some SOLO days R over, try MM today. great but now at least let us HIT raid mobs. (cold immune) [Archive]

SalBlu

06-22-2005, 04:33 PM

<DIV>Even though i dont like the change, I think it is for the best. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I did my time soloing Darkcoil, The Black Queen, Lavaborn, Cinderpede, Tundra Jack and Iceberg, and the Bastion of Flames, but really... when you think about it... should we have been able to do so at all? No... I knew it in the back of my head, and just took advantage of the situation while it lasted. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>With the new change, they basically "Woke up" the mobs so that they finally realize that they are only rooted in place, and not stifled down as well. Yes, this means that we lose a good ammount of our solo power, but it doesnt mean that we lose it all. We are STILL able to fight melee type mobs solo style. This is fine with me. We are also still able to keep groups of mobs locked down when in small group settings so that we can take them out one at a time.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>This is all going to bring about a more willingness to group on everyone's part. The new complaint is going to be that no one will take a Wizard over a Warlock, but I would have to turn that complaint down straight out. In group settings, (non epic) there really isnt much difference between the two classes. We get outdamaged by a small ammount, but a good portion of the time we can deal equal damage. With spell fixes going in eventually, we'll hopefully have our day of reduced spell costs, fixed spells, and reduced resistances.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just hang in there guys. The change is not breaking the game for us. We'll be alright. This is only a change in the solo game that we were not supposed to be successful in in the first place. Just hang in there.</DIV>

trysta

06-22-2005, 07:37 PM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SalBluee wrote:<BR> <DIV>Even though i dont like the change, I think it is for the best. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Just hang in there guys. The change is not breaking the game for us. We'll be alright. This is only a change in the solo game that we were not supposed to be successful in in the first place. Just hang in there.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE>Good positive post, but where exactly are we supposed to be successful? At level 50, the content at the present time is comprised of mostly raid instances, where (although I haven't experienced too much of it) we are supposedly so gimped as to be ineffective. Other classes can solo these mobs as well as or better than we could before this change, and now we can't even hope to accomplish these feats. So what do we have over other classes post-nerf? The only thing I can think of is using our health-to-power spells in the tradeskill instance...<BR>

SalBlu

06-22-2005, 10:12 PM

<P>Well... dont get down on what people will tell you about our uses in raids, because the good of us there far outweighs the bad. We ARE effective damage dealers in every raid we go to, and just because our ice spells are resisted does not [Removed for Content] us.</P> <P>And honestly... I have never, and will never see a tank solo the same stuff that I was soloing. The easiest of the bunch was Lavaborn, and even then, for a melee fighter to solo him would be a very tough if not impossible thing to do. Now with these mobs casting spells all the time, this is even more evident.</P> <P>Dont listen to everything you hear here Trystaad. There are alot of people that just believe we should be the end all in damage dealers, and sadly, that is not the case, nor is it a necessity. Instead of asking for a fix for resistances or spell power usage, people will ask for what they think is right, being an increase in power or a nerf to Warlock damage output. Which do you think is the most justified? Nerfing one class to bring you more in line with each other? Or making sure that your spell usage is brought up to speed in terms of mob resistance and spell cost. </P> <P>Power transfers will also be spit on by alot of people calling them a "Chanter's Power" or the "Job of a Healer". While I think that this belief is along the right lines, I DO get a great deal of satisfaction from dumping about 400 power on someone like a healer who is effectively keeping a raid or group alive. There is a certain lvl of happiness gained in knowing that if you hadnt dumped some power on that person, you'd most likely be dead right now. Not to mention people WILL thank you whole heartedly for that even in the midst of a fight.</P> <P>So... the mobs I was soloing were:</P> <P>Darkcoil<BR>Cinderpede<BR>Lavaborn<BR>The Black Queen<BR>Tundra Jack and Iceberg<BR>(and the Efreeti Lord in the Bastion of Flames)</P> <P>Four of those mobs are deep down inside Solusek's Eye, and surrounded by MANY smaller mobs. These mobs are heavy hitters both in and out of melee combat. I knew full well for a very long time that it was strange that a mob WITH ranged ability would just stay silent while rooted, and yet I didnt think twice about it because it was gaining me coin. Not only coin... but items. From Lavaborn alone i've looted 2 Ebon Coins which I gave away to people that needed them for armors. </P> <P>Fighting, and winning easily against those mobs just was not intended, and IMHO, a change to Wizard/Warlock soloability was looming on the horizon for a VERY long time.</P>

Lady Uaelr

06-22-2005, 11:52 PM

<DIV>That is a good way to look at it but wizards need to be fixed as do all other classes.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We can only sit and wait to see what is coming.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV>

SalBlu

06-23-2005, 12:00 AM

Yep... for now that is our best bet.

