Boreal what is the use?

[aa]

<DIV>I have done some experimenting with Boreal</DIV> <DIV>1 second cast time</DIV> <DIV>20 second duration</DIV> <DIV>30 second recast</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>It appears to stun the target but also stunning you for the same duration.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you cast the spell and nothing interupts it you remain stunned till the target mob is harmed or the time runs out.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If something does damage to the mob the stun is broken and you can cast again.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you cast the spell and nothing does damage to the mob you are stunned for the entire time.   Of course if some of the mobs friends decide to help him out and hit you the stun is broken on both sides and it turns into a free for all on the wizard.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If you cast a dot first then decide to cast Boreal the stun is broken the first time the dot does damage.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The low casting time appears to be helpful if you need to stop something from hitting you but while the spell is up you cannot do damage to anything else.  You cant have a dot operate while it is up so it keeps you from doing damage to the mob while it is stunned.  The recast is longer than the duration so it keeps you from chaining the spell and keeping the mob at bay.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am having trouble finding a use for this spell.  If the recast was the same as the duration I can see a practical application.  Run low on mana just use what you got left to hold an add at bay till they tank finishes off other mobs.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Better yet since it stuns you too, why not just have a very long duration on the stun and allow you to break it yourself if you do any other action.  So you cast and both you and the mob stay stunned till either one of you takes damage or you do something else.  I like this option best.  </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If dots didnt break it you could use it in addition to root to allow mobs to take damage while staying out of harms way.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But as it is there seems to be little use for the spell.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Does anyone have a suggestion?</DIV>

[aa]

<DIV>Another problem with this spell is the animation stays up after it goes down.  If you cast a dot on the mob and then cast Boreal, the mob will break the stun the moment it takes damage from the dot, but the animation of the rainbow swirl will stay up around your head and its head.  The icon that says how long it is up will go down but the animation keeps going.  If you are in combat and you cast Boreal and some tank does an aoe spell you  might think the spell is still up because the animation is still going but the mob is not stunned and will start whacking you with reckless abandoned.  </DIV>

[schom]

yeah......its definately a poor man's mez. but if youre in a group with one healer one tank and 4 DPS, you can sacrifice one DPS to mezz that ^^ add.  and whats really a beautiful thing about the spell, its saving grace, is that unlike how an enchanters mez generates aggro, the wizzies mez creates none.......after mez duration is over the add goes straight to whoever aggroed it in the first place. its a very situational spell, but there's nothing wrong with that IMO 49 wiz mistmoore <div></div>

[aa]

Does the higher level spell have a longer duration?  I don't think 20 seconds is long enough to really be that effective.

[Fendaria]

<div></div>Appr1 to Adept1 gave me no difference in anything except the mana cost for the spell (I believe it got more exspensive).  Big let down.  I'd recommend saving your cash before upgrading this spell. Fendaria <p>Message Edited by Fendaria on <span class=date_text>03-20-2005</span> <span class=time_text>05:42 PM</span>

[adamflanagan]

this spell has prevented a grp wipe a few times for me. its most useful for mezzing adds in places like runnyeye where adds are very easy to pick up. the other time ive used it was after getting an add in nek castle. all the group wiped except for me. i managed to run off the aggro and invis my way back to rezz the healer. unfortunately there was a yellow^^ golem wandering around the healer, so in between passes i rezzed the healer and then mezzed the golem when it aggroed us. the healer then managed to get the tank up and the grp was saved. while it is VERY situational it can be extremely useful if there is no illusionist/coercer in the grp. it can give the healer time to regen power and get some heals off to prevent a wipe. it is, however, completely useless while soloing. my advice is to keep it on you hotbar as you never know when you'll need it. <div></div>

[TheWhiteRaid]

<P>It is nice if you get an add on yourself and the tank is buzy.  You can mez it till the tank can get on it.</P> <P>BTW raising the spell from App1 to Adept 1 level makes it so you can mez higher level enemies. </P>

[Treve]

<P>i gotta say that this spell sits on my *4th* hotbar...that gives you an idea of how often i use it...i've used it *once* in combat, and i've never seen another wizzie use it either...even in this thread, the stories sound like "yeah i once used it when...."</P>

[Eleis]

yeah once I used it when my party was in trouble, got an orange ^^ add, boreal lasted ~5 seconds and we got wiped.anyway, Boreal is somewhat effective between lv25-30. Right after 30, it's like as if all mobs suddenly get +100000000 Wiz-Mez resistance or something, boreal literally breaks after a few seconds (w/o touching it in any way of course). Before lv30, I actually used it several times fighting against Giants, it lasted close to 20 seconds and proved to be marginally useful. Although in my experience, before lv30 if you have a decent party, adds (even white or higher con) are usually not too big of an issue. After 30, however, it's highly situational.

