second wether to run or root and fight for it....</P> <P>If they make it impossible to kill Heroic mobs, then please make some solo mobs a challenge. If not, then don't bother with any solo content. I dont want to spend my time running around instakilling mobs with Ice Comet.</P>

[curtlewis]

When that yellow con solo mob barrages you for 1800 leaving you with a bub of health, you might change your tune... <div></div>

[Valdar]

<P>Well, if our damage output is high enough, he wont get a special off.</P> <P> </P> <P>Stun > Ice Comet > Enfeeblement > Ball of Flames > have a beer.</P> <P> </P> <P>By the way, haven't played the new content yet, just going on posts here.</P>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> BigWillem wrote:<BR> <P>Please correct me if I'm wrong, but when I read this thread I get the impression that it's impossible to solo Heroic mobs?</P> <P>So where is the challenge in soloing then, if I also read here that all soloable mobs are instakills with Ice Comet or at best fights that last 15 seconds max.....?</P> <P>Personally I love to solo mobs that will kill me in 1-2 hits if the root breaks. There's nothing like having a ^^ Numbfoot rooted with RoC, getting a ^^ snowleopard add and then having to decide in a fraction of a second wether to run or root and fight for it....</P> <P>If they make it impossible to kill Heroic mobs, then please make some solo mobs a challenge. If not, then don't bother with any solo content. I dont want to spend my time running around instakilling mobs with Ice Comet.</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>My feedback on test, and with no knowledge of DOF, solo mobs (even at 49) are pathetically easy.  Heroic mobs are fricking hard.  There is no middle ground.  And yes, it is boring that way.</P> <P>When I was finishing of 50 (I was 48 or 49 when the changes hit), I was in a conversation with someone from live discussing the changes for 2 hours.  We had this conversation while I was soloing mobs (solo mobs) in EF.  Even while being distracted and casting the wrong spells at times, I only got myself in trouble once in 2 hours.  That was the result of casting on a heroic elephant accidentally.</P> <P>Now, there are mobs that give problems.  Bats in SP I hate.  Enchanter NPCs are ridiculous - i died to 4 level 40 (heroic) bloodline mobs because they kept me stifled for the entire fight.  I did bug that - I should have resisted some of their non-dps spells.  That and the fight lasted 15 minutes, it was kind of upsetting to not be able to cast for 15 minutes.</P> <P> </P>

[brow27]

Bloodlines mobs are way overdone.  I went in there at 45, when everything was quite gray, and got owned by one of the nameds with his posse of casters (which were level 37-38 at best).  When I was lower level, the SOLO green mobs would hit me for 300-600 damage.  Even now, it takes more damage and power for me to kill a level 36 mob (single of a group of 3-5) than to kill a mob that's orange to me at level 46. <div></div>

[treasterbr]

<DIV>I say if they going to make Wizzy's basically useless then we should have choices</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1) allow us to rechoose our class so what if we are 34  48 50 allow us to choos to stay a Wizzy or to drop back to 20 and become a warlock </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2) allow us to unattune our equipment so we can give it to a new toon since we did spend the time playing to get the gear initially </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3) DONT touch the wizzy's unless your gonna make them better to where we balance out more with the warlocks... </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I mean it bad enough on EQ1 you had the Necro being the best solo caster who then got ignored or cast times messed with to where spells took longer to cast which made us no longer the best solo caster and b4 you knew it everyone and his brother had either a Druid or Bard to do quad kiting just to be able to get the stuff for a necro that teh necro should be able to get</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Dont get me wrong I understand the concept of multiplayer and that they would like us to group more but for those of us that only have a couple hours a week to play really cant waste time looking for a group everytime we want to do something besides tradeskill. and when we do find a group to be asked to leave cause teh group would rather have a warlock because " well their spells arent resisted as much and that means they have better dps  .... so see ya " Boot from group.</DIV>

[Yaotzi]

how is wizard uselss? <div></div>

[treasterbr]

<DIV>it was stated that we are becoming a utility class </DIV> <DIV>that was my reaction to becoming a utility class IE only good for our buffs and evac ( which Scouts have anyways and usually in most group will have a scout if it a well balanced group) and being booted from groups just because a warlock hits more often and with less resist so they do more damage.. has happened to me many times being booted to be replaced with a warlock for that reason on Oasis server.</DIV>

[adamflanagan]