OneBadAli

06-23-2005, 12:51 AM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Power transfers will also be spit on by alot of people calling them a "Chanter's Power" or the "Job of a Healer". While I think that this belief is along the right lines, I DO get a great deal of satisfaction from dumping about 400 power on someone like a healer who is effectively keeping a raid or group alive. There is a certain lvl of happiness gained in knowing that if you hadnt dumped some power on that person, you'd most likely be dead right now. Not to mention people WILL thank you whole heartedly for that even in the midst of a fight.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Your entitled to your opinion, but its just your opinion. Myself, and the majority of wizards DO NOT GET SATISFACTION FROM BEING A MANA PUMP INSTEAD OF A DPS'er. When i say this im referring to raid mobs, i know we do damage solo, but i cant stand soloing especially after the mob buff's. The resistances/immunes need to be adjusted and our power consumption needs to be adjusted, thats all i really ask. A little more dps would bring us in line with warlocks, which is how it should be. I would be happy nonetheless if just our resistances/immunes were adjusted, and our power consumption was brought in line with warlocks. </DIV> <DIV>Unless you have an under equipped warlock you will get out dps'ed everytime. I have a 50 wizard with 16 tier 5 adept 3's, 5 fabled items, a few incombat mana items, and i still run out of power about 1/4th or 1/2th the way through the raid, while my warlock guildmate is 2 levels lower then me, only a few adept 3's, and constantly spams nukes/debuffs/aoe's the second the timer is up, he never ever ever runs out of power and he only has 1 incombat mana item. His dps is double sometimes triple mine. Its stupid, your just a hater IMO dunno why you continue to ignore the facts and then state that being a mana pump is a statisfaction for a dps class. Your a joke.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its absolutely silly that you get off on that, im sorry for you. I think something slow like checkers would also be your style, its not for me. I enjoy damage, i was told wizards were damage, and not utility, this is what i want. This is also what the majority of wizards want, the far majority. Your definitely in the minority when it comes to your thinking of what a wizzy can and cant do, and what a wizzy should and shouldnt do.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You can continue to disagree with every other wizard thats fine, but your idea of what a wizard should be is completely different from what we were told by SOE a wizard would be(which was at the top of the food chain when it comes to dps). Hence i got shafted and am very very disappointed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So do the rest of us wizzy's a favor and shut your pie hole, your in the far minority when it comes to thinking what a wizzy should and shouldnt be.</DIV>

dustye

06-23-2005, 01:30 AM

My account is cancelled until they fix wizards then. This is the only thing that made the game fun anymore (WOW, MANAPUMPING ON RAIDS IS [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ING EXCITING AS [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]!!!!!!!!) <div></div>

SalBlu

06-23-2005, 02:50 AM

<div><font color="#ff0000" size="2"><i><b>Its absolutely silly that you get off on that, im sorry for you. I think something slow like checkers would also be your style, its not for me. I enjoy damage, i was told wizards were damage, and not utility, this is what i want. This is also what the majority of wizards want, the far majority. Your definitely in the minority when it comes to your thinking of what a wizzy can and cant do, and what a wizzy should and shouldnt do.</b></i></font></div> <div><font color="#ff0000" size="2"><i><b> </b></i></font></div> <div><font color="#ff0000" size="2"><i><b>You can continue to disagree with every other wizard thats fine, but your idea of what a wizard should be is completely different from what we were told by SOE a wizard would be(which was at the top of the food chain when it comes to dps). Hence i got shafted and am very very disappointed.</b></i></font></div> <div><font color="#ff0000" size="2"><i><b> </b></i></font></div> <div><font color="#ff0000" size="2"><i><b>So do the rest of us wizzy's a favor and shut your pie hole, your in the far minority when it comes to thinking what a wizzy should and shouldnt be. </b></i><font color="#ffffff" size="3">I dont appreciate personal attacks, and I've done nothing but put forward good and true information. Being a minority or a majority has nothing to do with the state of the Wizard case at hand, and until I see anything definitive about Wizards being more than they should be right now, then i've done nothing wrong. Once Moorgard comes forth and tells us that we were supposed to be the all powerful, end all, mean machines that every Tom, [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot], and Jane say we are supposed to be, i'll go ahead and eat my words. But this does not lead away from the fact that aside from damage we are a VERY capable class. We are a VERY good class, and if you're so jealous about power then maybe you should roll up a Warlock. There's nothing wrong with that. But keep in mind that the spell changes are on the way soon, and if I know SOE, changes are going to be made that will redefine Wizards and Warlocks from the ground up. </font></font></div> <div></div>