[Andalla]

Granted, its nowhere near as effective as a chanters real mezzes, but I use it all the time (Adept 1).  Most messy situations are "make or break" in a few seconds time, that essential heal getting off, a chanter having an extra second to put a real mezz on an add, or an evac to go off with everyone still alive.  It is by no means a class defining ability, but it can be a real lifesaver.  Between our ghetto mez, stuns and roots, a skilled player can half-@$$ crowd control surprisingly well in the right environment. I personally believe (and flame me if you will) that it is a valuble tool, dont discount it just because its not as good as a real mezz. Maybe I use it more readily after playing a chanter in EQ for so long, but either way, its saved enough groups Ive been in to earn an easy to reach spot on my secondary hotbar. <div></div>

[Eleis]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Andalla wrote:<BR>Granted, its nowhere near as effective as a chanters real mezzes, but I use it all the time (Adept 1).  Most messy situations are "make or break" in a few seconds time, that essential heal getting off, a chanter having an extra second to put a real mezz on an add, or an evac to go off with everyone still alive.  It is by no means a class defining ability, but it can be a real lifesaver.  Between our ghetto mez, stuns and roots, a skilled player can half-@$$ crowd control surprisingly well in the right environment. I personally believe (and flame me if you will) that it is a valuble tool, dont discount it just because its not as good as a real mezz. Maybe I use it more readily after playing a chanter in EQ for so long, but either way, its saved enough groups Ive been in to earn an easy to reach spot on my secondary hotbar.<BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>Haha you said ghetto mez.</DIV> <DIV>Sorry I had to say that.</DIV> <DIV>I see your argument and by no means do I know Boreal is useless. It's just that in my experience it hasn't come to use that many times. Most of the time I save the party simply by nuking the hell out of the current mob (if it's killable without me grabbing to much aggro of course) so we can deal with the adds.<BR>Personally I haven't even been in many situations that needs crowd control. It helps I'm sure, but I just haven't seen many right environment that favors me sacrificing dps for cc. (just me. not confirmed on non-me subjects)</DIV>

[Shalara]

Well I'm not high enough to be able to speak from exeprience on this, but the way I look at it is the only reason you would need the duration to match the recast is if you *needed* to maintain it continuously like an enchanters mez.  Since it generates no aggro to the wiz having to wait 10 seconds to recast doesn't seem like the end of the world, I'd rather have it in its current form than be able to chain it and having to worry about getting additional aggro from it. I usually hunt a lot in small groups and lacking a proper mezzer I could see situations where giving up 20 seconds of dps to keep an add at bay might be the difference between running and being able to handle a tough pull. Definitely not a 10 on the utility scale, but I for one am looking forward to getting it next level. <div></div>

[Eleis]

<blockquote><hr>Shalara24 wrote: Since it generates no aggro to the wiz having to wait 10 seconds to recast doesn't seem like the end of the world, <div></div><hr></blockquote>Unfortunately, you have to wait for whole 30 seconds. The recast timer doesn't start ticking until after the mez is over/broken.

[aa]

<DIV>Through about 50 combats I have tried this spell over and over.  I find no evidence that it will ever break before its 20 second duration unless the mob takes damage.  I dont know if a taunt type spell will break it because all my experiments have been solo.  I can say that dots break it 100% of the time.  And casting it and waiting will give you 20 full seconds every time.</DIV>

[Darien al'Staff]

great spell Do I use it every fight?  no.  Do I even use it once a day?  no.  But you know what, it's saved my butt..and my group's butt in a pinch a couple times. <div></div>

[FrostP]

<P>It has no use.</P> <P> </P> <P>I am a 45 wizard....I have Adept 3 Frozen Manacles (Yes its a level 19 spell and [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] if it isnt still great at 45!)</P> <P>                                          Adept 1 Tether (My weakest root because it seems to break fastest)</P> <P>                                          Adep t 1 Ring of Cold (By far the godliest root I have unbreakable so nuke away)</P> <P> </P> <P>Now simple tactic to prove Boreal (I have adept 1) is useless.......</P> <P><FONT color=#cc3300>Situation 1)</FONT> Wizard is soloing and getting hit .....root target with one of the above spells step away nuke, or run. Situation solved. Using Boreal IF it lands and thats a big if, Im still the same distance from the mob and now Im stunned too. When Boreal wears off Im still in danger and havn't been able to improve the situation any better.</P> <P> </P> <P><FONT color=#cc3300>Situation 2)</FONT> Wizard gets hate from tank, while tank struggles to grab the attention of the mob I cast one of the above roots then step away leaving the mob out of melee range to me. First thing the mob does is switch targets to the nearest group member which is almost always the tank desperately trying to pull it off me. Situation solved. If I used boreal and IF it landed the second the tank hits it to try and regain hate boreal would break wasting power and allowing the mob to beat on me again. (The issue mentioned earlier about the effect continuing when the spell is broken also is a major problem for what the poster explained).</P> <P> </P> <P><FONT color=#cc3300>Situation 3)</FONT> Somebody else in the group not me gets hate or added aggro from another mob. Root and tell the person to step away, or even use a stun spell to buy the add victim and tank a few seconds to react to additional aggro. Result with the root is same as situation 2 the rooted mob will turn to the nearest available melee target again being the tank trying to peel it off the add victim. If I was to use boreal and IF it landed the second its hit it breaks and its a waste of power because the victim and the tank will definately be trying to fight the add off. Also leading to the confusion with the effect still going on but the mob has woke up and started beating on add victim again.</P> <P> </P> <P>These really are the 3 big situations the spell might be usefull for, I can't think of another where Boreal would take precedence over one of my 3 roots or 2 stuns I now have. The only reason its Adept 1 is because of a spell drop. The reason I keep saying "IF it lands" is because more often then not it never does land for me and I just consider it a waste of time trying. If it didn't stun me and if it landed more often in line with other roots and stuns I would actualy use it sometimes, the fact these two issues arn't as I would like them just makes me feel its a spell with more risk then reward.</P> <P>If people in the group want a mez get a proffessional either an Illusionist or an enchanter etc They do that well and thats part of their class makeup. If SOE took away Boreal and Aurora I certainly wouldn't miss them and would hope for some kind or power drain or group stifle in their place. </P>