<span><blockquote><hr>treasterbr wrote:<div>it was stated that we are becoming a utility class </div> <div>that was my reaction to becoming a utility class IE only good for our buffs and evac ( which Scouts have anyways and usually in most group will have a scout if it a well balanced group) and being booted from groups just because a warlock hits more often and with less resist so they do more damage.. has happened to me many times being booted to be replaced with a warlock for that reason on Oasis server.</div><hr></blockquote>we are certainly not becoming a utility class. our buffs and mana transfers have been nerfed and our DPS increased.</span><div></div>

[BadLieutenant]

<DIV>Does anybody have any feedback on raid mobs and their resist's? I am praying that if they aren't changed on test they are changed on Beta. As I said earlier, they can do what they want with our spells but that won't mean squat against raid mobs when they resist like crazy and most are immune to cold. Where's the poison immunity?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As far as the complaints about soloing go, Sony has caved in on almost everything in the game as far as making it easier. I'm sure that will happen here. I'm sure they will eventually establish a middle ground on what is challenging and doable and what is not. But I think the days of soloing heroic mobs that are even con or lower is gone, as it should be in my opinion. Yeah it was fun, but that's because it was challenging.  As long as there is a challenge to fighting these mobs then I'm ok with it. I am going to miss killing that first giant in PF so I could past him though.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Dramadon]

Everyone keeps talking about resists, and they should because it is a concern. What I want to know is, are we getting lure spells in the expansion? These were a big focus of the spells we got 51-60 in EQ 1 and they certainly made landing spells on mobs easier (even at the cost of using more mana). Since it appears our ability to debuff a mob is being decreased, we definately need some help here. If we do get lures, that will go a long way to quelling much of the complaining. <div></div>

[Bucksno]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> treasterbr wrote:<BR> <DIV>it was stated that we are becoming a utility class </DIV> <DIV>that was my reaction to becoming a utility class IE only good for our buffs and evac ( which Scouts have anyways and usually in most group will have a scout if it a well balanced group) and being booted from groups just because a warlock hits more often and with less resist so they do more damage.. has happened to me many times being booted to be replaced with a warlock for that reason on Oasis server.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Wow! You need a better source of your information. We will hardly be a utility class.</P> <P>And a better server too. Booted from a group on Oasis for a warlock? I'd say look for better groups and if they don't exist on Oasis, get off the server.</P>

[brow27]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> treasterbr wrote:<BR> <DIV>it was stated that we are becoming a utility class </DIV> <DIV>that was my reaction to becoming a utility class IE only good for our buffs and evac ( which Scouts have anyways and usually in most group will have a scout if it a well balanced group) and being booted from groups just because a warlock hits more often and with less resist so they do more damage.. has happened to me many times being booted to be replaced with a warlock for that reason on Oasis server.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Have you even read this post?  Have you read the other post with screenshots of all the spells?  I haven't seen a SINGLE mention from anyone that we are becoming a utility class.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And as for being booted from groups to be replaced by a warlock?  Either you are straight lying, you group with idiots, or they are making up a reason to kick you out of a group for some reason or another.</DIV>

[Mizzkit]

<P>I don't the devs are listening to us I really don't.  If the expansion is a make or break and they continue along with it pretty much as it is, there are an awful lot of people going to be leaveing EQ2.  Im the head of the largest guild on Unrest most of us also have a toon or three on test, and all of us read the boards.  Want to know what most of the /gu is at night when most are on?  What game are you going to try if the revamp isn't changed?  That's the topic and I'd say over 75% of the active players in my guild will leave EQ2 if things aren't rethought out.</P> <P>Granted a 36second non breakable root MAY have made us too powerful, but did it really?  Was anyone killing even or higher ^ heroics?  Was anyone finding groups of solo mobs so easy as to be boreing?  Was anyone not dieing when everything didn't go exactly right with our current root?  The majority of players are not in uber high end raiding guilds, and don't have access to the really fantastic stuff but we muddle thru, making our roots break will be the death nell for wizards soloing any much over a green single mob, and that is sad.  The Devs all but destroyed wizards on EQlive and they are going to do it here as well that's just sad.  My wizard gets invited to raids on EQlive for one reason, for her mass TP after the raid is done, if she didn't have that they wouldn't want her.  So I no longer do raids with my wizard on EQlive, it's not fun being thought of as cheap transportation and for nothing else.  Here on EQ2 we won't even have that ability, why will any raid group want a wizard?  Oh I know, they are getting too much exp and need debt that would be the reason.</P> <P>Mizzgnomer Class: Lvl 50 Debtmonger formerly known as Wizard</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