Sorano

06-23-2005, 03:07 AM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> SalBluee wrote:<BR> <DIV><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2><I><B><BR></B></I><FONT color=#ffffff size=3> Once Moorgard comes forth and tells us that we were supposed to be the all powerful, end all, mean machines that every Tom, [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot], and Jane say we are supposed to be, i'll go ahead and eat my words. But this does not lead away from the fact that aside from damage we are a VERY capable class.<BR><BR><BR></FONT></FONT></DIV> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>So you want to hear it form Moorgard himself then?</P> <P> </P> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc66>There have been questions recently about where wizards and warlocks are intended to fit in terms of damage output, as some players are concerned that these classes aren't fulfilling their role in this regard. I thought I'd address some of these questions in a general way, with the understanding that specific answers will have to wait until we have evaluated the damage output of all classes. This post does not promise any timeframe for when changes may occur.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc66></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc66><FONT color=#ff0066>Generally speaking, wizards and warlocks are intended to have the highest overall damage output, with the two subclasses being roughly equivalent to one another</FONT>. If wizards and warlocks are not achieving that level of damage output now (and we agree there are cases that they are not), we will be adjusting class balance accordingly.</FONT></DIV> <P> </P> <P>Can you honestly sit there and say that wizards and warlocks are doing roughly equivalent damage on raid mobs? Wizards are not only complaining over the fact that warlocks are outdamaging us, but also because nearly every single other class in the game can as well in raid situations. Raid mob resistances are borked. If you think that they are intended to be that way I will point you towards a change made to melee mob resistances a little while ago. Some raid mobs were completely immune to scout damage and they were unable to fulfill their DPS role in raids. Now scouts are THE utility class yet SOE moved to change raid mob resistances so that they could do DPS on raids. Sure wizards have mana feeding ability so we are not completely useless on raids, but that is not our role it is just utility. Our role is primarily DPS and we cannot fulfill that in raids. SOE cannot justify leaving raid mobs resistances as they are, especially given the change they made to melee resistances. No matter what spell changes they give us in the upcoming combat revamp, if raid mob resistances are not looked at, we will still be in the same boat we are in now! Everytime you post that we are fine, there isn't anything wrong with the class, you make it harder for us to get any fixes because it just confuses things by providing contradictory information. <BR></P>

Asterra

06-23-2005, 06:52 AM

<span><span><blockquote><hr>SalBluee wrote:<p>Well... dont get down on what people will tell you about our uses in raids, because the good of us there far outweighs the bad. We ARE effective damage dealers in every raid we go to</p><hr></blockquote></span></span><span>Hmm. Look, I can appreciate the desire to maintain a positive outlook on matters, but the above really does cross the threshold into "dodgy misinformation", if I may euphemize. I'm not going to go so far as to question whether or not you've actually attended garden variety raids like Orcishwastes Caverns, Shattered Stillness (Firemyst), Meeting of the Minds, etc., but it simply isn't possible to say, with both authority and a straight face, that Wizards provide good damage on such raids. <span> <blockquote><hr>There are alot of people that just believe we should be the end all in damage dealers, and sadly, that is not the case, nor is it a necessity.<hr></blockquote></span>Perhaps Moorgard should never have admitted that Sorcerers are supposed to be at the top of the DPS charts. The incompatibility between that admission (which, I should stress, is in agreement with the general perception of those who picked the class) and the reality that people have been stuck with for the game's entire history, is stark. I don't at all think it is unusual or a matter of incredulity that people feel Wizards should be the kings of DPS. It would be a far greater curiosity if Wizards were currently the DPS champs they're supposed to be and people started lobbying for better manadumping capabilities and longer stuns. </span><div></div>

ailees

06-23-2005, 12:00 PM

I read Salblue's post, then Onebadallien's answer with : "So do the rest of us wizzy's a favor and shut your pie hole, your in the far minority when it comes to thinking what a wizzy should and shouldnt be" I cannot understand that she should not say what she thinks just because you think she's in a FAR MINORITY. I don't see why she should not say it. Or do you think that having the majority gives you all rights ? BTW, I totally agree with Salblue, I'm happy with my wizz, as she is. Yesterday in a raid, raid leader told me "take care of X and Y, they <b>must </b>have power or we will wipe" ; I was very happy being useful. Of course as a player, I'm much more a <i>teamer</i> than anything else. I don't like soloing, and I don't care if I am not in the top 10 damagers of the server. I don't' see why a player allows himself to forbid us to speak (or type). <div></div>

SalBlu

06-23-2005, 03:12 PM

<div><font size="2"><i><b><font color="#66cc66">There have been questions recently about where wizards and warlocks are intended to fit in terms of damage output, as some players are concerned that these classes aren't fulfilling their role in this regard. I thought I'd address some of these questions in a general way, with the understanding that specific answers will have to wait until we have evaluated the damage output of all classes. This post does not promise any timeframe for when changes may occur.</font></b></i></font></div> <div><font size="2"><i><b> </b></i></font></div> <div><font size="2"><i><b><font color="#66cc66"><font color="#ff0066">Generally speaking, wizards and warlocks are intended to have the highest overall damage output, with the two subclasses being roughly equivalent to one another</font>. If wizards and warlocks are not achieving that level of damage output now (and we agree there are cases that they are not), we will be adjusting class balance accordingly. </font></b></i><font color="#66cc66"><font color="#ffffff">Thats all well and good, but it still doesnt say raid mobs, and his statement can be taken a number of ways. Highest damage output over time, highest damage output via single nuke, highest damage output through single encounter, highest damage output in heroic encounter... highest damage output in a raid situation. Let him come forward and say that Wizards are supposed to outdamage everyone in every situation. That's not going to happen. And this statement by Moorgard was not made in direct relation to our abilities in raids. Most likely he was making a general comment in regards to small group setting. And if you've bothered to read any of my other posts, I've ALWAYS said that it is raid mob resistances that need to be re-adjusted, and not the Wizard's spell lineup. I was never against that in the first place, but I guess in everyone's effort to nay-say me that was overlooked. Like I said before, there is nothing wrong with Wizards besides a broken Protoflame, spell cost totals, and EPIC resistances. <font color="#ff0000"><i><b> </b></i></font></font></font><font color="#ff0000"><i><b>Everytime you post that we are fine, there isn't anything wrong with the class, you make it harder for us to get any fixes because it just confuses things by providing contradictory information. </b></i><font color="#ffffff">Allright, but that neglects the fact that some of us still do enjoy how we play our wizards at this time right now. Just because someone labels me as the "minority" doesnt lead away from the fact that I can still post my feelings about the class, and about the direction we have been following. IMO, besides 3 things, we ARE fine. We are fulfilling what we were meant to do, and I knew what our role was going to be ever since I researched the change from Sorceror to either Wizard or Warlock way back in December. I still have a printout sitting here on my desk as a matter of fact that details spells for each class, and how they lined up to each other in the progression to lvl 50. I see our Depart... and yep... I see our Power Transfers. They've been there from the very beginning. </font></font></font></div> <div></div>