[iceriven2]

Boreal was ment to be a quick mez for some minor events.  I have had a few situations where i used it.  Getting adds and the grp can't hadle just at the moment i would mez to give the grp a chance to get rdy for it.  Its not something which i used commonly.  Cuase of the simple fact u mezz target your mezzed along with it.  It i believe gives us some minor extra crowd control.  We have our roots and stunns which can be effective in some situations but with boreal with get something small yes, used very little but can be effective in some situation.  <div></div>

[xsvhrs]

<P>One more thing I can think of that Boreal and the upgrade (Auroa?) are good for.</P> <P>When your root is resisted, and you're waiting for the timer to cycle.</P>

[Andalla]

It works best if you dont think of it as a mezz but as a stall tactic.  And so I cant do anything else while its up...boo hoo...try comparing your wizardly DPS to that of the mob your fighting...uh huh, thats right, by comparison, you arent doing sh*t.  It is by no means a be all, end all spell...but if you think its useless, then all I have to say is that you havent yet realized your full capability (this is not a flame, please dont take it as such), but may be taking a more costly or time consuming route to getting the job done.  And to Frostpaw...yes, on point three, stunning/rooting the mob and telling them to step away works just dandy...providing you either: a.) make a hotkey to address said multivariable occasion b.) didnt waste time making the hotkey and having it take up space on your hotbar and just type stupidly fast or c.) the person who is too close to said mob:     1.) does not listen to you     2.) is casting a vital (read-heal) spell with a longer cast time than your stun duration, as well as a mix of variables such as when the spell began or when he         noticed your message     3.) just plain didnt see said message To you sir, who states that it has no use, need to honestly think about the blatent stupidity of such a statement (not necissarily an idication of your own inteligence, which actually appears quite sound), when almost everyone has mentioned it has been useful, if only occasionally. <div></div>

[Treve]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Andalla wrote:<BR>It works best if you dont think of it as a mezz but as a stall tactic.  And so I cant do anything else while its up...boo hoo...try comparing your wizardly DPS to that of the mob your fighting...uh huh, thats right, by comparison, you arent doing sh*t.  It is by no means a be all, end all spell...but if you think its useless, then all I have to say is that you havent yet realized your full capability (this is not a flame, please dont take it as such), but may be taking a more costly or time consuming route to getting the job done.  <BR><BR>And to Frostpaw...yes, on point three, stunning/rooting the mob and telling them to step away works just dandy...providing you either:<BR><BR>a.) make a hotkey to address said multivariable occasion<BR>b.) didnt waste time making the hotkey and having it take up space on your hotbar and just type stupidly fast<BR><BR>or <BR><BR>c.) the person who is too close to said mob:<BR>    1.) does not listen to you<BR>    2.) is casting a vital (read-heal) spell with a longer cast time than your stun duration, as well as a mix of variables such as when the spell began or when he<BR>        noticed your message<BR>    3.) just plain didnt see said message<BR><BR>To you sir, who states that it has no use, need to honestly think about the blatent stupidity of such a statement (not necissarily an idication of your own inteligence, which actually appears quite sound), when almost everyone has mentioned it has been useful, if only occasionally.<BR><BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <DIV>oh give me a break..."this is not a flame"??...okay...it's a rant...and not even a well-written one...come back and make a new post when you can eloquently and logically address the points made by the other poster...in any any event, you totally lose all credibility when you misspell "intelligence"</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>now...you just calm down and come back another time when you can play fair</DIV>

[Andalla]

lol...ok, so I mispelled a word or two...just like you seem incapable of correctly using caps and puctuation...its a message board, I really dont thing anyone here puts all that much thought into spelling and grammar.  As for being a rant, your correct, it is...and its probably not a well written one because last time I checked, I didnt have a degree in any form of literary skill, nor do I really care how well written it is.  Either way, you missed the entire point.  All I am saying is that the spell does have a use or 2, and to completely discount those is only hindering your own capabilities.  Now, why dont you really stop and think about why you felt the need to be such an @$$hat by flaming me for my own opinion, when in fact I am perfectly entitled to one and, to be truely honest, DID NOT intend to flame anyone, just point out that to the OP, the spell does indeed have its uses. Is that "fair" enough for you? <div></div>

[aa]