[trysta]

<blockquote><hr>Mizzkitty wrote:<p>Here on EQ2 we won't even have that ability, why will any raid group want a wizard?  Oh I know, they are getting too much exp and need debt that would be the reason.</p><p>Mizzgnomer Class: Lvl 50 Debtmonger formerly known as Wizard</p><p> </p><p> </p><div></div><hr></blockquote>HAHA! I actually suggested almost the exact same thing a couple of weeks ago:"While we have a slightly better chance against solo mobs right now, Sony might as well change the class name of Wizards into "Debtmongers." The only reason we'll be welcomed into groups is if people feel like they're leveling too fast."Glad somebody else sees it the same way I do <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[blynchehaun]

< Was anyone killing even or higher ^ heroics? > Yes. Read the boards, Wiz forum. <div></div>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Mizzkitty wrote:<BR> <P>Was anyone killing even or higher ^ heroics?</P> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Not sure exactly what these all conned - but at 49 I was killing:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Wooly Mammoths (white ^^)</DIV> <DIV>Tundra Terrors (beleve that was name, yellow/white ^^)</DIV> <DIV>First Wandering Giant in Permafrost</DIV> <DIV>Numbfoot hunters</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now, I am not saying those were easy kills.  Tundra terrors I ran about 50%.  However, the risk was fun.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[trysta]

<span><blockquote><hr>goboy wrote:<div></div> <div> </div> <div>Now, I am not saying those were easy kills.  Tundra terrors I ran about 50%.  However, the risk was <i><u><b>fun</b></u></i>.</div> <div> </div><hr></blockquote>And there's the million dollar word. FUN. It was fun because it was the most dangerous thing you could possibly do in this game. You knew that if you fizzled once or a spell was resisted, you were dead. And that was seriously risky, but seriously fun.</span><div></div>

[brow27]

<span><blockquote><hr>Mizzkitty wrote:<p>I don't the devs are listening to us I really don't.  If the expansion is a make or break and they continue along with it pretty much as it is, there are an awful lot of people going to be leaveing EQ2.  Im the head of the largest guild on Unrest most of us also have a toon or three on test, and all of us read the boards.  Want to know what most of the /gu is at night when most are on?  What game are you going to try if the revamp isn't changed?  That's the topic and I'd say over 75% of the active players in my guild will leave EQ2 if things aren't rethought out.</p> <p>Granted a 36second non breakable root MAY have made us too powerful, but did it really?  Was anyone killing even or higher ^ heroics?  Was anyone finding groups of solo mobs so easy as to be boreing?  Was anyone not dieing when everything didn't go exactly right with our current root?  The majority of players are not in uber high end raiding guilds, and don't have access to the really fantastic stuff but we muddle thru, making our roots break will be the death nell for wizards soloing any much over a green single mob, and that is sad.  The Devs all but destroyed wizards on EQlive and they are going to do it here as well that's just sad.  My wizard gets invited to raids on EQlive for one reason, for her mass TP after the raid is done, if she didn't have that they wouldn't want her.  So I no longer do raids with my wizard on EQlive, it's not fun being thought of as cheap transportation and for nothing else.  Here on EQ2 we won't even have that ability, why will any raid group want a wizard?  Oh I know, they are getting too much exp and need debt that would be the reason.</p> <p>Mizzgnomer Class: Lvl 50 Debtmonger formerly known as Wizard</p> <div></div><hr></blockquote>What is it about the combat changes that bothers you so?  The fact that ring of cold is being nerfed?  Let's take a look at what people can do with Ring of Cold. 1. Multiple people have soloed Tundra Jack and Iceberg.  Now not everyone can do this, but the fact that ANYONE can do this is insane.  2. The Pit Champion is rediculously easy with Ring of Cold, even without Ice Comet.  I've stopped killing him because it's boring, but many classes can barely do it. 3. Heroic Mobs.  Most people with decent gear and spell upgrades can solo ^^ mobs with ease.  I regularly kill ^^ white and yellow mobs in Splitpaw, and many people have killed ^^ mobs up to 5x their level.  Have 2 wizards with RoC and you can duo [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] near anything thats not epic or red ^^ (and some wiz duos probably could) 4. Solo Mobs.  REDICULOUSLY easy.  I go into hideout on difficult and can wipe the zone without being touched if I use RoC on every encounter.  If you solo with this, you are practically unstoppable.  Even if the mob resists RoC, drop a stun and then a normal root on it, and you're fine. Ring of Cold IS overpowered, and though of course I love it, as I'm sure all wizards do, changing it was necessary.  It seems like you and your guildies are taking too much from just reading posts about the revamp, as many people are.  It's not just spells that are changing!  They are changing the mobs too, how damage bonuses are calculated, etc.  If you read the posts on the board from goboy (ignore trystaad he's been mr. negative from the beginning) you'll see that stuff is pretty good.  We do more damage now than before, many spells have a lower power cost, and soloing is rediculously easy even without rooting.  When the combat changes come, don't play for 5 minutes and quit.  Learn how things have changed, play for a few weeks with it at least, I really don't think it's as bad as you think it is.</span><div></div>