Sorano

06-23-2005, 04:35 PM

<DIV><FONT color=#66cc66>nothing else to say, do the same instances everyday and today MM is really different (u can tell why if u try). Just if u going to fix somthings so we can't solo this stuff make sure we have other stuff to do like be useful in the raid (not just powerpump and resists), maybe so we can do cold nuke dmg?. Change the raid mob reisists.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc66></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#66cc66></FONT> </DIV> <DIV>The above paragraph is the OP's message. All he is asking for is a change to raid resists, yet you respond with a post on warlock damage and how wizards aren't much different and we should just suck it up and stop complaining. That is why people are perhaps missing your other posts in support of changing raid mob resistances. Once you get to level 50 there is nothing much left to do except raid, so for a wizard the current endgame is not something to look forward to. It's a pretty big class breaking issue for me anyway that raid mob resistances make my character pretty much useless for anything but manafeeding. In fact it's such a big issue that I don't really play my wizzy much anymore. I honestly have more fun levelling my alt. I am giving SOE time to fix things with the big combat revamp, but if after the changes wizards and casters in general still continue to be second class to melee, I will be taking my money elsewhere. </DIV>

SalBlu

06-23-2005, 04:59 PM

<DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT size=2><FONT color=#ff0000>The above paragraph is the OP's message. All he is asking for is a change to raid resists, yet you respond with a post on warlock damage and how wizards aren't much different and we should just suck it up and stop complaining. That is why people are perhaps missing your other posts in support of changing raid mob resistances. Once you get to level 50 there is nothing much left to do except raid, so for a wizard the current endgame is not something to look forward to. It's a pretty big class breaking issue for me anyway that raid mob resistances make my character pretty much useless for anything but manafeeding. In fact it's such a big issue that I don't really play my wizzy much anymore. I honestly have more fun levelling my alt. I am giving SOE time to fix things with the big combat revamp, but if after the changes wizards and casters in general still continue to be second class to melee, I will be taking my money elsewhere.</FONT> </FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV> <P>I never said suck it up and stop complaining. I said:</P> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#66ccff size=2>Just hang in there guys. The change is not breaking the game for us. We'll be alright. This is only a change in the solo game that we were not supposed to be successful in in the first place. Just hang in there.</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I feel that was a pretty positive statement on my part. I do truly believe that we just need to hang in there and wait and see what happens with the spell revamp that everyone is talking about. I'm sure alot of issues that we have brought up both in the Wizarding forums and in other forums will be addressed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I'm sorry... I should have quoted from the PM I received about this thread. That's why there was mention of the Wizard/Warlock issue. I had a question directed at me that read:</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#33cc00 size=2>If you see the new thread that got created, the OP says that all we need is raid resistnances dropped so that we can do damage again with a ful set of spells in the form of nukes. What is saying now that a group will pick me over a warlock? I know what you'll say, and that would be that we are the equal blah blah blah, but you're dead wrong in every respect of this game and you should shut up you know nothing idiot. Dont bother replying or posting [Removed for Content].</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#33cc00 size=2></FONT></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV>I didnt feel that posting that message would be helpful to this post, and would only cause for more hate. But that is why I mentioned Warlock vs Wizard grouping only briefly. I had it in mind when I was typing the post, and I think instead of giving into a flame fest with the above posted person via PMs I tried to make light of it through a valid and non-inflammatory message.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Listen... I dont want to be the hated one here, but there are different points of view on the class. In my situation, I still think that we are a very good and legitimate class that has all the capabilities they need save for a few EPIC raid resists, power consumption, and a broken Protoflame. If you dont agree with me thats fine, I can respect that some people dont have the same views as myself. But I dont post to get flamed. My posting is derived from someone who likes to play Wizards as they are, and copes with what i've been given. If we get upgraded farther down the line, so be it. I'd be happy to get a spell boost because i'm a power hungry woman in the end, but I also dont see it as a justified improvement to put us so far out ahead of the pack when we are still a viable class in and of itself right now.</DIV>

Asterra

06-23-2005, 06:46 PM

It's a little difficult to accept the idea that Wizards are currently an acceptably viable class when I play one and don't have any particular penchant for unjustified optimism. As a case in point, my guild recently recruited three Warlocks, but in its entire six month history has not recruited a single new Wizard, and this is due to very down-to-earth facts about the viability of Wizards - facts which have everything to do with role fulfillment and nothing to do with hope for the future, particularly not with half a year of relative pointlessness.