<P>Again I spent 5 hours in a group last night trying to make good use of Boreal.  More experiments.  It seems and I cannot verify because it was unusual that it happend that it is possible to break the stun on the mob and the wizard will remain stunned.  this happend twice last night though never before.  I am /bugged it because I thought it was wrong.  May be related to the new patch.</P> <P>I still cannot find a good use for Boreal.  Rot or stun always take presidence.  Number one problem with boreal is AOEs and tanks who break it.</P>

[Vulking]

<P>It is an ABSOLUTE WASTE of mana and time to use this spell!!!!!!!</P> <P>Last night after reading this thread, I attempted to use this.  I was the highest level player in the group so I was sure the targets were of an appropriate level for the spell.  Not only did the spell stun the target and me, (as it should), but when anyone hit the mob it became un-mezzed and I remained mezzed.</P> <P>I don't know about you, but either its broke, never worked or is a waste.  I believe it is the latter.  I would rather have spent the mana on a couple of nukes.  <STRONG>And the time!! OH the time,</STRONG> I was out of action due to stun! The group lost two people to the mob in my absence due to this stupid <STRONG>death trap of a spell!!!</STRONG></P> <DIV>BTW:  I have deleted this spell from my hotbar!</DIV><p>Message Edited by Hammarus on <span class=date_text>03-22-2005</span> <span class=time_text>07:55 AM</span>

[FrostP]

<P>First of all I'm not a sir, secondly the fact I tried to point out in my original post is that regardless of how usefull it *might* be there are a long line of stuns and roots that do the same job more reliably and keep you the caster in the fight. Basicly the argument people are using to say the spell is effective is that it buys you 20 seconds or so if it lands. In that 20 seconds I can cast a root hit a macro while Im casting the root telling the victim to step out of melee range and then hit it with a stun or a nuke. If you cast boreal and anybody in the group hits the mob the mez breaks and the aggro continues. I would rather use up that quickbar slot on a macro shouting step away I am rooting the target then use it up on a mez spell as a wizard. </P> <P>The point about the victim not checking the chat channel for this warning may indeed be a factor in its effectiveness however it has not yet caused me problems as most of the people at my level are used to communicating during combat using the chat channels.</P> <P>If it really came down to it....and all 3 of my roots where cycling because none of them had landed and both my stuns where cycling or for some reason incapable of being used and someone in the group was in dire need of assistance I'd rather hit evac then risk the meagre chance that boreal would land and nobody in the group would hit the aggro for its duration.</P> <P>See I managed a reply without once questioning your opinion or throwing insults, its possible for me to express my feelings about someting without expecting others to agree with me. If you have found boreal usefull then thats great and I hope it benefits your groups, for those reading my original post who have not I hope it provides them either with comfirmation on their thoughts or some ideas on how to get a similar effect more reliably.<BR></P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Andalla wrote:<BR>It works best if you dont think of it as a mezz but as a stall tactic.  And so I cant do anything else while its up...boo hoo...try comparing your wizardly DPS to that of the mob your fighting...uh huh, thats right, by comparison, you arent doing sh*t.  It is by no means a be all, end all spell...but if you think its useless, then all I have to say is that you havent yet realized your full capability (this is not a flame, please dont take it as such), but may be taking a more costly or time consuming route to getting the job done.  <BR><BR>And to Frostpaw...yes, on point three, stunning/rooting the mob and telling them to step away works just dandy...providing you either:<BR><BR>a.) make a hotkey to address said multivariable occasion<BR>b.) didnt waste time making the hotkey and having it take up space on your hotbar and just type stupidly fast<BR><BR>or <BR><BR>c.) the person who is too close to said mob:<BR>    1.) does not listen to you<BR>    2.) is casting a vital (read-heal) spell with a longer cast time than your stun duration, as well as a mix of variables such as when the spell began or when he<BR>        noticed your message<BR>    3.) just plain didnt see said message<BR><BR>To you sir, who states that it has no use, need to honestly think about the blatent stupidity of such a statement (not necissarily an idication of your own inteligence, which actually appears quite sound), when almost everyone has mentioned it has been useful, if only occasionally.<BR><BR><BR> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P>

[Kilferf 'U]

I love my Aurora, please don't change it - thanks. :smileyvery-happy: <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Love,</DIV> <DIV>wiz</DIV>

[Vulking]

<P>Oh....! Yeah i get it!  Yeah, don't nerf our Boreal spell PLEAZE!! Leave it be, I works GREAT.  Yeah I have a uber power with Boreal.</P> <P> </P> <P><FONT size=1>yeah right.</FONT></P>

[Kilferf 'U]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Hammarus wrote:<BR> <P>Oh....! Yeah i get it!  Yeah, don't nerf our Boreal spell PLEAZE!! Leave it be, I works GREAT.  Yeah I have a uber power with Boreal.</P> <P> </P> <P><FONT size=1>yeah right.</FONT></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P> <P>don't be a [Removed for Content], use what they give you and use it well.....or cry about it</P> <P> </P> <P>OR! Ask someone how you can be the most effective wizard you can be by using all of your spells? I dunno, just a suggestion</P> <P>All i'm saying is don't change this spell because people don't/won't/can't use it. I know i use it alot, and it helps alot, in all sorts of situations. figure it out.. /shrug</P> <P>Respond like an idiot and i'll treat you like one....</P><p>Message Edited by Kilferf 'Uhn on <span class=date_text>03-22-2005</span> <span class=time_text>01:32 PM</span>