[GaldorChesf]

<DIV>rediculously easy mobs</DIV> <DIV>rediculously hard mobs</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>nothing in between.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Like some one else said. For the solo player is boring that way.</DIV>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<P>why is it when ever someone says we are not supposed to be able to solo heroic encounters I cringe?</P> <P>Finally a statement was made about a solo player soloing a "full group" heroic encounter.</P> <P>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</P> <P><FONT size=2>posted by<STRONG> MOORGUARD</STRONG></FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2><STRONG>Heroic creature with three up arrows, two creatures with two up arrows, three creatures with one up arrow, or four creatures with no arrows</STRONG> - A solo player in legendary gear with Adept III or higher spells may be able to defeat one of these encounters, but would likely be soundly defeated with lesser equipment and abilities.</FONT></P> <DIV>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>apparantly well equipped players should be able to solo heroic encounters under the new con system.  With the nerf to the wizards ROC and all the roots PLUS the increased cast timers on our DD's & the nerf to parry, it makes soloing them nearly impossible.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>the main problem I see is that gear plays nearly 0 roles in making a wizard successful at killing a heroic.  adept3 spells help, but it was always skill that got you through imho.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I say "nearly" impossible because I happen to know how one can solo them, but I do not know if mana will become an issue with the increased power costs of our spells AND the nerf to our canni line, and if you can get off a full craptacular 4second cast of our biggest nukes before you go splat.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>we'll soon see when this goes live, but what we really needed was to still have 3 roots available to us at any given moment. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>some simple changes that need to be reversed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*keep roc 15 sec duration (fine it was overpowered lasting for 36sec) but keep it unbreakable, and lower its recast to 30s.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>*return ice comet to 3s cast</DIV> <DIV>*return ball of flames to 2s cast</DIV> <DIV>*return immolation to tick ever 1.5seconds</DIV> <DIV>*change new root duration to 15seconds with 10s recast.</DIV> <DIV>*change new lvl 50 magic nuke to 3s cast.</DIV> <DIV>*change ALL aoe spells to 2s cast timers.</DIV> <DIV>*return paralyze to 1s cast (and subsiquent stun spell lines)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[Ghostbeard]