SalBlu

06-23-2005, 07:00 PM

<DIV>Well... I'm sorry for that. I think it is a mistake on your guild's part to only justify recruiting people in relation to their damage dealing abilities. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I know that last night, when my guild and I fought Darathar, my 1000+ points of fire resist were a welcome addition to where I was. Between myself and the Warden in my group, we had buffed for about 2500 fire resist, topping our main tank off at about 7000 fire resist. We effectively shrugged off Darathar's breath attack having an average resistance of about 6300 fire resist each.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Heh... we didnt win though. It was our first time fighting Darathar, and we didnt have the first clue as to how to go about defeating him. Tried many different strategies, but the best we could do was get him down to 79%. We're trying to formulate a new plan now as to how to get him down.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But anyway... its too bad your guild is not more appreciative of Wizards. I know my guild has more Wizards than Warlocks. I think we have 6 Wizards, and only 2 Warlocks. And we only really have myself and one or two of the other Wizards in raids. The Warlocks dont tend to join us for some reason.</DIV>

Yaotzi

06-24-2005, 06:00 PM

<div></div>darathar does not equal daily raid zones, wizards do not fill their class role, hell for the all instances (just about) wizards are the most useless and all other classes (except rangers..haha jk guys =P) would be more beneficial to the group. now ive checked out your guild a little saloma and honestly i dont think you have the right to say "oh wizards aren't so bad" when you do 1 zone 3 times a week, trying doing 5 instances,plus the other zones with lockout timers every day and tell me how you feel about wizards in 3-4weeks of no dps and constanst feeding to feel useful. edited because i cant type <div></div><p>Message Edited by Yaotzin! on <span class=date_text>06-24-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:02 AM</span>

yzyh

06-24-2005, 06:05 PM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> OneBadAlien wrote:<BR><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Power transfers will also be spit on by alot of people calling them a "Chanter's Power" or the "Job of a Healer". While I think that this belief is along the right lines, I DO get a great deal of satisfaction from dumping about 400 power on someone like a healer who is effectively keeping a raid or group alive. There is a certain lvl of happiness gained in knowing that if you hadnt dumped some power on that person, you'd most likely be dead right now. Not to mention people WILL thank you whole heartedly for that even in the midst of a fight.<BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Your entitled to your opinion, but its just your opinion. Myself, and the majority of wizards DO NOT GET SATISFACTION FROM BEING A MANA PUMP INSTEAD OF A DPS'er. When i say this im referring to raid mobs, i know we do damage solo, but i cant stand soloing especially after the mob buff's. The resistances/immunes need to be adjusted and our power consumption needs to be adjusted, thats all i really ask. A little more dps would bring us in line with warlocks, which is how it should be. I would be happy nonetheless if just our resistances/immunes were adjusted, and our power consumption was brought in line with warlocks. </DIV> <DIV>Unless you have an under equipped warlock you will get out dps'ed everytime. I have a 50 wizard with 16 tier 5 adept 3's, 5 fabled items, a few incombat mana items, and i still run out of power about 1/4th or 1/2th the way through the raid, while my warlock guildmate is 2 levels lower then me, only a few adept 3's, and constantly spams nukes/debuffs/aoe's the second the timer is up, he never ever ever runs out of power and he only has 1 incombat mana item. His dps is double sometimes triple mine. Its stupid, your just a hater IMO dunno why you continue to ignore the facts and then state that being a mana pump is a statisfaction for a dps class. Your a joke.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Its absolutely silly that you get off on that, im sorry for you. I think something slow like checkers would also be your style, its not for me. I enjoy damage, i was told wizards were damage, and not utility, this is what i want. This is also what the majority of wizards want, the far majority. Your definitely in the minority when it comes to your thinking of what a wizzy can and cant do, and what a wizzy should and shouldnt do.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You can continue to disagree with every other wizard thats fine, but your idea of what a wizard should be is completely different from what we were told by SOE a wizard would be(which was at the top of the food chain when it comes to dps). Hence i got shafted and am very very disappointed.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So do the rest of us wizzy's a favor and shut your pie hole, your in the far minority when it comes to thinking what a wizzy should and shouldnt be.</DIV><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>If wizard are so bad and warlock are so powerfull. Why do I always see a way more Wizard then warlock ? Even when I do a /who all wizard 20 30 and /who all warlock 20 30.</P> <P> </P> <P>Also wizard can dish big dps in raid even if you can't use ice comet most of the time due to resist problem. Yeah sure without these ice spell you wont deal dm as good as a warlock. But you still be a big DPS class.</P> <P> </P> <P>Then if you don't want to be a mana dump. Just let it know to your raid former b4 the raid start. If your guild is unhappy about that. Leave your guild and join another one.</P> <DIV>I am telling that their is many class that need balance b4 the wizard. Lets say chanters, shamans, SK.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And raid speaking I think its worst for the bards and paladin to be rezz bot then wizard beeing mana dump.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>No Wizard are not completly balanced yet thats a sure thing. But they are not that bad as some of you syaing. I think that I do see more whinning from the Wizard comunity then I can see from the real gimped class.</DIV>