[FrostP]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kilferf 'Uhn wrote:<BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Hammarus wrote:<BR> <P>Oh....! Yeah i get it!  Yeah, don't nerf our Boreal spell PLEAZE!! Leave it be, I works GREAT.  Yeah I have a uber power with Boreal.</P> <P> </P> <P><FONT size=1>yeah right.</FONT></P><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR> </P> <P>don't be a [Removed for Content], use what they give you and use it well.....or cry about it</P> <P> </P> <P>OR! Ask someone how you can be the most effective wizard you can be by using all of your spells? I dunno, just a suggestion</P> <P>All i'm saying is don't change this spell because people don't/won't/can't use it. I know i use it alot, and it helps alot, in all sorts of situations. figure it out.. /shrug</P> <P>Message Edited by Kilferf 'Uhn on <SPAN class=date_text>03-22-2005</SPAN> <SPAN class=time_text>01:29 PM</SPAN><BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P><BR>Perhaps you could detail what it is you are doing that makes the spell so great for you? The precise reason the spell should be changed is because people don't/won't/can't find a use for it. Can't think of any other more important reason to change said spell then that so I don't agree with your sentiment there.</P> <P>Right now without more information in your posting it does seem more like you are just trying to start an argument rather then have any usefull knowledge or contribution to this discussion. Anybody on the forums can post in this topic saying what you have said, dosn't have to be a wizard player. If youre a wizard and know how to make the spell effective to use your words "use it a lot and it helps a lot" you could share your experience with this spell and how to make it effective rather then troll the other posters.</P>

[Nacoa]

<span><blockquote><hr>FrostPaw wrote:<p>Perhaps you could detail what it is you are doing that makes the spell so great for you? The precise reason the spell should be changed is because people don't/won't/can't find a use for it. </p><hr></blockquote> Look, I don't even have the spell yet, and I can tell that it will be useful.  Will I cast it all the time?  No way.  In general mezzing should be left up to the enchanters.  But there are going to be times when it is extremely useful.  Am I gonna tell you?  No.  What's the point of playing if everyone hands you every answer to every question?</span><div></div>

[Kilferf 'U]

<DIV> <DIV>Frostpaw, I hear you man ^</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In all honesty i'm just not up to pointing out to others how to use their spells (as i know how to use them...apparently??!) everytime i see someone screaming for a nerf or replacement. It just gets old. Sure there are things wrong with some spells, like right now our Tether is [Removed for Content]. But Boreal (Aurora) ? Kmon...those are great spell(s). But you were nice, even though you knew i was trolling, so i'll respond in kind. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I roam with a bunch of newer* players to mmorpg's. IF we had a crwod control character we would use them, but we don't and i'm sure more than 75% of my friends don't even know what that is yet, exactly. Anyway, .....in a group full of guys who constantly get agro, adds, have bad situational awareness ect, i am THE crowd control extrodinaire. Plain and simple. I love handling it so much that i've decided to roll a coercer with hopes of a career in it. That being said, i'm very impressed with how well i can control unwanted situations, and i'm really glad SoE gave me a piece of that pie. It's not easy, obviously, but getting everyone in the group on teamspeak and getting them to understand just exactly how to NOT break my roots in situations like that as well as knowing that i *AM* paying attention, and that critter walking right to us WILL be taken care of, ect, has helped tremendously. With full knowledge of how i get around targets, how i can control adds ect, we have had some great success with no xp debt lol. Not to mention, it has opened up many peoples eyes as to just how they might be able to implement various techniques they may not have been privy to otherwise with their OWN character, because they're STUCK thinking they can ONLY PLAY THEIR CHARACTER ONE WAY. Opps, didn't mean to shout that. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>No, i don't think a wizards main role should be CC, but my guildmates knew me for one big reason (besides havoing outleveled everyone by nearly 10 levels) and that was my DAMAGE output. Well i'll be honest man, all the dying and agro getting got to me, i have little patience unfortunatley <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> . wehn i solo'd, i figured it out, more and mor4e and more. And i thought ok, if i can get everyone to LISTEN to ME and pay attention, i bet i can guarantee their safety. Well...would you look at that....it works. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I never wanted to explain to my own friends exactly how i found my wizard to be useful, because i thought it just too much for someone else to learn about a character they have never played. Well i was wrong, and man o man has it been great. There is no more dying, there is no more freakin out with adds ect, there is me, my roots, and my Aurora for those pop on group types. It casts so quickly, taunts won't break it, healer can heal everyone up ect. Sure you can do it with Tether too, and Frozen Manacles with less confidence (no icon?). but by juggling two or three adds by rotating all my roots, paying attention to everything, getting back in and dropping a debuff, immo, switch  target bomb, bomb, make more rounds and retether all encounters until everyone has regrouped and healed up ect, i'm am a very noticable presence.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Now for those of you who are just too uber to use this spell, because you never find yourself or your group mates in trouble like i do, often, then that's great for you, really it is and i applaud you. But *I* have a use for it, and i'm really glad i have it. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>poorly written cuz i'm AT work trying to work <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>and forgive my trolling, i mean no harm <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Thank you,</DIV> <DIV>Freehold</DIV></DIV><p>Message Edited by Kilferf 'Uhn on <span class=date_text>03-22-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:38 PM</span>