<span><blockquote><hr>IllusiveThoughts wrote:<div></div> <p>why is it when ever someone says we are not supposed to be able to solo heroic encounters I cringe?</p> <p>Finally a statement was made about a solo player soloing a "full group" heroic encounter.</p> <p>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</p> <p><font size="2">posted by<strong> MOORGUARD</strong></font></p> <p><font size="2"><strong>Heroic creature with three up arrows, two creatures with two up arrows, three creatures with one up arrow, or four creatures with no arrows</strong> - A solo player in legendary gear with Adept III or higher spells may be able to defeat one of these encounters, but would likely be soundly defeated with lesser equipment and abilities.</font></p> <div>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</div> <div> </div> <div>apparantly well equipped players should be able to solo heroic encounters under the new con system.  With the nerf to the wizards ROC and all the roots PLUS the increased cast timers on our DD's & the nerf to parry, it makes soloing them nearly impossible.</div> <div> </div><hr></blockquote></span>Excellent, excellent post Illusive. Primo. As I've stated before - *most* of the people on here crowing that RoC is overpowered have characters that are in their low 30's and have never even SEEN RoC, let alone CAST it on anything. And the few that are high enough level to actually understand how valuable RoC is and still brag that it's overpowered are, unfortunately, the kind of players who would presume to speak for ALL us and who constantly characterize anyone who has real concerns about the class as "whining". These are typically the same kind of players who live for PvP. You know the type. Head on over the Warlock forums. I promise you - they are NOT posting over there about how GLAD they are that Bony Grasp is being neutered. Most of them are sick at heart about the new changes - and you won't see many posts about how overpowered they are and that a nerf would be a "good" thing. Only on the Wizard forums will you find geniuses crowing that they are overpowered and could use a good nerfing. Unreal. <div></div>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR> <P>why is it when ever someone says we are not supposed to be able to solo heroic encounters I cringe?</P> <P>Finally a statement was made about a solo player soloing a "full group" heroic encounter.</P> <P>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</P> <P><FONT size=2>posted by<STRONG> MOORGUARD</STRONG></FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2><STRONG>Heroic creature with three up arrows, two creatures with two up arrows, three creatures with one up arrow, or four creatures with no arrows</STRONG> - A solo player in legendary gear with Adept III or higher spells may be able to defeat one of these encounters, but would likely be soundly defeated with lesser equipment and abilities.</FONT></P> <DIV>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>apparantly well equipped players should be able to solo heroic encounters under the new con system.  With the nerf to the wizards ROC and all the roots PLUS the increased cast timers on our DD's & the nerf to parry, it makes soloing them nearly impossible.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>....<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>You are making one mistake in your interpretation of Moorgaurds comments.  He does not use the word should - he uses the word may.  There is a huge difference between may be able to and should be able to.  To me, the word may means it is possible - but unlikely.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

[IllusiveThoughts]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> goboy wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR> <P>why is it when ever someone says we are not supposed to be able to solo heroic encounters I cringe?</P> <P>Finally a statement was made about a solo player soloing a "full group" heroic encounter.</P> <P>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</P> <P><FONT size=2>posted by<STRONG> MOORGUARD</STRONG></FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2><STRONG>Heroic creature with three up arrows, two creatures with two up arrows, three creatures with one up arrow, or four creatures with no arrows</STRONG> - A solo player in legendary gear with Adept III or higher spells may be able to defeat one of these encounters, but would likely be soundly defeated with lesser equipment and abilities.</FONT></P> <DIV>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>apparantly well equipped players should be able to solo heroic encounters under the new con system.  With the nerf to the wizards ROC and all the roots PLUS the increased cast timers on our DD's & the nerf to parry, it makes soloing them nearly impossible.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>....<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>You are making one mistake in your interpretation of Moorgaurds comments.  He does not use the word should - he uses the word may.  There is a huge difference between may be able to and should be able to.  To me, the word may means it is possible - but unlikely.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>you may be right but lets look at the statement logically.</P> <P> </P> <P>statement 1, a well equipped player "may" be able to solo a heroic encounter</P> <P>statement 2, a poorly equipped player "will likely be soundly defeated" by the same heroic encounter solo.</P> <P> </P> <P>it seems pretty loud and clear to me, poorly equipped =defeat, well equipped = chance to win.</P> <P> </P> <P>just like pret revamp we weren't guaranteed a win against heroic encounters, in fact I found myself running from about 30-40% of the fights because of resists.  That didn't guarantee I'd win, but i "may" be able to solo that heroic encounter, and did very often.  see my point?<BR></P> <p>Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on <span class=date_text>08-24-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:26 PM</span>

[Zyphius]

<DIV><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR> <BR> <P>just like pret revamp we weren't guaranteed a win against heroic encounters, <STRONG>in fact I found myself running from about 30-40% of the fights</STRONG> because of resists.  That didn't guarantee I'd win, but i "may" be able to solo that heroic encounter, and did very often.  see my point?<BR></P> <P>Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on <SPAN class=date_text>08-24-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>03:26 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>And based of the cited intentions, will be much more frequently (if not consistently).<BR></DIV>

[blynchehaun]

< statement 1, a well equipped player "may" be able to solo a heroic encounter > Statement 3: lead *may* spontaneausly transmute into gold. Just don't hold your breath. With stating anymore qualifiers than he (moorguard) has, people who feel they <b>should</b> be able to solo *cough*<b>group</b>*cough* encounters will continue to interpret "may" as a validation. And will continue to whine when they can't. Meanwhile, the rest of us will solo solo-mobs, and group up for group mobs..... /shrug <div></div>