Yaotzi

06-24-2005, 06:16 PM

sigh im going to have to make a post now show rough estimates of how much damage our spells do percent wise versus the daily raid mobs.. <div></div>

SalBlu

06-24-2005, 06:16 PM

<P><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2>darathar does not equal daily raid zones, wizards do not fill their class role, hell for the all instances (just about) wizards are the most useless and all other classes (except rangers..haha jk guys =P) would be more beneficial to the group. now ive checked out your guild a little saloma and honestly i dont think you have the right to say "oh wizards aren't so bad" when you do 1 zone 3 times a week, trying doing 5 instances,plus the other zones with lockout timers every day and tell me how you feel about wizards in 3-4weeks of no dps and constanst feeding to feel useful.<BR></FONT></EM></STRONG></P> <P>We dont do 1 zone three nights a week. We do multiple zones, upwards of 2-4 instances every night Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. So if you're not on the Antonia Bayle server, or following my raid group to our raids, I dont see how you're able to make a general statement as to what my guild is and is not capable of. Besides... what does my guild have to do with what a Wizard is capable of?</P> <P>I do upwards of 10-15 raids a week with my guild, not to mention I am invited to join in on NON-GUILD oriented raids other times. I make it to between 15 and 20 raids a week.</P> <P>I've been a lvl 50 Raid Wizard since the beginning of March, so before you set out to know what i've been doing, what i'm capable of, and how much I raid, you might first ask me for clarification. </P> <DIV>I'm not the noob lvl 50 Wizard you're painting me to be.</DIV>

Lady Uaelr

06-24-2005, 06:54 PM

<DIV>I really think this bantering is so needless. What is the point. Everyone is entiteld to their opinion.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Yes, wizards do get many resists on raids and the spells do upwards of 10-20% of their intended damage.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I understand everyone selected the wizard sub-class to deal devastating damage.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>What is the point of arguing or debating about something you have no control over. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You have to sit and wait for the changes to go live. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As a wizard you can destroy adds quickly and when the epic is about <40% health I have noticed that all my spells land more effectively.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I have dealt with the many changes and so have you. Just sit and wait and then decide if this is the game you want to be playing.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Take Care and Please stop the verbal abuse. Just becuase someone writes something positive does not mean SOE will read it and not fix anything.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Faarwolf has made it very clear that the people that post on the forums are a very small portion of the community and the people that post here are not an accurate representation of the general consensus.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>So save your energy and focus them on more productive things.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you are bored and want to push buttons then by all means rip eachothers eyebrows out.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Take Care Everyone.</DIV>

BlakMagi

06-27-2005, 10:49 AM

<DIV>its still possible to solo caster mobs. i still solo lavaborn and MM everyday, bastion is a lot harder but also still possible to solo.</DIV>

OneBadAli

06-27-2005, 06:34 PM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Yaotzin! wrote:<BR> darathar does not equal daily raid zones, wizards do not fill their class role, hell for the all instances (just about) wizards are the most useless and all other classes (except rangers..haha jk guys =P) would be more beneficial to the group. now ive checked out your guild a little saloma and honestly i dont think you have the right to say "oh wizards aren't so bad" when you do 1 zone 3 times a week, trying doing 5 instances,plus the other zones with lockout timers every day and tell me how you feel about wizards in 3-4weeks of no dps and constanst feeding to feel useful.<BR><BR>edited because i cant type<BR> <P>Message Edited by Yaotzin! on <SPAN class=date_text>06-24-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>07:02 AM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Wow She's the biggest hater of wizard balance, yet she doesnt even raid enough to truely understand the problems we have. I knew it....</P> <P>It figures someone with a mouth like hers doesnt even know what she's talking about. Go figure.....</P> <P>My guild does about 5 epic instances a night and have been doing so forever, i truely understand just how useless we are. She claims in a reply about how helpful she was for her heat resistances, lolz. That should justify all the balance problems we have? We can give a heat reistance buff and we can feed mana in raids, that makes us the true dps'ers were suppose to be?</P> <P>Its people like her that make me sick, they really dont do enough epic zones to truely understand how many mobs are immune to cold and highly resistant to heat. Yet she can come on here every daily and constantly shoot down 100's of wizards complaining about balance. I really hope that she will stop posting since she really doesnt know what she's talking about. Even if she continues to blab off about how well off we are, enough of us know she doesnt know what she's talking about.</P> <P> </P> <P> </P>