[Kilferf 'U]

<P>Ok, but alone? I don't have all that much use for it lol. I'll admit that. But hey, we're not supposed to be soloing, are we? Might aswell get rid of our other "useless" spells like fiery granduer since i can't really get it to proc when i'm ...stabbing my target (??!) :smileytongue:</P> <P> </P> <P>but in a group, where people know what's up, this thing is INCREDIBLY valuable.</P> <P>me again..</P> <P>/bow</P>

[Kilferf 'U]

<P>wait wait one more thing before i leave...</P> <P> </P> <P>Now when Aurora breaks (and i assume the rest of the line up and down) we stay the remainder of mez while target can maul us. (Unless your tank is all up in his face taunting while he's mezzed, he's coming straight for you) This is wrong, and i'm not sure if this was intended along with our Tethers additional movement impairment breaking too, or not.</P> <P>Cuz as of last night lol, Aurora contridicted EVERYTHING i said above. I am hoping this newest effect isn't intentional, and if it is...i'll be back here crying too. <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></P> <P>/shrug</P> <DIV>holy grammar.... *runs*</DIV><p>Message Edited by Kilferf 'Uhn on <span class=date_text>03-22-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:06 PM</span>

[FrostP]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Nacoa wrote:<BR><SPAN> <BLOCKQUOTE>Look, I don't even have the spell yet, and I can tell that it will be useful.  Will I cast it all the time?  No way.  In general mezzing should be left up to the enchanters.  But there are going to be times when it is extremely useful.  Am I gonna tell you?  No.  What's the point of playing if everyone hands you every answer to every question?<BR></SPAN></BLOCKQUOTE> <BR> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>The point is I think its useless, have been playing with a wizard for 5months solid, I'm not gonna sit here and say I know all the tricks but I think I've learned quite a lot about how to be a wizard. I think Boreal is useless and I have outlined why I think its useless clearly. Other people are saying its not useless however none of them are actually outlining how it is more usefull then a stun or a root when they are more reliable and don't instantly break when hit.</P> <P>So of course if we are having a disscussion on the wizard forum about how effective a spell is [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] right people should be explaining why they like a spell, just saying "I like it keep it the way it is" can be said by anybody in the world they don't even need to be a game player lets hear why these people like it if they have the experience! I have made the effort to explain why I don't think its usefull.</P> <P>Finally as you openly admit you don't even have the spell you are basicly giving an uneducated opinion on the effectiveness of something you have never experienced, I sugest you wait until you get the spell before saying it will be usefull because really if everyone who didn't have the spell started making assumptions about how good it is this thread would be flooded with fighters and scouts and healers all posting about how it "sounds" like a good spell therfore it must be!</P> <P>The trouble with disscussions like this is people who don't know what they are talking about make ambiguous statements without backing them up with description about their choice and then the true experienced casters get dorwned out in a flood of one liners about how people like it or don't like it. Lets see more constructive input, if you find it usefull explain how its more effective.<BR></P>

[FrostP]

<BR> <BLOCKQUOTE> <HR> Kilferf 'Uhn wrote:<BR> <DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I roam with a bunch of newer* players to mmorpg's. IF we had a crwod control character we would use them, but we don't and i'm sure more than 75% of my friends don't even know what that is yet, exactly. Anyway, .....in a group full of guys who constantly get agro, adds, have bad situational awareness ect, i am THE crowd control extrodinaire. Plain and simple. I love handling it so much that i've decided to roll a coercer with hopes of a career in it. That being said, i'm very impressed with how well i can control unwanted situations, and i'm really glad SoE gave me a piece of that pie. It's not easy, obviously, but getting everyone in the group on teamspeak and getting them to understand just exactly how to NOT break my roots in situations like that as well as knowing that i *AM* paying attention, and that critter walking right to us WILL be taken care of, ect, has helped tremendously. With full knowledge of how i get around targets, how i can control adds ect, we have had some great success with no xp debt lol. Not to mention, it has opened up many peoples eyes as to just how they might be able to implement various techniques they may not have been privy to otherwise with their OWN character, because they're STUCK thinking they can ONLY PLAY THEIR CHARACTER ONE WAY. Opps, didn't mean to shout that. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P>Thankyou for you comments, I find it intresting players in your groups do not break your mez.......perhaps you play with the same people day to day all the time who have learned your spells and how to recognise them. In which case you are very lucky I genrally have a pool of players I play with plus several dozen strangers weekly on AB. I can only think its the addition of teamspeak or "wise" friends that have learned not to attack adds because I don't think I've been in a group that has not responed to add by hitting it with something. If I was to attempt to mez an enemy the second someone hits it the spell breaks, this has been my experience every single time. </P> <P>I am curious what kind of success rate you think you have when casting boreal, does it land most of the time or just sometimes? If it only lands sometimes and a particular time it fails to land but the mez effect continues to swirl around the mob how do you deal with it then? root? stun? scream and run away? :p<BR></P> <p>Message Edited by FrostPaw on <span class=date_text>03-23-2005</span> <span class=time_text>04:25 AM</span>