[goboy]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> goboy wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> IllusiveThoughts wrote:<BR> <P>why is it when ever someone says we are not supposed to be able to solo heroic encounters I cringe?</P> <P>Finally a statement was made about a solo player soloing a "full group" heroic encounter.</P> <P>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</P> <P><FONT size=2>posted by<STRONG> MOORGUARD</STRONG></FONT></P> <P><FONT size=2><STRONG>Heroic creature with three up arrows, two creatures with two up arrows, three creatures with one up arrow, or four creatures with no arrows</STRONG> - A solo player in legendary gear with Adept III or higher spells may be able to defeat one of these encounters, but would likely be soundly defeated with lesser equipment and abilities.</FONT></P> <DIV>__________________________________________________ __________________________________________</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>apparantly well equipped players should be able to solo heroic encounters under the new con system.  With the nerf to the wizards ROC and all the roots PLUS the increased cast timers on our DD's & the nerf to parry, it makes soloing them nearly impossible.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV>....<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>You are making one mistake in your interpretation of Moorgaurds comments.  He does not use the word should - he uses the word may.  There is a huge difference between may be able to and should be able to.  To me, the word may means it is possible - but unlikely.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>you may be right but lets look at the statement logically.</P> <P> </P> <P>statement 1, a well equipped player "may" be able to solo a heroic encounter</P> <P>statement 2, a poorly equipped player "will likely be soundly defeated" by the same heroic encounter solo.</P> <P> </P> <P>it seems pretty loud and clear to me, poorly equipped =defeat, well equipped = chance to win.</P> <P> </P> <P>just like pret revamp we weren't guaranteed a win against heroic encounters, in fact I found myself running from about 30-40% of the fights because of resists.  That didn't guarantee I'd win, but i "may" be able to solo that heroic encounter, and did very often.  see my point?<BR></P> <P>Message Edited by IllusiveThoughts on <SPAN class=date_text>08-24-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>03:26 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Now the problem with the pre-combat changes - I was runnign 50-60% win rate vs. heroic mobs.  Now that may not sound great, but my gear is far from good - in fact it is probably below average.   That is one of the challenges playing on test is getting good gear.   At the time, I was wearing mostly an assortment of tundra walker and quested armor.</P> <P>I do have an assortment of adept III spells - but the only one I can recall using (often) on heroics was ball of flames.  I did not make 50 until after the combat changes, so I have no idea how easy/hard a heroic would have been with ROC and Ice Comet.</P> <P> </P>

[Zyphius]

<P>I totally agree that heroic mobs should not be feasibly defeated solo, period. That defeats the purpose of them being heroic mobs. However, I do feel they need to leave our roots ALONE. I have yet to kill a heroic (even a "just turned grey" one) before RoC expired. At that point it doesnt take many hits to take me out (as you all know). Since they are making heroics tougher, there is no reason to nerf our roots. It will be [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] near impossible to solo them with the roots as they currently are (I actually think they should make the tether line a little stronger). So, to sum up my feelings on this: For the most part, I like what i've read, with the exception of the root nerfing.</P> <P>On a side note. Those complaining (or rejoicing) on the differences being made per wizard vs warlock, here is my take (we can agree to disagree if you wish):</P> <P>Warlocks deal in poison and disease. Let's focus on disease first. There are really only two types, those that are contagious, and those that aren't. Most are, however. That being said, the disease line should, primarily, be AoE. It just makes sense. Add a dd nuke or two, but the line should be primarily AoE. Now lets focus on poison. How many poisons kill instantly? Not many... cyanide maybe, bout it. Most kill slowly, some much more quickly than others. My point is, the poison line should be, primarily, DoT. Make a couple be a mini-nuke with high DoT. That, also, just makes sense. Now look at the wizard line. We bring down balls of fire, and spears of ice, etc. Those, by design (and makes sense), should and are primarily DD. Sure, give us a couple AoE's (chilling wind - its a freezing wind, so yea, it should hit them all), but our powers that be are, primarily, the type that would only effect one mob. I think SOE is just trying to make sense, not actually nerf. Now, they may need to up a few things on the warlock side, because I don't want them to get nerfed, period. All I really want is to do the massive damage that made me sign up as a wizard in the first place. But I am trying to look at the big picture, and maybe come up with good reasoning as to why warlocks were made primarily AoE and DoT and wizards primarily DD by SOE.</P>