SalBlu

06-27-2005, 07:19 PM

<P>I guess you didnt read the response I made to him in regards to how much I raid on a nightly basis, so if you missed it, here's what I said:</P> <DIV> <P><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#66ccff size=2>"We dont do 1 zone three nights a week. We do multiple zones, upwards of 2-4 instances every night Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. So if you're not on the Antonia Bayle server, or following my raid group to our raids, I dont see how you're able to make a general statement as to what my guild is and is not capable of. Besides... what does my guild have to do with what a Wizard is capable of?</FONT></EM></STRONG></P> <P><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#66ccff size=2>I do upwards of 10-15 raids a week with my guild, not to mention I am invited to join in on NON-GUILD oriented raids other times. I make it to between 15 and 20 raids a week.</FONT></EM></STRONG></P> <P><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#66ccff size=2>I've been a lvl 50 Raid Wizard since the beginning of March, so before you set out to know what i've been doing, what i'm capable of, and how much I raid, you might first ask me for clarification. </FONT></EM></STRONG></P> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#66ccff size=2>I'm not the noob lvl 50 Wizard you're painting me to be."</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#66ccff size=2></FONT></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV>So... do youplay on AB? Have you been tracking my raid progress? Do you know what my guild does on a nightly basis, and for that matter, which raids we are completing on our raid nights? Do you know which other guilds I raid with during the week, and which pick up raids I take part in?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>No... you dont. I took part in raids last week that covered 23 instances. That's 3 per night if you try to break it out evenly.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Instead of flaming me and hurling insults, why is it so hard to understand that there is someone out there that is satisfied with our abilities? I dont appreciate being insulted when i've got a right to speak my mind about what i'm capable of as a wizard. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2></FONT></EM></STRONG> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2>... Wow She's the biggest hater of wizard balance, yet she doesnt even raid enough to truely understand the problems we have. I knew it</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2></FONT></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2>... It figures someone with a mouth like hers doesnt even know what she's talking about. Go figure</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2></FONT></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2>... Even if she continues to blab off about how well off we are, enough of us know she doesnt know what she's talking about.</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT color=#ff0000 size=2></FONT></EM></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV>Yep... i dont know what i'm talking about. I've only been a Wizard since December, and lvl 50 since March. Oh... I guess I havent been to every raid in the game, and havent been successful in every single one barring Darathar and Froglok EPIC.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I dont appreciate the insults, and it only makes you look petty. If you have a disagreement with what I say... fine. I can respect that, and know that there is another view besides my own here. To make an argument by saying that I dont know what i'm talking about, stating that I dont raid when I DO to a large extent, and throwing a pointed accusation out that i'm opposed to change is not debate, its berating. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>You have an issue with what I say? Fine. But at least respond to it in a way that I can read through without seeing insults. Put forth some information besides complaints about what I say. I'm not an idiot, and I dont deserve to be treated as such.</DIV></DIV>

RogueThrill

06-27-2005, 09:54 PM

<P>I am sick and tired of people complaining about the Wizard end game. There are mobs we can't hit with cold. There are mobs we can't hit with heat. There are VERY FEW mobs we can't hit wiht both (although they exist). As an example, the other day when the guild I am apping tried to kill a contested mob I over aggroed it and got smashed. A contested mob. Sure,we suck in the Meeting of the Minds. Sure, I have to use my Master 1 Ice Spike a lot (it's a great spell, even if it is level 15). But we still do pretty decent damage.</P> <P>But the most important thing is that there are plenty of classes that can do damage in the short term AND the long term. There are VERY FEW classes that can feed mana to someone who is low. Why people complain about having to feed mana is beyond me... in the end you are just pushing a button either way. The critical thing is that when the MT runs out of mana SOMEONE has to feed them so they can keep up the taunts and Venekor doesn't go ape[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] all over the Assassins and Monks. Or, when you are trying to kill The Cursed and you only have 5 healers SOMEONE has to feed them and make sure they can all keep the MT in the positive.</P> <P>The raiding wizard is not all about damage. On some mobs you own, on some mobs you suck... but you can ALWAYS play a major role in making sure your guild crosses the finish line and loots the little metal box. So stop whining and do what is needed of you. If you get passed up on raids because someone says "wizards suxor LOL" then count yourself lucky that you don't have to wipe with the rest of those [Removed for Content].</P> <P>Eriel Jewlar 50 Wizard / 50 Jeweler and Dexire Straits 44 Bruiser - Mistmoore</P>

Skwor

06-28-2005, 12:37 AM

<P>Logging all the names of those who beleive the wizards is just fine. :smileyvery-happy:</P> <P>Lets see if SOE agrees with you in the end. As a reminder regardless of how you feel those who are asking for DPS equivalent to warlocks are only asking for what SOE has officially stated. How anyone can continue to say it does not matter when SOE themselves believe it does boggles my mind. Moorgard's statement is fairly clear. No I don't see how it can be taken many ways and in the end mean something completly different. The english was fairly plain and to the point.</P>