[Lady Uaelr]

<DIV>Useless. I have attempted to use it in messy situations like a nightblood add-- does not always work.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>SOE= hates casters and you.</DIV>

[highlighter]

<P>I found Boreal to be very usefull at the lower levels.  If we are fighting groups of higher level mobs and the tank is taking severe damage, Boreal allows me to stop at least one of the mobs from doing damage to allow the healer to catch up on HP.  Yea it takes me out of commision for a few ticks, but If I can save the tank, it usually means I wont have to take a short jog when the tank falls.  Some perfer I just keep on nuking, but if the tank dies that mob is gonna come straight for me.</P> <P>Another good time to use it is with adds, it stops the mob from using all those special attacks at the beggining and causing the tank severe damage.  Also, if we are fighting a group encounter and I happen to go a lil nuke happy and get the mob comes after me, the mez prevents the mob from beating on me too much, at least until the tank can taunt the mob back.</P> <P>Its not a spell to be used all the time, just when you find yourself in that 'certain' situation.</P>

[Eleis]

<blockquote><hr>highlighter wrote:<P>I found Boreal to be very usefull at the lower levels.  If we are fighting groups of higher level mobs and the tank is taking severe damage, Boreal allows me to stop at least one of the mobs from doing damage to allow the healer to catch up on HP.  Yea it takes me out of commision for a few ticks, but If I can save the tank, it usually means I wont have to take a short jog when the tank falls.  Some perfer I just keep on nuking, but if the tank dies that mob is gonna come straight for me.</P> <P>Another good time to use it is with adds, it stops the mob from using all those special attacks at the beggining and causing the tank severe damage.  Also, if we are fighting a group encounter and I happen to go a lil nuke happy and get the mob comes after me, the mez prevents the mob from beating on me too much, at least until the tank can taunt the mob back.</P> <P>Its not a spell to be used all the time, just when you find yourself in that 'certain' situation.</P><hr></blockquote>the key words are "at lower levels." For me the problem is not the recast time or that it takes you out of dps'ing, but the fact at a certain level, it almost never work anymore. If it actually STICKS for 20seconds or even 15 or even 10!!! seconds would be great, but at lv30+ mobs (as I experienced it), Adept 1 Boreal gets resisted so much it's not even funny. Blue^^ and Green^^ are ok, probably 70% of sticking, but they can be taken care of easily with many other options available. White^^'s are *maybe* (i.e. 50% or less), orange^^ I would probably use stun or root or anything because boreal hits ~30% (rough figure) at most, anything above orange^^, no chance of sticking at all. And so we are stuck with the crappy mez for nearly 10 levels...

[Kilferf 'U]