trysta

06-28-2005, 01:38 AM

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> RogueThrill wrote:<BR> <P>Why people complain about having to feed mana is beyond me... in the end you are just pushing a button either way. The critical thing is that when the MT runs out of mana SOMEONE has to feed them so they can keep up the taunts and Venekor doesn't go ape[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] all over the Assassins and Monks. Or, when you are trying to kill The Cursed and you only have 5 healers SOMEONE has to feed them and make sure they can all keep the MT in the positive.</P> <P>The raiding wizard is not all about damage. On some mobs you own, on some mobs you suck... but you can ALWAYS play a major role in making sure your guild crosses the finish line and loots the little metal box. So stop whining and do what is needed of you. If you get passed up on raids because someone says "wizards suxor LOL" then count yourself lucky that you don't have to wipe with the rest of those [Removed for Content].</P> <P>Eriel Jewlar 50 Wizard / 50 Jeweler and Dexire Straits 44 Bruiser - Mistmoore</P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Alright, I understand that's it all about mashing buttons, but it's the result of mashing those buttons that we're complaining about. We like to see big negative numbers appear over a mobs head when we mash those buttons, not a players mana bar flinch. </P> <P>Why can't the raiding wizard be all about damage? From day one until they begin raiding, all fighters have one goal - tanking and secondary DPS. From day one until they begin raiding, all healers have the same purpose - making sure their group members stay alive. From day one until they begin raiding, scouts have one primary purpose - perform DPS and enhance some abilities of themselves or their group members. From day one until we begin raiding, wizards purpose change dramatically. We go from 49 levels of doing nothing but nuking and debuffing to until the next expansion comes out mana feeding. This is what we're complaining about. <BR></P>

RogueThrill

06-28-2005, 02:08 AM

<DIV>No the point isn't that I don't think wizards should be doing damage. It obviously needs to be worked on. My point is that even when you are able to do more damage to raid mobs you WILL STILL NEED TO BE A BATTERY. It's part of our role in prolonged encounters. People in your raid will need you to perform this function and to do so often. So suck it up and start feeding because someone has to do it and it's our job.</DIV>

Asterra

06-28-2005, 03:06 AM

<div></div><span></span><span><blockquote><hr>RogueThrill wrote:<div>No the point isn't that I don't think wizards should be doing damage. It obviously needs to be worked on. My point is that even when you are able to do more damage to raid mobs you WILL STILL NEED TO BE A BATTERY. </div><hr></blockquote></span>This is absolute rubbish, and I will tell you why. Both of the mana dumping spells are packaged with DPS-destroying delays. The lesser mana dump enjoys a spot in the top three longest Wizard cast times, at four seconds - an excruciatingly prolonged cast. The main mana dump comes complete with a fifteen second stun. It should be very obvious that mana dumping is, by design, an emergency alternative to a Wizard's true role of DPS, owing to the fact that one cannot mix the two. You either dump mana or you do DPS, and a solid raid (speaking from experience, I assure you) never needs the Wizard to switch from DPS to mana dumping. The only reason either of the Wizards in my guild ever gets asked is because it is typical that we are doing next to zero DPS anyway, and supposedly that scenario is going to become a non-issue when they fix the class. <p>Message Edited by Asterra on <span class=date_text>06-27-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:07 PM</span>

indra02

06-29-2005, 01:05 PM

<P>For those who thing that the "powerpump" role should make everyone happy, I am telling you that you should try to find their EQ2 game manual or check the class description on the official SOE site (<A href="http://eq2players.station.sony.com/classes/" target=_blank>http://eq2players.station.sony.com/classes/</A>). If you don't have time, I will just quote what is there:</P> <P>"<STRONG>Wizards are masters of the arcane arts who tap into the elemental powers of fire and ice. Wielding these powerful forces, wizards can inflict startling devastation upon their enemies</STRONG>."</P> <P>So, this is what I was really expecting when I created this character. Now who is telling me that the DPS role is not important and I have to bee happy with my powerpump or utility role must be out of his mind or is not really aware what Wizard class should be (this taking into consideration the official SOE statement).</P> <P>Really guys, I don't know what's the matter with you? You like you Wizard as it is now, or if you like the utility role, fine. What I don't understand is why you wouldn't he happy with more and you really want that things stay as they are.</P> <P>For me is a real disappointment of what Wizard class is at this moment and I really feel that my expectation were betrayed. Different players have different styles of playing while I can understand that some of us are defensive oriented or utility oriented, I don't understand why the class should not be modified so that is can fulfill it's primary role (DPS).</P>

RogueThrill

06-29-2005, 08:56 PM

<P>Don't be silly, I never said I like not being able to nuke the hell out of mobs. I think things should be improved. All I am saying is that you have these spells for transferring mana for a reason. You will encounter situations in which you will need to use them and you should. This is not a role a wizard should shy away from. There will be times when you are going at a x4 with 12 dudes and the healers are bound to run out of mana... and you should feed them. </P> <P>I just think the problem is grossly overstated and that the people who are constantly complaining are reactionaries with no sense of being a role based class for the time being. I have raided everything in the game aside from one contested mob I will likely be killing soon, I am not having these terrible problems everyone else is. There are very few mobs I can't hit with either heat, cold or magic based damage spells. Things need to be adjusted relative to Warlocks.... but those things are being done. There is no need for all these damned "the sky is falling" posts.</P> <DIV>Eriel Jewlar 50 Wizard / 50 Jeweler - Dexire Straits 44 Bruiser - Mistmoore</DIV>