<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT color=#ffffff>:smileytongue: </FONT> <HR> FrostPaw wrote:<BR> <DIV><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></DIV><BR> <P><FONT color=#ffffff>Thankyou for you comments, I find it intresting players in your groups do not break your mez.......perhaps you play with the same people day to day all the time who have learned your spells and how to recognise them. In which case you are very lucky I genrally have a pool of players I play with plus several dozen strangers weekly on AB. </FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffffff><FONT color=#ffff00>It took me all of ten minutes to explain to them how it works. I did silly things, like i would Mez a target and have tank swing at it and break mez. Then i would mez another and i would have the tank taunt the heck out of it while everyone watched. And then i said, "See how that works?" and they all went "oooooooohh!!". It really wasn't that difficult...</FONT></FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffffff>I can only think its the addition of teamspeak or "wise" friends that have learned not to attack adds because I don't think I've been in a group that has not responed to add by hitting it with something. If I was to attempt to mez an enemy the second someone hits it the spell breaks, this has been my experience every single time. </FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>Yes, you're in pick up groups or you're grouping with people who don't know what you're capable of. Learn yourself, <EM>the</EM>n teach them. But expect alot of what you're capable of in any class to be overlooked by the majority of people you might find "LFG". That INCLUDES me, and ya know i'd love to know all abot the other chars i'm grouped with but sometimes i just don't have the time to learn. And that's how it was with my friends and i, but wipe after wipe after pop/add after pop/add it got to me. I demanded attention in the Mez department, took the time to explain, demonstrate in the basic of ways and wow...look at that. There hasn't been a group wipe in days. Over the course of time i've come to find the majority of what others here on the boards considered useless were in fact quite the opposite, although not always lol. Don't confuse unorganized/ineffecient group tactics with useless spells. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffffff>I am curious what kind of success rate you think you have when casting boreal, does it land most of the time or just sometimes?</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffffff><FONT color=#ffff00>Boreal is below me now, but i used it as much then as i use Aurora now. I have </FONT><U><EM><STRONG><FONT color=#ff0000>never</FONT></STRONG></EM></U></FONT><FONT color=#ffff00> had a boreal or Aurora resist on me, </FONT><U><EM><STRONG><FONT color=#ff0000>ever</FONT></STRONG></EM></U><FONT color=#ffff00>. Dunno what you're all on about there. By all means, please, prove me wrong? DoT's don't count as resists, btw. (I may be dead wrong about this, but i seriously cannot recall a single time this was resisted)</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffffff> If it only lands sometimes and a particular time it fails to land but the mez effect continues to swirl around the mob how do you deal with it then? root? stun? scream and run away? :p</FONT></P><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P><FONT color=#ffffff><FONT color=#ccff99>With the latest patch Boreal/Aurora, when broken, will continue to keep the wizard stunned for the remainder of the spell duration. I hope this is a bug and will be fixed. I see there are similiar "oddities" with encounters lately, so i'm confident this was not the intention. I've yet to see a response yet. </FONT></FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffffff><FONT color=#ccff99> Assuming it WILL be fixed: </FONT><FONT color=#ccff00>All in all, we don't have that problem. My friends know what's going on now, and while even understanding what a mez was and when it was on, they may not have seen the positive effects from using it. Seeing first hand how easy a wizard can keep a target at bay for hours on end by juggling his roots and stuns (and the mighty boreal/aurora for those unexpected pops/add rushes - LIFESAVER!!), literally, has greaty improved our battles. Of course it's not ALL Boreal/aurora doing this, but none of this toned down crowd control would be possible if it weren't for the super fast casting, never been resisted BOREAL/AURORA spell we get. I fail to see how anyone could hate on a virtual <EM><U><STRONG>PAUSE</STRONG></U></EM> button unless they didn't know how to use it. But to answer your question, what do i do when mez is up? Well considering i'm not alone, i can either call for a stun from a friend in 3, 2, 1 NOW - friend stuns target - i recast FM or Tether (usually Tether as it has icon i can monitor, FM only good for stopping someone who has no DO''T's on dead in his tracks for a short, undetermined time as it seems to have random chance to break..tether much more reliable...well, waas  before last patch lol.) or i just cast FM and jump back once if creature is too close to me. then Tether, rinse and repeat till full health/power/whatever it is we needed to pause situation for.</FONT></FONT></P> <P><BR></P> <DIV><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT></DIV> <P><FONT color=#ffffff>Message Edited by FrostPaw on <SPAN class=date_text>03-23-2005</SPAN><SPAN class=time_text>04:25 AM</SPAN><BR></FONT></P><FONT color=#ffffff></FONT> <HR> </BLOCKQUOTE> <P> </P> <P><FONT color=#33cc00>I simply cannot agree with any of you regarding this being a useless spell. I can't. when i was told i needed to group with people if i wanted to do fun things, i kicked the dirt - i didn't come to the boards and whine and rant about my inability to solo effeciently, er, as effeciently. Then i found a group. When i got a useless spell i couldn't use,  i kicked the dirt - i didn't come to the boards and whine and rant about my inability to use it effeciently, err, as effeciently. Then i found a use.</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#33cc00>but nobody handed me instructions on how to use this spell either, i had to go figure it out. </FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#66ff33>Uaelrea?  I wish you wouldn't be so negative and matter of fact about things, you do make yourself out to be a very misinformed poster. You let me down in a prior post, i couldn't even defend you because the attacker was for the most part, correct. You have very biased iews, perhaps you read these forums a bit too much. /poke :smileywink:</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#33cc00>I have found everything in my arsenal to be valued, so should you. Unless of course, it really IS broken lol. The thing is Frost, i have found a genuine use for this spell...would i really be in here defending it (well mostly the line of our mez's) like i have been if i didn't? I'm not here to stunt our "potential" growth by impeding a spell swap or anything lol. but pointing out to others that taking less than 10 minutes to explain to a few of your regular grouping buddies what you're capable of is easy. <FONT color=#66ff99>The problem for you will be instead, getting them to trust that you are capable of performing those tasks when the time arises. And that, from what i've seen - is the problem the majority of the wizards posting in here are going to have. I know i wouldn't trust half of you to do what i do, but that's not my problem. I mean, if you haven't figured it out by now.....</FONT> <FONT color=#66ffcc><EM>My guys trust me.</EM></FONT> :smileywink:</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#33cc00>can't really explain anymore than i have...l mean it's not like i'm giving out secrets here, heck i don't even know why i've taken so much time to explain myself. The dev's are prolly laughing at me for it....isn't this all just common sense people? </FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ff3300>i'll leave you all alone now....but stop F'ing with our mez line..</FONT></P> <P><FONT color=#ffff00>/bow</FONT></P> <P> </P> <P>I referred to you as "man" in an earlier post frostpaw, my apologies. /bow</P><p>Message Edited by Kilferf 'Uhn on <span class=date_text>03-23-2005</span> <span class=time_text>03:44 PM</span>